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Gyarados (BW2 Update) [QC 3/3] [GP 2/2]

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by Jukain, Mar 3, 2013.

  1. Hemp Man

    Hemp Man

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    Well here's a list, which examples should we include?

    Offensive DD Life Orb +1 Adamant
    • Deoxys-D (OU Offensive Spiker) Bounce 79.66 - 94.19% Waterfall 75.1 - 88.79%
      Vaporeon (OU Hydration Tank) Bounce 81.79 - 96.25% Stone Edge 63.84 - 75.31%
      Dragonite (OU Rain Mixed Attacker [Multiscale]) Stone Edge 81.73 - 96.28% Bounce 52.01 - 61.3%
      Reuniclus (OU Offensive Trick Room) Bounce 82.39 - 97.31% Waterfall 77.5 - 91.44%
      Jirachi (OU Wish + Calm Mind) Earthquake 82.92 - 97.77% Waterfall 49.5 - 58.91%
      Magnezone (OU Substitute + 3 Attacks [Air Balloon]) Waterfall 83.44 - 98.62% Stone Edge 34.82 - 41.03%
      Hippowdon (OU Physical Wall) Waterfall 83.57 - 99.04% Bounce 44.52 - 52.38%
      Scizor (OU Bulky Swords Dance) Bounce 84.01 - 99.12% Waterfall 79.36 - 93.31%
      Scizor (OU Trapper) Bounce 84.25 - 99.41% Waterfall 79.59 - 93.58%
      Landorus-T (OU Offensive Pivot [Intimidate]) Waterfall 83.19 - 99.45% Bounce 44.71 - 52.84%
      Garchomp (OU Placeholder) Bounce 84.59 - 99.71% Waterfall 79.83 - 93.83%
      Latias (OU Calm Mind) Bounce 86.81 - 102.19% Stone Edge 68.13 - 80.21%
      Blissey (OU Support) Bounce 87.88 - 103.52% Waterfall 82.66 - 97.54%
      Rotom-W (OU Choice) Stone Edge 88.01 - 104.13% Bounce 56.19 - 66.52%
      Donphan (OU Defensive Rapid Spin) Waterfall 90.1 - 106.25% Bounce 48.17 - 56.77%
      Jellicent (OU Special Wall) Bounce 91.08 - 107.42% Stone Edge 71.53 - 84.4%
      Gastrodon (OU Tank) Bounce 93.42 - 109.85% Earthquake 73 - 86.15%
      Gastrodon (OU Choice Specs) Bounce 93.3 - 110.42% Earthquake 73.2 - 86.35%
      Latios (OU Dual Screens) Bounce 95.32 - 112.36% Stone Edge 74.72 - 87.91%
      Politoed (OU Choice Specs) Bounce 95.57 - 112.76% Stone Edge 74.73 - 88.28%
      Gyarados (OU RestTalk) Stone Edge 96.44 - 113.45% Bounce 61.42 - 72.58%
      Gyarados (OU Bulky Support) Stone Edge 96.69 - 113.74% Bounce 61.57 - 72.77%
      Hydreigon (OU Substitute) Bounce 96.93 - 114.11% Stone Edge 76.07 - 89.57%
      Gyarados (OU Bulky Dragon Dance [Intimidate]) Stone Edge 97.86 - 115.73% Bounce 62.4 - 73.86%
      Metagross (OU Stealth Rock) Earthquake 99.17 - 117.03% Waterfall 59.89 - 70.6%
      Gliscor (OU Defensive) Waterfall 99.15 - 117.51% Bounce 52.82 - 62.71%
      Gyarados (OU Choice Band [Intimidate]) Stone Edge 99.69 - 117.82% Bounce 63.74 - 75.52%
      Jellicent (OU Choice Specs) Bounce 100.52 - 118.75% Stone Edge 78.9 - 92.96%

    vs Offensive DD Life Orb +1 Jolly:

    • Deoxys-D (OU Offensive Spiker) Bounce 72.61 - 85.89% Waterfall 68.46 - 80.91%
      Vaporeon (OU Hydration Tank) Bounce 74.31 - 87.53% Stone Edge 58.35 - 68.82%
      Dragonite (OU Rain Mixed Attacker [Multiscale]) Stone Edge 74.3 - 87.61% Bounce 47.36 - 55.72%
      Reuniclus (OU Offensive Trick Room) Bounce 75.3 - 88.75% Waterfall 70.66 - 83.37%
      Jirachi (OU Wish + Calm Mind) Earthquake 75.24 - 88.86% Waterfall 45.29 - 53.46%
      Magnezone (OU Substitute + 3 Attacks [Air Balloon]) Waterfall 75.86 - 90% Stone Edge 31.72 - 37.58%
      Scizor (OU Bulky Swords Dance) Bounce 77.03 - 90.69% Waterfall 71.8 - 84.88%
      Landorus-T (OU Offensive Pivot [Intimidate]) Waterfall 76.69 - 90.78% Bounce 40.37 - 47.96%
      Hippowdon (OU Physical Wall) Waterfall 76.66 - 90.95% Bounce 40.95 - 48.33%
      Scizor (OU Trapper) Bounce 77.25 - 90.96% Waterfall 72.01 - 85.13%
      Garchomp (OU Placeholder) Bounce 76.75 - 91.03% Waterfall 72.54 - 85.43%
      Latias (OU Calm Mind) Bounce 78.57 - 93.13% Stone Edge 62.08 - 73.07%
      Blissey (OU Support) Bounce 79.75 - 94.17% Waterfall 75.3 - 88.65%
      Rotom-W (OU Choice) Stone Edge 80.57 - 95.04% Bounce 51.65 - 60.74%
      Donphan (OU Defensive Rapid Spin) Waterfall 82.03 - 97.39% Bounce 43.75 - 51.82%
      Jellicent (OU Special Wall) Bounce 82.92 - 97.77% Stone Edge 65.34 - 76.98%
      Gastrodon (OU Tank) Bounce 85.21 - 100% Earthquake 66.43 - 78.4%
      Gastrodon (OU Choice Specs) Bounce 85.11 - 100.74% Earthquake 66.74 - 78.66%
      Latios (OU Dual Screens) Bounce 86.81 - 102.19% Stone Edge 68.13 - 80.21%
      Politoed (OU Choice Specs) Bounce 86.71 - 102.6% Stone Edge 68.48 - 80.46%
      Gyarados (OU RestTalk) Stone Edge 87.81 - 103.55% Bounce 55.83 - 66.24%
      Gyarados (OU Bulky Support) Stone Edge 88.04 - 103.81% Bounce 55.97 - 66.41%
      Hydreigon (OU Substitute) Bounce 87.73 - 103.98% Stone Edge 69.32 - 81.59%
      Gyarados (OU Bulky Dragon Dance [Intimidate]) Stone Edge 90.13 - 106.13% Bounce 57.06 - 67.46%
      Metagross (OU Stealth Rock) Earthquake 90.65 - 107.14% Waterfall 54.67 - 64.28%
      Gyarados (OU Choice Band [Intimidate]) Stone Edge 91.23 - 107.55% Bounce 58 - 68.58%
      Gliscor (OU Defensive) Waterfall 90.96 - 107.9% Bounce 48.58 - 57.34%
      Jellicent (OU Choice Specs) Bounce 91.66 - 108.59% Stone Edge 72.13 - 84.89%
  2. alexwolf

