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Fighting Arceus (Support) Update

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by gookie, Aug 18, 2012.

  1. gookie

    gookie Administrator
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    [SET]
    name: Utility Counter
    move 1: Toxic
    move 2: Judgment
    move 3: Ice Beam
    move 4: Recover
    item: Fist Plate
    nature: Bold
    evs: 252 HP / 84 Def / 4 SpA / 168 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Fighting Arceus is an excellent Calm Mind sweeper, but it is equally adept at taking on a more supportive role. Arceus has a great support movepool, boasting access to moves such as Recover, Will-O-Wisp, and Stealth Rock. Fighting Arceus's great bulk, excellent 120 / 120 / 120 defenses, and lack of common weaknesses all help it in its role. Judgment has good neutral coverage in the Uber tier and does respectable damage even when unboosted thanks to Arceus's great base 120 Special Attack stat and STAB. Ice Beam has great coverage and is especially useful for taking out the ubiquitous Dragon-types in Ubers, most notably Rayquaza, which Fighting Arceus is an excellent check to. With Recover, Arceus can heal up during battle, increasing its overall longevity.</p>

    <p>Toxic is the primary status move, and is chosen over Will-O-Wisp due to its ability to cripple Fighting Arceus's four greatest checks: Ho-Oh, Mewtwo, Latias, and Lugia. Will-O-Wisp also provides less general utility, as the only semi-common Steel-type that can switch into Fighting Arceus is Jirachi; physical attackers and support Pokemon such as Dialga and Ferrothorn can be smacked with a super effective STAB Judgment instead of relying on residual damage from Will-O-Wisp.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Perish Song lets Arceus beat late-game sweepers such as Calm Mind Kyogre and Refresh Calm Mind Arceus. Roar can also be used to phaze out other Pokemon trying to set up on Arceus; it is best when used in tandem with entry hazards as it allows Fighting Arceus to rack up entry hazard damage on its foes. Finally, Arceus can set up Reflect to support the team if needed.</p>

    <p>The EVs are tailored to deal with specific Pokemon; a Bold nature and the Defense EVs means that a +1 Adamant Outrage from Life Orb Rayquaza will not OHKO, even after Stealth Rock. Even a Life Orb Adamant +2 ExtremeSpeed from Extreme Killer Normal Arceus only has a minuscule chance to OHKO this set after Stealth Rock and three layers of Spikes. 4 Special Attack EVs ensure that Ice Beam will OHKO Rayquaza, even without Stealth Rock. 168 Speed EVs allow Arceus to outspeed all unboosted Rayquaza, allowing it to switch into those that use Outrage off the bat and retaliate with Ice Beam before getting 2HKOed.</p>

    <p>This set has massive issues with Ho-Oh, Mewtwo, and Latias, but it actually does better against them than the Calm Mind set, thanks to Toxic. Ho-Oh laughs at all of Fighting Arceus's attacks and OHKOes with Brave Bird, while Mewtwo resists Fighting Arceus's STAB and can put it down with Psystrike. Latias with Psyshock will also wreck Fighting Arceus. Shaymin-S can 2HKO Arceus with Air Slash, which means that Fighting Arceus will lose if it gets flinched. Choice Scarf Zekrom can reliably revenge kill Ho-Oh, Mewtwo, Latias, and Shaymin-S, in addition to being one of the few Pokemon to be able to threaten Multiscale Lugia. Heatran is a good partner, as it laughs at StallTwo and walls Ho-Oh lacking Earthquake. Choice Scarf Heatran can revenge kill offensive Mewtwo in the sun with Overheat, and switch into Shaymin-S's Seed Flare. A physically bulky Kyogre can switch into non-Life Orb Ho-Oh, as Brave Bird will take less than 50% of its HP; furthermore, changing the weather lets Pokemon such as Dialga handle Ho-Oh much easier. Wobbuffet walls Mewtwo without sun-boosted Fire Blast or Shadow Ball, and can stall out Pokemon that Fighting Arceus has afflicted with Toxic. Lugia and Giratina wall Ho-Oh quite well and can stall it with Toxic or phaze it out. Lugia also resists Psychic-type attacks, while Giratina is a terrific spinblocker.</p>
  2. syrim

    syrim 1x1x1x1x1x1x1x1x1x1

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    The simple ability to switch into Extremekiller, (Arceus@Life Orb (252 EVs, +Nature) Extremespeed vs Arceus-Fighting (252/36 EVs, +Nature): 29.9 ~ 35.3% (133 ~ 157 HP), and check it with a reliable attack as opposed to a risky WoW,

