General LC discussion

[SkyNet]

After Laddering for a while, I haven't really seen much coming from Sun Teams, nor Sandstorm, neither Rain. Evolution Stone Zuruggu, Meditite, and Komatama seem to be taking control of the Metagame if they haven't already. Weather Teams haven't exactly received too much attention this Gen with so many good Pokemon and Evolution Stone around, both of which make life harder for Weather Teams.

Hai James :3, well that is true to a point...Sun was a huge factor when I was laddering a while back, before chlorophyll Bulba was found to be illegal. With the Growth buff in this Gen being +2/+2 Atk and SpAtk it could wreck many teams.

Also no-one has mentioned the scarf fires that really come into there own on sun teams, Fire is a great STAB in all of the top 20 LC pokes take neutral damage from it barring Pururiru, Chinchou and Mantyke.

 

[MapleSandwich]

Yeah, I'm agreeing with you on this: Trick Room will become more viable thanks to so many slow, strong mons. With Pokemon which have immense Offensive stats and Defensive ones, the speedy battles in LC you would find today are going to become scarce in a short amount of time. This is just my assumption and prediction, though.

I've been trying Trick Room, and it shows potential. Bulk Up Dokkora and Curse Tesshido both work pretty well. (sadly, I tried to get baby Shanderaa to sweep, but he's too frail.) I'm pretty sure the fact that I lose most of the time is due to the fact that I'm just doing it wrong, somehow. Maybe Rhyhorn + Yuniran + Dokkora core?

 

[Darkamber8828]

I've been trying Trick Room, and it shows potential. Bulk Up Dokkora and Curse Tesshido both work pretty well. (sadly, I tried to get baby Shanderaa to sweep, but he's too frail.) I'm pretty sure the fact that I lose most of the time is due to the fact that I'm just doing it wrong, somehow. Maybe Rhyhorn + Yuniran + Dokkora core?

The problem with Trick Room is that it doesn't boost attack.

Without an attack boost, you need to raise your attack with moves like Bulk Up to punch through Evo-stone pokemon.

And that wastes a TR turn.

After setting TR, switching in, and setting up, you only have two turns, and you're not going to OHKO everything in the game after one boost.

Which is why TR isn't so great.

 

[Banryu]

Yeah, TR was pretty good in Gen 4 IMO, but Evo Stone really hurts TR teams this time around. :0

 

[SkyNet]

TR is just one of them play styles that looks great on paper but in reality its mediocre and still considered a gimmick. With the birth of the Evolution Stone balanced team are becoming common which isn't the best match up for a TR team, as you can easily pivot stall the TR turns out and set up something like a DD Zuruggu just before TR runs out and go for a sweep.

 

[iDunno]

TR is just one of them play styles that looks great on paper but in reality its mediocre and still considered a gimmick. With the birth of the Evolution Stone balanced team are becoming common which isn't the best match up for a TR team, as you can easily pivot stall the TR turns out and set up something like a DD Zuruggu just before TR runs out and go for a sweep.

Yeah you're right anti-metagame strategies are horrible especially in a metagame full of frail sweepers. Also since there are absolutely NO wallbreakers in Littlecup TR is even worse. [/sarcasm]

 

[SkyNet]

Yeah you're right anti-metagame strategies are horrible especially in a metagame full of frail sweepers. Also since there are absolutely NO wallbreakers in Littlecup TR is even worse. [/sarcasm]

This is Gen 5 LC not Gen 4 LC, mainly full of bulky sweepers carrying Evolution stone such as Zuruggu and bulky Pokemon with a recovery move such as Pururiru, you should play the metagame before commenting.

P.s sarcasm is the lowest form of wit ._.

 

[Heysup]

TR is especially weak in this metagame due to its more defensive nature, I have to side with SkyNet on this one.

 

[KratosAurion]

Agreed, heavy Offense Teams are a lot less commonplace now. With all the Dokkora, Gligar, Tesshiido and Pururiru around these days, Trick Room's offensive nature will easily get stalled, or will see problems against Balanced.

