Gekirin

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by Sorawing, Aug 21, 2012.

  1. Sorawing

    Sorawing

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2012
    Messages:
    38
    Gekirin
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    Hi everyone! This is my first RMT and I would like to ask for your suggestions. I made this team at the dawn of BW2 and it is focused on checking the new threats in the metagame. I’ve been playing competitive since around early-mid BW and I had only made a Smogon account a few days ago. The title ‘Gekirin’ is the move Outrage in Japanese, as Salamence is the main sweeper. Please note that I’m new to this so please tell me if I’ve made any mistakes. Thanks.

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    Tornadus-T @ Expert Belt
    Nature: Hasty
    Ability: Regenerator
    252Sp Atk/252Spd/4Atk
    Hurricane
    Superpower
    U-Turn
    Rain Dance
    Tornadus-T was a Pokemon I really wanted to try out ever since it was released. This Tornadus-T was based off the original Hurriacane set and it actually works well with its great new ability – Regenerator. Hurricane is its main STAB move and does a ton of damage to anyone who doesn’t resist it, although 70% accuracy is pretty shaky, it works well in rain and KOs Fighting types. I chose Superpower over Focus Blast for its reliability, and a way to guarantee an OHKO against non-Chople Berry Tyranitars, Superpower does have its flaws though, Scizor could come in and trap me with Bullet Punch and Pursuit at -1 Defence. U-Turn is to scout switch ins and deals a fair amount of damage to Latios etc. for the last moveslot, rain dance allows me to avert the weather to my favour and screws around sand and sun teams. It also gives Hurricane 100% accuracy and is useful to most of my team. I chose Expert belt to bluff choice and deal a bit more damage to specific Pokemon. This Pokemon is my lead as it can check or scout many leads and could divert the weather to my favour.

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    Mamoswine @ Life Orb
    Nature: Adamant
    Ability: Thick Fat
    252Atk/252Spd/4HP
    Ice Shard
    Icicle Spear
    Earthquake
    Stealth Rock
    Mamoswine checks SO MANY threats in the meta, everyone was talking about how great this guy was, so I decided to give him a try. Ice Shard gives me priority to finish off weakened flying or dragon types. It prevents stuff like CS Salamence from sweeping my team and OHKOes opposing Tornadus-Ts after Stealth Rocks. Probably one of my least used move but Icicle Spear gives me a way to OHKO Dragonites and break Substitute users, it’s great against Pokemons like Gengar predicting a switch and Substituting, only to have it broken and potentially KO it if I get enough hits. Earthquake hits water types switching on and dealing a lot of damage in general, with Mamoswine’s 80 base speed, Earthquake also breaks Modest/ Calm non-balloon Heatran hoping to KO me with its STAB Fire moves (which it can’t if I’m on full health anyways unless its Modest Fire Blast due to Thick Fat). Stealth Rocks are... well, Stealth Rocks, almost every team should have a Stealth Rock user and Mamoswine is mine. Although it doesn’t find many opportunities to set up, if it does, then it’s great. I use Life Orb since I like the ability to switch moves and deal more damage; Thick Fat is great as it basically gives me Ice resistance and Fire neutrality, even with such great power and ability, its Ice/ Ground typing is a letdown as it’s weak to very common moves, notably water, fighting and steel. I’m often in a dilemma whether to switch to Starmie of Magneton when a Scizor comes in, as one mistake could be fatal...

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    Amoonguss @ Black Sludge
    Nature: Calm
    Ability: Regenerator
    252HP/252Sp Def/4Def
    Spore
    Giga Drain
    Clear Smog
    Stun Spore
    Amoonguss is the defensive pivot for my team, its Grass/ Poison typing gives it a couple of key resistances and its HP is HUGE. With max Special Defence, it’s very hard to take him down without a Super Effective STAB move; even then, it could just switch out and heal 1/3 of its health. He’s good at checking the common rain teams which does not have a Tornadus forme; he also handles Keldeo and Breloom and cripples Thundurus-Ts with Stun Spore. Spore is its main move as it basically takes out a Pokemon by itself, although it can’t utilize Spore as well as Breloom (where it’s basically like switch out or get swept and people tend to stay in on Amoonguss) it still gives me an advantage. Giga Drain gives it self-healing and handles Gastrodon and Rotom-W. Clear Smog is great is it resets the boosts of any set up sweeper and Baton Pass chains, it also 2HKOes Breloom, which is a great feat for someone with such crap offenses. Finally, Stun Spore to cripple fast guys and can be used on switch ins when Spore is risky. In my opinion, Stun Spore is more useful than HP Ice as it can’t do anything (doesn’t even OHKO Landorus-T) and Stun Spore is good at scouting switch ins. Black Sludge is there because Amoonguss is Poison type and makes people think twice about Tricking him.

