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DP Battle Tower Records

Discussion in 'Smogon's Greatest Hits' started by Peterko, Sep 20, 2007.

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  1. Jumpman16

    Jumpman16 np: Michael Jackson - "Mon in the Mirror" (DW mix)
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis an Administrator Alumnus

    Dec 19, 2004
    Thanks, and sure why not:

    Cresselia@Choice Scarf ** Wind Chime
    EVs: 252HP / 252Spd / 4SpD
    Nature: Bold
    ~ Trick
    ~ Thunder Wave
    ~ Reflect
    ~ Flash

    Timid wasn't worth it, especially when I realize that Metagross is incapable of both being able to 2HKO Cresselia with Meteor Mash provided the first one boosts and being faster than Cresselia after the Trick (can't be both +Atk and +Spd), and since Metagross is pretty much the first pokemon to consider when thinking of a Trick/Switcheroo poke, Bold passed.

    Latios @ Leftovers ** unban me
    EVs: 4HP / 252SpA / 252Spd
    Nature: Timid
    ~ Dragon Pulse
    ~ Calm Mind
    ~ Substitute
    ~ Rest


    Scizor@Sitrus Berry ** MEGA MAN X
    Ability: Technician
    Nature: Adamant
    EVs: 84HP / 252Atk / 172Spd
    ~ Bullet Punch
    ~ Superpower
    ~ Substitute
    ~ Swords Dance

    "Scizor is uber." For some numbers, a +6 Technical Bullet Punch does 90-106% to a no HP/Def EVs Charizard (all of them in both DP and PT) if it has 31/31 HP/Def IVs. That's honestly murderous. This can at least 2HKO everything in the game at +6, but the awesome thing is how many things it can OHKO without any risk at all: basically if you are not a Water, Fire, Electric or Steel Type, you are OHKOed by Scizor. This covers the Flame Body and Static Issue as well to some degree if they are the second pokemon (Effect Spore sucks too but whatever), as I doubt I'm setting up Scizor on a Static or Flame Body pokemon just by the nature of the attack they probably used on Cresselia. IIRC, Cresselia and Slowbro/King and maybe Zapdos and Gyarados are the only pokemon this Scizor can't OHKO at +6 with either move. Sitrus Berry is because I'll need that HP immediately, and survivability is more important than the 1.2× boost Iron Plate would give me.

    Flash rules but I really miss Charm sometimes, even if 3/9 Accuracy for Special and Physical attacks is comparable to 2/8 Attack. Scizor's fun as hell and is making the BT enjoyable for me again, though I already realize that setting it up for fun is not the best idea, since there are quite a few pokemon that can break its sub if and when it can't OHKO them with BP or go first with Superpower, which compared to +6 Latios behind a sub isn't as attractive in the long run, but that's what practice is for...

    I was largely over my disappointment last night when I posted and am even more now, so understand that I'm being completely level-headed when I call this post ridiculous and almost troll-like on many levels given what I just posted. First off, you're using literally my Starmie team, the same team a dozen people have posted in this thread that they have used, but with a few changes for the worse Chople Berry isn't worth it and "Stone Edge is the worst attack in DP" (and I can say this stuff because I've used this team more than anyone). You probably didn't know this or at least I hope not because it's on like a dozen pages of this thread, lol.

    Second, you didn't get "hacked" with your Gengar team. Thunder blows in the BT without rain and is bad even in competitive play, and you are begging to miss by relying on it and not Thunderbolt. I don't know if you have Counter on your set but that is 100% the right move to use if so since Aero has a decent chance of outspeeding Gengar. Further, going to Starmie first hoping for a miss and not Garchomp was just not a good move, at all. It doesn't really matter that you got CHed by Stone Edge, and certainly bitching that it CHed which is 10% but also that you missed with Thunder which is a 30% chance is just brow-raising.

    Third and most important, the fact that you don't know that the only Stone Edge Aero in the BT indeed has a Choice Band tells me that you have absolutely no right to be as confident that you are "good" (your word) enough to get to 300 wins. Besides the fact that you'd be using a worse version of my team that I can say with my experience would be hard-pressed to break 250 with even while knowing all of the movesets, not only do you not know how to use the team, but it's both rude and ignorant to call it "boring" to get to 300 wins. Rude because this thread is for people who actually care about the BT, but ignorant because the grind to 300 wins being boring isn't the reason you won't make it to 300 wins as you arrogantly imply—you won't make it because neither you nor the team are good enough to. Sorry.

    Fourth and finally, don't double post.

    I've had lucky strings like that too, lol. I think it was the same Gallade and a similar number of turns...but I didn't really need much luck because it was Charmed three times, Paralyzed, and facing Latios. Oh I guess I took its Scpoe Lens, but if it's then supposed to CH 1-out-of-8 turns, it didn't once over the eight turns it has to CH Latios (switch in, Sub, and 6 CMs). During my 321 streak actually, I did paralyze a Staraptor and Charm it three times, but it's still capable of breaking Latios's Sub with two Brave Birds, so I have to hope for an FP or two if I want to get 6 CMs without having to Rest naked. It was not FP once in at least a dozen turns, (it used Roost a couple of times in there), which is 3.1% hax...whatever though I guess!

    thanks, and yeah i know it man, we're pretty much honestly exactly the same person, lol. (and people, dont forget how much peterko has done for this site, he's probably our most unheralded user!) i am going to stop using the 3L team in favor of the CLS team, just because, thinking about it rationally, even if I did want to prove that my Lopunny team is the best, what's the difference? When you read that question literally, it's exactly nine battles, give or take however many you want to for the 7-8 times I used the CLS team. If all goes well and I get to 329, I'm going to use the Lopuny team on that round of 7 just becaues it will be fitting, I think! If I had not been driving when I started the round after 308 straight or 315 straight, I would have turned animations on for the first time since like February, but: "Why would I have animations on when I'm playing while I'm driving? That doesn't make sense." (lol)

    no doubles though, i have unfinished business =/ is that how it works, though? for the doubles tower can you really actually use two DSes? i honestly don't know how it works and i thought that was just for the Link one or whatever

    Thank you. I'm actually not convinced, but for the first time since about April or May it will actually be somewhat fun for me to play the Battle Tower (besides the few times I used the CLS team for "playtesting purposes"). Also, for what it's worth it makes me feel better to learn that you obviously aren't 15 or 16 years old (I know how old you are now through the admin panel but won't post it), as I feel better having been behind another adult on the record list, lol
  2. makiri

    makiri My vast and supreme will shall be done!
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnusis a Past WCoP Championis a defending SPL Champion

    Jun 24, 2006
    What McGraw said is true, Jumpman's post is a perfect example of the love/hate relationship many of us have with Pokemon. I applaud Jump for sticking with it, the number of times he could've just walked away from the BT is staggering, a lesser person would've given up long ago.

