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Pokémon Gengar

Discussion in 'OverUsed' started by X5Dragon, Oct 13, 2013.

  1. X5Dragon

    X5Dragon

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2011
    Messages:
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    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Gengar------Mega Gengar





    *MEvo facts: You can Mega Evolve and Attack on the same turn and your pokemon stays mega evolved through out the match. However, switching takes priority to Mega evolving.




    Pokedex Number - #094 (Mountain Kalos #32)
    Type(s) - Ghost/Poison

    Base Stats: (Gengar -> Mega Gengar)

    HP: 60-> 60
    Atk 65-> 65
    Def 60-> 80
    SpA 130->170
    SpD 75-> 95
    Speed 110->130



    Abilities:

    Gengar:

    Levitate: "Levitate renders the user immune to Ground-type moves (except Sand-Attack), Spikes, Toxic Spikes, Arena Trap, and damage from Sky Drop. These immunities can be lost if holding an Iron Ball, or the Pokémon is under the effects of Smack Down, Gravity, or Ingrain."


    Mega Gengar:

    Shadow Tag: "Opposing Pokemon cannot switch out while the wielder is on the field, unless both Pokemon have Shadow Tag or the opponent is Ghost typed. Opposing Pokemon can escape by using Baton Pass, U-turn, or Volt Switch (as long as the wielder isn't immune to Volt Switch), or by holding the item Shed Shell. Shadow Tag does not prevent the effect of Eject Button. In multi battles, Shadow Tag does not affect your partner Pokemon, nor does it affect non-adjacent opponents."

    *Parting Shot needs to be tested




    Moves:


    - Level up moves: Gen 5 -
    - TMs and HMs compatibility : Gen 5
    - Egg Moves: Gen 5-
    - Tutor-able Moves: Gen 5

    - New moves: Will update whenever we receive the relevant information.


    Notable Moves: Shadow Ball, Focus Miss, Icy Wind, Thunder, Thunderbolt, Hidden Power Fire, Disable, Will-O-Wisp, Toxic, Sludge Wave, Sludge Bomb, Destiny Bond, Perish Song, Taunt


    Two type combos:

    Ghost/Poison: Bisharp, Tyranitar, Skuntank, Drapion, Krookodile, Diggersby
    Ghost/Fight: Currently unresisted by any available pokemon
    Ghost/Fairy: Only Pyroar



    General Analysis of Pokemon:


    Mega Gengar (open)
    Gengar pretty much got all of it's wish list granted and dreams come true, Starmie no longer outspeeds it, it's SpA is now through the roof, cementing its status as an offensive spin blocker. What is more, Steel no longer resists Ghost, making it's STAB with the nerf of Dragons a new alternative for neutral coverage. Fairys also gave new life and meaning to its subtype, Poison, and can now make good use of its STAB Sludge Bombs and Waves. Additional perks are witnessed by getting a little bulkier on the SpD/Def side as well. While LO Gengar outperforms it on the pure offensive scale, the speed increase cannot be underestimated. The cherry on the cake being its new ability, Shadow Tag. Yes, losing Ground immunity does suck seeing how it lost a switch in opportunity, but in return your opponent cannot switch out most of the time, and will be unwilling to send any of his favorites to face Gengar any time soon.


    Gengar recieved many blessings in this gen, and even though his mega stone is now banned to ubers, he has plenty to work with. The most important being Ghost is no longer resisted by steel, and with the introduction of Fairy types Ghost is the now the best neutral attacking type. Other indirect advantages Gengar gains in this priority meta is the lack of choice items (in which he personally contributed much to this phenomena) so he can opt to choose Modest if and when going scarfed. Poison is now an excellent second stab and can help him nail fairies as well and grants him a neutral coverage on most of the meta with just his STABs. With that being said, the Priority meta and his frail bulk can cause many problems to our purple Ghost, and there has been a lot of new bulky pokemon, several with excellent SpD to counter his demonic ways.