    alexwolf Fear the D
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    Yeah i meant Jolly thanks.

    Also Hemp Man we are not going to mention any of those calcs, as Adamant is better for the offensive set for the bigger damage output in general, and Jolly doesn't outspeed anything major that justifies making it the first slash.
  3. Hemp Man

    Hemp Man

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    Nah don't worry its okay. I think he's basically covered everything that needs to be said for Gyarados at this point.
  4. Jukain

    Jukain .leaf
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    hi this has been ready for 2 weeks...
  5. alexwolf

    alexwolf Fear the D
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  6. Jukain

    Jukain .leaf
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    OH those were the changes I almost finished but accidentally closed my browser doing. all done now.
  7. shrang

    shrang Go to your room
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    Few things:

    1) One thing you really need to emphasise for Gyarados is its typing. Water / Flying is excellent defensively, and with Intimidate and good bulk, this is what turns Gyarados from a ordinary Dragon Dancer to a great one. Unlike many other Dragon Dancers in the tier, Gyarados is not taken down easily by priority (resists Mach Punch and Bullet Punch while taking very little from Ice Shard). Its typing also gives it some great resistances, such as Fighting, Ground immunity, Fire, Steel (Bullet Punch), and along with Intimidate, it helps it set up much, much easier. I really think this is important for readers to know.

    2) I'm getting the feeling from the first DD set that Gyarados beats Ferrothorn easily. It really doesn't. It can pretty much spam Power Whip and 2HKO you with it or prevent you setting up Substitutes. It can Leech Seed you as you come back down from Bounce, and Protect variants will foil Bounce.

    3)
    I think it's probably assuming too much if you think Ferrothorn is going to be burned when Gyarados comes in. Probably just remove the Ferrothorn mention, IMO.
  8. tehy

    tehy

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    I think Shrang's got a point but instead of removing it entirely, why not just emphasize Body Slam as the main reason for it, then list right after that "oh and by the way Ferro's burned PW doesn't break it either".
  9. Hemp Man

    Hemp Man

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    One complaint I have is that the SubDD set says the biggest problems are Skarmory, Electric Types, and Bulky Waters. I've never really had problem with Electric types (besides Rotom-W, who would count as a Bulky Water anyway) mainly because stuff like Jolteon can't really switch into Waterfall anyway. I think replacing Electric Types with Ferrothorn would be better.
  10. dice

    dice infinite bliss flows but does not ebb
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    Maybe mention Will-o-Wisp Rotom-W, Gengar, Mew, Heatran, etc. as partners to burn Ferrothorn so Gyarados has ample set-up time?

    Just a random thought.
  11. Hemp Man

    Hemp Man

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    Will-O-Wisp is a good idea but I wouldn't list Heatran as a partner. I don't think anyone keeps their Ferrothorn in against Heatran, I think Jellicant may be a better partner. Especially if its in the Rain.
  12. Seth Vilo

    Seth Vilo

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    <---
    And this guy.

    Burn+Intimidate = super easy DD's on physical stuff. Obvious statement is obvious. Sableye presence can also cause Terrakion, a Gyarados check with Scarf, to not spam CC in "favor" of Fail Edge, which can be helpful to your team overall. The same can be said for any Ghost though.

    EDIT: @below, Sableye also completely stops Substitute variants of Toxicroak (as well as most others), so more points as a Gyara partner.
  13. alexwolf

    alexwolf Fear the D
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    The biggest threats to this Gyarados are Perish Song Celebi, any Toxicroak with Substitute, Ferrothorn, Kyurem-B, and Encore or Perish Song Politoed. Skarmory is 2HKOed by +1 Waterfall in rain and can't do anything to Skarmory except for phazing it, thus only delaying the problem, electric types all fall to boosted Gyarados or are OHKOed on the switch (only Thunderbolt Rotom-W can deal with Gyarados and it is not a very common move) and the only water types that can deal with Gyarados are Politoed, Roar Vaporeor, and RestTalk Gyarados, and the last two are so rare that don't really deserve any mention. So just focus on the Pokemon that give to Gyarados real troubles, and then you can also talk a bit about how Skarmory is a good counter outside of rain and an ok check in it, as well as how electric types can scare out an unboosted Gyarados, and then mention partners to take care of them.

    When saying that Politoed support enables Gyarados to OHKO Jirachi, Rotom-W, Garchomp, and Magnezone, mention that this is after a boost.

    Change this to: ''After a boost Gyarados is nigh impossible to wall, allowing it to soften up the opponent's team nicely so that another Pokemon can sweep''. Sorry for telling you to change this sentence again but i realized that even if Gyarados's counter are alive, Gyarados can still weaken them to the point that another can get past them, so it's not as if Gyarados can't do its job if its checks are alive (i don't think there is any true counter to this thing).
  14. Jukain

    Jukain .leaf
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    implemented changes ^.^
  15. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
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    [qc]3/3[/qc]
  16. Jukain

    Jukain .leaf
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    ty and have fun gp ;)
  17. Seth Vilo

    Seth Vilo

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    Bulky DD says: "For Toxicroak, Pokemon such as Landorus-T, Latias, and Latios are recommended."

    I get the first one, but with Ice Punch and Sucker Punch being staple on Toxicroak, why the Lati@s?
  18. Jukain

    Jukain .leaf
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    Latias and Latios are at least good checks to non-Sucker Punch Toxicroak, so they deserve their mentions.
  19. Seth Vilo

    Seth Vilo

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    The only non-Sucker Punch set on sight is Substitute+Bulk Up (which still has it slashed). While possible to catch one off guard without a Sub, if it does have that Sub up suddenly Lati@s have to break it before they can truly check it, while taking 56.29 - 66.88% for Latios and 42.85 - 50.54% for max HP Latias with non-boosted 132 Atk Ice Punch. That's a shaky check at best I think. There's also the factor that 84.014% of all Toxicroak in March had Sucker Punch. It may be just me, but the Lati@s don't seem like good checks at all.

