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BW NU frozen pork

Discussion in 'RMT Archive' started by FLCL, Dec 15, 2012.

  1. FLCL

    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Past SPL Champion
    NU Tour Champion

    Mar 14, 2010

    the recent unbanning of snow warning in nu caused a huge splash in the metagame, shafting some of the biggest names in the tier and causing others to rise to stardom. i was eagar to take advantage of hail and abuse some of the new big threats. the result was an extremely offensive hail team designed to overwhelm defensive and offensive teams alike. in my opinion, hail balance was really hard to play since there were major synergy problems when i was using three ice-types on a team. stall has enough problems to deal with when using six team members, so using hail stall in conjunction with snover was a definite no-no. although this team was relatively successful, going about fourty games before suffering a loss under the alt "testing hail", i'm not a big fan of it since it doesn't fit in well with my playstyle. due to the offensive nature of this team, one crucial miss or critical hit can be devastating, and many times it requires the user to play perfectly.

    the team in depth

    Snover @ Eviolite
    Trait: Snow Warning
    EVs: 248 HP / 40 Def / 220 SDef
    Calm Nature
    - Blizzard
    - Protect
    - Leech Seed
    - Toxic

    this is by far the best snover set to use in nu. many water and electric types struggle to break through it and are stalled out by the combination toxic, leech seed, and protect. ludicolo is a common victim, since it likes to switch in and cancel out hail with rain dance, which is bad news for the rest of the team. blizzard can hit decently hard, but is rather lackluster against bulkier foes such as gardevoir. substitute users are the biggest threat to snover since they can avoid its arsenal of passive damage and set up, leaving the rest of the team in a bad position. due to this, if water-types and weather setters on the opponent's team are gone, i will often intentionally sacrifice snover to avoid it from being bait.

    Piloswine @ Eviolite
    Trait: Thick Fat
    EVs: 240 HP / 252 Atk / 16 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Earthquake
    - Stealth Rock
    - Ice Shard
    - Stone Edge

    piloswine might not gain any tangible benefits from hail, but it is definitely one of the best options to set up stealth rocks for a team like this. it shines against fast, frail teams that struggle to do enough damage and ohko'ed back as a result. between duosion, emboar, and rotom-f, it's easy to see that offense is the only archetype that has a chance against this team, which is what makes piloswine such a great choice. it strikes down dangerous flying-types such as braviary and swellow with icicle spear, surviving everything they throw at it, and deals with normals decently as well, which is important since this team has no resistances to the type. it is an amazing switch-in to electric-types, and stops them from volt switching all over my team.

    Duosion @ Eviolite
    Trait: Magic Guard
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spd
    Bold Nature
    - Calm Mind
    - Psychic
    - Recover
    - Signal Beam

    duosion is a common pokemon seen on nu hail teams, which is no surprise since it often fits in perfectly. four fighting-type weaknesses make duosion the most important member of this team, since it can counter sawk, gurdurr, and throh. emboar is a bit more difficult to deal with, but there isn't any team that doesn't have trouble with emboar. if duosion gets trapped by skuntank, i'll have to resort to revenge killing the aforementioned threats. if this wasn't a hail team, musharna would definitely be in this spot, but magic guard and recover make duosion the better choice in the current metagame. another benefit of it is the ability to hit dark-types and be immune to toxic at the same time, which is something musharna can't boast. stall teams usually are swept clean by duosion once i remove hypno, frillish, or misdreavus.

    Rotom-Frost @ Life Orb
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Blizzard
    - Thunderbolt
    - Substitute
    - Pain Split

    this guy right here is probably the best hail sweeper in nu. rotom-f has insane coverage and an immensely powerful blizzard that can overwhelm any pokemon that doesn't resist it. even special walls such as lickilicky and probopass will be put under so much pressure thanks to hail that they will often lose to this set. regice and piloswine are the only pokemon that can stop rotom-f under a substitute, and they are handled nicely by the rest of the team. many people expect choice scarf, and will protect with pokemon such as alomomola, giving me a free chance to get a substitute up. pain split is a wonderful move taking rotom-f's low hp into account, allowing me to heal massive amounts of hp against walls. it is also useful for dodging sucker punches from the likes of absol or skuntank when my health is low, allowing me to make more substitutes and play more mindgames with the opponent.

    Emboar @ Choice Band
    Trait: Blaze
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature
    - Flare Blitz
    - Superpower
    - Head Smash
    - Fire Punch

    fighting-types are great in this metagame due to their abilities to dismantle most hail teams. the only qualms about this teamslot i've had is whether to use sawk or emboar, with the latter winning out because of flare blitz. hail teams are often sent scrambling since their main fighting-type resistance cannot safely switch in anymore. emboar has excellent offensive synergy with rotom-f, destroying the special walls that stand a chance against it, while rotom takes care of bulky water-types such as alomomola. a jolly nature is used in order to outspeed absol, which is one of the bigger threats to this team due to its superb coverage. although emboar is an effective wall breaker, emboar often ends up killing itself with flare blitz or head smash; not without taking at least a pokemon down with it, though.

