1. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

End-of-Turn Effects

Discussion in 'Stark Mountain' started by david stone, Sep 9, 2007.

  1. david stone

    david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming.
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Smogon IRC AOp Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2005
    Messages:
    5,150
    End-of-turn effects

    1.0 Reflect wears off
    1.1 Light Screen wears off
    1.2 Safeguard fades
    1.3 Tailwind ends

    2.0 Wish

    3.0 Hail, Rain, Sandstorm, or Sun message

    4.0 Dry Skin, Hydration, Ice Body, Rain Dish

    5.0 Gravity

    6.0 Shed Skin, Speed Boost
    6.1 Ingrain
    6.2 Black Sludge, Leftovers
    6.3 Leech Seed
    6.4 Burn, Nightmare, Poison, Poison Heal
    6.5 Flame Orb activation, Toxic Orb activation
    6.6 Curse (from a Ghost)
    6.7 Bind, Clamp, Fire Spin, Magma Storm, Sand Tomb, Whirlpool, Wrap
    6.8 End of Outrage, Petal Dance, Thrash
    6.9 Magnet Rise
    6.10 Yawn
    6.11 Sticky Barb

    7.0 Doom Desire, Future Sight

    8.0 Perish Song

    9.0 Trick Room

    10.0 Pokemon is switched in (if previous Pokemon fainted)
    10.1 Toxic Spikes
    10.2 Spikes
    10.3 Stealth Rock


    Now for an explanation:

    If something has a priority of 4, it always goes before a 5. If it has a 2, it's always after a 1. Etc. However, for a faster Pokemon, their things within a 4, for example, will all go before a slower Pokemon's 4s. So Deoxys-S's Toxic Orb will activate before Shuckle's Ingrain, but Quagsire's Leftovers will be before its own Burn damage.

    So in other words, if one Pokemon were to have all these things happening at once, it would happen in the order listed. But if two Pokemon of differing Speeds were to have all these happening, faster Pokemon gets all the 1 effects, then the slower Pokemon gets the 1 effects, faster Pokemon gets all the 2 effects, then the slower one, etc.

    If the final Pokemon on each team faint to end-of-turn effects, the game is a draw if all Pokemon faint to the same effect, unless the fainting effect is in tier 6. If the Pokemon faint to different effects or the effect is in tier 6, then the end of the turn proceeds normally, and whichever Pokemon would faint last is declared the winner.

    What determines the order a Pokemon is switched in to replace a fainted Pokemon? The only three scenarios I could imagine would be: Speed of previous Pokemon, Speed of Pokemon coming in, whoever makes the selection first comes in first. Assuming Trick Room does end before a Pokemon comes in, I don't imagine it being the Speed of the previous Pokemon, though.

    Still need Bad Dreams, and a verification that Sticky Barb is 6.10 and not 7.0 (see if a faster Pokemon is hit by Future Sight before a slower one is affected by Sticky Barb).
  2. Team Rocket Elite

    Team Rocket Elite Data Integration Thought Entity
    is a Pokemon Researcher

    Joined:
    May 3, 2005
    Messages:
    1,006
    Pinch berries now activate immedately when the HP requirement is met.

    Mewtwo uses Psychic
    Jolteon is hit below 25%. Petaya Berry activates.
    Jolteon uses Thunderbolt. This attack is effected by the stat boost.

    I don't know off the top of my head if there are any other changes.
  3. Boa1891

    Boa1891 Ninja Researcher
    is a Researcher Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2007
    Messages:
    662
    I was going to mention that, as well.

    Protect/Detect's effect is assumed to end before any of these, correct?
  4. Calciphoce

    Calciphoce

    Joined:
    May 20, 2007
    Messages:
    1,713
    Does the same go for shoddy? This is incredibly helpful.
  5. Karrot

    Karrot plant
    is a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2005
    Messages:
    846
    Nothing on the list is affected by Protect/Detect/etc.
  6. Dragontamer

    Dragontamer

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2007
    Messages:
    2,068
    EDIT: Nevermind my first paragraph, I better check more closely before posting stuff like what used to be here...

    I know for a fact however, that hail -> leftovers is working correctly. Just won a battle in fact as some guy used subsitute to bring himself down to 1% hp, then hail hit him before leftovers.
  7. david stone

    david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming.
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Smogon IRC AOp Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2005
    Messages:
    5,150
    Detect, Protect, and Endure all end before any of this kicks in.

