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Get Yo Guns Up! (Got me to #61, 1960 ACRE)

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by CoolStoryBrobat, Sep 16, 2013.

  1. CoolStoryBrobat

    CoolStoryBrobat The hero Smogon needs, but not the one it deserves
    is a Battle Server Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2012
    Messages:
    712
    Introduction

    Sup, Smogon. CoolStoryBrobat here, a guy some of you know as: "That dude who makes extremely lengthy RMTs", or "That guy who uses weird crap in UU sometimes", or "That prick who banned me 2 days ago". Whatever it is, I guess I got another UU RMT here for y'all, and I'll try not to drown you in too many words this time. So uh...yeah. Scroll down right quick, yo.

    Teambuilding Process

    Man, I love writing these out, lol. Before I actually show the process, let me give you the background on how this team came around. In the Next Best Thing Thread I came up with this Blastoise set (As you can see if you clicked that link) and figured I'd test it out for a bit. The details of that set, which I'm not gonna re-explain in superfluous detail, are all in that link. So seriously, click it mayne. Anyway, this team is built around Choice Specs Blastoise, something so manly and raw you should salute as a tribute of respect. Anyway, as for the actual process...
    Not the greatest team in the world, and some threats can really split this team's wig up, but I'm surprised I got as high as I did. I can say however, using this team has improved my ability to make predictions a bit, which is where a lot of games are won when you're not looking at the random hax that always chooses whether to help or hurt me.

    When I made this team, I was just goofing around, too lazy to even log into my alt on the UU Suspect ladder. Didn't even care about going for voting reqs initially. But then I noticed I was having one of the sickest runs I ever got, and suddenly decided to go for it as a goal. Unfortunately I got kinda frustrated today and gave up just like 28 points short of making reqs because I felt it was becoming more than enough of a hassle and I kinda wanted to put this team down so you guys could enjoy it. Had a great run thus far, and definitely one of my faves to use, ever.

    Screenshot(s?)

    Show Hide
    [​IMG]


    Idk, not like it supremely matters, but this is actually the highest I ever got on PS...ever. Scoff as some of you may, I actually don't think ladder score is the most important thing, and it's definitely not what the game's about. This to me is just more of a personal achievement for finally getting a respectable score with something "unique" that actually managed to work effectively. (And I guess it's some backup proof to fall on in the event I get reqs for the regular UU ladder next week that I fell short of getting them on this one...)

    A Closer Look...
    (Just bought two tickets TO THE GUN SHOW!)



    [​IMG]
    The Gun Show (Blastoise) (M) @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Water Spout
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Rapid Spin

    • Pretty plain and straightforward...like I said, if you don't understand why I'm running Modest and max Speed/SpA on this Blastoise, click the link above to the thread where I go into immense detail. At first I was running HP Grass in the 4th slot, to deal with opposing bulky waters (literally, just those guys) but Toxic Spikes and Spike-Stacking teams in general got irritating. It was hard enough dealing with two of my big hitters having SR weaknesses, but it really hits you when 5 out of 6 Pokemon are taking damage every time they switch in. Qwilfish is a prick, and I need to get a spin off to undo its work at times.
    • Hard for me to even say this, but my only beef with Blastoise, is it's really getting bodied if it takes a strong hit. The standard defensive one kinda laughs at this guy's ability to stand up to hard hitters who can survive a move on the switch-in, because I really didn't want to afford any HP on it. I wanted to capitalize on outspeeding as many walls as I could with this as well as some slower offensive threats. I guess I just hate how much he gets worn down, and how much it can hurt to be locked into a single move at times. Specs Rapid Spin sounds crazy enough as is, and it really gives up momentum more than just a regular non-choiced Rapid Spin, so I really try to throttle back on my usage of that move. ONLY IF I NEED TO EVER USE IT will I actually go for it.
    [​IMG]
    Hombreon (Umbreon) (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Synchronize
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Foul Play
    - Heal Bell
    - Wish
    - Protect