    Potential Movesets:

    Mega Sets (open)

    Offensive Tag /Inescapable Death


    MegaGengar@Gengarite
    Nature: Timid
    Ability: Shadow Tag
    EVs: 252 SpA/252 Speed/4 HP or 252 SpA/176 Speed/80 HP

    Shadow Ball
    Focus Blast
    Sludge Wave/Sludge Bomb
    Icy Wind/Thunderbolt/HP Fire/Destiny Bond/Protect



    Set Description:

    Abuse the fact that not only you outspeed and overpower your opponent, he cannot escape as well. Using unresisted coverage with STAB Shadow Ball and Focus Miss, you will be hitting everything with solid damage. Furthermore, with Fairies being weak to Poison you can take this into advantage and OHKO them, perhaps as Halycon suggested leading to the rise of new DraGengar teams in gen 6.

    The last move is your choice, you can use Substitute to predict a switch and gurantee and extra hit as well as status protection, Icy Wind for prediction and guaranteed kills on those quad weak mons, HP Fire for OHKOs, or Thunderbolt to hit Bulky Waters where it hurts the most. Destiny Bond is sort of a last resort to screw those who gravely threaten you or after you managed to get the kill on another pokemon. Protect can be used to shield yourself first turn when you Mega evovle as well as for scouting purposes or should Sludge Bomb/Wave poison your opponent, stall them out for further damage.

    The speed evs are to outspeed base 120 speedsters with positive nature, while the rest is invested for bulk. If you want to be sure to outspeed both Weavile and Scarf Tyranitar, than max speed investment is a must.



    Calcs:

    * Thunderbolt was estimated at 95 BP at the time of calculation


    Offensive (open)

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 228+ SpD Amoonguss: 136-162 (31.48 - 37.5%) -- 96.73% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Amoonguss: 193-228 (44.67 - 52.77%) -- 89.06% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Blastoise: 242-286 (66.85 - 79%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Breloom: 243-286 (92.74 - 109.16%) -- 93.75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Sludge Wave vs. 252 HP / 236+ SpD Celebi: 278-330 (68.81 - 81.68%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 120 HP / 136 SpD Conkeldurr: 189-223 (49.6 - 58.53%) -- 99.61% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Dragonite: 160-189 (49.53 - 58.51%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Espeon: 336-396 (100.59 - 118.56%) -- guaranteed OHKO

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 208 SpD Ferrothorn: 118-141 (33.52 - 40.05%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Forretress: 191-225 (53.95 - 63.55%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Garchomp: 184-217 (43.8 - 51.66%) -- 14.06% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 172+ SpD Gastrodon: 142-168 (33.33 - 39.43%) -- 86.5% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 244 HP / 0 SpD Gliscor: 204-240 (57.95 - 68.18%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Focus Blast vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Heatran: 222-262 (57.66 - 68.05%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Hippowdon: 142-168 (33.8 - 40%) -- 95.95% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Hippowdon: 208-246 (49.52 - 58.57%) -- 99.61% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 220+ SpD Jellicent: 230-272 (56.93 - 67.32%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 236+ SpD Jirachi: 236-278 (58.41 - 68.81%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 40 HP / 0 SpD Kingdra: 168-198 (55.81 - 65.78%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Focus Blast vs. 56 HP / 0 SpD Kyurem-B: 350-412 (86.41 - 101.72%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 4 HP / 0- SpD Landorus-T: 214-253 (66.87 - 79.06%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Latias: 254-302 (69.78 - 82.96%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Lucario: 214-253 (75.88 - 89.71%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Magnezone: 175-207 (62.05 - 73.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mamoswine: 243-286 (67.31 - 79.22%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 160 SpD Metagross: 296-350 (81.31 - 96.15%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mew: 320-380 (79.2 - 94.05%) -- 50% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Politoed: 252-298 (65.62 - 77.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 248 HP / 232+ SpD Rotom-W: 112-133 (36.96 - 43.89%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Salamence: 214-253 (64.65 - 76.43%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Scizor: 192-226 (68.32 - 80.42%) -- 43.75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 224 HP / 32 SpD Skarmory: 205-243 (62.69 - 74.31%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 248 HP / 116+ SpD Slowking: 242-288 (61.57 - 73.28%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Starmie: 368-434 (113.93 - 134.36%) -- guaranteed OHKO

    252 SpA Gengar Sludge Wave vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Tangrowth: 648-764 (160.79 - 189.57%) -- guaranteed OHKO

    252 SpA Gengar Thunderbolt vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Tentacruel: 216-256 (59.5 - 70.52%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and weather

