Glaceon (GP 2/2)

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by Banedon, Oct 22, 2011.

  1. Banedon

    Banedon

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    Oh, mountain of ice.

    http://www.smogon.com/bw/pokemon/glaceon

    [Overview]

    <p>Ice, ice, and more ice – this should be your first thought when looking at Glaceon. Wielding one of the tier's highest Special Attack stats as well as a perfectly accurate move with 180 Base Power after STAB, Glaceon spams Blizzard in hail like no other, 2HKOing many common Ice-type resists after Stealth Rock! It is also bulky enough to survive most neutral STAB attacks, and is less vulnerable to Stealth Rock than other Ice-types thanks to Ice Body.</p>

    <p>Unfortunately for Glaceon, a weapon with this much destructive force is bound to have its drawbacks. Glaceon is painfully slow for an offensive Pokemon; it fails to outspeed several common threats in the tier even with a Choice Scarf. While Ice is an excellent offensive typing, it leaves much to be desired defensively. This is compounded by the fact that Glaceon needs Abomasnow, another Ice-type, to be effective. The defensive deficiencies that result are not easy to cover.</p>

    <p>Nonetheless, a Glaceon in hail is still one of the tier's strongest offensive Pokemon. It may not have the second STAB that Rotom-F does, and it does not get Trick or Volt Switch or Levitate, but if you're looking for sheer Blizzard-spamming power, Glaceon is second to none.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Choice Scarf
    move 1: Blizzard
    move 2: Shadow Ball / Baton Pass
    move 3: Ice Beam / Baton Pass
    move 4: Hidden Power Electric / Hidden Power Ground
    item: Choice Scarf
    nature: Timid
    ability: Ice Body / Snow Cloak
    evs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>The simplest way to make a slow, offensive powerhouse like Glaceon a viable sweeper is to put a Choice Scarf on it. With maximum investment and a Choice Scarf, Glaceon hits 373 Speed, outspeeding Alakazam and other base 120 Speed Pokemon. Blizzard is the obvious attacking move of choice and can 2HKO bulky Froslass as well as offensive Darmanitan and Arcanine with Stealth Rock support. Unless they are holding Choice Scarfs of their own, Glaceon will outspeed them as well. Because Blizzard is so powerful, the rest of the moves are mostly filler. Shadow Ball hits Psychic- and Ghost-type Pokemon super effectively, but a singly resisted Blizzard still hits harder than a neutral Shadow Ball, and a neutral Blizzard is more powerful than a super effective Shadow Ball. Shadow Ball should therefore only be used against Pokemon that resist Ice-type moves and are weak to Ghost-type attacks, such as Slowbro, Froslass, Chandelure, and Victini. It is worth noting, however, that Froslass, Chandelure and, Victini are all 2HKOed by Blizzard after Stealth Rock damage, and Blizzard never misses Froslass in hail, either.</p>

    <p> Of the remaining two moves, Ice Beam is available for use outside of hail and has more PP as well; with Hippowdon in the tier, it might be wise to have a backup STAB attack to use. It also allows Glaceon to function as a lead, hitting hard right from the get-go. The choice of Hidden Power depends on what you want Glaceon to cover. Hidden Power Electric targets Empoleon as well as bulky Water-types that resist Ice, while Hidden Power Ground hits Steel-types such as Registeel and Cobalion while maintaining coverage on Fire-types. Finally, Baton Pass can replace an attack, allowing Glaceon to scout its counters while forcing them to take hazard damage. Nonetheless, since Glaceon's offensive power is so immense, it is often better to fire away with Blizzard and risk the counter switching in, especially if the counter cannot recover its own health.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EVs on this set are self-explanatory, except for one thing: be careful not to put the leftover 4 EVs into HP, as it increases the damage Glaceon takes from Stealth Rock. A Modest nature gives Glaceon more power, but unfortunately losing to Alakazam is a very big drawback and so not recommended. For abilities, Ice Body is usually the better choice. Its constant healing forces the opponent to respond aggressively instead of playing around with resistances, and also helps offset Stealth Rock damage. That said, sometimes a Snow Cloak miss may be the only way to salvage a losing game, so it’s not a bad option.</p>