    • Also pretty plain and straightforward, mi hombre, Hombreon. Blahblah, special wall, magical dark fur that could withstand even the strongest Chandelure's Fire Blast, while keeping physical attackers at bay with Foul Play (Dat rhyme tho!) and using Wish/Protect to support itself and its teammates. Heal Bell cures status, blahblahblah. 'Nuff said, you've probably been irritated by Umbreon enough in general to really know how annoying (yet effective) it can be.
    • My only beef with Umbreon, sometimes it ends up really succumbing as a sponge for this team. Switches to it can be obvious, leading to a Chandelure ruining it with Trick. Or just offensive pressure in general can lead to its demise or the team's demise if I focus too much on one thing over the other. Not to mention, Umbreon has its fair share of opponents who would love to switch in and set up, some names being: Cobalion, Virizion, Scrafty, Bisharp, Machamp, etc. These pokemon are actually all troublesome in themselves one way or another, and it often requires witty double switches or switching in without going for Protect afterward just to stay on top, which leads to that attrition happening, where it gets worn down. And most of the time, Umbreon gets KO'd (critted) at an appropriate moment, leaving a massive gaping hole in this team. It's...pretty bad, man.
    [​IMG]
    Brobat (Crobat) (M) @ Black Sludge
    Trait: Inner Focus
    EVs: 116 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 136 Spd
    Jolly Nature
    - Brave Bird
    - U-turn
    - Taunt
    - Roost

    • Ah, yes. The epitome of dopeness itself that allows me to live every day TM 87'd to the maximum. This is basically your standard everyday run-of-the-mill Stallbreaker set, with nothing ordinary going on. Brave Bat for dat massive high-powered STAB, U-Turn for momentum, Taunt for insulting peoples' mothers, and Roost for healing. What may catch your eye though, is the EV spread. I've been using this EV Spread on Crobat for as long as I can remember, and haven't turned back since, honestly. I found the standard spread of like 176 HP/192 Atk or whatever hitting like a bag of sweet candy marshmallows when it needs to be KILLING. So I kinda tailored it a bit so that while maintaining the same speed (And those 4 SpDef EVs for Download abusers), I could just maximize Atk and dump whatever was left into HP. Like I said, been using this for long as I can remember (Several months, maybe like January or February) and haven't looked back once. Try it someday! Guarantees an OHKO on DD Scrafty after rocks, can't argue against that!
    • My only beef with Brobat, (Is it even possible to beef with oneself?) that stupid SR chipping its health away. Yeah, I know, I carry Rapid Spin on Blastoise. SR still gets annoying. This guy tends to also cause Zapdos, Rhyperior, a majority of any Steel/Rock types, and the occasional Scarf Mienshao going for a revenge kill to absolutely ruin their pants with sheer excitement for a chance to switch in. Gotta play smart when using Brobat, as half the stuff it switches in on carry a rock or ice move to dispose of it and make it (And I guess the guy using it) look pretty dumb if they play properly. Not to mention it's the same deal when Taunting most hazard setters, as they can hit hard with a move and still KO. But either way this guy's solid on this team and I feel the benefits outweigh the risks.
    [​IMG]
    Wheaties (Swampert) (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 240 HP / 16 Atk / 252 Def
    Impish Nature
    - Waterfall
    - Earthquake
    - Stealth Rock
    - Toxic

    • Aw, yes. The breakfast of CHAMPIONS. Start your day off with Swampert, and it'll probably have a 0.1% less chance of ever going wrong. Swampert's my physical tank and my usual go-to guy half the time for most hard hitters. Gotta have something to sponge a Darmanitan's Flare Blitzes and the like, right? And thanks to Umbreon, the occasional Scald burn or poorly-scouted-for-defensive Arcanine's Will-O-Wisp is a non-issue! I originally had Scald on this set for serving as a bulky water and fishing for that 30% burn chance, but I will agree. It sucked. Sunohara finally convinced me to put Waterfall on this thing like I used to always do back in the day, and I have not looked back. With this I have a reliable move to use when I feel someone may capitalize on a switch-in to Earthquake with something such as Flygon. Scald's burn chance isn't always guaranteed, and doesn't compensate for the low base power it has, unlike what Waterfall does. This guy also sets up Stealth Rock for me, but more importantly you'll notice I have Toxic in the last moveslot. I used to run Roar to phaze out boosting attackers (Mainly Bisharp, because I hate that thing as of late) but my team had a serious, and I mean SERIOUS problem with CM Slowbro. And Porygon2 was also kinda annoying cause it wasn't necessarily dying right away to this team. So I figured I'd use Toxic to put both these Pokemon (mainly Slowbro) on a timer so they can't sweep/refuse to die. But mainly sweep. Seriously, CM Slowbro could 6-0 my team if it got in and set up before Virizion came in, that alone is incentive enough. But that's besides the point...Ironically CroCune isn't as much a threat for this team.
    • My beef with Swampert is it made me write a massive paragraph when I told you I was gonna try not to word you all to death. No, jk. My biggest beef with it is that it just gets worn down, harder than anything. While duh, I do have Umbreon for this issue, I've come to notice a well-played Scarf Mienshao lategame is able to sweep only if this guy is weakened. I often alternate between Brobat if it goes for Hi-Jump Kick and this guy (sometimes Virizion) if I predict a Stone Edge, but that's kind of where it's stopped short. If this guy's weakened lategame I'm most likely going to get trucked by most physical Scarf users. Take your pick. Darmanitan, Mienshao, Heracross (not so much but still possible), etc.
    [​IMG]
    Trixie (Virizion) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Justified
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 20 HP / 252 SAtk / 236 Spd
    Hasty Nature
    - Giga Drain
    - Close Combat
    - Hidden Power [Rock]
    - Work Up

