1. Welcome to Smogon! Check out the Smogon Starters Hangout for everything you need to know about starting out in the community. Don't forget to introduce yourself in the Introduction and Hangout Thread, too!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

Electivire (Analysis)

Discussion in 'Locked / Outdated Analyses' started by Granstafer, Dec 24, 2010.

  1. Granstafer

    Granstafer

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2010
    Messages:
    232
    [​IMG]Status: Formatting and whatnot.
    Electivire
    Type: Electric

    [Overview]

    <p>In today’s metagame, Electivire falls behind many physical hard hitting Pokémon, such as Conkledurr, Haxorus, or Excadrill. Additionally, unlike other Pokémon, such as Blaziken, Electivire did not get many shiny new toys to play with. Combined with his average speed and mediocre 75/67/85 defenses, Electivire has to be knocked down a few pegs, even from last generation. Put simply, Electivire is certainly not a top-tier Pokémon.</p>

    <p> However, it would be an incorrect statement to say that he is a horrible Pokémon. Electivire still got a much needed physical STAB in Wild Bolt, which fits nicely into has vast movepool. Electivire can still outspeed a large amount of the metagame with a Motor Drive boost, combined with nice 125/95/95 offensive stats, he can act as a wallbreaker to take down new defensive threats such as Ferrothorn. Everything considered, Electivire has many shortfalls that prevent it with keeping up with the rest of the metagame, but nevertheless, he can still do his job well.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Mixed Attacker
    move 1: Thunderbolt
    move 2: Cross Chop
    move 3: Hidden Power Ice
    move 4: Flamethrower
    item: Life Orb / Expert Belt
    nature: Mild
    ability: Motor Drive
    evs: 252 SpA / 40 Atk / 216 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Electivire’s vast movepool and very nice offensive stats make him a prime candidate for a mixed set. Thunderbolt for the main stab may seem to surprise you due to Electivire’s superior attack stat, but on this set Thunderbolt packs a bigger punch. Cross chop is a very useful move on this set, capable of taking down Chansey, Blissey, Hydreigon, Tyranitar, and other steel types. Hidden power Ice is used to take out dragons not named Hydreigon, Gliscor, and other ground types. Unfortunately, it will not 2HKO max Special Defense Hippowdon, who can slack off the damage. Flamethrower is ideal for the last slot to deal heavy damage to Skarmory and Ferrothorn. As for the item choice, Life Orb is the best option for the most damage, but an expert belt can be used if you don’t like the recoil. However, You will be sacrificing some power, and will only work if your attack is super effective, which is not always the case.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Volt Switch is an interesting option, but since most switch-ins to Electivire would be things such as Hippowdon, Volt Switch is rendered useless.</p>

    <p>When using this Electivire Set, It is important to capitalize to do what Eelektross cannot otherwise accomplish with another mixed set. Since Eelektross has overall better defenses, access to Grass Knot, better mixed attacking stats, no weakness, along with a vast movepool similar to Electivire’s, Eelektross gives Electivire a lot of competition for the mixed attacking role. To use this Electivire properly, one must focus on what it has over Eelektross- namely, its ability to take out much speedier threats, and a much easier way to defeat Blissey or Chansey. As where Eelektross fails to strike first against important Pokémon such as Hydreigon, Electivire can strike first with a deadly Cross Chop. Also, Eelektross must invest a few extra EV’s to outspeed Blissey, giving Electivire another advantage.</p>

    <p>As this is a mixed attacking set, it can be easily used as a wallbreaking set, so Pokémon who need walls out of the way such as Scrafty are always a good choice. Of course, Electivire almost always requires a motor drive boost to make his sets effective, so naturally Pokémon who can lure in electric attacks are essential. Gyarados is the most effective for this role, as he has a 4x weakness to electric attacks. Skarmory is also a decent partner, also being weak to electric attacks, and can set up entry hazards for Electivire. However, due to the introduction of Ferrothorn in the metagame, flamethrower would be more common attack against Skarmory to cover them both.</p>

