Genesect [QC 3/3] [GP 2/2]

[Digital Sound]

[OVERVIEW]

Genesect is a great Pokemon in the Doubles metagame, as it's considerable for building its team's momentum thanks to a powerful U-turn. Download can provide Genesect with offensive presence once it has switched in, but Genesect has no way to control the chances of getting the boost it requires. Genesect can be very vulnerable to attacks when running Choice Scarf, as it can make Genesect Choice-locked into a poor move that gives certain opposing Pokemon a free switch in, such as Fire-types switching into Ice Beam. While Genesect isn't too flexible, it can use items besides Choice Scarf, but they give Genesect an odd Speed tier, making it slower than positive-natured base 100 Speed Pokemon such as Mega Kangaskhan and Mega Charizard Y, and because Genesect has mediocre defenses it requires a lot of team support in order to function well. On the other hand, Choice Scarf grants Genesect the ability to outspeed and OHKO top threats such as Landorus-T, Shaymin-S, and Latios.

[SET]
name: Choice Scarf
move 1: U-turn
move 2: Iron Head
move 3: Ice Beam
move 4: Explosion / Flamethrower
item: Choice Scarf
ability: Download
nature: Naive
evs: 252 Atk / 64 SpA / 192 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

U-turn is Genesect's main STAB move, and it also allows Genesect to switch out from a foe that checks it to an appropriate partner. Iron Head is Genesect's secondary STAB move and is more spammable as well, if you have some momentum to spare. It also has a nifty chance to cause the target to flinch, and without this move Genesect pretty much can't do anything to Fairy-types. Ice Beam helps Genesect take on foes such as Landorus-T, which Genesect is dead weight against otherwise. Explosion is another option for Genesect, as it allows it to pull off a last-ditch effort once it's weakened enough to the point where it can't do much back to the opposing team. Flamethrower is another option that gives Genesect coverage against a wide range of foes, namely Steel-types such as Aegislash, Ferrothorn, and Metagross.

Set Details
========

192 Speed EVs with a Naive nature allow Genesect to outspeed threats such as Jolly Landorus-T equipped with Choice Scarf and Naive Deoxys-A. The Attack EVs maximize Genesect's physical damage output, allowing its STAB moves to deal as much damage as possible. The leftover EVs are dumped into Special Attack to increase Genesect's special offense. A Naive nature is used over Hasty to prevent Genesect from being more susceptible to priority moves than it already is.

Usage Tips
========

Genesect is a good choice in the early-game, as it can utilize its powerful U-turn to switch into the Pokemon appropriate for the situation, quickly putting your opponent on the defensive. However, Genesect should play carefully around Protect, the most common move in the metagame, as its poor defenses prevent it from taking hits well and even neutral damage will quickly shorten its lifespan. Another thing to remember is that Genesect should not be used as a sweeper, but rather as a means of putting holes into your opponent's team and gathering offensive momentum. That being said, Genesect is also capable of being a revenge killer thanks to its high Speed and offenses.

Team Options
========

Genesect has a rough time dealing with opposing speed control, so Pokemon that can prevent the use of Trick Room, Thunder Wave, and Tailwind are viable teammates. This includes Taunt users such as Gyarados, Thundurus, and Terrakion. Pokemon that can handle Fire-types are exceptional teammates for Genesect. This includes Water-types such as Rotom-W, Keldeo, and Gyarados. Rock-types such as Terrakion and Mega Diancie can also check Fire-types. Garchomp is a solid option, because it beats common Fire-types such as Heatran, Mega Charizard Y, and Talonflame while Genesect deals with Garchomp's checks such as Diancie, Latios, Kyurem-B, Choice Scarf Hydreigon, and Landorus-T. Genesect also fears opposing Water-types because they can force it out, as it really wouldn't like burned by Scald. Dragon-types do an excellent job of dealing with Water-types because they don't mind switching in on them, and Genesect can help them in return by dealing with Fairy-types, Landorus-T, and even Steel-types. Pokemon that take advantage of Genesect's momentum are good teammates, especially those that capitalize on the Fire-types that Genesect lures in. Pokemon that can take advantage of Genesect's momentum and its ability to lure in Fire-types, such as Calm Mind Cresselia, Substitute attackers such as Kyurem B and Heatran, and even Belly Drum Azumarill, are great teammates. If you're using Explosion on Genesect, using a Ghost-type partner such as Gengar is a good idea, as it gives you something to switch in while Genesect is going for Explosion so none of your Pokemon get caught in the crossfire.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Genesect can also use a specially offensive Choice Scarf set with Energy Ball or Thunderbolt if you really need coverage against Water-types. Thunder is usable if you want to use Genesect on a rain team. A non-Choice Scarf set with either Life Orb or Expert Belt is a decent option, as it capitalizes on Genesect's wide range of coverage and allows Genesect to bluff a Choice Scarf and get surprise KOs. Choice Band is also an option, as it allows Genesect to hit foes really hard. Extreme Speed can help Genesect outprioritize other priority move users such as Mega Kangaskhan, Bisharp, and Talonflame.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Fire-types**: Fire-types such as Mega Charizard Y and Talonflame can easily beat Genesect, especially if Genesect lacks Thunderbolt. Genesect can 2HKO Mega Charizard Y with Thunderbolt, but Mega Charizard Y can retaliate back with a super effective STAB Heat Wave in the sun. Bulkier Fire-types such as Rotom-H, Heatran, and Mega Camerupt can also easily beat Genesect, as Genesect's attacks do pitiful damage against them, while they can all retaliate back with their own super effective STAB Fire-type moves.

**Water-types**: Bulky Water-types such as Rotom-W, Suicune, Politoed, and even Keldeo can tank most of the moves that Genesect throws at them, but they don't appreciate taking a U-turn. Because Genesect will be locked into one selected move, the opponent can scout for Genesect's movepool, see what move it locked itself into, and switch in the appropriate Pokemon, thus giving the opponent a lot of momentum by forcing Genesect to switch out.