    • My delicious Trix yogurt! And the "Win Condition" of choice for this team. Calloflochie suggested Work Up Virizion to me, a set I never tried out before. Honestly, I've been unable to get Virizion to work for me in the past due to its move issues: Calm Mind has to rely on a shaky Focus Blast for STAB (which is critically important) while Swords Dance has to rely on a shaky Stone Edge for crucial coverage (also critically important). While I specifically wanted a specially-oriented Win Condition since most of my attackers/tanks were physical, I decided to take Work Up Virizion since it capitalizes by using all of Virizion's most reliable attacks in one set. Being a mixed attacker, it could still surprise the occasional Snorlax or whatever that thought it could switch in once it saw I carry Giga Drain, and more importantly it also can take advantage of a Justified boost from Umbreon (or any Dark-type really, but mainly Umbreon). Hasty Nature is preferred since Virizion's Special Defense is highly usable even without investment, and to give Download users an Attack Boost. The EVs are customized to still outspeed +Speed Base 105s, but with a little HP on the side. I run HP Rock (Cause I hate Chandelure), which forces me to use a 30 IV in speed...meaning opposing Virizion/Cobalion will always outspeed me regardless.
    • My beef with Virizion...let's see how I can say this in as few words as possible: Weak physical defense. Gets wrecked by opposing Virizion/Cobalion 100% of the time. Has pretty weak power initially with no boosts, even if I predict, HP Rock ain't killing Chandy at +0. Most of the time I never set up past +1 when in position to sweep (Though this isn't always a bad thing, but a trend I noticed that influenced me to try Tangrowth at one point). I mean, Virizion is still amazing at what it does, and I think at one point I attempted to try Sceptile too. But that's neither here nor there. Virizion's got flaws like any other poke, but I guess it all goes back to playing smart. Y'know?
    [​IMG]
    Darmikqua (Darmanitan) (F) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Sheer Force
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature
    - Flare Blitz
    - Earthquake
    - U-turn
    - Yawn

    • What starts with "F" and ends in "UCK"? "Freaking Darmanitan hits like a big red firetrUCK!" Seriously, it does, and I've been totally satisfied since I replaced Azelf with it. The power is too much to pass up on, and the set is pretty straightforward. Why do I run Earthquake instead of Rock Slide? Earthquake's won me a few games, and I figure I'd rather have a reliable move to kill Fire-types with. Granted, Rock Slide is boosted by Sheer Force, there's not a handy chunk of Flying-types/Levitators in UU who can take a Flare Blitz, so it's not too much of an issue to me. What you are reading this paragraph for, is why I have Yawn in the last slot. Well, for one, I never liked Superpower on Scarf Darmanitan. Outside of revenging a Snorlax, you most likely will never use this move without regretting it as you're subsequently turned into setup bait for whatever fails to die. So I figured I'd use a move that allows me to actually employ some use! I tried Sleep Talk (Hey, it worked with my CB Victini), but the outcome wasn't too awesome, and I had Heal Bell anyway. So I tried Encore, but it was highly situational on when it was actually effective to use it. And then, Yawn. This move has literally averted so many Honchkrow sweeps, it's not even funny. As you can see, I got no Flying resists. My physical tank is 2HKO'd by LO Brave Bird from Adamant Honchkrow, so you can see what I'm going through. I honestly feel standard sets are good for getting your team together but when you analyze your weaknesses, you should patch up the holes as much as possible. With this, I can turn a game around and keep a Honchkrow from outright sweeping me (They always go for Sucker Punch on Darmanitan, it's only natural) and I can also almost guarantee a win in the endgame if there's only one Pokemon left that can still be an issue.
    • My beef with Darm, is it made me write an EVEN BIGGER paragraph just to talk about it. That and mainly the SR weakness + Flare Blitz recoil + inability to really switch in on much at all (Meaning, have fun receiving a Wish anytime soon). It all really kicks me in the sides, but that won't detract me from using Darmanitan, as it's an excellent Pokemon and has been carrying the team through several games.
    Threat List
    Coming Soon...I have a horrible tendency to write RMTs when it's extremely late. Smh. Placeholders until I get time to flesh this section out: Bisharp, Scarf Mienshao, Swords Dance Mew, Honchkrow, Choice Band Crobat, Physical Abomasnow, etc.