    EDIT: I guess I'm just the only one who doesn't see it... Nevermind then.
  20. alexwolf

    alexwolf Fear the D
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    To answer to your concern, the only Toxicroak variants that are problems with Gyarados are those with Sub, as they can protect from Bounce and are immune to Waterfall, and the variants of Toxicroak with Sub are BU, SubPunch, and SubToxic, and all of them are checked by Landorus-T, Latios, and Latias.
  21. cbt

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    <p>Gyarados is easily one of the most threatening sweepers in the OU tier. While it hasn't changed much from DPP, nothing needed to be changed;, as Gyarados is still a monster. It has two STABs with great coverage and above-average stats across the board, in addition to two stellar abilities in Intimidate and Moxie. Gyarados is most commonly seen sporting a bulky Dragon Dance sweeper set, allowing it to set up on and tear apart many Pokemon. On the flip side, Gyarados can also run a more defensive RestTalk set aiming to utilize Gyarados's numerous resistances and the immense physical bulk granted by Intimidate. Gyarados can even utilize rain perfectly with its terrifying double-STAB Waterfalls. Unfortunately, the popularity of Volt Switch and Electric-type attackers in general makes Gyarados's life difficult. Additionally, Gyarados has rather lackluster initial Speed, meaning it can be forced out easily, which is compounded by its Stealth Rock weakness. Gyarados can still be outsped by many Choice Scarf users after a Dragon Dance, of which many can OHKO Gyarados. However, physical Water-type attackers are a rare commodity, in OU at least, making Gyarados a tough competitor in today's metagame.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Bulky Dragon Dance
    move 1: Substitute / Taunt
    move 2: Dragon Dance
    move 3: Waterfall
    move 4: Bounce
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 88 HP / 248 Atk / 4 Def / 168 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This is Gyarados's bread-and-butter set this generation, being able to set up on a multitude of Pokemon. Dragon Dance is just an amazing move for Gyarados, boosting its Attack to ungodly high levels and patching up its underwhelming Speed. Gyarados also has an amazing Water / Flying typing, which distinguishes it from other Dragon Dance users. It provides resistances to common Fighting-type attacks (such as Mach Punch and Close Combat), Fire-type attacks, Bullet Punch, and U-turn, and an immunity to Ground. With Intimidate, Gyarados can even tanke attacks such as Ice Shard, Icicle Crash, and Crunch. The most common variant of this set runs Substitute, which makes setting up much easier. With Substitute, Gyarados can avoid status, revenge killers, and Volt Switches. In a metagame full of those three things, Substitute makes it much less of a burden to set up. All walls that don't carry phazing moves are going to be in trouble against Gyarados. Terrakion will not be able to revenge kill Gyarados lest it be KOed by Waterfall (the same with other revenge killers). The other, less common variant runs Taunt, which is geared specifically toward walls. Taunt renders walls unable to phaze, recover health, or use a status move, or Perish Song. It is essential if you wish to beat Skarmory or Hippowdon with Gyarados, as both can take a +1 Waterfall and phaze Gyarados out. Additionally, it allows Gyarados to beat Perish Song Celebi with Flying resists, one of its biggest counters.</p>

    <p>As for the moves, Gyarados's STABs generally provide enough coverage. Waterfall, especially with a rain boost, can put heavy dents in any Pokemon unlucky enough to be at the receiving end of it. Bounce has nice coverage with Waterfall, most notably hitting bulky Water-types, and ensures Gyarados's Substitute isn't broken while it attacks, only faltering against Thunder in rain.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EVs allow Gyarados to outrun Jolteon at +1 and prevent Jirachi and burned Ferrothorn from breaking a Substitute with Body Slam and Power Whip, respectively. In order to burn Ferrothorn, partners that carry Will-O-Wisp, such as Rotom-W, Gengar, Mew, Heatran, and Sableye, are recommended. Sableye in particular makes a good partner, as it can take advantage of its priority Will-O-Wisp to cripple foes such as Terrakion and Toxicroak. The HP number achieved increases the healing received from Leftovers. The remaining EVs are pumped into Attack for more power. Waterfall is obviously irreplaceable on this set, but Bounce isn't. Stone Edge can be used to hit Rotom-W, opposing Gyarados, and Dragonite harder, in addition to being more reliable against Substitute Kyurem-B, but Bounce is generally more useful. The choice of ability choice is one of vital importance. Intimidate allows Gyarados to reduce the power of its foes upon switching in, allowing for easier set-up and better match-ups against Pokemon such as Scizor, while Moxie boosts Gyarados's Attack with each kill, making it much more potent offensively. The choice really depends on whether you want a more offensive or defensive Gyarados. Do note, however, that Intimidate ensures Substitutes can't be broken by foes such as lead Mamoswine's and Choice Scarf Jirachi's respective Ice Shard and Ice Punch, respectively.</p>

    <p>The biggest threats to Gyarados are Perish Song Celebi, Substitute Toxicroak, Ferrothorn, Kyurem-B, and defensive Politoed, so Gyarados's teammates should be able to handle these Pokemon. Politoed is almost mandatory, because the rain it brings boosts the power of Waterfall, which allows Gyarados to 2HKO Skarmory and, OHKO 252 HP Jirachi, Choice Scarf Rotom-W, Garchomp, and Magnezone with a boost. Skarmory can also be a bit of a pain for Gyarados; Choice Specs Politoed can OHKO with Surf. To Jolteon and Thundurus-T, while having to take a risk to do so, can absorb Electric-type attacks aimed at Gyarados, while Gyarados can switch in on Ground-type attacks aimed at the former. Both can dispatch Politoed with ease, and Jolteon can even pass Gyarados a Substitute. To deal with Ferrothorn and Skarmory, Magnezone makes a great partner, as does Choice Specs Gothitelle. Gothitelle can also handle Choice Scarf Terrakion, Celebi, and Politoed. Terrakion is a good choice for Kyurem-B, while the aforementioned Gothitelle does best for Celebi. Scizor and Tyranitar are alsother good choices to handle Celebi. For Toxicroak, Pokemon such as Landorus-T, Latias, and Latios are helpful in recommendedmoving it. Finally, Rapid Spin support is appreciated, as having Stealth Rock off the field allows itGyarados to switch in with much greater ease. Starmie is the best choice for a spinner, as it can deal heavy damage to bulky Water-types and Skarmory.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Offensive Dragon Dance
    move 1: Dragon Dance
    move 2: Waterfall
    move 3: Bounce
    move 4: Stone Edge / Earthquake
    item: Life Orb / Lum Berry
    ability: Moxie
    nature: Adamant / Jolly
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This Gyarados tosses aside easier setup for greatly increased offensive potential. After just one Dragon Dance, Gyarados can outspeed pretty much the entire unboosted OU tier. After a boost, Gyarados is nigh impossible to wall, allowing it to soften up the opponent's team to the point where another Pokemon can sweep. When you factor in the sheer power of this set, it needs much less support than other sets. You won't have any issue getting Gyarados in either due to the ubiquitous Close Combats present in the tier. With Gyarados's Attack sky-high after just one boost, it can just start attacking. It has no trouble punching massive holes early- to mid-game.</p>