**Aegislash**: Aegislash can tank all of Genesect's moves, as even Flamethrower is a 3HKO without the Download boost, and hit it right back with Shadow Ball. Aegislash can also carry Weakness Policy, and if the player is completely unaware of that, Aegislash will tank the Flamethrower from Genesect and OHKO it right back with a +2 Shadow Ball.

**Intimidate and Burns**: Intimidate users such as Scrafty, Gyarados, and Hitmontop can easily frighten Genesect, as Genesect's attacks won't do much to any of these Pokemon. Gyarados, however, isn't much of a threat if Genesect is running Thunderbolt. Genesect also needs to avoid burns as much as possible, as its STAB moves won't be doing that much if it gets crippled by burns and the residual damage will also wear down it quickly. Thus, Genesect needs to stay away from Pokemon that can use Will-O-Wisp or Scald, including Rotom-W, Rotom-H, Suicune, and Keldeo.

**Speed Control**: Moves such as Icy Wind, Thunder Wave, Tailwind, and Trick Room can cripple Genesect by making it slower. Common users of these moves include Rotom-W, Rotom-H, Thundurus, Suicune, Talonflame, Yache Berry Salamence, Cresselia, and Jellicent.

skele

[OVERVIEW]

• Genesect can obtain momentum with U-turn fairly easily because of its exceptional coverage, so it'll be a great teammate for teams that needs the momentum.
• Download will give Genesect a free boost every time it switches in. Therefore, allowing Genesect to hit both physically and specially offensively hard.
• Download is a bit unreliable sometimes because you may not end up getting the boost that you really need since some Pokemons in the metagame are given an EV spread that messes up Genesect's Ability.
• being a Choice Scarf user makes Genesect very vulnerable to revenge killers and while not having full coverage. Genesect being used as a non-Choice Scarf user makes it very slow to Pokemons that would normally outspeed it, and it would likely also make Genesect a bit too frail.
  
• Genesect is weak to being revenge killed, and once it's Choice-locked into a move that baits in threatening Fire-types Pokemons, they can deal a huge amount of damage. Especially threats like Heatran and Mega Charizard Y.
  
• While equipped Choice Scarf, Genesect can outspeed a whole ton of Pokemons in the Doubles metagame that would normally outspeed Genesect, including Pokemons like Landorus-T, Shaymin-S, Latios, and others.

[SET]
name: Choice Scarf
move 1: U-turn
move 2: Iron Head
move 3: Ice Beam
move 4: Flamethrower
item: Choice Scarf
ability: Download
nature: Naive
evs: 252 Atk / 64 SpA / 192 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

• U-turn is Genesect STAB move allowing it to gain momentum by taking advantages of the switches that Genesect forces out.
• Iron Head is Genesect STAB move and it's also spammable as well, if you have some momentum to spare. It also has a nifty chance to flinch its opponents too.
  
• Ice Beam helps Genesect beat Landorus-T, without it, Genesect is dead weight against Landorus-T.
  
• Flamethrower gives Genesect coverage against wider range of its opponents, such as Steel-type Pokemons like, Aegislash, Ferrothorn, and Metagross.

Set Details
========

• 192 Speed EVs with a Naive nature allows Genesect to outspeed threats like, max Speed Jolly nature Landorus-T equipped with Choice Scarf and including Naive nature Deoxys-A, with max Speed investment.
• 252 Attack EVs helps Genesect increase its physical damage output to the max allowing its STAB move to deal off amount of damage.
• The leftover EVs are dump into Special Attack so that Ice Beam and Flamethrower would do just about enough with the help from the Download boost.
• While Genesect is equipped Choice Scarf, Genesect can outspeed almost all non-boosted Pokemon in the metagame.
• Naive nature increases Genesect Speed stat even more while also not hindering either one of Genesect Attack or Special Attack stats. It also allows Genesect to not be weak against priority in the metagame because most of them are very common, so it's best to use Naive over Hasty.
  
• Explosion can be used as a last-ditch effort for Genesect, if it's severely weaken and it can't do anything no more.

Usage Tips
========

• Genesect can be used as a lead during early-game, but it's best to use U-turn on the first turn since a Pokemon could potentially switch into one of Genesect's attack besides U-turn, and thus soak up its momentum.
  
• Genesect main purpose is to gain offensive momentum with U-turn, so don't have it mistaken being used as a sweeper because Genesect isn't meant for that type of purpose.
• When using Genesect as a momentum user it's best to be extremely caution when using U-turn because the opponent could likely predict the incoming U-turn on one of his or her Pokemon and proceed to use Protect which will likely leave Genesect vulnerable from an attack against the opponent's partner.
  
• However, Genesect is a great revenge killer seeing how what it can do in the metagame because of how fast it is and thanks to it having the ability to hit a huge portion of the metagame really hard.
  
• If you're using Genesect to revenge kill something on the opposing team, be sure to play very carefully with it, if Genesect can't seem to KO the Pokemon it's trying to revenge kill don't let it take any sorts of damage afterwards. Try having a partner to back it up if it doesn't seem that Genesect have a chance revenge killing the opposing Pokemon.

Team Options
========

• Genesect has a rough time dealing with opposing Speed Control, so Pokemons that can prevent the use of Trick Room, Thunder Wave, and Tailwind are viable teammates, this includes Pokemons like Gyarados, Thundurus, and Terrakion since these Pokemons have access to the move Taunt.
• Pokemons that can handle the likes of Fire-type Pokemons are exceptional teammates for Genesect. This includes Water-type Pokemons such as, Rotom-W, Keldeo, and Gyarados.
• Genesect also fears Water-type Pokemons because it can force it to switch since it really wouldn't like taking a Scald, or even getting burned too. Dragon-type Pokemons does an excellent job dealing with Water-types since they don't mind switching in onto them, and Genesect can help out while dealing with Fairy-types, Landorus-T, and even Steel-types.
  