    The Team In Action!

    It may be shameless self-advertising, but screw it. I actually recorded 2 PS Lives of me playing this team for over an hour and a half in total, so you get to see it in quite immense detail how it's played. If it's wrong for me to post these vids here, let a moderator inform me and I'll pull 'em off here.


    (A run of the first version of this team, with Azelf and the initial setup)


    (A run of the latest modified version of the team, after finalizing with Darmanitan and making a few changes within)


    Exportable
    Try it for yourself now! A few notes: This team relies on some decent predicting skills...and at times knowing what beats what. Like, know that Blastoise outspeeds Nidoqueen always. Bring in Blastoise when you predict someone to set SR, and start spamming Water Spout. Remember that Virizion loses to other Virizion. Most importantly, if you see a Mienshao, keep Swampert and Crobat alive and healthy. THAT IS A MUST.

    Show Hide

    The Gun Show (Blastoise) (M) @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Water Spout
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Rapid Spin

    Hombreon (Umbreon) (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Synchronize
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Foul Play
    - Heal Bell
    - Wish
    - Protect

    Brobat (Crobat) (M) @ Black Sludge
    Trait: Inner Focus
    EVs: 116 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 136 Spd
    Jolly Nature
    - Brave Bird
    - U-turn
    - Taunt
    - Roost

    Wheaties (Swampert) (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 240 HP / 16 Atk / 252 Def
    Impish Nature
    - Waterfall
    - Earthquake
    - Stealth Rock
    - Toxic

    Trixie (Virizion) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Justified
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 20 HP / 252 SAtk / 236 Spd
    Hasty Nature
    - Giga Drain
    - Close Combat
    - Hidden Power [Rock]
    - Work Up

    Darmikqua (Darmanitan) (F) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Sheer Force
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature
    - Flare Blitz
    - Earthquake
    - U-turn
    - Yawn


    Conclusion

    Anyway, this is the team and I'm pretty proud of it. For the most part I guess the kick to Blastoise was the surprise factor, but even after the Specs set was revealed, it was still able to break down a good chunk of the foe's team, and probably my favorite wallbreaking set to ever use on a Pokemon. All in all, I do feel this team could be better, and you're free to give me your rates and opinions for ways to improve it, though I can't guarantee I'll apply them. The main reason for me posting this was to just "retire" this team in a sense, and share it with you guys. I had a lot of fun using it, and you're free to do whatever the heck ya want with it now, lol. Thank you for reading all this! Enjoi​
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2013
  2. Nightmare Vampire

    Nightmare Vampire

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2012
    Messages:
    102
    Hey Brobat, nice team you got there. A good team and some huge amounts of fun with the surprise factor running rampant throughout the team (i.e. Specstoise, Yawn on Darm, Work Up Virizion). I have to commemorate you for Specstoise and Work Up Virizion (love them both). Onto the rate...

    This team looks great at threatening many leads with Specstoise and then threatening late game with STAB Hydro Pumps in Torrent range, however most boosting sweepers can take advantage of switches and then be able to overpowered your team. I do see your reasoning behind Toxic on Swampert, but with Roar, you can still phaze it out and phaze out other sweepers trying to set up on your Hombreon or Wheaties.

