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Foongus (Analysis) [GP 2/2]

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by Ace Emerald, May 9, 2011.

  1. Ace Emerald

    Ace Emerald Horsing around
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    My first analysis, so please point out any formating errors.

    [​IMG]
    Foongus
    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    [Overview]

    <p>Foongus's older brother, Amoonguss, is a prominent force in the VGC 2011 metagame. The former is only useful when used together with Amoonguss as a back up. To set up Trick Room successfully, players will often sacrifice Amoonguss by using Rage Powder. Using both Foongus and Amoonguss on the same team allows players to have Spore support even after Amoonguss sacrifices himself. Due to his lower Speed stat, Foongus has a "faster" Spore than Amoonguss in Trick Room.</p>

    [Set]
    name: Support
    move 1: Spore
    move 2: Rage Powder
    move 3: Giga Drain
    move 4: Protect
    item: Eviolite
    ability: Effect Spore
    nature: Relaxed
    evs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
    ivs: 0 Spe

    [Set Comments]

    <p>This set is meant to be used with Trick Room in play, alongside an effective attacker. After Foongus enters the field, he can render almost any opposing Pokemon useless with Spore. Your attacker can knock out one of your opponent's Pokemon while Foongus puts the other one to sleep to prevent your opponent from attacking. Foongus is slower than Musharna, Gigalith, Escavalier, Ferrothorn, and doesn't have to Speed tie with Reuniclus, Cofagrigus, and opposing Amoonguss. Most importantly, this allows Foongus to put Musharna and Reuniclus to sleep before they can hit him with Psychic, and also cripples Amoonguss before he puts any of your pokemon to sleep. This provides Foongus with a small advantage over Amoongus while still being able to assist a sweep in Trick Room. Protect can be used to scout for the opponent's moves and Rage Powder can be used to draw moves away from your teammate, possibly saving them and wasting your opponent's turn. For example, if you have a Reuniclus beside your Foongus, you can draw Bisharps's Sucker Punch away from Reuniclus, while taking no damage. Giga Drain allows Foongus to not be complete Taunt bait, and can hit Jellicent and Terrakion for decent damage. Here are some calculations against Jellicent and Terrakion.</p>

    <ul class="damage_calculation">
    <li>Giga Drain vs. 252/4 Jellicent 24% - 30%</li>
    <li>Giga Drain vs. 4/0 Jellicent 28% - 35%</li>
    <li>Giga Drain vs. 4/0 Terrakion 35% - 40%</li>
    </ul>

    [Additional Comments]

    <p>The EV spread maximizes his defenses to make the most use of Eviolite. The best Trick Room partners for Foongus are Reuniclus and Jellicent. Both possess the offensive presence needed to attack sleeping foes, and Jellicent enjoys Foongus taking Grass- and Electric-type attacks with Rage Powder. As previously stated, Amoonguss is necessary to justify the use of Foongus on your team in the first place. Gigalith is a another great partner in Trick Room, as Foongus can draw away Grass- and Fighting-type moves that Gigalith hates while taking almost no damage. This allows Gigalith to score many OHKOs with Rock Slide, while Foongus can put whichever of your opponent's Pokemon Gigalith can't OHKO to sleep.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Focus Sash can be used to ensure Foongus survives a hit, but it is generally an inferior option to Eviolite. Mental Herb can protect Foongus from priority Taunt, but the absence of Eviolite really hurts Foongus's bulk.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Conkeldurr is immune to Foongus's Spore thanks to the Flame Orb it generally holds, but Mach Punch and Drain Punch can easily be pulled from their intended target with Rage Powder. Safeguard protects the opponent's Pokemon from Spore. Pokemon holding Lum Berry can shrug off a Spore and fire back an attack. Prankster Taunts can prevent Foongus from using Spore, Rage Powder, or Protect; and Prankster Substitutes can block Foongus's Spore before he can use it.</p>
  2. Human

    Human

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    Just how can you write an analysis about Foongus and not mention the item Evolite?
  3. Ace Emerald

    Ace Emerald Horsing around
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    I didn't think it was worth mentioning because my focus was on a punching bag set, and without focus sash theres no guarantee he will take two hits, especially because many people designate a poke to be able to OHKO Amoonguss. If you think its worth mentioning I'll certainly add it.
  4. Human

    Human

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    Normally I wouldn't, but this thing is outclassed by Amoonguss in nearly every way, Focus Sash to make it a punching bag would not be the best way to use it in my opinion, but for a lot of bulk and low speed in Trick Room while using Evolite is the only reason I see it being used.
  5. gec

    gec i've been crawling through the falling
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    I really think you should highlight some more advantages that Foongus has over Amoonguss because at the moment all you've said is that Foongus makes good death fodder, and that's about it. I agree with Human, I've heard fairly good things about Eviolite Foongus and while I have never used it myself, I assume that is the main reason some people run Foongus > Amoonguss.
  6. Darkmalice

    Darkmalice Like a facepalm, but better
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    Evolite Foongus has worse duraibilty than Amoongus, both physically and specially. Focus Sash Amoongus pulls this set better than Foongus.

    There are only 2 reasons to use Foongus. Lower Speed (being slower than all the fully evolved VCG Pokemon), and this reason below:

    In saying this, I don't think Foongus should be used alongside Amoongus. They don't give much team variety, and makes you much more prone to anything that can hit them super-effective, especially Heat Wave users. 2 Spores users isn't that great if you can't take advantage of them being asleep. Giga Drain has poor coverage, and Amoonguss deals little damage to most things, whilst Foongus' has near non-existent offensive presence; it can't even 2HKO Terrakion with Giga Drain. You're also extremely vulnerable when Trick Room isn't up, when many opposing Pokes can nail them with super-effective attacks, and Trick Room WILL run out with those two' offensive abilities.

