SPOILERS! General Pokémon Anime Discussion

[Pikachu315111]

So for the eyes of someone who didn't watch that movie... is it spamming Mega Evolutions for fan pandering in a similar way as to Hoopa's movie did with legendaries?

Pretty much, yeah. Only Mega Evo that does anything prominent is Mega Gengar (used by the main villain as his main Pokemon, battling and using Hypnosis) and Gardevoir (the princess's Pokemon). All other Mega Evos are mooks, pretty much ones that couldn't really get to show up in the anime so they shoved them in here (mostly the ORAS Mega Evos since the opening of the Mega Evolution Special covered the ones introduced in XY).

 

[Frozocrone]

Feels, was not prepared for them.

Litten joins Ash and I'm stoked as I think it's evolution line is the coolest of the Alolan starters, not to mention it's personality.

 

[Cresselia92]

Pathetic special we've got today. The Ash and Pikachu "bonding" episode ended up being a dud. It failed both as a 20th anniversary special and as a bonding episode.

Frankly, both titular characters don't appear any more united than how they have been over all these past years. It ended up being just a cute fillerish trip between buddies without any meaningful substance.

I seriously wish there was more than that, like mentioning the various characters that have actually been meaningful throughout all their journey. The fact that there is absolutely no mention irks me somewhat, especially since we're talking about the freaking anniversary special. You know… the episode which is supposed to be an homage of the anime, and not only a summary of the various (mis)adventures in Alola?

The Litten episode was good, though. If all it broke this sickening slapstick mood somewhat and handled a much more serious theme. If this saga had more serious moments like this more often, I would have probably enjoyed it much more than I currently am not.

 

[Pikachu315111]

Feels, was not prepared for them.

Litten joins Ash and I'm stoked as I think it's evolution line is the coolest of the Alolan starters, not to mention it's personality.

Hide

Oh, if the theory is true that Stoutland was the Lillipup that Lillie was holding this might get even sadder...

 

[Norne]

Pathetic special we've got today. The Ash and Pikachu "bonding" episode ended up being a dud. It failed both as a 20th anniversary special and as a bonding episode.

Frankly, both titular characters don't appear any more united than how they have been over all these past years. It ended up being just a cute fillerish trip between buddies without any meaningful substance.

I seriously wish there was more than that, like mentioning the various characters that have actually been meaningful throughout all their journey. The fact that there is absolutely no mention irks me somewhat, especially since we're talking about the freaking anniversary special. You know… the episode which is supposed to be an homage of the anime, and not only a summary of the various (mis)adventures in Alola?

The Litten episode was good, though. If all it broke this sickening slapstick mood somewhat and handled a much more serious theme. If this saga had more serious moments like this more often, I would have probably enjoyed it much more than I currently am not.

Honestly i couldnt care less for the human cast of the previous sagas getting mentioned so for me the pikachu bonding episode was ok.

 

[Cresselia92]

Honetly i couldnt care less for the human cast of the previous sagas getting mentioned so for me the pikachu bonding episode was ok.

Truth to be told, I wouldn't have minded if this wasn't hyped as an anniversary special and was just a "regular" episode. However, I still found this episode pretty forgettable even after ignoring its special status.

I dunno, I guess I expected something more from an Ash and Pikachu bonding episode, like… it could have happened much later and resulted in Pikachu relearning Volt Tackle and mastering Catastropika, or maybe Pikachu mastering 1.000.000 Volts. That could have had the potential to show how strong and united both characters have become.

 

[Pikachu315111]

Honetly i couldnt care less for the human cast of the previous sagas getting mentioned so for me the pikachu bonding episode was ok.

Eh, personally I would care as Ash's friends were also Pikachu's friends, even more so with the Pokemon. Most notably Pikachu was a big brother to Misty's Togepi and best pals with Dawn's Piplup. Yes, the episode is about Ash and Pikachu's bond, but that bond grew stronger not only with the two working together but also with the interaction with their friends. And it wouldn't have to be a major vocal point, Ash & Pikachu could be just reminiscing about all the places they've went too and we get quick flashbacks of Ash and Pikachu traveling with their friends (they could have even made it arty, like keep Ash & Pikachu walking in the center while his clothes, friends he's walking with, and location they're walking through changes).

