Don't Use This, Use That

Discussion in 'BW RU' started by DittoCrow, May 19, 2013.

  1. Hot N Cold

    Hot N Cold PLUTO
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    Dont use this:
    [​IMG]
    Feraligatr @ Life Orb / Lum Berry
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Dragon Dance
    - Waterfall
    - Ice Punch
    - Earthquake / Crunch


    Instead use this:
    [​IMG]
    Crawdaunt @ Leftovers / Life Orb
    Trait: Adaptability
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Dragon Dance
    - Waterfall
    - Crunch
    - Substitute / Superpower


    Fera DD have no double stab, less attack and worst ability for this set which means that is outclassed by Crawdaunt since this have a better ability to break by the reasons mentioned, the worst speed and bulky isnt a deal for Crawdaunt since have a nice type that help to setupp on common mons like Slowking, both of them should be outrunning by common things like Rotom-Cut Scarf. While the different of power between both is very notorious. If you wanna use Feraligatr just run a SD versions because is bulkier and better because also take advantage of Torrent with Acua Jet + Waterfall and you can run like item Mystic Water, when Sheer Force gets released in Feraligatr will be another story totally diferent. After of this I should to say that DD Crawdaunt is better because the offense presence doing a lot of damage with Waterfall and Crunch. Anyone know that Crawdaunt is a pain for stall teams that lacks of Tangrowth / Poliwrath / sometimes Ferroseed.

  2. DittoCrow

    DittoCrow
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    DD Feraligatr is actually really good from my experiences and I would recommend using it. It has an easy time breaking walls and wearing down the opposing team, or it can sweep offensive teams late-game. It can catch many teams off guard with Ice Punch/Crunch and boosted Speed. Crawdaunt isn't that good in my opinion because it has a hard time setting up and gets outsped by a lot of Pokemon even at +1. Crawdaunt may be good vs. stall, but struggles greatly against offense.
  3. Hot N Cold

    Hot N Cold PLUTO
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    The problem that i have with DD Fera in this case is like wallbreaking if you need a wallbreaking Ferra is better Sword Dance since the speed boost against walls is irrelevant, if you wanna better wallbreaking even you can just run Waterfall or Acua Jet | Crunch | Ice Punch or Earthquake with LO which is gonna break better, doing a lot of better damage against stuff like Poliwrath.

    I know that Fera have an easy time to setupp since is bulkier than Crawdaunt but this last is really stronger than Ferra because higher Atk + Adaptability. The extra power is relevant than a bit more of bulk imo

    A comparison of power between them:

    252 Atk Life Orb Feraligatr Waterfall vs. 0 HP / 0 Def (custom): 146-173 (42.81 - 50.73%)
    252 Atk Life Orb Feraligatr Return vs. 0 HP / 0 Def (custom): 125-148 (36.65 - 43.4%)

    252 Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Waterfall / Crunch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def (custom): 216-255 (63.34 - 74.78%)
  4. DittoCrow

    DittoCrow
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    What I meant was that DD Feraligatr can also clean up because it outspeeds Aerodactyl and everything below, notably Sceptile, Galvantula, and Lilligant; it also outspeeds Scarf Emboar which means that it doesn't need Aqua Jet, so it gets to use an extra coverage move. SDGatr has 4mss so DD + Ice Punch can come in handy to catch stuff like Sceptile. A lot of people on the ladder are probably just using it wrong (sending it in too early, running EQ, etc.). I guess I wouldn't really compare the two and wouldn't say to not use DD Gatr. "Don't use this" is supposed to include unviable stuff like Scarf Archeops, and I don't think that DD Gatr is unviable.
    Hot N Cold likes this.
  5. Hot N Cold

    Hot N Cold PLUTO
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    Yes, i agree with you. I dont think that its unviable but i think that is outclassed mostly on my thoughts. Maybe should be switchted to "why its better" "why its worst / outclassed in this part" because i feel the same with another sets like Choice Galvantula over LO Galvantula, Hitmonchan Foresight over Kabutops, Suicide Lead Aerodactyl, Scarf Absol over all out attacker. I dont think that some of them are unviable just more limited / less dangerous. :)

    I'll post more lately ~
  6. Molk

    Molk Partakes in Buttish activities
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    I'm going to work off of DD Feraligatr here, i really don't think DD Feraligatr is bad, but there's one set that i see people using that confuses me to no end.