    I'm still at 161 because I am afraid of losing and I've actually spent more time in the past few weeks devising a 2vs2 team instead of actually playing my 1vs1 BT.

    I really can't wait until Jump starts using the CLS team, because Scizor and its Bullet Punch negates any real qualms about giving a Scarf to <Pokemon>. The moment he showed me I knew the team was going to be amazing, and I even told him "I wouldn't be surprised if you hit 999."
  3. Syberia

    Syberia [custom user title]
    is a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

    Jun 22, 2005
    I wouldn't count on hitting 999 anytime soon in the hax tower... :(
  4. FastHippo


    Dec 26, 2007
    I tried Sand Attack on my Hippo. I loved it! But, of the at least three times that I got to 3/9 and switched to 'Chomp, I would get hit about 80% of the time. This made me think that the accurracy was restored when Hippo switched out. It is frustrating to get hit four consecutive times by a 26.7% accurate move. And then get hit by three out of four, twice.

    I take that you are certain that the accuracy stays lowered, if the pokemon stays in?

    About my age, if you send me a PM, I will tell you how old I am. Suffice it to say, I played Pong when it was new. Except for the three years after my first child was born, I've been playing video games.

    It's kind of funny, short version. I replied to someone(I don't remember who) by saying that very few people are so busy that they have absolutely no leisure time available.

    They responded by saying something like, bless me if I haven't gotten to the point in my life where I have to prioritize my time.

    I didn't respond, but it made me chuckle.
  5. Shelcario


    Nov 25, 2007
    I always love seeing Jumpmans' posts as they are interesting and make the Battle Tower more interesting for me, so thank you Jumpman16 for making the BT more interesting for me:)
  6. Little Green Yoda

    Little Green Yoda

    Aug 8, 2005
    Okay, now that I personally gave my luck to you, I expect a 999 run, Jump. <_<

    I just lost my streak at 151 straight wins. :( My team is solid but not really one designed to exploit the AI. I dodged a lot of hax bullets and frankly, it was probably about time that it came back to screw me over.

    Timid Levitate 4 HP, 252 SpA, 252 Spd
    @ Black Sludge
    Shadow Ball
    HP Ice [67]

    Finally gave in and used Gengar after seeing how many teams utilized it with great effect. But I wanted to use its immunities/resistances (which are AMAZINGLY useful) to the max so I went with a more conservative set than CounterSash.

    Hypnosis isn't a horrible filler move and is only used when I'm desperate (7 in 10 chance of incapacitating the opponent when you're cornered isn't too bad). For the same shaky accuracy, it's more useful overall than Focus Blast anyhow. General strategy is to decide whether I should stay in and 1HKO/2HKO the opposing lead or switch if the other Pokemon can 1HKO Gengar. Knowing when to switch is crucial since I also use Gengar to cleanup and revenge-kill later in the match if possible.

    Black Sludge over Life Orb due to my conservative nature and it actually has saved Gengar from being 2HKO'd on many occasions.

    Bold Magic Guard 252 HP, 152 Def, 104 SpA
    @ Leftovers
    Calm Mind
    Ice Beam

    The inspiration for the team since I bred one of these and I wanted to try it out. Pretty standard fare. Magic Guard means I lol @ Toxic stallers. I generally try to find a way to stat up and sweep but crits can be troublesome (though I didn't have much problem in my latest run).

    Leftovers over Life Orb since surviving to stat up is more important than an extra kick in offense IMO.

    Suicune has better defenses to pull this off but it lacks a 50% recovery move and losing the Ghost immunity means I won't have a free switch against Ghost leads. Blissey also has better stats but no reliable way to get rid of status when running a CM set. Magic Guard >>>> Natural Cure since I don't want to switch out to remove status.

    I'm considering maybe running DDTar in this slot in the future though since I could also use a Dark resist to go with a Ghost resist.

    Jolly Sand Veil 4 HP, 252 Att, 252 Spd
    @ Yache Berry
    Swords Dance
    Dragon Claw
    Fire Fang

    The best Pokemon to use in the Battle Tower IMO. Every team that's not running a full fledged strategy or ScarfChomp should use one. Nothing more needed to say other than it's one of the best at turning 1-3 deficits into 1-0 victories.
    How I lost

    Opponents sends out Latias. I figure there's no way to kill it in one shot with Gengar barring a crit and I didn't want to risk missing with Hypnosis since Psychic would surely kill Gengar. So I switch to Clefable who takes a Psychic (~35% damage). I decide to CM up only to find out that Latias is doing the same thing -_-;. I sprinkle an Ice Beam here and there to weaken it since I know that the CM Latias set doesn't run Speed EVs, meaning Garchomp could easily revenge kill it assuming its health was low enough. Eventually Clefable faints after spamming Ice Beam since I'm paranoid that Latias might Roost. Garchomp comes in and does its thing.

    Out comes Articuno. :( No way my Stone Edge-less Chomp can finish the icy bird before it 2HKOs me. I Fire Fang, hoping for a flinch but it Ice Beams me, activating Yache. Fire Fang did roughly 1/3 so I decide to D-Claw instead (fearing the 95 accuracy would screw me over) and let Gengar revenge kill Articuno (one of the Articunos carry the Electric resist berry so I couldn't rely on T-bolt). D-Claw crits and leaves Articuno with a sliver of health. >:[ Chomp dies to Ice Beam and Gengar finishes Articuno off.

    Zapdos then joins the fray and Detects first turn. It appears to be a bulkier set; I run some calcs and figure there's no way I'm 2HKOing Zappy without a crit. And T-Bolt would surely 2HKO Gengar. Cue Hypnosis. I mean, cue Hypnosis' unreliability since it decides to miss while Zappy T-bolts Gengar for like 65% damage. I Hypnosis again and thankfully, it hits. I follow up with HP Ice, which does roughly 1/3 damage only to have Zapdos wake up immediately and faint Gengar with Drill Peck. :(
  7. Jumpman16

    Jumpman16 np: Michael Jackson - "Mon in the Mirror" (DW mix)
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis an Administrator Alumnus

    Dec 19, 2004
    That's some tough luck there Yoda but congrats. And I commend you for using a "team that doesn't exploit the AI" (and Clefable in general) and realizing that there's a pretty big difference between those that do and those that don't when you're talking about trying to break 200 wins.

    oh i missed this, thanks EE!