    252 SpA Gengar Focus Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Terrakion: 350-412 (108.35 - 127.55%) -- guaranteed OHKO

    252 SpA Gengar Sludge Wave vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Thundurus-T: 255-301 (85.28 - 100.66%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Togekiss: 226-266 (60.42 - 71.12%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Thunderbolt vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Tornadus: 306-360 (102.34 - 120.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 244 HP / 0 SpD Toxicroak: 228-268 (61.95 - 72.82%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and weather

    252 SpA Gengar Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Tyranitar: 460-544 (113.86 - 134.65%) -- guaranteed OHKO

    252 SpA Gengar Thunderbolt vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Vaporeon: 266-314 (57.45 - 67.81%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 72 HP / 0 SpD Venusaur: 160-190 (50.15 - 59.56%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 240 HP / 0 SpD Volcarona: 153-181 (41.23 - 48.78%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

    252 SpA Gengar Sludge Wave vs. 248 HP / 236+ SpD Zapdos: 150-177 (39.16 - 46.21%) -- 95.31% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock



    * Tested with this EV Spread: 252 SpA/176 Speed/80 HP

    Defensive (open)

    252+ Atk Life Orb Technician Breloom Bullet Seed (3 hits) vs. 80 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 156-186 (55.51 - 66.19%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252+ Atk Dragonite Dragon Claw vs. 80 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 178-210 (63.34 - 74.73%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    0 Atk Ferrothorn Gyro Ball (150 BP) vs. 80 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 186-219 (66.19 - 77.93%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252 SpA Heatran Magma Storm vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Gengar: 205-243 (72.95 - 86.47%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252+ SpA Hydreigon Dragon Pulse vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Gengar: 165-195 (58.71 - 69.39%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    4 SpA Infernape Overheat vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Gengar: 163-193 (58 - 68.68%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252 Atk Jirachi Iron Head vs. 80 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 132-156 (46.97 - 55.51%) -- 69.53% chance to 2HKO

    252 SpA Choice Specs Jolteon Thunderbolt vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Gengar: 216-255 (76.86 - 90.74%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252 SpA Keldeo Hydro Pump vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Gengar: 204-241 (72.59 - 85.76%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    240+ SpA Life Orb Kingdra Draco Meteor vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Gengar: 273-321 (97.15 - 114.23%) -- 81.25% chance to OHKO

    216+ Atk Kyurem-B Dragon Claw vs. 80 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 208-246 (74.02 - 87.54%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252 SpA Magnezone Thunderbolt vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Gengar: 162-192 (57.65 - 68.32%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252 Atk Life Orb Mamoswine Ice Shard vs. 80 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 103-122 (36.65 - 43.41%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

    252 SpA Rotom-W Hydro Pump vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Gengar: 177-208 (62.98 - 74.02%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252 Atk Salamence Outrage vs. 80 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 243-286 (86.47 - 101.77%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO

    252+ Atk Choice Band Technician Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 80 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 195-229 (69.39 - 81.49%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252 Atk Skarmory Brave Bird vs. 80 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 171-202 (60.85 - 71.88%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252 SpA Life Orb Starmie Hydro Pump vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Gengar: 222-263 (79 - 93.59%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252 Atk Terrakion Stone Edge vs. 80 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 196-232 (69.75 - 82.56%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252 SpA Thundurus-T Thunderbolt vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Gengar: 177-208 (62.98 - 74.02%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252 SpA Sharp Beak Tornadus Hurricane vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Gengar: 238-282 (84.69 - 100.35%) -- 6.25% chance to OHKO

    252 SpA Tyranitar Fire Blast vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Gengar: 110-130 (39.14 - 46.26%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

    252 SpA Life Orb Venusaur Hidden Power Fire vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Gengar: 87-103 (30.96 - 36.65%) -- 66.72% chance to 3HKO

    252 Atk Victini V-create vs. 80 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 295-348 (104.98 - 123.84%) -- guaranteed OHKO

    0 SpA Zapdos Thunderbolt vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Gengar: 129-153 (45.9 - 54.44%) -- 47.66% chance to 2HKO




    Counters & Checks:


    252 SpA Gengar Focus Blast vs. 4 HP / 252+ SpD Blissey: 188-222 (28.83 - 34.04%) -- possible 4HKO

    As you can see, Special walls such as Blissey still manage to tank its hits, although there isn't much it can do aside from using T-wave on non substitute sets. Powerful Choice Scarf mons and possible Sand Rushers/Swift Swimmers can also manage to take it down (ironically scarf Gengar), while Mega Alakazam can also revenge kill it if Gengar doesn't manage to get a sub on. Gliscor, Garchomp and Hippodown and any bulky ground can act as a check if at full health. Finally, don't forget to include a spinner lest you fall prey to Stick Web.



