ORAS OU Ditto Stall Squad [Qualified for OLT, #3 Peak]

Googly

Arcadia
is a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnus


Hi there! I’m Googly, and this is my first RMT on Smogon. I’ve had a surprising amount of success with this team, having used it to qualify for OLT, and then going undefeated with it in the playoffs (unfortunately I lost whenever I used any other team lol, should’ve just stuck with this one!) Anyway, a few people have been asking me for the team, so I thought why not make an RMT and share it with everyone :]


Cycle 4 was intense! :o


Team at a Glance



So yeah, at first glance the team looks… strange, but bear with me here. Essentially it’s a stall team built around utilising Ditto, which can be a big threat with the right support. The slow U-Turn core of Mega Scizor and Landorus-T gives Ditto and Gothitelle safe switches, while Alomomola and Umbreon form a dual Wish core to keep the team healthy and wall things with their fatness.

In-Depth Analysis


Ditto @ Choice Scarf

Ability: Imposter
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 Atk / 30 SpA / 0 Spe
- Transform
-
-
-

This all started after I’d just finished making a new team, only to find that it got 6-0’ed by Charizard-Y… but rather than just slapping on a Chansey, I wanted to do something a little more creative. As it turns out, Ditto works as a decent counter to Charizard Y. It takes roughly half from sun boosted Fire Blasts and is capable of stalling out the sun with Roost. Since stall can often struggle with Charizard Y, I was interested in trying out Ditto.

Ditto’s usefulness goes far beyond checking Charizard Y though. If it can come in safely on a set up sweeper, it will copy their boosts, outspeed thanks to its Choice Scarf and then potentially sweep the opposing team. Just Ditto's presence will deter the opponent from setting up for a sweep, which is always nice for a stall team. If the opponent’s team has been whittled down enough, Ditto can even transform into one of their strong attackers and just sweep that way. Mega Pokemon in particular make nice candidates for Ditto, as Ditto essentially becomes a scarfed Mega. Just imagine the kind of damage Scarf Mega Medicham can deal! Because of this, Ditto is often this team’s win condition, especially against offense.

Against opposing stall, you may be thinking that Ditto is pretty dead weight, but that's not true at all. First off, it basically has unlimited PP, meaning if it comes down to it, Ditto can PP stall simply by switching in and out. Secondly, if you can bait the opponent into knocking off Ditto’s Choice Scarf, it suddenly becomes much more useful. Plus if it comes in on the right Pokemon, it can save other team members their PP by doing their job of clearing away hazards or curing status ailments.

One of the biggest benefits of using Ditto though is being able to find out a Pokemon’s moveset, which is especially helpful when scouting for things like HP Fire on Mega Diancie for example.

As for the set, since Ditto copies every stat except HP upon transforming, HP investment is crucial. I gave it 248 EVs so it takes slightly less from hazards. And just in case the battle ever comes down to Ditto vs Ditto, it has minimum speed and maximum defence investment to allow it to win the eventual struggle war. The IVs give Ditto a Hidden Power typing of Fire, which allows it to trap and KO opposing Magnezones, letting Mega Scizor roam free. Choice Scarf lets it outspeed whatever it transforms into, and act as a semi-reliable revenge killer.

I could go on about what Ditto can do, but I suggest trying it for yourself ;]

- - -


Scizor @ Scizorite

Ability: Light Metal
EVs: 248 HP / 44 Def / 216 SpD
Impish Nature
IVs: 29 Spe
- Bullet Punch
- Defog
- Roost
- U-Turn

The first member of the team’s U-Turn core, bulky Mega Scizor is great at walling a good number of threats. So long as they aren’t carrying fire coverage, Mega Scizor completely shuts down Fairies like Mega Gardevoir, Mega Diancie and Clefable, as well as the mighty wallbreaker Kyurem-B. Even with minimal Defense investment, Mega Scizor is still capable of walling a number of physical attackers too, such as Weavile, Mega Metagross and Mega Altaria. Mega Scizor is also the team’s Defogger, and it performs this role decently so long as it isn’t forced to Defog in an unfavourable situation. It’s best to stay on top of hazards before the opponent has too many layers up, otherwise the team is very quickly worn down. Roost is extremely helpful in keeping Scizor healthy, which is essential due to the number of roles it fills. The key move on this set though is U-Turn, which coupled with Scizor's low speed, gives both Ditto and Gothitelle safe switch-ins. This is especially useful when there are set-up sweepers or Pursuit trappers involved. 29 Speed IVs lets Mega Scizor underspeed opposing Mega Scizors to get off slower U-Turns for switch momentum, while still being able to outrun slower variants of Magnezone.

