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Floatzel (Analysis)

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by SuperJOCKE, Sep 13, 2011.

  1. SuperJOCKE

    SuperJOCKE Lowtier Warrior!
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    [​IMG]
    Floatzel

    [Overview]

    <p>Floatzel has always been a solid Pokemon, sporting a good Attack stat, an excellent Speed stat, and a decent Special Attack stat; this makes it a great offensive threat. Floatzel can use moves such as Ice Beam in tandem with Waterfall and other physical moves, allowing it to take down most of the Pokemon in the UU tier. Floatzel is also the fastest Pokemon with Swift Swim in the game. However, like most fast sweepers, Floatzel is rather frail with only 55 Defense and 50 Special Defense stats. Fortunately, they are somewhat patched up with a good HP stat of 85, and, due to its Water typing, Floatzel only has two weaknesses.</p>

    <p>Despite this, Floatzel still has a hard time in the UU tier due to all the new additions to the tier. Suicune, Slowbro, and Empoleon put a stop to Floatzel if it doesn't carry the right move, while faster threats, such as Jolteon, can easily KO it. However, Floatzel did receive two new tools to play with this generation: Switcheroo and Water Veil. With Switcheroo, Floatzel easily shuts down several Pokemon in combination with Choice Band, whereas Water Veil prevents Scald from burning Floatzel. All this makes Floatzel a dangerous and tricky Pokemon to face.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Rain Sweeper
    move 1: Waterfall
    move 2: Ice Beam
    move 3: Brick Break / Crunch
    move 4: Rain Dance
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Swift Swim
    nature: Rash
    evs: 240 Atk / 252 SpA / 16 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Rain Dance, in combination with Swift Swim, makes Floatzel the sweeper that it is. With the above EVs and Swift Swim, Floatzel reaches an incredible Speed stat of 540, outspeeding the entire tier. With Rain Dance, Floatzel also makes a great hail counter. Waterfall is a reliable STAB with a good side effect, and it hits hard in rain. Ice Beam helps in taking care of Floatzel's greatest counter, Tangrowth, as well as other Grass- and Dragon-types. The choice of the third move depends solely on what you want to hit. As Floatzel counters hail so well, Brick Break makes a great choice. Brick Break hits Ice-type Pokemon for super effective damage, the most noteworthy being Abomasnow. Brick Break also hits Empoleon and Ferroseed for super effective damage. Crunch, however, hits Slowbro for super effective damage, who resists Floatzel's other moves. Either one can be used over Rain Dance if you have rain support on your team already.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Several other moves can be made of use on this set. Aqua Tail hits harder than Waterfall, but has lower accuracy; this is a major flaw since Floatzel can't really afford to miss. Aqua Jet is also an option since it has priority, but it's rather redundant with Swift Swim. Low Kick hits Empoleon slightly harder than Brick Break, but does less damage to Chansey. Taunt can prevent other Pokemon from setting up on or status Floatzel. The listed EVs make Floatzel hit as hard as possible with all its moves, while it also letting it outspeed up to neutral 85 base Speed Pokemon, such as Heracross, outside of rain. Uxie is a great partner to Floatzel since it can provide dual screen support as well as rain support if Floatzel isn't carrying Rain Dance itself. Floatzel also benefits from all kinds of entry hazards. Uxie can set up Stealth Rock in tandem with screens, while Roserade and Nidoqueen can set up Spikes, Toxic Spikes, and Stealth Rock, respectively. If Floatzel lacks one of its coverage moves, Brick Break or Crunch, Pokemon that can take care of Empoleon and Slowbro make great partners. Mismagius can easily take care of Slowbro with Nasty Plot and the super effective Shadow Ball, while Heracross can easily dispose of Empoleon with Close Combat. Rhyperior is also a great partner, taking care of Electric-type Pokemon such as Jolteon and Zapdos.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Choice Band
    move 1: Waterfall
    move 2: Ice Fang
    move 3: Crunch / Brick Break
    move 4: Switcheroo
    item: Choice Band
    ability: Water Veil
    nature: Jolly / Adamant
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Floatzel is a great Choice Band user thanks to its high Attack and Speed stats. Waterfall is Floatzel's main move, being a reliable STAB move with a good effect. Ice Fang is used to hit Grass- and Dragon-types harder than Waterfall. It won't do that much damage to Tangrowth, though. The third move depends on what you want Floatzel to hit. Crunch hurts Slowbro, who resists Floatzel's other moves, while Brick Break hits Empoleon and Ferroseed, who also resist its moves. Switcheroo is an excellent move for a fast Choice Band user, and sets Floatzel apart from other users of it, such as Kabutops. Switcheroo will make several Pokemon in the tier useless when used.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Aqua Tail is a viable option over Waterfall if you want more power, but the loss in accuracy hurts since Floatzel can't afford to miss. Aqua Jet can also be used for priority. Ice Beam is an option over Ice Fang to hit Tangrowth harder, as an uninvested Ice Beam 2HKOes it. A Naive or Naughty nature is recommended in this case. Low Kick hits Empoleon slightly harder than Brick Break, but does less damage to Chansey. Water Veil is used to prevent Floatzel from being burned, but it limits Floatzel to either Ice Fang or Ice Beam. Ice Punch is still an option for more power, but it can only be used with Swift Swim. Ice Punch is also illegal with Switcheroo, making Ice Fang the only choice for a physical Ice-type move. A bulkier spread of 240 HP, 252 Attack, and 16 Speed EVs is usable with Swift Swim and rain support.</p>