    Suggested changes:
    Roar > Toxic on Wheaties (Swampert)

    Besides the above, I believe this team is a very solid one and I love it a lot. Liked and have fun trying Tangrowth in UU, :)
  3. Patrick1088

    Patrick1088

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2013
    Messages:
    526
    Hey brobat! I like the team! Just a few points...
    1. Specs blastoise is def a threat. So kudos! Rapid spin is kinda meh. I ran trickspecz starmie on ou for a while and i get it, its multi functional and hazards stink but its just a bit of a momentum killer.
    2. Umbreon is well umbreon.
    3. Def run roar over toxic on swampy. Cm raikou is a bit of a pain for this team and the need to phaze is necessary. Also crobat/swampy core handle scarf shao very well so i wouldnt worry about shao as much. You just have to watch out for hjk for swampy and se on crobat.
    4. Workup virizion is okay its just hp rock is so low power as you stated. If youre facing off against sp def zapdos then its pretty moot. I think sd virizion can open more holes and can immediately threaten all walls, physical and special after 1 boost.
    5. I LOVE yawn on darm. Im def going to try it!
    Overall good team! I think you may want to consider a grounded poison type like nidoqueen which can also setup sr since blastoise hates t spikes as does virizion and darm. You may want to try lum berry over lo if you go for sd virizion also.
  4. CoolStoryBrobat

    CoolStoryBrobat The hero Smogon needs, but not the one it deserves
    is a Battle Server Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2012
    Messages:
    712
    Thanks for the rate, Nightmare Vampire. I appreciate it. And as useful as Roar is, I honestly feel I need Toxic to deal with some boosting sweepers. Most of the time I can manage to keep some at bay with Darmanitan/Crobat by being able to threaten them out as they set up, for the most part...And like I said, CM Slowbro literally can shut down this team, even if it's only at +1. While Swampert can Roar it out, it runs the risk of being burnt should it run Scald, or even worse, outright 2HKO'd and almost unable to reliably switch in. Virizion's Giga Drain can't really nail Slowbro anymore, and it can switch out and come back later to just set up thanks to Regenerator's healing. Really, the only boosting sweeper I'd worry about who isn't crumbled by sheer offensive pressure is probably going to be Bisharp, and that's if he's behind a Sub by the time Swampert comes in. THAT, I can understand, but Bisharp can still be played around and shut down. But once again, I do appreciate your input, man.


    Thanks for giving me a rate, Patrick1088. Yeah, I do agree you can't kill momentum any harder than a choice-locked Rapid Spin, but I sometimes use it as a last-ditch move to save myself, preferably after the hazard setter's been gone. 2 SR weaknesses and 5 Grounded Pokemon (And none able to absorb Toxic Spikes) really can take its toll, which is what eventually made me pull HP Grass. I hardly used HP Grass anyway, even against bulky waters most of the time other than Swampert, who is still taking a huge ton from Hydro Pump/Full HP Water Spout.

    As for Roar > Toxic, I kinda explained it in my response to Nightmare Vampire...CM Raikou itself isn't able to break Swampert, and will usually die or at least be weakened enough to be killed by something else, even if it manages to get past Swampert. And yeah, the core does handle Scarf Mienshao, but it really boils down 100% to predicting and being healthy enough to take its assaults repeatedly over and over. Otherwise, it can break through and be nigh-unstoppable lategame.

    Yeah, SD Virizion is more potent, but I kinda wanted to keep a balance between physical and special attackers, not just for this team but just kinda something I do in general. Work Up Virizion also is a good way to fool peeps at times, which isn't totally dismissable. If it is at +1 though, with SR up, Chandelure/Zapdos/etc. aren't gonna want to afford switching in.

    And lol, do try Yawn on Darmanitan, I swear it's worth it, lol. Really, I have considered Nidoqueen several times when looking at this team. The only thing that literally stopped me was the fact she just adds another Psychic weakness onto Crobat and Virizion. Umbreon, being the only resist, could be picked off by a boosted coverage move from something such as NP/SD Mew, or even CM Slowbro, since nothing as is would stop it from setting up. But once again dude, I do appreciate the fact you took time to rate this. Many thanks!
  5. Iminyourcloset

    Iminyourcloset OBJECTION! What do you mean I have a weakness now?!
    is a Battle Server Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2010
    Messages:
    185
    Hey Brobat. Lovely team you've got here,
    However-
    ~~~~~~~~~~~WHEARE IZ DAH FAB????????!!one??
    srsly whear
    To be completely honest,
    I really think Virizion would lovelovelovelovelovelove Lum Berry instead of LO. Virizi is prone to status, and a Lum berry can be a nice back up. I'm not sure what KOs you net with LO anyway, at the cost of having to take SR damage + possible spikes damage AND LO damage.