    As for SpD for walls...I welcome them. None of them can do anything to Lopunny on Turn 1 except Regice Ice Beam which I have beaten about a dozen times even though it does over 25% to Luke with the first IB. And when Latios is set up, Substitute ensures I am able to kill them all in at most two turns. The only pokemon that aren't OHKOed by a +6 Latios Timid 252 SpA EVs Dragon Pulse are: Blissey, Probopass, Bastiodon Registeel, Regice, sometimes Metagross and Regice, and very rarely Skarmory and Magnezone (one of the four each has a like 50/50 shot).

    I may be forgetting one or two but it doesn't matter because I ensure I am behind a sub 99.9% of the time, which ensures me that I win 99.999% of my battles with a +6 Subbed Latios. Lucario's only a liability because of its just "good" speed, meaning I have to get it into Salac range which is at least risky most of the time and impossible at others. Locking, say, Aggron into Stone Edge, Charming it and waiting for it to Struggle is a balancing act that I'm not sure can ever result in exactly a +6 Luke at 1-25% and Subbed, and this failure directly cost me my second highest streak at 268 to that Sash Garchomp and then Tyranitar.

    The final reason for CMers is that Special Attacks are superior to Physical attacks in the BT if just because of Static, Flame Body, Poison Point, Effect Spore and Aftermath and Rough Skin. Those first three will probably screw you over at some point if the first or second poke has one of those abilities. I've considered Lum on Scizor but Sitrus is too useful to pass up, and futher, I cannot imagine a scenario in which I am locking in a Turn 1 Flame Body or Static poke to a move that Scizor is setting up on anyway. So it's only Turn two that those Abilities have a shot of screwing me over, and, well, lets just say I hope it happens after 330 if it's going to happen, lol. As far as Sub goes, it is the best and most useful way, in my opinion, to combat Brightpowder, Quick Claw, and Focus Sash all in one, though I advise at least one move on any one team that can deal with Brightpowder and evasion if you don't have Sub. Evasion's hardly an issue for as I've stated before because I don't care if I lock something into DT, it's off my screen in at most 19 turns regardless of what happens.
  8. setris


    Jul 7, 2008
    Just lost at 115.

    Latios @ Expert Belt
    Timid: 4 HP, 252 SpA, 252 Spe
    -Dragon Pulse

    Good type coverage for my lead. Aside from being strong and fast, it also happens to be pretty bulky, surviving some attacks that I was sure would take it out. Trick room users destroy it though, since I outspeeds almost anything normally and most trick room users resist Latio's STABs.

    Metagross @ Lum Berry
    Adamant: 152 HP, 252 Atk, 104 Spe
    -Meteor Mash
    -Bullet Punch

    Usually my finisher, although it can take on entire teams if Latios bites it early on. It has alot of power behind it, so Meteor Mash and Earthquake hit just about everything hard. Bullet Punch is good for picking off weaker things, and Explosion's always handy if I need a sure-fire way to end things quick.

    Infernape @ Life Orb
    Naive: 128 Atk, 128 SpA, 252 Spe
    -Close Combat
    -Grass Knot
    -Hidden Power [Ice]

    My pinch-hitter. It didn't see too much action, since it was so frail to begin with, and I only ever used it when I was backed into a corner, since it can hit fast and hard. I considered replacing it for a while, but I never could think of something good enough. I remember seeing some mixed Tyranitar variant somewhere that looked really interesting, so that might be worth a try.

    Latios and Metagross were the one-two punch of the team. Latios almost always managed to take out about 1 - 1.5 opponents (sweeping entire teams a surprising amount of time, too), and then Metagross would come in, get it down to 2 on 1, and explode for the win.

    I ended up losing to some trick room team. The game leads off with Bronzong, and I know the set, so I know it's gonna trick room right off the bat, and it has earthquake, so Infernape's out of the question. Latios can sometimes get lucky against those Bronzong, so I decide to risk it. I finally take it out, and it brings in Ampharos, who get me first because of trick room. It uses signal beam on my Latios, which is in the red from being gyro balled, and takes me out. I bring in Metagross. It still outruns me because of trick room, but charge beam leaves me with a good chunk of health, so I get it with earthquake. The it brings in Magmortar, which either speed ties me or outruns me with a +speed nature, just in time for the trick room to run out. It outruns me and takes out what I have left with flare blitz. Then comes in my last resort, Infernape. I know the set, I know it has earthquake, and I know it's gonna use it, so I decide to bet it all one one close combat. Close combat hits, and leaves it with just a sliver of health left, and it takes out Infernape, even more frail with the defense drop. gg
  9. Phoenix_21


    Mar 18, 2007
    Just posting to say that even though I've not been involved with the Battle Tower at all (relatively - I needed a choice scarf and power items, lol) Jump's 321 post was great to read and I really wanted to offer my congratulations/sympathies to him on his streak and '37 mins away' loss of same.

    This post feels monumentally insubstantial compared to the dedication and forethought that the creation and correct use of the 3L team must have required, but 'oh well' I guess. GL with the CLS team Jump.
  10. Jumpman16

    Jumpman16 np: Michael Jackson - "Mon in the Mirror" (DW mix)
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis an Administrator Alumnus

    Dec 19, 2004
    Thanks man, the sentiments are appreciated. As I stated, though, I'm honestly a little crazy, and I have 6,956 Battle Points as of the time of this post, so that's a little bit of an indication of how much I've put into this!

    setris, if I can offer some advice...usually I am able to bounce my pokemon off of Trick Room pokemon's attacks when it's Gallade or Slowbro or Porygon2. You should know what move they are going to use, and therefore it was a good idea to switch Infernape into to likely a 4Enter text here.× NVE Signal Beam from Ampharos (since you knew which set Bronzong you were facing, you therefore knew which Ampharos you were facing too). Sure, there's a chance it uses Thunder Wave, but a Paralyzed Infernape is better than a Paralyzed or dead Latios. Then switching Metagross into the electric attack is the best course of action and going from there. Trick room will wear out before Ampharos can have a chance kill Metagross, and if somehow you're not able to EQ Ampharos, you have Infernape to severly dent if not kill it, and if Amphy still doesn't die, Latios cleans up probably,even given Magmar's Passho Berry. Just a good way of thinking about how to deal with Trick Room in general.
  11. DougJustDoug