    <p>It goes without saying that Glaceon must have Snow Warning support, which in UU means Abomasnow. This unfortunately mandates four shared weaknesses, namely to Fire-, Fighting-, Rock- and Steel-type attacks. Having Pokemon that can absorb these attacking types is vital. Slowbro can shrug off most Fighting- and Rock- moves, as well as Flare Blitz from the likes of Arcanine and Darmanitan. Nidoqueen resists Fighting- and Rock-type attacks, and can set up Stealth Rock to aid Glaceon's sweep. It also absorbs Toxic Spikes, an entry hazard that Glaceon is vulnerable to. Flash Fire Chandelure is another option, courtesy of its immunities to both Fire- and Fighting-type moves, although it introduces yet another weakness to Rock. Glaceon is vulnerable to Stealth Rock, so Rapid Spin support is appreciated. Cyrogonal can fire off Blizzards of its own while spinning away Stealth Rock, while Hitmontop is another worthy choice for its Rock-type resistance. Xatu also gets a mention, as it is the only Pokemon in UU that gets Magic Bounce and so stop Stealth Rock from going up in the first place.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Choice Specs
    move 1: Blizzard
    move 2: Ice Beam / Baton Pass
    move 3: Shadow Ball / Baton Pass
    move 4: Hidden Power Electric / Hidden Power Ground
    item: Choice Specs
    nature: Modest
    ability: Ice Body / Snow Cloak
    evs: 8 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 244 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>When you combine Glaceon’s formidable attacking stats with Choice Specs, you get a wallbreaking machine that hits so hard none bar the bulkiest of walls can stand in its way! Sure, Glaceon is too slow to sweep teams, but its armor-piercing Blizzards become so strong that even Ice-type resists have trouble taking its assaults. To put this into perspective, physically defensive Milotic, Thick Fat Snorlax, and even Eviolite Chansey are all forced to use their recovery moves if they switch into Glaceon with Stealth Rock down. Although Glaceon will still have to switch out, this means a teammate can enter the field unscathed.</p>

    <p>The moves for this set are the same as for the Choice Scarf set, albeit with a slightly decreased emphasis on Baton Pass. Since Glaceon's damage output is now so high, giving up a free turn to attack is less appealing. Nonetheless, Baton Pass may still be useful to wear down Pokemon such as Chansey, which would otherwise heal itself as Glaceon switches out. Similarly, the choice of Hidden Power is no longer for coverage when revenge killing sweepers, but to smash through walls. If your team has difficulties with Empoleon, Suicune, and other bulky Waters, consider Hidden Power Electric. If Registeel is more troubling, choose Hidden Power Ground.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EVs on this spread grant Glaceon maximum power while maintaining enough speed to outpace uninvested base 95s such as defensive Arcanine and Roserade. A Timid nature to outspeed uninvested base 100s like Zapdos and Mew is possible, but the power loss is quite significant. As mentioned before, Ice Body is the preferred ability, but Glaceon will usually not be able to stay in for long. Therefore, depending on your playstyle and risk appetite, Snow Cloak might be preferable.</p>

