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Gurdurr [QC 3/3] [GP 2/2]

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by Hollywood, Jun 10, 2013.

  1. Hollywood

    Hollywood she's thin, she's blonde, she says "wow" a lot
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    Other Metas Leader

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    [​IMG]
    *flex*

    [Overview]

    <p>As one of just a handful of viable Fighting-types in NU, Gurdurr carves a clear niche for itself as a bulky boosting sweeper and pivot. Gurdurr has a lot going for it in NU: it has decent defensive stats, augmented by Eviolite; STAB Drain Punch makes up for a lack of recovery; and base 105 Attack gives it good power. While it might be slow, Gurdurr has access to priority in the form of Mach Punch, allowing it to bypass faster would-be checks and KO them before they get the chance to strike. Additionally, two great abilities, Guts and Iron Fist, both help it do its job, one that no other Pokemon in NU can perform quite the same. Unfortunately, Gurdurr's low Speed and Special Defense can make it an easy target for some offensive Psychic-types, and even with Drain Punch, Gurdurr detests Spikes, an entry hazard that has increased significantly in prominence in the tier.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Bulk Up
    move 1: Bulk Up
    move 2: Drain Punch
    move 3: Mach Punch
    move 4: Payback / Ice Punch
    item: Eviolite
    nature: Adamant
    ability: Guts
    evs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>With Bulk Up, Gurdurr can play the role of a boosting sweeper, taking advantage of the boosts in defensive stats that Eviolite provides in order to help it set up. This set generally takes much longer to set up than other sweepers in the tier, such as Shell Smash Carracosta, Rain Dance Ludicolo, and Swords Dance Sawsbuck, but what it loses out in speed of setup, it more than makes up for in reliability. Bulk Up is used to raise Gurdurr's Attack and Defense, simultaneously helping it set up thanks to the Defense boosts and increasing its power to prepare for its sweep. Drain Punch is Gurdurr's most reliable STAB; thanks to the recovery the move provides, Gurdurr can continue to fight even in the face of Pokemon that could otherwise cripple it. Mach Punch is used on this set to ignore Gurdurr's poor Speed and to finish off many Pokemon that would otherwise outspeed and KO it. The last choice in move typically goes to Payback, a move that doubles in power if the user moves second, which Gurdurr generally will due to its low Speed. Payback allows Gurdurr to compensate for this flaw, and it also lets it beat Misdreavus one-on-one. Ice Punch can be used in this slot, however, should you already have a reliable check for Misdreavus, as it allows Gurdurr to beat Flying-types and Vileplume much more easily.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Eviolite should always be used along with full HP investment to give Gurdurr much needed bulk. Attack investment is used over Special Defense investment, since many special attackers, such as Charizard, Gardevoir, and Musharna, can often beat it regardless of additional defensive investment. Guts is the preferred ability for this set, as it allows Gurdurr to absorb status that would otherwise cripple it or cut its sweep short. Guts is also the better ability to use for the potential matchup against Misdreavus, which very often carries Will-O-Wisp. If you run Heal Bell support on your team, Iron Fist can be used instead for the immediate power boost it provides; however, it should be noted that a burn will still cut a sweep short, since you'll have to call Gurdurr back in order to use Heal Bell. You can also use Stone Edge or Rock Slide on this set to hit Charizard or Articuno on a switch, but Golurk will then wall Gurdurr entirely.</p>

    <p>Skuntank partners well with this set due to its ability to beat Psychic- and Ghost-types that threaten it. Additionally, Metang can both provide Stealth Rock support and tank Flying- and Psychic-type attacks aimed toward Gurdurr. Bulky Rock-type Pokemon, such as Regirock, can also take Flying-type attacks while setting up Stealth Rock. As previously mentioned, Heal Bell support, while by no means required, is appreciated alongside Gurdurr to prevent an untimely Toxic from taking it down while it's getting ready to sweep. Finally, special walls, such as Audino, Lickilicky, and Mantine, are all appreciated to sponge attacks targeting Gurdurr's less impressive Special Defense stat.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Bulky Attacker
    move 1: Drain Punch
    move 2: Mach Punch
    move 3: Ice Punch
    move 4: Knock Off / Stone Edge
    item: Eviolite
    nature: Adamant
    ability: Iron Fist / Guts
    evs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Although it is most often seen running a Bulk Up set, Gurdurr can also play the role of a bulky attacker and pivot for offensively oriented teams in need of a partner that can take a hit and dish one out. This set is also very bulky, but it forgoes the ability to boost and sweep teams for greater utility. Drain Punch is chosen as a reasonably powerful STAB that can make up for the lack of passive recovery from Leftovers. Mach Punch allows Gurdurr to come in and revenge kill faster offensive threats. Because of the prominence of frail attackers in NU, this quality is greatly appreciated for bulky offensive teams and offensive teams alike. Ice Punch should be used in the third slot for the most reliable coverage alongside Gurdurr's Fighting-type STAB, as it hits Flying-type and Vileplume for super effective damage. Knock Off can be used in the last slot to hinder the performance of the common bulky Pokemon, such as Alomomola, Misdreavus, and Tangela, that rely heavily on their item in order to function best. Alternatively, if you would prefer a way of hitting Bug-types, such as Scolipede, Stone Edge is a great option in the fourth slot.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Eviolite is incredibly important for Gurdurr to run on this set, as its teammates will be relying on it to sponge hits, something it cannot do without the added bulk that Eviolite provides. Rock Slide can be used over Stone Edge for greater accuracy, although the lack of boosting item makes the added power of Stone Edge more appealing. Hammer Arm can be used in place of Drain Punch, trading perfect accuracy and recovery for added power. Toxic can be used in the last slot as an alternate way of handling bulky switch-ins, but it leaves you vulnerable to being set up on by Spikes users, such as Scolipede and Garbodor. Iron Fist is chosen for the ability on this set since the majority of the moves on the set are boosted, but Guts is an option if you are more concerned with absorbing status.</p>