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    Starmie @ Life Orb
    Nature: Timid
    Ability: Natural Cure
    252Sp Atk/252Spd/ 4HP
    Surf
    Ice Beam
    Psyshock
    Rapid Spin
    Starmie has been in OU since the beginning of Pokemon (as you’re all aware), and it’s not hard to see why. It serves as my Rapid Spinner and is great at doing its job, the only Pokemon it has troubles with (in terms of walling) is Jellicent and Ferrothrn. Apart from that, Starmie is a great Pokemon, with its high offensive power coupled with Life Orb; it breaks through many other Pokemons. Surf is its STAB move and is more reliable than Hydro Pump, coupled with Ice Beam for coverage. Psyshock, in my opinion, is more useful than Thunderbolt, as it counters many of Starmies switch ins like Tentacruel, Amoonguss, Chansey and Gengar, it also fits fighting types for Super Effective damage. Psyshock also gains STAB and can be used if Surf seems unappealing. However, the best thing about Starmie is its ability, Natural Cure. With it, it absorbs status for my team and can switch out unscathed, it’s funny how people waste crippling Starmie a turn instead of doing as much damage possible before they die. Life Orb again lets me dish out as much damage as it can.

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    Magneton @ Choice Scarf
    Nature: Timid
    Ability: Magnet Pull
    252Sp Atk/252Spd/4HP (30Atk/Def/Spd)
    Thunderbolt
    Flash Cannon
    HP Fire
    Volt Switch
    Magneton; the Steel Trapper. I chose Magneton over its evolution Magnezone as my team had a problem with Tornadus-T and with Magneton’s 10 extra base speed, it can outspeed it and OHKO with Thunderbolt, whereas Magnezone can’t outspeed it with Choice Scarf and is in danger of being Focus Blasted, although Magneton is much more frail than zone. However, its 10 extra base speed had saved me a couple of matches, outspeeding Starmies and stuff. Thunderbolt is my main STAB move and gets a lot of OHKOs and 2HKOes, it’s my only way of checking Gyarados, however I have to be careful if the opponent has a ground type in their team. Flash Cannon is its secondary STAB move and helps against Hail teams; it is a pretty powerful move in general as it gets 2HKOes on switch ins to Thunderbolt. HP Fire is a way to finish off opposing steel types quickly before they can set up, although Ferrothorn gives it trouble in the rain. Volt Switch allows me to scout and completes the ‘VoltTurn’ core with Tornadus-T. Choice Scarf is the main reason I use him over Magnezone as it outspeeds more Pokemon and is better at revenge killing.

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    Salamence @ Lum Berry
    Nature: Naive
    Ability: Moxie
    252Atk/252Spd/4HP
    Dragon Dance
    Outrage
    Earthquake
    Hydro Pump
    Last but not least – Salamence, my main sweeper. I use the Dragon Dance set because it’s so easy to bluff and can usually sweep if it gets only one Dragon Dance boost. Most people expect a Choice Scarf set so they would switch into a steel type to resist Outrage, only to let me get a free Dragon Dance and (usually) KO it with Earthquake. Dragon Dance is one of the best boosting moves out there, with one Dragon Dance and a Moxie boost; it could potentially sweep the opponents team. Outrage is its main STAB move and after a boost, it could OHKO most non-steel types in the tier! Earthquake has great synergy with Outrage, hitting steel types. The final move is Hydro Pump. Why Hydro Pump? Well, since my team is (partly) rain based, Fire Blast would be greatly weakened and does not do as well (3HKO on neutral nature 252HP/ 168Sp Def standard Ferrothorn in rain). However Hydro Pump gets a rain boost and surprises Pokemon like Gliscor and Landorus-T. It even 2HKOes 252HP/ 0Sp Def Skarmory in rain! Although Ferrothorn walls it… but that’s what Magneton is forJ. I chose Lum Berry as it protects me from status once and could heal Salamence’s confusion at the end of the Outrage chain.

