Flygon

[haxiom]

Flygon

[QC: 3/3] -- Nayrz / Fireburn / Minority Suspect
[GP: 2/2] -- The Dutch Plumberjack / Luka~ + Snobalt

[OVERVIEW]

Flygon's typing and ability, Levitate, give it key resistances to Fire and Rock and an immunity to Ground, allowing Flygon to serve as a solid check to Primal Groudon, Low Kick Blaziken, Tyranitar, Ground Arceus, and some Excadrill sets, though it must be healthy in order to check the latter. Flygon also has access to Defog, which it can use reliably against Primal Groudon to keep Stealth Rock off the field while also stalling it with Toxic and Roost. It further stands out as a Defog user thanks to a resistance to Stealth Rock and immunities to Spikes and Toxic Spikes, which help it avoid being worn down. While Flygon is immune to Thunder Wave, it is susceptible to other forms of status, such as burn and poison. Furthermore, Flygon is rather passive and can give free turns to opposing Pokemon, especially those immune to Ground. Flygon also faces competition from other Defog users; however, running Defog on Flygon frees up the Arceus slot to run a more offensive set. While Flygon is a good check to Primal Groudon and a reliable Defog user, it does not do much else besides this.

[SET]
name: Defog
move 1: Defog
move 2: Roost
move 3: Toxic
move 4: Earth Power / U-turn
item: Leftovers
ability: Levitate
nature: Bold
evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

Flygon's ability to reliably use Defog on Primal Groudon, the most common Stealth Rock user in Ubers, is the main reason to use it; as such, Defog is a mandatory move. Roost keeps Flygon healthy throughout a match and can help it Toxic stall Primal Groudon. Toxic allows Flygon to wear down and stall out Primal Groudon; it is also Flygon's best way to deter switch-ins that do not mind Earth Power. Earth Power hits Primal Groudon and some Steel-types for super effective damage. U-turn allows Flygon to pivot and keep momentum after it successfully stops Primal Groudon, as well as escape from Wobbuffet and Gothitelle.

Set Details
========

252 HP and Defense EVs maximize Flygon's physical bulk in order to deal with Primal Groudon and Ground Arceus more easily. The remaining EVs are invested in Special Defense to offer an negligible amount of help against special attacks such as Primal Groudon's Lava Plume. Leftovers provide Flygon with useful passive recovery. Levitate grants Flygon a key immunity to Ground, which is essential to Flygon's ability to check Primal Groudon.

Usage Tips
========

Flygon is intended to be a consistent counter to Primal Groudon throughout a match, so keep it healthy and switch it into Primal Groudon when given the opportunity. After switching into Primal Groudon, select a move according to circumstance; use Defog if entry hazards need to be removed, Roost if Flygon needs to recover HP, Toxic if the former two moves do not need to be used and spreading Toxic is beneficial, and Earth Power to hit Steel-types and weakened or poisoned Primal Groudon. U-turn should be used on predicted switches to keep momentum, but make sure that Flygon remains healthy enough to continually check Primal Groudon. Some scouting of sets may be necessary, as Flygon cannot switch in and beat Rock Polish Primal Groudon with Dragon Claw or Dragon Pulse, and support Ground Arceus with Ice Beam will KO Flygon. Be wary when using Toxic against a team that has Magic Bounce users, as poison greatly limits Flygon.

Team Options
========

Flying-types, especially Ho-Oh and Lugia, appreciate Flygon's ability to use Defog reliably against Primal Groudon. Xerneas checks, such as Primal Groudon, Ho-Oh, Klefki, and Aegislash also make for good partners. Offensive Arceus formes with Swords Dance or Calm Mind appreciate Flygon's Defog allowing them to run a more offensive set instead. Rock Arceus is a good teammate for Flygon because it checks Flying-types such as Ho-Oh and Mega Salamence. Finally, Mega Sableye completes an excellent core for controlling entry hazards, as it can deal with Pokemon that Flygon cannot, such as Skarmory, Bronzong, and Deoxys-S.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Earthquake makes use of Flygon's slightly higher Attack to deal slightly more damage to a few targets, but Earth Power hits most common targets harder and is not weakened by burns from Primal Groudon's Lava Plume. Dragon Tail phazes setup sweepers other than Xerneas, preventing them from setting up on Flygon.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Flying-types**: Flying-types are immune to Earth Power, so they only have to worry about Toxic. Ho-Oh switches in and threatens Flygon with a powerful Brave Bird; Mega Salamence, especially if it is carrying Refresh, can set up with Dragon Dance on Flygon; Shaymin-S can set up Substitute or hit Flygon with a powerful Seed Flare; and Rayquaza can set up with Dragon Dance or Swords Dance or hit Flygon with Draco Meteor or Dragon Ascent.