    DougJustDoug Knows the great enthusiasms
    is a member of the Site Staffis an Artistis a Programmeris a CAP Contributoris an Administratoris a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
    CAP Leader

    Jun 26, 2007
    Jumpman, a bit of a late post here to say congrats on the 321 streak. That is an epic string. I also appreciated every word of your post detailing how you got there. I have not played the BT in several months, but find myself scheming on new strategies almost on a daily basis. My fascination with the BT does not reach your level of obsession -- but I have spent enough time in the tower to appreciate and identify with your quest. As mad scientists go -- you are one of the maddest. They say people that drink too much like to hang out with people that drink even more, just to make themselves feel like they don't have a problem. Along that same line of thinking, thank you for being a little bit nuts Jumpman -- it makes me feel a little bit more "normal" when it comes to this Battle Tower thing. ;-)
  12. CaptKirby


    Nov 4, 2006
    I think my biggest problem with your logic, Jumpman, is your use of "fair" and "unfair" to talk about it. It is entirely fair to lose at a game that has luck as a factor at any time regardless circumstances or of time and effort invested, or in regard to any other problems. Unfair is when you are deliberately cheated by some factor. (Fair versus unfair in terms of hacking is an annoying argument that can never be settled, so I am not applying it to encompass that as well)
  13. Chinese Dood

    Chinese Dood

    Aug 15, 2008
    Hey setris, I'm no Jumpman, but I just have an advice to give. I think, assuming that most of the time, you won't need to use Infernape until your opponent has one pokemon left, having Focus sash instead of Life Orb is more useful for your Infernape, since you'd get to attack twice instead of once at 1.3 power. It's especially good since Infernape's frail anyway and won't survive much of an attack if it gets hit after a close combat. Basically if you're outsped, you get to attack once (whereas with LO you wouldn't be able to attack at all [so 1x attack vs 0x with LO]), while if you're faster, you'll get to attack twice [2x attack vs 1.3x with LO].
  14. Jumpman16

    Jumpman16 np: Michael Jackson - "Mon in the Mirror" (DW mix)
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis an Administrator Alumnus

    Dec 19, 2004
    I used fair and unfair to talk about the ways that I lost three specific streaks that had nothing to do with the "luck factor" in the game. I did not once even mention Brightpowder or Quick Claw or Critical Hits in that post, because nobody wants to hear that crap (especially not for 3,700 words). The fairness and unfairness I speak of can completely and directly be applied to a "DP Chess Tower Records" when you think about it. Having my "DP Chess" CD-Rom freeze during a long chess winning streak would elicit the same exact kind of "unfair" post from me.

    As I mention in that post with my "don't throw your DS" lesson that I've learned, it can obviously be argued that it was indeed "fair", which is why I put the word in quotes pretty much every time I used it to talk about how I "unfairly" lost those streaks. But your "game that has luck as a factor" does not logically apply to that argument, because luck literally had nothing to do with why I used "fair". Thanks for reading my post though (or at least some of it, lol)!
  15. Groombridge


    Dec 19, 2007
    Singles: 122 wins

    This was an accident. I hadn't played singles seriously for months, since doubles is more my game and I'd spent my time developing my Trick Room team. I'd play a round or two of singles or whatever in between doubles, just to keep 'fresh'. (BTW, 50 wins in Multi! Curselax and DD Gyara F the W!)

    As I was playing my last doubles streak, I noticed I'd got to 84 wins in singles on the side. I'd used a standard SD Lucario, a Jumpmanesque Outrage Scarfchomp and the DD Gyara I'd used to play through the game. Thinking, 'wow, I'm near my ultimate strong 100 win record!', I decided to improve the team a little and maybe inch my way towards the singles leaderboard...

    Lucario is tremendous fun, but the best lead I've used is undoubtedly Gengar. I repurposed the one from my Gravity team.

    - -
    Gengar @ Focus Sash
    Timid, Levitate
    252 SpA, 252 Spe, 6 HP

    Destiny Bond
    Energy Ball
    Shadow Ball
    - -

    Anyone else fed up with Hypnosis and Focus Blast missing? One of the reasons I used a Gravity team was just so that I could throw those around willy-nilly. Well, not in singles. I went for 100% accurate attacks plus the mighty Destiny Bond. Energy Ball is actually really handy for messing up Swampert, Rock/Grounds etc. The more things Gengar can OHKO on Turn 1, the better.

    - -
    Gyarados @ Leftovers
    Adamant, Intimidate
    170 HP, 160 Atk, 80 Def, 100 Spe

    Dragon Dance
    Ice Fang
    - -

    I bred a new Gyara, mostly so I could actually know what its EVs are. The EV spread was supposed to be the one McGraw came up with... but I misremembered it somewhat. So my Gyara has less speed, a little less attack, and a lot more bulk. Er, thanks, McGraw! ^_^;

    - -
    Garchomp @ Choice Scarf
    Adamant, Sand Veil
    252 Atk, 108 Spe, 148 HP

    Aerial Ace
    Dragon Claw
    - -

    Scarfchomp. You know his steez.

    - -

    It's a sweeper team through and through. Gengar can 2HKO a hell of a lot with its moveset and Sash, usually allowing it to Destiny Bond the second enemy out. From there, I go to Gyara, simply because I'd rather switch Chomp into Rock or Electric attacks more than Gyara into Ice or Dragon.

    Two on one means we can usually pull off a win. If Gyara can DD, like against Weavile or whatever, it's usually GG. This is fast and fun, as distinct from my doubles team, which is all business, baby. It's slow and bulky, like an Escalade with a Bronzong under the hood, a Hariyama for seats and Magnezones for 24" rims.

    Mental note: build Pokemon-themed rims.

    - -
    Fail time!

    Every saga of awesomeness from Jump or TRE must be balanced with an epic feat of failure.

    Please note that since I've just moved house and have no internet access at home, I was playing 'blind', since I don't have the movesets or trainers committed to memory.

    AI sent out Porygon2!
    I sent out Gengar!

    Gengar has its Sash, so I might as well attack. I can't 2HKO a P2, but I don't want to switch Gyara or Chomp into a Charge Beam or an Ice Beam. Fight!

    Gengar used Thunderbolt!
    35% damage or so!
    Porygon2 used Shadow Ball!
    90% damage!

    Right, this thing has to die.

    Gengar used Destiny Bond!
    Porygon2 used Signal Beam!
    9% damage! 3HP left!
    Gengar was confused!