    <p>Entry hazards are needed to score certain KOs. Roserade and Nidoqueen make good partners, with Roserade providing Spikes and Nidoqueen Stealth Rock; both can provide Toxic Spikes and absorb them as well. Neither are particularly harmed by Electric-type moves, and Roserade also resists Grass-type moves directed at Floatzel. Furthermore, Floatzel resists Fire-, Water-, Ice-type moves that Roserade and Nidoqueen are weak to. Donphan provides necessary Rapid Spin support, as Floatzel will be switching around a lot. Donphan is also immune to the dangerous Electic-type moves, and it's able to set up Stealth Rock as well. If you're going to use the bulky spread and Swift Swim on Floatzel, rain support is needed. Uxie makes a excellent choice for a Rain Dance user. Uxie can also set up dual screens, which Floatzel also benefits from. Rhyperior is also a great partner, as it can easily take care of Electric-types such as Jolteon and Zapdos.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Pursuit is an option to hit common Psychic- and Ghost-types, such Mew and Mismagius, hard on the switch. Return is also a viable option, as Water and Normal give great coverage, but it will leave Floatzel horribly walled by Slowbro and Empoleon. Both Surf and Scald can used on the first set with some success, if you feel a special Water-type move is needed. Also, Hidden Power Electric and Hidden Power Grass are usable to hit other Water-types; Hidden Power Grass is important if Quagsire is a problem. Icy Wind is a viable support Ice-type move since it lowers the opponent's Speed stat. Floatzel also has access to Bulk Up, but can find it hard to use in this highly offensive metagame. However, a set with Bulk Up and Agility can make Floatzel a good Baton Pass user. It does face competition from Mew; Floatzel is faster, but Mew is bulkier, making it a better choice overall.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Suicune is Floatzel's greatest counter. It resists Floatzel's STAB and Ice-type moves, and it takes little damage from Crunch and Brick Break. Switcheroo is a problem for Suicune though. Tangrowth is also a good counter, as without Ice Beam, Floatzel won't be doing any big damage. Physically defensive versions of Zapdos are also a good choice, as they won't take much damage from Floatzel's physical moves and hit hard with its Electric-type moves. Zapdos needs to be wary of Ice Beam though. Jolteon is also a dangerous Electric-type Pokemon, as it is faster than Floatzel and will easily KO it with Thunderbolt. Jolteon is the main reason a Bulk Up set won't work very well. There are also several Pokemon who check Floatzel depending on what move it's carrying. Both Quagsire and Slowbro will easily wall Floatzel if it doesn't carry the rare Hidden Power Grass and Hidden Power Electric, or Crunch, whereas Empoleon will wall Floatzel if it doesn't carry Hidden Power Electric or Brick Break. Abomasnow also poses a major threat if Floatzel doesn't carry Brick Break.</p>
  2. Omicron

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    Why is Ice Fang slashed with Ice Punch? I can't think of any reason to use Ice Fang over Ice Punch unless its some legality issue?? Other than that, this looks pretty solid.

    EDIT: Don't mention Icy Wind, Floatzel is already fast and doesn't really benefit from the Speed drop. Perhaps a mention of HP Grass in the AC of the first set to hit Gastrodon. Taunt + WOW Mew walls the Rain Dance set due to its bulk and can burn it with WOW. Also, Switcheroo kinda screws with Empoleon already, perhaps even more so than Brick Break at times. I would also talk about how Aqua Jet is a great option to revenge kill Choice Scarf Victini. Mention Taunt, as Floatzel actually has the speed to use it and can prevent status which essentially cripples it.