    Rayquaza,
    Rayquaza@Life Orb (252 EVs, Neutral Nature) Outrage vs Arceus-Fighting (252/36 EVs, +Nature): 48.1 ~ 56.9% (214 ~ 253 HP)

    Rayquaza@Life Orb (252 EVs, Neutral Nature) Draco Meteor vs Arceus-Fighting (252/8 EVs, Neutral Nature): 63 ~ 74.5% (280 ~ 331 HP)

    Rayquaza@Life Orb (44 EVs, Neutral Nature) Extremespeed vs Arceus-Fighting (252/36 EVs, +Nature): 18.6 ~ 22% (83 ~ 98 HP) (Rain)

    and Dialga, barring Life Orb thunder with a paralysis, make this set very valuable.

    But the inclusion of Toxic makes all of the usual suspects pay very heavily for switching into this set, and Toxic causes much more harm to Pokemon like Ho-oh and Lugia than even the offensive set can hope to muster.

    But what seems to be especially critical is the difficulty that most hazard layers will have setting up on this set. Admittedly, Tentacruel is a full stop, with really no way for it to be dented, but skarmory, ferrothorn and forry, as well as all of the common SR setters, namely Groudon, Dialga, and now to an extent excadrill, have to tread very carefully, and cannot switch in to take advantage of a NVE Judgment. In short, the ability to check very frightening physical threats whilst not being set up bait for what usually mauls support arceus is a very valuable niche. The only thing that I see as a possibilty is a more defensive spread. With the given spread,

    Excadrill@Life Orb (252 EVs, +Nature) Earthquake vs Arceus-Fighting (252/36 EVs, +Nature): 40.7 ~ 48.1% (181 ~ 214 HP).

    After SR that's pretty much game for fightceus, so it can't reliably switch in. One could either move the SpA evs, which results in

    Excadrill@Life Orb (252 EVs, +Nature) Earthquake vs Arceus-Fighting (252/88 EVs, +Nature): 38.7 ~ 45.9% (172 ~ 204 HP) (Rain) and

    Arceus-Fighting@Fist Plate (0 EVs, Neutral Nature) Judgment vs Arceus@Life Orb (88/0 EVs, Neutral Nature): 64 ~ 75.9% (258 ~ 306 HP) (Rain),

    or reduce speed as well, which is a simple trade off. All in all, any change at this point will be a trade off to check specific pokemon, but the trouble a fightceus capable of switching into excadrill could give any sand team is definitely note worthy.
  3. syrim

    syrim 1x1x1x1x1x1x1x1x1x1

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    <@Poppy> syrim we'll see what other QC members say but yeah i was just considering pouring 88 evs into defense
    <+Syrim> well like i said
    <+Syrim> it's a trade off
    <+Syrim> but you don't lose much from dropping the SpA
    <+Syrim> at least for exkiller and arceus
    <+Syrim> rayquaza*
    <+Syrim> i haven't calced versus support mons though
    <+Syrim> Arceus-Fighting@Fist Plate (0 EVs, Neutral Nature) Judgment vs Skarmory@Life Orb (232/252 EVs, +Nature): 41.3 ~ 49.2% (136 ~ 162 HP) (Rain)
    <+Syrim> fine there
    <+Syrim> Arceus-Fighting@Fist Plate (0 EVs, Neutral Nature) Judgment vs Forretress@Life Orb (252/216 EVs, Neutral Nature): 47.7 ~ 56.7% (169 ~ 201 HP) (Rain)
    <+Syrim> yeah
    <+Syrim> i don't see why you shouldn't
    * +Colonel_M (ColonelM@Sub.per.io.r) Quit (Quit: The Colonel has left the internets. Rejoice.)
    * PDC_ (~PDC@synIRC-6B8CCB1F.lightspeed.wlfrct.sbcglobal.net) has joined #ubers
    <@Poppy> syrim what about
    <@Poppy> well with the SpA Evs can you
    <@Poppy> 2hko skarm
    <@Poppy> after SR
    <+Syrim> yeah i calced everything relevant
    <+Syrim> you obv beat ferrothorn
    <+Syrim> and lose to tenta
    <+Syrim> there's one more thing to calc i guess
    <+Syrim> Arceus-Fighting@Fist Plate (0 EVs, Neutral Nature) Ice Beam vs Groudon@Life Orb (252/0 EVs, Neutral Nature): 43 ~ 50.9% (174 ~ 206 HP) (Rain)
    <+Syrim> Arceus-Fighting@Fist Plate (52 EVs, Neutral Nature) Ice Beam vs Groudon@Life Orb (252/0 EVs, Neutral Nature): 45 ~ 53.4% (182 ~ 216 HP) (Rain)
    <+Syrim> woops
    <+Syrim> yeah not a big enough difference imo
    <+Syrim> you're not going to prevent it from setting up sr regardless
    <+Syrim> and you wall it to hell and are capable of beating LO sets with either spread
    <@Poppy> hm yea ok
    <@Poppy> i'll go update the spread later
    <@Poppy> too lazy atm
  4. Gates