• Rock-type Pokemons can also check Fire-type Pokemons as well, this includes Pokemons like, Terrakion and Mega-Diancie. However, Garchomp is a solid option because it beats the common Fire-type Pokemons such as, Heatran, Mega Charizard Y, and Talonflame, and Genesect can deal with Garchomp checks such as, Diancie, Latios, Kyurem-B, Choice Scarf Hydreigon, and Landorus-T.
  
• Pokemon that takes advantage of Genesect's momentum are good teammates since Genesect lures in Fire-types and Calm Mind Cresselia sets up on them with ease, and Substitute Attackers like Kyurem-B and Heatran also works and even Belly Drum Azumarill also appreciates this kind of momentum since it keeps Fire-type in the field and while Grass-type can't switch in because of Genesect.
• If you're using Explosion on Genesect, then using a Ghost-type partner such as Gengar would help a lot since you would have something to switch in while Genesect is going for Explosion, so any of your Pokemons won't get caught in the crossfire.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

• Genesect can also use a Special Choice Scarf set with Energy Ball instead, if you really need a type of coverage against Water-types.
• Thunder is usable if you want to use Genesect on a rain team, and the same goes with Thunderbolt as well, but it should only be used out of rain.
• A non-Choice Scarf set with the item of Life Orb or either Expert Belt, is somewhat of an option since it capitalizes upon Genesect's wide range coverage, and it also bluff the opponents thinking you were Choice Scarf and gets surprised KOs.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Typing Advantage**: Fire-type Pokemons, such as, Mega Charizard Y and Talonflame can both easily beat Genesect since this set is lacking the move Thunderbolt and therefore it cannot hit any of these Pokemons for effective damage. Genesect can at least try to 2HKO Mega Charizard Y with Thunderbolt, but Mega Charizard Y can retaliate back with a super effective STAB Heat Wave in the sun, so keep that in mind. Other kinds of Fire-type Pokemons, such as, Rotom-H, Heatran, and Mega-Camerupt which are all more bulky-oriented Pokemons that can also easily beat Genesect since Genesect attacks do pitiful damage against these Pokemons, and they can all retaliate back with their own super effective STAB Fire-type moves. Bulky Water-type Pokemons doesn't fear any moves that Genesect throws at them, but still doesn't appreciate taking a U-turn from Genesect. This includes Pokemons like Rotom-W, Suicune, Politoed, and even Keldeo because it sponges any attacks that Genesect throws at it. Genesect is also prone being locked into one selected move, so if you can scout for Genesect's movepool and see what move it locked itself into, and switch in the appropriate Pokemon that resist the move it locked itself into, then you can gain a lot of momentum from that since it forces Genesect to hard switch out.

**Intimidate and Burns**: Intimidate users, such as, Scrafty, Gyarados, and Hitmontop can easily frighten Genesect since any of Genesect attacks doesn't do that much to these Pokemons. Although Gyarados isn't much of a threat if you're running Thunderbolt instead, so keep that in mind. Genesect also needs to watch out for burns as much as possible since Genesect STAB moves won't be doing that much if it gets crippled by burns, and the residual damage can also wear down Genesect quickly, so basically Genesect needs to stay away from these Pokemons that can use the move Will-O-Wisp, or either Scald, this includes Pokemons like Rotom-W and Rotom-H, Suicune, and Keldeo.

**Speed Control**: Moves like Icy Wind, Thunder Wave, Tailwind, and Trick Room can cripple Genesect by making it become slower to Pokemons that can outspeed it afterwards. Common Pokemons that can use these moves are, Rotom-W and Rotom-H, Thundurus, Suicune, Talonflame, Yache Berry Salamence, Cresselia, and Jellicent.

 

[Electrolyte]

Some suggestions:

OVERVIEW:
- Be careful in your Overview; the purpose should be to outline the Pokemon's capabilities, not display obvious, searchable information (such as Ability mechanics)
- When you talk about Download, you don't have to explain how it works. Instead, explain how it adds to Genesect's offensive capabilities by giving it a free power boost every time it switches in, also enabling it to hit powerfully both physically and specially.
- Talk about how it's great for momentum not only because of U-turn but also because of its excellent coverage. Chances are it will be able to hit at least one of the opponents super effectively, and thus causes a lot of switches, which it can then take advantage of with U-turn to gain momentum.
- Genesect's defenses are actually pretty great; statistically it doesn't stand out but its typing definitely helps it by giving it tons of resistances and only one avoidable weakness. It can easily tank any non super effective attack.

SET:
- Just call it "Choice Scarf."

MOVES:
- Don't say "allows you to scout for anything on the opposing team," as that terminology is commonly reserved for the functions of Protect, and you already talk about gaining momentum, which is the main purpose of U-turn. I also wouldn't call U-turn a "main STAB," as that implies that it is Genesect's main source of damage output, which isn't really true. Just say that it's a powerful STAB move that can be used to gain momentum by taking advantage of the switches Genesect forces.
- For Flamethrower, Thunderbolt, and Ice Beam, don't just say "it hits _____-types," also give concrete examples. For instance, Flamethrower hits Steel-types such as Aegislash, Ferrothorn, Scizor, and Mega Metagross, while Thunderbolt hits Water- and Flying-types such as Keldeo, Azumarill, Politoed, and Talonflame, while Ice Beam hits Ground-, Flying-, and Dragon-types such as Landorus-T, Salamence, Shaymin-S, etc.
- Mention at the end that the three special moves and U-turn enable Genesect to hit a wide range of threats super effectively, and have perfect coverage with each other.