    I wouldn't slash Ice Fang at all on the CB set, it is way too weak to pose any threat, even to super effective targets. CB will be switching often, so having Water Veil for protection against a burn is rather unnecessary.

    A Bulk Up Baton Pass set is actually worth looking into IMO, something like:

    [SET]
    name: Bulk Up
    move 1: Bulk Up
    move 2: Baton Pass
    move 3: Substitute / Taunt
    move 4: Waterfall / Aqua Tail
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 80 HP / 252 Def / 176 Spe

    EVs maximize defense and allow Floatzel to outspeed base 105's like Mismagius

    I'll try to think of something more... but i honestly can't find anything else.
  3. SuperJOCKE

    SuperJOCKE Lowtier Warrior!
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    Ice Punch = Gen 4 only move. Therefore it is illegal with Water Veil.

    EDIT: Well, I'll leave Icy Wind in there. It's mostly for team support. I think I've mentioned Icy Wind (in OO) in my Spiritomb analysis and Snunch didn't mind. If QC wants it gone, then I will remove it.

    As for Mew, I'll wait and see. Mainly because Waterfall will 2HKO if WoW misses (in rain). If QC... yeah you know.

    I'll leave Ice Fang in as well. Roserade and Flygon still gets mauled by it and Tangrowth takes little damage from Ice Punch anyways. Celebi is hit harder by Crunch. Sceptile with no HP investment will be OHKOed most of the time as well, but it is faster so it doesn't really matter. Shaymin won't be OHKOed by Ice Punch (A 2HKO with max HP, no Defense, for both Ice Fang and Ice Punch. SR or Spikes might be needed sometimes for Ice Fang.) And Altaria is OHKOed by Ice Fang if it doesn't go with max HP and Defense.

    EDIT, again: Try the Bulk Up set out first, then come talk to me. I've tested it and I didn't like it a bit. Mainly because of Suicune and Jolteon.

    Oh, one last thing. Please read everything. You say: "Mention Taunt and Aqua Jet". Look at the AC of the Rain Sweeper set. And the AC of the CB set as well. And please, post a new post instead.
  4. NatGeo

    NatGeo sun's coming up
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    I would mention an Agility set in OO, though it shoudl be stresed that Rain Dance just outclasses it by so much. Good to use if you fear a weather switchin though.

    No mention of Quick Attack on CB? I know it isn't the most powerful attack in the world but Water / Normal is excellent coverage. I'd put it in AC. Pursuit can go in there too while you're at it. Return too maybe???? idk on that one though

    Aqua Tail can go in OO, power vs. accuracy.

    That's all I could find.

    edit: my bad then.
  5. breh

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    I really don't feel RD is worth it. Kabutops seems better. I realize the latter is not as fast out of rain, but it seems far superior due to a higher attack and defence..

    CB, on the other hand, was a fun set.

    iirc I ran Waterfall/Return/Aqua Jet/Switcheroo. I feel that Aqua Jet may be worthy of a slash on the CB set, but that's up to you. Note that Switcheroo forces Swift Swim, iirc.

    EDIT: Yeah my bad; was thinking of Ice Punch >_<
  6. SuperJOCKE

    SuperJOCKE Lowtier Warrior!
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    No it doesn't. You can use Switcheroo with Water Veil. Female Buizel is released.

    @NatGeo. Read all of it first. Pursuit is in OO, where it should be. Aqua Tail is AC, where it should be.

    Quick Attack? Seriously? Then I'd rather use Aqua Jet in tandem with either Waterfall or Return.
  7. SuperJOCKE

    SuperJOCKE Lowtier Warrior!
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    Yo, QC team, I'm bored again!

    Won't you show this sea weasel some love and give me something to do?
  8. Oglemi

    Oglemi I ask consent before I thrash anuses.
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  9. Chou Toshio

    Chou Toshio @Fighting Necktie
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    k

    [​IMG]

    QC APPROVED (2/3)
  10. PK Gaming

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    The first set is badass.