    <p>Once again, Glaceon absolutely must have Snow Warning support, and once again in UU that requires Abomasnow as a teammate. This also means Slowbro, Chandelure, Nidoqueen, Hitmontop, and Xatu are still excellent partners for Glaceon. Because this Glaceon is meant to punch holes in the other team, a fast teammate that can take advantage of any openings is a good idea. If the opponent's Ice resists have all been severely weakened, a Choice Scarf Rotom-F for example can easily Blizzard its way to victory. Other fast attackers such as Jolteon, Choice Scarf Heracross, and Alakazam can also take advantage of weakened walls to sweep.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Glaceon can act as a defensive pivot with Heal Bell and Wish, but it is slow and does not have a high base HP. Furthermore, a defensive Ice-type brings little to the team in terms of resistances. Glaceon can run a set similar to Stallrein with Substitute, Protect and Ice Body, but Walrein will usually pull that off better thanks to its Water typing. Heal Bell is also illegal with Ice Body. A Substitute set is possible along with a boosting item such as Life Orb, but Glaceon's attacks are usually so set in stone (read: use Blizzard) that Substitute is not overly helpful. Trick Room support goes a long way to fixing Glaceon's low Speed and can make Glaceon a dangerous sweeper, but should only be used in a full Trick Room team. Finally, Glaceon can use Fake Tears to lower its opponent's Special Defense, which can help it muscle its way past Pokemon such as Suicune and Chansey. However, most bulky Water-types can be dealt with by Abomasnow, and much of the time Glaceon is simply better off attacking.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Glaceon hits hard, but there are still Pokemon that can weather its assaults. Milotic, Suicune, Chansey, Thick Fat Snorlax, Empoleon, and Registeel can all take a few hits if necessary. However, with hail negating Leftovers recovery, all these would-be counters must be careful about being worn down. Many of them are unable to seriously hurt Glaceon either, especially when Ice Body healing is factored in. Still, Thunder Wave will ruin the Choice Scarf set, while Toxic will eventually kill Glaceon.</p>

    <p>As a grounded Ice-type Pokemon, Glaceon is fully vulnerable to all entry hazards. Toxic Spikes will wear Glaceon down rapidly, while Stealth Rock will limit the number of times Glaceon can switch in. One can also check Glaceon is by outspeeding it. Choice Scarf Glaceon is not especially fast, outspeeding only base 120s. This means Pokemon such as Weavile and Jolteon, as well as many Choice Scarf users, can revenge kill Glaceon. Be warned though: Glaceon is quite bulky, and without a fairly powerful super effective attack, a full health Glaceon is not likely to be OHKOed. Nonetheless, Pokemon such as Aerodactyl and Choice Scarf Heracross can easily finish Glaceon off in one hit.</p>

    <p>Glaceon can also be checked, ironically, via its biggest weapon. While Blizzard is very much the perfect attack in hail, it does only have 8 PP. This makes it especially vulnerable to Pressure stalling. There are a few Pressure Pokemon that can take a few hits, eating up precious PP in the process. Deoxys-D, Suicune, and Spiritomb fall into this category. Although Glaceon can muscle its way past Deoxys-D and Spiritomb eventually, it gets only four chances to land a critical hit or freeze. If that doesn't happen, Glaceon exhausts all its Blizzard ammunition, and is is far less threatening as a result.</p>

    <p>Finally, if you can change the weather, Glaceon sheds a tear. Glaceon outside of hail isn't harmless—Blizzard still has a 70% chance to hit, and Ice Beam is still dangerous—but it loses Ice Body recovery, and since it can't use Blizzard reliably, it becomes much easier to handle.</p>

    Show Hide
    [Overview]
    - Massive base SpA, tying Kyurem, making Glaceon one of the best Blizzard spammers in the tier
    - Pure Ice typing is both a curse and a boon. Ice is a great offensive type and STAB Blizzard buries almost everything, but its four weaknesses, forcibly shared with Abomasnow, causes defensive fragility
    - Closely competes with Rotom-F. Has a few advantages though: most important is Ice Body, which forces the opponent to do something instead of switch between resistances. Also makes Glaceon a more durable sweeper, as it can afford to switch into SR more often than Rotom-F can. Glaceon also gets Ice Beam for use outside of hail
    - Unfortunately, pretty damn slow, but it's quite bulky and can survive most neutral STAB attacks

    [SET]
    name: Choice Scarf
    move 1: BLIZZARD (capitalized for effectivenes)
    move 2: Ice Beam / Baton Pass
    move 3: Shadow Ball / Baton Pass
    move 4: Hidden Power Electric / Hidden Power Ground
    item: Choice Scarf
    nature: Timid
    ability: Ice Body / Snow Cloak
    evs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe / 4 SpD