**Levitating Steel-types**: Skarmory and Bronzong are immune to both Earth Power and Toxic, can use Toxic on Flygon, and can set up Spikes and Stealth Rock, respectively.

**Calm Mind Arceus Formes with Refresh**: Calm Mind Arceus formes, such as Rock and Dark Arceus, can set up on Flygon and shrug off Earth Power and Toxic with Recover and Refresh, respectively.

**Dragon-types**: Latias and Latios can switch in and threaten to KO Flygon with a super effective Draco Meteor; however, they do not like Toxic. Zekrom outspeeds Flygon and can KO it with Outrage or Draco Meteor. Dialga does not take much damage from Earth Power and can also KO Flygon with Draco Meteor.

**Xerneas**: Xerneas can switch in and threaten Flygon with Moonblast or set up with Geomancy.

**Ferrothorn**: Ferrothorn takes little damage from all of Flygon's attacks and is immune to Toxic. In return, it can set up Spikes and wear Flygon down with Leech Seed.

**Mega Sableye**: Mega Sableye takes little damage from Earth Power and bounces back Toxic thanks to Magic Bounce. It can also burn Flygon with Will-O-Wisp and heal off any damage take with Recover.

**Primal Kyogre**: Primal Kyogre threatens Flygon with Origin Pulse, Ice Beam, and Scald. Toxic hinders Calm Mind variants, but Rest variants completely wall Flygon.

**Fast Ice Beam Users**: Water Arceus, Lugia, and Mewtwo can outspeed Flygon and KO it with Ice Beam. However, switching into Toxic will limit their effectiveness and longevity.

 

[haxiom]

QC ready I guess

 

[Nayrz]

Mention that Earthquake also sux because switching into Lava Plume Pdon becomes much riskier.

C&C should have Primal Kyogre in there, if it has Rest it doesnt even care for Toxic, and Earth Power does pitiful damage even to the 0 bulk sets. The rest is fine though.

0 SpA Flygon Earth Power vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Primal Kyogre: 54-64 (15.8 - 18.7%)

QC 1/3

 

[haxiom]

Implemented

 

[Fireburn]

C&C should be a little bigger...most CM + Refresh Arceus formes (Rock, Dark, Fairy, Ice) can set up on Flygon without a care in the world. You should also mention Palkia/Kyurem-W since Flygon gives them a pretty easy chance to switch-in and nuke something, probably lump them in with Lati@s under opposing Dragon-types. Rayquaza and Shaymin-S should also go under Flying-types. Skarmory and Bronzong should also be mentioned since they will get their hazards up against Flygon pretty easily.

Mega Sableye is worth mentioning in Team Options. It beats the hazard setters that Flygon can't like Skarmory, Bronzong, and Deoxys-formes while Flygon takes care of Primal Groudon. Mega Gengar can also do something similar to that.

You could probably make a section called "Ice Beam" or "faster Pokemon with Ice Beam" and mention things like Lugia, Arceus-Water, Mewtwo, etc. Granted, most of those hate Toxic, but anything faster than Flygon with Ice Beam is a reasonable check since its damage output is very low.

I think U-turn is possibly worth slashing after Earth Power. While you become less able to fight Klefki and KO a weakened Primal Groudon, U-turn allows Flygon to pivot out of the many things that would enjoy coming in on it to make it less of a momentum suck, and it would be a pretty easy way to get something like Mega Gengar a free switch-in. If you don't think its worth slashing then at least give it a significant mention in OO.

Rest looks fine though, QC 2/3

 

[haxiom]

Implemented the second check, and I'll start writing this up.

 

[zf]

personally, i think u-turn should be slashed with earth power; being able to pivot in on ground moves and actually gain momentum back by clicking u-turn is a valuable niche. ground stab isn't /that/ important to begin with since it only has 2 real targets (keys and pdon) but it's definitely better on stall builds that use flygon (both steel and dice have stall teams using it iirc). on the other hand, u-turn pairs well with offensive threats like mega-gengar (it can trap xerneas / mega-mence / latios after u-turn chip depending on the set) and LO deo-a (kills everything and enjoys the free switch-in). just my two cents, but i think it's just as viable.

