DPP Jirachi (Physical Mix)

[TAY]

This is a Jirachi that I have been using since the Latias suspect test. It was effective then and it is still effective now, and since the closest set on-site is "Superachi" (which is pretty damn different), I figure this deserves its own set. Additionally, I know a number of other players who can attest to the effectiveness of this set.

current analysis: http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/jirachi

[SET]
name: Physical Mix
move 1: Iron Head
move 2: Ice Punch
move 3: Fire Punch
move 4: Grass Knot / Thunderbolt
item: Expert Belt
nature: Naive / Hasty
evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>While Jirachi is typically seen either running Calm Mind or carrying Choice Scarf, this set is an excellent alternative which acts as both a mid-game wall breaker and a late-game sweeper. Be warned though - this is not a Pokemon which can be haphazardly thrown onto a team with the expectation of functioning well: it serves a very specific role and should only be used if your team is capable of supporting it.</p>

<p>Jirachi's main purpose is as a mid-game wall breaker. Like most mixed wall breakers, this Jirachi relies on excellent type coverage; however, unlike its companions Infernape and Salamence, Jirachi relies not on large damage output, but on surprise value. Expert Belt along with physical attacks will often cause the opponent to assume that Jirachi is holding a Choice Scarf and send in something like Skarmory, Swampert, or Salamence to take the opportunity to set up. Jirachi's oft overlooked 100 base Speed only makes it easier to create this illusion.</p>

<p>Even without bluffing Choice Scarf, however, the oddity of this set is often enough to work your opponent into a corner. If you manage to double-switch into something like Scizor, Swampert, or Salamence, it is unlikely that your opponent will switch out, and you can go for an easy OHKO (Salamence needs to take Stealth Rock damage, due to intimidate). Similarly, Jirachi is perfect for sending in after a double KO via Explosion or recoil damage.</p>

<p>Besides being a powerful wall breaker with its coverage and a useful late game sweeper with a 60% Flinch Rate attack and 100 base Speed, this Jirachi also serves as a useful check against a number of common OU threats. Most notable among these are Lucario and Latias: the former is outsped and takes a minimum of 78% damage from Fire Punch, a sure OHKO after a defense drop from Close Combat (and a possible OHKO after Life Orb and Stealth Rock Damage); the latter will always be 2HKOed by Ice Punch and will generally fail to 2HKO Jirachi.</p>

<p>There are two Pokemon to look out for when using this Jirachi. The first is Heatran, which 4x resists or is immune to every one of this sets attacks, and can easily OHKO Jirachi with Fire Blast. If your team demands it, Hidden Power Ground can be used over Grass Knot or Ice Punch in order to quickly deal with Heatran and Magnezone; however, this will open Jirachi up to even more threats which are more difficult to deal with than the generally predictable Heatran. The second Pokemon to look out for is Gyarados, which will not take much more than 30% from Grass Knot, and can easily set up with Dragon Dance. If you are more worried about Gyarados than Swampert, then you can exchange Grass Knot for Thunderbolt, though that will make Jirachi less effective against both Suicune and the Bulky Ground-type Pokemon. In reality, any combination of these moves can be effective; the key is knowing exactly what your team needs Jirachi to eliminate.</p>

 

[Morm]

Second paragraph, first sentence:

<p>Jirachi's main purpose is as a mid-game wall breaker.

A porpoise is a small dolphin basically :P

 

[Veedrock]

If you manage to double-switch into something like Scizor, Swampert, or Salamence, it is unlikely that your opponent will switch out, and you can go for an easy OHKO.

You should include a special mention that Salamence requires Stealth Rock for the KO, compliments of Intimidate.

199 Atk vs 196 Def & 332 HP (75 Base Power): 264 - 312 (79.52% - 93.98%)

It's never a good idea to assume Stealth Rock.


Love the set by the way. I love Superachi, but this looks so much more useful.

 

[White Ninja]

End of second paragraph says " Jirachi's oft overloked..."
Meant to say often I assume. Change that up.

Edit:
Also this : "...takes a minimum of 78% damage from Fire Punch, a sure OHKO after Close Combat (and a possible OHKO after Life Orb and Stealth Rock Damage); the latter will always be 2HKOed and will generally fail to 2HKO Jirachi."
Kind of sounds as though you wil be using Fire Punch against latias. I do get it, but at first glance I was like Fire punch to a Latias ?