    Conclusion:
    Well here’s my team! It does have a few checks like Jellicent, which is really annoying to take down, and Cloyster, who could sweep my team after a Shell Smash boost etc. but I enjoyed using this team. Since PS was down for me till Friday of last week, I’ve been forced to ladder on PO and I peaked at 87th with this team. Now that PS is working for me, I can finally move. By the way I do not want to make this a weather team so please don’t mention Politoed. Thanks.
  2. PDC

    PDC they say i'm crazy but i have a good time
    is an official Team Rateris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributor

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    Hello, and welcome to Smogon!

    So first off moveset nitpicks are changing to Fire Blast over Hydro Pump on Salamence, as it offers no real additional coverage aside from Hippowdon, which Outrage overall just hits harder. This helps you defeat Skarmory, Ferrothorn, and Forretress. I suggest moving that 4 EVs from HP to SAtk, as this gives you an odd HP number, meaning you can switch into Stealth Rock once more than you could otherwise, it also gives Fire Blast as much power as possible. I also suggest trying a Choice Scarf set instead of Dragon Dance, as this allows you to check Volcarona.

    I can see a large weakness to threats such as Mamoswine, Dragons, and Alakazam. For Mamoswine I suggest trying a Defensive Starmie to handle Mamoswine easier. This also aids in defeating stuff Tentacruel, Breloom, and Gengar easier. A spread of 252 HP / 44 Def / 216 Spe covers this nicely. I also suggest trying a different spread on Amoonguss. 252 HP / 40 Def / 216 SDef Calm. This allows it to survive two Life Orb Ice beams from Starmie, while giving it the most physical bulk possible. I suggest trying Calm Mind Reuniclus over Tornadus - T, who doesn't aid you very much. This helps break stall and defeat stuff like Blissey, Ferrothorn, and Gliscor with ease.

    sets (open)


    Reuniclus @ Leftovers
    252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Bold Nature
    Calm Mind
    Psyshock
    Focus Blast
    Recover

    Salamence @ Choice Scarf
    252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 SAtk
    Naive Nature
    Outrage
    Earthquake
    Fire Blast
    Dragon Claw



    Good luck!

    EDIT : Shining latios is my master and i owe all credit to him he is the best rater ever ( for salamence )
  3. Shining_Latios

    Shining_Latios

    Joined:
    May 5, 2010
    Messages:
    1,425
    Hey, cool team you have here man. However I do have a few suggestions. First off, Dragon-types really mess with you, particularly Latios. You have no safe switch in. Your only resist is Magneton and he is really frail. I suggest changing Magneton into a Specially Defensive Jirachi.

    Specially Defensive Jirachi (open)

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    Jirachi @ Leftovers
    EVs: 252 HP / 224 Special Defense / 32 Speed
    Careful Nature
    Moves:
    - Iron Head
    - Body Slam
    - Wish
    - Protect / Fire Punch


    Jirachi offers you with a nice Dragon-type resist, while being able to give them headaches with the combination of ParaFlinch + Serene Grace. Jirachi gives you a solid Tornadus-T counter as well, being able to take Hurricanes all day long. Jirachi is great as a Wish passer too, allowing you to effectively heal your other Pokemon. Body Slam + Iron Head is for the obvious ParaFlinch combination to cripple teams with ease. The last move depends on if you want to ensure Jirachi gets healed the next turn from Wish or Fire Punch to roast Steel-types such as Scizor. If you are planning on using Tornadus-T a lot with Rain Dance, you are probably better off using Protect. Jirachi also gives you a nice counter to Reuniclus, who looked troublesome to your team. Overall, Jirachi fills a nice role on your team consisting of a Wish Passer, Dragon-type resist, Special Wall, and Tornadus-T counter. Now, since you lack a current Revenge Killer, I suggest switching your Salamence to a Choice Scarf set.

