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Durant (BW2 Update) [QC: 1/3]

Discussion in 'Locked / Outdated Analyses' started by Governess, Mar 23, 2013.

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  1. Governess

    Governess A Beautiful Blossom Waiting to Bloom
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    [box]
    [qc]1/3[/qc]
    [Lavos Spawn]
    [gp]0/2[/gp]

    QC Rejected: 0/3

    Current State: Skeleton[/box]

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    [Overview]

    • High Risk, High Reward Pokemon.
    • Generally outclassed by Scizor due to Scizor having priority moves, better bulk, and overall better base stats.
    • Horrible HP and Special Defense; rarely can he take a Special Attack hit.
    • Poor movepool, only one viable set fit for OU.
    • BW2 has introduced even more threats to Durant; Keldeo notably.
    • Durant's ability Hustle is one of the few reasons Durant is useful in OU; his base Attack stat is raised to outstanding heights, one of the highest in the game.
    • 109 Speed is enough to outspeed most of the OU metagame, such as Thundurus-T and Infernape, along with barely outpacing Terrakion and Keldeo.
    • While he has his pros and cons, Durant is an unique Pokemon in the OU tier to use; he usually won't last long, so it's all or nothing.

    [SET]
    name: Hone Claws
    move 1: Hone Claws / X-Scissor
    move 2: Iron Head
    move 3: Superpower
    move 4: Thunder Fang / Rock Slide
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Hustle
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    • Only viable set in the OU metagame.
    • Takes advantage of Hustle's immense power boost and great speed.
    • Durant works as a late-game sweeper with Hone Claws to raise accuracy in attacks and potentially sweep.
    • Hone Claws is the crux of this set. Increasing the accuracy lost from Hustle, Durant becomes a very effective late-game sweeper.
    • X-Scissor could also be used for an All-Out Attacker set. Though X-Scissor doesn't offer much coverage to the OU environment outside of Celebi, it's a powerful STAB move.
    • Iron Head as STAB move, powering through most of the metagame.
    • Superpower; great coverage move, especially against Pokemon such as Tyranitar, Magnezone, and Ferrothorn.
    • Final moveslot depends on your preference. Thunder Fang is useful for Pokemon such as Jellicent, Politoed, and Keldeo, that Durant would usually have issues with. Rock Slide, on the other hand, can check Thundurus-T, (Who is unaffected by Thunder Fang, and merely 2HKO'd by Iron Head) Volcarona, and Ninetales, all of which Durant can outspeed, considering they aren't equipped with a Choice Scarf.

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    • Durant has great attacking potential, as his Hustle ability raises his Attack stat high above the clouds. Here are some calculations of Durant's power versus the top-tier defenses and threats of OU:

      <ul class="damage_calculation">
      <li>252 Atk Life Orb Hustle Durant Superpower vs. 252 HP / 88+ Def Ferrothorn: 304-359 (86.36 - 101.98%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO</li>

      <li>+1 252 Atk Life Orb Hustle Durant Thunder Fang vs. 224 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 208-247 (63.6 - 75.53%) -- guaranteed 2HKO</li>

      <li>252 Atk Life Orb Hustle Durant Thunder Fang vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Keldeo: 268-317 (82.97 - 98.14%) -- guaranteed 2HKO</li>

      <li>252 Atk Life Orb Hustle Durant Superpower vs. 232 HP / 0 Def Rotom-W: 213-251 (71.23 - 83.94%) -- guaranteed 2HKO</li>

      <li>+1 252 Atk Life Orb Hustle Durant Iron Head vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Hippowdon: 292-344 (69.52 - 81.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO</li>

      <li>252 Atk Life Orb Hustle Durant Superpower vs. 252 HP / 96 Def Magnezone: 367-434 (106.68 - 126.16%) -- guaranteed OHKO</li>

      <li>252 Atk Life Orb Hustle Durant Superpower vs. 232 HP / 0 Def Rotom-W: 213-251 (71.23 - 83.94%) -- guaranteed 2HKO</li>