 

[haxiom]

^ yeah it was slashed from after Fireburn's post, I agree that it is useful.

 

[haxiom]

Written.

 

[Minority]

I'd mention somewhere in the analysis that Flygon can also check Excadrill, Tyranitar, and non HP Ice Blaziken, maybe in the intro after you mention P Don and Arc Ground. Mention that U-Turn also allows Flygon to escape from Wobb and Goth. Ferrothorn should be included in C&C, as should Dialga and Zekrom since they outspeed, OHKO with Draco, and take little from Earth Power.

QC 3/3

 

[Fireburn]

I'd mention somewhere in the analysis that Flygon can also check Excadrill, Tyranitar, and non HP Ice Blaziken, maybe in the intro after you mention P Don and Arc Ground. Mention that U-Turn also allows Flygon to escape from Wobb and Goth. Ferrothorn should be included in C&C, as should Dialga and Zekrom since they outspeed, OHKO with Draco, and take little from Earth Power.

QC 3/3

Some quick addendums to these you should mention:

Flygon is light enough to escape the 2HKO from Low Kick from LOKen, but HJK will 2HKO cleanly.

Though that particular set is rareish I guess, Adamant LO Excadrill will nearly OHKO Flygon with +2 Iron Head (+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Excadrill Iron Head vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Flygon: 320-376 (87.9 - 103.2%) -- 25% chance to OHKO) so if you want it to check Excadrill you have to keep it at near full health. Flygon also can't OHKO it back with Earth Power and outright loses to Balloon sets.

Rest is fine.

 

[haxiom]

Ok, this is GP ready.

 

[Lumari]

oh this looks cute

remove add / fix (comments); (AC=add comma; RC=remove comma; SC=semicolon)
GP 1/2

wow it's bw2 stunfisk all over again

[OVERVIEW]

Flygon's typing and ability Levitate give it key resistances to Fire and Rock and an immunity to Ground, allowing Flygon to serve as a solid check to Primal Groudon, Low Kick Blaziken, Tyranitar, Ground Arceus, and some Excadrill, though it must be healthy in order to check Excadrill the latter. Flygon also has access to Defog, which it can use reliably against Primal Groudon to keep Stealth Rock off the field (RC) while also stalling it with Toxic and Roost. Flygon also has It further stands out as a Defog user thanks to (or something, but I wanted to get rid of the repetition and this should work) a resistance to Stealth Rock and an immunity to Spikes and Toxic Spikes, which helps Flygon help it avoid being worn down. While Flygon is immune to Thunder Wave, it is susceptible to other forms of status, such as burns and poison. Furthermore, Flygon is rather passive and can give free turns to opposing threats Pokemon, especially those immune to Ground. Flygon also faces competition from other Defog users; however, running Defog on Flygon frees up the Arceus slot to run a more offensive set. While Flygon is a good check to Primal Groudon and a reliable Defog user, but (making the second clause into the main one makes this a sentence that introduces new info as opposed to a generic closure) it does not do much else besides this.

[SET]
name: Defog
move 1: Defog
move 2: Roost
move 3: Toxic
move 4: Earth Power / U-turn
item: Leftovers
ability: Levitate
nature: Bold
evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

Flygon's ability to reliably use Defog on Primal Groudon, the most common Stealth Rock user in Ubers, is the main reason to use it; as such, Defog is a necessary mandatory (the nuance necessary conveys doesn't make too much sense) move. Roost keeps Flygon healthy throughout a match and can help it Toxic stall Primal Groudon. Toxic allows Flygon to wear down and stall out Primal Groudon; it is also Flygon's best way to deter switch-ins that do not mind Earth Power. Earth Power hits Primal Groudon and some Steel-types for super effective damage. U-turn allows Flygon to pivot and keep momentum after it successfully stops Primal Groudon, as well as escape from Wobbuffet and Gothitelle.

Set Details
========

252 HP and Defense EVs maximize Flygon's physical bulk in order to best deal with Primal Groudon and Ground Arceus. The remaining EVs are invested in Special Defense to offer an negligible amount of help against special attacks such as Primal Groudon's Lava Plume. Leftovers provide Flygon with useful passive recovery.