    <p>Naturally, Waterfall is the powermain move, ripping apart pretty much every Pokemon in the tier with rain and Dragon Dance boosts. Bounce is of course Gyarados's other STAB move, hitting Grass-types, such as Celebi, that resist Waterfall hard, as well as dealing heavy damage to all common Dragon-types. Without having to mess with a non-attacking move to set up, Gyarados also has room for a coverage move. Stone Edge hits Kyurem-B, Rotom-W, and Flying-types, such as Dragonite, for heavy damage. Earthquake, on the other hand, hits Magnezone, Tentacruel, Toxicroak, Jirachi, and Heatran hard, which is especially useful in sun.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>There are important distinctions between the two nature choices on this set; while Jolly allows Gyarados to outrun Jolteon and Choice Scarf Politoed at +1 and Jolly Choice Scarf Mamoswine with nout a boost, Adamant gives a noticeable power buff. Jolly also makes Gyarados much faster unboosted, but the loss in power is significant against foes such as Ferrothorn, as well as for hole punching. Since Gyarados can boost past the threats Jolly is needed to outspeed, Adamant is usually preferred, but it's your preference. For the item, Life Orb is usually best, boosting Gyarados's power even higher, which is what this set is all about. However, Lum Berry helps immensely against status users such as Ferrothorn and Jirachi and lets Gyarados avoid an untimely Scald burn. Double-Edge is a viable coverage option for Rotom-W and Dragon-types (most notably Substitute Kyurem-B). It also has amazing neutral coverage; Return is an option if you don't want the recoil, though it loses out against Kyurem-B. Unfortunately, Double-Edge has rather nasty recoil, so only use it if you plan to play Gyarados recklessly. Finally, Intimidate can be used over Moxie to aid setting up, but it really just gets away from the whole point of this set: power. The only reason to use it is because Double-Edge is unfortunately illegal with Intimidate.</p>

    <p>Rain support helps Gyarados get certain OHKOes after a boost, so Politoed is appreciated as a partner, but it is not obligatory, as this set still has enough power without rain. Rapid Spin support is essential with Life Orb, as Stealth Rock damage piled on with Life Orb recoil means Gyarados dies too quickly. Starmie and Tentacruel are good options because they can deal with many of Gyarados's checks and counters, such as Skarmory. Suicide leads that carry Taunt, such as Terrakion and Mew, also work to prevent Stealth Rock. Moving on, Gyarados has a lot of trouble against revenge killers without Substitute. Latios, Terrakion, and Salamence can all outrun Gyarados, even if it has a +1 boost. Scizor can utilize its powerful Bullet Punch to deal with most revenge killers. Substitute + Calm Mind Jirachi and Swords Dance Scizor are Pokemon that can take advantage of weak Choice Scarf users and set up. Ferrothorn and Jellicent are difficult for Gyarados to get past, so Magnezone and Nasty Plot Celebi with Hidden Power Fire are good partners.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Choice Scarf
    move 1: Waterfall
    move 2: Ice Fang
    move 3: Stone Edge
    move 4: Earthquake
    item: Choice Scarf
    ability: Moxie
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>While Gyarados is no doubt a deadly sweeper, it can also function as an effective revenge killer. With a Choice Scarf attached, Gyarados can outrun many notable threats, just barely outpacing +1 Adamant Dragonite and having enough bulk to tank boosted priority moves, such as Breloom's Mach Punch. With Moxie, Gyarados can even function as a late-game cleaner à la Choice Scarf Salamence. Rain-boosted Waterfall and Moxie are Gyarados's main advantages over other Choice Scarf users. The other moves are for rather specific targets. Ice Fang is the best move Gyarados has to hit Dragon-types, such as Dragonite, Salamence, Latias, and Latios. Stone Edge hits Volcarona and Kyurem-B hard; it is necessary for the former under sun and doesn't carry the risk of activating Flame Body. Finally, Earthquake does solid damage to Tentacruel and Toxicroak.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Adamant is almost always the preferred nature; the only time Jolly is useful is on rain teams that have trouble against Jolteon. A move worth consideration is Outrage. Outrage can OHKO Latias after Stealth Rock damage, which is a feat Ice Fang simply can't manage. Unfortunately, it has a rather nasty lock-in side effect that pretty much ensures Gyarados will die the next turn.</p>

    <p>Rain support is non-negotiable with this set, as otherwise Gyarados is completely outclassed by Salamence. Rapid Spin support is another requirement because it ensures Gyarados can switch in and out freely. Starmie is the best choice, as it can hit bulky Water-types for good damage and soften up opponents to set the stage for Gyarados. After taking Hydro Pumps from Starmie, the opponent will be ill-equipped to handle Gyarados. Other options include Tentacruel, who can Toxic bulky Water-types, and Forretress, who can set up hazards and take physical hits well. Unfortunately, the former has a hard time against spinblockers. It is important to note that Gyarados isn't an amazing revenge killer; it's best used to sweep late-game. Therefore, you probably shouldn't use Gyarados as your sole Choice Scarf user. In any case, bulky Water-types, Ferrothorn, Latias, Kyurem-B, and Celebi are perfect stops for this set. Your own Celebi can take care of bulky Water-types, while Scizor can deal with Ferrothorn, Latias, Kyurem-B, and Celebi as well as use Bullet Punch to help Gyarados with its revenge killing duties.</p>