      <li>+1 252 Atk Life Orb Hustle Durant Iron Head vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 218-257 (51.9 - 61.19%) -- 94.92% chance to 2HKO</li>

      <li>+1 252 Atk Life Orb Hustle Durant Iron Head vs. 252 HP / 184+ Def Gliscor: 220-259 (62.14 - 73.16%) -- guaranteed 2HKO</li>
      </ul>

    • 252 EVs on Attack to increase Durant's offensive power.
    • Despite the fac that 109 is an unique speed in OU, he still needs 252 in speed to speed tie with opposing Durant.
    • Jolly nature to outspeed any Pokemon under base Speed 109. Adamant can be used for maximizing Durant's Attack, however, Jolly Terrakion and Keldeo can then outspeed Durant, and proceed to KO him.
    • Life Orb is the preferred item, to be more versatile with it's move selection.
    • Lum Berry is an option to avoid status effects that would otherwise cripple Durant. The loss in raw power from Life Orb is noticeable, however.
    • Pokemon like Hippowdon and Tyranitar are great partners, as they can produce sand that can aid Durant in weakening the opponent and attacking. Heatran also has good synergy with Durant, absorbing the Fire-type attacks.
    • Blissey/Chansey: Special Defensive monsters that can work well with Durant, as they take all the Special Defensive attacks that would otherwise destroy Durant.
    • Terrakion is also a good Pokemon partner, handling Thundurus-T and Volcarona, both of which are part of Durant's top threats.
    • Choice Scarfers are also good to Durant, as every Pokemon who outspeeds Durant can easily KO him. Having speedy Scarfers such as Starmie helps against revenge killers.
    • Keldeo has risen in BW2 as one of Durant's biggest threats. Rotom-W is a great partner to counter Keldeo.

    [Other Options]

    • Very pitiful movepool; very few viable options left to consider.
    • Traunt + Entertainment combination could be used for Choice Scarf Durant; it cripples the opponent by causing them to waste a turn in recovery
    • Baton Passing moves, such as Agility and Hone Claws seem promising, but as mentioned before, Durant rarely has a chance to setup in the OU environment.
    • Support moves, such as Thunder Wave and Toxic, could also be used to cripple the opponent. Though, Durant is better off at just attacking the opponent than crippling it.
    • Substitute - Good for setting up and attempting to setup with Hone Claws.
    • Choice Scarf is also an option over Choice Band, for more speed to revenge kill, though, the loss in power is easily noticed.

    [Checks and Counters]

    • Choice Scarfers; generally anything that outspeeds Durant and can take a hit from him can proceed to KO him.
    • Bulky physical walls, such as Hippowdon, Skarmory, Ferrothorn, Forretress, and Gliscor, can all fare well against Durant, as long as it doesn't carry Hone Claws.
    • Fire-types, specifically Volcarona and Heatran, can easily rid of Durant. However, the former must watch out for Rock Slide, and the latter must be wary of Superpower.
    • Choice Scarf Magnezone can not only trap Durant, it can also outspeed him, and 1HKO him with Hidden Power Fire.
    • Bulky Water-type Pokemon, such as Jellicent, Politoed, Rotom-W, and Tentacruel, can take a Thunder Fang from Durant, and could either Scald or Surf Durant to get a KO.
    • Opposing Steel-types, such as Magnezone, Scizor and Lucario, can check Durant; though, Lucario and Magnezone are easily handled by Superpower.
    • Keldeo is a big threat to Durant; it can easily 1HKO Durant, take a Thunder Fang from him, and can easily outspeed him with a Choice Scarf.
    • Special Attackers in general, such as Alakazam, Gengar, and Starmie, can easily dispose of Durant due to his pitiful defenses. Thundurus-T and Volcarona are also placed in this category, though, Durant can outspeed/check both of them with Rock Slide.
  2. SpareAacount