Also the next movie is also going to focus heavily of Ash & Pikachu's relationship so would be nice if they made the anime episode one have a bigger retrospective scope.

 

[Prof. Almeida]

Oh boy, I cried my eyes out.

 

[Pikachu315111]

Well, this movie took a sharp twist:

0:25: Everything plays out as we either remember or we think how they may expend upon it, Ash & Pikachu trying to bond via spending time together.
0:27-0:29: Those Pokemon variety scenes were a bit reminiscent of the ones in the "World of Pokemon" intro from Pokemon Heroes.
0:30: Piplup?!
0:33: ... Okay, I guess they're not saving Marshadow for the next Pokemon movie (interesting what they have planned for the next movies, unless Marshadow is justm making an early debut before its official movie and release. But they're already promoting its in the game so that would make you think they were releasing it in this movie). And it looks like it joins Ash for the running of the movie?
0:37: Hello not Misty and Brock.
0:43: Is that Mr. Goodshow, the President of the Pokemon League (at least for the Japanese regions, didn't show up in Unova or Kalos)? And he's wearing a cap similar to Red's in the original Gen I games stock art, though the badge looks different (though still sort of looks like a leaf).
0:47: And here it blows out the idea of it something occurring before the big moment with Spearow, we see Ash start catching his other Kanto Pokemon, battling in Gyms (looks like Erika's. Purple vines would mean Tangela, but Pikachu never battled Erika's Tangela), and encountering Team Rocket the first time with these new characters. Are they replacing Misty and Brock for this movie?
1:05: And now an Incineroar (and its matching trainer) out of no where.

Okay, so what is this movie about? It's not a retelling/expansion of the first episode as they're changing quite a bit of things (and it's not contained to just the first episode). This can't be a canon story, so what's it about then? Well, we've only got these short cut together scenes, maybe they're trying to make it look like some drastic changes have been made but then reveal it does fit into the original story somehow?

 

[Prof. Almeida]

I don't know what this movie is about, but I'm hyped as hell for this.

Edit: They apparently didn't pay Misty and Brock for a cameo.

 

[Karxrida]

What.

I was actually kind of interested before when I thought it was a straight-up nostalgia trip, but for whatever reason they decided to replace Misty and Brock (and probably Gary) with new random characters and shoehorn newer Gen mons like Piplup in.

No thanks.

 

[Pikachu315111]

So a synopsis of the movie has been revealed:

To all Pokémon fans: This is the story of the duo's "meeting" and "promise". This is the creation of the 20th anniversary movie! Pocket Monsters, or "Pokémon" for short: Mysterious lifeforms that hide many secrets. There are still many things we don't know about their ecology. Even today, Pokémon Trainers continue their adventures with the aim of encountering Pokémon never before seen...

Ash, a boy living in Pallet Town, greeted the morning of his 10th birthday, the day he could become qualified to become a Pokémon Trainer. Ash's heart was filled with a desire for Pokémon he has never seen before and a world he has never seen before, but while he was meant to be given a Pokémon that would become his partner at the Oak Laboratories, he ended up severely oversleeping, and all that was left for him was a single Pikachu, a Pokémon that did not get attached to humans. "Do you hate me? I like you!" Even though the two were at odds with one another, their friendship deepened little by little, and as they looked up at the legendary Pokémon Ho-Oh that flew through the sky on the day they set off, Ash and Pikachu swore an oath as they held one of its Rainbow Wings: "Let's go meet it together one day!" And thus, Pikachu and Ash, who set off on his journey to become the world's greatest Pokémon Master, end up meeting the Trainers Makoto and Soji on their way before getting told a legend concerning Ho-Oh.

"Those who, guided by the Rainbow Wing, meet with Ho-Oh, shall become the Heroes of the Rainbow." Ash and the others end up getting guided by Marshadow, a mysterious Pokémon that had been lurking in Ash's shadow without anyone realizing, and make their way to Mount Tensei, where Ho-Oh lives, but a strong enemy appears before them. Will the duo manage to reach Ho-Oh?! In order for them to fulfill the promise they swore on the day the departed, the two of them now begin an adventure that will last until they become "true partner?