    <p>This set struggles against Psychic- and Ghost-type Pokemon, making Skuntank a good partner. Gurdurr also still needs partners that can take special hits, but as it's also going to be taking many hits, specially defensive Pokemon that can pass it Wishes are appreciated—Audino and Lickilicky both perform this role well. Finally, offensive Pokemon that don't like taking hits play well with this set. SubDisable Haunter can escape Skuntank, a Pokemon that would otherwise cause it major problems, and pivot out into Gurdurr to take it on more efficiently. Additionally, Jynx strongly dislikes taking Bug- and Dark-type attacks, both of which Gurdurr can switch into with ease.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Despite its sets being very similar to one another, Gurdurr does have some other options you may want to consider. While a Choice Band set may sound worthwhile, it's a set that is generally outclassed by Sawk due to its greater power and Speed, and Gurdurr's good bulk with Eviolite is its main draw. A set with Substitute and Focus Punch could be used, but the lack of passive recovery and its inability to beat Gurdurr's typical checks and counters are both off-putting. A set with Rest, Sleep Talk, and Bulk Up is something to consider as well, although because it cannot beat Ghost-types and because Throh can perform this role better, it is generally unappealing. Low Sweep is an option to be considered on the bulky attacker set, as it can lower the Speed of potential switch-ins to make it easier for another Pokemon to set up or to finish off the slower foe. The only downside with Low Sweep is that Gurdurr generally prefers the recovery that Drain Punch provides; this is Gurdurr's only form of recovery, so losing it allows Gurdurr to be worn down by chip damage and hazards much more easily. ThunderPunch and Fire Punch might seem appealing, but they add little in terms of coverage. Facade is an option alongside Guts, but it relies on being statused—otherwise, it is dead weight. On a similar note, a status orb set with Guts can be used, but Gurdurr's low Speed and sub par bulk without Eviolite make it a very poor choice for a Guts sweeper. Finally, Taunt is an option on either set, but Gurdurr is far too slow to be running it.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>In terms of checks and counters, you could just hope Gurdurr drops its iron girder on its foot! But if you are looking for a more sensible approach, feel free to keep reading. Musharna is one of the best checks to either set, as it can tank any move Gurdurr has to offer and retaliate with a STAB Psychic. It is also slower than Gurdurr, meaning that Payback will only have 50 Base Power when used against it. Misdreavus is a great check to sets running Iron First, as it can outspeed and burn Gurdurr, thus crippling it for the rest of the match; however, it can struggle against Guts sets and detests losing its Eviolite to Knock Off. Iron Fist boosted Ice Punch is a 3-4HKO against Golbat while Golbat can Taunt Gurdurr to prevent it from using Bulk Up, Roost off any damage from Ice Punch or Stone Edge, and strike back with a super effective Brave Bird. Vileplume only struggles to take an Ice Punch, and it can put Gurdurr to sleep, then switch out to an appropriate check. Charizard can take on Gurdurr to a decent extent, taking everything but Stone Edge well and KOing Gurdurr with Air Slash after just a bit of prior damage. Psychic-types, such as Gardevoir and Exeggutor, can switch in on Fighting-type moves with ease and KO Gurdurr with Psychic. Grumpig, on the other hand, can take any hit from Gurdurr and Whirlwind, fearing absolutely nothing Gurdurr has to use against it: Psychic resists Fighting, Thick Fat adds an Ice-type resistance, and Payback will always go first when Grumpig uses Whirlwind. Finally, Garbodor and Weezing can both Clear Smog against Bulk Up variants to remove the boosts that Gurdurr has gathered.</p>

    Show Hide

    [Overview]

    • One of few viable Fighting-types in NU
    • Great bulk w/ Eviolite and good base 105 Atk
    • Can set up or serve as a bulky pivot on offensive teams
    • Slow, but has priority to make up for it
    • Two great abilities to help it do its job
    • SpDef isn't the best, and Fighting typing is weak to a lot of special attackers
    • Even with Drain Punch, hates Spikes which sucks because lots of Scolipedes
    • No other Pokemon can do the same job it does

    [SET]
    name: Bulk Up
    move 1: Bulk Up
    move 2: Drain Punch
    move 3: Mach Punch
    move 4: Payback / Ice Punch
    item: Eviolite
    nature: Adamant
    ability: Guts
    evs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def

    [SET COMMENTS]

    • Boosting sweeper that values its great bulk w/ Eviolite to help it set up
    • Generally sets up more slowly but more reliably with more opportunities to set up than Pokemon such as Shell Smash Gorebyss/Carracosta or Rain Dance Ludicolo
    • Bulk Up to boost Atk and Def
    • Drain Punch for reliable, decently strong STAB w/ recovery that Gurdurr misses out on because of Evioite
    • Mach Punch makes up for poor Speed and deals solid damage against fastmons after some boosts, letting Gurdurr avoid being hit
    • Ice Punch is a reliable coverage move that deals consistent damage against most Fighting resists
    • Payback is primarily for Misdreavus which Gurdurr otherwise struggles to beat

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    • Eviolite and max HP EVs should always be used to add much needed bulk, especially since Speed is unimportant for such a set
    • Atk investment>SpDef investment since many special attackers still beat it anyways
    • Guts has awesome utility, letting Gurdurr absorb status and help it beat Misdreavus
    • Iron Fist can be used instead for immediate benefit and should be used w/ Ice Punch if you choose to use it>Guts
    • Even with Payback most Psychic-types as well as a couple Ghost-types (Drifblim and Haunter, for example) can scare it out bc low SpDef, so Skuntank is a good partner
    • Metang can set up SR and take Psychic- and Flying-type moves
    • Bulky Rock-types like Regirock can take Flying hits too, and having a Flying resist is appreciated for any team
    • Heal Bell support helps both sets since Toxic can stop a sweep on Guts set and burn can stop Iron Fist from doing anything
    • Special walls like Audino, Lickilicky, Mantine, etc are all nice to help sponge special hits Gurdurr would rather avoid