    Don't Use This:

    [​IMG]
    Feraligatr @ Leftovers
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Dragon Dance
    - Aqua Jet
    - Ice Punch
    - Earthquake

    Why Its Bad:

    There are two things very wrong with this set that i'd like to point out to you guys. The first and most noticable of which is the use of Aqua Jet as the main STAB move. Of Course Aqua Jet is perfectly viable on Swords Dance Feraligatr, but there is legitimately no reason to use it as your main STAB move on Dragon Dance Feraligatr. Aqua Jet only has half the base Power of Waterfall, meaning you'll often miss out on KOs Waterfall would've scored, and using a priority move on a Pokemon that's boosting its Speed stat with Dragon Dance is simply put......redundant. You probably already outspeed the Pokemon you're going to be hitting with Aqua Jet, why use a priority move here? If your concern is hitting scarf Electric-types that still outrun gatr at +1.....well Feraligatr still can't OHKO them with Aqua Jet without a +2 boost, so you could only really KO them after a Swords Dance regardless :/. The other *bad* part about this set is the use of Leftovers. It might not seem bad at first to use Leftovers on a reasonably bulky sweeper, but i feel Feraligatr really needs to the extra power on the Dragon Dance set. Because Dragon Dance isn't boosting Gatr's Attack as much as Swords Dance, i feel Feraligatr needs all the power it can get, and when using Leftovers i often find Gatr misses out on KO's it would've easily scored with Life Orb.

    Instead, Use This:

    [​IMG]
    Feraligatr @ Life Orb
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Dragon Dance
    - Waterfall
    - Ice Punch
    - Crunch / Earthquake

    Why its better:

    Unlike the above set, this Dragon Dance Feraligatr uses the powerful and consistent Waterfall as its main STAB move instead of the weak and completely redundant Aqua Jet, making it much easier for Feraligatr to score KOs against Pokemon it needs to hit its main STAB with while sweeping, and drastically lowering the amount of people who laugh at you for using a priority move as your main STAB move on a Pokemon thats boosting its Speed stat. This Feraligatr also has a Life Orb instead of Leftovers, trading in the longevity for the extra power i feel DD feraligatr really needs to function, letting gatr score some Extra KOs it wouldn't be able to otherwise, and even eventually lowering Feraligatr into torrent range to pull off a super powered Waterfall. Crunch is also the primary slash over Earthquake here as it gives Feraligatr a good way to hit Slowking hard, which is very important considering how common and power it is in the tier currently. Overall, i feel this set is much, much better than the set listed above with Aqua Jet, and i don't understand why you'd even consider DD+Aqua Jet in the first place tbh.... (Feel free to disagree with me though).
  7. Molk

    Molk Partakes in Buttish activities
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    I just checked to see, and Dragon Dance+Aqua Jet is legal on Feraligatr via chain breeding. Dragonite gets Aqua Jet as an egg move and learns Dragon Dance by level up. Because Dragonite is in the same egg group as Feraligatr, both moves can be passed on at the same time, meaning DD+Aqua Jet is a legal combination.
  8. Punchshroom

    Punchshroom
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    Yeah I deleted my post before you posted yours. Forgot Nite got Aqua Jet as an Egg move in B2W2.
  9. Kenny

    Kenny don't expect me

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    Don't Use This:
    [​IMG]
    Electivire @ Life Orb
    Trait: Motor Drive
    EVs: 144 Atk / 140 SAtk / 224 Spd
    Naive Nature
    - Wild Charge
    - Flamethrower
    - Ice Punch
    - Earthquake
    Why Its Bad:
    Not strong enough, despite the nice coverage it has. Usually for its intent, it was too weak to be a really effective wallbreaker (especially with it's weak ass moves), often missing out on important KOs that other mons could net, which can be the difference between the opponent losing their mon or you losing yours. With the mons it's super effective against, even then it has troubles and doesn't eat them. Wild Charge also has a lot of recoil, especially when paired with LO, ensuring Electivire dies as quick as 3-4 turns into its existence. Some examples of it not being strong enough:
    144 Atk Life Orb Electivire Wild Charge vs. 252 HP / 152+ Def Uxie: 109-130 (30.79 - 36.72%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
    144 Atk Life Orb Electivire Wild Charge vs. 252 HP / 192+ Def Spiritomb: 121-144 (39.8 - 47.36%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
    144 Atk Life Orb Electivire Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Regirock: 138-164 (37.91 - 45.05%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
    144 Atk Life Orb Electivire Wild Charge vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Eviolite Misdreavus: 114-136 (35.18 - 41.97%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
    144 Atk Life Orb Electivire Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Eviolite Roselia: 234-278 (76.97 - 91.44%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    Instead, Use This:
    Not much is a good comparison really, it's a unique mon but sadly it sucks at what it's unique at (Although other wallbreakers can be used in it's place like Aggron and Druddigon [mixed druddigon n_n], or other Electric types like Galvantula and Manectric.)
  10. ScraftyIsTheBest

