1. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.
  2. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!

Gen VI Stall

Discussion in 'XY OU Teams' started by Sacaen, Nov 28, 2013.

  1. Sacaen

    Sacaen

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2012
    Messages:
    90
    So the first few teams I've made in gen 6 haven't been working out so well, and nothings really feeling anywhere close to how powerful my gen 5 VoltTurn team was, which is a bit disappointing. That said, I've been having some decent success playing stall. Despite what everyone says about it, it's doing pretty well atm from what I've seen. The team I'm using is nothing new, it's just a FWG core alongside a SkarmBliss core with the almighty power of talonflame to clean up and provide insurance against those that are able to set up if shit hits the fan.

    The Team:
    upload_2013-11-28_2-55-41.png upload_2013-11-28_2-41-55.png upload_2013-11-28_2-44-3.png upload_2013-11-28_2-44-23.png upload_2013-11-28_2-41-29.png upload_2013-11-28_2-45-41.png


    upload_2013-11-28_2-51-16.png
    Superlove (Blissey) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Natural Cure
    EVs: 252 Def / 252 SDef / 4 HP
    Calm Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Wish
    - Protect
    - Seismic Toss
    - Heal Bell

    While it may seem odd to not have any status moves on blissey, the rest of the team has no problem spreading status to help blissey whittle her enemies down so that she can focus entirely on doing her job as a cleric. The entire team appreciates wish support, especially Heatran who doesn't have any recovery moves of it's own, and venusaur who doesn't have leftovers and can tend to be worn down relatively easily compared to the rest of the team get the most mileage out of her massive wishpassing. Protect allows her to scout moves, selfheal with wish, and stall any status damage. Seismic Toss keeps her from being complete taunt bait and gives her a little damage output.

    Fighting: Venusaur, Slowbro, Talonflame

    upload_2013-11-28_2-41-55.png
    Beat it (Skarmory) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Sturdy
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Bold Nature
    - Defog
    - Roost
    - Whirlwind
    - Spikes

    Skarmory is the team's hazard control, as well as one of the big reasons I'm giving stall another shot this generation as I no longer have to rely on spinners like starmie and forretress who don't really fit into my stall teams due to the formers lack of bulk and the latter's lack of recovery. Skarmory easily keeps the field clear of hazards and once the opponent's hazard layer is dead he can lay his own spikes down. Whirlwind allows him to phase setup sweepers that heatran cannot. Skarmory of course is still completely capable of pulling his weight as an incredible physical wall and partner in crime with blissey.

    Fire: Heatran, Slowbro, Talonflame
    Electric: Venusaur

    upload_2013-11-28_2-44-23.png
    Still Alive (Slowbro) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Regenerator
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Bold Nature
    - Scald
    - Ice Beam
    - Toxic
    - Slack Off

    Probably my favorite pokemon to use on any stall team and one I'd never make a stall team without. Thanks to his fantastic ability in regenerator, he is, imo, a better physical wall than even skarmory, he never gets worn down and can take incredibly powerful, boosted attacks from the game's top tier physical attackers with ease (bar KyuB's fusion bolt). Scald+Toxic makes him very difficult to switch into and most things that face him will end up being status'd eventually. Ice Beam provides coverage against the dragons he walls and the grass types that like to switch into him.

    Ghost: Blissey
    Dark: -
    Electric: Venusaur
    Grass: Venusaur, Heatran, Talonflame
    Bug: Skarmory, Heatran

    upload_2013-11-28_2-41-29.png
    The Bad Touch (Heatran) (F) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Flash Fire
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 SDef / 4 SAtk
    Calm Nature
    - Lava Plume
    - Protect
    - Roar
    - Stealth Rock

    Even though heatran took a rough hit losing his resistance to dark and ghost like all steel types had to deal with, his typing is still far above average with stats that complement it perfectly. Heatran functions as a backup special wall to blissey as it can do things blissey cannot, such as phasing, spreading burns, and setting up SR for the team. Between Skarmory and Heatran most threats can be phased out if they manage to set up. Even uninvested, Lava Plume hits very hard thanks to heatrans great base SpA and makes switching into heatran difficult. Protect allows heatran to scout for lethal coverage moves and stall for status damage.