    I've got a few problems with the 2nd set however. Why isn't switcheroo a main slash? IMO its pretty much the only reason why'd you want to use this thing over CB Kabtutops. Water Veil is such a poor ability competitively, i don't think its worth losing Ice Punch at all (keep in mind that STAB Stone Edge > Super Effective Stone Edge, its that weak!). You should also mention a bulkier spread in AC for use on Rain teams. I also have problem with the ability slashes. Crunch should get priority over Brick Break because targeting Slowbro (as well as catching Celebi and a few other dark weaks) > targeting Empoleon and ferroseed.

    The 2nd set should look like this:
    name: Choice Band
    move 1: Waterfall
    move 2: Switcheroo
    move 3: Ice Punch / Ice Fang
    move 4: Crunch / Brick Break
    item: Choice Band
    ability: Swift Swim / Water Veil
    nature: Jolly / Adamant
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
  11. Delta 2777

    Delta 2777 Machampion
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    You should probably make a bigger note that Ice Punch is illegal with Water Veil.
  12. SuperJOCKE

    SuperJOCKE Lowtier Warrior!
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    I've already made a big enough mention.
  13. Omicron

    Omicron
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    I completely forgot about SubPunch. Might be worth mentioning it in OO.
  14. SuperJOCKE

    SuperJOCKE Lowtier Warrior!
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    Ok, I'll put Switcheroo by itself, but I don't really get why I would go without burn protection just to get a slightly more powerful move in Ice Punch? Ice Fang already hits what it needs to hit hard enough (see quote below*). I will also change Brick Break and Crunch.
    What bulky spread are you suggesting then?

    *
    Sorry for doubleposting.
  15. PK Gaming

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    Ice Fang is pathetically weak and it doesn't outdamage Kabutops Stone Edge (who hits grass types HARDER) whereas Ice Punch is just as strong as Stone Edge (with perfect accuracy) that power boost is actually really important. There's less of a reason to use CB Floatzel over Kabutops without it. On the other hand, burn immunity isn't that good considering bulky waters hard wall you anyway and you don't want to be anywhere near them (simply switcherooing them is enough)

    As for the bulky spread you could just mention using evs: 240 hp / 252 Atk/ 16 Spe on the CB set with rain support.

    QC APPROVED (3/3)

  16. SuperJOCKE

    SuperJOCKE Lowtier Warrior!
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    I don't see the logic behind comparing Floatzel with Kabutops, but I'll go with it. Changes made.
  17. TROP

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    I know this already got past QC,but second set needs Ice Punch removed because it is sadly illegal with Switcheroo.

    Ice Punch is gen 4 tutor only move,Switcheroo is gen 5 only egg move.
  18. PK Gaming

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    I see, thats unfortunate.

    Kabutops is flat out better than Floatzel at using a Choice band 99% of the time so it needs to close the gap in whatever it can (matching Stone Egde's base power against grass types, etc) but it looks like its illegal with switcheroo so I guess you can remove ice punch altogether and mention it in AC. (That also means you can go back to using water veil)
  19. SuperJOCKE

    SuperJOCKE Lowtier Warrior!
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    Yay! All "jokes" aside, to think I never thought about that makes me chuckle, I've already mentioned that Switcheroo is illegal with Ice Punch in the AC. Oh well, changes made.

    Also, should I keep Swift Swim and the bulky spread as well? Should I move Swift Swim to AC?
  20. PK Gaming

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    Nope, feel free to remove since its useless now. Mention Swift Swim + Bulky spread in AC though.
  21. SuperJOCKE

    SuperJOCKE Lowtier Warrior!
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    ^Done and done.

    This is now written as well.

    EDIT: God, I forgot little miss Gastrodon moved up so I need to remove it before GP can check it.

    EDIT2: Done, it was only mentioned twice...
  22. TheBaron

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    STAB Stone Edge = 100 x 1.5 = 150
    Super-Effective Stone Edge = 100 x 2 = 200
    200>100 so PK Gaming, all I have to say is that you are wrong.
  23. SuperJOCKE

    SuperJOCKE Lowtier Warrior!
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    No, PK is right. He's talking about how a super effective Ice Punch does the exact same damage to Grass-types as a STAB Stone Edge (75 x 2 = 150 100 x 1.5 = 150).

    But this doesn't matter, as Ice Punch is illegal with Switcheroo, thus making Ice Fang the better option.
  24. blarajan

    blarajan i was born under the same star as shakeitup
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    Make Rain Dance the first slash on the first set?
  25. SuperJOCKE

    SuperJOCKE Lowtier Warrior!
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    May I ask you why? It shouldn't really matter though.

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