    [SET]
    name: Bulky Attacker
    move 1: Drain Punch
    move 2: Mach Punch
    move 3: Ice Punch
    move 4: Knock Off / Stone Edge
    item: Eviolite
    nature: Adamant
    ability: Iron Fist / Guts
    evs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def

    [SET COMMENTS]

    • Plays the role of a bulky pivot on offensive teams that need something to take a hit and dish them out
    • Still very bulky but drops Bulk Up for more offensive options/utility
    • Drain Punch makes up for lack of Leftovers and hits reasonably hard
    • Mach Punch to revenge kill and finish off weakened foes
    • Ice Punch for best reliable coverage alongside Fighting-type attacks
    • Stone Edge hits Pokemon like Scolipede that think they can set up on Gurdurr
    • Knock Off is a great utility move to cripple walls reliant upon their items like Tangela and Misdreavus

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    • Eviolite is mandatory bc this set sponges hits for offensive teams and it can't do that without the added bulk
    • Rock Slide>Stone Edge for more accuracy, but the flinch chance is irrelevant on something so slow and the loss in power sucks
    • Hammer Arm can be used here for more power instead of recovery, since Speed is mostly unimportant
    • Toxic can be used to cripple walls like Alomomola, Tangela, etc, but then you are more helpless against Poison-types
    • Since you're mainly using the punching moves on the set, Iron Fist helps add some extra power to make up for lack of boosting item
    • Guts is cool for letting Gurdurr switch into status for offensive partners
    • Very similar teammates
    • Still hates Ghosts and Psychics, so Skunk is cool
    • Offensive Pokemon that don't like taking hits: SubDisable Haunter can avoid Pursuit from Skunk and switch out, Jynx hates taking Bug- and Dark-type attacks that Gurdurr resists and pretty much any physical hit in general, etc
    • Still needs something to take special hits, so Audino and Lickilicky make good partners on balanced teams since they can Wish pass to it as well
    • :toast:

    [Other Options]

    • CB could be ok, but Sawk does it better bc stronger and higher BP moves and the loss in bulk from no Eviolite is noticeable
    • Sub/Focus Punch, but it doesn't get past its typical counters and has no Leftovers recovery to make up for Subs
    • RestTalk Bulk Up, but bad because can't hit Ghosts and Throh does it better
    • Rock Slide>Ice Punch/Payback on Bulk Up, but then you miss coverage against Golurk :(
    • Low Sweep for Bulky Attacker set to slow down switch ins, but not as valuable as the moves already on the set
    • ThunderPunch and Fire Punch, though they do little in terms of coverage
    • Facade on Guts sets, but it adds little in terms of coverage and is useless if you don't get statused
    • Status Orb Guts, but you lose bulk and take passive damage; too slow to do it well
    • Taunt, but far too slow to use it well

    [Checks and Counters]

    • Musharna since Payback has 50 BP against it and has far more physical bulk than Gurdurr does special
    • Vileplume can take on sets w/o Ice Punch
    • Golbat takes nothing from Fighting moves and not a whole lot more from Ice Punch/Stone Edge and can Taunt then recover w/ Roost
    • Missy can still beat Iron Fist sets through burning it, deals decent damage with Shadow Ball, and can Taunt it to keep it from setting up
    • Charizard can take most anything but a Stone Edge and hit hard w/ Fire Blast or Air Slash
    • Psychic-types (Gardy, Exeggutor) can switch in on Fighting-type moves and KO with Psychic
    • Grumpig can take any hit and Whirlwind (resists Ice Punch and Drain Punch and will go last against Payback variants while using WW) while Garbodor can Clear Smog and proceed to set up hazards
    • Weezing walls it and can Clear Smog then burn
  2. JoshuaMunoz

    JoshuaMunoz

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2012
    Messages:
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    Hihi Treecko.

    • I wouldn't say its SpDef is easy to prey on; factored by Eviolite it actually can take some hits on the special side. You also said so yourself in the overview that it has great bulk, contradicting those two statements.
    • @Set Comments : Guts; I wouldn't say that bulk up raises its defense and attack, pretty obvious for an average player, no?
    • @Set Comments : Bulky Attacker; Hammer Arm should be Additional Comments imo.
  3. Hollywood

    Hollywood she's thin, she's blonde, she says "wow" a lot
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Battle Server Administratoris a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon IRC SOPis a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
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    SpDef is the easier side to prey on no doubt though. The issue is that most of the viable special attackers in the tier are strong enough to donk it or have SE coverage on it. I can reword it, but I feel like it's important to note that.

    Bulk Up's description doesn't really hurt anything either imo since I'll probably spend about a half a sentence stating that, but I'll leave that up to QC.

    Hammer Arm was supposed to be there: thanks for catching that!
  4. tennisace

    tennisace Proximity to power deludes some into thinking they wield it.
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a CAP Contributor Alumnus
    Twitter Head

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    [​IMG]

    you made the changes i asked for on irc so stamp
  5. ebeast

    ebeast she's probably sexting nprtprt
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    In the Overview mention how even with Drain Punch, Gurdurr gets worn down by Spikes really easily. Mention how this is especially relevant considering Scolipede is one of the most common Pokemon in the tier.

    [qc]2/3[/qc]
  6. Hollywood

    Hollywood she's thin, she's blonde, she says "wow" a lot
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    wee write-up finished; ready for third check~
  7. Raseri

    Raseri here to help
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    Id like to see Stone Edge / Rock Slide in AC of BU. THey hit zard super effective,yl as well as articuno. Which can be big threats to Gurdurr.