    <p>The counters to this set are rather straightforward. Choice scarfed Garchomp can revenge kill Electivire with ease with a STAB Earthquake. However, one should still be wary, as this can allow Pokémon such as Dragonite or Salamence to set up, having Garchomp being locked into Earthquake. Due to Electivire’s lack of physical bulk, Pokémon that can cause a lot of physical damage can also harm Electivire, such as Bulk Up Conkledurr. However, Electivire absolutely shudders in fear at Sand throw Excadrill. This would cause Electivire to switch, possibly letting Excadrill set up, having the rest of his team face one of the most dangerous Pokémon in the game, or get knocked out by an Earthquake.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Physical Attacker
    move 1: Wild Bolt
    move 2: Ice Punch
    move 3: Fire Punch / Earthquake
    move 4: Cross Chop
    item: Life Orb / Expert Belt
    nature: Adamant
    ability: Motor Drive
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe




    [SET COMMENTS]
    • Uses Electivire’s great attack stat.
    • Good move pool allowing for excellent coverage.
    • Wild bolt for Main STAB.
    • Ice punch allows coverage against dragons and Gliscor, landlos, and other ground types that do not survive ice punch.
    • Earthquake is to hit some steels hard along with fire-types.
    • Fire Punch can be used to hit Scizor, Forretress, Ferrothorn, and Genesect.
    • Like the mixed set, Cross chop hits steels, Blissey,Chansey, along with Tyranitar and Bisharp, and hits Hydreigon harder.
    • Expert belt is an option, but life orb is the prime choice for the most non-choiced power.
    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
    • Volt change is also an option, but again as most switch-ins to Electivire are ground types, it is not too productive on this set.
    • Meditate can be used, with Earthquake/ Fire Punch replaced with meditate.
    • However, due to so many hard and fast-hitting pokemon in this generation, Electivire will rarely have the chance to set up.
    Teammates and Counters
    • This set cannot afford a burn, so physically offensive flying or water types, such as Gyarados, who also doesn't like a burn, are not the best choices.
    • Same usual partners, like Skarmory and Tornadus.
    • Since This set suffers more from residual damage than the other set, a wish supporter, such as chansey, can be a good partner for Electivire.
    • Excadrill can usually come in on Electivire, but he should be wary of balloon.
    • Similar counters to the first set; revenge killed by scarfed Garchomp, can be plucked off by Conkledurr and Excadrill (unless in the event of a balloon).
    • Even Hippowdon, who is weak to ice punch, can endure almost anything Electivire throws at it, and then slack off the damage.
    [Other Options]

    <p>A Balloon can be used on Electivire to avoid ground attacks and an OHKO on Excadrill on the physical set, which can be very helpful in certain situations.</p>




    [Counters and Checks]
    <p>Indubitably, Sand Throw Excadrill is by far the best counter to all variants of Electivire. As for other ways to defeat or weaken Electivire, Choice Scarfed Garchomp can revenge kill Electivire with ease, or at least force a switch (without a baloon!) Once again, Electivire's poor defenses allow him to be plucked of by hard-hitting threats, so even a pokemon such as Conkledurr can cause a substatial amount of damage. </p>

    [Dream World]


    <p>Electivire gets Vital spirit as a Dream World ability. Due to sleep's new mechanics, and thus more presence of sleep, this would have been useful, but Electivire's average speed combined with less than average defenses practically forces Electivire to have Motor Drive.</p>
  2. KurashiDragon

    KurashiDragon

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2008
    Messages:
    828
    As I'm sure alot of people will say, put Wild Bolt in place of Thunder Punch.
  3. (makeup)

    (makeup) kevin
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2010
    Messages:
    2,874
    Formatting needs work, Wild Bolt outclasses ThunderPunch most of the time.

    EVire definatley wants these sets:

    - Choice Band
    - Mixed Attacker
    - Balloon
    - Physical Attacker

    Personally, I don't think Volt Chance deserves to be on the current set (especially a phyiscal set) because Electivire's main switch-ins are Ground-type, which will make Volt Change useless. Also, Fire Punch should be in the AC because all it hits is Scizor, which isn't too common nowadays because of Genosect.

    In my opinion, this looks like a fourth gen set written on a Fifth Gen forum.

    I can see Vital Spirit becoming useful though, as sleep is a lot more popular this generation due to it's new mechanics (sleep timer resets after switching out).
  4. Donny Mae.

    Donny Mae.

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2009
    Messages:
    213
    Expert belt/Balloon work better on Electivire than Life Orb does. Also, Vital spirit is good, but because of Electivire's middling speed stat, it NEEDS the boost that motor drive offers.
  5. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Past SPL Winner

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2009
    Messages:
    5,158
    Ok this analysis seriously needs a re-work from the ground up.