 

[jrrrrrrr]

lol WH1T3N1N7A, "oft" is an adverb too, it's technically correct...do you think it sounds weird? >_>

often; frequently; not rarely; many times (chiefly poetic and dialectal)
en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Oft

But anyways, this looks like the physical version of Superachi. You might want to mention the fact that it also destroys Tyranitar, Scizor and Magnezone in that small section where it mentions the ability of this thing to beat common threats. That seems like a very convincing argument to use this set to me.

You might want to put Thunderbolt as the first option in the 4th moveslot, especially if Manaphy becomes OU.

 

[White Ninja]

Hmm. I seem to be red in the face now. Nevermind then.
I think it is better having Grass knot first rather than thunder bolt like it is , because Swampert will come in to resist an expected Iron Head STAB and EQ you to death. I think Grass knot should be used for that reason.

 

[TAY]

@Morm: Don't worry, it won't go on-site written as porpoise, lol

@Veedrock: Fixed

@Whiteninja: Oft is definitely a word. I fixed the awkward phrasing that you were referring to.

@jrrrrrrr: I will add in something about magnezone for sure, because this is a pretty big deal with bluffing scarf. Tyranitar is pretty obvious (I would like the write up to be more about how to use it than saying specifically everything it beats). Scizor is mentioned briefly, though it might be good to mention that it will easily OHKO just about any Scizor (96% minimum to 252 / 0 Scizor).

I have found Thunderpunch to actually be a better option than thunderbolt on the suspect ladder. This allows Jirachi to come in on CM Manaphy and still be able to deal decent damage, though you miss out on the 2HKO against NP Manaphy (though those often run LO anyway). Gyarados is OHKOed after rocks anyway. You do less to Suicune, but few people use Cune when manaphy is an option.

I manaphy moves to OU, then Thunder[something] will definitely become the main option.

 

[Wishy]

Most notable among these are Lucario and Latias: the former is outsped and takes a minimum of 78% damage from Fire Punch, a sure OHKO after Close Combat...

This part sounds really awkward, because it sounds as if Jirachi is going to be using Close Combat. I don't even understand what you were trying to say here, really.

 

[Syberia]

"a sure OHKO if Lucario has lowered its defenses with Close Combat" would eliminate the confusion.

 

[Aldaron]

Just agreeing with someone that HP Ground should just be a third slash in that last moveslot.

Grass Knot and Thunderbolt are probably better options in general, but it wouldn't hurt having it as a slash along with the set description sentence explaining its purpose against heatran and magnezone.

 

[Fuzznip]

Does the Jirachi still work well if it carries Life Orb? Provided with Wish support, Life Orb can be another option instead of Expert Belt. Jirachi has decent speed so I'm sure he can benefit from it and he won't lose too much health.

 

[TAY]

@Wishy: Changed the phrasing there a bit

@Aldaron: Added HP Ground as a slash, mentioned magnezone in passing

@Fuzznip: Expert belt is by far the superior choice. The biggest benefit I suppose is a OHKO on SpDef Swampert...even now, GK will only do 94% minimum to 252 / 0 Swampert. Still, bluffing choice scarf is both incredibly easy and extremely powerful, and seeing Life Orb recoil will instantly tell the opponent that you are either running a 4 attack or 3 attack set, and they will likely assume some odd combination of attacks. Additionally, Jirachi is an excellent Pokemon defensively, and Life Orb ruins Jirachi's ability to take attacks and keep on sweeping / wall breaking / whatever. Life Orb also means that Skarmory can stall you out just by spamming roost (with Expert Belt you can wait for burn and then flinch with iron head).

If you want to try it out and report back with your honest opinion (and logs) then I would be happy to consider it, but as of now I don't see any large reason to use Life Orb.

 

[Fuzznip]

@Wishy: Changed the phrasing there a bit

@Aldaron: Added HP Ground as a slash, mentioned magnezone in passing

@Fuzznip: Expert belt is by far the superior choice. The biggest benefit I suppose is a OHKO on SpDef Swampert...even now, GK will only do 94% minimum to 252 / 0 Swampert. Still, bluffing choice scarf is both incredibly easy and extremely powerful, and seeing Life Orb recoil will instantly tell the opponent that you are either running a 4 attack or 3 attack set, and they will likely assume some odd combination of attacks. Additionally, Jirachi is an excellent Pokemon defensively, and Life Orb ruins Jirachi's ability to take attacks and keep on sweeping / wall breaking / whatever. Life Orb also means that Skarmory can stall you out just by spamming roost (with Expert Belt you can wait for burn and then flinch with iron head).

If you want to try it out and report back with your honest opinion (and logs) then I would be happy to consider it, but as of now I don't see any large reason to use Life Orb.