Usage Tips
========

Flygon is intended to be a consistent counter to Primal Groudon throughout a match, so keep it healthy and switch it into Primal Groudon when given the opportunity. After switching into Primal Groudon, select a move according to circumstance; use Defog if entry hazards need to be removed, Roost if Flygon needs to recover HP, Toxic if the former two moves do not need to be used and spreading Toxic is beneficial, and use Earth Power to hit Steel-types and weakened or poisoned Primal Groudon. U-turn should be used on predicted switches to keep momentum, but make sure that Flygon remains healthy enough to continually check Primal Groudon. Some scouting of sets may be necessary, as Flygon cannot switch in and beat Rock Polish Primal Groudon with Dragon Claw or Dragon Pulse, and support Ground Arceus with Ice Beam will KO Flygon. Be wary when using Toxic against a team that has Magic Bounce users, as Flygon is greatly limited by poisoned.

Team Options
========

Flying-types, especially Ho-Oh and Lugia, appreciate Flygon's ability to reliably Defog against Primal Groudon. Xerneas checks, such as Primal Groudon, Ho-Oh, Klefki, and Aegislash also make for good partners. Offensive Arceus formes with Swords Dance or Calm Mind appreciate Flygon's having Defog so that Arceus does not need to run Defog and can freeing up their moveset, allowing them to run an offensive set instead. Rock Arceus is a good teammate for Flygon because it checks Flying types such as Ho-Oh and Mega Salamence for it. Finally, Mega Sableye completes an excellent core for controlling entry hazards, because Mega Sableye it can deal with Pokemon that Flygon cannot, such as Skarmory, Bronzong, and Deoxys-S.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Earthquake makes use of Flygon's slightly higher attack to deal slightly more damage to a few targets, but Earth Power hits most common targets harder and is not weakened by burns from Primal Groudon's Lava Plume. Dragon Tail phazes set up setup sweepers other than Xerneas, preventing them from setting up on Flygon.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Flying-types**: Flying-types are immune to Earth Power, so they only have to worry about Toxic. Ho-Oh switches in and threatens Flygon with a powerful Brave Bird; (SC) Mega Salamence, especially if it is carrying Refresh, can set up with Dragon Dance on Flygon; (SC) Shaymin-S can set up a Substitute or hit Flygon with a powerful Seed Flare; (SC) and Rayquaza can set up with Dragon Dance or Swords Dance (RC) or hit Flygon with Draco Meteor or Dragon Ascent.

**Levitating Steel-types**: Skarmory and Bronzong are immune to both Earth Power and Toxic, can Toxic Flygon, and can set up Spikes and Stealth Rock, (AC) respectively.

**Calm Mind Arceus Formes with Refresh**: Calm Mind Arceus formes, such as Rock and Dark Arceus, can boost with Calm Mind set up on Flygon while shrugging off Earth Power with Recover and Toxic with Refresh.

**Dragon-types**: Latias and Latios can switch in and threaten to KO Flygon with a super effective Draco Meteor; however, they do not like Toxic. Zekrom outspeeds Flygon and can KO it with Outrage or Draco Meteor. Dialga does not take much damage from Earth Power and can KO Flygon with Draco Meteor.

**Xerneas**: Xerneas can switch in and threaten Flygon with Moonblast or set up with Geomancy.

**Ferrothorn**: Ferrothorn takes little damage from any of Flygon's attacks and is immune to Toxic. In return, it can set up Spikes and wear Flygon down with Leech Seed.

**Mega Sableye**: Mega Sableye walls Flygon, bouncing back Toxic thanks to Magic Bounce and using Recover to regain HP. Mega Sableye It can also burn Flygon with Will-O-Wisp.

**Primal Kyogre**: Primal Kyogre threatens Flygon with Origin Pulse, Ice Beam, or Scald. Calm Mind variants dislike Toxic, but Rest variants completely wall Flygon.

**Fast Ice Beam Users**: Water Arceus, Lugia, and Mewtwo can outspeed Flygon and KO it with Ice Beam. However, they do not like switching into Toxic.

 

[haxiom]

Implemented, thanks.