    Synergy:

    Dragons and other pokemon who appreciate to have their counters trapped will love to partner up with Mega Gengar, Hazard teams will love to have such a fearsome spinblocker and it also benefits you when dealing with stall since you will be able to eliminate a key element of their defensive core, making it easier to crack their team down. Mega Gengar however will also love to have teamates who can deal with bulky Grounds and faster pokemon as well as laying down hazards to make it's kill easier. Priorities such as Scizor is still annoying and as such it is best dealt with another team mate.


    =============

    Eternal Slumber/Sleeping with the Fishes
    Suggested by Duckster


    Mega Gengar @ Gengarite
    Nature: Timid
    Ability: Shadow Tag
    EVs: 252 SpA/252 Speed/4 HP

    Shadow Ball/Hex (now 65 BP, 130 if opponent is statused)
    Focus Blast/Dazzling Gleam
    Hypnosis
    Substitute/Taunt



    Set Description:

    What's more aggravating than a SpA monster that you can't switch away from? The one that puts you to sleep, subs on your snoring body or disables your status moves/recovery. This takes trapping to the extreme and pounds you with attack after attack until there is nothing left, with the choice between the more powerful Focus Blast or the consistent and always hitting Dazzling Gleam should the sleep counter treat you harshly. The last slot is to either prevent status, healing or manage to land an extra attack.



    Calcs:

    Discussing the pros and cons of using Ghost/Fairy coverage (open)

    D) Fairy/Ghost:

    Resisted by: Normal/Poison, Normal/Fire, Normal/Steel
    Perfect Third Type Coverage: Water, Electric, etc.

    So pretty much only Pyroar resists Shadow Ball + Dazzling Gleam. The noticeable changes by relying on those two only is Heatran becomes a 3HKO when Specially Defensive, and you lose the OHKO on slightly bulky Kyube, Tyranitar and Terrakion. On the other hand...

    252 SpA Gengar Hidden Power Dragon vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Dragonite: 214-252 (66.25 - 78.01%) -- 25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

    *HP Dragon used as substitute for Dazzling Gleam, BP adjusted to 80

    So it gives you chance to clear away Dragons before they retaliate. The non missing factor can also come in handy with the Hypnosis set which doesn't tolerate misses at all, I'll slash it there thanks.



    Counters & Checks:


    Pretty much you either outspeed him or kill him with a priority before he manages to have his way with you.



    Synergy:

    Destroying priorities and scarfers or speedy pokemons is very much preferred for this set to work, and this pokemon would very much enjoy any entry hazards you can manage to throw at the other side. Gravity support, while not mandatory could make this infinitely better if only to make sure the opponent goes to sleep and every focus blast hits.


    ==============


    *Welcome to Perish/Troll Ball
    Suggested by X5Dragon, slash by Tactical


    Mega Gengar @ Gengarite
    Nature: Timid
    Ability: Shadow Tag
    EVs: 252 SpA/252 Speed/4 HP


    Protect
    Substitute/Disable
    Shadow Ball
    Perish Song

    *Perish song will be legal in December when the bank is online



    Set Description:

    The premise of this set is to start with trapping something that can OHKO'd or 2HKO'd with Shadow Ball, after that you can continue on wreaking havoc on your opponents team or take down their counter by using Perish Song and stalling them with subs and protects or even disabling their SE moves via Disable.



    Counters & Checks:


    Your only hope of avoiding a certain death against that set is to bring in something that outspeeds Gengar and at the same time manages to break it's Sub if you switch in too late. Priority users and Multi-hitting moves such as Icicle Spear, Rock Blast and Water Shuriken are all good bets against a frail Gengar. At the very least, you can minimize your casualties and play around to make sure his Gengar only goes down with one of your pokemon.