    [qc]3/3[/qc]


    I KEEP MY MODS GG TREECKO
  8. Hollywood

    Hollywood she's thin, she's blonde, she says "wow" a lot
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  9. mikel

    mikel frizy will carry ocn
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    diff (open)
    [Overview]

    <p>As one of just a handful of viable Fighting-types in NU, Gurdurr carves a clear niche for itself as a bulky boosting sweeper and pivot. Gurdurr has a lot going for it in NU: it has decent defensive stats, augmented by Eviolite; STAB Drain Punch makes up for a lack of recovery; and base 105 Attack gives it good power. While it might be slow, Gurdurr has access to priority in the form of Mach Punch, allowing it to bypass faster would-be checks and KO them before they get the chance to strike. Additionally, two great abilities, Guts and Iron Fist, both help it do its job, one that no other Pokemon in NU can perform quite the same. Unfortunately, Gurdurr's low Speed and Special Defense can make it an easy target for some offensive Psychic-types, and even with Drain Punch, Gurdurr detests Spikes, an entry hazard that has increased significantly in prominence in the tier.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Bulk Up
    move 1: Bulk Up
    move 2: Drain Punch
    move 3: Mach Punch
    move 4: Payback / Ice Punch
    item: Eviolite
    nature: Adamant
    ability: Guts
    evs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>With Bulk Up, Gurdurr can play the role of a boosting sweeper, taking advantage of the boosts in defensive stats that Eviolite provides in order to help it set up. This set generally takes much longer to set up than other sweepers in the tier, such as Shell Smash Carracosta, Rain Dance Ludicolo, and Swords Dance Sawsbuck, but what it loses out in momentum, it more than makes up for in reliability. Bulk Up is used to raise Gurdurr's Attack and Defense, simultaneously helping it set up thanks to the Defense boosts and increasing its power to prepare for its sweep. Drain Punch is Gurdurr's most reliable STAB, and thanks to the recovery the move provides, Gurdurr can continue to fight even in the face of Pokemon that could otherwise cripple it. Mach Punch is used on this set to ignore Gurdurr's poor Speed and to take out and finish off many Pokemon that would otherwise outspeed and KO Gurdurr. The last choice in move typically goes to Payback, a move that doubles in power if the user moves second, which Gurdurr generally will due to its low Speed. Payback allows Gurdurr to compensate for this flaw, and it also lets it beat Misdreavus one-on-one. Ice Punch can be used in this slot, however, should you already have a reliable check for Misdreavus, as it allows Gurdurr to beat Flying-types and Vileplume much more easily.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Eviolite should always be used along with full HP investment to give Gurdurr much needed bulk. Attack investment is used over Special Defense investment, since many special attackers, such as Charizard, Gardevoir, and Musharna, can often beat it regardless of where it invests its EVs. Guts is the preferred ability for this set, as it allows Gurdurr to absorb status that would otherwise cripple it or cut its sweep short. Guts is also the better ability to use for the potential matchup against Misdreavus, which very often carries Will-O-Wisp. If you run Heal Bell support on your team, Iron Fist can be used instead for the immediate power boost it provides; however, it should be noted that a burn will still cut a sweep short, since you'll have to call Gurdurr back in order to use Heal Bell. You can also use Stone Edge or Rock Slide on this set to hit Charizard or Articuno on a switch, but Golurk will then wall Gurdurr entirely.</p>

    <p>Skuntank partners well with this set thanks to its ability to beat Psychic- and Ghost-types that threaten it. Alternatively, Metang can provide Stealth Rock support in addition to tanking Flying- and Psychic-type attacks aimed toward Gurdurr. Bulky Rock-type Pokemon, such as Regirock, can also take Flying-type attacks while setting up Stealth Rock. As previously mentioned, Heal Bell support, while by no means required, is appreciated alongside Gurdurr to prevent an untimely Toxic from taking it down while it's getting ready to sweep. Finally, special walls, such as Audino, Lickilicky, and Mantine, are all appreciated to sponge attacks targeting Gurdurr's less impressive Special Defense stat.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Bulky Attacker
    move 1: Drain Punch
    move 2: Mach Punch
    move 3: Ice Punch
    move 4: Knock Off / Stone Edge
    item: Eviolite
    nature: Adamant
    ability: Iron Fist / Guts
    evs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Although it is most often seen running a Bulk Up set, Gurdurr can also play the role of a bulky attacker and pivot for offensively oriented teams in need of a partner that can take a hit and dish one out. This set is also very bulky, but it forgoes the ability to boost and sweep teams for greater utility. Drain Punch is chosen as a reasonably powerful STAB that can make up for the lack of passive recovery from Leftovers. Mach Punch allows Gurdurr to come in and revenge kill faster offensive threats. Because of the prominence of frail attackers in NU, this quality is greatly appreciated for bulky offensive teams and offensive teams alike. Ice Punch should be used in the third slot for the most reliable coverage alongside Gurdurr's Fighting-type STAB, as it hits Flying-type and Vileplume for super effective damage. Knock Off can be used in the last slot to hinder the performance of the common bulky Pokemon, such as Alomomola, Misdreavus, and Tangela, that rely heavily on their item in order to function best. Nevertheless, if you would prefer a way of hitting Bug-types, such as Scolipede, Stone Edge is still a great option in the fourth slot.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Eviolite is incredibly important for Gurdurr to run on this set, as its teammates will be relying on it to sponge hits, something it cannot do without the added bulk that Eviolite provides. Rock Slide can be used over Stone Edge for greater accuracy, although the lack of boosting item makes the added power of Stone Edge more appealing. Hammer Arm can be used in place of Drain Punch, trading perfect accuracy and recovery for added power. Toxic can be used in the last slot as an alternate way of handling bulky switch-ins, but it leaves you vulnerable to being set up on by Spikes users, such as Scolipede and Garbodor. Iron Fist is chosen for the ability on this set since the majority of the moves on the set are boosted, but Guts is an option if you are more concerned with absorbing status.</p>