    ScraftyIsTheBest all hail Greninja
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    Don't Use This:

    [​IMG]

    Drapion @ Life Orb / Lum Berry
    Trait: Sniper
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Swords Dance
    - Crunch
    - Earthquake
    - Poison Jab / Taunt

    Why it's bad:
    Please don't use this as a physical sweeper. Drapion has a mediocre base 90 Attack and low base power STABs. Furthermore, its coverage is not going to cover up most of the tier, and is not great overall offensive coverage. Drapion can't do significant damage to most of the tier, not even OHKOing many things in the tier. Without Poison Jab it's relatively helpless against Tangrowth and such, and overall it's a really mediocre offensive Pokemon in this metagame. It's also really badly outclassed as an SD sweeper by Scolipede, who although has the same Attack, has greater Speed as well as a much more brutal STAB move in Megahorn, and it also deals with Tangrowth really well. Drapion sucks as an offensive Pokemon in this meta and Offensive Drapion is just terrible in general.

    Instead, Use this

    [​IMG]


    Drapion @ Leftovers
    Trait: Battle Armor
    EVs: 248 HP / 244 SpD / 16 Spe
    Careful Nature
    - Toxic Spikes
    - Taunt
    - Whirlwind
    - Crunch

    Why it's better:

    Drapion functions best in this metagame as a specially defensive Toxic Spiker. It has a very useful typing, and its alright special bulk make it a viable check to some common special threats such as Sceptile, Mesprit, and Sigilyph. It also has Toxic Spikes and Whirlwind, so it can support its team to set up hazards while spreading toxic poison across the team with its mighty Whirlwind. It also has a nice Taunt to do well with, and can stop Sigilyph and Clefable, two pains to stall teams. Drapion also pairs up very well with Misdreavus, covering up each other's weaknesses really well. Hail teams also enjoy its presence.
  11. Molk

    Molk Partakes in Buttish activities
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    Going to revive this thread to post a set that i really don't think should be getting so much use and a better alternative :s.

    Don't Use This

    [​IMG]
    Golurk @ Leftovers
    Trait: No Guard
    EVs: 148 HP / 252 Atk / 108 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Stealth Rock
    - Earthquake
    - Dynamicpunch
    - Stone Edge

    Why its Bad:

    To be honest i've never seen any appeal in No Guard Golurk, and ever since BW2 i've always found Iron Fist to be the superior ability because of Golurk's new movepool additions. Of course i can understand the initial appeal of an 100% accurate confusion move that does damage, but to be honest i don't find it to be worth it. Firstly, using No Guard Golurk weakens some of Golurk's other moves, such as Fire Punch, Ice Punch, Thunderpunch, Drain Punch, and most importantly Golurk's potential secondary STAB Shadow Punch, which only has a measly 60 BP without the Iron Fist boost, ensuring that No Guard Golurk struggles a bit more with Pokemon such as Uxie and Mesprit who would all fall to Golurk's Iron Fist boosted STAB Shadow Punch. The weakening of Golurk's punch based coverage moves is detrimental as well, as even if Golurk uses these moves instead of Stone Edge, the power difference is very noticeable. Speaking of Power, because of Golurk's lack of STAB on DynamicPunch, the move is a bit less spammable than it would be on, say, no guard machamp, further reducing its effectiveness as most of the time Golurk would want/need to use its main STAB move regardless. All in all, i simply don't think an unstabbed Confusion move is worth the drop in power of Golurk's secondary Ghost-type STAB, Drain Punch, and many of Golurk's coverage moves in the elemental punches.