    Also, Amoongus' bulk is one of its defining abilites, and Focus Sash Foongus doesn't have it. Furthermore, anything with Taunt will Taunt Foongus, knowing it won't have a Mental Herb, whilst ganging up on its partner and not attacking the useless Foongus till everything is KOed, effectively either forcing the Foongus to swap or to fight with essentially 1 Pokemon for the entire match.

    [EDIT] Safeguard also destroys the Foongus + Amoongus combo.

    [EDIT 2] On second thought, Foongus and Amoongus COULD work together, but only if they're not on the field at the same time. Lead with Amoongus, use Rage Powder till it dies and Spore if the scenario allows it, then send out Foongus, who outspeeds everything and hence can Spore practically everything. Eviolite is superior to Focus Sash for the bulk, as it has close to Amoongus' bulk, but Focus Sash still deserves mention.
  7. cosmicexplorer

    cosmicexplorer pewpewpew
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    Amoonguss always has more bulk than Foonguss, even when Foonguss has an Eviolite. With that said, I think the only way Foonguss can be viable is like what Darkmalice said, on a team with Amoonguss, but not out at the same time.
  8. Ace Emerald

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    I should have made it more clear, this is what I intended. I'll edit in the rest.
  9. Alakapimp

    Alakapimp All washed up
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    When I put this in the analysis reservation queue I was intending for it to focus entirely to use both. "It's not as important" is not a reason to use it over Amoongus. Similar to Salamence in Ubers, the entirety of this analysis should focus on Foongus being with Amoongus.
  10. Ace Emerald

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    Just saw this after I finished editing, would you like me to add more mention of the combo, or did I cover it?
  11. cosmicexplorer

    cosmicexplorer pewpewpew
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    Make sure it's clear in the overview that that's the only reason to use Foonguss.
  12. Ace Emerald

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    Fixed, looking for some more critiques.
  13. Ace Emerald

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    Bump for either more critiques or some quality control checks.
  14. cosmicexplorer

    cosmicexplorer pewpewpew
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    What is this 252 HP / 252 Def Sassy? That's a very inefficient EV spread. When using any Pokemon with Eviolite, you'll want to put 252 EVs in both defenses. Since Foonguss won't be able to survive Chandelure's Overheat even with maximum Special Defense and HP Sassy, I suggest a spread of 252 Def / 252 SpD Relaxed, which makes the most of its defenses and allows it to have about 88% of Amoonguss's physical bulk.
  15. Ace Emerald

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    Fixed, sorry, never been amazing at defensive spreads -.-'
  16. Moo

    Moo Professor
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    Giga Drain is awful, since Foongus has a pitiful Special Attack stat, I'd go with something else in that moveslot tbh. Also if the analysis is focusing on Foongus being used with Amoonguss, I think you should give it a name to suggest that. Salamence's set name in Ubers is called Rayquaza's Dancing Partner for example

    Also why is Rage Powder the first move when the set is called Slow Spore....
  17. Ace Emerald

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    Name changed. As for the rage powder deal, my original set was rage powder based, but I changed it. Also fixed. I don't know what would go over Giga Drain really. In the offensive metagame, I don't know if synthesis is worth it. If anyone has suggestions, I'll happily take them.
  18. cosmicexplorer

    cosmicexplorer pewpewpew
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    Make "Support" the set's name.

    Also, Giga Drain is the best option for Foonguss. Some damage is better than no damage, and it allows Foonguss to do some good damage to Jellicent and Terrakion, so it's not completely useless when Taunted or when the opponent has Safeguard up. Synthesis is useless; Foongus can always be doing something better with the turn it uses to heal itself, like using Spore or Rage Powder.
  19. Ace Emerald

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    Fixed (again). The critiques seem to be diminishing in number and importane, maybe I can get some QC input/checks (hint hint nudge nudge)?
  20. Alakapimp

    Alakapimp All washed up
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    Pm'd you with a rework for the whole thing, get that done and we can look at a qc.
  21. Alakapimp

    Alakapimp All washed up
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    Made a few small edits myself that you may have missed in my most recent pm.

    Quality Control 1/2
  22. Kinneas

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    QC Approved 2/2

    [​IMG]

    D'awwww
  23. Jibaku

    Jibaku Balance is a fool's master
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    This isn't true. I don't know how to describe it really, but since Eviolite is just a multiplication of the original amount, EVing eviolite Pokemon should not be any different than if it doesn't have it attached. An example of this would be Dusclops - you wouldnt want to max its defenses. You want to max its HP regardless of Eviolite.
  24. iss

    iss happily ever after
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    Yeah. A big factor in this is that LO Reuniclus (max+) never KOes 252 HP/252 SpD Sassy Foongus with Psychic. (2 HP short at max roll).

    tl;dr: use 252 HP/252 SpD Sassy

    BS HAX (open)
    <%cosmicexplorer> oh and say
    <%cosmicexplorer> This post approved by cosmicexplorer.
  25. breh

    breh ⁰ ゝ⁰
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    Yes, this is true. The spread is inefficient:

    4 HP/252 Def/252 SpD:
    Defense: 57960
    Special Defense: 58520

    252 HP/200 Def/56 SpD (a generic spread x-act gave me)
    Defense: 60192
    Special Defense: 60192

    I'm rather surprised nobody noticed this.

    As a rule, always max HP on defensive pokemon unless they have obscene HP.

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