- - -


Landorus-T @ Leftovers

Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 204 Def / 52 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- U-Turn

The other member of the team’s U-Turn core, defensive Landorus-T is amazing at handling most physical attackers thanks to its Intimidate ability. It serves as the team’s Stealth Rocker, and those STAB Earthquakes still hit pretty hard even without attack investment. Rock Slide is a great coverage move alongside Earthquake, hitting Flying types that are immune to Earthquake as well as big threats to the team like Volcarona. U-Turn serves the same function as it does on Scizor, and U-Turning between the two can quickly rack up damage against the opposing team. The 52 Speed EVs let it outspeed some key threats, including Crawdaunt, opposing defensive Landorus, 124 Speed Heatran and most variants of Rotom-W. Slower U-Turns aren't needed against these particular Pokemon, and outspeeding them is generally more useful. Since Landorus-T lacks recovery, it appreciates Leftovers as its item.

- - -


Gothitelle @ Choice Scarf

Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 80 HP/ 176 SpA / 252 Spe
IVs: 0 Atk
Timid Nature
- Calm Mind
- Psychic
- Rest
- Trick

Ahh, cancer itself! Gothitelle is a staple on a lot of stall teams these days. Thanks to the ridiculously broken ability Shadow Tag, Gothitelle is able to trap and remove anything annoying to the team. This Pokemon can dismantle most opposing stall teams with ease, while also being able to cripple set up sweepers like Manaphy and Nasty Plot Thundurus by Tricking them a Choice Scarf. In particular, Gothitelle can also handle Keldeo, Mega Venusaur and Mega Heracross, which the rest of the team struggles against. On top of all that, Gothitelle can even work as a secondary win condition, where if it is able to set up enough Calm Minds and retrieve its scarf, it can sometimes sweep with Psychic.

80 EVs in HP lets Gothitelle take 3 Seismic Tosses from Chansey and proceed to stall it out with Rest. However it can pull this strategy off against pretty much anything passive enough, such as Specially Defensive Heatran, Bulky Starmie and Clefable. Speed is maximised so Gothitelle is fast as possible with a Choice Scarf, while the rest is invested in Special Attack to give Psychic more fire power. 0 Attack IVs reduce Foul Play damage.

- - -


Alomomola @ Rocky Helmet

Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 192 HP / 252 Def / 64 SpD
IVs: 0 Atk
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Toxic
- Wish
- Protect

Now we reach the more passive end of the team. Alomomola serves as one of the team’s Wish passers, and is also good at spreading burns and poison to whittle down the opposing team. With its Regenerator ability, amazing bulk and reliable recovery, Alomomola is incredibly hard to take down. To better handle powerful physical attackers like Charizard X, I maximised its defense, since it doesn't take strong special attacks too well anyway but can easily eat up weaker ones. 192 HP EVs lets Alomomola hit a Regenerator number while taking less damage from hazards. The rest of the EVs were put into Special Defence to better take special attacks when it needs to, particularly where a Keldeo is involved as Alomomola is its only safe switchin. Since it already has recovery in Wish + Protect and Regenerator, I decided Leftovers weren't necessary and opted for a Rocky Helmet to wear down physical attackers more easily.

- - -


Umbreon @ Leftovers

Ability: Synchronize
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
IVs: 0 Atk
Calm Nature
- Foul Play
- Heal Bell
- Wish
- Protect

While Umbreon may seem like an odd choice in OU, it can serve as an effective cleric with both Heal Bell and Wish. It has excellent bulk, and its Dark typing allows it to take on threats which the rest of the team struggles against, such as Hoopa-U and Gengar. Full special defence investment lets Umbreon wall most special attackers that aren't Fairies. Even a Focus Blast from Mega Alakazam only does around half… and that’s assuming it hits! Foul Play gives Umbreon at least some offensive presence, and hits the aforementioned threats hard, as well as Pokemon like Mega Metagross and the Lati twins. It also gives me a way to deal with Swords Dance Gliscor, which is otherwise a major problem for this team. Leftovers is essential here, as it helps avoid alot of 2HKOs. It's also a bit of free recovery whenever Umbreon uses Protect. Synchronize isn't the greatest ability, but it can come in handy on occasion. For instance, it can be used to burn Mega Sableye and Rotom Wash, or paralyze Clefable.

- - -

Threats
Swords Dance Bisharp If this manages to set up, it can do quite a number on my team. Wearing this thing down is a top priority, and if need be I will sack Gothitelle to Trick Bisharp its scarf. A Scald burn from Alomomola will quickly shut it down though.