 

[Luka~]

Addition [AP] = Add Period | [AC] = Add Comma.
Removal [RP] = Remove Period | [RC] = Remove Comma.
[Commentary]

Tagging Snobalt to check me so this AM check can become official. I'm still learning. Remember this is an amateur check, and is not official until approved and checked by a GP member. Feel free to use my changes, however!

AMCheck

[OVERVIEW]

Flygon's typing and ability,[AC] Levitate,[AC] give it key resistances to Fire and Rock and an immunity to Ground, allowing Flygon to serve as a solid check to Primal Groudon, Low Kick Blaziken, Tyranitar, Ground Arceus, and some Excadrill sets, though it must be healthy in order to check the latter. Flygon also has access to Defog, which it can use reliably against Primal Groudon to keep Stealth Rock off the field while also stalling it with Toxic and Roost. It further stands out as a Defog user thanks to a resistance to Stealth Rock and an immunity immunities to Spikes and Toxic Spikes, which help it avoid being worn down. While Flygon is immune to Thunder Wave, it is susceptible to other forms of status, such as burns burn and poison. Furthermore, Flygon is rather passive and can give free turns to opposing Pokemon, especially those immune to Ground. Flygon also faces competition from other Defog users; however, running Defog on Flygon frees up the Arceus slot to run a more offensive set. While Flygon is a good check to Primal Groudon and a reliable Defog user, it does not do much else besides this.

[SET]
name: Defog
move 1: Defog
move 2: Roost
move 3: Toxic
move 4: Earth Power / U-turn
item: Leftovers
ability: Levitate
nature: Bold
evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

Flygon's ability to reliably use Defog on Primal Groudon, the most common Stealth Rock user in Ubers, is the main reason to use it; as such, Defog is a mandatory move. Roost keeps Flygon healthy throughout a match and can help it Toxic stall Primal Groudon. Toxic allows Flygon to wear down and stall out Primal Groudon; it is also Flygon's best way to deter switch-ins that do not mind Earth Power. Earth Power hits Primal Groudon and some Steel-types for super effective damage. U-turn allows Flygon to pivot and keep momentum after it successfully stops Primal Groudon, as well as escape from Wobbuffet and Gothitelle.

Set Details
========

252 HP and Defense EVs maximize Flygon's physical bulk in order to best deal with Primal Groudon and Ground Arceus more easily. The remaining EVs are invested in Special Defense to offer an negligible amount of help against special attacks such as Primal Groudon's Lava Plume. Leftovers provide Flygon with useful passive recovery. [You should probably cover Levitate in here. You can get some nice coverage on it to make this section a little bit longer. n_n]

Usage Tips
========

Flygon is intended to be a consistent counter to Primal Groudon throughout a match, so keep it healthy and switch it into Primal Groudon when given the opportunity. After switching into Primal Groudon, select a move according to circumstance; use Defog if entry hazards need to be removed, Roost if Flygon needs to recover HP, Toxic if the former two moves do not need to be used and spreading Toxic is beneficial, and Earth Power to hit Steel-types and weakened or poisoned Primal Groudon. U-turn should be used on predicted switches to keep momentum, but make sure that Flygon remains healthy enough to continually check Primal Groudon. Some scouting of sets may be necessary, as Flygon cannot switch in and beat Rock Polish Primal Groudon with Dragon Claw or Dragon Pulse, and support Ground Arceus with Ice Beam will KO Flygon. Be wary when using Toxic against a team that has Magic Bounce users, as poison greatly limits Flygon is greatly limited by poison.

Team Options
========

Flying-types, especially Ho-Oh and Lugia, appreciate Flygon's ability to reliably use Defog reliably against Primal Groudon. Xerneas checks, such as Primal Groudon, Ho-Oh, Klefki, and Aegislash also make for good partners. Offensive Arceus formes with Swords Dance or Calm Mind appreciate Flygon's Defog freeing up their moveset one of their moveslots, allowing them to run an offensive set move instead. Rock Arceus is a good teammate for Flygon because it checks Flying types Flying-types such as Ho-Oh and Mega Salamence for it. Finally, Mega Sableye completes an excellent core for controlling entry hazards, because as it can deal with Pokemon that Flygon cannot, such as Skarmory, Bronzong, and Deoxys-S.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Earthquake makes use of Flygon's slightly higher attack Attack to deal slightly more damage to a few targets, but Earth Power hits most common targets harder and is not weakened by burns from Primal Groudon's Lava Plume. Dragon Tail phazes setup sweepers other than Xerneas, preventing them from setting up on Flygon.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Flying-types**: Flying-types are immune to Earth Power, so they only have to worry about Toxic. Ho-Oh switches in and threatens Flygon with a powerful Brave Bird; Mega Salamence, especially if it is carrying Refresh, can set up with Dragon Dance on Flygon; Shaymin-S can set up a Substitute or hit Flygon with a powerful Seed Flare; and Rayquaza can set up with Dragon Dance or Swords Dance,[RC] or hit Flygon with Draco Meteor or Dragon Ascent.