SET DETAILS:
- You can also mention the spread that outspeeds 212 Adamant Scarf Lando-T, but mention that the reason why that isn't posted is because Landos sometimes speed creep, and the extra Atk EVs usually don't make a difference anyway.
- Don't say "outspeeding almost all of the base 100s"; I know you mean 100-199 but you imply just base 100's. Instead, say "outspeeding almost all non-boosted Pokemon in the metagame," which is more precisely what you mean.

USAGE TIPS:
- You might want to also mention when Genesect should attack and when it should U-turn. If it can OHKO an opponent and isn't really scared of its partner or any possible switchins, then it should attack. If not, aim at the right opponent and use U-turn.
- Mention that it should be going for the super effective attack as frequently as it is safe to do so; otherwise its attacks, even when boosted by Download, are quite weak.
- Mention that the player should watch out for opposing Protect if U-turn is about to be used; you won't be able to switch out if you hit a Protect, which might leave you vulnerable to the opposing partner's attack.

TEAM OPTIONS:
- No point in listing out all of Genesect's counters first; only mention counters when you justify the options and say which threats each suggestion beats, specifically, kind of like you did in the 4th bullet point (get rid of the first sentence, basically)
- There are a lot more things you can mention that can beat Genesect's Fire-type counters! Other Water-types such as Keldeo, Azumarill, and Gyarados can all help check Fire-types.
- Rock-type attackers are also really great for this role- examples include Terrakion, whose appeal is its speed, Landorus-T, whose appeal is its ability to form a U-turn core, and Mega Diancie, whose appeal is its strong mixed coverage to go with Genesect's.
- Mention Pokemon that can prevent Speed control. Thundurus's Taunt can prevent Thunder Wave, Tailwind, and Trick Room use.


CHECKS & COUNTERS:
"**Fighting-types**" is not an allowable tag. Combine the Fighting-type mention with the **Typing Advantage** tag.
- Also in the "Typing Advantage" tag belongs all of the Pokemon that Genesect can only hit neutrally (and therefore for not as much damage.) which include bulky yet powerful threats such as Ludicolo (which can outspeed Genesect), Mega Kangaskhan, and Mega Diancie.



Nice work

 

[Darkmalice]

Replace TBolt with Energy Ball. It is much better. Hits more relevant Water-types than TBolt (Rotom-W > Gyarados, Mega Swampert too) and also Diancie and Terrakion.

There should be a more physically orienated Scarf Genesect in addition to the Special set (U-turn, Iron Head, Ice Beam, and Flamethrower). This can probably be part of the same Scarf set but with a different EV spread mentioned in set comments. For the record, Iron Head should be replacing Tbolt Energy Ball. It's more suitable for teams that care less about the coverage Genesect provides and more for the momentum it applies, bringing with it a harder hitting U-turn and a stronger STAB attack fyi Iron Head is better than it used to be thanks to Mega Diancie.

Add a non-scarf set. It's not as good as it used to be, but it works with speed support and can catch people off guard.

I will also refer you to my guide for writing doubles analyses for some pointers.

 

[antemortem]

You could bear to clarify that Conkeldurr's Drain Punch can 2HKO the Scarf Genesect with Drain Punch, and said 2HKO is an assured 1HKO after Knock Off (which is still a 2HKO, but in tangent with the removal of Scarf). I say this because atm it just says that health can be regained from it but Genesect is assured to take a plunge if it remains in after being Knocked Off, or after an initial DP.

 

[Bughouse]

There is roughly zero reason to run Thunderbolt. It hits Gyarados and if you're being really generous, predicted Talonflame switch-ins. Iron Head must be on the main set. The ability to hit Fairies is one of the main reasons you would even use Genesect.

 

[Darkmalice]

Special Attacker
########
name: Special Attacker
move 1: Flamethrower
move 2: Energy Ball
move 3: Ice Beam
move 4: Protect / U-turn
item: Expert Belt
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
nature: Timid

Used as a late game sweeper to sweep with coverage. The first 3 moves net the best coverage, scoring a super-effective hit on most of the metagame. Requires speed support and skill. Can bluff Scarf with this.

If using U-turn, use Naive nature with 4 remainder EVs in Atk.

Do not oversell this set



With the physical set, EVs should be 252 Atk / 64 SpA / 196 Spe, not 156 Spe. Outrunning Landorus-T is too important, and you still easily OHKO with Ice Beam.


TBolt should go in OO and only OO.

 

[Bughouse]

I will literally qc reject any set that doesn't have iron head

 

[Darkmalice]

QC had a talk. You do not need to write up a non-choice set. Just the Scarf set. The non-choice set can go to OO.

Add a Choice Band set to OO too

Scarf set:
U-turn
Iron Head
Ice Beam
Flamethrower
252 Atk / 64 SpA / 192 Spe Naive

Explosion in set comments. Special Scarf set with Energy Ball can be mentioned in OO for coverage against Water-types, but physical set is better cause it powers up U-turn which is Genesect's most important move, and gives Iron Head more power against neutral targets and helps against redirection (Togekiss and Amoonguss specifically) - the physical set has more focus on momentum and STAB Iron Head is pretty handy, more so than focus on coverage on a choiced mon (and Energy Ball isn't OHKOing Water-types anyways).

ShunGTX!!

 

[Stratos]

ShunGTX!! checks and counters where

 

[Electrolyte]

Alright, I've been meaning to QC this for almost a week and I am finally committing myself to doing it

First things first, don't forget to convert to the new format that is listed here:
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/the-new-analysis-formatting-guide.3537802/#post-6211950

All you really need to do is change / add subsection titles and reformat Checks and Counters to be more specific.


