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Deoxys-S (Analysis) [QC 0/3]

Discussion in 'Locked / Outdated Analyses' started by Calm Pokemaster, Nov 30, 2010.

  1. Calm Pokemaster

    Calm Pokemaster
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    [​IMG]
    Deoxys-S

    Status: Finished, ready for QC checks.

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    [OVERVIEW]
    <p>Deoxys-S remains quintessentially the very same Pokemon, as one of the best entry hazard laying leads around. It remains unmatched in its ability to lay down entry hazards, with its huge base 180 Speed stat. With its fantastic movepool, Deoxys-S can also function as an effective utility counter, without having to rely on a Choice Scarf thanks to its blistering speed.</p>

    <p>However, Deoxys-S recieved no new moves of any significance in the 5th Generation. Mischievious Heart Pokemon with access to Taunt like Borutorosu and Erufuun can shut down Deoxys-S with a priority Taunt. Still, the abilities to lay entry hazards and provide team support with Reflect and Light Screen are highly valued, making Deoxys-S a fantastic support Pokemon.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Entry Hazards Lead
    move 1: Spikes
    move 2: Magic Coat
    move 3: Taunt
    move 4: Stealth Rock / ExtremeSpeed
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Jolly
    EV's: 4 Def / 252 HP / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]
    <p>Deoxys-S works out well in the lead spot, as it can utilise its huge 180 base Speed to lay entry hazards on the field quickly. Taunt and Magic Coat help Deoxys-S take on . Taunt prevents Pokemon such as Forretress from setting up any hazards, while Magic Coat requires some amount of prediction, but helps out tremendously against Mischievious Heart users.</p>

    <p>For the 4th move, you have 2 options. Stealth Rock is yet another entry hazard which Deoxys-S can run, but ExtremeSpeed helps pick off frail or weakened Pokemon in general should Deoxys-S be alive later on.</p>

    [ADDTIONAL COMMENTS]
    <p>252 HP EVs improve Deoxys-S's bulk, as it can certainly take a hit with its nice base defensive stats. However, if ExtremeSpeed is used, 252 Atk EVs instead of the HP EVs and an Adamant nature should be used. The remaining 252 EVs are put in Speed.</p>

    <p>Leftovers is the item of choice, giving Deoxys-S more oppurtunities to lay down entry hazards. Focus Sash is an inferior option due to the prevalence of Sandstorm and priority moves. </p>

    <p>Shadow Ball is a viable alternative over Extreme Speed, as it allows you to hit Magic Mirror Xatu and Magic Mirror Espeon, 2 common switch ins to Deoxys-S to bounce back entry hazards, for super effective damage.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Dual Screens
    move 1: Reflect
    move 2: Light Screen
    move 3: Taunt / Magic Coat
    move 4: Spikes
    item: Light Clay
    nature: Jolly
    EV's: 4 Def / 252 HP / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]
    <p>Deoxys-S is not limited to setting up entry hazards, and can provide team support with Reflect and Light Screen. This set aims to set up dual screens quickly and help a team member set up easily. With either Taunt or Mirror Coat, Deoxys-S can prevent the laying of entry hazards avoid getting Taunted by Mischievious Heart users.<p>

    <p>With the EVs in HP, and dual screens, Deoxys-S can easily lay down 3 layers of Spikes. Spikes is thus an excellent option for the 4th moveslot, though if you already have another Spikes user such as Skarmory or Nattorei, you can either opt for both Taunt and Magic Coat.<p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
    <p>If Deoxys-S does not carry Mirror Coat, Mischievous Heart users such as Borutorosu, Sableye and Erufuun will shut it down with Taunt. Borutorosu can also set up Nasty Plot on Deoxys-S. However, if Deoxys-S favours Magic Coat over Taunt, set up sweepers such as Bulk Up Roobushin will use it as set up bait. For this reason, it would probably be wise to drop Spikes and run both Taunt and Magic Coat.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Anti-Lead
    move 1: Ice Beam
    move 2: Superpower
    move 3: Fire Punch
    move 4: Spikes
    item: Life Orb / Expert Belt
    nature: Naughty
    EV's: 252 Atk / 88 Spe / 170 SpA