    Oh. Fuck. You. The AI uses the weakest attack it can to finish the job, but Gengar lives and so does P2. But the confusion? I can just see Gengar knocking itself out next turn. I have to switch.

    It 'should' go for Signal Beam again, right? I could get Gyara in safely, but I'll need to set up, and I'm worried about getting Tri-Attacked back to the Stone Age. I'll send in Chomp to Outrage the space duck.

    I switched in Scarfchomp!
    Porygon2 used Ice Beam!
    My hopes and dreams were cruelly dash'd!

    That's odd... why did it use Ice Beam? This particular P2, I later found out, has Tri Attack/Ice Beam/Signal Beam/Shadow Ball. If the AI uses the weakest move to finish the job, why did it use the second strongest in that situation?

    Obviously this sucks megaballs for me, as my closer is now dead, but at least I can use Destiny Bond now. I didn't realise this P2 had a Quick Claw either, but that didn't make any difference.

    Gengar is back in effect, bitches!
    Gengar used Destiny Bond!
    Porygon2 used Signal Beam!
    Oh, now you use it! Well, fuck you!
    Porygon2 and Gengar died!

    So now I'm 2:1 down. I'm expecting a Starmie or a Froslass or something...

    AI sent out Blaziken!
    I sent out Gyarados!

    A ray of hope... after Intimidate, nothing it can do should kill Gyara barring a CH.

    Gyarados used Dragon Dance!
    Attack buff, speed buff!
    Blaziken used Stone Edge!
    55% damage! Lefties! 51%.

    I'm not going to risk another DD here. I just have to take out the chicken and see what comes next.

    Gyarados used Waterfall!
    Blaziken fainted! Lefties! 57%.

    Now let's see...

    AI sent out Hariyama!

    I love this guy, he's the lynchpin of my TR team. Right now, though, I'm gonna strike. I don't want to DD again and then eat a Stone Edge. I ain't goin' out like no punk bitch.

    Gyarados used Waterfall!
    65% damage!
    Hariyama used Rock Tomb!
    30% damage, speed drop!
    Lefties! 43%.

    It's coming down to the wire. I still don't know what this dude has, so I assume it'll use Rock Tomb again and continue the asswhipping.

    Hariyama used Endure!
    Gyarados used Waterfall!
    34% damage!
    Salac activated!
    Lefties! 49%.

    Should have seen that coming, should have Danced. After the speed drop from Rock Tomb, this thing is faster than me. I'm screwed.

    Hariyama used Reversal!
    Gyarados is like, fuck you, fatty.

    If Chomp had still been kicking, Aerial Ace would have finished the job. Alas.

    - -

    And that's that. Here's the question: when Gengar was on 3HP, why did Porygon2 use Ice Beam and not Signal Beam? It should have used the weakest move for the job, so why did it switch from a 75bp 4x resisted attack to a 95bp neutral one? Is there a degree of randomness involved, or was it just screwing with me?

    - -
    Enough about me: respect to Jump for a truly epic streak. 321 is an incredible achievement, as is not killing yourself playing your DS while driving. I have enough trouble playing mine on the London Underground, so my hat goes off to you just for that. Seriously, what do you say if you get pulled over? Or does having a Sub up protect against traffic misdemeanours in the US? :)
  16. Jumpman16

    Jumpman16 np: Michael Jackson - "Mon in the Mirror" (DW mix)
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis an Administrator Alumnus

    Dec 19, 2004
    Well, the pigs here in the states are either Oblivious or they have Thick Fat, so I guess they're all Oblivious here in Pittsburgh! Thanks though.


    and thanks for this.

    To answer your question, my DS is pretty much either on my lap (right thigh) or not more than an inch or two from it. Nobody can see me playing unless they are in a big 18-wheeler.
  17. KwameTheGreat


    Oct 6, 2008
    I've been wondering the same FREAKING thing. Something is screwed about that game. Say I have a Pokemon in and the opponent uses a SE attack against me and I'm about to die. Thinking it's going to do it again, I switch into something else, and guess what? It decides to use a different move that wouldve been Neutral/NVE to my other Pokemon but SE to the one I just brung out. I REALLY think the game is made so it records what your switching in and everything and then programs the Pokemon to use a different move and everything.

    As for the guy that got the 900+ streak or whatever. Yea not believing that. Hax HAS to get at one point or another. Thats ridicolous. Idc what anyone says. Trust me, I USED to hack when I was a noob. U kan easily put in a AR and use the "Restore Health" cheat code and never lose. I used to do that when the game would cheat me. But it didn't feel the same as me accomplishing it on my own so I stopped. That's why I rather have video proof AFTER getting the 900+. But hey, thats just my opinion.

    My other war story...Man I swear God always comes through for me.

    Kwame Sends Out Breloom
    CPU Sends out Raichu

    Raichu Focus Blast Me for over 50%
    I spore it

    Raichu Stays Sleep
    I Drain Punch It For +50%..And gets paralyzed

    Next turn I Drain Punch For Ko

    CPU sends in Rapidash
    Rapidash mEgahorns for Breloom KO

    My Gatr DD's
    CPU Rapidash Megahorns and misses

    Bekuz I wanted 2 be stupid and not be careful accidentaly pressed Ice Punch instead of Waterfall!
    CPU Rapidash takes 30%...And then Horn Drills for the KO

    I Send it Raikou...Subs it
    Rapidash Horn Drill Misses

    (This is when I start praying hard)
    I CM...Rapidash Misses AGAIN
    I CM again..It hits with Megahorn and breaks the sub

    I Thunderbolt for OHKO

    Opponent sends in....Quagsire!

    I only have HP Ice and I know it most likely has EQ so I started complaining how I always lose

    All I remember is it kept using Amnesian then had started Mud Bombing and at the end when I had 70% or less health It keep missing over and OVER. Then I FINALLY killed it down with HP Ice.

    Now THATS what you call miracles. I swearz God's got me out of many situations where I shudda lost.

    God = Serious Bizness. Lul.

    Another Thing..Why the HELL does those OHKO hit so much..and their 30%?? Like wtf. BT Hax sooo much.
  18. kd24

    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Dec 21, 2007
    alright i finally charged my ds and played the battle tower, being extremely frustrated that i could never break past 60.

    Yesterday I hit 85 before losing with a simple team of Sash gengar, SD Skarm (helped with battles 40-60 where ohko moves are all the rage), and a scarfchomp for clean up. i was fairly happy with the team although I dont even remember what I lost to (although i believe it was a froslass).

    anyway, i liked the scarfchomp which is why i made a new team.