    Instead, use this:

    [​IMG]
    Golurk @ Leftovers
    Trait: Iron Fist
    EVs: 148 HP / 252 Atk / 108 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Stealth Rock
    - Earthquake
    - Shadow Punch
    - Fire Punch / Drain Punch

    Why Its Better:

    This is my favorite offensive tank Golurk set at the moment, and i've had far more success with this Golurk than i've ever had with No Guard Golurk to be honest. As i went over in the previous paragraph, Iron Fist changes Golurk's STAB Shadow Punch from too weak to be of use to a decently powerful move that can damage pokemon No Guard Golurk would have a lot of trouble with, such as the previously mentioned Uxie and Mesprit. This Golurk also uses either Iron First Fire Punch or Drain Punch over Stone Edge in the last slot (i know these can technically be used on No Guard Golurk too, but they lose a bit of power without Iron Fist) to either make Golurk a decent check to Escavalier while giving it a way to hit various Grass-types on the switch such as Sceptile, Lilligant, and Rotom-C or give Golurk a way to attack and recover a decent amount of HP at the same time.
    Soulgazer likes this.
  12. -Tsunami-

    -Tsunami- ¡YA HA!
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    Don't Use This:
    [​IMG]
    Medicham @ Life Orb
    Trait: Pure Power
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Fake Out
    - Bullet Punch
    - Hi Jump Kick
    - ThunderPunch

    Why it's bad: Medicham DOES NOT have Technician. Relegating Medicham to using 40 Base Power priority moves with poor coverage is not the way to abuse Pure Power. This set does not help stop the few things that can tank hits from Medicham at all; in fact, it does the opposite. Fake Out gives almost the entire tier a free switch-in, meaning Medicham will likely be forced out / KO'd on the following turn. Not to mention, Fake Out and Bullet Punch do not even hit help against the best set-up sweepers in the tier, as Pokemon such as Shell Smash Omastar and Hone Claws Durant tank the moves easily. Medicham does not even learn Mach Punch, making this strategy even more useless. Having these moves also clogs up Medicham's movepool and makes it miss out on having a Psychic-type STAB move in Zen Headbutt (Psycho Cut is incompatible with Bullet Punch).

    Instead, Use This:
    [​IMG]
    Medicham @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Pure Power
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Adamant / Jolly Nature
    - Hi Jump Kick
    - ThunderPunch
    - Psycho Cut
    - Trick

    Why it's better: Scarf Medicham outruns a plethora of threats in the RU metagame, and still hits extremely hard, being able to 2HKO Alomomola and Tangrowth. The opponent will be hard-pressed to find very many things that can switch into this set, especially because ThunderPunch 2HKOs Slowking. Psycho Cut provides good coverage alongside Hi Jump Kick, and can hit Rotom extremely hard. On top of all of this power, Medicham boasts access to Trick, which allows it to completely cripple otherwise solid switch-ins, such as Uxie and RestTalk Spiritomb, which is the only other good Ghost-type Pokemon in the tier.
    Magical Magmortar likes this.
  13. Molk

    Molk Partakes in Buttish activities
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    Don't Use This

    [​IMG]
    Steelix @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
    Brave Nature
    IVs: 0 Spd
    - Curse
    - Gyro Ball
    - Earthquake
    - Fire Fang

    Why Its Bad:

    While Steelix's good all around bulk, steel type, decent STABs, and low Speed might make it seem like an ideal curse user, Curse Steelix usually doesn't function too well in practice, and it should usually stick to going on the defensive. While Steelix has massive physical bulk to work with, it has a very low Special Defense and common weaknesses to moves such as Scald and Fire Blast that hold it back from being able to use curse to become an unstoppable tank, as the opponent can simply switch in a bulky Water-type like Slowking, something like say Moltres, or simply just a powerful special attacker with a decent neutral move at any time and wipe out Steelix no matter how many Curse boosts its gained over the course of the match (Curse boosts defense not special defense ;-;). One of the reasons say Curselax was good way back in the day was because its Special Bulk was so high it could stomach multiple special hits even though it couldnt boost that stat with Curse, Steelix Doesn't have that luxury, and its therefore inferior. Also note that while 85 Attack is decent, Steelix will probably still need at least two Curse boosts to do any serious damage to the opposing team, especially against teams that carry bulky Pokemon such as Tangrowth and Alomomola, further hindering it. Lastly, Curse Steelix has no recovery move to heal itself with, meaning it will eventually be worn down by repeated attacks, and even if it chooses to use something such as rest, that just gives the opponent two free turns to either force the steelix out or go to a Pokemon that can KO it.