    [SET COMMENTS]
    <p>Deoxys-S can be an effective anti-lead, since it has a fantastic mixed movepool which helps it deal with Pokemon used commonly as leads. Ice Beam helps Deoxys-S eliminate Mischievous Heart users such as Borutorosu and Erufuun which are commonly used against it, 2HKOing both of them. Superpower deals with Tyranitar, which is a commonly used as a lead on Sandstorm teams. </p>

    <p>Fire Punch deals with Pokemon such as Nattorei and Forretress, which are commonly used to lay entry hazards. Spikes works out well in the last moveslot, since Doexys-S is bound to get many oppurtunitites to lay Spikes.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
    <p>The 252 EVs in Attack and a Naughty nature ensure that Fire Punch 2HKOs Nattorei. 88 Speed EVs ensure that Doexys-S outspeeds Scarf Heatran, and the remaining EVs are put in Special Attack.</p>

    <p>Life Orb adds more sting to your attacks, but it reveals the fact that Deoxys-S is running an offensive set. Therefore, Expert Belt can be used to bluff a different item, such as Focus Sash.</p>

    [Team Options]
    <p>As with any entry hazard laying Pokemon, Deoxys-S appreciates a Spin blocker. Burungeru and Dusclops are both good candidates for this role. In case you do not run Stealth Rock on Deoxys-S, another Pokemon with the same can be useful.</p>

    [Optional Changes]
    <p>Knock Off can be used to remove an item, but outside of that it has virtually no use. Trick can be used to cripple walls, or hit hard and switch. However, it requires a lot of prediction and will more often then not backfire. Deoxys-S also has access to boosting moves such as Calm Mind and Cosmic Power, but it does not have the offensive stats to attempt a sweep.<p>

    <p>Out of its support moves, Deoxys-S also has access to Gravity, Psycho Shift, Recover, and Toxic. With its Speed, Deoxys-S can be an excellent user of Gravity, but Deoxys-S does not have the offensive capability to abuse inaccurate moves it learns, such as Zap Cannon. Recover can be used on the Spikes set to enhance Deoxys-S's longevity, giving it more oppurtunitites to set up entry hazards.</p>

    <p>Deoxys-S might not have the defenses to be an effective Toxic Staller by itself, but using Toxic can free up a moveslot for Pokemon like Blissey, who can run two recovery moves or an additional status move instead of Toxic. Finally, Psycho Shift can be used in conjuction with a Flame Orb or a Toxic Orb to cripple a sweepr, but is predictable.</p>

    <p>Running a Choice Scarf on Deoxys-S might seem absurd considering Deoxys-S's high Speed, but it will allow it to eliminate many popular weather sweepers such as Kingdra, Doryuzuu and Kabutops. It also has the defenses to take weak priority attacks which most of these sweepers tend to carry.</p>

    [Counters]
    <p>Pokemon with Rapid Spin such as Starmie, Doryuzuu and Forretress can Rapid Spin away all entry hazards laid by Deoxys-S and easily KO it with their STAB moves.</p>

    <p>If Deoxys-S does not carry Magic Coat, it will get shut down by Mischievious Heart users such as Borutorosu and Erufuun. Borutorosu can also use Deoxys-S as set-up fodder, and proceed to set up Nasty Plot.</p>

    <p>Due to its Psychic typing, Pursuit users such as Choice Band Scizor and Choice Band Tyranitar can switch in on any of its attacks(though Tyranitar should be wary of Superpower), and effectively trap and eliminate Deoxys-S with Pursuit if it tries to switch out. Even if it stays in, Pursuit is a clean 2HKO.<p>

    [Dream World]
    <p>Deoxys-S does not get a Dream World ability.</p>
  2. Riptide451