    Synergy:

    Having assurance that something like Sticky Web isn't on field is nice, which can be provided by either a Defog user or a spinner. Getting rid of obvious counters such as Multi Hit users and Priority or at least weakening them for the OHKO will guarantee a Gengar terror run into your enemies team.


    ==============

    Wall Breaker/Stall Killer
    Suggested by Freze, Plopper, Strone RG


    Mega Gengar @ Gengarite
    Nature: Timid
    Ability: Shadow Tag
    EVs: 252 SpA/252 Speed/4 HP

    Taunt
    Destiny Bond/Substitute
    Shadow Ball
    Focus Blast/Sludge Bomb



    Set Description:

    As the name suggest, this set mainly aims to prevent walls from healing, phazing and status moves while you proceed to finish them off, making it good to finish of walls and hazard leads such as Skarmory. Taunt is a must for this to happen, and unresisted coverage is a nice guarantee for dealing consistent damage. The last slot is to either focus more on Fairys, take something down with you after you have done your job or your opponent some how manages to escape and you feel pursuit trapped, or substitute to take advantage of totally hapless pokemon after the taunt such as Blissey.



    Counters & Checks:

    There are walls that can defeat this set even with Taunt on the table:

    Reuinclus
    Celebi with Psychic
    Hippodon
    Donaphan
    Gliscor



    Synergy:

    Aside from the usual Gengar counters, dealing with the above pokemon, bulky grounds and psychics should be handled by someone else if they aren't damaged beforehand. Hazards that damage such pokemon and take their HP slowly such as spikes and t-spikes are appreciated.


    ==============


    Sub Disable Kill/Lol Pursuit Trappin

    Mega Gengar @ Gengarite
    Nature: Timid
    Ability: Shadow Tag
    EVs: 252 SpA/252 Speed/4 HP

    Shadow Ball
    Focus Blast/Sludge Bomb
    Substitute
    Disable



    Set Description:

    The classic sub disable set returns, but now benefiting from both Steel losing its resistance to Ghost and Fairy being weak to Poison, leading Ghost/Fight and Ghost/Poison combos into having fantastic coverage. The set aims to disable the most important moves the opponent may have, be it Pursuit, Bullet Punch, Outrage or healing moves, leaving them with weaker attacks or status moves which Substitute covers. On top of that, Shadow tag prevents from switching into something else, allowing now once counters to became easy prey.




    Counters & Checks:

    Needless to say this does depend on prediction a bit, and the opponent may have more than one move to finish the job, for example a Scizor with Pursuit and Bullet Punch or the opponent may even bluff and use a move that can break Gengar's sub while keeping the STAB or SE for after Disable.


    Synergy:

    Entry hazards are appreciated, and toxic spikes may help taking down walls much faster.


    ==============


    Speed Demon/Spamming BallZ

    Gengar@Choice Scarf
    Nature: Timid/Modest
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 252 Speed/252 SpA/4 HP

    Shadow Ball
    Focus Blast
    Sludge Wave/Icy Wind
    Trick/Thunderbolt




    Set Description:

    Don't want to fret about speed issues and just want to spam Shadow Ball and laugh at Jirachi/Latios/Sweepers and those new MEvos with frightening speed tiers? This outspeeds base 180 Deoxys S.



    Counters & Checks:


    Blissey and Special Walls that take neutral damage from its attacks, as well as priorities and pokemon who are bulky and have powerful STABs of their own to OHKO Gengar, especially after SR.



    Synergy:

    This set is mainly for spin blocking and late game sweeps, taking advantage of Steel not resisting Gengar's Ballz anymore. As such, using this with Hazard teams or HO is advised, as well as having teammates who deal with his SpD wall issues and priorities and finishing off any pursuirters.


    ======================


    Shadow Orb/Ghost Life

    Gengar@Life Orb
    Nature: Timid
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 252 Speed/252 SpA/4 HP

    Shadow Ball
    Focus Blast/Dazzling Gleam
    Sludge Bomb/Sludge Wave
    Substitue/HP Fire




    Set Description:

    Ghost being the best damned thing since Dragons kind of makes LO an appealing choice. After all, if the opponent has little to nothing to switch onto Gengar, why not just spam the balls? The other options have him capitalize on his other stab, more coverage and an option for choosing substitute as the last slot for prediction and more attacking opportunities.
    Counters & Checks:

    Blissey and Special Walls that take neutral damage from its attacks, as well as priorities and pokemon who are bulky and have powerful STABs of their own to OHKO Gengar, especially after SR.
    Synergy:
    This set is takes advantage of Steel not resisting Gengar's Ballz anymore. As such, using this with Hazard teams or HO is advised, as well as having teammates who deal with his SpD wall issues and priorities and finishing off any pursuirters.