EDIT: Also, could I consider the Slowpoke Analysis as done? Or is there anything else to add?

 

[calze6]

Surely TR is still viable? There still are tonnes of things with huge power still in LC. Clamperl and Cubone can easily cause trouble to a team. It's not as if LC is now full of stall. Things have all gone bulkier but can still be taken down.

 

[lullelulle32]

I have used TR and I can say it's still viable. The evostone has made it harder to make the most out of those TR turns, but evostone also made it a lot easier to set up. When TR is up it's not as deadly as it was in gen 4, but it'll be up a lot more during a match than 4th gen.

 

[SkyNet]

EDIT: Also, could I consider the Slowpoke Analysis as done? Or is there anything else to add?

It looks pretty complete to me, James. Just add '(QC Approved 0/2)' to the title when you're ready

 

[NeoSeth]

Surely TR is still viable? There still are tonnes of things with huge power still in LC. Clamperl and Cubone can easily cause trouble to a team. It's not as if LC is now full of stall. Things have all gone bulkier but can still be taken down.

Cubone, yes. But I'd rather run Shell Break Clamperl and rape, which I honestly feel is better than TR Clamperl.

 

[calze6]

Still, 36 SAtk (or whatever) is far above average. Evolution stone has also helped trick room as well though with things like porygon and slowpoke now also being ultra bulky.

 

[Every1XplodeNOW]

Ok there is something I don't understand. I was looking at the Bachuru thread, and they were listing sets with sucker punch, electra ball, bug bite, and other things. I was under the impression that you could only use moves a pokemon learns at lvl. 5 under, tm/hms, tutor, and breeding moves? I'm trying to learn this metagame, so I don't, I just figure I would point that out.

 

[KratosAurion]

Level Up Moves can always be bred into the Level 5 Pokemon, by leveling up the Male parent with the desired moves. Unless Move legality interferes, of course.

 

[Every1XplodeNOW]

Did that change in 5th gen? I mean it's been forever since I legitimately breed, but I don't recall it being able to pass down level up moves......

 

[KratosAurion]

It has not changed at all. The Male Pokemon will pass on it's moves to the child, whereas the Female Pokemon will pass the Ability and the Species.

 

[Banryu]

Actually, to be clear, both parents must know the level-up moves one is attempting to breed onto the baby. The male parent must then know any egg moves that are to be passed down. TMs and tutors, obviously, can be attained after birth and whatnot. (FYI not really a discussion for this thread; if you have any further questions like this, Scuba Stevee, please take them to the Little Question Little Answer thread.)

 

[calze6]

I thought these level up moves that weren't egg moves were passed on through the pomeg glitch.

 

[Lady Shinki]

If you want to run balanced teams focusing on offense...

Please run Knock Off Tentacool.

He's fast enough to get the Knock Off in vs. most evo stone setup sweepers, and can set up toxic spikes, which are very viable to check LC setup in general. There isn't a lot that absorb toxic spikes in the metagame (all I can think of that's even remotely common was croagunk in gen IV). 5 offensive pokemon+tspikes+sr+no evo stone on zuruggu/meditite=greatly weakened setup. You could probably make a balanced team abusing fake out, priority, and tspikes damage to great effect, running something like Taunt+SD Kibago to muscle through stall.

 

[SkyNet]

I thought these level up moves that weren't egg moves were passed on through the pomeg glitch.

Thats only for genderless pokemon.

 

[Dubulous]

I thought these level up moves that weren't egg moves were passed on through the pomeg glitch.

Thats only for genderless pokemon.

Actually, the Pomeg glitch can be used to get early level up moves on any Pokemon that can hatch from an egg, but only in the Generation III games. Because these Pokemon are only available for use in Generation V games, the Pomeg glitch is not relevant.

 

[Darkamber8828]

But yeah, if both parents have a move that's in the baby's level up movepool, it gets the move when it hatches.

Kenshi, you're right, with Tspikes, Haze, Knock Off, and/or Rapid Spin, Tentacruel trolls teams, mine included.

 

[(makeup)]

Anyone know a total counter to Murkrow?