Belly Drum Azumarill Unless I pull some fancy switching between Alomomola and Scizor, this thing usually gets a kill before I can revenge with Ditto… but then I have a +6 Choice Scarf Azumarill!

Ancient Power/Earthquake Charizard Y Ditto can't reliably counter these Charizard Y variants. Good thing nobody runs those moves!

Special Attacking Mega Altaria Fortunately these are quite rare, but taking this out is always an issue, as Hyper Voice + Fire Blast gives it the coverage it needs to plow through my team and it can heal any status with Heal Bell/Refresh. Ditto isn’t a solid answer, as Altaria will just switch out, but weakening it with Scizor and finishing it off with Gothitelle can work. If Gothitelle has Tricked away its Choice Scarf, it can set up on Altaria and KO it.

Volcarona I poison it with Alomomola, then try to survive long enough for it to go down to toxic damage before it sweeps the entire team!

Gothitelle Because this Pokemon is so 'balanced', it basically limits me to using only half my team, since if Goth comes in on Alomomola or Umbreon it’s a free kill (Foul Play from Umbreon does literally zero)

Hawlucha Substitute set up sweepers are a problem in general, since Ditto can’t transform into them and Gothitelle can't Trick them. Hawlucha gets a special mention though since it’s capable of massacring the entire team, and even if Ditto does copy it, it will be outsped since it doesn’t receive Hawlucha’s Unburden boost. Rocky Helmet damage and Protecting on High Jump Kicks are honestly the only way I have to deal with this.

Swords Dance + Roost Scizor Unfortunately, I have to rely on a Scald burn from Alomomola to beat this.

Crawdaunt If I play smart with Landorus-T and switch in on an SD, it can survive a +1 Aqua Jet and U-Turn to Scizor or Ditto who can then finish it off. If the Crawdaunt goes for Crabhammer instead, Lando will outspeed and can U-Turn to Alomomola, which should then KO it with Rocky Helmet.


Replays




So, that's the team! I know alot of people aren't big fans of stall, but I think it can be really fun to use and can make for some interesting games, despite being a stall team. It may look odd, but it can work really well. There's always room for improvement though, so please let me know if you have any suggestions on how to make it better. Thanks for taking the time to read this RMT, and for anyone interested in using the team, the importable is just below :]
Ditto @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Imposter
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 Atk / 30 SpA / 0 Spe
- Transform
-

Scizor @ Scizorite
Ability: Light Metal
EVs: 248 HP / 44 Def / 216 SpD
Impish Nature
IVs: 29 Spe
- Bullet Punch
- Defog
- Roost
- U-turn

Landorus-Therian @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 204 Def / 52 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- U-turn

Gothitelle @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 80 HP / 176 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Psychic
- Rest
- Trick

Alomomola @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 192 HP / 252 Def / 64 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Toxic
- Wish
- Protect

Umbreon @ Leftovers
Ability: Synchronize
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Foul Play
- Heal Bell
- Wish
- Protect
 
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smh u reviewed the squad how am i suppose to ladder now? jkjk on a serious note i think if u should run 29 speed ivs on scizor allowing you to get slower u-turns against other scizors so u can get momentum. 29 over 30 incase anyone else wants to try to be slick and the speed on scizor dosent really matter.

Another thing u might consider is running twave over calm mind on goth allowing you to outspeed mons like fast taunters (heatran). And tricking someone a scarf then twaving them is pretty nice. But Calm mind is probably better since you can set up and just win unless they have a dark type ofc.

Yeah team is very solid i cant think of much good job fren.
But then you have niggas like Will (TCMK) running 28 speed Sciz, so some niggas try being slick and run 27 after his RMT, but some have godly perdikts and run 26 speed, so I'd say use 25 speed sciz. -kawaiiii

On some real shit tho, like the team. looks like complete aids and I love it. But having lando just makes the sharp weakness even worse. I'd say to run hippo just because it has more reliable recovery, can handle sharp a lot better as well as play some mind games with weather, but yeah. you do lose the utility of knock off. lando probably might be better, but to me hippo seems like a more viable mon.
 