    [Set Comments]
    - Outruns Alakazam and other base 120s with Choice Scarf
    - Blizzard does big damage; with SR it can 2HKO Darmanitan, Chandelure and Arcanine while outspeeding them all
    - Ice Beam for use outside of hail, as well as more PP. Baton Pass for scouting
    - Shadow Ball for coverage. Nonetheless a singly resisted Blizzard still does more than a neutral Shadow Ball, and a neutral Blizzard does more than a super-effective Shadow Ball, so this is only better against Pokemon weak to it + resist Ice i.e. Froslass, Slowbro, Victini and Chandelure. With SR however it's possible to 2HKO bulky Froslass, offensive Chandelure and offensive Victini with Blizzard, and you will never miss the former
    - HP Electric specifically targets Empoleon, while also hitting other Pokemon like Suicune and Milotic super-effectively. HP Ground can be used instead to hit steel types (Registeel and Cobalion spring to mind) as well as Fire types

    [Additional Comments]
    - No choice but to run Timid, because losing to Alakazam is a serious drawback.
    - Still outsped by base 125s (that's Weavile), but it can't OHKO with Low Kick / Brick Break and you 2HKO with Blizzard. Base 130s all die in the same way bar Aerodactyl, who can KO first.
    - Ice Body is usually the better ability, but there may be times where a Snow Cloak miss is the only way to salvage a losing game
    - Obviously don't put the excess 4 EVs into HP because of Stealth Rock
    - Must have Abomasnow support
    - A decently good wallbreaker, especially with hail helping neuter Leftovers recovery, but if you need more there is always ...

    [SET]
    name: Biggest gun in UU history
    move 1: BLIZZARD !!! (now with a few more exclamation marks!)
    move 2: Ice Beam / Baton Pass
    move 3: Shadow Ball / Baton Pass
    move 4: Hidden Power Electric / Hidden Power Ground
    item: Choice Specs
    nature: Modest
    ability: Ice Body / Snow Cloak
    evs: 252 SpA / 244 Spe / 8 HP / 4 SpD

    [Set Comments]
    - Hands up kiddies. Who wants to die?
    - Glaceon's armour-piercing bazooka deals 33.8% - 39.8% to 252/0 Milotic, 29.4% - 34.7% to 252/0 +1 Chansey, and 28.6% - 33.8% to 252/0 Thick Fat Snorlax, more than enough to put all three into the danger zone with Stealth Rock. Does anyone else care to wall Glaceon?
    - What, Slowbro's not happy? Well eat this, you stupid snail-without-a-hat: 49.2% - 57.9% to 252/0 Slowbro

    [Additional Comments]
    - You know Abomasnow is a bad Pokemon when he makes it hail, but can't summon a fraction of the power that Glaceon can. Like seriously. All that ice flying around but no hax0rz damage like Glaceon? What?
    - Glaceon likes it when it's that cold though
    - 244 Spe outspeeds min speed Arcanine, Xatu and other base 95s, rest split between defensive stats

    [Other Options]
    - Walrein set with Substitute + Protect, but (without having used it) Walrein does it better thanks to Water-typing
    - Wish, but low HP, and Glaceon's really slow
    - Heal Bell
    - Fake Tears

    [Checks and Counters]
    - Nobody can wall Glaceon and its armour-piercing gun
    - Except those buggers with bulletproof vests aka. Milotic, Chansey, Snorlax, Empoleon, Registeel, etc
    - Glaceon's a cute little girl so don't put her under Pressure. That's right, I mean you! Spiritomb, Suicune, Weavile, Raikou, Deoxys-D, etc can all gtfo and stop ruining Blizzard's PP.
    - Toxic Spikes, Stealth Rock
    - If you can replace the weather with something else, Glaceon sheds a tear *sniffle*
  2. Heysup

    Heysup CANadian not a CANTnadian
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    Approved great mon.
  3. breh

    breh
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    don't run max speed on specs. this thing has nice bulk; invest either enough to outspeed machamp/golurk with max or just max HP.

    shadow ball is for chandelure and nothing else. make note of this.
  4. Heysup

    Heysup CANadian not a CANTnadian
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    Froslass and Slowbro too.
  5. Banedon

    Banedon

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    Good point about the speed. I didn't look at the UU speed tiers when I made those spreads. Checking it now gives:

    So Scarf set has no choice but to run 252 speed EVs with Timid nature. As for Specs:

    Crawdaunt is quite uncommon, so Glaceon can probably afford to lose the speed tie, but Arcanine, Xatu, Empoleon, Roserade, Deoxys-D, etc are all important Pokemon. I don't feel comfortable dropping below 227 speed for the base 95s.

