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Eelektross [Revamp] (QC 3/3)

Discussion in 'Locked / Outdated Analyses' started by Incon, Sep 24, 2012.

  1. Incon

    Incon

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    [​IMG]

    Eelektross

    [OVERVIEW]

    1. I want to remove this because it is rather irrelevant after BW2. He received Superpower, Aqua Tail, Drain Punch, and Fire Punch from move tutors which are all relatively high base power moves. It already had Wild Charge which is great physical STAB move.

    2.Would like to re-word this and add the fact that it received Drain Punch and Giga Drain from tutors offering semi-reliable recovery.

    3. Because CB is arguably his best set, i would like to remove the word "Specs" so it says "That being said, Eelektross is a fine Choice user, and fits well on VoltTurn or Choice-based teams," as not to as much emphasis on Specs since Band is just as good.

    I think Choice Band is his best set so id like it to be put first. Ill add the skeleton of the CB here but let me know what you guys think.

    [SET]
    name: Choice Band
    move 1: U-Turn
    move 2: Wild Charge/Thunder Punch
    move 3: Drain Punch/Superpower
    move 4: Aqua Tail/Fire Punch
    item: Choice Band
    ability: Levitate
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 132 HP / 252 Atk / 124 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    • New Additions from Bw2 lets it be a good Choice Band user.
    • Slow, Powerful U-Turn gains momentum and safe switch in.
    • Wild Charge for strong STAB, recoil can be annoying. Thunderpunch is weaker but no recoil.
    • New option in Drain Punch hits normals and steels hard while recovering Hp, Superpower hits a lot harder (Not sure about any notable extra Kos or if its worth slashing)
    • New addition Aqua Tail hits ground types SE like Golurk, Fire Punch for Amoonguss and Tangela.

    [ADDITONAL COMMENTS]
    • Evs maximize attacking presence with enough speed to outpace base 65's with no investment (Garbodor, Alomomola).
    • Adamant nature for increased attack power, already outpaces base 65 without + nature.
    • Life Orb
    • Crunch to hit Misdreavus or other ghost types harder.
    • Physically defensive Amoonguss and Misdreavus are good counters without Fire Punch or Crunch, not OHKOd by them.
    • Regirock is only 3HKOd by Drain Punch.
    • Special Samurott good partner, takes out lots of physically defensive counters
    • Swellow hits hard and can form a U-Turn combination.
    • Hazards important, forces lots of switches.
    • Cacturne or Garbodor for spikes.

    1. U-turn might be slashed or could replaced. Eases prediction, dont worry about ground types

    2. Giga Drain is superior option.

    3. Evs should be 128 hp / 252 SpAtk / 124 Spe to again outpace base 65's and some Golurk variants.

    [SET COMMENTS]
    1. Mention U-turn for no ground immunity so eases prediction. Wont be doing as much, since its not boosted but it hits psychics harder

    2. Remove "primary STAB" because of emphasis on U-turn

    3. Change Grass Knot to Giga Drain.

    1. Reflect new ev spread and why its better, tangela is rarely seen in this meta?

    2. Remove this, talk about u-turn earlier.

    1. Thunderpunch can be used for no recoil, less power. Slash that here?

    2. Instead of Return, Drain Punch should be slashed. Better coverage and recovery outside of Lefties.

    1. Thunderpunch over Wild Charge for no recoil??

    2. Remove, Drain Punch is superior for recovery. Amoonguss walls now tho.

    1. Amoonguss is better counter with similar abilities, Tangela isnt used as much.

    2. Drain Punch can recover as well. Mention here.

    3. Remove Brick Break

    4. Make Amoonguss more prevalent as better counter. Mention Golurk and his walling capabilities of this set.

    1. Remove mention of Brick Break

    2. U-Turn for switching in sweeper as well

    3. Remove, Choice band is covered above.

    1. Remove, Giga Drain does a big chunk to Stunfisk

    2. Does Lickilicky use return?

    3. Talk about Amoonguss instead, does not outspeed however. Talk about Golurk for check to all Physical Sets

    4. Bastiodon is outdated now that Eelektross gets Drain Punch/Superpower.

    I wasnt sure about Sub + Three Attack set so we can discuss if it should be mentioned or not.
  2. Scoopapa

    Scoopapa

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    I would like to weigh in on the Coil set, since I've been using a version of it a lot since it got the new moves. Drain Punch is obviously a sick addition to a bulky booster, but the question is where to put it. First, I think Substitute is much more crucial to the set than Dragon Tail is, so I would recommend slashing Drain Punch to it as opposed to Substitute. The set really wants to have that buffer in place to deal with its best checks safely, and will never get past Amoongus without it (or Fire Punch I guess, but why do that when you can just beat it with Sub?).