    <p>This set struggles against Psychic- and Ghost-type Pokemon, making Skuntank a good partner. Gurdurr also still needs partners that can take special hits, but as it's also going to be taking many hits, specially defensive Pokemon that can pass it Wishes are appreciated—Audino and Lickilicky both perform this role well. Finally, offensive Pokemon that don't like taking hits play well with this set. SubDisable Haunter can escape Skuntank, a Pokemon that would otherwise cause it major problems, and pivot out into Gurdurr to take it on more efficiently. Additionally, Jynx strongly dislikes taking Bug- and Dark-type attacks, both of which Gurdurr can switch into with ease.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Despite its sets being very similar to one another, Gurdurr does have some other options you may want to consider. While a Choice Band set may sound worthwhile, it's a set that is generally outclassed by Sawk due to its greater power and Speed, and Gurdurr's good bulk with Eviolite is its main draw. A set with Substitute and Focus Punch can be used, but the lack of passive recovery and its inability to beat Gurdurr's typical checks and counters are both off-putting qualities. A set with Rest, Sleep Talk, and Bulk Up is something to consider as well, though because it cannot beat Ghost-types and Throh can perform this role better with Circle Throw, it is generally unappealing. Rock Slide can also be used on the Bulk Up set alongside Drain Punch and Mach Punch, but then you'll be missing out on coverage against Golurk. Low Sweep is an option to be considered on the bulky attacker set, as it can lower the Speed of potential switch-ins to make it easier for another Pokemon to set up or to finish off the slower foe. The only downside with Low Sweep is that Gurdurr generally prefers the recovery that Drain Punch provides. ThunderPunch and Fire Punch might seem appealing, but they add little in terms of coverage. Facade is an option alongside Guts, but it relies on being statused—otherwise, it is dead weight. On a similar note, a status orb set with Guts can be used, but the loss in bulk, along with Gurdurr's low Speed, make it a very poor choice for a Guts sweeper. Finally, Taunt is an option on either set, but Gurdurr is far too slow to be running it.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>In terms of checks and counters, you could just hope Gurdurr drops its iron girder on its foot! But if you are looking for a more sensible approach, feel free to keep reading. Musharna is one of the best checks to either set, as it can tank any move Gurdurr has to offer and retaliate with a STAB Psychic. Misdreavus is a great check to sets running Iron First, as it can outspeed and burn Gurdurr, thus crippling it for the rest of the match; however, it can struggle against Guts sets. Iron Fist boosted Ice Punch is a 3-4HKO against Golbat while Golbat can Taunt Gurdurr to prevent it from using Bulk Up, Roost off any damage from Ice Punch or Stone Edge, and strike back with a super effective Brave Bird. Vileplume stuggles only to take an Ice Punch, and it can put Gurdurr to sleep, then switch out to an appropriate check. Charizard can take on Gurdurr to a decent extent, taking everything but Stone Edge well, and can KO with Air Slash after just a bit of prior damage. Psychic-types, such as Gardevoir and Exeggutor, can switch in on Fighting-type moves with ease and KO Gurdurr with Psychic. Grumpig, on the other hand, can take any hit from Gurdurr and Whirlwind, fearing absolutely nothing Gurdurr has to use against it: Psychic resists Fighting, Thick Fat adds an Ice-type resistance, and Payback will always go first when Grumpig uses Whirlwind. Finally, Garbodor and Weezing can both Clear Smog against Bulk Up variants to remove the boosts that Gurdurr has gathered.</p>


    um i talked through most of the controversial-ish changes on irc. couple of things:

    don't refer to set order or "previous set" or anything like that, since it can change or analyses can be deleted, etc.

    may = permission, might = chance. it's kinda pedantic but it's prescriptive usage that smogon follows.

    [gp]1/2[/gp]
  10. Hollywood

    Hollywood she's thin, she's blonde, she says "wow" a lot
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Battle Server Administratoris a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon IRC SOPis a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Other Metas Leader

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    Messages:
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    thanks mbw

    ready for GP 2!!
  11. TalkTakesTime

    TalkTakesTime um excuse me
    is a Battle Server Moderator
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    amcheck (open)
    [Overview]

    <p>As one of just a handful of viable Fighting-types in NU, Gurdurr carves a clear niche for itself as a bulky boosting sweeper and pivot. Gurdurr has a lot going for it in NU: it has decent defensive stats, which are augmented by Eviolite;, a STAB Drain Punch to makes up for a lack of reliable recovery;, and a solid base 105 Attack gives it good power. While it might be slow, Gurdurr has access to priority in the form of Mach Punch, allowing it to bypass faster would-be checks and KO them before they get the chance to strike. Additionally, two great abilities, Guts and Iron Fist, both help it do its job, one that no other Pokemon in NU can perform to quite the same standard. Unfortunately, Gurdurr's low Speed and Special Defense can make it an easy target for some offensive Psychic-types, and even with Drain Punch, Gurdurr detests Spikes, an entry hazard that has increased significantly in prominence in the tier.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Bulk Up
    move 1: Bulk Up
    move 2: Drain Punch
    move 3: Mach Punch
    move 4: Payback / Ice Punch
    item: Eviolite
    nature: Adamant
    ability: Guts
    evs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>With Bulk Up, Gurdurr can play the role of a boosting sweeper, taking advantage of the boosts in defensive stats that Eviolite provides in order to help it set up. This set generally takes much longer to set up than other sweepers in the tier, such as Shell Smash Carracosta, Rain Dance Ludicolo, and Swords Dance Sawsbuck, but what it loses out in momentum, it loses is more than makesde up for inby its reliability. Bulk Up is used to raise Gurdurr's Attack and Defense, simultaneously helping it set up further thanks to the Defense boosts and increasing its power to prepare for its sweep. Drain Punch is Gurdurr's most reliable STAB, and; thanks to the recovery the move provides, Gurdurr can continue to fight even in the face of Pokemon that could otherwise cripple it. Mach Punch is used on this set to ignore Gurdurr's poor Speed and to take out and finish off many Pokemon that would otherwise outspeed and KO Gurdurr. The last choice in move typically goes to Payback, a move that doubles in power if the user moves second, which Gurdurr generally will due to its low Speed. Payback allows Gurdurr to compensate for this flaw, and it also lets it beat Misdreavus one-on-one. Ice Punch can be used in this slot, however, should you already have a reliable check for Misdreavus, as it allows Gurdurr to beat Flying-types and Vileplume much more easily.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Eviolite should always be used along with full HP investment to give Gurdurr much needed bulk. Attack investment is used over Special Defense investment, since many special attackers, such as Charizard, Gardevoir, and Musharna, can often beat it regardless of where itadditional defensive invests its EVsment. Guts is the preferred ability for this set, as it allows Gurdurr to absorb status that would otherwise cripple it or cut its sweep short. Guts is also the better ability to use for the potential matchup against Misdreavus, which very often carries Will-O-Wisp. If you run Heal Bell support on your team, Iron Fist can be used instead for the immediate power boost it provides; however, it should be noted that a burn will still cut a sweep short, since you'll have to call Gurdurr back in order to use Heal Bell. You can also use Stone Edge or Rock Slide on this set to hit Charizard or Articuno on a switch, but Golurk will then wall Gurdurr entirely.</p>