    Riptide451

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    I don't want to seem like a troll, but i decided to run some calculations on a Choice Scarf Modest Deoxys-S to see how it can handle some of the premiere Swift Swim/Chlorophyll/Sand Paddle sweepers that the bane of the Hyper Offensive teams.
    The following calculations are from a Modest max Speed, max Sp. Attack 4 Hp Choice Scarf Deoxys-S with the moves Psycho Boost, Focus Blast, Signal Beam and Ice Beam/Thunderbolt for utility:

    Popular Swift Swim Sweepers:
    Psycho Boost on 4/0 Kingdra: 72.3%-85.3%
    Psycho Boost on 4/0 Ludicolo: 66.9%-78.8%
    Focus Blast on 4/0 Kabutops: 118.3%-139.7% (OHKO)

    Popular Chlorophyll Sweepers:
    Psycho Boost on 4/0 Venusaur: 133.8%-157.6% (OHKO)
    Psycho Boost on 4/0 Victreebel: 202.6%- 238.4% (OHKO)
    Psycho Boost on 4/0 Tangrowth: 102.6%-121.1% (OHKO)
    Psycho Boost on 4/0 Leafeon: 105.9%-124.6% (OHKO)
    Signal Beam on 4/0 Exeggutor: 124.1%-147% (OHKO)
    Signal Beam on 4/0 Shiftry: 136.6%-161.5% (OHKO)

    Sand Paddle Sweeper:
    Focus Blast on 4/0 Doryuuzu: 90.6%-107.2%

    Sorry about this wall of numbers, but as you can see Scarf'd Deoxys-S can be useful in OHKOing several popular weather sweepers while bringing others into a range where they can be revenged by most priority moves. It can also be a viable part of any team that needs a scarf'd pokemon to plug holes in their team.
  3. Forte.EXE

    Forte.EXE

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    I think Shadow Ball should be slashed next to Taunt, with ExtremeSpeed de-slashed, while changing the nature to Timid (and moving the Atk EVs to either SpA or HP). Magic Mirror Pokemon are going to come in constantly, and Shadow Ball stops them from reflecting back your Entry Hazards.

    And maybe slash Taunt next to Magic Coat instead, but that's my personal opinion (always preferred 252 HP | 4 Def | 252 Spe).
  4. chocolate-kipp

    chocolate-kipp

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    Why are the abilities listed, let alone as Levitate? Deoxys has Pressure, and if a Pokemon has only one ability it doesn't need to be listed.
  5. Calm Pokemaster

    Calm Pokemaster
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    @Riptide451-I will see if I can give your suggestions an AC mention, depending on the results of the Suspect voting currently underway.

    @chcolatekipp-Whoops, thanks for pointing that out.

    @Forte.EXE-Deoxys-S definitely needs both Taunt and Mirror Coat for dealing with Miscievous Heart users and slower entry hazards leads. I will give Shadow Ball an AC mention.

    Suggested changes have been made wherever possible. Thanks for the help.
  6. Fizz

    Fizz

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    I'm confused as to why the hazard lead set has max Attack invested when the only attacking move on the set, Extremespeed, isn't even given the first slash.
  7. Calm Pokemaster

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    @Fizz: I have edited the first set with your suggestion. However, I have mentioned the 252 Atk EV spread in AC.
  8. Fizz

    Fizz

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    Small nitpick, the EV spread has 4 HP as well as 252 HP.
  9. PooF

    PooF

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    Deoxys-A seems to be a better choice for a set like this, as he's still fast enough with scarf to outspeed Dory in the sand (although it does require speed boosting nature) and he can guarantee KO on all those pokemon. He does have horrible defenses, but that hardly matters since neither A nor S forme cannot switch into any of these pokemon, only revenge kill.
  10. A Man In Black

    A Man In Black

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    Deo-A may be going to ubers. Plus, almost all of the examples are setup sweepers, so it can come in on the setup move.
  11. Ian15

    Ian15

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    Your Utility Counter set is missing 20 EVs and you have 4 HP and 252 Hp listed for the lead.
  12. PooF