OVERVIEW

Reorganize your overview in terms of most significant aspects to least significant aspects. Genesect's main advantage is its coverage - so that should be first. Then, mention download boosts. Scarf mention is least significant because any Pokemon with more than base 91 Speed can outspeed all of those threats when it takes a scarf, so you need to first explain why Genesect is a good mon for that job (because of its coverage)

Also, list a few more of Genesect's weaknesses, including:
- Download is unreliable; you might not always get the boost you need, and without it Genesect is very weak
- Either be Scarf and be prone to being revenge killed / not have access to full coverage or be not Scarf and be just a bit too slow and just a bit too frail
- Fire-type is true but not the full extent of it-again, Gene is prone to being revenge killed, especially once it's choice locked, and many threatening spread fire attackers can easily jump on the opportunity and switch in to unleash a lot of damage. Especially Heatran / Zard Y. Rotom-H and Camerupt are lesser mentions.


MOVES

Keep things simple: in the beginning, explain that the moves are aimed to allowed Genesect to confront as many possible different opponents and still have something to hit them hard 1 v 1 as a revenge killer.
- Uturn, Ice Beam, and Iron Head descriptions are good, just change the phrasing a bit; say Iron Head is the spammable STAB move to use when you have some momentum to spare, and it flinches too.
- Don't say Flamethrower helps Gene hits threats that would otherwise wall it- just say Flamethrower lets Gene cover an even wider array of possible opponents. Your current phrasing implies that Flamethrower is put there so Gene can't be walled, but Gene isn't a coverage sweeper, it's a revenge killer, so that phrase is misleading there
- Move Explosion to Set Details as Darkmalice said


SET DETAILS
- is gud


USAGE TIPS

Good that you specifically mention that it's not supposed to function as a sweeper, though you could also add revenge killer to the list of things it does, and it's fairly good at it because it's fast and because of its ability to hit a large portion of the metagame hard.
- When in doubt, U-Turn out (unless Protect)
- Say that when revenge killing, be sure to play carefully - select a move that will not only KO or severely damage the opponent, but also not leave genesect super prone to being punished afterwards. In the beginning of the game, it is most often just better to U-Turn because there's a greater chance a healthy Pokemon will be waiting in the wings to soak up your attack and drain your momentum

Otherwise you cover a lot of good points in the section


TEAM OPTIONS

Generally you'd want things to be able to serve as U-Turn switch ins and sponge hits when Genesect is absolutely forced to U-Turn out; counters to Fire-types is good, also mention counters to Water-types because Gene really can't even take a Scald all too well, especially not if it burns. Dragons are great partners for Genesect because they have the bulk and resistances to tank attacks aimed at Gene; Latios, Salamence, and Hydreigon all work, and love Genesect's ability to KO Fairies, Landorus-T, and Steel-types.

Also mention Pokemon that can quickly take advantage of momentum: including CM Cresselia, which can easily set up on the Fire-types that Genesect draws in, and Sub attackers such as Kyurem-B (also Dragon) or your own Heatran. Even BD Azu works because Gene keeps Fires in and Grasses out, and beats Lando.


OTHER OPTIONS

Non Scarf ( LO / EBelt ) that capitalizes upon Gene's wide coverage and nabs surprise KOs


CHECKS AND COUNTERS

**Typing Advantage**: say that the best way to neuter Genesect is to 1. scout for its movepool and check which move it locks itself into and 2. switch in the right Pokemon to take it. While its coverage is threatening, again choice sets can only attack with one attack at a time so if you switch in a resist then you can gain a lot of momentum. Also add in Bulky water-types that don't fear any of Genesect's moves except U-Turn. Examples include Rotom-W, Suicune, Politoed, and even things like Keldeo can sponge a few attacks.

**Speed Control**: remove Electroweb, it's not really common / useful anymore






Do all this and I'll come back to stamp it
ShunGTX!!

 

[xzern]

hi there ShunGTX!! are you still working on this? if so, implement electrolyte's check above mine and some brief add-ons from myself. once you do that, tag me and i'll hopefully give you 1/3!

Overview

• mention more of genesect's downsides, like how it faces competition as a scarfer from lando-t, which can also pivot with u-turn
• also, its a bit harder to switch in than lando and genesect beats/checks a smaller margin of threats.

Set Details

• mention how naive is used over hasty because you dont want to be weaker to priority than you already are

Team Options

• if running explosion, packing a ghost type ally like gengar is usually helpful so that ally isnt forced to protect on that turn

 

[Digital Sound]

I'm almost done adding your check Electrolyte, and I'll finish this up tomorrow while adding your check as well xzern.

 

[Pocket]

• mention more of genesect's downsides, like how it faces competition as a scarfer from lando-t, which can also pivot with u-turn

Specifically, you can mention how the lack of QuakeSlide prevents Genesect from checking important Fire-types that Landorus-T can check when Scarfed. No Thunder Wave immunity, either.

• Rock-type Pokemons can also check Fire-type Pokemons as well, this includes Pokemons like, Terrakion and Mega-Diancie. Landorus-T can check Fire-type Pokemons as well while performing a U-turn core along with Genesect.

Eh, are you suggesting running double scarf? Landorus-T isn't exactly a good check to Fire-types without Scarf to guarantee being faster than Charizard Y. Garchomp is a much more solid option, since it is faster than Charizard Y and actually resists said Fire-type. They form a pretty nice synergy, as Genesect does a good job checking Diancie, Latios, Kyurem-B, Scarf Hydreigon, and Landorus-T that hinder Garchomp.

 

[Digital Sound]

I'm done adding your checks Electrolyte, I even also mentioned about Garchomp in the teams option too, Pocket .

EDIT: xzern, added your check.

 

[xzern]

in the overview, you say that genesect is outclassed by landorus. this isn't true; it simply faces competition from it as a scarfer. landorus is a lot more splashable and fits on more teams because it has a higher range of noteworthy attributes such as intimidate and its typing.

once you say this or something along those lines in the overview, its good to go.

1/3

 

[Electrolyte]

I'd just remove the Landorus-T mention completely because it's not relevant. Genesect and Landorus play almost completely differently so there's no reason why you should even mention it.

Remove it and


QC 2/3

No fancy stamp sorry Im not on a computer


EDIT: fun, you can start writing it ShunGTX!!

