Gen 2 GSC OU Viability Ranking Thread V2

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Blissey from B- > C+

Blissey is a very potent special tank, however, it lacks something many other pokemon have, offensive pressure. I can understand blissey being OU as a last resort Zapdos/Kou counter, but Kou does a much better job as it isn’t a free switch in to half as many pokemon as Blissey. The only reason that i can see for blissey is Screen support, but screens aren’t as much of a threat as a thunder from Kou

TTar from A- > A

Tyranatar is a monster. It is a huge boon on stall teams, acting as a pursuiter for both ghost that block spin and starmie, FB + pursuit to wear down forry/cloy, and DP to scare away the Drumlaxes that show up and ruin your day. Tyranitar also Pairs well with Machamp, getting rid of starmie, egg, and zapdos, so Machamp can wreak havoc with Cross chop. Honestly though, Pursuit on TTar is one of the most scary things seen in GSC. Pursuit TTar with Fire Blast completely covers all common checks to LKDrumlax. Another tool that this Swiss Army knife of a pokemon gets is roar. Tyranitar with curse+roar+rs+rest is only hard-countered by suicune, and once that is out of the way tyranitar runs loose on the opposing team. With roar, Tyranitar can also pull off incredibly long roar chains, as tyranitar has the tools to usually scare 3-5 pokemon on the opposing team. Tyranitar only has a few problems, namely weakness to common moves such as EQ and Surf, most of the time not having enough space for rest so it gets worn down easily, and lack of physical dark STAB. hypothetically though, Physical crunch and pursuit would make this Godzilla-esque monster even more menacing, possibly even making it to S-rank.

(From my PP acc)
 
I support that Blissey drop. Never liked the blob. Almost entirely outclassed by Miltank as a heal beller (the only thing it has over Miltank is bulk) and almost entirely outclassed by Raikou (as well as zapdos and lax to a lesser extent) as a special wall.
The only thing that Blissey has is special bulk. It can't attack for the most part (the only attacking move you will see on it is either ice beam or flamethrower, and it doesn't do much, flamethrower can't even OHKO Scizor. Same goes for its ice beam on Dragonite. not like anyone uses those but that's the most they'll do to anything). It can't sponge physical hits too well (unboosted Snorlax double edge 2HKO's more likely than not, unboosted Machamp Cross Chop OHKO's more likely than not, unboosted Marowak w/ Thick Club eq will always 2 hit). It really only sponges special hits, and that's it (Zapdos's Thunder is a possible 7HKO)

Calcs
Blissey Flamethrower vs. Scizor: 268-316 (78.1 - 92.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Blissey Ice Beam vs. Dragonite: 231-272 (60 - 70.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Snorlax Double-Edge vs. Blissey: 352-414 (49.3 - 58%) -- 63.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Machamp Cross Chop vs. Blissey: 660-776 (92.5 - 108.8%) -- 53.8% chance to OHKO after Leftovers recovery
Thick Club Marowak Earthquake vs. Blissey: 478-562 (67 - 78.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Zapdos Thunder vs. Blissey: 123-145 (17.2 - 20.3%) -- possible 7HKO after Leftovers recovery
 

Zokuru

The Stall Lord
is a Tiering Contributor
I support that Blissey drop. Never liked the blob. Almost entirely outclassed by Miltank as a heal beller (the only thing it has over Miltank is bulk) and almost entirely outclassed by Raikou (as well as zapdos and lax to a lesser extent) as a special wall.
The only thing that Blissey has is special bulk. It can't attack for the most part (the only attacking move you will see on it is either ice beam or flamethrower, and it doesn't do much, flamethrower can't even OHKO Scizor. Same goes for its ice beam on Dragonite. not like anyone uses those but that's the most they'll do to anything). It can't sponge physical hits too well (unboosted Snorlax double edge 2HKO's more likely than not, unboosted Machamp Cross Chop OHKO's more likely than not, unboosted Marowak w/ Thick Club eq will always 2 hit). It really only sponges special hits, and that's it (Zapdos's Thunder is a possible 7HKO)

Calcs
Blissey Flamethrower vs. Scizor: 268-316 (78.1 - 92.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Blissey Ice Beam vs. Dragonite: 231-272 (60 - 70.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Snorlax Double-Edge vs. Blissey: 352-414 (49.3 - 58%) -- 63.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Machamp Cross Chop vs. Blissey: 660-776 (92.5 - 108.8%) -- 53.8% chance to OHKO after Leftovers recovery
Thick Club Marowak Earthquake vs. Blissey: 478-562 (67 - 78.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Zapdos Thunder vs. Blissey: 123-145 (17.2 - 20.3%) -- possible 7HKO after Leftovers recovery

Well, you're emphasing Bliss worst traits instead of make a more general post. That's true that Blissey is a worst Miltank and a worst Raikou in a lot of build, but that's also what it's good at. I mean, Raikou does Raikou things, and Miltank does Miltank things. Blissey does both does bar the Raikou Offensive presence ( Bliss has Sing and can Ice beam / FT opposing marowak / Forretress so it's not that easy to switch into ) and the fact that Blissey can't beat CurseLax reliably.