    The most helpful way to test this would be to put as many of these effects on one Pokemon as possible, and saying the order.
  8. QibingZero

    QibingZero

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2007
    Messages:
    226
    On shoddy, Wish happens after Sandstorm/Hail damage, that's for sure. After losing a few pokemon to that, I checked in game, and this post is definitely correct in regards to Wish - Weather Effects - Leftovers at least.

    Actually, Wish even happens after Burn/Poison on shoddy as well. That can really suck when you're trying to get a Wish to a guts activated Heracross. =P
  9. Lemmiwinks MkII

    Lemmiwinks MkII

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,678
    Where does Speed Boost fit in on the list? I'd imagine it to be alongside Shed Skin and Rain Dish, but it hasn't been mentioned.
  10. Peterko

    Peterko Never give up!
    is a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2005
    Messages:
    1,070
    order of what I tested

    1. sandstorm
    2. leftovers
    3. leech seed
    4. toxic orb activation

    1. reflect wore off (set up after screen in the same turn, same team)
    2. light screen wore off (set up before reflect in the same turn, same team)
    3. sandstorm damage
    4. leftovers
    5. leech seed
    6. toxic damage
    7. poison heal
  11. david stone

    david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming.
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Smogon IRC AOp Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2005
    Messages:
    5,150
    Are you healed from Poison Heal the turn the Toxic Orb activates? If a Pokemon has Toxic Heal, does it still give some sort of message stating that the Pokemon is Poisoned, or do they just heal? It seems to me most likely that Poison Heal and Poison damage would be in the same turn (since it's impossible for a Pokemon to have both at once, if they are "next to each other", they are the same.
  12. fiddlestix

    fiddlestix

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2006
    Messages:
    109
    No you are not healed in the same turn. Um I'm not sure about toxic heal or if that was a screw up but for poison heal it gives a message "POKEMON was badly poisoned by the Toxic Orb!" the turn that toxic orb activates. And so it heals at the end of the next turn and so on.
  13. david stone

    david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming.
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Smogon IRC AOp Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2005
    Messages:
    5,150
    I meant Poison Heal not Toxic Heal.
  14. Peterko

    Peterko Never give up!
    is a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2005
    Messages:
    1,070
    sorry I should´ve mentioned that toxic orb/psn heal was on a breloom and everything else on a partner starmie...yeah toxic orb activates, but it goes after poison so no damage that turn, which also affects psn heal which will heal you next turn the first time

    and also there´s no message that the pokémon is poisoned when psn heal is in play, it just heals with a psn heal message

    the only way to find out whether psn heal takes the place of poison damage is to use a faster psn heal pokémon and a slower toxiced/poisoned partner/foe


    EDIT: ok toxic orb activation is on the same priority place as poison damage, against a wild bidoof toxic orb activated before bidoof (slower), also psn heal HP recovery next turn was also first

    poison/toxic damage, burn damage, toxic orb/flame orb activation and poison heal all have the same end turn priority, which one will go first depends on the speed (fastest first)
  15. Peterko

    Peterko Never give up!
    is a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2005
    Messages:
    1,070
    TEST 1:
    1. sandstorm
    2. curse
    3. sand tomb
    4. yawn (fell asleep)

    TEST 2:
    1. sandstorm
    2. poison
    3. curse
    4. sand tomb

    TEST 3:
    1. light screen
    2. safeguard
    3. wish
    4. sandstorm
    5. ingrain
    6. leftovers
    7. poison
    8. sand tomb
    9. yawn
    10. future sight
    11. perish count

    TEST 4:
    1. speed boost
    2. leftovers


    the first post list is correct except the yawn "fell asleep" message comes before future sight and what I said in the previous post, toxic/flame orb and psn heal = poison/burn damage (4.4)
  16. E=mc^2

    E=mc^2

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2007
    Messages:
    73
    What about Hydration? Isn't the status effect removed form the end of a turn?
  17. david stone

    david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming.
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Smogon IRC AOp Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2005
    Messages:
    5,150
    Ah, knew I was forgetting something. I know Hydration comes after Rain's message, meaning you don't benefit from it the turn Rain ends.
  18. david stone

    david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming.
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Smogon IRC AOp Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2005
    Messages:
    5,150
    Which happens first: A faster Pokemon falls to Sleep due to Yawn, or a slower Pokemon activates any of these:

    4.0 Moist Body, Rain Dish, Shed Skin, Speed Boost
    4.1 Ingrain
    4.2 Leftovers

    This will determine if Yawn ought to be 4.8 or 5.0.
  19. nomargu46

    nomargu46

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2007
    Messages:
    953
    how about Black Sludge? i assume it goes in the same tier as Leftovers recovery for Poison-types, but what about non-poisons who are getting wrecked by it?
  20. david stone

    david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming.
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Smogon IRC AOp Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2005
    Messages:
    5,150
    It would make sense for it to be the same as the recovery, as it would likely be like "Do you have Black Sludge? If so, then heal Poisons and damage others."
  21. MythTrainerInfinity