Hmm, that totally makes sense now that you explained it to me. I just thought it would improve Jirachi's sweeping capabilities, not wall breaking. I'll try him out with a Life Orb and see how it goes.

 

[iKitsune]

Does the Jirachi still work well if it carries Life Orb? Provided with Wish support, Life Orb can be another option instead of Expert Belt. Jirachi has decent speed so I'm sure he can benefit from it and he won't lose too much health.

I believe the main reason this works well is because of its suprise factor that is why life orb is not really feasible.

 

[Fuzznip]

Yeah, the Jirachi doesn't do so well with Life Orb. I mean, it's an outstanding late-game sweeper, but health is too valuable for this kind of Jirachi. You can mention it if you want in the analysis that LO is an option if you use Jirachi as a late-game sweeper. I dunno, it's up to you.

 

[Zepar]

This is a Jirachi that I have been using since the Latias suspect test. It was effective then and it is still effective now, and since the closest set on-site is "Superachi" (which is pretty damn different), I figure this deserves its own set. Additionally, I know a number of other players who can attest to the effectiveness of this set.

current analysis: http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/jirachi

[SET]
name: Physical Mix
move 1: Iron Head
move 2: Ice Punch
move 3: Fire Punch
move 4: Grass Knot / Thunderbolt / Hidden Power Ground
item: Expert Belt
nature: Naive / Hasty
evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>While Jirachi is typically seen either running Calm Mind or carrying Choice Scarf, this set is an excellent alternative which acts as both a mid-game wall breaker and a late-game sweeper. Be warned though - this is not a Pokemon which can be haphazardly thrown onto a team with the expectation of functioning well: it serves a very specific role and should only be used if your team is capable of supporting it.</p>

<p>Jirachi's main porpoise is as a mid-game wall breaker. Like most mixed wall breakers, this Jirachi relies on excellent type coverage; however, unlike its companions Infernape and Salamence, Jirachi relies not on large damage output, but on surprise value. Expert Belt along with physical attacks will often cause the opponent to assume that Jirachi is holding a Choice Scarf and send in something like Skarmory, Swampert, or Salamence to take the opportunity to set up. Jirachi's often overlooked 100 base Speed only makes it easier to create this illusion.</p>

<p>Even without bluffing Choice Scarf, however, the oddity of this set is often enough to work your opponent into a corner. If you manage to double-switch into something like Scizor, Swampert, or Salamence, it is unlikely that your opponent will switch out, and you can go for an easy OHKO (Salamence needs to take Stealth Rock damage, due to intimidate). Similarly, Jirachi is perfect for sending in after a double KO via Explosion or recoil damage.</p>

<p>Besides being a powerful wall breaker with its coverage and a useful late game sweeper with a 60% Flinch Rate attack named Iron head and 100 base Speed, this Jirachi also serves as a useful check against a number of common OU threats. Most notable among these are Lucario and Latias: the former is outsped and takes a minimum of 78% damage from Fire Punch, a sure OHKO after a defense drop from Close Combat (and a possible OHKO after Life Orb and Stealth Rock Damage); the latter will always be 2HKOed by Ice Punch and will generally fail to 2HKO Jirachi.</p>

<p>There are two Pokemon to look out for when using this Jirachi. The first is Heatran, which 4x resists or is immune to every one of this sets attacks, and can easily score a OHKO. If your team demands it, Hidden Power Ground can be used over Grass Knot or Ice Punch to quickly deal with Heatran and Magnezone; however, this will open Jirachi up to even more threats which are more difficult to deal with than the generally predictable Heatran. The second Pokemon to look out for is Gyarados, which will not take much more than 30% from Grass Knot, and can easily set up with Dragon Dance. If you are more worried about Gyarados than Swampert then you can exchange Grass Knot for Thunderbolt, though that will make Jirachi less effective against Suicune (Take it out becuase it does barely any to it)and the Bulky Ground-type Pokemon as well. Any combination of these moves can be effective, as long as you know what Jirachi will be walled by, and prepare the rest of your team to deal with those threats.</p>

Thunderbolt should be in set comments because the only thing you are hitting is Gyarados and Skarmory (which you can Burn hax to death).
There is no mention of how Jirachi cannot switch in on many Boosted nuetral attacks becuase most will 2HKO, like a CBTar 2HKOs with Crunch.

 

[Scofield]

Thunderbolt should be in set comments because the only thing you are hitting is Gyarados and Skarmory (which you can Burn hax to death).
There is no mention of how Jirachi cannot switch in on many Boosted nuetral attacks becuase most will 2HKO, like a CBTar 2HKOs with Crunch.