    =================


    Disable Ghost/Sub, Able and Destroy

    Gengar@ Black Sludge
    Nature: Timid
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 252 Speed/252 SpA/4 HP

    Shadow Ball
    Focus Blast/Dazzling Gleam/Sludge Bomb/HP Fire
    Disable
    Substitue




    Set Description:

    Ghost being the best damned thing since Dragons kind of makes LO an appealing choice. After all, if the opponent has little to nothing to switch onto Gengar, why not just spam the balls? The other options have him capitalize on his other stab, more coverage and an option for choosing substitute as the last slot for prediction and more attacking opportunities.
    Counters & Checks:

    A lot of pokemon have more than one strong move/Stab to hit with, and Gengar being frail they can still cause problems if they can live a 2HKO from anything Gengar can attack with. Also special walls are usually annoying if they have a threatening move or you disable the wrong thing.


    Synergy:

    Hazards are always nice, as well pokemon that can deal with his problems such as bulky offensive pokemon or special walls.

    ==========================


    Stall Ghost/Lulz Chansey
    Suggested by Alexwolf, Hex slash by X5D


    Gengar@Black Sludge
    Nature: Timid
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 252 Spe/28 HP/148 SpA/80 SpD

    Substitute
    Will-o-Wisp
    Taunt/Sludge Wave/Disable
    Shadow Ball/Hex




    Set Description:

    This infamous set takes advantage of Gengars overall abilities, resistances and wide movepool to give Stall a massive headache. Not the least spreading around burns, utilizing substitutes and disabling the opponents ability to lay down hazards, status and most importantly recover health.



    Counters & Checks:


    Dark type pokemon such as Tyranitar and Bisharp can still power through if Gengar does not have a substitute even thought they won't enjoy the Burn that comes first. Mandibuzz also escape this encounter relatively unharmed and Aegislash is always a pain. Choice Banded priorities such as Talonflame will also manage to take this Ghost off the skies.



    Synergy:

    This set provides you with many chances to set up later in the game after Gengar finishes his work, it also requires support from Pursuiters or pokemon capable of taking out the few offensive threats and priorities that stop Gengar.

    =====================================



    [​IMG]
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2014
  2. JSND

    JSND

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2010
    Messages:
    951
    Gengar pretty much need to do its initial switch in properly before those M.Evo and Shadow Tag ETC goes in.

    Does Mega Evolving have higher priority than Switching?
  3. Bribery

    Bribery

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2009
    Messages:
    339
    Destiny Bond could also be a viable option in the last slot for taking out Pokemon Gengar can't beat normally without prior damage (Scizor, Keldeo, Garchomp etc)
  4. UltiMario

    UltiMario

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2009
    Messages:
    1,187
    Gengar doesn't learn Sludge Wave.
  5. Arcticblast

    Arcticblast It hasn't been as nice at night these last few days
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    Gastly gets Sludge Wave as a Dream World move from BW. That said, Sludge Bomb's 30% chance to poison is often worth the 5 BP drop in power from Sludge Wave.
  6. Duckster

    Duckster

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    Clearly Megas are Uber-tier.

    I can see this thing wreaking havoc in tandem with Gravity Xerneas.

    Thinking

    Mega Gengar
    - Shadow Ball
    - Focus Blast / Thunder / Sludge / Destiny Bond
    - Hypnosis / Taunt
    - Protect / Disable / Substitute / Psychic

    Gravity Raises your accuracy to 100 percent while you either Protect or sleep gamble. If Gravity is up when you switch in then you have the best moveset in the game. Mess things up with Disable or kill with Uber Sp. Atks. If it's Nintendo rules no sleep clause is going to make things easier for you.

    Being able to shut things down from hitting you while trapping is nuts. It is also incredibly effective against the common Fake-Out Fighting type + Trick Room led. You destroy half a team in 4 v 4, haha.
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2013
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  7. X5Dragon

    X5Dragon

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    I kind of like that option, a last resort when you realize you're low on health and cannot 2HKO your opponent.