    Gates

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    Is SR worth mentioning as an option for this set? It seems like it's standard fare to have it in analysis as an option for Support Arceus sets, even though it's often not optimal.
  5. shrang

    shrang Go to your room
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    SR should probably be AC material. I'd also consider Roar on the set somewhere, since phazing is nice.

    Otherwise, qc approved 1/3
  6. trickroom

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    [​IMG]
    QC APPROVED 2/3

    I think you should just dump Will-O-Wisp into AC. Ghost and Grass Arceus do the burning thing better. Judgment is what Fighting Arceus has over other walls. You don't need to burn Ferrothorn or ExtremeKiller Arceus because you can KO them straight. Also you mentioned no Steel types will switch into Fighting Arceus anyway.

    Will-O-Wisp however can help vs things like SD Groudon and Zekrom. You still wall Scarf Zekrom and Groudon needs Swords Dance to get past you. Since Ice Beam will KO them in 2 hits anyway, I think Will-O-Wisp is pretty useless.

    Mention the power advantage over Lugia and STAB Judgment hits hard. Tyranitar, Excadrill, Dialga and Ferrothorn will never switch in on you because you OHKO them. Lugia can't touch those at all besides Toxic Tyranitar.

    Sadly Bulky Kyogre still gets 2HKOed by LO Ho-Oh Brave Bird. Heatran is fine as a partner. Scarf Heatran has the advantage of checking Mewtwo with Overheat. Defensive Heatran helps deal with Ho-Oh without Earthquake, Giratina and Stalltwo. Fighting Arceus scares off Terrakion, Darkrai and friends.

    I think SR isn't worth mentioning because this Arceus has no free slots. Using Stealth Rock on Arceus is always pretty bad anyway because Arceus is so versatile. You need Toxic to weaken would be Fighting Arceus counters and Ice Beam makes you a great Rayquaza counter. Also Ice Beam is your only way of attacking Giratina-O.
  7. Furai

    Furai a Ωdefender // a αguardian
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    [​IMG]
    QC Approved 3/3


    trickroom is the man.
  8. kittenmay

    kittenmay

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    Amateur GP

    EDIT: Sorry Furai


  9. Furai

    Furai a Ωdefender // a αguardian
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    kittenmay, that is a single set, thus it does not need the Overview, Other Options, and Checks and Counters sections, only Set and Additional comments


    !
  10. Gates

    Gates

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    I hate to get off topic but would this be something that would apply to every Support Arceus revision then?
  11. trickroom

    trickroom
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    Fighting Arceus needs all the moveslots to be effective. Without Ice Beam, you are no longer the Rayquaza counter and Giratina-O can easily phaze you out and slowly die to Toxic.

    Fighting type Judgment is what this Arceus has others don't. Recover is a must on defensive Arceus. Toxic as stated by Poppy is really useful for catching Ho-Oh, Lugia and even Latias switch ins.

    None of the moves can be replaced. Ghost Arceus is different because it can use a set like Judgment, Recover, Flamethrower/Will-O-Wisp and Stealth Rock, still a bad option but Ghost Arceus can still use it to an extend, mainly because it spin blocks as well. Steel Arceus has Stealth Rock mentioned because nothing is immune to Steel Judgment. A set like Judgment, Recover, Stealth Rock and Will-O-Wisp/Roar still works.