    [SET]
    name: RestTalk
    move 1: Rest
    move 2: Sleep Talk
    move 3: Waterfall
    move 4: Roar / Dragon Tail
    item: Leftovers
    ability: Intimidate
    nature: Impish
    evs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Although it is an effective attacker, Gyarados can also perform well with a defensive set. With solid bulk, a great typing, and Intimidate, Gyarados has all the tools it needs to be a good bulky Water-type. However, Gyarados is a bit different from your usual bulky Water-type, as it doesn't have reliable recovery. Resistances to Fighting, Bug, and Steel, as well ands an immunity to Ground make Gyarados a stellar pivot. Consequentially, Gyarados is also a perfect counter to Scizor, Mamoswine, and Volcarona outside of sun. In order to be healthy enough to deal with these threats, Gyarados unfortunately must rely on RestTalk, which is a rather shaky combination, especially with this generation's sleep mechanics. On the other hand, it does make Gyarados much more sturdy. Just be sure to avoid resting while foes such as Jolteon are still alive, as Gyarados hates being forced out while asleep. Waterfall provides Gyarados with a reliable attacking move. The last slot gives Gyarados a phazing move, which helps against setup sweepers and allows Gyarados to spread entry hazard damage; Roar is 100% accurate and can hit through Substitute, while Dragon Tail isn't affected by Taunt and can hit Magic Bounce users, which is helpful for teams that struggle against Baton Pass chains.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Since Gyarados is meant to challenge physical attackers, its EVs should make it as bulky as possible. While Gyarados should usually run Rest and Sleep Talk, theis scenario is different if a good Wish passer and Rapid Spin user are paired with it. If that is the case, RestTalk should be replaced with Taunt and Thunder Wave. The former helps against defensive Pokemon, while the latter can cripple offensive Pokemon. However, in order to run those, you again need to have a Wish passer and Rapid Spin user. For the Wish passer, Jirachi is best used because of its great defensive synergy with Gyarados, particularly helping against Kyurem-B; Terrakion and Scizor also work for that purpose. For the Rapid Spin user, Forretress is best, as it can tanke Outrages, which Gyarados cannot do. A Pokemon that can trap Ghost-types, such as Choice Scarf Tyranitar or Gothitelle, is useful to ensure Forretress can spin. Additionally, Heal Bell Celebi makes a great partner, as it counters Thundurus-T and other Electric-types that threaten Gyarados. Heal Bell can also wake up Gyarados if it is sleeping, which is helpful. Finally, Ferrothorn can set up entry hazards and take Electric- and Rock-type attacks, making it a good partner.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Choice Band
    move 1: Waterfall / Aqua Tail
    move 2: Double Edge
    move 3: Ice Fang / Stone Edge
    move 4: Earthquake
    item: Choice Band
    abilty: Intimidate
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 88 HP / 252 Atk / 168 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This set sacrifices the ability to sweep in exchange for raw power right off the bat. With a Choice Band and Intimidate, Gyarados makes for an amazing offensive pivot. This is no surprise combined with Gyarados's Fighting and Water resistances and Ground immunity. Most importantly, Gyarados can switch into threats such as Volcarona, Mamoswine, and special Landorus. Once it is in, Gyarados can hit the foe with a powerful attack. It plays as a sort of hit-and-run, all-purpose attacker; the best term to use here is "hard-hitting tank." Gyarados's rain-boosted Waterfalls strike fear in the hearts of its opponents. Boasting a fairly high flinch rate and perfect accuracy, Waterfall is almost always the superior option. However, Aqua Tail allows Gyarados to OHKO certain foes, such as defensive Landorus-T and Choice Scarf Jirachi. Double-Edge is mainly used to hit a lured-in Rotom-W, though no bulky Water-type other than Jellicent appreciates being hit by it. Ice Fang is preferred in the third slot to hit Grass-types such as Celebi and Breloom, being the only move on this set that can OHKO the latter; it also hits Dragon-types hard. Stone Edge, on the other hand, does a boatload of damage to Kyurem-B and opposing Gyarados. Finally, Earthquake does heavy damage to Jirachi, Ninetales, Tentacruel, and Toxicroak.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EVs allow Gyarados to outrun Adamant Breloom while still being powerful enough to dish out heavy damage; the remaining EVs are placed in HP to give Gyarados a little bulk. Avalanche can be used instead of Ice Fang for a harder hit, but negative priority is a major detriment, as Gyarados doesn't want to take any unnecessary damage. Bite can 2HKO Jellicent and Celebi and deal solid damage to Starmie and Latios.</p>

    <p>Rain support is a necessity for Gyarados, as otherwise it just doesn't hit hard enough to be justified over another Choice Band user, such as Dragonite or Terrakion. Additionally, Gyarados has a rather nasty Stealth Rock weakness, so since it intends to switch in and out a lot, so Rapid Spin support is required. Life Orb Starmie is the best choice, as it can beat most bulky Water-types and provide Rapid Spin support; unfortunately it adds yet another Electric weakness to the team. Breloom, specifically the SubPunch variant, is another choice to beat bulky Water-types. It can set up a Substitute on and kill Jellicent, which Starmie can't do; Gastrodon, Tentacruel, and Politoed are also vulnerable to it. Finally, be sure to have Pokemon such as Terrakion or Jirachi to deal with Kyurem-B.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Gyarados really doesn't have any other options worth considering. Aqua Tail could be used over Waterfall on Dragon Dance sets for bit of extra power, but its lower accuracy makes it usually not worth it. While Scald might seem tempting for a bulky set, its lack of power makes Gyarados complete Taunt fodder. Flail isn't really that great for Gyarados with its relatively low Speed. Wacan Berry could be worth a shot, but Gyarados still dies to most Electric-type moves anyway. Bounce and Outrage might be worth a look on Choice sets, but they have detrimental lock-in effects that make them not worth the while.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Despite its diversity, Gyarados has quite a few counters. The foremost of these is Ferrothorn, who can take pretty much any attack and break Gyarados's Substitutes with Power Whip. Additionally, it can set up Stealth Rock, which makes Gyarados's life miserable. Skarmory is also difficult to break through and can phaze out Gyarados, negating any boosts it has obtained. Rotom-W is also a good response, especially if it carries Thunderbolt. Gyarados really can't hit Rotom-W hard at all outside of a Choice Band-boosted Double-Edge. Opposing defensive Gyarados also fare well, as it can phaze your Gyarados out. Kyurem-B is another solid counter, boasting the ability to take any hit, even Stone Edge in a pinch, and OHKO with Fusion Bolt in return. Finally, Porygon2 can shake off everything Gyarados can throw at it and OHKO back with a Thunderbolt.</p>