    Instead, Use This:

    [​IMG]
    Steelix @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 220 Def / 36 SDef
    Relaxed Nature
    IVs: 0 Spd
    - Stealth Rock
    - Gyro Ball
    - Earthquake
    - Roar

    Why Its Better:

    While Steelix shouldn't be Curse Sweeping anytime soon, there's no denying that Steelix's massive bulk, slew of physical resistances, phazing, and access to Stealth Rock all make it one of the best physically defensive support Pokemon in the tier. Steelix can take pretty much any physical hit with ease with this set and set up Stealth Rock, a really powerful and important move, can even take boosted hits from threatening physical sweepers and phaze them out, racking up hazards damage and eliminating any stat boosts they may have accumulated in the process. Examples of Pokemon this Steelix can effectively check for balance/stall include Escavalier, Absol lacking fire blast, Cinccino, Druddigon without Flamethrower, Kabutops lacking Waterfall, Aggron, Klinklang, Braviary, and Swellow. I'd say a good support pokemon that can set up rocks, phaze out set up pokemon and rack up hazards, and check and counter a slew of physical threats is much better than a silly Curse set with little utility that will rarely end up sweeping regardless.
  14. TROP

    TROP FUCK DRUDDIGON

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    Don't Use This:
    [​IMG]
    (Entei) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Pressure
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    IVs: 30 Def / 30 SDef / 30 Spd
    - Flare Blitz
    - ExtremeSpeed
    - Stone Edge
    - Iron Head

    Why it's bad:
    What are you even hitting with Iron Head besides Regirock who isn't even common in the current RU meta (note: Iron Head doesn't even score a 2HKO on 252/0 Regirock, so it doesn't really help that much against Regi either lol)? I know that is the filler slot you will rarely use, but seriously, there are much better options in the filler slot than Iron Head, such as Sleep Talk and Hidden Power Grass. at least they actually help your team by giving you a great sleep absorber that matches up well vs most of the common sleep inducers such as Lilligant and Amoonguss or greatly damage some of the things that are supposed to counter/Check Entei such as Kabutops, Omastar, Quagsire, and the manly Rhydon.

    Instead, Use This:
    [​IMG]
    (Entei) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Pressure
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    IVs: 30 Def / 30 SDef / 30 Spd
    - Flare Blitz
    - ExtremeSpeed
    - Stone Edge
    - Sleep Talk / Hidden Power [Grass]

    Why it's better:
    Sleep talk gives your team a nice sleep absorber(check if opponent has HP Rock Lilli before sending Entei to absorb the sleep), while being infinitely more useful than Iron Head. HP Grass does what Iron Head is supposed to but 100x better because it actually has good chances of ohkoing Kabutops after Stealth Rock Damage, prevent Omastar from setting up and probably sweeping you with +3 speed and +2 sp.A, as well as hitting Rhydon and Quagsire for solid damage because otherwise they stomach Flare Blitzes from entei without even trying.

    I know this might be silly because it is just a move, but it gets almost as much usage as the good options for Entei's last slot on its cb sets.

    Im sure the reason sleep talk got more usage than Iron Head this month is because molk plays a lot and used entei a lot last month
  15. Molk

    Molk Partakes in Buttish activities
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    Don't Use This:

    [​IMG]
    Snover @ Eviolite
    Trait: Snow Warning
    EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature
    - Substitute
    - Leech Seed
    - Protect
    - Blizzard

    Why Its Bad:

    When most players see an NFE, they usually go for Eviolite as the item and try and pull off a more defensive set, thinking that the Pokemon will be more viable with the item. Most of the time this is true, but this isn't the case for Snover. While Snover does get the boost from Eviolite, it still functions pretty poorly defensively because of its 7 common weaknesses to moves such as Flare Blitz, Stealth Rock, Drain Punch, U-turn, and Iron Head. These weaknesses hold back Snover quite a bit when it comes to being an effective defensive Pokemon, and because of them, pretty much any Pokemon in the tier can 2HKO defensive Snover at the very worst outside of a few specific Pokemon such as Qwilfish and Lanturn, making an offensive set more worthwhile in the end.