 

[Digital Sound]

Electrolyte, I've removed the mention about Landours-T and Genesect.

 

[Digital Sound]

shaian, written. ( ._.)

 

[shaian]

reworded a lot of this to read a bit easier

[OVERVIEW]
- What exactly does its great coverage options have to do with U-Turn? Just write that Genesect is great for building momentum thanks to a powerful U-Turn.

- "Download will give Genesect a free boost every time it switches in. Therefore, allowing Genesect to hit both physically and specially offensively hard. Download is a bit unreliable sometimes because you may not end up getting the boost that you really need since some Pokemons in the metagame are given an EV spread that messes up Genesect's Ability" change that into something like "Download provides a guaranteed boost to one of its offenses when it comes in, however Genesect has zero control over which stat gets the boost, and it is very easy to get a boost in the unneeded offense."

- "Being a Choice Scarf user makes Genesect very vulnerable to revenge killers and while not having full coverage. Genesect is weak to being revenge killed, and once it is Choice-locked into a move that baits in threatening Fire-types Pokemons, they can deal a huge amount of damage. Especially threats like Heatran and Mega Charizard Y." rephrase it into something like "Since Genesect is more often than not using a Choice Scarf it is very vulnerable to being revenge killed, or is often in situations where it is locked into move that is a poor choice at the time, such as being locked into Ice Beam against Fire-types"

- "Genesect being used as a non-Choice Scarf user makes it very slow to Pokemons that would normally outspeed it, and it would likely also make Genesect a bit too frail." reword it into something like "While Genesect can forego using a Choice Scarf, an awkward Speed tier, falling just short of Pokemon such as Mega Kangaskhan and Mega Charizard, as well as poor defenses means that it will require extensive team support in order to function well."

- "While equipped Choice Scarf, Genesect can outspeed a whole ton of Pokemons in the Doubles metagame that would normally outspeed Genesect, including Pokemons like Landorus-T, Shaymin-S, Latios, and others." just reword this into "With a Choice Scarf Genesect is able to outspeed and OHKO several of the top threats in Doubles OU, such as Landorus-T, Shaymin-S, and Latios."

[SET]
- I'd put Explosion over Flamethrower as non-STAB Fire-type moves are really really bad in this meta bar Fire Blast Hydreigon and Heat Wave on Zapdos (and even that last one is a stretch). For now just slash it behind Explosion

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
- "U-turn is Genesect STAB move allowing it to gain momentum by taking advantages of the switches that Genesect forces out allowing it to fulfill its duty as a momentum user as well." just say U-Turn allows it to switch to an appropriate partner as a "momentum user" is not an actual thing

- Everything else looks fine, just mention Explosion for now

Set Details
- "192 Speed EVs with a Naive nature allows Genesect to outspeed threats like, max Speed Jolly nature Landorus-T equipped with Choice Scarf and including Naive nature Deoxys-A, with max Speed investment" it seems obvious but mention that Genesect needs to be with its own Choice Scarf for this

- "The leftover EVs are dump into Special Attack so that Ice Beam and Flamethrower would do just about enough with the help from the Download boost." is inaccurate, they were just dumped there. The current phrasing sounds like they are there for picking up a certain KO on something, which they are not. Just write "the leftover EVs are dumped into Special Attack to max out Genesects offense" or something like that

- "While Genesect is equipped Choice Scarf, Genesect can outspeed almost all non-boosted Pokemon in the metagame." don't need this, already covered

- "It also allows Genesect to not be weak against priority in the metagame because most of them are very common, so it's best to use Naive over Hasty" misleading, write that it prevents Genesect from being more susceptible to priority moves than it already is

Usage Tips
- "Genesect can be used as a lead during early-game, but it's best to use U-turn on the first turn since a Pokemon could potentially switch into one of Genesect's attack besides U-turn, and this soak up its momentum. Genesect main purpose is to gain offensive momentum with U-turn, so don't have it mistaken being used as a sweeper because Genesect isn't meant for that type of purpose. When using Genesect as a momentum user it's best to be extremely caution when using U-turn because the opponent could likely predict the incoming U-turn on one of his or her Pokemon and proceed to use Protect which will likely leave Genesect vulnerable from an attack against the opponent's partner." how about "Genesect is a good choice in the early game as it can utilize its powerful U-Turns to switch to the appropriate Pokemon, and quickly put your opponent on the defensive. However, Genesect should play carefully around Protect, the most common move in the metagame, as its poor defenses prevent it from taking hits well and even neutral damage will quickly shorten its lifespan. Another thing to remember is that Genesect is not, and should not be used as a sweeper, but rather as a means of putting holes into your opponents defenses and gathering offensive momentum. That being said, Genesect is also a capable revenge killer thanks to its high Speed and offenses."

- "However, Genesect is a great revenge killer seeing how what it can do in the metagame because of how fast it is and thanks to it having the ability to hit a huge portion of the metagame really hard." What the literal fuck were you trying to write down here?

Team Options
- Fine

Other Options
- Mention Choice Band and Extreme Speed

Checks and Counters
- Aegislash has its way with this thing unless Flamethrower, but even then Weakness Policy Aegislash eats that up and OHKOs back

 

[Pocket]

I also second Explosion > Flamethrower. It is a nice way to dish out damage to both opponents when Genesect has nothing else left to do, and it is a great way to keep up the offensive pressure by gaining a free switch and softening up / taking down opponent(s)

 

[Bughouse]

one of the reasons explosion isn't as amazing as the past two posts have made it sound is that opponents will very frequently Protect with one mon when Genesect is just coming on to the field to scout for U-Turn, which is its most common, spammable choice. It's somewhat rare to catch both opponents off guard. Combine that with the need to protect/Ghost type next to it, makes it good, but far from great.