    Cinccino @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Skill Link
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Tail Slap
    - Rock Blast
    - Bullet Seed
    - U-turn

    cinccino is the catch-all revenge killer of this team, being able to outrun a huge amount of threats even after they boost their speed. many people are taken by surprise when their swellow, gorebyss, and rotom-s are killed off since this set is so uncommon. without cinccino, this team will be crushed by opposing sweepers. outside of checking threats, cinccino also helps lure in bulky water or steel types with u-turn for emboar and rotom-f to prey on. it can prevent golem and carracosta from setting up stealth rocks with bullet seed, which benefits the rest of the team greatly. when the rest of the team has open enough hopes in the opponent's defense, cinccino can often clean up with ease if tail slap doesn't miss.


    this team is bother by an extent by hazards, but the real culprit here is opposing weather teams. if i cannot keep snover alive against dedicated sun or rain teams, this team will be steamrolled. emboar, samurott, and braviary can also be troublesome, but i can usually prevent them from getting too many kills if i play smart. this team is not meant to switch into everything; sometimes it requires you to look and see which pokemon need to be removed so a team member can sweep and sacrifice pokemon accordingly. this strategy is risky, but the payout is usually a satisfying victory. however, i feel that a lot can be done to improve how this team functions.
  2. JCM.


    Jun 28, 2012
    I think...I love this team. Scarf Cincc is sooo uncommon and will catch everything off guard. I'd run Giga Drain over Toxic on Snover, which is what I run, but I guess Toxic works too. Is Reckless released on Emboar?
  3. ebeast

    ebeast she's probably sexting nprtprt
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Aug 21, 2011
    Giga Drain's only purpose would be to defeat SubSmash Gorebyss one on one with Snover, but FLCL already has Scarf Cinccino to revenge it. With the Scarf Cinccino will outspeed +2 Gorebyss and Skill Link + Bullet Seed will hit it through the Sub if the opponent is using the SubSmash set. Toxic is important on Snover because it helps rack up damage on Ludicolo and Pokemon that like to switch into Snover such as Emboar. To answer the second question, no Reckless Emboar is not out yet.

    For changes maybe you could try changing Snover's spread to 248 HP / 40 Def / 220 Calm. The loss in Special Defense in negligible and it gives Snover a much better chance at living a Timid Life Orb Hydro Pump followed up by Megahorn from Samurott. I know you're not a big fan of Wild Charge/Head Smash (one of those, I can't remember which one) on Emboar so you could possibly change that for Sleep Talk to have something to take a Spore or Sleep Powder if needed and be able to attack through Sleep Talk. Emboar is powerful enough that Sleep Talk can pick pretty much any move and it will do a lot of damage to anything.
  4. JCM.


    Jun 28, 2012
    Ok, thanks, EBeast. And Emboar learns...Sleep Talk? e.e
  5. Organization Member XIV

    Organization Member XIV

    Oct 22, 2012
    I agree with JCM, this team is great. I would suggest Substitute instead of Blizzard on Snover so it can block status, but then you would be Taunt bait. However, Snover only has 62 base SpAtk, so it's up to you. The only other thing I can say is that the Snover set would be a nightmare to face if Toxic and Leech Seed still worked together like they did in gen1.
  6. WhiteDMist

    WhiteDMist Path>Goal
    is a CAP Contributoris a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Apr 3, 2010
    Sorry for taking so long to rate, it's been a busy week. Your offensive Hail team looks great, as always. Since this team is already so offensively competent, there isn't much I can really change about this team.

    One small detail would be that I think you can put Stone Edge on Piloswine. While you have both Emboar and Cinccino to handle opposing Hail mons, Piloswine is one of the best defenses against them in general. Having a way to handle opposing Rotom-F reliably means that you don't have to rely on Cinccino and Stealth Rocks to stop it. As for what to put it over, I think you can afford to remove 1 Ice move, though both have great uses as well.

    EBeast's EV change suggestion for Snover is decent, since having an better chance of living against Samurott would be very useful. It's not like the extra Special bulk is that important otherwise, and you get to live a Timid Megahorn and stall out more residual damage. I wouldn't give up Blizzard though, since it gives you a chance to break frail Subs and deter the mons from setting up. Sure, it may be relatively weak, but Blizzard still has STAB and 120 bp.


    Piloswine: Stone Edge>Icicle Spear/Ice Shard
    Snover: EBeast's suggestion.

    Nice team FLCL! :pimp:
  7. DTC

    DTC I'll be your 1-Up girl
    is a Battle Server Administratoris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Live Chat Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributor

    May 8, 2011
    You mention how Emboar usually kills itself pretty fast and that you don't really like Head Smash/Wild Charge. I recommend using Fire Punch > Wild Charge so that you have a decently powerful STAB move that does not give you recoil. Fire Punch is actually not that much weaker than Flare Blitz, so it is a nice move to spam when you cannot afford to waste your health away. You do not really need Wild Charge for Alomomola because Snover / Duosion / Rotom-Frost already handle Alomomola very well.
  8. FLCL

    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Past SPL Champion
    NU Tour Champion

    Mar 14, 2010
    As EBeast mentioned, Giga Drain isn't really useful on Snover, so I'll stick with Toxic to be able to wear down Ludicolo.

    That Snover spread looks great, I'll definitely use it over my current one since Samurott is really troublesome for this team to face. I won't be using Sleep Talk since I hate being locked into it and I have horrible luck with it.

    I'd rather not cut down Snover's HP even more with Substitute since it needs everything it can get to be able to switch into Stealth Rocks multiple times and cancel out opposing weather. I doubt a defensive set like this lacking Leftovers will find many chances to stall the opponent anyways.

    I'll use Stone Edge over Icicle Spear since a lot of people have suggested it to me on IRC. It provides good coverage alongside Earthquake and I really need the priority that Ice Shard has.

    The last slot doesn't really matter, although Wild Charge was mainly for Frillish which can be annoying if it carries Taunt. I'll test out Fire Punch though.

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