Sup Googly

I'm honestly really glad to see another successful non-Mega Sableye creative Stall out there :], anyways, on to the rate:

You always mention how you are weak to Mega Charizard Y, but in fact that is not the case, and Ditto isn't even your best check. I had previously used Umbreon and, although it may not look like it, Umbreon can actually beat Mega Zard Y 1v1 and stall out both Fire Blast and Focus Blast.
Timid:

252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Umbreon in Sun: 187-222 (47.4 - 56.3%) -- 30.5% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Umbreon: 182-216 (46.1 - 54.8%) -- 9% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Modest:

252+ SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Umbreon in Sun: 207-244 (52.5 - 61.9%) -- 98.8% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Mega Charizard Y Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Umbreon: 202-238 (51.2 - 60.4%) -- 90.6% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery


You are probably wondering how the hell does Umbreon 1v1 this when Modest Zard Y has a 99% chance to 2HKO? It's because Wish works different from something like soft-boiled, with Wish, you are practically gaining 62.5% each 2 turns. On the first turn, you go for wish and gain 6.25% from Leftovers, and on the second turn you go for Protect and gain 50% from wish and another 6.25% from Leftovers, totaling 62.5%, which means you heal up on zard Y lol. This wasn't a change but more of a fun fact ^.^

Other than that, the team pretty much cannot become any better without changing too many things, and it's already very good. The only thing to consider is Thunder Wave > Calm Mind on Gothitelle.

Nice team!
 
Hey Fren , Cute Team and gratz for good results.(before starting sorry for bad english)

Im not a big fan of Stall Team but i must say that i like your pretty, however, let's start with the rate.

I noticed immediately that
Crawdaunt gives you many problems , if Set-up against Landorus or against Gothitelle that has previously trapped and killed a Pkmn you need to sack Landorus for drop Daunt attack and give more chance to alomomola to check this threat , seen that with a boost Alomomola can't do anything especially if rocks are in the field.
Damages

+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Alomomola: 473-559 (88.7 - 104.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Mega Scizor: 439-517 (127.9 - 150.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO


another weakness that i noticed is
Sableye(Mega) with Calm mind Set, the only chance that you have for beat he is burn with Alomomola scald and try to crit with Ditto.

Medicham(Mega) nobody in your team is a safe switch-in , lando-t is the most safe but as I said in a previous rmt Ice Punch is not the most used move but neither is missing.

I suggest just to give more speed to
Scizor(Mega) so you can revenge kill Crawdaunt and enter in the field ,having the security to attack or recover. For Medicham(Mega) and Sableye(Mega) i suggest to change
/
>
Alomomola for Slowbro with CM (with a bit of SAttack)set that it's very helpful because counter Medi and can win the 1 vs 1 against sableye giving you one more chance with ditto.
 
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Googly

Arcadia
is a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnus
smh u reviewed the squad how am i suppose to ladder now? jkjk on a serious note i think if u should run 29 speed ivs on scizor allowing you to get slower u-turns against other scizors so u can get momentum. 29 over 30 incase anyone else wants to try to be slick and the speed on scizor dosent really matter.

Another thing u might consider is running twave over calm mind on goth allowing you to outspeed mons like fast taunters (heatran). And tricking someone a scarf then twaving them is pretty nice. But Calm mind is probably better since you can set up and just win unless they have a dark type ofc.

Yeah team is very solid i cant think of much good job fren.
Lol, didn't you just laugh when I first passed this to you? :p

Good point with Mega Scizor. I'll go ahead and make the change. While T-Wave does have its merits on Gothitelle, on this particular team I do think that Calm Mind is better. You can see in some of those 'riveting' replays where Calm Mind comes in handy. It makes handling special attackers like Clefable easier, is a potential win con, and gives me at least some way of handling Hyper Voice + Fire Blast Mega Altaria.

Thanks for the rate fren :]
But then you have niggas like Will (TCMK) running 28 speed Sciz, so some niggas try being slick and run 27 after his RMT, but some have godly perdikts and run 26 speed, so I'd say use 25 speed sciz. -kawaiiii

On some real shit tho, like the team. looks like complete aids and I love it. But having lando just makes the sharp weakness even worse. I'd say to run hippo just because it has more reliable recovery, can handle sharp a lot better as well as play some mind games with weather, but yeah. you do lose the utility of knock off. lando probably might be better, but to me hippo seems like a more viable mon.
The slippery slope of underspeeding/speed creeping XD

Hippo definitely is a good Pokemon in this metagame. Unlike Lando-T it doesn't have that awful 4x Ice weakness, has reliable recovery, and would make handling Bisharp easier. However I'd lose alot of benefits that Lando-T has over Hippo, most notably U-Turn, which allows me to switch into Ditto or Gothitelle safely.

