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Dragon Master Zipzo

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by Zipzo, Oct 26, 2012.

  1. Zipzo

    Zipzo

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2012
    Messages:
    18
    I went with a cheesy topic title.

    Basically when I started Pokemon back in Blue I always loved Dragonite and onward was always a big fan of dragon pokes. I've always tried to wrap my team around at least a Dragon or two.

    This is going to be my first outing at VGC. I'm reading a lot but I still need a ton more practical experience, and I'm still not even done EVing my chosen Pokepool. I have this team rounded out as a basis to start with...and some really valuable advice would be super ridiculously appreciated so that I don't veer off in to a ditch the moment I get on-site to my regionals.

    Since I understand that we are only allowed to choose 4 Pokemon of the 6 available, I went with a core/alternates type setup. I like the Dragon + Steel combination out in front, and I adore Cresselia as a support. So basically this team is (in the corny pokemon world in my head) an imagining of what I feel a Dragon Master might do with the intention of winning (given that a team full of dragons would obviously suck, haha).

    []~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~[]

    [​IMG]
    Support Cresselia
    Max HP & Special Defense, 4 Defense
    Calm [Leftovers]
    - Reflect
    - Thunder Wave
    - Helping Hand
    - Psychic

    In general she's my support heavy Pokemon. She's meant to go well with every single other Pokemon on my team. I love the look of Cresselia, I love her stats and Wall-ish stature, and I just enjoy using her on the team. It's a pretty typical setup. I go with Reflect because I find that physical sweepers are far and wide more common than special/mixed sweepers, and given that Cresselia's Special Defense is quite high anyway, I found Reflect to be the more intelligent route.

    [​IMG]
    Physical/Tailwind Salamence
    Max Attack & Speed, 4 HP
    Adamant [Yache Berry]
    - Tailwind
    - Earthquake
    - Dragon Claw
    - Protect

    I generally lead with this Salamence next to Cresselia to throw up Tailwind and get Intimidate off.

    [​IMG]
    Basic Scizor {Technician}
    Max Attack & HP, 4 Speed
    Adamant [Occa Berry]
    - Protect
    - Bug Bite
    - Superpower
    - Bullet Punch

    Basic Scizor is basic, meant to boast synergy with the dragons.

    [​IMG]
    Physical/Lead {Intimidate}
    Max Attack & Speed, 4 HP
    Adamant [Life Orb]
    - Extreme Speed
    - Protect
    - Flare Blitz
    - Close Combat

    Meant to be an alternate lead based on my opponents with Cresselia. Provides Intimidate support. Acts as sort of a suicide Pokemon.

    [​IMG]
    Special Zone {Magnet Pull}
    Max Special Attack & HP, 4 Defense
    Modest [Sitrus Berry]
    - Thunderbolt
    - Protect
    - Hidden Power Ground
    - Thunder Wave

    Also meant to be good team mates to my dragons, or a Scizor alternate. More Thunder Wave support along with Cresselia makes having either of these two a pain in the butt for my opponents given the high powered dragon team mates that are probably rampantly mutilating their team. This Magnezone is sort of like both a support Pokemon, and an "alternate" special steel if my opposing team walls physical too much and I need to leave Scizor out for the match (remember we can only pick 4). I went with Magnet pull so I can essentially wipe out opposing meta steels with earthquake or Fire blast, as I've rarely seen sturdy get used on zone because of his high Defense.

    [​IMG]
    Special Hydreigon
    Max Special Attack & Speed, 4 HP
    Timid [Dragon Gem]
    - Draco Meteor
    - Fire Blast
    - Dark Pulse
    - Protect

    'Nuff said really. Meant to be an ace in the hole. Salamence alternate.

    []~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~[]

    Overall each Pokemon is meant to compliment any of the others on the team. I put a lot of emphasis on Support/Weakness covering partners, and Intimidate, I like both of those strategies. The double steel/dragon picks are generally "alternates" of each other, seeing as how you can only pick 4 out of 6 in a doubles battle and the alternates tend to cover all of the opposing threats of most given meta teams.

    In any case I won't say too much, this is my first stab at a competitive team and I'm open to any and all advice because I want to be the best there ever was, to beat all the rest...yeah, that's my cause. Thanks for helping out!

    [EDITS]

    - Switched Haxorus to put Hydreigon in. I figure for now it's better to go with something reliable for when I'm just setting up my team for early success
  2. Phozon

    Phozon

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2012
    Messages:
    53
    Hi this team seems very well put togeather and I must say I really like it alot.

    First things first, tailwind on Salamance... that seems a little odd but hey what do I know. I would recomend then running a bulkie set:

    Salamance
    Adamant- 252HP/ 252 Atk

    This will allow you to live hits while able to set up your tail wind and still able to out pace. Also, I would also recoment Icy Wind on Cresselia. I use to run the same set that you are running right now and trust me Icy Wind is so much nicer to have. You lower speed and allow her a way to hit Dark types and even Dragons.