    First of all, the CB set isn't viable in this metagame and it should be axed immediately. Its extremely easy to setup on his choiced attacks and Electivire lacks the speed and power to make good use of one.

    Secondly, the physical set should be second. Yes I am aware that Electivire got a buff in Wild Volt, but the mixed set is still superior. (It has an easier time dealing with Nattorei, it can beat Hippowdon etc) The mixed set is out of whack. Hidden Power Dark, really?!? There are tons and tons superior options. (Hidden Power Ice being the prime one)
    The EV spread needs some work too, (its overly complicated)

    Just run 40 Atk / 252 SpA / 216 Spe with a Mild nature. The items are a bit to slashy and you can probably remove Balloon (Electivire is too weak without an attack boosting item, and he's ridiculously frail so Balloon is largely unneeded)
  6. Bloo

    Bloo
    is a Tutoris a Tournament Directoris a member of the Site Staffis an official Team Rateris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis an Administratoris Smogon Frontier's Pike Queenis a Past WCoP Winnerdefeated the Smogon Frontier
    Head TD

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2009
    Messages:
    1,832
    Talked this over with PK on IRC and we came up with the following:

    Get rid of Hidden Power Dark on the mixed set; it's useless. Your reasoning for it:

    Wild Bolt hits every single one of those Pokemon harder than HP Dark. Also, why would use HP Dark versus Jellicent and Starmie when you have a super effective STAB Electric move to use against them?

    Hidden Power Ice > Ice Punch on the mixed set as well. HP Ice hits Gliscor Hippowdon, and other Ground-types harder than Ice Punch ever will, making it the better choice.

    Speaking of the mixed set, make it the first set. It's better than the physical set, simply because it enables Electivire to kill the Pokemon who would otherwise wall it (notably Gliscor, Ferrothorn to an extent, among others). As PK Gaming stated, ditch the Choice Band set IMO; Electivire hates being locked into moves, and Wild Bolt isn't a very good move to be locked into in this metagame, with Ground-types and whatnot lingering around every corner. Electivire is also relatively weak and slow.

    Lastly, I'd say shift Balloon into Additional Comments on each of Electivire's sets. Without Life Orb or Expert Belt, Electivire isn't going to be packing much of a punch. Being immune to Ground until your Balloon is popped is cool and all, but Electivire really appreciates the extra power.
  7. Bugbot

    Bugbot

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2010
    Messages:
    200
    Like Bloo said, HP Dark does not deserve any mention. Replace the mixed-attacker set with this:

    [SET]
    name: Mixed Attacker
    move1: Wild Charge
    move2: Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Grass
    move3: Cross Chop / Brick Break
    move4: Flamethrower
    item: Expert Belt / Life Orb
    ability: Motor Drive
    nature: Lonely
    evs: 252 Atk / 104 SpA / 152 Spe
  8. ParaChomp

    ParaChomp

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2010
    Messages:
    596
    I call dibs on Electivire if he gives it up!

    Anyways, listen to what everyone is saying. I have nothing more to say, maybe include Meditate in additional comments?

    Also, what is the minimum SpA that Electivire needs to 2HKO max HP max SpD Hippowdon with Hidden Power Ice?
  9. Buzzcut

    Buzzcut

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2010
    Messages:
    148
    Modest, max SpA with Life Orb only does a max of 43.8%.
  10. Granstafer

    Granstafer

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2010
    Messages:
    232
    all right, thanks for everyone's input (especially those of Bloo and PK).
    Analysis is up for QC checks.
  11. ParaChomp

    ParaChomp

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2010
    Messages:
    596
    Ooh...might want to include Whimsicott as a teammate, it completely destroys tanks in general.
  12. Delta 2777

    Delta 2777 Machampion
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis the Smogon Tour Season 10 Champion

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2009
    Messages:
    1,241
    Looks good. Just slash Earthquake (on the Physical set) with Fire Punch, and mention Meditate in the AC (Fire Punch is pretty important to fry Scizor, Nattorei and Forretress). Also mention Balloon in Other Options to not get wrecked by stuff like Doryuuzu.

