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Metagame Gen V Balanced Hackmons

Discussion in 'Other Metagames' started by verbatim, Mar 17, 2012.

  1. Imanalt

    Imanalt WHY BUNNELBY DO HAVE FUR?
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    because everything runs max speed in bh, you can actually run even base 100s in tr, and youll stilll underspeed the majority of mons. i think trick room is actually a very interesting strategy and intend to build a tr team to try out when i have some time
  2. Uselesscrab

    Uselesscrab

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    Postscript (Jirachi) @ Lum Berry
    Trait: Simple
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
    Bold Nature
    - Skill Swap
    - Toxic
    - Quiver Dance
    - Stored Power

    Simple Stored Power Jirachi is really good. I use Jirachi for bulk and immunity to toxic. I also have Skill Swap for Shedinja and Contrary sweepers, and Toxic also works for Shedinja and Unaware things.
  3. Imanalt

    Imanalt WHY BUNNELBY DO HAVE FUR?
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    i feel like skill swap isnt particularly useful, as you can already beat shedinja with toxic (although i'd suggest switching to poison gas so that if it runs magic coat, you can win the ppstall). In place of skill swap, i'd suggest running magic coat, which makes you much less vulnerable to prankster spore etc, as well as supporting your team nicely in a lot of other cases.
  4. Level 51

    Level 51 by far the worst
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    PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT THING

    Sturdninja is now nerfed (edit: fixed): instead of not taking damage from attacks, it now takes 0 damage from attacks (i.e. it can be affected by secondary effects, such as Inferno's and Sacred Fire's burn)

    /me pet Imanalt
  5. verbatim

    verbatim Red like Roses
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    Shedinja taking zero damage is not a nerf in any way shape or form, it is a correction to a longstanding bug that PS has been dealing with for a while.
  6. windwolf777

    windwolf777

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    Why would Rhoda affect him ? I mean, why was it different before ?
  7. Uselesscrab

    Uselesscrab

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    Oh. Well. That means that No Guard Rayquaza can easily KO Shedinja with 100% accuracy Inferno.
  8. Champion Steve

    Champion Steve

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    Still has to go through the Lum Berry, but yeah.
    I have to wonder how this will affect the meta. Sheddy is less common than before because of all the team support it requires, but every team carries a counter too it because it can easily win games otherwise. Personally, I've rarely seen the moves that could KO Shedinja with their secondary, but maybe No Guard and Serene Grace will become more common since they can KO Shedinja and give you additional power / mad haxing skills.
  9. Uselesscrab

    Uselesscrab

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    What's the best pokemon to use No Guard? I use Rayquaza.
  10. Imanalt

    Imanalt WHY BUNNELBY DO HAVE FUR?
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    in general i'd want to use a bulky mon that can take advantage of spreading status with no guard moves, such as arceus, which can both successfully use both physical and special moves, and can take enough hits for it to be useful
  11. Aeongate

    Aeongate

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    Sheddinja is a terrible Pokemon for the tier, in my experience. Every game I play is won with hazards - they barely ever leave the field when you predict and spinblock correctly. Then again, I've faced some pretty nasty anti spin-blockers. I won't reveal the sets though, because I want to use them myself.
  12. Aeongate

    Aeongate

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  13. The Eevee General

    The Eevee General The Adventures of Eevee, Queen of the Desert
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    I like Mewtwo.
    -Inferno
    -Zap Cannon
    -Dynamic Punch
    -Blizzard/filler/status/whatever

    Doesn't take super-effective damage like Rayquaza (Dragon is everywhere, Ice kinda common) except maybe Ghost (Gengar). Faster and better Special Attack (just a smidgen), which takes advantage of No Guard's special bias.
  14. GG Unit

    GG Unit

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    Zapdos seems like a good No Guard candidate as well. Not quite as bulky, but STAB on Zap Cannon packs a punch. Between Inferno, Focus Blast, and Blizzard, you'll be hitting most Electric resists super effectively.
  15. Arcticblast

    Arcticblast Deer Lord
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    Oldish No Guard post:
    Since No Guard means in singles that attacks can't miss, Skill Swapping it with a move with questionable accuracy (we're talking 70 here so it works if the opponent switches out) is pretty nice.
  16. Imanalt

    Imanalt WHY BUNNELBY DO HAVE FUR?
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    Another note to people:
    Instead of using prankster groudon, try out rhydon over it.
    Rhydon has a good bit more bulk, which lets it beat a lot of things after stealing their boosts, and its rock typing allows it to beat counter belly drum slaking/regigigas which groudon cant do.

    the set:
    Rhydon @eviolite
    prankster
    -Heart swap
    -baton pass
    -nature power
    -encore/recover/some other filler that helps your team
  17. PureQuestion

    PureQuestion

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    Why are you using Rhydon and not Rhyperior? Every single stat is better.
  18. The Eevee General

    The Eevee General The Adventures of Eevee, Queen of the Desert
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    Read: eviolite. But you're right, if you need a Lum Berry, Rhyperior does it better.
  19. Champion Steve

    Champion Steve

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    I'm quite sure its because of Eviolite.
  20. PureQuestion

    PureQuestion

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    Ahhh right. With all the other crazy shit running around (ie Ubers everywhere) you tend to forget Eviolite even exists...
  21. Fyermind

    Fyermind

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    A few threats and trends I'm seeing in the metagame today

    The huge trend I am seeing is very long games. With so many bulky pokemon in the tier, and lots of recovery options and resistances/immunities, games can easily drag on over 70 turns.