I'd put Explosion on the set but behind Flamethrower, personally. Both are team specific. Need the extra fire coverage to hit Aeg and Ferrothorn? Flamethrower 100%. Got a good fire type on the team? Explosion or Flamethrower can be interchanged, depending on other factors.

 

[Pocket]

Yea, if you want to Explode it's best to bring Genesect in as the target is Protecting so the Pokemon has to risk double Protect when Genesect pulls the trigger.

 

[Digital Sound]

shaian , I added your check. ;3

 

[shaian]

Oh yeah, forgot about this. If no one else has anything to add this should be good for 3/3.

 

[Mr. Uncompetitive]

amcheck. Had a hard time editing this and prolly went a tad overboard, so you might want to wait for an official GP member to go over this :x

Additions (AC) = add comma
Removals (RC) = remove comma
Comments

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[OVERVIEW]

Genesect is a great Pokemon in the Doubles Metagame, as it's great for building its team's momentum thanks to a powerful U-turn. Download can provide Genesect with offensive presence once it's it has switched in, but Genesect has no way to control the chances of getting the boost it requires, (RC) and it's easy for Genesect to get the boost it doesn't need. Genesect can be very vulnerable to an attacks since it's usually when running Choice Scarf, and as it can make Genesect choice-locked into a poor move that baits in gives certain opposing Pokemons a free switch in, like such as Fire-types switching being locked into Ice Beam where Fire-types can get a free switch in. While Genesect isn't a flexible Pokemon, it can use other items besides Choice Scarf, which can but they give Genesect an odd speed tier, making it slower against than positive base 100s Speed Pokemons like, such as Mega Kangaskhan and Mega Charizard Y, and since because Genesect has dismal mediocre (71/95/95 isn't that bad is it?) defenses it requires it to have a large-scale of lot of team supports in order to function well. (sentence feels so weird and bloated, revise/clarify this a bit maybe?) On the other hand, Choice Scarf grants Genesect the ability to outspeed top threats in the Doubles Metagame and can OHKO Pokemons like threats such as, Landorus-T, Shaymin-S, and Latios.

[SET]
name: Choice Scarf
move 1: U-turn
move 2: Iron Head
move 3: Ice Beam
move 4: Explosion / Flamethrower
item: Choice Scarf
ability: Download
nature: Naive
evs: 252 Atk / 64 SpA / 192 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========
While Although U-turn is one of Genesect's STAB Move moves, but it also allows Genesect to switch out from a foe that checks it (I'm assuming) to an appropriate partner. On the other hand, Iron Head, (AC) is Genesect's secondary STAB move, (AC) and it's is also more spammable as well, if you have some momentum to spare. It also has a nifty chance to flinch its opponents too, but and without this move it Genesect pretty much can't do nothing anything to Fairy-types. Ice Beam helps Genesect take on foes like Landorus-T because without it, which Genesect is dead weight against Landorus-T otherwise. Flamethrower gives Genesect coverage against wider range of its opponents, such as Steel-type Pokemons like, Aegislash, Ferrothorn, and Metagross. Explosion is another option for Genesect, (AC) as it allows it to pull off a last-ditch effort once it's weaken enough to where the point it can't do much back to the opposing team. Flamethrower is another option that gives Genesect coverage against a wide range of opponents, namely Steel-types such as Aegislash, Ferrothorn, and Metagross. (Flamethrower is the second mentioned move, so this should be moved to the end)
Set Details
========

192 Speed EVs with a Naive nature allows Genesect to outspeed threats like, such as max Speed Jolly nature Landorus-T equipped with Choice Scarf and including Naive nature Deoxys-A, with max Speed investment (I think it's safe to assume that, unless otherwise mentioned, the reader knows it outspeeds said Pokemon regardless of investment? Could be wrong, and plus I don't know the kinds of spreads used in Doubles :x). However, Genesect needs to be equipped with Choice Scarf in order to outspeed them. The Attack EVs helps Genesect increase maximize its Genesect's physical damage output to the max , (AC) allowing its STAB move to deal off amount of as much damage as possible. The leftover EVs are dumped into Special Attack to max out increase Genesect's special offense. Naive nature increases Genesect Speed stat even more while also not hindering neither one of Genesect's Attack or its Special Attack stats. This also prevents Genesect from being more susceptible to priority moves than it already is (maybe explain a bit about the fact that it is a Special Defense drop rather than a Defense drop?).

Usage Tips
========

Genesect is a good choice in the early game, (AC) as it can utilize its powerful U-Turns to switch to the appropriate Pokemon appropriate for the situation (I'm assuming), and quickly put your opponent on the defensive. However, Genesect should play carefully around Protect, the most common move in the metagame, as its poor defenses prevent it from taking hits well and even neutral damage will quickly shorten its lifespan. Another thing to remember is that Genesect is not, and should not be used as a sweeper, but rather as a means of putting holes into your opponent's (add apostrophe) defenses and gathering offensive momentum. That being said, Genesect is also a capable revenge killer thanks to its high Speed and offenses.