    QC Approved (1/3)
  13. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Past SPL Winner

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2009
    Messages:
    5,158
    QC APPROVED 2/3
  14. Bloo

    Bloo
    is a Tutoris a Tournament Directoris a member of the Site Staffis an official Team Rateris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis an Administratoris Smogon Frontier's Pike Queenis a Past WCoP Winnerdefeated the Smogon Frontier
    Head TD

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2009
    Messages:
    1,832
    Thanks for making the changes. Though, you have a lot of formatting issues with your OP. Here you go:

    Mixed Attacker (open)

    [SET]
    name: Mixed Attacker
    move 1: Thunderbolt
    move 2: Cross Chop
    move 3: Hidden Power Ice
    move 4: Flamethrower
    item: Life Orb / Expert Belt
    nature: Mild
    ability: Motor Drive
    evs: 252 SpA / 40 Atk / 216 Spe


    Physical Attacker (open)

    [SET]
    name: Physical Attacker
    move 1: Wild Bolt
    move 2: Ice Punch
    move 3: Fire Punch / Earthquake
    move 4: Cross Chop
    item: Life Orb / Expert Belt
    nature: Adamant
    ability: Motor Drive
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    I made one slight change to the physical attacker: Fire Punch the first slash over Earthquake. Fire Punch is better since it hits Natorei and Scizor hard. Earthquake is only for Tyranitar, Heatran, and other Steel-types, but, Cross Chop hits them anyways. So, Fire Punch should be listed first.

    QC APPROVED (3/3)
  15. Granstafer

    Granstafer

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2010
    Messages:
    232
    all right, all checks earned. thanks for everyone's help; will begin copyediting soon.
  16. Darkamber8828

    Darkamber8828

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    Messages:
    2,979
    Why should he be wary of Balloon when any time Balloon Electivire switches in, it says "Electivire is floating on a balloon?"

    Don't these two points contradict each other?

    What do you mean, even?

    Also, mention Electivire doesn't reach 100 base speed, so it's not hard to revenge.

    It also can't take priority with its low defenses.

    Also, where's Gyarados in TO? It's a classic...

    Also, mention a completely special set in OC.

    Perhaps you could talk about how Electivire isn't outclassed by other electric-types? (namely, its movepool and mixeyness)

    Should mention Hippowdon in counters for the physical set. It eats Ice Punch and happily OHKOs with EQ, and Slack Offs the damage.
  17. serazac

    serazac

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2011
    Messages:
    12
    What if you make him hold Cell Battery? If you switch in to an electric attack you get a DD boost, and I think it will work great in doubles with Jolteon giving Discharges and making Electivre Faster and Stronger :)
  18. Lucario_Guy

    Lucario_Guy

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2009
    Messages:
    211
    Cell Battery doesn't work if the holder is immune to Electric moves, unfortunately. :/
  19. serazac

    serazac

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2011
    Messages:
    12
    D: , i'm guessing the same thing for absorb bulb or whatever, damn electivre would of been so awesome with that haha
  20. Colonel M

    Colonel M JESUS BIRD HAS RETURNED
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2007
    Messages:
    4,415
    How's this going by the way? I see some activity from May 15th, but it still isn't finished. :(
  21. Granstafer

    Granstafer

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2010
    Messages:
    232
    ^yeah about that... Iv'e been working on it, but progress has been slow with my exams coming up... don't worry though, it won't be much longer.
  22. Moo

    Moo Professor
    is an Artist Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2010
    Messages:
    1,446
    I really think Balloon should get a slash on both sets, because it's surprisingly hard to take down a +1 Evire without ground moves, you'll usually end up getting a kill as something pops the balloon
  23. MewGod

    MewGod

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2011
    Messages:
    29
    Special viable?
  24. AccidentalGreed

    AccidentalGreed "Smogon friends" is an oxymoron.
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2009
    Messages:
    2,683
    You might as well go with Jolteon, Raikou, or some other fast sweeper if you're going that route. While Electivire does have a niche in Motor Drive, there are times when the Speed Boost is just unnecessary, and could fail you if Electivire chooses to become a Special sweeper.
  25. AccidentalGreed

    AccidentalGreed "Smogon friends" is an oxymoron.
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2009
    Messages:
    2,683
    Heads up: The OP of this Electivire analysis has not been active since June 9th, and the analysis has only been updated since the third of that month.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)