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Gothorita Discussion

Discussion in 'BW NU' started by zbabyovr9000, Sep 17, 2012.

  1. zbabyovr9000

    zbabyovr9000

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2012
    Messages:
    17
    [​IMG]

    Gothorita
    Traits: Frisk / Shadow Tag
    60 / 45 / 70 / 75 / 85 / 55

    Compared to Gothitelle:
    -10 / -10 / -25 / -20 / -20 / -25 / -10

    At first glance, Gothorita seems like a terrible choice for a pokemon (even in NU). However, with Gothitelle banished to the BL, Wynaut just being bad (especially with encore nerf), Gothorita rises as the best user of Shadow Tag in the tier (arguably up to UU).

    Is Gothorita viable? I think it is, despite the significant drop in bulk and power and small drop in speed. I believe its best set is as follows:

    [​IMG]
    Gothorita @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Shadow Tag
    EVs: 252 Spa / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Psychic / Psyshock
    - Thunderbolt / Energy Ball / Dark Pulse
    - Shadow Ball / Energy Ball / Signal Beam
    - Hidden Power Ground / Hidden Power Fighting / Hidden Power Ice

    Gothorita's job should be to come in safely, either off a death or slow Volturn, sleeping pokemon, encore, whatever, and take out the pokemon. The best usage would be to take out the Alomomola / Amoonguss core with Psyschock and Thunderbolt, to take out any threat your team needs taken care of. (For example, HP Ground will make quick work of Bastiodon for Swellow).

    Each coverage move has its own merits, and basically any decent special attack is useful if it can take out something that threatens your team. Energy ball is great for Golem (with hazards support), Signal Beam for Exeggutor.

    As for other options, a Choice Scarf / Trick / CM set might seem viable, or an eviolite set, but I think that the lack of power hurts (as I thought with Gothitelle as well. The speed is not needed, the power is). Gothorita derives its usefulness from basically being able to say "I want that one gone", and going out and doing it. With 20 less Spa, 252+ and Specs are necessary to KO threats. Proving me wrong on this would be nice though :)

    Here is a calc to show Gothorita's effectiveness.

    Gothorita@Choice Specs (252 EVs, +Nature) Thunderbolt vs Alomomola (252/4 EVs, Neutral Nature): 82 ~ 96.6% (438 ~ 516 HP)

    It misses the OHKO, which is the huge downfall of Gothorita. However, A 2HKO is guaranteed and not bad, because the worst Alomomola can do is crit waterfall or Toxic. Gothorita can still KO pretty easily anyway since it isn't hard to bring Alomomola down to 82% health. Spam some physical attack as they switch in Alomomola to sponge it, then bring in Gothorita to KO.

    My calc wasn't really working for Amoonguss (it was saying Psyshock did less on special variants? although most Amoonguss are physically defensive), but I assure that Psychic and Psyshock will do a good chunk (once again not KOing, but depending on the set can OHKO). If someone could run some calcs that would be great (or recommend a good Gen 5 calc?).

    So what do you guys think? How viable is Gothorita? Are there other sets that are as effective as the Specs set?
  2. col49

    col49 what.
    is a Contributor to Smogon
    Mentor

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    Gothorita has actually been pretty neat for me so far :] While certainly not being as good as Gothitelle, Gothorita is still capable of trapping and KOing defensive 'mons, which makes it an excellent utility for offensive teams that have trouble getting around stuff like Regen cores. I've been running a simple Calm Mind set fairly effectively:

    Gothorita (F) @ Eviolite
    Trait: Shadow Tag
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SAtk
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Calm Mind
    - Psychic
    - Rest
    - Sleep Talk

    Not anything innovative, and relying on SleepTalk for recovery sucks, but it effectively gets rid of walls / Fighting-types pretty efficiently, and it can actually clean up if the opponent lacks a Dark-type to answer it. I dunno how effective a Specs set is when Gothirita's bulk w/out Eviolite bolstering it is mediocre at best, but I'm definitely not against testing it out and seeing how it does :)
  3. zbabyovr9000

    zbabyovr9000

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2012
    Messages:
    17
    I suppose it depends on who your want to take out whether or not you can you specs. I find Gothorita to have enough bulk to take Alomomola and Amoonguss's attacks, because they just don't hit very hard.


    The thing about Amoonguss is spore, which your set deals with well but not the specs one, because it misses that OHKO so annoyingly. So team support is necessary in the form of sap sipper (or I guess vital spirit Magmar could work...), or sleep fodder.

    This is very situational, but a Trick Scarf could cripple an eviolite pokemon (ie, Gurrdurr without payback) while bolstering Gothorita at the same time. Just a thought. I just don't know if Gothorita can take many hits from Gurdurr even with eviolite. I guess I have some play testing to do.

    Edit: Also, in the NU combinations thread they mention Diglett + Gothitelle. Your CM could pull this off as well, with even better bulk granted from Diglett's memento.
  4. kniteowl

    kniteowl

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2010
    Messages:
    342
    For Rest Talk Variants of Goth facing 1 on 1 with a Clear Smog Synthesis Amoonguss, it becomes a very long and dragged out stall battle between the the two but Goth should come out on top in the end unless you run out of pp on your moves before Amoongusss does.
  5. cuckoos

    cuckoos

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2009
    Messages:
    22
    I've actually been using Gothorita in RU to take the piss out of Sandslash users. The idea is to Trick your victim a Choice Scarf, CM up to +6 and Trick back the Scarf. I've gotten more than a few clueless wins over there, but I still think it would be viable against defensive/balanced teams here in NU.

    *Will post set later*

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