    PooF

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    If Deo-A goes to Ubers, normal Deo forme still does this better than Deo-S i guess. Also, bulk is irrelevant when switching on setup moves.
  13. elDino

    elDino Deal With It.
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    You should put Shadow Ball in Optional Changes rather than in Additional Comments as it's not really that viable IMO. It's your choice I guess...
  14. Riptide451

    Riptide451

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    Basically, out of all of the useful Deoxys forms (i'm looking at you, Deoxys-D) Deoxys-S has the best chance of staying in OU. Normal Deoxys has just as good a chance in getting banned to Ubers as Deoxys-A, so i posted these calcs onto Deoxys-S.
  15. Snorlaxe

    Snorlaxe 2 kawaii 4 u
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    i don't mean to come off as annoying, but i think that you should make this write-up a bit longer. it really isn't too detailed in its current state, and while you don't need to have a crazy long analysis, it is important to have a somewhat extensive one so that the reader can get as much as possible out of it. deoxys-s is a pretty important pokemon, so i think that the analysis should reflect it.
  16. Calm Pokemaster

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    Don;t worry Snorlaxe, you are not annoying. Regarding your suggestion, I am currently woking adding some more content to the analysis, without sounding redundant. I have also slightly expanded the [Optional Changes] section with some of Deoxys-S's support options.
  17. Calm Pokemaster

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    BUMP. Sorry if this counts as a double post, but I think this analysis is ready for QC checks now.
  18. Judas DN

    Judas DN

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    This analyse needs some serious update, it has a smelly Generation IV flavor surrounding it. Also it has a few small mistakes like 256 HP ev's and Mirror Coat instead of Magic Coat and mentioning Sableye and Shandera who aren't released.

    Seriously, why max speed? During Generation IV everyone was running Deoxys-E as their lead making speedties worth it. Now Deoxys-E isn't as nearly as common as it used to be(Out of 50 battles in smogon university i only encountered 3 Deoxys-E, which may not be solid proof but a good indication), maxing Speed for a rather uncommon pokemon to win only 50% of the time sounds like such a terrible waste.

    Also what exactly is Extremespeed supposed to achieve, what does it better than let's say Psychic? The only reason it's included in the Gen IV analyse is to win against Deoxys-A leads running Extremespeed, which are as far i know still banned. Lucario, Scizor, Dragonite and Roobushin the most common users of Priority in this metagame all get pitifull damage from it, Doryuuzu the only common pokemon that is faster doesn't get much damage either.


    My suggestion is to the fellowing Deoxys-E lead sets to the analyse instead of ones you currently have listed, because after extensive testing i found them both to be equally usefull. My personal favorite is this offensive Deoxys-E lead set.

    name: Offensive Entry Hazards Lead
    move 1: Superpower
    move 2: Ice Punch
    move 3: Spikes
    move 4: Fire Punch / Stealth Rock
    item: Expert Belt / Life Orb
    nature: Adamant
    EV's: 252 HP / 168 Atk / 88 Spe

    88 Spe allows you to outrun Scarfed Heatran, aside from that there are very few 'common' pokemon left between 418 and 504 Speed bracket. Superpower beats Tyranitar and 2HKO's Nattorei, Ice punch allows you to defeat Voltolos the most common MH user one on one(without getting damage if it uses Taunt). Fire Punch is used as an additional move to provide coverage against Steel types most notably Scizor and Forretress. Since this set like any Deoxys-E set relies on coverage Expert Belt is preferred for the lack of recoil damage. Also i slashed Fire Punch but in fact any of the 3 coverage moves can be replaced by Stealth Rock depending on your team's structure.

    name: Dual Screens Lead
    move 1: Reflect
    move 2: Light Screen
    move 3: Spikes
    move 4: Taunt / Magic Mirror
    item: Light Clay
    nature: Bold
    EV's: 252 HP / 168 Def / 88 Spe

    Same set, but with a more efficient EV spread.