    Latias: Leftovers
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
    - Dragon Pulse
    - Safeguard
    - Recover
    - Calm Mind

    ok, my reasoning is fairly simple on the lead. Safeguard and Cm yourself up to be almost unstoppable if they dont have a good physical attacker. Dragon Pulse will do some major damage although remember, this is meant to be an attacker. Latias should be aiming to protect garchomp and lucario. I should have eved for full speed but whatever, its all good.

    Garchomp: Choice Scarf
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    - Earthquake
    - Outrage
    - Fire Fang
    - Stone Edge

    garchomp is a pretty safe switch in for the things that beat latias (sash pokemon with strong bug type attacks, steel types who take jack from dragon pulse, ect.). I really just wanna be able to kill as much as possible. I might switch to fire blast but fire fang is somewhat helpful anyway (95 acc 55 bp physical > 85 acc 120 bp special without a doubt in the bt).

    Lucario: Focus Sash
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    - Extremespeed
    - Close Combat
    - Swords Dance
    - Crunch

    i need a ice resist and a dragon resist and something that could deal with yanmega pretty easily. i already had a sd lucario set up which deals with ice and dragon types ... somewhat well and sd extremespeed, inner focus, and focus sash should help beat yanmega fairly easy.

    ok so im a bit shaky on this team which is why i want some advice on how to improve it. I might actually just rid latias for my sash gengar who was extremely helpful.

    ill keep you guys updated and hopefully i get some advice on gengar vs latias.
  19. RobertM


    Oct 7, 2007
    Hey, Jumpman, Why use flash? I'm not an expert like you, but accuracy modifications always seem to have no effect for me =/. If you fight 1,000
    or so pokemon won't flash eventually not do it's job right when you need it?
  20. Shelcario


    Nov 25, 2007
    I also agree that using accuracy lowering moves wouldn't work too well in the Battle Tower because the opponent like always will get lucky/use their haxing abilities to surpass over the accuracy drops but, considering I've never tested these moves in the Battle Tower then don't take my word for it.
  21. KwameTheGreat


    Oct 6, 2008
    oMFG..HAX..But Im only mad kuz I was on floor 70+. I spore a Empoleon. I Drain Punch. it Wakes up, Blizzard. OHKO. I use Raikou Thunderbolt. Then comes Lucario with EQ. I thunderbolt with like 40% health left. He EQ's. Like last time though, I didn't survive it. All bekuz someone Empoleon Woke up. If not. Spore Luke. Drain Punch. Game.
  22. RobertM


    Oct 7, 2007
    ALWAYS sub after a spore. ALWAYS. Also, Drain Punch? Why?
  23. Jumpman16

    Jumpman16 np: Michael Jackson - "Mon in the Mirror" (DW mix)
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis an Administrator Alumnus

    Dec 19, 2004
    Yeah so I just got kind of gayed at Battle 201 with my CLS team, though I'm honestly not too pissed about it because if, when starting my streak again last Thursday, I had to pick one number to get gayed at, it would be 201. Much more than that and it's another "really long" streak I lose, and literally one less battle and it's only a streak of 199. I realized last week that I have a chance to take three different teams to 200 or more, so whatever "I did it".

    Here's why Metagross is my least favorite pokemon:

    Jogger Ryne sends out Metagross...I literally face one of the two QC variants 90% of the time, this is not even an exaggeration and this is no exception

    QC activates (doesn't matter but thanks), MM, Atk raise (does matter, thanks)/Trick, ~60%

    so yeah that's pretty lame. I don't want to die to the next MM after I TW so I Reflect

    Reflect/MM, Atk raise, ~30%

    ok cut it out? since the rest of my moves dont do anything to metagross i have to waste a turn hoping it doesn't atk raise again

    Reflect/MM, no atk raise thankfully cress faints

    so yeah what a dick. I already know Scizor takes more than 25% from an unboosted MM so I have to SD

    SD/MM, Atk raise, ~65% HP

    lol. Reflect was still up but I likely won't get a chance to SD twice...I "can" SD once and hope that it doesn't CH (3.98%) but i wouldn't exactly be surprised if it did!

    SD/MM, ~46% after Sitrus

    So no FP or miss and I have to Superpower...I've been in worse sports before than a +3 Scizor with no Sub. Calcing this now confirms that this Metagross was +Attack...if it hadn't been, I may have had the HP to consider SDing again "but whatever". There are a lot of pokemon that Scizor can OHKO at +3 with BP...

    SP Atk/Def drop, fuck off Meta...go Arcanine

    ...and this isn't one of them. I think it had Intimidate but I don't know for sure, but I do know that it's this one:

    752 Arcanine Adamant White Herb Overheat Thunder Fang Crunch Iron Tail HP/Atk/Spe

    Latios walls one Arcanine and this isn't it. I have to Bullet Punch and it only does 47% (as expected, +6 kills most Charizard, even more Blaziken and all Infernape/Houndoom). I have to send out Latios to CM and kill it, luckily I don't get CHed but it does enough to ensure that final poke Mamoswine's Ice Fang kills after taking 70% from +1 DP. "Oh well".

    I've seriously considered Trick/TW/Reflect/Flash Starmie in the leadoff spot now that it gets Trick cause it will draw EQ from Metagross and, with 252 HP/Def actually cannot be OHKOed by even Rhyperior's +Atk, QC Megahorn, but Yanmega would be pretty gay to face and Heracross to a lesser extent so whatever. This loss was pretty fluky as far as I'm concerned, with three Attack raises and one of the like only pokemon +3 Scizor can't at lest severly dent coming out second, since Jogger Ryne can't use Heatran and +3 Scizor would have done about 70% to the BP-resisting Starmie, for example.