**Levitating Steel-types**: Skarmory and Bronzong are immune to both Earth Power and Toxic, can use Toxic on Flygon, and can set up Spikes and Stealth Rock, respectively.

**Calm Mind Arceus Formes with Refresh**: Calm Mind Arceus formes, such as Rock and Dark Arceus, can set up on Flygon and while shrugging off Earth Power with Recover and Toxic with Refresh. shrug off Earth Power and Toxic with Recover and Refresh, respectively.

**Dragon-types**: Latias and Latios can switch in and threaten to KO Flygon with a super effective Draco Meteor; however, they do not like Toxic. Zekrom outspeeds Flygon and can KO it with Outrage or Draco Meteor. Dialga does not take much damage from Earth Power and can also KO Flygon with Draco Meteor.

**Xerneas**: Xerneas can switch in and threaten Flygon with Moonblast or set up with Geomancy.

**Ferrothorn**: Ferrothorn takes little damage from any of all of Flygon's attacks and is immune to Toxic. In return, it can set up Spikes and wear Flygon down with Leech Seed.

**Mega Sableye**: Mega Sableye walls Flygon, bouncing back Toxic thanks to Magic Bounce and using Recover to regain HP. It can also burn Flygon with Will-O-Wisp. Mega Sableye takes little damage from Earth Power and bounces back Toxic thanks to Magic Bounce. It can also burn Flygon with Will-O-Wisp and heal off any damage taken with Recover. [There was an issue here referring to Mega Sableye "walling". Rewrote it a bit, hope you don't mind! n_n]

**Primal Kyogre**: Primal Kyogre threatens Flygon with Origin Pulse, Ice Beam, or and Scald. Calm Mind variants dislike Toxic hinders Calm Mind variants, but Rest variants completely wall Flygon. don't mind the move.

**Fast Ice Beam Users**: Water Arceus, Lugia, and Mewtwo can outspeed Flygon and KO it with Ice Beam. However, they do not like switching should not switch into Toxic.

Good luck with this analysis! I hope my check helped. Shoutout to Snobalt for being an amazing mentor and helping me. n_n

 

[Empress]

[redacted]

 

[Freeroamer]

Err I feel kinda nitpicky here but the part about Defog freeing up a moveslot in "Team Options" has been changed to make it inaccurate, what was there before is completely correct. Defog Arceus tend to run something like Judgment / Toxic / Defog / Recover while offensive Arceus sets, particularly SD tend to look a lot different like SD / physical STAB / coverage / more coverage or recovery. They also tend to run very different EV spreads so it's not really as simple as just a move change.

tdp edit: not gonna comment on any of the gp changes now, but same deal with the edits to POgre in c&c; that one def. doesn't mind Earth Power either, but fsr the check removes that by changing "completely wall" to something else, implying that it only doesn't mind Toxic but cannot consistently take Earth Powers.

 

[haxiom]

Some things:

• Last sentence of intro isn't really a random summary, it's actually of some importance (in my opinion) to note that Flygon does very little other than check Primal Groudon. Do I keep this? Delete it? Elaborate on how as a result, Flygon isn't great for role compression which is really important?
• Do I make the changes re: Arceus formes or not?
• Do I make the changes re: Primal Kyogre or not?
• The last bit about "should not switch into Toxic" in the last C&C section seemed a bit odd to me. To me, it seems to imply that it is always in inferior play to do so on the part of the player who is playing against the Flygon. This isn't really the case, it's more that switching into Toxic is a bit annoying, although there isn't a reason they can't and it's not necessarily that they should not do so either. I made the change but I'm not certain I should have
• I implemented all the other changes

Thoughts?
Luka- Snobalt The Dutch Plumberjack

 

[Lumari]

Last sentence of intro isn't really a random summary, it's actually of some importance (in my opinion) to note that Flygon does very little other than check Primal Groudon. Do I keep this? Delete it? Elaborate on how as a result, Flygon isn't great for role compression which is really important?

it's fine the way it is. There is a rule about not using generic closures, but on the other hand not all closures are generic of the kind "However, capitalize on Flygon's strengths and it certainly won't disappoint." My take is that as long as such a final sentence contains information at all, it's worth keeping. Axing it here definitely takes something away from the overview, which is why I kept it in my check, and the other GP leaders agree with me on this one.