Well, even if it is aids, I'm glad you like it haha!
Sup Googly

I'm honestly really glad to see another successful non-Mega Sableye creative Stall out there :], anyways, on to the rate:

You always mention how you are weak to Mega Charizard Y, but in fact that is not the case, and Ditto isn't even your best check. I had previously used Umbreon and, although it may not look like it, Umbreon can actually beat Mega Zard Y 1v1 and stall out both Fire Blast and Focus Blast.
Timid:

252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Umbreon in Sun: 187-222 (47.4 - 56.3%) -- 30.5% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Umbreon: 182-216 (46.1 - 54.8%) -- 9% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Modest:

252+ SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Umbreon in Sun: 207-244 (52.5 - 61.9%) -- 98.8% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Mega Charizard Y Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Umbreon: 202-238 (51.2 - 60.4%) -- 90.6% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery


You are probably wondering how the hell does Umbreon 1v1 this when Modest Zard Y has a 99% chance to 2HKO? It's because Wish works different from something like soft-boiled, with Wish, you are practically gaining 62.5% each 2 turns. On the first turn, you go for wish and gain 6.25% from Leftovers, and on the second turn you go for Protect and gain 50% from wish and another 6.25% from Leftovers, totaling 62.5%, which means you heal up on zard Y lol. This wasn't a change but more of a fun fact ^.^

Other than that, the team pretty much cannot become any better without changing too many things, and it's already very good. The only thing to consider is Thunder Wave > Calm Mind on Gothitelle.

Nice team!
Holy... I knew Umbreon was bulky, but man! I'll keep that in mind the next time I come up against a Charizard Y haha! Thank you for the kind feedback :]

Hey Fren , Cute Team and gratz for good results.(before starting sorry for bad english)

Im not a big fan of Stall Team but i must say that i like your pretty, however, let's start with the rate.

I noticed immediately that
Crawdaunt gives you many problems , if Set-up against Landorus or against Gothitelle that has previously trapped and killed a Pkmn you need to sack Landorus for drop Daunt attack and give more chance to alomomola to check this threat , seen that with a boost Alomomola can't do anything especially if rocks are in the field.
Damages

+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Alomomola: 473-559 (88.7 - 104.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Mega Scizor: 439-517 (127.9 - 150.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO


another weakness that i noticed is
Sableye(Mega) with Calm mind Set, the only chance that you have for beat he is burn with Alomomola scald and try to crit with Ditto.

Medicham(Mega) nobody in your team is a safe switch-in , lando-t is the most safe but as I said in a previous rmt Ice Punch is not the most used move but neither is missing.

I suggest just to give more speed to
Scizor(Mega) so you can revenge kill Crawdaunt and enter in the field ,having the security to attack or recover. For Medicham(Mega) and Sableye(Mega) i suggest to change
/
>
Alomomola for Slowbro with CM (with a bit of SAttack)set that it's very helpful because counter Medi and can win the 1 vs 1 against sableye giving you one more chance with ditto.
Hey haha, thanks I appreciate it ^.^

Wow! You're right about Crawdaunt! Can't believe I overlooked that! Definitely adding it to the threat list! Giving more speed to Scizor would help solve this problem, but it'd lose alot of the bulk it needs to take on other threats like Mega Gardevoir. I may add a few more speed EVs to Lando though and see how that works out, since it doesn't need much to outspeed Jolly Crawdaunt. Aqua Jet is still doing a ton though! x_x

Actually, even at +6 Mega Sableye isn't doing much to Umbreon. Between it and Ditto, I can PP stall Mega Sableye. Not the best strategy, but at least it's something haha.

On paper, Mega Medicham may look like a massive threat to the team, but if you watch my battle with PDC, you'll see it can be dealt with. It struggles to High Jump Kick safely, since it loses 50% of its health if I Protect, and if Lando-T comes in and gets off an Intimidate (Ice Punch isn't even an OHKO), I can then switch into Alomomola and wall it. I actually use this strategy quite alot against strong physical attackers. Lando-T + Alomomola make a surprisingly good defensive core! (People also say that Goth is an answer to Mega Medi, but meh...)

As much as I like CM Slowbro, I think Alomomola's Wish support would be sorely missed. Plus, a Slowbro wouldn't really help my Bisharp weakness XD
 
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Googly

Arcadia
is a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnus
on your bisharp weakness, i would suggest quagsire > alomomola, which helps you also against scizor, but also threats like cm raikou which ditto can't beat. not much to say here, since the team is pretty solid

also grats on your olt run :D
Ah, fitting Quag on the team would patch up some of those weaknesses quite nicely! I'm just afraid the team would miss Alomomola's superior bulk and wish support. Definitely worth trying out though!