Okay, I'm gonna jump the gun here. I'm confused why they're "retelling" the first episode, but they're not retelling it. This sounds more like a "what if" story, like what they did for several Pokemon Origins episodes. Actually, this more sounds like a fanfic written my a marketing director:

"We'll retell the first episode since everyone loves the original series. It'll play out as it did, except we should "expand" upon some things. Like, Ash and Pikachu sees Ho-Oh yet don't do anything with it? It's just meant to show the Pokemon world has many mysterious and wondrous creatures that are yet to be discovered? That's no good! Customers want stuff "NOW", not a promise more are to come. Upon Ash & Pikachu seeing Ho-Oh they should go after it! Course Ash is not going to catch it, we want the customer to catch them in their games and feel they're better than Ash, so they would just get something arbitrary like a feather as a good luck charm.
Oh, of course he has to meet trainers along the way. Now we now Misty and Brock are well liked, BUT that was back in the late 1990s. We should "expand" upon Ash's companions... by completely replacing them. The girl character is a tsundere tomboy who criticizes the main character's faults and can take care of herself? Cute and non-confronting is the in thing now, just take a look at how well Serena went over. And she should have an equally cute and marketable Pokemon, like Piplup! Oh, and the male companion should be an edgelord, not an older experienced trainer who informs and gives advice to the younger trainers. He should have an equally tough and marketable Pokemon, like Lucario! We'll do that! Wait, we have to advertise the newest generation, don't we? Okay, throw in Marshadow we just have lying around as well as a random rival character with an Alolan Pokemon, how about Incineroar to make it obvious the rival is a jerk and so customers would know to hate him.
And you know what, sticking to the first episode feels very limited. Customers would want to see Ash catching his other Pokemon and battles Gym Leaders, so let's also put that in. That'll also mean we can put in Team Rocket, but make them act like their present goofy selves so the kiddies can easily recognize them."

Already retelling the first episode was going to be difficult since it was a tightly written episode without much wiggle room. However I was willing to see a re-written version of it, show Ash and Pikachu trying to get along and slowly building up their generation strong bond. Now you do still have to touch the major points of the episode so Ash and Pikachu can't become buddy buddy till the very end, but you can show how much Ash loves Pokemon by him trying his best to break that barrier till that point and Pikachu slowly opening up to him realizing Ash may not be the fool he considers him to be. But instead this movie is looking like it's being made by committee who is focusing on what would be marketable.

And I swear to Arceus if they actually dare to try and say they're retconning Ash's backstory...

 

[Prof. Almeida]

Actually, Misty and Brock can show up as gym leaders, not Ash's sidekicks

 

[Norne]

Now that Misty isn't in the spotlight I'm actually hyped.

Jesus,I'm actually hyped for a movie I thought was going to be shameless nostalgia pandering. What a good day this turned out to be.

I'm not trying to anger the mistyfags, but her character was a corpse dragged for to long in Johto and I'm glad that she doesn't even seen to be hinted in the movie.

 

[Karxrida]

Honestly if they had just decided to axe Misty and Brock and have Ash travel alone during the movie, it would have been "whatever" to me. I'm not so attatched to the two that their absence is a deal-breaker in and of itself.

But creating replacements just seems. Disingenuous? Disrespectful? Dis-something. They come across as fanfic OCs. I'm not against the inclusion of new characters, but when you do so by overwriting preexisting ones it gets a little skeevy. Especially in an Anniversary movie.

 

[Cresselia~~]

Honestly we knew that Misty won't be a companion the moment her bike wss missing from the trailer.

Could still be a gym leader though.

And we knew Piplup due to the merchandise AND illustration contest logo.
Just that we weren't that confident about it back then.

 

[Pikachu315111]

Honestly if they had just decided to axe Misty and Brock and have Ash travel alone during the movie, it would have been "whatever" to me. I'm not so attatched to the two that their absence is a deal-breaker in and of itself.