    Instead, Use this:

    [​IMG]
    Snover @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Snow Warning
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
    Rash Nature
    - Blizzard
    - Giga Drain
    - Hidden Power [Fire] / Toxic
    - Ice Shard / Protect

    Why Its Better:

    Focus Sash Snover is probably the best set Snover can run in the current metagame, and its exceptionally good at doing damage to common Blizzard checks early game such as Entei, Emboar, Offensive Magneton, and Escavalier, wearing them down for the Blizzspammers to break through more easily later on. and can possibly even wear down or even KO various offensive Pokemon such as Accelgor and Galvantula with decently powerful blizzards and alright coverage Of course, this set can't really take any hits at all even compared to the above set, but it doesn't need to thanks to its handy Focus Sash, which ensures Snover survives for at least one turn to fire off a Blizzard bar multi hit moves. Plus, the majority of the time Snover only needs to survive a few turns to make a big impact because of its hail, so bar opposing weather inducing moves there's no huge need for the tree to survive the whole match.

  16. Silvershadow234

    Silvershadow234 :]]]]]
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    Don't use this:
    [​IMG]
    Durant @ Life Orb
    Trait: Hustle
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature
    - Hone Claws
    - X-Scissor
    - Iron Head / Thunder Fang / Rock Slide
    - Superpower

    Use this:
    [​IMG]

    Durant @ Leftovers / Lum Berry
    Trait: Hustle
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature
    - Hone Claws
    - X-Scissor
    - Iron Head / Thunder Fang / Rock Slide
    - Superpower

    In my experience, Life Orb has generally been a bad choice for Hone Claws Durant. This is because, with its low HP and Special Defence stats it needs all the help it can get to actually set-up a HC, and LO reduces sweeping time and certainly doesn't help it set-up at all. Leftovers and Lum, while they do miss out on some KO's that Life Orb would get, make setting up much easier which generally does make the difference between setting up a Hone Claws / maintaining a sweep or not.
  17. DittoCrow

    DittoCrow
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    I think Life Orb is pretty good because Durant is so weak. When I used Lum Berry I kinda lost a lot of power and switched back to LO (probably because I was using it to wallbreak instead of sweep late-game). I never really use Hone Claws anyways unless the opponent is extremely weak to Durant; it just doesn't get the chance to very often because it is so frail.

    Also I think Rock Slide is a viable choice if you want to lure in Moltres and other Fire-types. What you shouldn't be using is STONE EDGE >_>
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2013
  18. Kenny

    Kenny don't expect me

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    Messages:
    460
    Don't Use This:
    [​IMG]
    Bouffalant @ Life Orb
    Trait: Sap Sipper
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
    Adamant Nature
    - Head Charge
    - Megahorn
    - Stone Edge
    - Earthquake


    Why Its Bad:

    One of the reasons Bouffalant should be used is because of its good bulk, which allows it take surprisingly strong hits and hit very hard in return with a STAB Head Charge or coverage move. Life Orb is usually good on physical attackers, but imo it cuts into that impressive bulk too much for it to be a good option on Bouffalant, especially with Head Charge recoil, I'd much rather use CB to reduce recoil or Lefties to increase longevity, otherwise it just dies too fast imo, despite the nice power boost.


    Or This:
    [​IMG]
    Bouffalant @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Sap Sipper
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
    Jolly Nature
    - Head Charge
    - Megahorn
    - Stone Edge
    - Earthquake

    Why this is also bad:


    Choice Scarf might seem appealing at first to patch up Bouffalant's low Speed stat, but in reality Bouffalant is way too slow to use Choice Scarf effectively, being unable to outpace boosted threats of any kind with the item, and not even having enough speed to outpace things such as Cinccino and Sceptile even with the Choice Scarf, that's definitely not fast enough to make a potential revenge killer or Choice Scarf user. I'd much rather either have the raw power of Choice Band or the freedom to switch moves and some passive recovery with Leftovers than have the speed boost in this situation. Also, those moves aren't the /best/ moves to be locked into, considering that both Head Charge and EQ have types that are completely immune to it, forcing a switch. Choice Band Bouffalant has the same problem, but more raw power to back it up.ʕ•͡ᴥ•ʔ ʕ•͡ᴥ•ʔ



    Instead, Use this:
    [​IMG]
    Bouffalant @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sap Sipper
    EVs: 156 HP / 252 Atk / 100 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Substitute
    - Swords Dance / Stone Edge
    - Head Charge / Return
    - Earthquake

    Or
    [​IMG]
    Bouffalant @ Choice Band
    Trait: Sap Sipper
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
    Adamant Nature
    - Head Charge
    - Megahorn
    - Stone Edge
    - Earthquake


    Why They're Better:

    Lefties, the catchall item! Lefties gives Afrobull a lot more longevity than the previous too items, and also lets it take more hits/use substitute more effectively. SubSD is particularly scary, especially for defensive teams because of the nice bulk it sports and its ability to boost (although it has a bit of trouble with Scolipede and ghosts). Even without SD, Substitute Bouffalant is particularly effective at switching in on common Grass-types, setting up a Substitute as a cushion, and posing an immediate threat to the switch in afterwards. It serves as a really nice check to those Grass types that like throwing around Sleep Powders and whatnot =p. CB Bouffalant is really cool too - although being locked into a move with common resists/immunities isn't the best, it packs a REALLY strong punch, and can score many 2HKOs and OHKOs that Substitute Bouffalant can't, such as a 2HKO on Spiritomb after Stealth Rock with Megahorn, a 2HKO on Golurk with Earthquake, and a guaranteed OHKO on Druddigon after Stealth Rock with Head Charge.
    ScraftyIsTheBest likes this.
  19. Molk

    Molk Partakes in Buttish activities
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    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    Don't Use This:

    [​IMG]
    Ferroseed @ Eviolite
    Trait: Iron Barbs
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Relaxed Nature
    IVs: 0 Spd
    - Stealth Rock
    - Gyro Ball
    - Leech Seed
    - Thunder Wave / Protect

    Why Its Bad:
    Ferroseed's Bulk and set of resistances might make it seem like a good hazard setter at first, but compared to other Pokemon that commonly carry Stealth Rock.....there are better options for just purely setting up Stealth Rock that have more overall utility/power such as Druddigon, Rhydon, Golurk, and Steelix. In my opinion Ferroseed is better off setting up Spikes, as its bulk lets it get up at least two layers up reliably, and it has more of a niche setting up Spikes than it does Stealth Rock, thanks to the moves limited distribution compared with the somewhat common Stealth Rock. With this in mind, some players might want to run both Stealth Rock and Spikes on their Ferroseed, but this is hard to do effectively because of Ferroseed's case of 4mss: it'll either have to give up an attack, a way of healing and wearing down the opponent at time same time, or a way to cripple the opponent (assuming you run Thunder Wave) to fit both SR and Spikes on the same set, each of which leaves Ferroseed open to various threats that it would've been able to hurt/cripple otherwise. While not mentioned here, i also dislike using Protect on Ferroseed for the same reasons, because while the extra Leech Seed recovery and ability to scout Choiced Pokemon can be useful, i often find either an attack move or Thunder Wave too vital to give up, same goes for other various support moves.

    Instead, Use This:
    [​IMG]
    Ferroseed @ Eviolite
    Trait: Iron Barbs
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Relaxed Nature
    IVs: 0 Spd
    - Spikes
    - Gyro Ball / Seed Bomb
    - Leech Seed
    - Thunder Wave

    Why it's better:
    While not too different from the set posted above, i feel like Ferroseed makes a more effective spiker than it does of setting Stealth Rock, and this set makes full use of what Ferroseed can bring to a team. As stated earlier, there are usually much better options than Ferroseed when it comes to purely setting up Stealth Rock, and Ferroseed really doesn't have the moveslots needed to set up both Stealth Rock and Spikes in one set while still being effective otherwise, all in all making it best at setting purely Spikes, which is does rather reliably. Ferroseed can reliably switch in on many strong moves such as Aggron's Head Smash, Druddigon's Outrage, and Kabutops Stone Edge and can use those opportunities to rack up residual damage and set up multiple layers of Spikes. Outside of setting up Spikes, Ferroseed can check these same Pokemon it can switch in on, wear down the opponent further with Leech Seed and Iron Barbs, and cripple opponents with Thunder Wave, which is especially important as things like Entei and Emboar that might want to switch in on Ferro hate being paralyzed (Twave and Gyro Ball might seem to conflict at first, but the reality is Ferroseed is so slow it can still hit paralyzed opponents with a max or near max power Gyro Ball >_>). Gyro Ball is Ferroseed's most powerful move overall, and in fact its high base 150 BP helps out with Ferroseed's mediocre Attack stat somewhat, while Seed Bomb makes ferroseed a better overall check to Crawdaunt and Omastar, letting the seed KO them more easily. So all in all, i feel this Ferroseed set carves the biggest niche for itself, works to its maximum effectiveness, and uses all of its moveslots as efficiently and effectively as possible, whereas trying to fit Stealth Rock or other moves like Protect kinda hinders that.

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