    SpareAacount

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    Just saying, Durant isn't a Rock-type, so it doesn't get a Special Defense boost, and I really don't think Gravity users should be mentioned.
  3. AJC

    AJC

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    hustle doesn't effect special attack moves or status moves it only reduces the acc of physical attack moves

    although in OU durant has better things to do than to try to paralyze something with t-wave.
  4. Governess

    Governess A Beautiful Blossom Waiting to Bloom
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    Alright, thank you AJC, fixed that as well.
  5. Chillarmy

    Chillarmy

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    Swamp-Rocket updated Durant not too long ago and not much has changed for Durant (i.e, the metagame didn't crap on it / make it any better). I don't see anything that warrants an update; the overview is the only thing that needs tweaking afaict.

    edit: if Durant is to be updated here, then be sure to mention that 259 HP is an LO number (divisible by 10 minus 1). Also, beef up C+C a bit, as Durant has a ton more hard counters; e.g, mention that resilient physical walls such as Gliscor, Hippowdon, and Skarmory can prove to be trouble without Hone Claws.

    (also, it's "X-Scissor" not "X-Scissors")
  6. Governess

    Governess A Beautiful Blossom Waiting to Bloom
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    Hmm.. Well, I wouldn't know much about that, I'm not QC, and it was on the list.. But they get the final say, so we will see.
    Made the changes; added more threats, etc.
  7. Lavos Spawn

    Lavos Spawn
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    i talked with some people on irc, and long story short, you're gonna have to remove the choice band set, because it sucks. the extra power doesn't do anything significant enough to warrant keeping, especially when you consider the loss of durant's modest movepool, which saves its abdomen in a lot of scenarios. so yeah...do that please
  8. Jukain

    Jukain fuck macle
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    this analysis needs a truant + entrainment mention. you give your opponent truant with a scarf durant and boom they're crippled.
  9. Governess

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    Ok, removed all traces of Choice Band, and added a mention of Traunt + Entertainment in OO.
  10. Lavos Spawn

    Lavos Spawn
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    alright thanks boss. you should probably keep x-scissor slashed in with hone claws since a mono attacker is a perfectly viable set and bug is the best you've got when it comes to stab, since steel sucks. if you do that i think it'll be qc ready
  11. Governess

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    Ok; added X-Scissor back to the set; thank you for that,I didn't know where to put that move. It's ready for QC checks/suggestions, then.
  12. shrang

    shrang Defend the Headquarters of Revolution
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    I'm sorry, but I really don't like this bit:

    Just... why do I need to be told these calculations? What do they prove? Do I really need to be told that Volcarona gets OHKOed by Rock Slide, or Tyranitar by Superpower? You don't need to run a damage calc to know these sort of things. Can you please give us some more relevant damage calcs, like say, how much Thunder Fang does to Skarmory after a boost, or how much Iron Head does to Hippowdon after a boost. Show us how strong Durant is by showing how much he does to actual physical walls, not Pokemon who obviously can't take the attacks, please.

    Sorry if I sounded condescending, but I hope you understand why I'm annoyed at this kind of thing.
  13. jc104

    jc104 Humblest person ever
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    Yeah I was going to say the same thing about those damage calcs. Probably only ferrothorn and keldeo should stay, maybe also rotom. I would recommend showing that +1 Iron Head will comfortably 2HKO Gliscor and Hippowdon (with a good flinch chance, and neither can do much back), for instance.
  14. Governess

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    It's ok; I'll be sure not to make the same mistake next time. I replaced everything, minus Ferrothorn and Keldeo, and added Skarmory, Gliscor, and Hippowdon with +1 boosts as well.
  15. Lavos Spawn

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    you can re-add the calcs on rotom-w and magnezone, they're semi-relevant. other than that, looks good to me.