    Speaking of Dragons. This team gets beaten by the bread and butter rain team ( Politoed, Kingdra, Ludicolo, Toxicroak ) You have nothing on your team well equiped to take anything from them. I would recomend Kindgra> Hydreigon. You team could really use a water type and this poke can also threaten other rain teams that come your way. I'm very fond of the Sub Lum Kingdra just because it's so hard to stop:

    Kingdra- Lum Berry
    Timid/ Modest- 252Sp.Akt/ 252Speed/ 6HP
    Sub
    Hydro Pump/ Protect
    Surf/ Muddy Water
    Dragon Pulse

    This is with out a doubt Kingdra's best set and your team can definally benifit from a water type too.

    Also, if you want a suicide Fire Type try Infernape:

    Infernape- Life Orb
    Hasty- 80Atk 172Sp.Atk/ 252 Speed
    Protect
    Taunt/ Mach Punch
    Close Combat
    Heat Wave

    I know it doesn't have intimidate but if you just need a suicide poke then this is the one. You also get STAB on CC as well and priority in the form of Mach Punch.

    Other then that, just watch out for Garchomp and Latios because those could become a problem, but with the build of your team you should be fine!
  3. Zipzo

    Zipzo

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2012
    Messages:
    18
    I actually love the idea of Kingdra and a way to get on Rain teams nerves.

    I could easily swap Hydra for Kingdra, I'd happily make that switch if it will blotch out my rain team weakness. Great advice :)

    What do you think of running a Gyarados over Arcanine as a bonus?
  4. TheMantyke

    TheMantyke ᴵ ᶰᵉᵉᵈ ᵃ ᵐᵒᶰˢᵗᵉʳ ᵗᵒ ᶜᶫᵒᵇᵇᵉʳ ᵗʰᵃᵗ ᵗʰᵉʳᵉ ᴷᶦʳᵇʸ
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Team Rater Alumnus
    VGC Leader

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2007
    Messages:
    5,415
    I guess I can throw in a rate for you, but your descriptions for all but Cresselia and Magnezone are kind of lacking. Remember, for better rates, try to elaborate on why you chose that Pokemon for the job on top of the basics like elaborating on move set choices. Additionally, the old dragons + steels team archetype from OU doesn't carry very well over into the doubles environment. Slapping a Steel-type down to deal with Dragon type Pokemon isn't nearly as effective when the opponent can simple choose to attack the non-dragon resistant Pokemon. Basically, Dragon centric offense in VGC still works, but the need for things like a Steel-type trapper is unneeded.

    While Kingdra would be a big help versus Rain teams runnign Ferrothorn, it's hardly a nessesicty. If you really enjoy using Salamence and the super cool intimidate support it brings, other changes can be made to make your time versus rain easier.

    When Salamence and Arcanine are Intimidating left and right, Reflect seems pretty redundant on Cresselia. To help against Rain and Sun as well as just against the always annoying Draco Metoer, I would suggest replacing it with Light Screen. Between Light Screen and Thunder Wave, Cresselia plays a big role in making life easier against rain neutering their Swim Swimmers and their strong special Water-type moves. To compensate for the new found extra special bulk, migrate some of your EVs in Special Defense into Physical defense and switch from Calm to Bold. Finally, if you find Garchomp to be a really nasty Pokemon to face, you should consider replacing Thunder Wave with Icy Wind for an alternate form of speed control.

    Salamence can be surprisingly bulky with it's stellar array of resistances and Intimidate, so I think you should emphasize Salamence's bulky a tad more. Without significant investment, you're not living Latios's Draco Meteor, so I might dump your Speed EVs into HP to bulk him up a bit. If you're interested in living specific hits, you should consider playing with a damage calculator to figure out if migrating some EVs into either defense allow you to live it. You mentioned that this was your first time fiddling around with VGC though, so keep in mind that's hardly necessary if you're just beginning.

    As I mentioned earlier, the Dragons + Steels team archetype from single battles doesn't carry over well into doubles mostly thanks to the fact your bound to have at least one Pokemon that takes neutral damage from Dragon-type attacks out at a time. As such, Magnezone's effective really goes down the drain. To help buff up your team more against rain and provide another useful Ice resistance, I would recommend replacing Magnezone with a Rotom-W.

    [​IMG]
    Rotom-W @ [​IMG]
    Levitate
    Modest
    252 HP / 252 SpAtk / 6 Speed
    -Hydro Pump
    -Thunderbolt
    -Hidden Power Ice
    -Protect

    With some decent bulk and fantastic defensive typing, Rotom-W makes a solid player on any team. For you in particular, it pairs well with Scizor, Arcanine... actually, pretty much every team member you have likes having Rotom-W as a partner as he shares no weaknesses with any of them! The choice of moves is obvious outside of Hidden Power Ice. You seem pretty vulnerable to Garchomp and I think having another Pokemon on board that isn't hit for super effective damage by him and can dish out a strong hit in return will serve you well.

    Hope my advice helped!
  5. Golden Piloswine

    Golden Piloswine

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2012
    Messages:
    432
    As TmTyke suggeested please expand greatly on your descriptions, a bland sentence is not satisfactory. Cresselia, and Magnezone are alright, but the rest is unacceptable.

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