    If Poppy wants to mention Stealth Rock that's still fine because the old analysis has mentioned Stealth Rock as a bad last resort option. Putting it in Other Options of the Fighting Arceus analysis seems to be the best.
  12. Gates

    Gates

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    Okay, I understand now, that makes sense. Thanks.
  13. Jellicent

    Jellicent ~the spirit who loves spirits~
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    Doing another C/P check~

    c/p (open)
    [SET]
    name: Support
    move 1: Toxic
    move 2: Judgment
    move 3: Ice Beam
    move 4: Recover
    nature: Bold
    evs: 252 HP / 84 Def / 4 SpA / 168 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Fighting Arceus is an excellent Calm Mind sweeper, but it is equally adept at taking on a more supportive role. Arceus has a great support movepool, boasting access to moves such as Recover, Will-O-Wisp, and Stealth Rock. Fighting Arceus's great bulk, excellent 120 / 120 / 120 defenses, and lack of common weaknesses all help it in its role. Judgment has good neutral coverage in the Uber tier and does respectable damage even when unboosted thanks to Arceus's great base 120 Special Attack stat and STAB. Ice Beam has great coverage and is especially useful for taking out the ubiquitous Dragon-types in Ubers, most notably Rayquaza, which Fighting Arceus is an excellent check to. Thanks to Recover, Arceus can heal up during battle, increasing its overall bulkiness.</p>

    <p>Toxic is the primary status move, and is chosen over Will-O-Wisp due to its ability to cripple Fighting Arceus's four greatest checks: Ho-Oh, Mewtwo, Latias, and Lugia. Will-O-Wisp also provides less general utility, as the only semi-common Steel-type that can switch into Fighting Arceus is Jirachi; physical attackers and support Pokemon such as Dialga and Ferrothorn can be smacked with a super effective STAB Judgment, instead of relying on residual damage from Will-O-Wisp.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Perish Song lets Arceus beat win-condition sweepers such as Calm Mind Kyogre or Refresh Calm Mind Arceus. Roar can also be used to phaze out other Pokemon trying to set up on Arceus; it is best when used in tandem with entry hazards as it allows Fighting Arceus to rack up entry hazard damage on its foes. Finally, Arceus can set up Reflect to support the team if needed.</p>

    <p>The EVs are tailored to deal with specific Pokemon; a Bold nature and the Defense EVs means that a +1 Adamant Outrage from Life Orb Rayquaza will not OHKO, even after Stealth Rock. Even a Life Orb Adamant +2 ExtremeSpeed from Extreme Killer Normal Arceus only has a minuscule chance to OHKO this set after Stealth Rock and three layers of Spikes. 4 Special Attack EVs ensure that Ice Beam will OHKO Rayquaza, even without Stealth Rock. 168 Speed EVs allow Arceus to outspeed all unboosted Rayquaza, allowing it to switch into those that Outrage off the bat and retaliate with Ice Beam before getting 2HKOed.</p>

    <p>This set has massive issues with Ho-Oh, Mewtwo, and Latias, but it actually does better against them than the Calm Mind set, thanks to Toxic. Ho-Oh laughs at all of Fighting Arceus's attacks and OHKOes with Brave Bird, while Mewtwo resists Fighting Arceus's STAB and can put it down with Psystrike. Latias with Psyshock will also wreck Fighting Arceus. Shaymin-S can 2HKO Arceus with Air Slash, which means that Fighting Arceus will lose if it gets flinched. A Choice Scarf Zekrom can reliably revenge kill Ho-Oh, Mewtwo, Latias, and Shaymin-S, in addition to being one of the few Pokemon able to threaten Multiscale Lugia. Heatran is a good partner, as it laughs at StallTwo and walls Ho-Oh without Earthquake. Heatran's Choice Scarf set can revenge kill offensive Mewtwo in the sun with Overheat, and switch into Shaymin-S's Seed Flare. A physically bulky Kyogre can switch into non-Life Orb Ho-Oh in the sun, as Brave Bird will take less than 50% of its HP; changing the weather lets Pokemon such as Dialga handle Ho-Oh much easier. Wobbuffet walls Mewtwo without sun-boosted Fire Blast or Shadow Ball, and can stall out Pokemon that Fighting Arceus has afflicted with Toxic. Lugia and Giratina wall Ho-Oh quite well and can KO it with Toxic or phaze it out. Lugia is also resistant to Psychic-type attacks, while Giratina is a terrific spinblocker.</p>