    [​IMG]

    QC Approved (1/3)

    actually yeah what tehy said, you should probably move the extra hp ev to either speed or defense, since adding it makes it so that you're now at the least beneficial number for life orb a_a
  16. tehy

    tehy

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    So two things:

    Firstly, is not speed tying with other durants really worth 4 HP evs? I get that Durant is rare and that you outspeed everything else you possibly can but unless that extra 1 hp really changes something (LO number, hazards number, some specific attack), isn't it better to just speed tie with opposing Durant?

    Secondly, Entrainment Truant's best deal is to be used with an eject button (or maybe still a scarf) and to be used with Shadow Tag. Chandelure was popular for this, but you could probably still use a Gothitelle. Other than that, theoretically you could either force infinite switches or allow a totally free turn of setup, I suppose, although you'd need to give your Scarfer Truant and anything with Memento does the job better without that whole downside.
  17. Governess

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    Ok; changed the EV spread; added Rotom-W and Magnezone in the calculations as well. Thank you for the QC check Lavos, and tehy for the EV change spread.
  18. alexwolf

    alexwolf Rain Summoner
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    While the overview does a good job explaining Durant's flaws, it doesn't explain its pros very good. Explain that Hustle and access to Hone Claws, as well as its excellent Base Speed, make it almost impossible to wall and a very good hard hitter for offensive teams. Also remove the mentions of Infernape from the overview, and focus on Keldeo and Terrakion, which Durant can dent or OHKO.

    Explain why someone would use X-Scisoor. For example with X-Scissor Durant OHKOes Celebi, OHKOes 252 HP Jirachi after SR + Spikes after a boost (without losing it ability to sweep unlike Superpower), OHKOes Latias and OTR Reuniclus unboosted, and hits some Pokemon equally hard with Superpower without lowering your stats, such as Rotom-W, Gastrodon, and Metagross.

    When talking about Rock Slide, explain how most of its targets are still destroyed by Durant after a Hone Claws even without Rock Slide. For example all of those Pokemon that you mention as targets of Rock Slide are OHKOed by any of Iron Head / Superpower / T-Fang after a boost and SR. For this reason, Rock Slide is best suited for an all out attacking set which won't be able to boost and get past those threats otherwise, putting Rock Slide's coverage into good use.

    Add this calculation on the list:

    +1 252 Atk Life Orb Hustle Durant Iron Head vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Thundurus-T: 225-265 (75.25 - 88.62%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

    and remove the calc on Magnezone, as i don't think anyobdy would send a Fighting-weak Steel type against Durant anyway (what's up with the weird EV spread on the Magnezone anyway?).

    Remove the mention of Adamant from the AC, and don't even mention it in OO. If you are not taking advantage of Durant's amazing Speed to beat Keldeo and Terrakion, don't use Durant at all.

    Also, why is Lum Berry mentioned in the AC? What Pokemon that would want to switch into Durant uses status moves? None i think, so if you can't provide some solid reasoning, move it to OO. It still has some use to allow Durant to setup against T-Wave Celebi, Body Slam Jirachi (if you have X-Scissor that is), and T-Wave Ferrothorn, but i think its use is fairly situational, and Durant really needs LO.

    Finally, i would like to see a bit more of teammates and threats for Durant in the AC. Volt Switch Forretress is probably the best counter to Durant in OU, as it can wall Durant and bring in something faster safely with Volt Switch. Landorus-T is also a very good answer, avoiding the 2HKO from Iron Head and 2HKOing back. Volcarona and Thundurus-T are shaky checks at best to Durant, as non-bulky Volcarona is OHKOed by unboosted Iron Head after SR, while Thundurus-T is OHKOed by Iron Head after a boost and OHKOed by Rock Slide without a boost. So de-emphasize the importance of having answers to those Pokemon, and focus more on Pokemon that pose greater threats to Durant (Landorus-T, Keldeo, and Forretress).
  19. Seven Deadly Sins

    Seven Deadly Sins ~hallelujah~
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    Sorry about this, but due to a clerical error, this analysis was mislabelled as needing a revamp when it doesn't. As a result, I'm closing this thread. Minor edits will be made on SCMS.

    Sorry for the inconvenience.
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