    Noted about Shadow Ball. I'll mention though that Blizzard in hail never misses, even against Snow Cloak Froslass :)

    EDIT: Wait, need confirmation about that last part. I know I've yet to miss Blizzard against Froslass, but it could be simply because I've been lucky. I'll check on a mechanics thread somewhere ...
    EDIT #2: Says on Bulbapedia that Blizzard never misses in hail, so I'm assuming it ignores Snow Cloak. In that case, bulky Froslass is 2HKOed with SR by Scarf Blizzard and 2HKOed without SR by Specs Blizzard. It might be worth attacking with Blizzard to avoid the miss + parahax. I'll make a note of it.
  6. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming The truth is in my hands
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    The first two sets have way too many slashes.
    I suggest giving Baton Pass slash its own slot and slashing Shadow Ball and Ice Beam together (the order is entirely up to you)

    That said though

    WINTER FURY (2/3)
  7. Snunch

    Snunch
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  8. risenreturn

    risenreturn

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    How about a more Hail-Stall role? Basically the same as stallrein, but at the loss of HP and Super Fang, it gets more Defense investment and a much higher special attack, which can make it a very good alternate to walrein, and in certain situations, do better than it. In addition to not having a water typing that adds a weakness to Electric and Grass over any large noticeable advantage

    EDIT: nevermind, didn't see that you had already mentioned it
  9. Banedon

    Banedon

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    Lol didn't notice the YouTube link.

    I've found Baton Pass rather weak. The point is that if you predict your opponent's switch to a counter, you attack with one of your coverage moves OR you just keep spamming Blizzard. There are still a few Pokemon for which you're better attacking with Baton Pass: Snorlax (with Rest), Suicune (with Rest), etc, but since Glaceon's such a big gun, once you have it in, you usually start spraying bullets like crazy. So I'm not convinced that Baton Pass deserves its own slash. It can replace one of the other moves, though.

    Maybe Fake Tears deserves a bigger mention. Most teams have at most two Pokemon that can take Glaceon's Blizzard, and most of the time they don't have reliable recovery. If Glaceon can hit Milotic (say) with Fake Tears and force it to switch out, then it can not only wear down the rest of the other team, it can force Milotic to take entry hazard damage next time it comes in. There're a few victims out there that can't do much to Glaceon either. Milotic is one, non-CM Suicune is another.

    Some calcs:

    252 SpA Modest Glaceon Blizzard vs. 252/0 -2 Suicune: 47.3% - 55.7% (beware Pressure)
    252 SpA Modest Glaceon Blizzard vs. 252/252+ -2 Empoleon: 20.4% - 24.2%
    252 SpA Modest Glaceon Blizzard vs. 252/0 -1 Chansey: 44% - 52% (did I do this calc right? That's a LOT of damage)
    252 SpA Modest Glaceon Blizzard vs. 252/0 -2 Thick Fat Snorlax: 38% - 44.8%
    252 SpA Modest Glaceon Blizzard vs. 252/252+ -2 Registeel: 31.9% - 37.6%
    252 SpA Modest Glaceon Blizzard vs. 252/0 -2 Slowbro: 65.5% - 77.4%

    If they have to switch out, then someone else has to tank that Blizzard and that's not easy.

    Preliminarily, I'd make the set look something like this:

    [SET]
    name: Fake Tears
    move 1: BLIZZARD ('doh)
    move 2: Wish (maybe, but with Leftovers and Ice Body together now it might not be needed)
    move 3: Fake Tears
    move 4: Hidden Power Electric / Hidden Power Ground / Ice Beam
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Modest
    ability: Ice Body
    evs: 252 SpA / 244 Spe / 4 SpD / 8 HP

    I think it has potential. Will test and see.
  10. SuperJOCKE

    SuperJOCKE Lowtier Warrior!
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    The Chansey calc is correct. Otherwise we both did it wrong.
  11. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming The truth is in my hands
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    While you have a point, the moves that are slashed alongside Baton Pass are literally useless almost 90% of the time. Ice Beam has more pp but what is Shadow Ball hitting really? Chandelure is the only target I can think of. In fact, locking yourself into Shadow Ball is actually a bad idea since it makes you set up fodder for most of the metagame (Bisharp, Krook etc) Baton Pass is actually very useful on Glaceon because dry passing (when hazards are up especially) is awesome.