    Nice ^.^
    [gp]1/2[/gp]
  14. sandshrewz

    sandshrewz POTATO
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    Placeholder ^_^

    gp (open)
    [SET]
    name: Support
    move 1: Toxic
    move 2: Judgment
    move 3: Ice Beam
    move 4: Recover
    item: Fist Plate
    nature: Bold
    evs: 252 HP / 84 Def / 4 SpA / 168 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Fighting Arceus is an excellent Calm Mind sweeper, but it is equally adept at taking on a more supportive role. Arceus has a great support movepool, boasting access to moves such as Recover, Will-O-Wisp, and Stealth Rock. Fighting Arceus's great bulk, excellent 120 / 120 / 120 defenses, and lack of common weaknesses all help it in its role. Judgment has good neutral coverage in the Uber tier and does respectable damage even when unboosted thanks to Arceus's great base 120 Special Attack stat and STAB. Ice Beam has great coverage and is especially useful for taking out the ubiquitous Dragon-types in Ubers, most notably Rayquaza, which Fighting Arceus is an excellent check to. Thanks toWith Recover, Arceus can heal up during battle, increasing its overall bulkinesslongevity.</p>

    <p>Toxic is the primary status move, and is chosen over Will-O-Wisp due to its ability to cripple Fighting Arceus's four greatest checks: Ho-Oh, Mewtwo, Latias, and Lugia. Will-O-Wisp also provides less general utility, as the only semi-common Steel-type that can switch into Fighting Arceus is Jirachi; physical attackers and support Pokemon such as Dialga and Ferrothorn can be smacked with a super effective STAB Judgment, instead of relying on residual damage from Will-O-Wisp.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Perish Song lets Arceus beat win-conditionlate-game sweepers such as Calm Mind Kyogre orand Refresh Calm Mind Arceus. Roar can also be used to phaze out other Pokemon trying to set up on Arceus; it is best when used in tandem with entry hazards as it allows Fighting Arceus to rack up entry hazard damage on its foes. Finally, Arceus can set up Reflect to support the team if needed.</p>

    <p>The EVs are tailored to deal with specific Pokemon; a Bold nature and the Defense EVs means that a +1 Adamant Outrage from Life Orb Rayquaza will not OHKO, even after Stealth Rock. Even a Life Orb Adamant +2 ExtremeSpeed from Extreme Killer Normal Arceus only has a minuscule chance to OHKO this set after Stealth Rock and three layers of Spikes. 4 Special Attack EVs ensure that Ice Beam will OHKO Rayquaza, even without Stealth Rock. 168 Speed EVs allow Arceus to outspeed all unboosted Rayquaza, allowing it to switch into those that use Outrage off the bat and retaliate with Ice Beam before getting 2HKOed.</p>

    <p>This set has massive issues with Ho-Oh, Mewtwo, and Latias, but it actually does better against them than the Calm Mind set, thanks to Toxic. Ho-Oh laughs at all of Fighting Arceus's attacks and OHKOes with Brave Bird, while Mewtwo resists Fighting Arceus's STAB and can put it down with Psystrike. Latias with Psyshock will also wreck Fighting Arceus. Shaymin-S can 2HKO Arceus with Air Slash, which means that Fighting Arceus will lose if it gets flinched. A Choice Scarf Zekrom can reliably revenge kill Ho-Oh, Mewtwo, Latias, and Shaymin-S, in addition to being one of the few Pokemon to be able to threaten Multiscale Lugia. Heatran is a good partner, as it laughs at StallTwo and walls Ho-Oh withoutlacking Earthquake. Heatran's Choice Scarf setHeatran can revenge kill offensive Mewtwo in the sun with Overheat, and switch into Shaymin-S's Seed Flare. A physically bulky Kyogre can switch into non-Life Orb Ho-Oh in the sun, as Brave Bird will take less than 50% of its HP; furthermore, changing the weather lets Pokemon such as Dialga handle Ho-Oh much easier. Wobbuffet walls Mewtwo without sun-boosted Fire Blast or Shadow Ball, and can stall out Pokemon that Fighting Arceus has afflicted with Toxic. Lugia and Giratina wall Ho-Oh quite well and can KOstall it with Toxic or phaze it out. Lugia is also resistant tos Psychic-type attacks, while Giratina is a terrific spinblocker.</p>