    I have my doubts about the usefullness of the Utility counter set in Generation V. It's offensive stats are way below Generation V's average(even a Life Orb Psychic won't KO Roobushin) and Doryuuzu is faster and much more powerfull. The only reason one would ever to consider using it over Doryuuzu is when there is no sandstorm running, but i doubt that's going to be a common situation in the future.

    Though i'm not infallible of course, so i'm looking forward to any constructive criticism.
  19. Forte.EXE

    Forte.EXE

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    Might want to edit out the part about Shandera trapping Deoxys-A, since Dream World Shandera hasn't been released yet (to my knowledge). Genosekuto too, since it hasn't been released yet (you mention it in the Utility Counter set).
  20. Calm Pokemaster

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    Thanks for the suggestions, everyone. I am going to scrap the current utility counter set, and add an anti-lead set. I am kinda caught up with school work currently, so the changes will be made over the weekend.
  21. RaikouLover

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    I know this was a month ago but just had to comment. The fact that the fastest pokemon in the fucking game is considering Choice Scarf just shows how fucked up the Metagame was at one point, lol.
  22. badabing

    badabing hevy hangs da hood,,

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    The EVs on the first set are messed up. It has HP twice
  23. Bad Ass

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    Beef this up. It's way too short. Mention Bulky TrickScarf in OC and emphasize it, it's really good.

    Deoxys-S @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 252 HP / 172 Def / 84 SDef
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
    - Spikes
    - Trick
    - Taunt
    - Superpower

    Again, only in other options, and you can slash in Stealth Rock with Superpower, but it's nice doing 75% to Tyranitar. It's cool crippling one thing with Trick and getting two layers up thanks to your blindingly fast speed.

    Deoxys is missing an All-Out Attacker set. I think you should change the Anti-Lead to
    Deoxys-S @ Life Orb
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
    - Thunderbolt
    - Ice Beam
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Superpower

    It's better. the Anti-Lead is an inferior Spiker to the lead set and an inferior clean up sweeper than this is. It outspeeds ScarfChomp and anything below, so it's really fast, and all that speed is needed.

    I'll check back later and approve it.
  24. Bloo

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    I'm not fond of the term 'Anti-Lead' in Gen. V. Thanks to team previews, nothing is stopping your opponent from re-arranging their team before the start of a match and putting a Pokemon that screws Deoxys-S over in the lead position. Deoxys-S also functions outside the lead position; in fact, it's an excellent late game cleaner once your opponent's team has been softened up. I'd just change the set name to something along the lines of "Attacker," and mention how Deoxys-S can fare in the lead position due to its ability to take down many common leads.

    I believe Deoxys-S is better off Spiking with his other two sets than he is with the 'Anti-Lead' set, and as such, I'm going to agree with Bad Ass and his suggestion of turning the set into Thunderbolt / Ice Beam / Superpower / Psycho Shock or Hidden Power Fire. Notice how HP Fire > Fire Punch on this set. HP Fire is significantly better than Fire Punch because you have to waste tons of EVs on Deoxys' attack in order to make Fire Punch hit hard. Investing tons of EVs into Attack isn't necessary because the main physical move you'll be using is Superpower to hit Tyranitar and Blissey (both of which take a boatload of damage without any investment). You're far better off investing your EVs into Special Attack.

    I suggest the same EV spread, but I'd put the 4 EVs into Attack since Deo's running Superpower.

    That's all I have to say for now. Though, this analysis is quite short at the moment; there's a lot more that could be said about Deoxys-S. Try expanding on your writing a tad more. I'll approve this once these changes are made :)

    EDIT: Ice Beam / Superpower deserve a mention on the 'Entry Hazards Lead' set. Superpower beats Tyranitar leads, and Ice Beam offers good coverage for a sole move, dealing with Dragons and whatnot.
  25. Dan Dan

    Dan Dan

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    Small nitpick, you have Mirror Coat down instead of Magic Coat on the dual screener.

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