Thanks, OLT was alot of fun :]
 

Googly

Arcadia
is a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnus
Alright, so after a bit of testing on the ladder, I’ve decided to add 52 Speed Evs to Landorus-T. The loss of bulk isn’t noticeable, it’s still slow enough to get off slow U-Turns, and the given Speed EVs allow it to outspeed almost all variants of Rotom (making it much easier to wear down with U-Turn) as well as 124 Speed Heatran (which is apparently a standard set). The main reason I wanted a faster Landorus though was so I could outspeed Jolly Crawdaunt, and after coming up against a couple of Crawdaunt teams, it seems to work well. If Lando comes in on an SD, it can survive an Aqua Jet, U-Turn out into something like Ditto or Scizor who can then finish up. If Crawdaunt goes for Crabhammer instead, U-Turning to Alomomola will cause it to die to Rocky Helmet.

Also, I did try out Quagsire > Alomomola, but it wasn’t as good at sponging hits due to the lack of Regenerator, and Lando-T kinda missed the wish support. Anyway, the one time I came up against a Bisharp it had Grass Knot lmao.

Another slight change I made was thanks to a suggestion from NotFalse. Ditto is now a Relaxed nature with 0 Speed IVs and maximum defence, which basically makes sure that in the unlikely event the battle comes down to Ditto vs Ditto, it will win the eventual Struggle war.

I’ll make the changes to the OP, but here are the updated sets:

Landorus-Therian @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 208 Def / 52 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Knock Off
- U-turn

Ditto @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Imposter
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 Atk / 30 SpA / 0 Spe
- Transform
-
 

Stallion

Tree Young
is a Tiering Contributoris a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnusis a Three-Time Past WCoP Champion
M-Scizor is one of the best Bisharp counters known to man and I love your teams synergy, so instead of suggesting a crazy change I'd recommend adding enough defence so that you're comfortable switching in on it, U-Turning out and then finishing the job with Ditto or something. Umbreon already does a pretty good job of sponging special hits and fairies can only really hit Scizor with focus blast and no stab, so you can afford to drop a little spdef. I'd be careful of HP fire Diancie though, if your opp catches Scizor with a hidden power you're actually ravished by it.
 

Googly

Arcadia
is a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnus
M-Scizor is one of the best Bisharp counters known to man and I love your teams synergy, so instead of suggesting a crazy change I'd recommend adding enough defence so that you're comfortable switching in on it, U-Turning out and then finishing the job with Ditto or something. Umbreon already does a pretty good job of sponging special hits and fairies can only really hit Scizor with focus blast and no stab, so you can afford to drop a little spdef. I'd be careful of HP fire Diancie though, if your opp catches Scizor with a hidden power you're actually ravished by it.
Thanks for the suggestion, I'll definitely try that out. There's been quite a few situations where I've wanted a little more defence on Scizor anyway. Only trouble with using Ditto to finish Bisharp is that it's forced to Knock Off and take a Sucker Punch, but that's still better than the current situation haha. Yeah, fairies in general with fire coverage are a problem in general for this team lol.
 

Century Express

melodies of life
is a Tutoris a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Former Old Generation Tournament Circuit Champion
World Defender
The only variation i would run in this team is Stone Edge over Knock Off on Landorus-T. You said Knock Off is useful to remove Eviolite and Leftovers, but Chansey and other glues like Ferrothorn, Hippowdon are already trapped by Gothitelle, so i don't see too much utility running Knock Off, except for removing a random Shed Shell / Rocky Helmet or Choice item, which is kinda unlikely if your opponent play carefully. I understand the utility of chipping damage removing lefties + SR, but it kinda sounds a bit "innefective" in practice, giving you some utility, but failing to cover others threats (i find Knock Off a bit overrated on Lando-T tbh), but is up to you. In the other side of the coin, SE looks really useful to cover potential threats, because it hits Gyarados for super effective damage before mega evolving (which is a huge threat if SubDD), and gives you a backup plan vs SubSD Hawlucha and Volcarona, which is important since Lum Berry is a common pick on Volcarona.
 

Snou

the grand master of all the things bad!
is a Tutor Alumnusis a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past SCL Champion
on your bisharp weakness, i would suggest quagsire > alomomola, which helps you also against scizor, but also threats like cm raikou which ditto can't beat. not much to say here, since the team is pretty solid

also grats on your olt run :D
Eh I would suggest the same thing, but it's Keldeo weak even with Alomomola, lets think using Quagsire...
 