    In hindsight I think Baton Pass should actually replace Shadow Ball on the 3rd slot and you should slash Shadow Ball alongside Ice Beam.
  12. breh

    breh
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    the chansey calc is incorrect. use metal powder or soul dew or whatever and give it -2 def. eviolite + -2 SpD != -1 SpD; it is the same as about 1.33x damage (2/1.5).
  13. Guyguypants

    Guyguypants

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    So you just give Glaceon a +2 Sp.A, and let Chansey keep his +1 Sp.Def, which gives 39.2% - 46.2%.

    Which is pretty much a 2HK0 after Hail damage and Stealth Rock, no?
  14. pie cream

    pie cream

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    Maybe a offensive sub set could work? sub / blizzerd / shadow ball / hidden power electric with life orb could work since with ice body you regain the health lost by life orb but wish support is still helpful to it.

    edit: I know sub is mention in oo but that only mentions a stall type one when this one is offensive. But aleast mention it can go offensive with sub too.
  15. Banedon

    Banedon

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    Shadow Ball targets: Chandelure, Froslass, Victini and Slowbro. Dry passing is nice, but Glaceon is vulnerable to hazards too so it can't afford to scout that much. I'm especially doubtful about Baton Pass on the Specs set, because aside from things like wearing Chansey down with dry passing you're usually better off attacking. QC input?

    And yeah the Chansey calc is incorrect, but Chansey still takes a huge amount from Modest Blizzard after Fake Tears. The Sub + LO set might work too. I have to test both, but for now I have to make a hail team that needs a powerful wallbreaker.

    I wrote up most of the analysis, with some OO stuff still to figure out.
  16. Pocket

    Pocket Nyanko Sensei >:3
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    ^ pie cream's Sub Glaceon would really work great in conjunction with Fake Tears. Banedon, have you tried Sub + Fake Tears Glaceon? I feel like it does a better job at forcing switches and racking entry hazard damages. Substitute synergizes particularly well with either of Glaceon's abilities.
  17. Banedon

    Banedon

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    [SET]
    name: Fake Tears
    move 1: BLIZZARD ('doh)
    move 2: Subsitute / Wish
    move 3: Fake Tears
    move 4: Hidden Power Electric / Hidden Power Ground / Ice Beam
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Modest
    ability: Ice Body
    evs: 252 SpA / 204 Spe / 4 SpD / 48 HP

    This maybe? I was trying to make an EV spread that will allow Glaceon's Subsitute to not be broken by bulky Water Scalds, but that's not possible with 252 EVs unless (actually even if, in the case of Milotic) Glaceon uses a +SpD nature. As it is, I have 204 Spe EVs here to outpace min speed Deoxys-D and Roserade. As for Life Orb, I'm doubtful; Glaceon will die fast with Subsitute + Life Orb even with Ice Body recovery.

    I will test Fake Tears sometime, I just haven't done it yet. The only real problem I see with this set before testing is that covering bulky Waters is Abomasnow's job ... I guess Glaceon could use HP Ground instead, but since all the Steel and Fire types in the tier don't have reliable recovery in hail, they will all die eventually. Furthermore, the offensive Fire types are already 2HKOed with SR by Scarf Glaceon, so what is this Glaceon's niche?
  18. Pocket

    Pocket Nyanko Sensei >:3
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    Well, Glaceon can break through the conventional special walls / ice resists through Fake Tears. Substitute just offers extra protection / eases prediction. If you pair it up with Snow Cloak, it can be almost SubChomp-esque. Probably works well with Toxic Spikes.
  19. Banedon

    Banedon

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    See the problem is that Glaceon is bound to have Abomasnow as a teammate. Quickly, name some special walls / Ice resists that Fake Tears + Sub Glaceon can beat but Abomasnow and Scarf Glaceon can't. We assume Glaceon gets a Sub up as the opponent goes to said Pokemon. Let's go down the list of Pokemon that resist Ice ...