    I honestly don't know and that's after searching for answers, I'll let someone else answer that.

    That chance does seem great especially with 2HKOs or opponents with recovery. However it appears one of Chespin's hidden abilities is Bullet Proof, so I'll mention both as an option.

    I...like this, a lot? First of all you don't need more than Shadow Ball and Focus Blast damage wise, since you are putting them to sleep. I'd prefer moving Taunt and Substitute to the same slot as well. I'll add this one up in the OP,thanks!
  8. Duckster

    Duckster

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    NP.

    You might want to take note of all of the great Gengar partners in you first post. Two that come to mind are Dusknoir and Noivern.

    Dusknoir @ Mental Herb
    - Gravity / Imprison
    - Earthquake
    - Psychic / Shadow Ball
    - Protect / Helping Hand / Shadow Ball

    This can serve as either a generic Gravity user who wants to set up a quick Gengar sweep or a defensive gatekeeper making Gengar immune to its strongest counters. With imprison, you can block out all of Gengar's main weaknesses (Dark is covered by Focus Blast). This gives him incredible staying power imo.

    Pkmn 2 might be novelty but I like it.

    Noibat @ Focus Band
    Trait: Frisk
    - Tailwind
    - Superfang / Boomblast
    - Drago Meteor
    - Protect / Hurricane / Boomblast

    Frisk can reveal scarf if you're lucky which will dictate whether you want to attack or protect with your Gengar. It's like auto-prediction. Tailwind jacks up your speed which might be necessary in such a fast metagame.

    Superfang is a great move to put an opponent into KO range. Boomblast is a neat spread move that could work work with Gengar's normal immunity though Protect and Flying coverage are great things to have.
  9. Curtains

    Curtains

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    Change SpD to Spe in the base stats bit.
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  10. kd24

    kd24 yo daddy musta been a drug dealer? why, cuz you're dope
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    An option I haven't seen discussed is Perish Song. I imagine that when people think of their initial answer to Mega Gengar, it's one that is defensive enough to not care about Shadow Ball or Focus Blast (And because of the threat of Shadow Ball, Ghost-types won't switch in to evade Shadow Tag). Without having to waste a turn Mean Looking, you could potentially trap a lot of the metagame if we do shift towards a more defensive game. So yeah, this is a move that secretly worries me a lot.
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  11. Stone RG

    Stone RG Megas are broke

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    Gengar @ Gengarite
    Trait: Levitate (Shadow Tag as Mega Gengar)
    EVs: 252 SpA / 136 Spe / 120 HP
    Timid Nature
    - Shadow Ball
    - Sludge Wave / Sludge Bomb
    - Focus Blast
    - Taunt

    Correct me if im wrong, but this set beats any stall poke 1v1, with a newfound bulk, Kyurem White level SpA, and Taunt, Mega Gengar easily 2hkos any physicaly oriented wall, and can beat the most specially defensive behemoths with simple spamming of his STAB moves. Idk what the EVs are actually for, and Sludge Wave is slashed first due to the newly found hidden ability of Chestnaught, which (please correct if im wrong on this) makes him inmune to ''Ball'' or ''Bomb'' moves, making him an easy stop for Gengar in the worst of the cases, a very obscure check, but a check nontheless.
  12. pkmn-taicho321

    pkmn-taicho321

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    Mega evos take up a turn, no? Seems like if you scout the Megastone Mega evos have a really huge weakness. Gengar isn't all that bulky, even Mega-Gengar.

    I think, unlike the huge power creep in Gen5, Megas aren't going to impact the Meta as much as people might think. It's already been said that Mega Gengar loses in raw power to Life Orb Gengar. Personally my favorite Gengar is a Sub/ Wisp set, so I probably won't use Mega Gengar much.