    <p>Skuntank partners well with this set thanksdue to its ability to beat Psychic- and Ghost-types that threaten it. Alternativedditionally, Metang can both provide Stealth Rock support in addition toand tanking Flying- and Psychic-type attacks aimed toward Gurdurr. Bulky Rock-type Pokemon, such as Regirock, can also take Flying-type attacks while setting up Stealth Rock. As previously mentioned, Heal Bell support, while by no means required, is appreciated alongside Gurdurr to prevent an untimely Toxic from taking it down while it's getting ready to sweep. Finally, special walls, such as Audino, Lickilicky, and Mantine, are all appreciated to sponge attacks targeting Gurdurr's less impressive Special Defense stat.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Bulky Attacker
    move 1: Drain Punch
    move 2: Mach Punch
    move 3: Ice Punch
    move 4: Knock Off / Stone Edge
    item: Eviolite
    nature: Adamant
    ability: Iron Fist / Guts
    evs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Although it is most often seen running a Bulk Up set, Gurdurr can also play the role of a bulky attacker and pivot for offensively oriented teams in need of a partner that can take a hit and dish one out. This set is also very bulky, but it forgoes the ability to boost and sweep teams for greater utility. Drain Punch is chosen as a reasonably powerful STAB that can make up for the lack of passive recovery from Leftovers. Mach Punch allows Gurdurr to come in and revenge kill faster offensive threats. Because of the prominence of frail attackers in NU, this quality is greatly appreciated for bulky offensive teams and offensive teams alike. Ice Punch should be used in the third slot for the most reliable coverage alongside Gurdurr's Fighting-type STAB, as it hits Flying-type and Vileplume for super effective damage. Knock Off can be used in the last slot to hinder the performance of the common bulky Pokemon, such as Alomomola, Misdreavus, and Tangela, that rely heavily on their item in order to function best. NeverthelessAlternatively, if you would prefer a way of hitting Bug-types, such as Scolipede, Stone Edge is still a great option in the fourth slot.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Eviolite is incredibly important for Gurdurr to run on this set, as its teammates will be relying on it to sponge hits, something it cannot do without the added bulk that Eviolite provides. Rock Slide can be used over Stone Edge for greater accuracy, although the lack of boosting item makes the added power of Stone Edge more appealing. Hammer Arm can be used in place of Drain Punch, trading perfect accuracy and recovery for added power. Toxic can be used in the last slot as an alternate way of handling bulky switch-ins, but it leaves you vulnerable to being set up on by Spikes users, such as Scolipede and Garbodor. Iron Fist is chosen for the ability on this set since the majority of the moves on the set are boosted, but Guts is an option if you are more concerned with absorbing status.</p>

    <p>This set struggles against Psychic- and Ghost-type Pokemon, making Skuntank a good partner. Gurdurr also still needs partners that can take special hits, but as it's also going to be taking many hits, specially defensive Pokemon that can pass it Wishes are appreciated — Audino and Lickilicky both perform this role well. Finally, offensive Pokemon that don't like taking hits play well with this set. SubDisable Haunter can escape Skuntank, a Pokemon that would otherwise cause it major problems, and pivot out into Gurdurr to take it on more efficiently. Additionally, Jynx strongly dislikes taking Bug- and Dark-type attacks, both of which Gurdurr can switch into with ease.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Despite its sets being very similar to one another, Gurdurr does have some other options you may want to consider. While a Choice Band set may sound worthwhile, it's a set that is generally outclassed by Sawk due to its greater power and Speed, and; Gurdurr's good bulk with Eviolite is its main draw, which it lacks when using a Choice Band. A set with Substitute and Focus Punch canould be used, but the lack of passive recovery and its inability to beat Gurdurr's typical checks and counters are both off-putting qualities. A set with Rest, Sleep Talk, and Bulk Up is something to consider as well, although because it cannot beat Ghost-types and Throh can perform this routclassed better with Circley Throw, it is generally unappealing. Rock Slide can also be used on the Bulk Up set alongside Drain Punch and Mach Punch, buh, who has access to Circle Throw, it then you'll be missing out on cov generage against Golurklly unappealing. Low Sweep is an option to be considered on the bulky attacker set, as it can lower the Speed of potential switch-ins to make it easier for another Pokemon to set up or to finish off the slower foe. The only downsides with Low Sweep is that Gurdurr generally prefersare the losses of power and the recovery that Drain Punch provides; this is Gurdurr's only form of recovery, so losing it allows Gurdurr to be worn down by chip damage and hazards, limiting its useful life. ThunderPunch and Fire Punch might seem appealing, but they add little in terms of coverage. Facade is an option alongside Guts, but it relies on being statused — otherwise, it is dead weight. On a similar note, a status orb set with Guts can be used, but the loss in bulk, along with Gurdurr's low Speed, and lack of bulk without Eviolite make it a very poor choice for a Guts sweeper. Finally, Taunt is an option on either set, but Gurdurr is far too slow to be running it.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>In terms of checks and counters, you could just hope Gurdurr drops its iron girder on its foot! But if you are looking for a more sensible approach, feel free to keep reading. Musharna is one of the best checks to either set, as it can tank any move Gurdurr has to offer and retaliate with a STAB Psychic; it is also slower than Gurdurr, causing Payback to have a mediocre 50 base power. Misdreavus is a great check to sets running Iron First, as it can outspeed and burn Gurdurr, thus crippling it for the rest of the match; however, it can struggle against Guts sets, and detests Knock Off. Iron Fist boosted Ice Punch is a 3-4HKO against Golbat, while Golbat can Taunt Gurdurr to prevent it from using Bulk Up, Roost off any damage from Ice Punch or Stone Edge, and strike back with a super effective Brave Bird. Vileplume only struggles only to take ank Ice Punch, and it can put Gurdurr to sleep, then switch out to an appropriate check. Charizard can take on Gurdurr to a decent extent, taking everything but Stone Edge well, and can KOing with Air Slash after just a bit of prior damage. Psychic-types, such as Gardevoir and Exeggutor, can switch in on Fighting-type moves with ease and KO Gurdurr with Psychic. Grumpig, on the other hand, can take any hit from Gurdurr and Whirlwind, fearing absolutely nothing Gurdurr has to use against it: Psychic resists Fighting, Thick Fat adds an Ice-type resistance, and Payback will always go first when Grumpig uses Whirlwind. Finally, Garbodor and Weezing can both Clear Smog against Bulk Up variants to remove the boosts that Gurdurr has gathered.</p>