    There is also a massive threat for quick sweeps/hole breaking because of move sets like the following:

    Lugia: @white herb
    Trait: Simple
    EVs: 252 HP / - 252 Atk / + 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
    - Baton pass
    - substitute
    - shell smash
    - Stored Power

    Which can start firing off 260 base power stored power shots at +3 SpA form behind subs and pass off to a bouncer if it suspects whirlwind / heartswap.

    There are several other powerful set-up sweepers with similarly narrow counters, so the metagame requires a large and versatile team to survive.

    This leads to an increased emphasis on breaking small holes in teams. With a two pokemon defeated there is a good chance that a team now lacks a counter to one or more sweeping potentials or lacks the potential to sweep in return.

    Perhaps due to a decrease in the use of magic bounce in the metagame (I'm not sure why, perhaps a surge in mold breaker deoxys-s) spore-phasing is a very effective technique I have noticed. After bouncers are eliminated spore-phasing also gathers massive momentum. For people who haven't been the recipients of this technique, it functions two basic principles:
    1) sleeping counters reset on phasing
    2) damage builds up over dragon tail/ entry hazards

    Whirlwind circumvents substitute while dragontail avoids magic bounce, making the moves complimentary rather than reduntant. It should be noted that spamming dragontail on a mostly sleeping team makes it impossible to switch in a counter intentionally, reducing the chance of getting a counter out before losing a pokemon to as low as 1 - (4/5)^(#turns it takes to defeat one pokemon). These odds can be particularly severe because of how common dragon types are as well as the massive damage stealth rocks do to some pokemon.

    Since building any momentum is a massive boon in the metagame, being able to sleep a few pokemon and scramble the opposing team can be enough to make that first break.

    A few spore phasers I've seen are as follows:

    Giratina @ lum berry/leftovers
    Trait: prankster
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / + 252 Def / - 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
    - Spore
    - Stealth rocks
    - Dragon Tail
    - Whirlwind

    Deoxys-s @ lum berry
    Trait: Mold breaker
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / - 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / + 252 Spd
    - spore
    - stealth rock
    - dragon tail / substitute / other utility move
    - whirlwind

    Lugia @ leftovers
    Trait: Magic bounce
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / + 252 Def / - 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
    - dragon tail
    - substitute
    - spore
    - utility move / recovery move / entry hazard / whirlwind

    They all achieve similar effects in different ways such that counters to Giratina don't necessarily counter deoxys or lugia. I wouldn't suggest running all three on the same team, but having counters to all of them is extremely important.

    Of interest here is that magic coat using sturdinja will eventually phase into hazards as it is now phased by dragon-tail. Whirlwind is favored over dragontail on deoxys because it's low attack makes it hard to break substitutes and win attrition damage, but mold breaker and the high pp of whirlwind allow it to set up a powerful midgame dominance by breaking magic bounce.

    There are also bulk rock types who can probably execute this method effectively under sandstorm for additional passive damage, but I haven't used or seen them yet.
  22. Doolez

    Doolez

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    Prankster spore is a great tactic, you just have to prepare to be accused of having "no skill" by people who are unaware of Magic Coat/Bounce.

    On a slight change of subject, has anyone else noticed that when you use Skill Swap your 'new' ability doesn't show up when you hover over your pokemon anymore? I run a lead Skill Swap Regirock and after using Skill Swap it still displays my old ability...?

    Sorry if this isn't the place to post this...
  23. Uselesscrab

    Uselesscrab

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    Yeah, it's really annoying. But it can also be good. For example, people don't know when I skill swap them normalize so they just attack me with different moves over and over.

    EDIT: I just got swept by Prankster Assist Outrage Kyurem-B. How do I beat it?
  24. ForeverPerfectXI

    ForeverPerfectXI

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    OH man people are still doing the Prankster outrage thing on Kyu-B? >_<

    Such a good strategy. There are some dedicated strategies that can beat it but they can't do much else. You've got to get a way to get rid of their blissey (probably) that has the actual outrage.
  25. Arcticblast

    Arcticblast Deer Lord
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    If you have a not-so-obvious Prankster user you can Taunt the Kyurem-B (I'm not sure if Assist can select Magic Coat or not). A really sturdy physical wall with recovery will usually come out on top against Outrage spam teams. Getting rid of Blissey won't help though, as Assist can select moves from a fainted Pokemon.

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