    I'd excited to see some of our lower tier 'mons getting a possible shot at OU.
  13. oasis

    oasis

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    Mega Evos can evolve and attack in the same turn
  14. zero2exe

    zero2exe Veteran Breeder - Expert Translator
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    I believe it was confirmed a while ago that you can mega evo AND attack on the same turn. Although actual confirmation would be nice now.
    Edit: lol ninja'd
  15. pkmn-taicho321

    pkmn-taicho321

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    Ah, thanks for clearing that up for me, I haven't gotten very far into the game yet, seems like I'm one of the few that actually got it on launch day, and I had to work an eighter today.
  16. Millky95

    Millky95

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    Not sure if it's tested but does switching have a higher priority than Mega Evolving? If so, trapping the first time you bring in Gengar could be more difficult as you bring in Gengar, they switch, you evolve, they've got the advantage to kill you with priority or Pursuit you. That being said, I do think moves like Hidden Power Fire and Focus Blast are important to consider with Focus Blast practically a given. Here are some calcs based on Scizor. Note: HP has been fixed to 60 Power
    252 SpA (custom) Hidden Power Fire vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Scizor: 384-452 (111.95 - 131.77%) -- guaranteed OHKO
    252 SpA (custom) Shadow Ball vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Scizor: 190-225 (55.39 - 65.59%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
    252+ Atk Choice Band Technician Scizor Pursuit vs. 4 HP / 0 Def (custom): 308-364 (133.33 - 157.57%) -- guaranteed OHKO
    252+ Atk Choice Band Technician Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def (custom): 231-273 (100 - 118.18%) -- guaranteed OHKO

    HP Fire gives you the chance to OHKO on the switch, while Bullet Punch eats you alive.
  17. Robert Alfons

    Robert Alfons Walking back to you is the hardest thing I can do
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    Specially defensive Hippowdon survives Shadow Ball with ease as far as I'm concerned and has Earthquake to tear MegaGengar a new one. Go hippo!
  18. TwoBit

    TwoBit

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    Perish Song certainly can be useful, but I doubt Mega Gengar will be able to take many hits especially when you consider how hyper offensive the OU metagame is. It's worth a slash as it can be useful against of pokemon that would otherwise wall Gengar.
  19. Fundance

    Fundance

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    Mega gengar ends up being faster than a good majority of viable pursuit users, including Weavile, so pursuit-trapping it (especially with slightly boosted defenses) seems to be out of the question for the most part on anything that isn't choice scarfed.

    And even then I'm pretty sure a scarfed weavile can't OKO that with pursuit.

    Also, it has shadow tag and hypnosis, so it could actually make some use of Nightmare or Dream Eater...
  20. The Wobbuffet Kid

    The Wobbuffet Kid

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    Personally, the aesthetic looks of Mega Gengar is already sort of a let down, but, with Gengar already being in OU since Gen 1, it does indeed improve just a bit. But, I am going to be happy to try out some of the listed sets.
  21. Siggu

    Siggu

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    Mega Gengar is probably one of the few Mega Evolutions that doesn't mind the loss of an item. It's not far from the power output of Life Orb Gengar and its only competition is... Scarf Chandelure, which is weaker, has a worse typing and is locked to a single move
  22. Millky95

    Millky95

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    I think the reason for that is because MegaGengar has a different role to normal Gengar. Thanks to Shadow Tag it can trap and probably KO most of the metagame. It's not trying to do a slightly faster or stronger version of what Gengar did in terms of sweeping. It can sweep obviously but normal Gengar is more suited to that role
  23. gvmgvm40

    gvmgvm40

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    Gengar @ Gengarite
    Trait: Levitate (Shadow Tag as Mega Gengar)
    EVs: (not sure as of now)
    Timid Nature
    - Shadow Ball
    - Sludge Wave / Focus Blast
    - Taunt
    - Destiny Bond

    Sure, you lose coverage either against fairies or steels, but a fast Taunt/Destiny Bond combination will let you secure lots of KOs.
  24. Manaphy

    Manaphy

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    Yes but Chandelure has the advantage of being faster, having a very powerful STAB Overheat, and as someone pointed out before, not having to actually transform which let's your opponent switch without Shadow Tag activating. Chandy also doesn't take up your Mega Evo slot.
  25. MrEon

    MrEon

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    Just want to correct you, LO is applied on the actual stat, not the base stat. Eg. Timid MegaGengar = 439 SpA, and LO Timid Gengar = 359 + 30% = ~467 SpA. See this -
    252 SpA Life Orb Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mew: 338-400 (99.12 - 117.3%)
    252 SpA Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mew: 320-378 (93.84 - 110.85%) <----- MegaGar
    It's still pretty close though, and iirc given the coverage this thing has, it probably won't mind the power drop.

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