    <p>Any Pokemon that can outspeed Gyarados after a Dragon Dance is a pretty good check. These Pokemon include Choice Scarf Terrakion and Choice Scarf Thundurus-T. The latter resists Bounce, making it an even better switch-in; the latformer is a much riskier choice, as it is weak to Water is a much riskier choifall and doesn't resist Bounce. Jolteon can only outspeed non-Jolly variants that are at +1, but it works too. However, none of them can really switch in out of fear of Waterfall. Pokemon that resist or are immune to Water, such as Gastrodon, Starmie, Cloyster, Celebi, and Toxicroak, are also good checks. None of them, especially Celebi and Toxicroak, particularly enjoy taking a Bounce, however. For this reason, they are best when combined with a Pokemon that resists Flying. Perish Song Celebi with such partners is particularly good. Toxicroak is only useful against the Substitute + Dragon Dance variant and only if it runs Substitute itself. If all else fails, a surprise Electric-type move, such as ThunderPunch on Jirachi or Hidden Power Electric on Keldeo, will do in a pinch.</p>


    c/p
    Show Hide
    <p>Gyarados is easily one of the most threatening sweepers in the OU tier. While it hasn't changed much from DPP, nothing needed to be changed, as Gyarados is still a monster. It has two STABs with great coverage and above-average stats across the board, in addition to two stellar abilities in Intimidate and Moxie. Gyarados is most commonly seen sporting a bulky Dragon Dance sweeper set, allowing it to set up and tear apart many Pokemon. On the flip side, Gyarados can also run a more defensive RestTalk set aiming to utilize Gyarados's numerous resistances and the immense physical bulk granted by Intimidate. Gyarados can even utilize rain perfectly with its terrifying double-STAB Waterfalls. Unfortunately, the popularity of Volt Switch and Electric-type attackers in general makes Gyarados's life difficult. Additionally, Gyarados has rather lackluster initial Speed, meaning it can be forced out easily, which is compounded by its Stealth Rock weakness. Gyarados can still be outsped by many Choice Scarf users after a Dragon Dance, of which many can OHKO Gyarados. However, physical Water-type attackers are a rare commodity in OU at least, making Gyarados a tough competitor in today's metagame.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Bulky Dragon Dance
    move 1: Substitute / Taunt
    move 2: Dragon Dance
    move 3: Waterfall
    move 4: Bounce
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 88 HP / 248 Atk / 4 Def / 168 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This is Gyarados's bread-and-butter set this generation, being able to set up on a multitude of Pokemon. Dragon Dance is just an amazing move for Gyarados, boosting its Attack to ungodly high levels and patching up its underwhelming Speed. Gyarados also has an amazing Water / Flying typing, which distinguishes it from other Dragon Dance users. It provides resistances to common Fighting-type attacks (such as Mach Punch and Close Combat), Fire-type attacks, Bullet Punch, U-turn, and an immunity to Ground. With Intimidate, Gyarados can even tank attacks such as Ice Shard, Icicle Crash, and Crunch. The most common variant of this set runs Substitute, which makes setting up much easier. With Substitute, Gyarados can avoid status, revenge killers, and Volt Switches. In a metagame full of those three things, Substitute makes it much less of a burden to set up. All walls that don't carry phazing moves are going to be in trouble against Gyarados. Terrakion will not be able to revenge kill Gyarados lest it be KOed by Waterfall (the same with other revenge killers). The other, less common variant runs Taunt, which is geared specifically toward walls. Taunt renders walls unable to phaze, recover health,use a status move, or Perish Song. It is essential if you wish to beat Skarmory or Hippowdon with Gyarados, as both can take a +1 Waterfall and phaze Gyarados out. Additionally, it allows Gyarados to beat Perish Song Celebi, one of its biggest counters.</p>

    <p>As for the moves, Gyarados's STABs generally provide enough coverage. Waterfall, especially with a rain boost, can put heavy dents in any Pokemon unlucky enough to be at the receiving end of it. Bounce has nice coverage with Waterfall, most notably hitting bulky Water-types, and ensures Gyarados's Substitute isn't broken while it attacks, only faltering against Thunder in rain.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EVs allow Gyarados to outrun Jolteon at +1 and prevent Jirachi and burned Ferrothorn from breaking a Substitute with Body Slam and Power Whip, respectively. In order to burn Ferrothorn, partners that carry Will-O-Wisp, such as Rotom-W, Gengar, Mew, Heatran, and Sableye are recommended. Sableye in particular makes a good partner, as it can take advantage of its priority Will-O-Wisp to cripple foes such as Terrakion and Toxicroak. The HP number achieved increases the healing received from Leftovers. The remaining EVs are pumped into Attack for more power. Waterfall is obviously irreplaceable on this set, but Bounce isn't. Stone Edge can be used to hit Rotom-W, opposing Gyarados, and Dragonite harder, in addition to being more reliable against Substitute Kyurem-B, but Bounce is generally more useful. The choice of ability is of vital importance. Intimidate allows Gyarados to reduce the power of its foes upon switching in, allowing for easier set-up and better match-ups against Pokemon such as Scizor, while Moxie boosts Gyarados's Attack with each kill, making it much more potent offensively. The choice really depends on whether you want a more offensive or defensive Gyarados. Do note however that Intimidate ensures Substitutes can't be broken by foes such as lead Mamoswine's and Choice Scarf Jirachi's Ice Shard and Ice Punch, respectively.</p>