    C/P Version (open)
    [Overview]

    <p>As one of just a handful of viable Fighting-types in NU, Gurdurr carves a clear niche for itself as a bulky boosting sweeper and pivot. Gurdurr has a lot going for it in NU: it has decent defensive stats which are augmented by Eviolite, a STAB Drain Punch to make up for a lack of reliable recovery, and a solid base 105 Attack. While it might be slow, Gurdurr has access to priority in the form of Mach Punch, allowing it to bypass faster would-be checks and KO them before they get the chance to strike. Additionally, two great abilities, Guts and Iron Fist, both help it do its job, one that no other Pokemon in NU can perform to quite the same standard. Unfortunately, Gurdurr's low Speed and Special Defense can make it an easy target for some offensive Psychic-types, and even with Drain Punch, Gurdurr detests Spikes, an entry hazard that has increased significantly in prominence in the tier.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Bulk Up
    move 1: Bulk Up
    move 2: Drain Punch
    move 3: Mach Punch
    move 4: Payback / Ice Punch
    item: Eviolite
    nature: Adamant
    ability: Guts
    evs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>With Bulk Up, Gurdurr can play the role of a boosting sweeper, taking advantage of the boosts in defensive stats that Eviolite provides in order to help it set up. This set generally takes much longer to set up than other sweepers in the tier, such as Shell Smash Carracosta, Rain Dance Ludicolo, and Swords Dance Sawsbuck, but what momentum it loses is more than made up for by its reliability. Bulk Up is used to raise Gurdurr's Attack and Defense, simultaneously helping it set up further thanks to the Defense boosts and increasing its power to prepare for its sweep. Drain Punch is Gurdurr's most reliable STAB; thanks to the recovery the move provides, Gurdurr can continue to fight even in the face of Pokemon that could otherwise cripple it. Mach Punch is used on this set to ignore Gurdurr's poor Speed and finish off many Pokemon that would otherwise outspeed and KO Gurdurr. The last choice in move typically goes to Payback, a move that doubles in power if the user moves second, which Gurdurr generally will due to its low Speed. Payback allows Gurdurr to compensate for this flaw, and it also lets it beat Misdreavus one-on-one. Ice Punch can be used in this slot, however, should you already have a reliable check for Misdreavus, as it allows Gurdurr to beat Flying-types and Vileplume much more easily.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Eviolite should always be used along with full HP investment to give Gurdurr much needed bulk. Attack investment is used over Special Defense investment, since many special attackers, such as Charizard, Gardevoir, and Musharna, can often beat it regardless of additional defensive investment. Guts is the preferred ability for this set, as it allows Gurdurr to absorb status that would otherwise cripple it or cut its sweep short. Guts is also the better ability to use for the potential matchup against Misdreavus, which very often carries Will-O-Wisp. If you run Heal Bell support on your team, Iron Fist can be used instead for the immediate power boost it provides; however, it should be noted that a burn will still cut a sweep short, since you'll have to call Gurdurr back in order to use Heal Bell. You can also use Stone Edge or Rock Slide on this set to hit Charizard or Articuno on a switch, but Golurk will then wall Gurdurr entirely.</p>