Team Options
========

Genesect has a rough time dealing with opposing Speed Control speed control, so Pokemons that can prevent the use of Trick Room, Thunder Wave, and Tailwind are viable teammates, . (add period) this This includes Pokemons Taunt users like such as Gyarados, Thundurus, and Terrakion since these Pokemons have access to the move Taunt. Pokemons that can handle the likes of Fire-types Pokemons are exceptional teammates for Genesect. This includes Water-types Pokemons such as, Rotom-W, Keldeo, and Gyarados. Genesect also fears Water-type Pokemons because it can force it to switch since it really wouldn't like taking a Scald, or even getting burned too. Dragon-type Pokemons does an excellent job dealing with Water-types since they don't mind switching in onto them, and Genesect can help out while dealing with Fairy-types, Landorus-T, and even Steel-types. Rock-types Pokemons such as Terrakion and Mega Diancie can also check Fire-types Pokemons as well, this includes Pokemons like, Terrakion and Mega-Diancie. However, Garchomp is a solid option, (AC) because it beats the common Fire-types Pokemons such as, (RC) Heatran, Mega Charizard Y, and Talonflame, (RC) and while Genesect can deals with Garchomp's checks such as, (RC) Diancie, Latios, Kyurem-B, Choice Scarf Hydreigon, and Landorus-T. Genesect also fears opposing Water-types because they can force out, as it really wouldn't like burned by Scald. Dragon-types do an excellent job of dealing with Water-types since they don't mind switching in onto them, and Genesect can help them in return by dealing with Fairy-types, Landorus-T, and even Steel-types. (You talk a bit more about Fire-type checks after this, so I'm gonna move all this stuff to after the Fire-type check stuff to keep the topic focused. Did some general revisions to this) Pokemon that takes advantage of Genesect's momentum are good teammates since , especially those that capitalize on the Fire-types that Genesect lures in Fire-types. (add period) (I'm assuming you're intending to say something like this? it was very weirdly worded) and Calm Mind Cresselia sets up on them with ease, and as do Substitute Attackers attackers like such as Kyurem-B and Heatran also works . (add period) and even Belly Drum Azumarill also appreciates this kind of momentum since , as it keeps Fire-types in will be on the field and while Grass-types can't switch in because of Genesect. If you're using Explosion on Genesect, then using a Ghost-type partner such as Gengar would help a lot since , as you would have it gives you something to switch in while Genesect is going for Explosion, (RC) so any none of your Pokemons won't get caught in the crossfire.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Genesect can also use a Special specially offensive Choice Scarf set with Energy Ball or Thunderbolt (I'm assuming this applies here, it also makes things more concise) instead, if you really need a type of coverage against Water-types. Thunder is usable if you want to use Genesect on a rain team, (RC) and the same goes with Thunderbolt as well, but it should only be used out of rain. A non-Choice Scarf set with the item of either Life Orb or either Expert Belt, is somewhat of an a decent option since , as it capitalizes upon Genesect's wide range coverage, (RC) and it also bluff the opponents thinking you were Choice Scarf allows Genesect to bluff a Choice Scarf and gets surprised KOs. Choice Band is also an option for Genesect, as it allows Genesect to hit foes really hard with it. Extreme Speed is another option for Genesect, (AC) as it can help Genesect out-priority outprioritize other Pokemon that uses priority moves priority move users like, (RC) such as Mega Kangaskhan, Bisharp, and Talonflame.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Typing Advantage**: (k so is it possible at all to split this up into multiple sections? This paragraph is incredibly bloated and covers lots of things that could easily be split up into sections like "Fire-types" and "Water-types") Fire-types Pokemons, (RC) such as, (RC) Mega Charizard Y and Talonflame can both easily beat Genesect since this set is lacking the move Thunderbolt and therefore it cannot hit any of these Pokemons for effective damage , especially if Genesect lacks Thunderbolt. Genesect can at least try to 2HKO Mega Charizard Y with Thunderbolt, but Mega Charizard Y can retaliate back with a super effective STAB Heat Wave in the sun, so keep that in mind. Other kinds of Bulkier Fire-types Pokemons, (RC) such as, (RC) Rotom-H, Heatran, and Mega-Camerupt (remove hyphen) which are all more bulky-oriented Pokemons that can also easily beat Genesect since , as Genesect's attacks do pitiful damage against these Pokemons them, and while they can all retaliate back with their own super effective STAB Fire-type moves. Bulky Water-types such as Rotom-W, Suicune, Politoed, and even Keldeo Pokemons doesn't fear any can tank most of the moves that Genesect throws at them, but still doesn't don't appreciate taking a U-turn from Genesect. This includes Pokemons like Rotom-W, Suicune, Politoed, and even Keldeo because it sponges any attacks that Genesect throws at it. Because Genesect is also prone being will be locked into one selected move, so if you the opponent can scout for Genesect's movepool and , (AC) see what move it locked itself into, and switch in the appropriate Pokemon that resists the move it locked itself into, then you can gain thus giving the opponent a lot of momentum from that since it forces by forcing Genesect to hard switch out. Aegislash can take advantage of how bulky it is and it can tank all of Genesect's moves, as even Flamethrower is a 3HKO without the Download boost, and hit it right back with Shadow Balls, (RC) and even if Genesect is running Flamethrower it's still a 3HKO without the Download boost. However, Aegislash can sometime also carry Weakness Policy and if the player is completely unaware of that, Aegislash will tank the Flamethrower from Genesect and it will retaliate and hit OHKO it right back with a +2 Shadow Ball and OHKO Genesect.

**Intimidate and Burns**: Intimidate users, (RC) such as, (RC) Scrafty, Gyarados, and Hitmontop can easily frighten Genesect (oh god that pun) since , as any of Genesect's attacks doesn't won't do that much to any of these Pokemons. (Doesn't Intimidate kinda neuter Genesect in general though?) Although Gyarados, (AC) however, (AC) isn't much of a threat if you're Genesect is running Thunderbolt instead, so keep that in mind. Genesect also needs to watch out for avoid burns as much as possible since , as Genesect STAB moves won't be doing that much if it gets crippled by burns, (AC) and the residual damage can will also wear down Genesect quickly, (RC) so basically . (add period) Thus, (AC) Genesect needs to stay away from these Pokemons that can use the move Will-O-Wisp, (RC) or either Scald, this includes Pokemons like including Rotom-W, (AC) and Rotom-H, Suicune, and Keldeo.

**Speed Control**: Moves like such as Icy Wind, Thunder Wave, Tailwind, and Trick Room can cripple Genesect by making it become slower to Pokemons that can outspeed it afterwards. Common Pokemons that can use users of these moves are, include Rotom-W and, (AC) Rotom-H, Thundurus, Suicune, Talonflame, Yache Berry Salamence, Cresselia, and Jellicent.