    <p>The biggest threats to Gyarados are Perish Song Celebi, Substitute Toxicroak, Ferrothorn, Kyurem-B, and defensive Politoed, so Gyarados's teammates should be able to handle these Pokemon. Politoed is almost mandatory, because the rain it brings boosts the power of Waterfall, which allows Gyarados to 2HKO Skarmory, OHKO 252 HP Jirachi, Choice Scarf Rotom-W, Garchomp, and Magnezone with a boost. Skarmory can also be a bit of a pain for Gyarados; Choice Specs Politoed can OHKO with Surf. Jolteon and Thundurus-T, while having to take a risk to do so, can absorb Electric-type attacks aimed at Gyarados, while Gyarados can switch in on Ground-type attacks aimed at the former. Both can dispatch Politoed with ease, and Jolteon can even pass Gyarados a Substitute. To deal with Ferrothorn and Skarmory, Magnezone makes a great partner, as does Choice Specs Gothitelle. Gothitelle can also handle Choice Scarf Terrakion, Celebi, and Politoed. Terrakion is a good choice for Kyurem-B, while the aforementioned Gothitelle does best for Celebi. Scizor and Tyranitar are also good choices to handle Celebi. For Toxicroak, Pokemon such as Landorus-T, Latias, and Latios are helpful in removing it. Finally, Rapid Spin support is appreciated, as having Stealth Rock off the field allows Gyarados to switch in with much greater ease. Starmie is the best choice for a spinner, as it can deal heavy damage to bulky Water-types and Skarmory.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Offensive Dragon Dance
    move 1: Dragon Dance
    move 2: Waterfall
    move 3: Bounce
    move 4: Stone Edge / Earthquake
    item: Life Orb / Lum Berry
    ability: Moxie
    nature: Adamant / Jolly
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This Gyarados tosses aside easier setup for greatly increased offensive potential. After just one Dragon Dance, Gyarados can outspeed pretty much the entire unboosted OU tier. After a boost, Gyarados is nigh impossible to wall, allowing it to soften up the opponent's team to the point where another Pokemon can sweep. When you factor in the sheer power of this set, it needs much less support than other sets. You won't have any issue getting Gyarados in either due to the ubiquitous Close Combats present in the tier. With Gyarados's Attack sky-high after just one boost, it can just start attacking. It has no trouble punching massive holes early- to mid-game.</p>

    <p>Naturally, Waterfall is the main move, ripping apart pretty much every Pokemon in the tier with rain and Dragon Dance boosts. Bounce is of course Gyarados's other STAB move, hitting Grass-types, such as Celebi that resist Waterfall hard, as well as dealing heavy damage to all common Dragon-types. Without having to mess with a non-attacking move to set up, Gyarados also has room for a coverage move. Stone Edge hits Kyurem-B, Rotom-W, and Flying-types, such as Dragonite, for heavy damage. Earthquake, on the other hand, hits Magnezone, Tentacruel, Toxicroak, Jirachi, and Heatran hard, which is especially useful in sun.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>There are important distinctions between the two nature choices on this set; while Jolly allows Gyarados to outrun Jolteon and Choice Scarf Politoed at +1 and Jolly Choice Scarf Mamoswine without a boost, Adamant gives a noticeable power buff. Jolly also makes Gyarados much faster unboosted, but the loss in power is significant against foes such as Ferrothorn, as well as for hole punching. Since Gyarados can boost past the threats Jolly is needed to outspeed, Adamant is usually preferred, but it's your preference. For the item, Life Orb is usually best, boosting Gyarados's power even higher, which is what this set is all about. However, Lum Berry helps immensely against status users such as Ferrothorn and Jirachi and lets Gyarados avoid an untimely Scald burn. Double-Edge is a viable coverage option for Rotom-W and Dragon-types (most notably Substitute Kyurem-B). It also has amazing neutral coverage; Return is an option if you don't want the recoil, though it loses out against Kyurem-B. Unfortunately, Double-Edge has rather nasty recoil, so only use it if you plan to play Gyarados recklessly. Finally, Intimidate can be used over Moxie to aid setting up, but it really just gets away from the whole point of this set: power. The only reason to use it is because Double-Edge is unfortunately illegal with Intimidate.</p>

    <p>Rain support helps Gyarados get certain OHKOes after a boost, so Politoed is appreciated as a partner, but it is not obligatory, as this set still has enough power without rain. Rapid Spin support is essential with Life Orb, as Stealth Rock damage piled on with Life Orb recoil means Gyarados dies too quickly. Starmie and Tentacruel are good options because they can deal with many of Gyarados's checks and counters, such as Skarmory. Suicide leads that carry Taunt, such as Terrakion and Mew, also work to prevent Stealth Rock. Moving on, Gyarados has a lot of trouble against revenge killers without Substitute. Latios, Terrakion, and Salamence can all outrun Gyarados, even if it has a +1 boost. Scizor can utilize its powerful Bullet Punch to deal with most revenge killers. Substitute + Calm Mind Jirachi and Swords Dance Scizor are Pokemon that can take advantage of weak Choice Scarf users and set up. Ferrothorn and Jellicent are difficult for Gyarados to get past, so Magnezone and Nasty Plot Celebi with Hidden Power Fire are good partners.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Choice Scarf
    move 1: Waterfall
    move 2: Ice Fang
    move 3: Stone Edge
    move 4: Earthquake
    item: Choice Scarf
    ability: Moxie
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>While Gyarados is no doubt a deadly sweeper, it can also function as an effective revenge killer. With a Choice Scarf attached, Gyarados can outrun many notable threats, just barely outpacing +1 Adamant Dragonite and having enough bulk to tank boosted priority moves, such as Breloom's Mach Punch. With Moxie, Gyarados can even function as a late-game cleaner à la Choice Scarf Salamence. Rain-boosted Waterfall and Moxie are Gyarados's main advantages over other Choice Scarf users. The other moves are for rather specific targets. Ice Fang is the best move Gyarados has to hit Dragon-types, such as Dragonite, Salamence, Latias, and Latios. Stone Edge hits Volcarona and Kyurem-B hard; it is necessary for the former under sun and doesn't carry the risk of activating Flame Body. Finally, Earthquake does solid damage to Tentacruel and Toxicroak.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Adamant is almost always the preferred nature; the only time Jolly is useful is on rain teams that have trouble against Jolteon. A move worth consideration is Outrage. Outrage can OHKO Latias after Stealth Rock damage, which is a feat Ice Fang simply can't manage. Unfortunately, it has a rather nasty lock-in side effect that pretty much ensures Gyarados will die the next turn.</p>

    <p>Rain support is non-negotiable with this set, as otherwise Gyarados is completely outclassed by Salamence. Rapid Spin support is another requirement because it ensures Gyarados can switch in and out freely. Starmie is the best choice, as it can hit bulky Water-types for good damage and soften up opponents to set the stage for Gyarados. After taking Hydro Pumps from Starmie, the opponent will be ill-equipped to handle Gyarados. Other options include Tentacruel, who can Toxic bulky Water-types, and Forretress, who can set up hazards and take physical hits well. Unfortunately, the former has a hard time against spinblockers. It is important to note that Gyarados isn't an amazing revenge killer; it's best used to sweep late-game. Therefore, you probably shouldn't use Gyarados as your sole Choice Scarf user. In any case, bulky Water-types, Ferrothorn, Latias, Kyurem-B, and Celebi are perfect stops for this set. Your own Celebi can take care of bulky Water-types, while Scizor can deal with Ferrothorn, Latias, Kyurem-B, and Celebi as well as use Bullet Punch to help Gyarados with its revenge killing duties.</p>