    MythTrainerInfinity

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2006
    Messages:
    827
    I haven't played against very many Darkrais to know, but I'm assuming Bad Dreams needs to be added/tested.
  22. Peterko

    Peterko Never give up!
    is a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2005
    Messages:
    1,070
    -> lagging tail ninjask speed bost activated after a pkmn fell asleep
    -> faster pokémon leftovers activated & it fell asleep before leftovers activated on a slower pokémon
    -> faster pokémon fell asleep before leftovers activated on a slower pokémon

    I´m a bit confused now, this means that yawn is 4.8, right?

    also, speed boost doesn´t activate the turn you switch it in, unless it was out for a whole turn (I mean sent out after a pkmn fainted)


    1. hurt by black sludge
    2. leech seed

    1. black sludge recovery
    2. leech seed

    black sludge is like lefties


    4.4 = 4.5 (I mean 4.5 should be 4.4), I mean they can´t happen at the same time, right? the orbs won´t activate when you´re already statused (yeah I toxiced a breloom holding toxic orb and there was no toxic orb message, only poison heal)
  23. david stone

    david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming.
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Smogon IRC AOp Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2005
    Messages:
    5,150
    Flame Orb and Toxic Orb come after the status damage / healing because you are not damaged the turn they activate.

    Yes, that means Yawn is 4.8.

    So if Yawn is in the same tier as the others, what about Doom Desire / Future Sight? How to test: Get a Pokemon to use Doom Desire / Future Sight on a fast Pokemon. See if the faster Pokemon is hit by Future Sight before a slow Pokemon's Leftovers / Ingrain / status / whatever activates.
  24. Peterko

    Peterko Never give up!
    is a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2005
    Messages:
    1,070
    slower leftovers activated before a faster pkmn was hit by future sight

    1. wish
    2. gravity
    3. leftovers
    4. future sight
    5. trick room

    1. sandstorm
    2. leftovers (212 speed)
    3. leftovers (210 speed)
    4. electromagnetism wore off (210 speed)
    5. future sight

    1. sandstorm
    2. gravity
    3. leftovers
    4. perish count
    5. trick room

    1. hail
    2. leftovers
    3. leech seed
    4. burn
    5. curse
    6. electromagnetism wore off

    1. curse
    2. electromagnetism wore off
    3. yawn

    1. curse
    2. wrap
    3. electromagnetism wore off
    4. yawn


    so...

    1.0 Reflect wears off
    1.1 Light Screen wears off
    1.2 Safeguard fades

    2.0 Wish

    3.0 Hail, Rain, Sandstorm, or Sun message

    4.0 Gravity

    5.0 Dry Skin, Hydration, Rain Dish, Shed Skin, Speed Boost*
    5.1 Ingrain
    5.2 Black Sludge, Leftovers
    5.3 Leech Seed
    5.4 Burn, Poison, Poison Heal
    5.5 Flame Orb activation, Toxic Orb activation
    5.6 Curse (from a Ghost)
    5.7 Bind, Clamp, Fire Spin, Magma Storm, Sand Tomb, Whirlpool, Wrap
    5.8 Magnet Rise
    5.9 Yawn

    6.0 Doom Desire, Future Sight

    7.0 Perish Song

    8.0 Trick Room

    9.0 Pokemon is switched in (if previous Pokemon fainted)


    Tailwind, Hydration, Dry Skin, Shed Skin left
  25. david stone

    david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming.
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Smogon IRC AOp Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2005
    Messages:
    5,150
    Effects that need to be tested are: Tailwind ending, Dry Skin, and Hydration (I know it comes after Rain's message), Shed Skin activating. I was going to test some of this stuff for ADV, but I can't find my GBA. I'm assuming Shed Skin, Dry Skin, and Hydration are in the same slot as Rain Dish and Speed Boost, but this should be tested. The order that a Pokemon is effected by Spikes, Stealth Rock, and Toxic Spikes is also needed, I suppose.

    What determines the order a Pokemon is switched in to replace a fainted Pokemon? The only three scenarios I could imagine would be: Speed of previous Pokemon, Speed of Pokemon coming in, whoever makes the selection first comes in first. Assuming Trick Room does end before a Pokemon comes in, I don't imagine it being the Speed of the previous Pokemon, though.

    Does Speed Boost activate the turn it is gained through Skill Swap, Trace, or Roll Play?

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)