    c/p (open)
    [SET]
    name: Support
    move 1: Toxic
    move 2: Judgment
    move 3: Ice Beam
    move 4: Recover
    item: Fist Plate
    nature: Bold
    evs: 252 HP / 84 Def / 4 SpA / 168 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Fighting Arceus is an excellent Calm Mind sweeper, but it is equally adept at taking on a more supportive role. Arceus has a great support movepool, boasting access to moves such as Recover, Will-O-Wisp, and Stealth Rock. Fighting Arceus's great bulk, excellent 120 / 120 / 120 defenses, and lack of common weaknesses all help it in its role. Judgment has good neutral coverage in the Uber tier and does respectable damage even when unboosted thanks to Arceus's great base 120 Special Attack stat and STAB. Ice Beam has great coverage and is especially useful for taking out the ubiquitous Dragon-types in Ubers, most notably Rayquaza, which Fighting Arceus is an excellent check to. With Recover, Arceus can heal up during battle, increasing its overall longevity.</p>

    <p>Toxic is the primary status move, and is chosen over Will-O-Wisp due to its ability to cripple Fighting Arceus's four greatest checks: Ho-Oh, Mewtwo, Latias, and Lugia. Will-O-Wisp also provides less general utility, as the only semi-common Steel-type that can switch into Fighting Arceus is Jirachi; physical attackers and support Pokemon such as Dialga and Ferrothorn can be smacked with a super effective STAB Judgment instead of relying on residual damage from Will-O-Wisp.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Perish Song lets Arceus beat late-game sweepers such as Calm Mind Kyogre and Refresh Calm Mind Arceus. Roar can also be used to phaze out other Pokemon trying to set up on Arceus; it is best when used in tandem with entry hazards as it allows Fighting Arceus to rack up entry hazard damage on its foes. Finally, Arceus can set up Reflect to support the team if needed.</p>

    <p>The EVs are tailored to deal with specific Pokemon; a Bold nature and the Defense EVs means that a +1 Adamant Outrage from Life Orb Rayquaza will not OHKO, even after Stealth Rock. Even a Life Orb Adamant +2 ExtremeSpeed from Extreme Killer Normal Arceus only has a minuscule chance to OHKO this set after Stealth Rock and three layers of Spikes. 4 Special Attack EVs ensure that Ice Beam will OHKO Rayquaza, even without Stealth Rock. 168 Speed EVs allow Arceus to outspeed all unboosted Rayquaza, allowing it to switch into those that use Outrage off the bat and retaliate with Ice Beam before getting 2HKOed.</p>

    <p>This set has massive issues with Ho-Oh, Mewtwo, and Latias, but it actually does better against them than the Calm Mind set, thanks to Toxic. Ho-Oh laughs at all of Fighting Arceus's attacks and OHKOes with Brave Bird, while Mewtwo resists Fighting Arceus's STAB and can put it down with Psystrike. Latias with Psyshock will also wreck Fighting Arceus. Shaymin-S can 2HKO Arceus with Air Slash, which means that Fighting Arceus will lose if it gets flinched. Choice Scarf Zekrom can reliably revenge kill Ho-Oh, Mewtwo, Latias, and Shaymin-S, in addition to being one of the few Pokemon to be able to threaten Multiscale Lugia. Heatran is a good partner, as it laughs at StallTwo and walls Ho-Oh lacking Earthquake. Choice Scarf Heatran can revenge kill offensive Mewtwo in the sun with Overheat, and switch into Shaymin-S's Seed Flare. A physically bulky Kyogre can switch into non-Life Orb Ho-Oh, as Brave Bird will take less than 50% of its HP; furthermore, changing the weather lets Pokemon such as Dialga handle Ho-Oh much easier. Wobbuffet walls Mewtwo without sun-boosted Fire Blast or Shadow Ball, and can stall out Pokemon that Fighting Arceus has afflicted with Toxic. Lugia and Giratina wall Ho-Oh quite well and can stall it with Toxic or phaze it out. Lugia also resists Psychic-type attacks, while Giratina is a terrific spinblocker.</p>


    Most changes were just to make some things clearer / remove ambiguity. Good job!

    [GP]2/2[/GP]

    Great Sage thanks for the GP tags~~~ weeeee
  15. Jibaku

    Jibaku Balance is a fool's master
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    i'd rename the set to utility counter because honestly it doesn't offer much support other than countering certain things and baiting stuff to toxic
  16. Nexus

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