But creating replacements just seems. Disingenuous? Disrespectful? Dis-something. They come across as fanfic OCs. I'm not against the inclusion of new characters, but when you do so by overwriting preexisting ones it gets a little skeevy. Especially in an Anniversary movie.

Disingenuous is close, but I would lean more toward disregardful. It's not a matter of respect or sincerity, it's a matter of them deciding what actually happened which was what fans originally connected with wasn't worth keeping. They have their own ideas and their own characters they want to show which would be alright... if this was an original story. But it's not, it's advertised as a retelling of the first episode and this trailer shows, no, it's not as:

1. I'm not going to say Ash didn't meet any other trainer between Gary and Misty, but he didn't travel around with them.
2. They have a Piplup and Lucario, two Pokemon he would not meet until the Sinnoh region (or Hoenn if you counter Luncario's debut being in the movies). You can add Incineroar onto that list too. Marshadow, eh, you could shove it in and just have Ash have no idea what it is, that is unless it does make an appearance in the main anime.
3. Okay, including episode 2 I think it alright as it's sort of the conclusion of episode 1, but going beyond that feels like they want their cake and eat it too. They want to retell the first episode... BUT they also want to include the cool moments from future episodes. Admittedly, this is more of a minor point, but still it does ago against what we were led to believe that this was an expansion of the first (two) episodes.

 

[Frozocrone]

I'm stoked that Misty and Brock aren't abandoning their posts and it's actually more than just the first few episodes of the original saga as was originally indicated.

Tbqh it should have been clear that Misty wasn't returning when there was no bike during the Spearow scene.

Now that we've got new characters to get invested in, as well as Pokemon from other regions and not just a Kanto wankfest, this movie looks so much more interesting.

 

[Mova]

I have to admit that the movie looks more interesting with other Pokémon besides Kanto-native species. I don't mind the precense of the new characters, either. Marshadow was a sudden reveal, though. Game Freak really enjoys proving fans wrong when they get the chance.

 

[Codraroll]

And I swear to Arceus if they actually dare to try and say they're retconning Ash's backstory...

Say they're retconning Ash's backstory? I'd be surprised if they do. Retconning while denying it was ever anything different? Now, that's more their style.

 

[Prof. Almeida]

To be fair, other than the Charizard return scene, and that was in BW, iirc, kids that started watching in XY have no idea who Brock and Misty are, have they?

 

[Frozocrone]

To be fair, other than the Charizard return scene, and that was in BW, iirc, kids that started watching in XY have no idea who Brock and Misty are, have they?

Maybe? But given we live in the age of the internet, it's not hard to take a trip in time and see where Ash all began.

 

[Prof. Almeida]

Maybe? But given we live in the age of the internet, it's not hard to take a trip in time and see where Ash all began.

I've started with the first seasons, and had my New Year's Resolution to watch all episodes, but Misty is too annoying.

 

[Pikachu315111]

More info on the characters:

Soji (Partner Pokemon: Lucario): A young male Trainer aiming to become a Pokémon Professor. His catchphrase is "Be advised that...".
Makoto (Partner Pokemon: Piplup): An energetic and masculine girl Trainer. She appears to enjoy adventures, but the truth is...
Bonji: A researcher that has chased after Ho-Oh for a long time. The author of "My Life is Ho-Oh".
Cross (Partner Pokemon: Incineroar): A boy that believes strength is everything and that aims to become the ultimate Trainer.

So they replaced Misty and Brock... for Misty 2.0 and Brock 2.0.

 

[Cresselia~~]

More info on the characters:

Soji (Partner Pokemon: Lucario): A young male Trainer aiming to become a Pokémon Professor. His catchphrase is "Be advised that...".
Makoto (Partner Pokemon: Piplup): An energetic and masculine girl Trainer. She appears to enjoy adventures, but the truth is...
Bonji: A researcher that has chased after Ho-Oh for a long time. The author of "My Life is Ho-Oh".
Cross (Partner Pokemon: Incineroar): A boy that believes strength is everything and that aims to become the ultimate Trainer.

So they replaced Misty and Brock... for Misty 2.0 and Brock 2.0.

I find it weird and confusing too.
I don't know why the marketing team greenlighted this.