    Arcanine - offensive Arcanine is 2HKOed by Scarf Glaceon after Stealth Rock. Defensive Arcanine Glaceon cannot beat. At best you get off a HP Ground as it breaks your Sub, which does not kill, and then switch out.
    Milotic - Fake Tears Glaceon can kill Milotic, but then so can Abomasnow.
    Frosslass - is 2HKOed by Scarf Glaceon after Stealth Rock. Fake Tears Glaceon will finish it off, but takes longer, and Spikes go up.
    Slowbro - I guess, if it has Fire Blast, Abomasnow cannot handle it. Neither does Scarf Glaceon KO without a predicted HP Electric. Advantage Fake Tears Glaceon.
    Cobalion - Glaceon needs to attack with HP Ground behind the Sub. Fake Tears achieves nothing here; if Glaceon uses Fake Tears as Cobalion breaks Sub then it'll die without achieving anything.
    Registeel - From the calc before, Glaceon does 31.9% - 37.6% to -2 Registeel. Takes 3 hits. Registeel will threaten Glaceon, so Glaceon cannot stack Fake Tears without getting paralyzed (although it can play mind games with Substitute. It's a stretch, but maybe.
    Houndoom - is 2HKOed by Scarf Glaceon, without SR. Fake Tears Glaceon needs HP Ground to kill it.
    Victini - is 2HKOed by Scarf Glaceon with SR. Fake Tears Glaceon needs HP Ground to kill it, but chances are Victini will U-turn.
    Bisharp - Like Cobalion. Better off Scarfed.

    We can see a trend here. There's very little Fake Tears Glaceon can do that Scarf Glaceon / Abomasnow can't. Scarf Glaceon will be better vs. offensive types, Abomasnow against most bulky waters. You could use Fake Tears to break down bulky Water-types, but you could equally switch to Abomasnow and put up Leech Seed. That leaves Fake Tears Glaceon with nothing but a few scraps, which sounds very much like OO material. For what it's worth, the remaining Ice resists are Rotom-H, Darmanitan, Suicune, Azumarill, Weavile, Empoleon, Chandelure
    Escavalier and Blastoise.

    I think I convinced myself (without testing) that Fake Tears should remain OO.
  20. Luxpluff91

    Luxpluff91

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    Glaceon cannot use Fake Tears on Registeel anyway thanks to Clear Body
  21. Pocket

    Pocket Nyanko Sensei >:3
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    Well, I was specifically thinking about Glaceon vs. Chansey situation.

    Scenario:
    1) Glaceon forces out something and use Fake Tears as Chansey switches in. Blizzard now does ~40%.
    2) Usually Chansey will try to Toxic - Glaceon can then set up Substitute to block it
    3) Glaceon can now hit Chansey twice with Blizzard before she can retaliate. With entry hazard damage and hail damage, Chansey wont be tanking 40% Blizzard easily.
    4) If it tries to Softboiled the damage, Glaceon can Fake Tears, again, forcing Chansey out. If the opponent lacks any other mon to take a Blizzard, then they would lose a mon.

    Again, this would work well with Toxic Spikes support. However, I do see your reasoning as to how Fake Tears Glaceon may be generally inferior to Scarf Glaceon.
  22. Rayquaza_

    Rayquaza_

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    A Trick Room set should be mentioned.
    Thanks to Ice Body and its decent defenses, Glaceon can afford running a LO set with a +Sp. Atk nature and HP investiment.
    I think it's one of, if not the best TR special sweeper in the UU tier.
  23. Banedon

    Banedon

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    Good point about Registeel - completely forgot about Clear Body there. Another strike against Glaceon. As for Chansey, true. I'll give it a mention, as I will Trick Room. It might be hard to fit in both TR and Abomasnow on a team, though, although Abomasnow is quite slow itself.

    This should be ready for copyediting within 15 minutes of my making this post!
  24. RitterCat

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  25. Oglemi

    Oglemi #bananarepublic
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    Stamping that check

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