    Speaking of Amoongus, a set of Sub / Drain Punch / Coil / Wild Charge will actually set up to +6 and defeat it, despite all the moves being resisted. At +3, you can start to get a net health regain by alternating Drain Punch and Substitute, and Amoongus can't break your sub even with Sludge Bomb. If Eelekross comes in unscathed and your opponent switches to Amoongus immediately, you will get much higher than the necessary +3 before needing to heal. So basically, you don't need coverage on Amoongus to defeat it with the Coil set. What you do need is protection from Spore, Sludge Bomb, and Clear Smog, in the form of Substitute.

    It's true that Golurk is completely immune to Electric/Fighting coverage, and if you choose to run that set, it's something you need to deal with. I'm not that's a killing blow to the viability of the set, though. The reason for this is that it's very hard to both preserve your recovery-lacking Stealth Rock tank to counter something while also getting Stealth Rock up in the face of offensive pressure. This is especially true when the opponent knows that your Golurk walls their Eelektross but you don't. So while there should certainly be slashes on the set, I don't think Electric/Drain Punch coverage needs to be shunned just because of this fact.

    Dragon Tail is still an awesome move for that set, but I bet a better slash layout might be:

    Wild Charge/Thunderpunch
    Drain Punch/Dragon Tail
    Coil
    Substitute

    I do like the idea of Thunderpunch over Wild Charge because I found that I wasn't using Wild Charge that often and was most often using it on enemies like Samurott who were weak to electric and saccing themselves for a heavy hit in order to soften me up for the final blow.

    As always, QC will be the final judge, but I thought my experience could be valuable here.
  3. Incon

    Incon

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    Thanks for the input Scoopapa! I do like your ideas but im gonna let QC weigh in before i make any changes.
  4. marilli

    marilli
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    Hey, just wanna tell you one thing. Implement your changes. If this is going to go through QC again (which it might) then it is pointless to juggle around quotes and bolds and other clumsy things like that. Might be better to just post a simple QC skeleton, noting what changes need to be made. And after it passes QC you can work with the prose, etc.
  5. Zebraiken

    Zebraiken GANONBOARF
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    This is somewhat of a tough subject, since the Eelektross analysis is fairly recent and it just needs to be updated to the new meta (Golurk, some EV spreads changed, CB set added). I don't think it's worth throwing out the entirety of the (rather good) previous write-up, so I told Incon to do it like this so we could both preserve the original write-up and point out exactly what's going to change after Incon's suggestions are applied. I assumed it'd be easier for QC to understand exactly what's going to be changed and be able to read the original at the same time, unless you have a better suggestion.

    I'll get to QCing this later.
  6. Raseri

    Raseri here to help
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    OK this has been sitting here for way to long, so I'll take a stab at it.


    [Overview]

    • I agree with this, BW2 has finally given Eelektross a physical movepool. Needs to be there for sure in the update.

    • This is inconsequential, and it a good thing to add.


    • Sure thing, Specs and CB are both good. Maybe mention that Eelektross is one of the best momentum grabbers in NU.


    • I'm not entirely sure that Choice Band should be the first set. It is very good, but I think between that and the special attacker it is close. I won't put up a huge battle if people disagree but I think that the Special Attacker iss a better set.


    • I've always ran U-turn / ThunderPunch / Superpower / Fire Punch and it has never let me down. I think ThunderPunch is generally a better choice than Wild Charge, since bulk is a huge part of what makes Eelektross good. If Wild Charge gains some really important KOs it should be first though.


    • I don't think U-turn should be slashed. Ground types aren't that common, and they can easily be hit with Giga Drain. U-turn just makes this set weaker.
    • Yes Giga Drain > Grass Knot 100%
    • I also like your EV spread, better in this meta

    Set Comments:

    • I don't want u-turn slashed so I have to say no to this
    • u-turn sucks

    • yes

    Additional Comments:
    • yes talk about new EV spread, talk about u turn here though




    I'll get to the rest of this later, if you need any clarification on what I said or want me to go more indepth just ask :)
  7. Wobble

    Wobble

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    Fire Punch should not be slashed as it is pretty much necessary to deal with Alomamoongus cores.