However, there's cerain build were that particular niche is super appreciated, an exemple can be DrumLax / ST Umbreon ( or ST Vaporeon ) / Blissey / Skarmory / Haze Dragonite ( Or any Offensive support that pressures BD Lax if using Umbreon, Marowak is an exemple ) / Starmie, that rely on DrumLax ( + Another threat sometimes ) as their only offensive strategy supported by screens in order to deny the opponing setup snowball possibilities.

Blissey definitely has a niche in GSC OU, being able to deny offensive strategies from you opponent with Sing + Light screen is super solid, Ice Beam can be used in order to pressure offensive Marowak but the former two are generally prefered, Heal Bell alongside Sing is also super good, allowing TurboLax strategies to success versus opponing Beller, and the fact that you can play without an Electric helps the kind of underestimate super bulky TurboLax teams that can do the job versus a majority of the metagame.

Blissey should stay her rank.
 

Jorgen

World's Strongest Fairy
is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Past SPL Champion
“turbodrum” isn’t really a thing but bliss is generally a much more reliable heal beller than miltank. miltank gets crippled with paralysis/toxic or takes >30% on the switch against all but a few Pokemon, whereas blissey tanks thunders all day (let alone surfs) and doesn’t really care too much about status because of just how hard it is to outright kill with your standard hp electrics.

miltank generally gets the nod because the set of things it checks (ie its checkset) is larger & contains bigger threats & less overlap with lax’s checkset than Bliss’s checkset. But if all you need is a heal beller, Bliss is actually the better option. Sort of a Cloyster/Forretress situation - Forretress is the better spiker due to toxic immunity & better longevity for it, but Cloyster can actually do other things.
 

Mr.E

unban me from Discord
is a Two-Time Past SPL Champion
Blissey's weakness is being a huge liability versus Snorlax. It's not even the lack of general offensive pressure or letting Lax flip momentum, it's that Snorlax can switch in even at very low health and get a Rest off when you otherwise may have had it chipped down and need to work hard to come back in without dying, because Blissey barely even outdamages Leftovers. Otherwise, Light Screen keeps even FB Lax at bay offensively backed by Skarm and situationally sets up certain offensive sweepers to wreak havoc. It's just in a metagame that revolves around Snorlax, Blissey is about the only thing that lets it switch in "for free" to heal up at very low HP. (Umbreon sorta does too, but at least maintains pressure by punishing Lax with Charm, allowing itself to switch out freely to another threat.) Miltank isn't "better" than Blissey because it stands up to Lax defensively, it's "better" because it hits Lax hard enough to prevent it from Drumming freely or letting it switch in at 20% HP to get a Rest off.

I'd also say that non-Bell Blissey is grossly underutilized. Blissey is still a great status absorber on its own, as it can wait out sleep all day versus special attackers and doesn't care about paralysis (though you're not really gonna sit in against BS Lax), and dropping Heal Bell gives it access to a range of good RBY tradeback moves, particularly Seismic Toss and Reflect/Counter.
 
See, blissey isn’t a bad poke in its own right. The fact that it is outclassed by miltank as a growler/beller and it has horrible matchups all around the board constitute to the fact that i want it dropped. Also, blissey seems to be used on teams as a secondary special wall (of course primary is lax), which brings up the point, why do you not use kou
 

Zokuru

The Stall Lord
is a Tiering Contributor
See, blissey isn’t a bad poke in its own right. The fact that it is outclassed by miltank as a growler/beller and it has horrible matchups all around the board constitute to the fact that i want it dropped. Also, blissey seems to be used on teams as a secondary special wall (of course primary is lax), which brings up the point, why do you not use kou
First, Blissey is almost never used with Growl, as its function isn't to beat Cursers.

Then, Snorlax, especially in the archtypes you can find Blissey, isn't a special wall, it's often played with BDrum, or just 3 atk Rest, but it never carry Sleep Talk ( What you need if you want to somehow counter the electrics ).

For the " why not using Raikou ? ", eeehh ... Raikou can't Bell, can't Sing, isn't as good as a pivot ( You lose many turns to Rest vs a competent opponent ), lose to HPump Vaporeon, is 100% a bait to Marowak ( which Blissey isn't with Sing ).

Well Blissey is super passive, that's true, but it will somehow do the job of Miltank + Raikou under the conditions that your team is resiliant to Snorlax, what is a super helpful role compression.
 
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