    Ground: Skarmory, Talonflame
    Fighting: Venusaur, Slowbro
    Water: Venusaur, Slowbro

    upload_2013-11-28_3-27-52.png
    Flower Power (Venusaur) @ Venusaurite
    Ability: Chlorophyll
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 HP / 56 Def / 200 SDef
    Careful Nature
    - Leech Seed
    - Synthesis
    - Knock Off
    - Toxic

    Venusaur complete's my FWG core, and has great synergy with slowbro and heatran. An underused mega, and while certainly not broken like Kangaskhan and Gengar are, he is quite solid for the intents and purposes of this team. Upon mega evolving he boosts his bulk up to base 80/123/120 and loses his weakness to fire and ice making him very difficult to take down. The difference in bulk is so great that I will often lead with him to make sure he mega evolves asap as switching in before evolving can be quite a bit harder. His typing also allows him to absorb toxic spikes, spores, sleep powders, and leech seeds for the team making him invaluable. A combination of leech seed, synthesis, and wish support help him make up for his lack of leftovers and his massive bulk carries him the rest of the way. Knock off hits surprisingly hard even without stab and uninvested attack, but more importantly it removes choice bands, choice specs, and life orbs allowing him and his team to take hits even easier as well as leftovers to wear the enemy down faster. It is a very high reward, low risk move. Toxic provides more residual damage for the team. Venusaur is mainly a special tank but he can take physical hits very well too, thanks to some key resistances to fighting, ground, and a bug neutrality. His ev spread is a bit random, I've run him with a physical spread, a special spread, and a few mixed spreads and he has performed very well with all of them.

    Flying: Heatran, Skarmory
    Psychic: Heatran, Skarmory, Slowbro

    upload_2013-11-28_3-43-22.png
    War Dynamics (Talonflame) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Gale Wings
    EVs: 72 HP / 252 Atk / 184 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Flare Blitz
    - Brave Bird
    - Roost
    - Will-O-Wisp

    On a stall team? Yeah. Talonflame is just that good. Talonflame brings the team offensive pressure and speed which would be non-existant without it. His main job is to clean up lategame when everything is weakened and his checks are gone, but that doesn't stop him from coming in midgame to stop a potential sweep or toss out a couple burns. Skarmory is always there to remove stealth rock so he doesn't get worn down to quickly. Despite being the squishiest member of the team, he usually isn't the first to die, as long as you can find an opportunity to switch him in, he is very hard to touch from that point forward due to his amazing speed/priority and powerful attacks and has no trouble switching out when the matchup becomes unfavorable due to his bulky team mates to take an attack for him. Will-o-Wisp is an underrated and underused option for Talonflame that can give his usual counters tyranitar, hippowdon, Landorus-T, and Gliscor (prior to toxic orb activation) a really bad day, crippling them for the remainder of the match, and whittling them down so talonflame can come in again later to sweep once they are sufficiently weakened. His speed EVs allow him to reach 334 speed which allows him to outspeed and flareblitz Timid Thunderus-T and burn jolly Garchomp. The rest are put into his hp for his (surprisingly acceptable bulk (he won me a game by being able to switch into gengar's focus blast after SR damage once)).

    Electric: Venusaur
    Water: Venusaur, Slowbro
    Rock: -



    Threatlist (WIP)
    ***Kyurem-Black - With both Skarmory and Slowbro weak to Electric, Kyurem-Black with Fusion Bolt are a big issue.
    ***Gengarite - Perish Song Mega Gengar is a threat to 5/6 members of my team, the 6th of which can't switch into him. Destiny Bond threatens 3/6 members, and he can straight up beat both skarmory and slowbro if they end up getting trapped with shadow ball/thunderbolt. Thankfully most people I've run into aren't very good at using him.
    ***Kangaskhan - Particularily ones that run Seismic Toss, which can 2hko everything bar blissey, which can't take anything else Kanga runs.
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2013
    Usatoday likes this.
  2. Team Rocket

    Team Rocket

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2012
    Messages:
    19
    Most people? I'd say Skarmory's set is fine just as it is. The only thing that I don't like about this team is Talonflame. It's too frail to stay alive when SR are up and can't really fight back without setting up. Plus, that WoW is pretty useless. I'd change Talonflame to Mega Pinsir and use the regular Venusaur with Substitute, Leech Seed, Giga Dragin and Knock Off.
  3. newtonja

    newtonja

    Joined:
    May 5, 2013
    Messages:
    263
    By the way, keep the talon flame (ignore the guy above). You only want one mega, and mega venusuar is doing just fine. If you are using defog I would really advise against spikes, like really advice against it. either don't use defog and have skarmory carry brave bird instead, or use defog and have skarmory have the stealth rocks instead of spikes and have heatran carry something else. The reason is that since defog rets rid of hazards on both sides it is a huge set back when you have layered all your spikes only to have them all blown away. (By the way sorry team rocketfor totally thowing you under the bus but I feel like I needed to)
  4. Basileus

    Basileus

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2012
    Messages:
    279
    I totally agree with newton to use Brave bird but use BB instead of defog as defog will only come back to hurt you in the end. Spikes is great on a stall team.