    Aqua Tail is generally not necessary as it's shaky accuracy isn't good and Superpower hits everything anyway.
  8. Django

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    Aqua Tail hits Golurk, which is extremely relevant in the current metagame, so yes it is necessary.
  9. Annoyer

    Annoyer =)~

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    Giga Drain doesn't 100% completely outclass Grass Knot. Grass Knot OHKO's Golurk and Regirock after rocks. The HP gained from Giga Drain is better, but Grass Knot has a lot more power against the threats that the Grass-type move is targeted at.
  10. DTC

    DTC ˢᵉʳᶦᵒᵘˢ
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    Yeah, I would add Grass Knot to AC of the special attacker set.

    Lickilicky rarely ever uses Return. It's only seen 9.917% of the time.

    Also agreeing with Raseri that U-turn should not be slashed in the special attacker set.
  11. Raseri

    Raseri here to help
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    Fire Punch hits Amoonguss, which is extremely relevant in the current metagame, so yes it is necessary.


    Honestly, the choice between hitting Amoonguss and Golurk is a tough one. I'd lean towards making Aqua Tail the primary slash, but Fire Punch needs a huge huge huge mention. Golurk is just more threatening than Amoonguss in general.

    For now, this is how I think the sets should look:

    [SET]
    name: Choice Band
    move 1: U-Turn
    move 2: ThunderPunch / Wild Charge
    move 3: Superpower / Drain Punch
    move 4: Aqua Tail/Fire Punch
    item: Choice Band
    ability: Levitate
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 128 HP / 252 Atk / 124 Spe


    name: Special Attacker
    move 1: Volt Switch
    move 2: Flamethrower
    move 3: Giga Drain
    move 4: Thunderbolt
    item: Leftovers / Choice Specs
    ability: Levitate
    nature: Modest
    Evs: 172 Hp / 252 SpAtk / 84 Spe

    giga drain and acid spray in AC

    [SET]
    name: Coil
    move 1: Coil
    move 2: Wild Charge
    move 3: Dragon Tail
    move 4: Substitute/Return
    item: Leftovers
    ability: Levitate
    nature: Careful
    Evs: 252 Hp / 4 Def / 252 SpDef


    • I personally don't think that the extra power is worth the recoil on CB, but if QC thinks otherwise i wont oppose wild charge being first.
    • For c&c, keep the tangela mention but add Amoonguss as well, remove bastiodon. Remove Stunfisk.


    For the Sub + 3 attack set, it can probably be incorporated into the special attacker as a slash next to Substitute. I personally love the set, but Volt Switch is great too. I'd like to see dome discussion on the Sub + 3 attack set.
  12. Annoyer

    Annoyer =)~

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    In my opinion, I think ThunderPunch should be used over Wild Charge. The recoil is way too annoying considering it has no real recovery. ThunderPunch is much better since after a couple of boosts (and even without any boosts), the added damage from Wild Charge is insignificant. (Show me some calcs where Wild Charge is better, otherwise I think it deserves no mention)

    However, I believe that Wild Charge should still be mentioned on the CB set because of the following ccalcs
    On the CB set:
    Wild Charge OHKOs Emboar 100% of the time after Rocks
    2HKOs Max HP Lickilicky
    can OHKO rotom-s
    Ohio's specstaria after rocks
  13. Zebraiken

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    this is dead but after all of the above changes are implemented,

    QC APPROVED 1/3
  14. Django

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    Hi I'm following zebs lead

    [qc]2/3[/qc]
  15. Raseri

    Raseri here to help
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    3 mods in a row
    [qc]3/3[/qc]
  16. MangaMan

    MangaMan

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    What about a mixed set for Eelektross? I haven't had a chance to try it out yet, but I think it could make a great mixed attack. Maybe mention it's effectiveness on trick room teams.
  17. Zebraiken

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    A mixed set doesn't accomplish anything that either of the specialized sets cannot do on their own, and splits its offenses so that it's weaker than both of those sets. Unless there are specific KOes that Eelektross achieves by having both a physical and special attack available to it (while not being outclassed by either set), then there's no reason to go mixed.
  18. Incon

    Incon

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    Thanks for the input everyone and sorry for not getting this done sooner. I will have it up sometime this week.
  19. Raseri

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    reassigning

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