    That said, calcing now, Latios does 56% min to that Arcanine, and I may have won if I'd elected to just DP Arcanine since it was at ~53%, but I felt that the last poke would have a better chance of dying to 1.5 DP than to unboosted DP no matter my HP...this is probably a mistake and I likely would have calced instead of assuming if I hadn't been driving! A loss like this does mean that I won't exactly be playing 3-4 hours a day if I break 330 (like I would anyway, lol), but it doesn't mean I'm going to quit because actually looking at the pokes Jogger Ryne can use, Arcanine is seriously the only pokemon that can screw me there. ~For Some Numbers~:

    A poke needs:

    • an equivalent of Base 90 HP/85 Def and at least neutrality to Steel to not be OHKOed guaranteed by +3 Bullet Punch (98.18% min damage), or
    • an equivalent Base 90HP/120Def at at least neutrality to Fighting to not be OHKOed guaranteed by +3 Superpower (97.58% min damage), or
    • to have greater than 107 speed if it doesn't meet the requirements of surviving a +3 Superpower (or just QC me, one of the main reasons I am in love with Bullet Punch, go straight to hell Quick Claw)

    Actually going down the list of the 68 pokemon Jogger Ryne can use (instead of continuing my new streak, lol), here are the pokemon that even remotely give me trouble, where I define trouble here as "Scizor can't at the very least dent this enough for Latios to cleanup with DP since it will beat Mamoswine 1-on-1 over 90% of the time" since over 75% of the time Mamoswine can't OHKO 100% HP Latios with Ice Fang. Even given the low chance that Metagross gets three Attack raises. That chance is 0.8%, and I figure that it will get four cracks at three Attack raises before Scizor is assured "comfort" in setting up. These pokemon are (assuming HP/Def IVs of 31, i have bolded the ones that deserve any comment whatsoever):

    691 Gengar Timid Brightpowder Hypnosis Dream Eater Shadow Ball Focus Blast SpA/Spe, no, lol

    692 Ampharos Bold Chesto Berry Thunder Wave Charge Beam Signal Beam Rest HP/Def/SpD, no, SP does 104% min

    693 Politoed Careful Salac Berry Belly Drum Waterfall Earthquake Rest HP/Def/SpD, no, SP kills and i'm faster

    694 Pinsir Adamant Salac Berry Endure Flail X-Scissor Superpower Atk/Spe, no, not at least 165HP/105Def
    695 Scizor Adamant Occa Berry X-Scissor Iron Head Aerial Ace Night Slash HP/Atk
    696 Heracross Adamant Coba Berry Megahorn Stone Edge Facade Shadow Claw Atk/Spe
    697 Ursaring Jolly Toxic Orb Facade Protect Earthquake Crunch HP/Atk/Spe
    698 Houndoom Timid White Herb Sunny Day Overheat Solar Beam Dark Pulse SpA/Spe
    699 Donphan Adamant Brightpowder Earthquake Stone Edge Thunder Fang Ice Shard Atk/SpD, SP does 98% min so no

    700 Wailord Adamant Leftovers Curse Earthquake Waterfall Double Team HP/Atk/SpD
    701 Claydol Brave Quick Claw Explosion Earthquake Stone Edge Gyro Ball HP/Atk
    702 Rampardos Jolly Salac Berry Endure Stone Edge Earthquake Giga Impact Atk/Spe

    703 Bronzong Brave Macho Brace Trick Room Gyro Ball Earthquake Explosion HP/Atk, no because Superpower does 95% min and will die to +2 BP next...and if it uses Trick Room after the SP I actually have a better chance to win, literally outspeeding everything with either BP or faster (Trick Room) Superpower

    704 Drapion Jolly King's Rock Poison Fang Fire Fang Thunder Fang Ice Fang Atk/Spe
    705 Luxray Impish Shuca Berry Attract Swagger Thunder Wave Ice Fang HP/Def/SpD, nope, SP does 107% min

    706 Ninetales Bold Grip Claw Fire Spin Hypnosis Fireblast Dream Eater Def/SpA, latios sets up on this so no

    707 Machamp Adamant Chesto Berry Brick Break Earthquake Thunderpunch Rest HP/Atk
    708 Shuckle Bold Leftovers Double Team Substitute Toxic Sandstorm HP/Def/SpD
    709 Roserade Modest Coba Berry Sleep Powder Sludge Bomb Shadow Ball Giga Drain Def/SpA
    710 Honchkrow Adamant Quick Claw Sucker Punch Drill Peck Frustration Roost Atk/SpD
    711 Steelix Relaxed Metal Coat Flash Cannon Gyro Ball Iron Tail Stealth Rock HP/Def/SpA, no, SP does 110% min

    712 Weavile Jolly Choice Band Night Slash Ice Shard Aerial Ace Brick Break Atk/Spe
    713 Gliscor Jolly Focus Sash Counter Guillotine U-Turn Payback HP/Spe, gliscor from hell, but even if it counters or guillotine hits at the very least i enable latios to beat mamoswine 1-on-1

    714 Tentacruel Modest Focus Sash Mirror Coat Surf Sludge Bomb Giga Drain HP/SpA
    715 Aerodactyl Jolly King's Rock Rock Slide Iron Head Ice Fang Thunder Fang Atk/Spe
    716 Porygon2 Modest Quick Claw Tri Attack Ice Beam Signal Beam Shadow Ball HP/SpA
    717 Lickilicky Brave Lum Berry Curse Rest Return Gyro Ball HP/Atk, no, BP does 68% min (SP kills) and what are you going to do, return?

    718 Yanmega Modest Quick Claw Bug Buzz Air Slash AncientPower Shadow Ball SpA/SpD
    719 Gardevoir Modest Brightpowder Psychic Thunderbolt Energy Ball Focus Blast Def/SpA
    720 Gallade Brave Iron Ball Trick Room Close Combat Aerial Ace Stone Edge Atk/Def
    721 Exeggutor Modest Expert Belt Sunny Day Solar Beam Psychic Sludge Bomb HP/SpA/Spe
    722 Starmie Timid Expert Belt Psychic Thunderbolt Ice Beam Surf SpA/Spe, needs to be timid to hit latios with ib after taking ~70% from BP (starmie rules so this is ok...)

    723 Flygon Timid Scope Lens Dragon Pulse Flamethrower Silver Wind Giga Drain SpA/Spe
    724 Vaporeon Quiet Damp Rock Rain Dance Hydro Pump Shadow Ball Yawn Def/SpA, no, SP does 98% min

    725 Jolteon Timid Brightpowder Thunderbolt Shadow Ball Captivate Yawn SpA/Spe
    726 Flareon Adamant Charcoal Fire Fang Return Bite Will-O-Wisp HP/Atk
    727 Espeon Modest Razor Claw Calm Mind Psychic Shadow Ball Hyper Beam SpA/Spe
    728 Umbreon Relaxed Scope Lens Confuse Ray Assurance Last Resort Shadow Ball HP/Atk
    729 Leafeon Adamant Wide Lens GrassWhistle Giga Impact Iron Tail Leaf Blade Atk/Spe
    730 Glaceon Calm Brightpowder Yawn Water Pulse Ice Beam Shadow Ball SpA/SpD
    731 Lucario Adamant Salac Berry Endure Reversal Earthquake Stone Edge Atk/Spe, BP does 65-76% which is good cause it has to EQ cause the chance i put it into salac range is just that slim