    I second NV's suggestion of
    Roar > Toxic. Any poke tox'd means that Umbreon's Synchronize is useless plus Yawn on Darm isn't going to be as effective.
    However, if you wish to keep Toxic, or even if you don't; I'm
    REAAAAAAAAAAAAAALLY iffy on Yawn on Darm.
    It's just that you're using a status move on a choice-locked pokemon. I get how it works, it's just that I don't think it's that effective. Maybe you should check out LO for it??? (I know that leaves you scarfless, but Darm doesn't outspeed Scarfshao/Gon/Tini/Kou/Zelf/dos/dile anyway.)

    Hope I helped SlowBrobat ;)

    (call me xoxo)
    Laga likes this.
  6. Lovelace

    Lovelace

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2013
    Messages:
    110
    Really well built team Brobat, nothing stands out as immediately so threatening but you have really great synergy and balance. If only it had a better player behind it (JK lol). But based on your live coms and the couple of matches I was able to play against you that you actually play the team very well and also that it's very suited to your playstyle and personality, which is something not really talked about a lot. Also, Specs Blastoise is actually legit.

    Anyways on to the feedback. First of all I really really have to second Lum SD over Work Up. Work Up is very fun to use but there's not much it can do that SD can't, aside from maybe being able to break through Gligar and Sableye a bit better. Giga Drain and HP have such low BP, especially when you're only giving yourself +1 not +2. The times when you miss Stone Edge are frustrating as hell (and I know you have awful luck) but I think that even for you those times will be less frequent than when you fail to kill thanks to being so weak. Being partially specially based helps you a lot against burns such as the aforementioned Sableye but Lum can do that too as well having a lot of utility against Sleep or T-Wave which are equally crippling (I think of situations like Venomoth setting up or Whimsicott firing off Prankster T Waves). Finally, LO really does a great disservice to Virizion's great bulk and typing. It can tank tonnes of hits on the special side and thanks to its fantastic typing can actually wall a lot of physical threats like Rhyperior, Aerodactyl, Sharpedo, Krookodile, etc. etc.

    I actually made a team inspired by this team and in addition to the above change I swapped Darmanitan for Scarf Chandelure and Swampert for Rhyperior. Rhyperior allows you a nice flying resist as well as a switch in to Snorlax and tanks those big powerful fire hits much better than Swampert. This does leave you a little weaker to fighting which is where Chandelure comes in. It does require more prediction and is a lot riskier but a problem I find with Swampert in this team, and Swampert in general that it gets worn down really damn easily. In fact Chandelure does a lot of work even when I don't switch it in at all (I actually almost never switch it in to predicted fighting moves). People on the ladder love to try to nail him with Stone Edges and I often switch Rhyperior into fighting types because of this (he's bulky enough to take a hit and switch out anyways). Even from something weak like unboosted Jolly Close Combats from Cobalion it's still taking over 30%. I don't think this is necessary better than Pert and Darm but it's something you could try and something that I've found works.
  7. CoolStoryBrobat

    CoolStoryBrobat The hero Smogon needs, but not the one it deserves
    is a Battle Server Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2012
    Messages:
    712
    Lol, thanks for the FAB rate, Closet. You know, I have had some issues with Virizion's bulk being compromised by Life Orb, which kinda got annoying factoring in SR (Even if it does resist it and I have a spinner) and the occasional Spikes. Definitely wanting to try this, as having to go to Umbreon just to cure status was a total momentum-killing move in itself. However, I'm still gonna stand by Toxic > Roar on Swampert. I haven't had too many issues with setup sweepers (Even if this does make me more Bisharp-prone) who couldn't get cut short by Toxic or hammered by Swampert's STABs. In fact, I usually am throwing Swampert at some setup sweepers just to pHaze them out and thus take some extra damage only for them to come back later and finish the job. Sometimes I want 'em to be done, ya know?