Does this even need to be mentioned? It is even mentioned that the best way to get this in is a double switch or after an explosion. Besides, Jirachi outspeeds ttar and has that nice chance of flinch.

 

[cim]

Thunderbolt should be in set comments because the only thing you are hitting is Gyarados and Skarmory (which you can Burn hax to death).

Skarmory will set up on you and Gyarados will likely DD on you. Burns don't bother Skarmory that much.

There is no mention of how Jirachi cannot switch in on many Boosted nuetral attacks becuase most will 2HKO, like a CBTar 2HKOs with Crunch.

That's not something one commonly assumes nor is expected; the whole reason CBers are used are because they hurt things with neutral damage

 

[diinbong]

http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/jirachi

[SET]
name: Physical Mix
move 1: Iron Head
move 2: Ice Punch
move 3: Fire Punch
move 4: Grass Knot / Thunderbolt / Hidden Power Ground
item: Expert Belt
nature: Naive / Hasty
evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>While Jirachi is typically seen either running Calm Mind or carrying Choice Scarf, this set is an excellent alternative which acts as both a mid-game wall breaker and a late-game sweeper. Be warned though - this is not a Pokemon which can be haphazardly thrown onto a team with the expectation of functioning well; it serves a very specific role and should only be used if your team is capable of supporting it.</p>

<p>Jirachi's main purpose is as a mid-game wall breaker. Like most mixed wall breakers, this Jirachi relies on excellent type coverage; however, unlike its companions Infernape and Salamence, Jirachi relies not on large damage output, but on surprise value. Expert Belt along with physical attacks will often cause the opponent to assume that Jirachi is holding a Choice Scarf and send in something like Skarmory, Swampert, or Salamence to take the opportunity to set up. Jirachi's oft overlooked 100 base Speed only makes it easier to create this illusion.</p>

<p>Even without bluffing Choice Scarf, however, the oddity of this set is often enough to work your opponent into a corner. If you manage to double-switch into something like Scizor, Swampert, or Salamence, it is unlikely that your opponent will switch out, and you can go for an easy OHKO (Salamence needs to take Stealth Rock damage, due to intimidate). Similarly, Jirachi is perfect for sending in after a double KO via Explosion or recoil damage.</p>

<p>Besides being a powerful wall breaker with its coverage and a useful late-game (consistency) sweeper with a 60% flinch rate attack and 100 base Speed, this Jirachi also serves as a useful check against a number of common OU threats. Most notable among these are Lucario and Latias: the former is outsped and takes a minimum of 78% damage from Fire Punch, a sure OHKO after a defense drop from Close Combat (and a possible OHKO after Life Orb and Stealth Rock Damage); the latter will always be 2HKOed by Ice Punch and will generally fail to 2HKO Jirachi.</p>

<p>There are two Pokemon to look out for when using this Jirachi. The first is Heatran, which 4x resists or is immune to every one of this sets attacks, and can easily score an OHKO. If your team demands it, Hidden Power Ground can be used over Grass Knot or Ice Punch to quickly deal with Heatran and Magnezone; however, this will open Jirachi up to even more threats which are more difficult to deal with than the generally predictable Heatran. The second Pokemon to look out for is Gyarados, who will not take much more than 30% from Grass Knot, and can easily set up with Dragon Dance. If you are more worried about Gyarados than Swampert then you can exchange Grass Knot for Thunderbolt, though that will make Jirachi less effective against Suicune and the Bulky Ground-type Pokemon as well. Any combination of these moves can be effective, as long as you know what Jirachi will be walled by, and prepare the rest of your team to deal with those threats.</p>

All changes are non-subjective.

yeah I know I'm on vacation screw you

 

[Zepar]

Chrisisme, read the thread.

(with Expert Belt you can wait for burn and then flinch with iron head).

 

[Scofield]

I think TAY meant that you can do that if jirachi is your last pokemon...

 

[Havak]

Is this ready to go on-site now then, TAY?

 

[TAY]

Uh, there are a few more things I need to change. I wasn't able to use the internet much during my NY trip, so this got put on hold a bit =P

I'll have it done in an hour or so, and then I'll scms it myself.

EDIT: OK This is more or less ready. The only change I made that wasn't related to grammar / wording was removing HP Ground as an option in the 4th moveslot. It is still mentioned in the set comments since Heatran is a fairly common switch-in, but HP Ground will never OHKO Heatran even after SR damage. This is really shitty considering HP Ground is used pretty much excusively for Heatran (Magnezone is 2HKO'd anyway). If anyone has any objections, then post them here in the next hour or so, otherwise this is going on site.