    Choice Scarf Salamence (open)

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    Salamence @ Choice Scarf
    EVs: 252 Attack / 4 Special Attack / 252 Speed
    Naive Nature
    Moves:
    - Outrage
    - Dragon Claw
    - Earthquake
    - Fire Blast


    Choice Scarf Salamence adds a premier revenge killer to your team. One of the most dangerous revenge killers in the metagame, Salamence has access to Moxie, boosting his Attack by 1 stage for every KO you pick up with this bad ass. This combined with the speed of Choice Scarf makes it difficult to take Salamence down. Salamence The moveset is the standard. Fire Blast is for when you need to dispatch Steel-types before you set Rain up. Naive Nature over Naughty because you outspeed Choice Scarf Genesect this way, allowing you to pound it with Fire Blast. Another reason is for Volcarona, who seems to give your team a bit of trouble. Choice Scarf Salamence with a Naive Nature and 252 Speed EVs allows you to speed tie with Max Speed Volcarona, OHKO'ing it with Outrage as it can take a +1 Fire Blast and most Volcarona do not carry HP Rock. Anyways, that's all I got. Hope I helped and good luck.

    EDIT: To PDC [​IMG]
  4. Sorawing

    Sorawing

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2012
    Messages:
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    Thanks to both of you for your rates. I tried Jirachi and ScarfMence (but the ladder shut down for some reason) and they both worked well, I'm a bit reluctant on Reuniclus though as Tornadus-T seems to be very valuable to my team, switching weather and all that, but I'll give it a try nevertheless. The EVs are interesting although defensive Starmie would now fail to 2HKO 252HP/252Def Bold Tentacruel without rocks (if I use leftovers), but I the extra bulk will let me survive more hits. Is it fine to use 4Sp Atk to ensure a OHKO with Psyshock on 4HP/ 0Def Gengar? Specs Latios does pose a threat but I have bet it a few times (although I can't remember how), I've never met a Volcarona while using this team before but I guess it could be a threat when it gets a few Quiver Dances. Alakazam is KOed by a U-Turn from Tornadus-T followed by Ice Shard from Mamoswine. Opposing Mamoswines can't stand Surf from Starmie. The only big problem is Jellicent, which I can't do much against...
  5. PDC

    PDC they say i'm crazy but i have a good time
    is an official Team Rateris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributor

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    Running 4 SAtk is perfectly fine. Jellicent can be defeated by Reuniclus, and Amoonguss.
  6. Sorawing

    Sorawing

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    Amoonguss is vulnerable to burn and Giga Drain doesn't do a lot either, Reuniclus can be Taunted to prevent setting up and Recover, but I guess it'll do...
  7. qwertybanana

    qwertybanana

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2010
    Messages:
    35
    I'm more of a dragonite user because he isn't a fatty like salamance...
    ANYWAY...
    Your team looks great! it looks well balanced and I can see it can cover one of the most dangerous threats in the metagame. However I do see you endangered by most scizor variants. Your only source of priority is mamo...who obviously is allergic to that red bug.

    I agree that you need jirachi to counter it, or magnezone might have some use against scizors and other opposing rachis.
  8. chimpact

    chimpact fire nation
    is a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
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    First of a Naive nature would be better on tornadus as the majority of priority users are physical and it would definitely help in taking those physical hits better. Secondly Tornadus-T is rarely scarfed as you really miss out on the power and it already hits a trolly base speed of 121. You can't really bluff a specs set as they can tell from the damage that Tornadus will not be specs. Life Orb is definitely the way to go with your set.

    Additionally you really need Politoed as Tornadus is not a threat without it. Sun and Sand teams will absolutely destroy you if you try to set up manual weather. You can put a choice scarf politoed over Magneton. It can fill somewhat of a similar role as a revenge killer but it won't be able to trap steels.

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