    And lol yeah, Yawn on Darmanitan looks questionable from 100% of the outside, even to myself, not gonna disagree with you. I literally just use it as a panic button against any sweepers relying on Sucker punch, like Honchkrow and SD Mew. I've had myself get swept too many times when it wasn't available. And LO Darm...too slow for this team's needs. A solid revenge killer is a staple for this team, as I'm sure you could see I've got issues with stuff like Scarf Heracross, Weavile, etc. Even though Darm doesn't beat MOST other scarfers, it's more important it beats everything else not carrying one. Ya know? Once again, thanks for the rate!


    Thanks for the rate dude, one of the most solid team rates I've gotten thus far. Definitely gonna try Lum SD Virizion out, for reasons mentioned above in reply to Closet. Scarf Chandelure is a Pokemon I've had some mixed bundles of success with, and I can't guarantee if I'd want to try it over Darm (due to losing to scarf Hera as well, and Fire Blast's miss chance) but it is something I can test for a while. However Chandy would at least make Scarf Mienshao have second thoughts before attempting a sweep, something I'm not totally objectionable about. Rhyperior is a pretty dope option, too. Literally the only reason I didn't choose Rhyperior was because of the Fighting weakness and the inability to stop Bisharp by itself (Also CM Slowbro ugh). In fact what I kind of hate is that Bisharp would actually become even more threatening if I chose both of these Pokemon, but not losing to Honchkrow/Crobat is just as big an issue, imo. But these are definitely replacements worth consideration, and maybe I'll find new ways to circumvent those as well. So thank you also for rating this team!
    Lovelace likes this.
  8. biscuitz

    biscuitz

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2013
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    Quick question: how does your team deal with DD-Kingdra? Surely it can come in on swampert after swampy's netted a KO and start boosting with ease? I mean, even if you spam EQ, you've only got a 1.9% chance of getting a 2HKO, and it laughs at toxic with its almighty lum berry of awesomeness. Fair enough, you could switch to Darm as it dances about and still outspeed it, but then what? You can't kill it before it kills you and it canny fall asleep cos of dat lum berry. Not saying it's a bad team or anything (actually I think it's purty fancy), just wanted to know what you'd do in that scenario. Thx
  9. CoolStoryBrobat

    CoolStoryBrobat The hero Smogon needs, but not the one it deserves
    is a Battle Server Moderator

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    712
    Normally I get Umbreon in and go for a Foul Play as I can tank a +1 Outrage if I'm healthy. If he sets up to +2, he's taking a severe chunk from it. But basically, Umbreon's my #1 Kingdra switch-in due to the potential special set it could also be running. Not saying it absolutely beats Kingdra, but most of the time it wears Kingdra down enough that if the opponent doesn't gamble on confusion and switches that it can be dealt with later. Still a huge threat imo, but to be fair Kingdra does threaten...most teams in general that lack an Empoleon or Ferroseed
  10. Grey Knight

    Grey Knight

    Joined:
    May 25, 2013
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    I honestly believe that superpower should be on darm, i mean it hits so many pokemon for natural damage,including kingdra, the fact that a lum berry +1/+1 outrage kingdra destroys your team after umbreon or swampy falls bellow 50% should be more than enough reason for you to run SP on darm,
  11. Ash Borer

    Ash Borer Sun Worshiper
    is a Pre-Contributor

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    Jul 26, 2007
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    I've been running crobat on practically every team of mine, its resistances check such an important part of the tier, its speed with good power make it a great revenge killer, and late game lifeline.

    I notice that you are disappointed with his survivability. I used that exact set you use for a long time, but decided to test out flying gem acrobatics and I've been very pleased with it. The initial attack is considerably stronger than brave bird, and can hit a typical switch in very hard, or can be conserved for later in game for a revenge kill. After that, the subsequent attacks are nearly as strong, but lack recoil. Despite lacking black sludge recovery, survivability is still high with roost, and, overall health depletes more slowly I've found.

    The utility of a stronger first attack, and better survivability is a superior option, in my opinion.
  12. casey90

    casey90

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2009
    Messages:
    125
    Hey Brobat, kudos to the team and your success! I love the originality in your blastoise set!

    However looking at the team, I'm curious how you deal with togekiss? as of right now you have nothing that really threatens the specially defensive mono attacker, either heal bell or thunder wave variants can destroy your team almost singlehandedly. the only attacker immediately threatening to it is Darm, but between SR damage, FB recoil and the fact that blitz only manages 75-88% even if kiss stays in, it can use the more passive nature of your team to come in consistently come in and threaten a sweep.

    I'm not particularly good at rating just posing the question.

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