Googly

Arcadia
is a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnus
The only variation i would run in this team is Stone Edge over Knock Off on Landorus-T. You said Knock Off is useful to remove Eviolite and Leftovers, but Chansey and other glues like Ferrothorn, Hippowdon are already trapped by Gothitelle, so i don't see too much utility running Knock Off, except for removing a random Shed Shell / Rocky Helmet or Choice item, which is kinda unlikely if your opponent play carefully. I understand the utility of chipping damage removing lefties + SR, but it kinda sounds a bit "innefective" in practice, giving you some utility, but failing to cover others threats (i find Knock Off a bit overrated on Lando-T tbh), but is up to you. In the other side of the coin, SE looks really useful to cover potential threats, because it hits Gyarados for super effective damage before mega evolving (which is a huge threat if SubDD), and gives you a backup plan vs SubSD Hawlucha and Volcarona, which is important since Lum Berry is a common pick on Volcarona.
I'll test it out first, but I really like this idea. Knock Off has actually gotten in the way a couple of times, like accidentally removing a Skarmory's Choice Scarf that I tricked it lol. I think Stone Edge will be a much better alternative to Knock Off, thanks for the suggestion :]
 
Alomomola takes special hits like a beast if you invest more in Sp.Def, and less in HP. Thanks to that huge HP stat you dont need much investment to be honest. I would aim to hit a regenerator number (number divisible by 3) and at the same time a number to take rocks better, (number divisible by 8 - 1) 495 HP is a good example, and requires just 96 EVs. This gives a HUGE boost to your special defense. 2 calcs for example:

252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Alomomola: 568-670 (106.5 - 125.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 96 HP / 160 SpD Alomomola: 432-510 (87.2 - 103%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO

It's physical bulk doesn't suffer much:

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Claw vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Alomomola: 159-187 (29.8 - 35%) -- 17.3% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Claw vs. 96 HP / 252+ Def Alomomola: 159-187 (32.1 - 37.7%) -- 93.7% chance to 3HKO

Remember this is just an example, you might want a higher HP stat. Thats up to you
All numbers divisible by 3 and 8 (- 1) : 471 (0 EVs), 495 (96 EVs) and 519 (192 EVs)
 

Googly

Arcadia
is a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnus
Alomomola takes special hits like a beast if you invest more in Sp.Def, and less in HP. Thanks to that huge HP stat you dont need much investment to be honest. I would aim to hit a regenerator number (number divisible by 3) and at the same time a number to take rocks better, (number divisible by 8 - 1) 495 HP is a good example, and requires just 96 EVs. This gives a HUGE boost to your special defense. 2 calcs for example:

252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Alomomola: 568-670 (106.5 - 125.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 96 HP / 160 SpD Alomomola: 432-510 (87.2 - 103%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO

It's physical bulk doesn't suffer much:

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Claw vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Alomomola: 159-187 (29.8 - 35%) -- 17.3% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Claw vs. 96 HP / 252+ Def Alomomola: 159-187 (32.1 - 37.7%) -- 93.7% chance to 3HKO

Remember this is just an example, you might want a higher HP stat. Thats up to you
All numbers divisible by 3 and 8 (- 1) : 471 (0 EVs), 495 (96 EVs) and 519 (192 EVs)
I don't normally use Alomomola for taking special attacks, but since the difference in physical bulk is so minuscule, I guess it wouldn't hurt to add a little sp def investment. Also had no idea about regenerator numbers until I looked them up haha, thanks for the tip. Might be tweaking some of the spreads soon :o
 

Googly

Arcadia
is a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnus
After taking feedback on board and doing some testing, I've made a few minor adjustments to the team that I think optimise its performance:
- Changed Scizor's EVs to: 248 HP / 44 Def / 216 SpD with an Impish Nature, allowing it to take physical attacks better and giving me a better answer to Bisharp.
- Gave Lando-T Rock Slide > Knock Off to better deal with Volcarona, Hawlucha and Regular Gyara (kinda). Stone Edge can be used, but I prefer Rock Slide for its better accuracy and higher PP.
- Changed Alomomola's EVs to 192 HP / 252 Def / 64 SpD to give it a huge boost in special bulk, while barely impacting its physical bulk. Also lets it hit a Regenerator number.

Also, with Shadow Tag now banned, Gothitelle is obviously useless on the team. Unfortunately it isn't as simple as swapping her out for a different Pokemon, since nothing else can do what Goth did. The team probably needs a complete overhaul to still be successful in this meta. I'm open to suggestions, but as a quick fix, I've been experimenting with Tangrowth and Amoonguss in Gothitelle's place. While they're nowhere near as effective, they do synergise quite nicely with the team and help with some pre-existing threats. Tangrowth helps pressure a lot of things that Goth used to trap, however straight up loses to CM Clefable with Flamethrower. Amoonguss can shut down most threats with Spore and Clear Smog on set up sweepers, but makes the team even more passive.