Do I make the changes re: Arceus formes or not?

The changes are still grammatically correct, but (assuming Freeroamer's post is correct) they introduce content errors, so don't make them. GP-wise, I can see the original being a bit clunky, but that can be remedied by simply changing it to "appreciate Flygon's Defog allowing them to run a more offensive set instead", assuming you don't find that change removes any valuable content.

Do I make the changes re: Primal Kyogre or not?

Again, the changes are still grammatically correct, but (assuming I was correct in saying Rest POgre shrugs off Earth Power without a second thought) introduce content errors, so keep it imo. Additionally, I genuinely don't understand what was wrong with the original, so Snobalt / Luka~ will have to explain their reasoning there. Unless they took "walling" to mean "being immune to everything the foe can do", but that'd be pretty absurd considering how limited its applications then would be and definitely is not the sense pretty much everyone uses it in. (For the same reason, I'm not getting the changes to the Sableye entry--however, that one does seem still sound in terms of content, so if you prefer that one, def. go ahead and keep it)

The last bit about "should not switch into Toxic" in the last C&C section seemed a bit odd to me. To me, it seems to imply that it is always in inferior play to do so on the part of the player who is playing against the Flygon. This isn't really the case, it's more that switching into Toxic is a bit annoying, although there isn't a reason they can't and it's not necessarily that they should not do so either. I made the change but I'm not certain I should have

Nah, your reasoning for keeping it is sound. Again, Luka~ / Snobalt will have to explain their reasoning, but the only way I can picture them seeing the original as incorrect is it applying "human" emotions (i.e. not liking something) to Pokemon, but that's just way too overly meticulous and certainly does not adhere to official GP policy.

 

[Luka~]

Some things:

• Last sentence of intro isn't really a random summary, it's actually of some importance (in my opinion) to note that Flygon does very little other than check Primal Groudon. Do I keep this? Delete it? Elaborate on how as a result, Flygon isn't great for role compression which is really important?
• Do I make the changes re: Arceus formes or not?
• Do I make the changes re: Primal Kyogre or not?
• The last bit about "should not switch into Toxic" in the last C&C section seemed a bit odd to me. To me, it seems to imply that it is always in inferior play to do so on the part of the player who is playing against the Flygon. This isn't really the case, it's more that switching into Toxic is a bit annoying, although there isn't a reason they can't and it's not necessarily that they should not do so either. I made the change but I'm not certain I should have
• I implemented all the other changes

Thoughts?
Luka- Snobalt The Dutch Plumberjack

Last sentence of the summary I read as fluff, considering that it restated what you had previously said, it's like using a concluding sentence that restates what you said, so I removed it.
In the bit about Arceus, I changed it to what I thought sounded a bit better. If they introduce content errors, don't use it (although I don't see what content errors it creates).
In the bit about Primal Kyogre, the wording you used didn't make a lot of sense to me, and the fact that you gave Kyogre a "personality" in that it dislikes a move being used. I know what you're going for, but assuming this was formal you wouldn't want to use that language, imo. I don't play Ubers so if that creates a content error, I apologize.
Again, I was concerned with Pokemon having emotions towards a move. I'm aware that you mean "don't like to be hit with" or "don't like to take", but assuming this is formal writing, I wouldn't use this.

Hope this explains some of my reasoning, haxiom The Dutch Plumberjack

 

[haxiom]

Luka~ Snobalt The Dutch Plumberjack

• I kept the last sentence of the introduction.
• Changed the Arceus thing to what tdp suggested
• Changed the "like" stuff in the Kyogre and Ice Beam sections, but kept the wall thing in the Kyogre one

Is this okay?

 

[Empress]

Looks good to me.

 

[haxiom]

Done.