    732 Hippowdon Careful Sitrus Berry Sand Tomb Yawn Ice Fang Fissure HP/SpD, sand tomb doesnt do shit even if SP does 57-67%

    733 Probopass Adamant Hard Stone Thunder Wave Rock Tomb Rock Slide Rollout HP/Atk
    734 Dusknoir Brave Spell Tag Trick Room Shadow Punch Earthquake Ice Punch HP/Atk dont care if BP only does 71-85%, latios cleans

    735 Aggron Adamant Quick Claw Iron Tail Stone Edge Earthquake Sandstorm Atk/SpD needs to QC

    736 Walrein Bold Brightpowder Sheer Cold Fissure Rest Sleep Talk Def/SpD, yeah i will actually sub and not care if scizor dies cause latios sets up entirely

    737 Mamoswine Careful Brightpowder Hail Earthquake Fissure Ice Fang Def/SpD, impossible to have faced in hindsight but im faster and SP OHKOs

    738 Lapras Modest Chople Berry Surf Thunderbolt Ice Beam Psychic SpA/SpD, hey lapras i dont care about your chople berry i do 110% min

    739 Crobat Timid Lum Berry Hypnosis Roost Sludge Bomb Dark Pulse HP/Spe
    740 Magnezone Modest Shuca Berry Magnet Rise Charge Beam Flash Cannon Thunder Wave Def/SpA
    741 Rhyperior Adamant Choice Scarf Earthquake Megahorn Rock Wrecker Horn Drill Atk/Spe
    742 Tangrowth Modest Focus Sash Sunny Day Solar Beam Wring Out Sludge Bomb SpA/Spe, sash sucks..oh wait i wall you entirely with hp too low for wring out to do anything, a quad resist to a move you won't get to get off, and an immunity

    743 Porygon-Z Timid Leftovers Charge Beam Tri Attack Magnet Rise Conversion SpA/Spe
    744 Gyarados Jolly King's Rock Waterfall Ice Fang Bite Dragon Dance Def/SpD/Spe, legitimate (gyarados rules too)

    745 Snorlax Adamant Iron Ball Last Resort Fling Recycle Yawn HP/Atk/Def
    746 Kingdra Timid Haban Berry Dragon Pulse Hydro Pump Ice Beam Dragon Dance SpA/Spe
    747 Blissey Bold Brightpowder Counter Hyper Beam Shadow Ball Snatch HP/Def
    748 Milotic Bold Wide Lens Hydro Pump Ice Beam Mirror Coat Recover HP/Def, SP does 85% min so no

    749 Electivire Modest Wise Glasses Thunderbolt Psychic Focus Blast Barrier Def/SpA, dont care, latios sets up and i want that

    750 Magmortar Adamant Passho Berry Flare Blitz Thunderpunch Earthquake Brick Break Atk/Def, even if SP didnt do 116% min dont care, latios sets up and i want that

    751 Togekiss Modest Scope Lens Water Pulse Flamethrower Silver Wind AncientPower HP/SpA
    752 Arcanine Adamant White Herb Overheat Thunder Fang Crunch Iron Tail HP/Atk/Spe, fuck you

    753 Dragonite Modest White Herb Draco Meteor Thunder Hyper Beam Safeguard HP/SpA, BP does 99% min so i dont think so

    754 Tyranitar Adamant Choice Scarf Crunch Stone Edge Earthquake Aerial Ace Atk/Spe
    755 Salamence Timid Petaya Berry Dragon Pulse Hydro Pump Flamethrower Substitute SpA/Spe, bp does 80-95% after intim i dont care

    756 Metagross Adamant Quick Claw Meteor Mash Earthquake Zen Headbutt Arm Hammer HP/Atk, impossible given im calcing these because of the position this bitch put me in but it'd need to QC like Aggron does

    757 Garchomp Brave White Herb Draco Meteor Earthquake Crunch Poison Jab HP/Atk/SpA
    758 Slaking Jolly Expert Belt Return Arm Hammer Shadow Claw Earthquake Atk/Spe, BP does 63-75% but latios sets up on this which i want

    so yeah, literally the only Jogger Ryne pokemon that threaten me even in this shitty situation are arcanine and gyarados. even of the eight brightpowder pokemon which is literally the only other factor (QC is a non-issue unless i'm forced to use SP, as i note with aggron and metagross), mamoswine doesn't count and i wall walrein and kind of glaceon too so ok. i am sure glad i spent time doing that purposeful exercise!

    lastly i kind of wish i'd taken a picture of my 200 given how much i value it even if it isn't required (yet) but I wanted to keep playing and i was driving so "take my word for it"...i dont think it's elitist to say that those already over 200 are more "believable" and most important this is assuming they are using a different team because if, say, garo gets to 251 with his rotom team it doesn't matter, but if carl breaks 200 with whatever team it's a new record for him (and something i'd appreciate a picture of as suggested earlier). i cant imagine many of would think i'd make up this 200 though lol.
  24. FastHippo


    Dec 26, 2007
    Jumpman, I was thinking about this, recently. I am currently actively above 200 with my Lapras team. I think that it matters how many different pokemon you achieve 200+ with. For example, you now have gotten 200+ with 8 different pokemon, correct? Even if I got a third completely different team to 200+, that would only be 7 pokemon.
  25. Jumpman16

    Jumpman16 np: Michael Jackson - "Mon in the Mirror" (DW mix)
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis an Administrator Alumnus

    Dec 19, 2004
    I think it matters as well, that's a good point. I'm not sure how we want to qualify it, but at least two different people seem to realize that it is saying something to have used eight different pokemon to break 200. (I realize I am largely talking about myself and, again, don't want any of you to get the impression I am bragging.) It does mean a lot to me to have taken three teams (and eight pokemon) to 200 or better, almost to the point where I start to maybe satisfy my obsession with proving to myself and to you all that "I am the best", lol. Your own current team has changed one pokemon but I think that constitutes a different team, and at the same time, a notation that you will have used "only" four pokemon on your leaderboard teams is probably in order.

    There also may be something to be said for my old 268 record not being on the leaderboard anymore, as with anyone else in the future like yourself if you break 311 with your original team, however when I think about it it's the best thing to do to leave it off because what am I going to do, take a picture of 329 and 327 and 326 if I do that with the same Lopunny team (I would absolutely lose my mind if that happened btw). It would definitely be something I'd think "requires" proof but you start to draw the line at policing that and to myself I would say "tough luck", lol
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