For anyone interested, here are the sets that I've been testing out:

Amoonguss @ Black Sludge
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 32 Def / 224 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Spore
- Giga Drain
- Clear Smog
- Hidden Power [Fire]


Tangrowth @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 244 HP / 12 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Rock Slide
- Earthquake


Changes will be updated in the OP, but unless someone knows of a way for the team to work without Gothitelle, this is probably the end for the Ditto Stall Squad :c
 
With the spread I made it successfully cockblocks it and can stall it out with Wish and Protect

252 SpA Manaphy Scald vs. 248 HP / 56+ SpD Clefable in Rain: 153-181 (38.9 - 46%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
you havent taken into account the burn damage
 

Googly

Arcadia
is a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnus
Dugtrio is definitely a decent trapper, but on this particular team the only thing it really helps with is Heatran. It doesn't stop those scary special sweepers like Manaphy, Serperior, Keldeo and NP Thundy.

hi

So since your looking for a replacement for Goth that can stop quite a few Stallbreakers i suggest you try out Unaware Clefable in it's place. Unaware Clefable is a dead stop to Manaphy, Thundurus, etc. It also works as a wincon for your team so thats a plus as well since you already have Heal Bell support, but it's not as efficient as Goth, but what can you do? WishTect is used because Rain saps away from Moonlight's healing.

Clefable @ Leftovers | Unaware
Calm | 248 HP / 204 Def / 56 SpD
Calm Mind | Moonblast | Wish | Protect
Hi :]

Unaware Clef seems like a pretty solid option, especially since it can serve as a backup wincon, though I may want to run more sp def just to handle all those special sweepers better. Goth was never really used for physical attackers, so I don't consider defence investment too important. Anyway, thanks for the suggestion! I'll definitely try it out, and yay for triple wish spam! XD
 
Hey man, sick team. Always nice to see a creative stall build. This reminds me a lot of lil manaphy's style. Anyway, this rate is probably useless since shadow tag is gone now but I wanted to recommend a physically defensive gliscor over landorus. The reason for that is because it still fills the same role and, despite lacking intimidate, it has very reliable healing in the form of poison heal and roost. This is important because I see the best way to pressure this team is to try and break it while alo is trying to pass wishes to other members. When gliscor has a form of recovery, it makes the members less dependent on each other to succeed while still maintaining a strong defensive synergy.

Hope I helped! [:
 

Googly

Arcadia
is a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnus
Hey man, sick team. Always nice to see a creative stall build. This reminds me a lot of lil manaphy's style. Anyway, this rate is probably useless since shadow tag is gone now but I wanted to recommend a physically defensive gliscor over landorus. The reason for that is because it still fills the same role and, despite lacking intimidate, it has very reliable healing in the form of poison heal and roost. This is important because I see the best way to pressure this team is to try and break it while alo is trying to pass wishes to other members. When gliscor has a form of recovery, it makes the members less dependent on each other to succeed while still maintaining a strong defensive synergy.

Hope I helped! [:
Thanks, I appreciate it :] Yeah, that's the big problem with Lando-T is its lack of reliable recovery. It's hugely dependent on Alo and Umbreon's Wishes to stay healthy, which as you said can be exploited. But Intimidate is what makes Lando such an effective pivot. It allows me to switch in on a physical attacker that's trying to set up in my face and then U-Turn safely out to Ditto. I know Gliscor could do the same thing (and would even be a better answer to Bisharp) but without Intimidate it'd take more damage and having recovery won't really matter since it won't be staying in long enough to use it. Alomomola is also reliant on Lando's Intimidate to wall powerful threats like Mega Medicham and Mega Heracross.

With Shadow Tag gone, I have been changing up the team though. Gliscor does have its merits over Lando, but the one issue I've had with running Gliscor on this kind of stall is that I rely on Heal Bell to keep the rest of the team healthy. This works against Gliscor's Poison Heal, and if it gets its Toxic Orb Knocked Off that can be real bad news. I know it can still be run, but Gliscor + Heal Bell is something I try to avoid if possible.



So yeah, I've been altering the team a bit, trying to make it work without Gothitelle. I honestly didn't think it could be done, but I might have a new variation of the team that works just as well, if not better. I'm still testing it, but it's done pretty well on the ladder so far (iirc it was something like 30-1 at one point). Unfortunately I couldn't keep Ditto on the team, so it's not a Ditto Stall Squad anymore lol. Don't know if I should make another RMT or anything, but I'd rather not change the original even though it's outdated now haha.
 

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