    However, I disagree with keeping Talonflame. I thought you were going for stall. If you want to stall then I think you should go with a more defensive pokemon than Talonflame. Talon is crippled by rocks and you need more coverage so he has to go. Basically you are looking at a glass cannon. Also, you need a rapid spinner if you aren't going to use defog. If you want great coverage and decent bulk I suggest you use either Dolphan or Excadrill with their basic bulky sweeper sets. Plus now you have a pokemon immune to electric attacks. With Talonflame on this team as it is currently makes your team look more like an excessive set up for a Talonflame sweep rather than a stall team. I don't think you want to replace Talonflame though looking at what you have written, but if you do, and if you want more help making a bulky sweeper set on Dolph or Exca then just tell me and I will help you gladly.

    Other than that though, I have a few more minor suggestions:

    1. Give Blissey Thunder Wave instead of protect. This is because you really need to be able to paralyze your opponent if you want to run stall. Paralysis can literally ruin a pokemon entirely, and that is what you want to do on a stall team, make your opponent's pokemon useless.

    2. Give Venasaur Giga Drain over synthesis and sludge bomb over toxic. This is because you HAVE TO be able to attack with Venasuar or else you are just wasting so much potential. With wish support and leech seed you don't really need more recovery but giga drain is a nice move to have anyway. As for sludge bomb, chances are you will poison your opponent anyway and now you have a good counter to fairies.

    3. Give heatran the EV spread 252 HP / 72 SDef / 184 Def because he really is a great wall that can be so viable to your team. He has amazing defensive base stats that you should be utilizing. He should be your lead, not Blissey. Also, Give it Air ballon as an item so you have somthing to handle earthquake even if only temporarily.

    4. Ok, so really you should use Jellicent instead of Slowbro with literally the exact same moveset ant item, but with recover instead of slack off and Special Defense EVs and nature. This is because you require Ghost type to ignore rapid spin and gain several needed immunities. However, I highly doubt you want to get rid of Slowbro considering you have stated that you "would never make a stall team without him." So if you want to keep Slowbro then I suggest you use Eviolite not leftovers as the insane boost in defense really overshadows leftovers HP increase. Also, you don't really need leftovers considering you have slack off and regenerator.

    Overall: This team is ok, but for a stall team it really needs to focus more on crippling your opponents pokemon with status conditions and hazards rather than just endless healing and Talonflame sweeping. Another thing is that 5/6 of your pokemon have the same item which is slightly unusual. Anyway, good luck and have fun. I hope my suggestions could help. :D
  5. shamaleon

    shamaleon

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2013
    Messages:
    14
    First off, I think your team is cool and creative, and having talonflame is good for a stall team. It has an intresting combination. However, your Venusaur has chlorophyll, but nothing to use it with, so basically you have a pokemon with a useless ability until he mega evovles. In fact, if you change your mega from request from a another rater, you'll will have an okay Venusaur. If your not going to use the sun, there is no reason Venusaur should have Chlorophyll. You should probably change the ability to Overgrow.
  6. Team Rocket

    Team Rocket

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2012
    Messages:
    19
    What? I've been playing stall for couple of years now, and the whole point of this playstyle is to wear down your oponent to the point where he will forfeit or hazards will wear him down. What's the point of having a weak pokemon, with almost no HP and Def, with double SR weakness. And you're suggesting to get rid of Defog? Seriously. This team have some major issues. It can be swept pretty easily by a bulky pokemon with SD if you're not paying attention, or hell, even Kangaskhan can sweep it without setting up when Skarmory is gone. You have no Dark resistance whatsoever and Gengar can eat you for breakfast, since you can't do anything to him with Blissey (change it to Chansey, really). Also, I think that using Mega as a tank is a REALLY bad idea, because from my observation Venusaur isn't REALLY that bulky. Either make this team semi - stall or use Kangaskhan to sweep at the end.
  7. Basileus

    Basileus

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2012
    Messages:
    279
    The real problem is this team isnt really a stall team. I think what Sacaen really wants is a team that's centered around talonflame doing a late-game sweep. Having a bunch of semi-stall bulky pokemon isn't the best way to do that though. I don't think you want a stall team. So here's my question: what is your core concept and which/how many Pokemon do you want to center it around?
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2013

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)