    <p>Skuntank partners well with this set due to its ability to beat Psychic- and Ghost-types that threaten it. Additionally, Metang can both provide Stealth Rock support and tank Flying- and Psychic-type attacks aimed toward Gurdurr. Bulky Rock-type Pokemon, such as Regirock, can also take Flying-type attacks while setting up Stealth Rock. As previously mentioned, Heal Bell support, while by no means required, is appreciated alongside Gurdurr to prevent an untimely Toxic from taking it down while it's getting ready to sweep. Finally, special walls, such as Audino, Lickilicky, and Mantine, are all appreciated to sponge attacks targeting Gurdurr's less impressive Special Defense stat.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Bulky Attacker
    move 1: Drain Punch
    move 2: Mach Punch
    move 3: Ice Punch
    move 4: Knock Off / Stone Edge
    item: Eviolite
    nature: Adamant
    ability: Iron Fist / Guts
    evs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Although it is most often seen running a Bulk Up set, Gurdurr can also play the role of a bulky attacker and pivot for offensively oriented teams in need of a partner that can take a hit and dish one out. This set is also very bulky, but it forgoes the ability to boost and sweep teams for greater utility. Drain Punch is chosen as a reasonably powerful STAB that can make up for the lack of passive recovery from Leftovers. Mach Punch allows Gurdurr to come in and revenge kill faster offensive threats. Because of the prominence of frail attackers in NU, this quality is greatly appreciated for bulky offensive teams and offensive teams alike. Ice Punch should be used in the third slot for the most reliable coverage alongside Gurdurr's Fighting-type STAB, as it hits Flying-type and Vileplume for super effective damage. Knock Off can be used in the last slot to hinder the performance of the common bulky Pokemon, such as Alomomola, Misdreavus, and Tangela, that rely heavily on their item in order to function best. Alternatively, if you would prefer a way of hitting Bug-types, such as Scolipede, Stone Edge is a great option in the fourth slot.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Eviolite is incredibly important for Gurdurr to run on this set, as its teammates will be relying on it to sponge hits, something it cannot do without the added bulk that Eviolite provides. Rock Slide can be used over Stone Edge for greater accuracy, although the lack of boosting item makes the added power of Stone Edge more appealing. Hammer Arm can be used in place of Drain Punch, trading perfect accuracy and recovery for added power. Toxic can be used in the last slot as an alternate way of handling bulky switch-ins, but it leaves you vulnerable to being set up on by Spikes users, such as Scolipede and Garbodor. Iron Fist is chosen for the ability on this set since the majority of the moves on the set are boosted, but Guts is an option if you are more concerned with absorbing status.</p>

    <p>This set struggles against Psychic- and Ghost-type Pokemon, making Skuntank a good partner. Gurdurr also still needs partners that can take special hits, but as it's also going to be taking many hits, specially defensive Pokemon that can pass it Wishes are appreciated — Audino and Lickilicky both perform this role well. Finally, offensive Pokemon that don't like taking hits play well with this set. SubDisable Haunter can escape Skuntank, a Pokemon that would otherwise cause it major problems, and pivot out into Gurdurr to take it on more efficiently. Additionally, Jynx strongly dislikes taking Bug- and Dark-type attacks, both of which Gurdurr can switch into with ease.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Despite its sets being very similar to one another, Gurdurr does have some other options you may want to consider. While a Choice Band set may sound worthwhile, it's a set that is generally outclassed by Sawk due to its greater power and Speed; Gurdurr's good bulk with Eviolite is its main draw, which it lacks when using a Choice Band. A set with Substitute and Focus Punch could be used, but the lack of passive recovery and its inability to beat Gurdurr's typical checks and counters are both off-putting qualities. A set with Rest, Sleep Talk, and Bulk Up is something to consider as well, although because it cannot beat Ghost-types and is outclassed by Throh, who has access to Circle Throw, it is generally unappealing. Low Sweep is an option to be considered on the bulky attacker set, as it can lower the Speed of potential switch-ins to make it easier for another Pokemon to set up or to finish off the slower foe. The only downsides with Low Sweep are the losses of power and the recovery that Drain Punch provides; this is Gurdurr's only form of recovery, so losing it allows Gurdurr to be worn down by chip damage and hazards, limiting its useful life. ThunderPunch and Fire Punch might seem appealing, but they add little in terms of coverage. Facade is an option alongside Guts, but it relies on being statused — otherwise, it is dead weight. On a similar note, a status orb set with Guts can be used, but Gurdurr's low Speed and lack of bulk without Eviolite make it a very poor choice for a Guts sweeper. Finally, Taunt is an option on either set, but Gurdurr is far too slow to be running it.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>In terms of checks and counters, you could just hope Gurdurr drops its iron girder on its foot! But if you are looking for a more sensible approach, feel free to keep reading. Musharna is one of the best checks to either set, as it can tank any move Gurdurr has to offer and retaliate with a STAB Psychic; it is also slower than Gurdurr, causing Payback to have a mediocre 50 base power. Misdreavus is a great check to sets running Iron First, as it can outspeed and burn Gurdurr, thus crippling it for the rest of the match; however, it can struggle against Guts sets, and detests Knock Off. Iron Fist boosted Ice Punch is a 3-4HKO against Golbat, while Golbat can Taunt Gurdurr to prevent it from using Bulk Up, Roost off any damage from Ice Punch or Stone Edge, and strike back with a super effective Brave Bird. Vileplume only struggles to tank Ice Punch, and it can put Gurdurr to sleep, then switch out to an appropriate check. Charizard can take on Gurdurr to a decent extent, taking everything but Stone Edge well, and KOing with Air Slash after just a bit of prior damage. Psychic-types, such as Gardevoir and Exeggutor, can switch in on Fighting-type moves with ease and KO Gurdurr with Psychic. Grumpig, on the other hand, can take any hit from Gurdurr and Whirlwind, fearing absolutely nothing Gurdurr has to use against it: Psychic resists Fighting, Thick Fat adds an Ice-type resistance, and Payback will always go first when Grumpig uses Whirlwind. Finally, Garbodor and Weezing can both Clear Smog against Bulk Up variants to remove the boosts that Gurdurr has gathered.</p>
  12. Shame That

    Shame That cheerio
    is a Battle Server Moderatoris a Contributor Alumnus
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    Sep 20, 2011
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    discussed a few changes on IRC and this is an a-ok amcheck

    [gp]2/2[/gp]
  13. gamer boy

    gamer boy

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2013
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    817
    Nice going Treeko XD
  14. Hollywood

    Hollywood she's thin, she's blonde, she says "wow" a lot
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Battle Server Administratoris a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon IRC SOPis a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Other Metas Leader

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    Messages:
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    Gurdurr ready for upload
  15. Raseri

    Raseri here to help
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Researcher Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
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