    [SET]
    name: RestTalk
    move 1: Rest
    move 2: Sleep Talk
    move 3: Waterfall
    move 4: Roar / Dragon Tail
    item: Leftovers
    ability: Intimidate
    nature: Impish
    evs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Although it is an effective attacker, Gyarados can also perform well with a defensive set. With solid bulk, a great typing, and Intimidate, Gyarados has all the tools it needs to be a good bulky Water-type. However, Gyarados is a bit different from your usual bulky Water-type, as it doesn't have reliable recovery. Resistances to Fighting, Bug, and Steel, as well as an immunity to Ground make Gyarados a stellar pivot. Consequentially, Gyarados is also a perfect counter to Scizor, Mamoswine, and Volcarona outside of sun. In order to be healthy enough to deal with these threats, Gyarados unfortunately must rely on RestTalk, which is a rather shaky combination, especially with this generation's sleep mechanics. On the other hand, it does make Gyarados much more sturdy. Just be sure to avoid resting while foes such as Jolteon are still alive, as Gyarados hates being forced out while asleep. Waterfall provides Gyarados with a reliable attacking move. The last slot gives Gyarados a phazing move, which helps against setup sweepers and allows Gyarados to spread entry hazard damage; Roar is 100% accurate and can hit through Substitute, while Dragon Tail isn't affected by Taunt and can hit Magic Bounce users, which is helpful for teams that struggle against Baton Pass chains.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Since Gyarados is meant to challenge physical attackers, its EVs should make it as bulky as possible. While Gyarados should usually run Rest and Sleep Talk, this scenario is different if a good Wish passer and Rapid Spin user are paired with it. If that is the case, RestTalk should be replaced with Taunt and Thunder Wave. The former helps against defensive Pokemon, while the latter can cripple offensive Pokemon. However, in order to run those, you again need to have a Wish passer and Rapid Spin user. For the Wish passer, Jirachi is best used because of its great defensive synergy with Gyarados, particularly helping against Kyurem-B; Terrakion and Scizor also work for that purpose. For the Rapid Spin user, Forretress is best, as it can tank Outrages, which Gyarados cannot do. A Pokemon that can trap Ghost-types, such as Choice Scarf Tyranitar or Gothitelle, is useful to ensure Forretress can spin. Additionally, Heal Bell Celebi makes a great partner, as it counters Thundurus-T and other Electric-types that threaten Gyarados. Heal Bell can also wake up Gyarados if it is sleeping, which is helpful. Finally, Ferrothorn can set up entry hazards and take Electric- and Rock-type attacks, making it a good partner.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Choice Band
    move 1: Waterfall / Aqua Tail
    move 2: Double Edge
    move 3: Ice Fang / Stone Edge
    move 4: Earthquake
    item: Choice Band
    abilty: Intimidate
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 88 HP / 252 Atk / 168 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This set sacrifices the ability to sweep in exchange for raw power right off the bat. With a Choice Band and Intimidate, Gyarados makes for an amazing offensive pivot. This is no surprise combined with Gyarados's Fighting and Water resistances and Ground immunity. Most importantly, Gyarados can switch into threats such as Volcarona, Mamoswine, and special Landorus. Once it is in, Gyarados can hit the foe with a powerful attack. It plays as a sort of hit-and-run, all-purpose attacker; the best term to use here is "hard-hitting tank." Gyarados's rain-boosted Waterfalls strike fear in the hearts of its opponents. Boasting a fairly high flinch rate and perfect accuracy, Waterfall is almost always the superior option. However, Aqua Tail allows Gyarados to OHKO certain foes, such as defensive Landorus-T and Choice Scarf Jirachi. Double-Edge is mainly used to hit a lured-in Rotom-W, though no bulky Water-type other than Jellicent appreciates being hit by it. Ice Fang is preferred in the third slot to hit Grass-types such as Celebi and Breloom, being the only move on this set that can OHKO the latter; it also hits Dragon-types hard. Stone Edge, on the other hand, does a boatload of damage to Kyurem-B and opposing Gyarados. Finally, Earthquake does heavy damage to Jirachi, Ninetales, Tentacruel, and Toxicroak.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EVs allow Gyarados to outrun Adamant Breloom while still being powerful enough to dish out heavy damage; the remaining EVs are placed in HP to give Gyarados a little bulk. Avalanche can be used instead of Ice Fang for a harder hit, but negative priority is a major detriment, as Gyarados doesn't want to take any unnecessary damage. Bite can 2HKO Jellicent and Celebi and deal solid damage to Starmie and Latios.</p>

    <p>Rain support is a necessity for Gyarados, as otherwise it just doesn't hit hard enough to be justified over another Choice Band user, such as Dragonite or Terrakion. Additionally, Gyarados has a rather nasty Stealth Rock weakness, so since it intends to switch in and out a lot, so Rapid Spin support is required. Life Orb Starmie is the best choice, as it can beat most bulky Water-types and provide Rapid Spin support; unfortunately it adds yet another Electric weakness to the team. Breloom, specifically the SubPunch variant, is another choice to beat bulky Water-types. It can set up a Substitute on and kill Jellicent, which Starmie can't do; Gastrodon, Tentacruel, and Politoed are also vulnerable to it. Finally, be sure to have Pokemon such as Terrakion or Jirachi to deal with Kyurem-B.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Gyarados really doesn't have any other options worth considering. Aqua Tail could be used over Waterfall on Dragon Dance sets for bit of extra power, but its lower accuracy makes it usually not worth it. While Scald might seem tempting for a bulky set, its lack of power makes Gyarados complete Taunt fodder. Flail isn't really that great for Gyarados with its relatively low Speed. Wacan Berry could be worth a shot, but Gyarados still dies to most Electric-type moves anyway. Bounce and Outrage might be worth a look on Choice sets, but they have detrimental lock-in effects that make them not worth the while.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Despite its diversity, Gyarados has quite a few counters. The foremost of these is Ferrothorn, who can take pretty much any attack and break Gyarados's Substitutes with Power Whip. Additionally, it can set up Stealth Rock, which makes Gyarados's life miserable. Skarmory is also difficult to break through and can phaze out Gyarados, negating any boosts it has obtained. Rotom-W is also a good response, especially if it carries Thunderbolt. Gyarados really can't hit Rotom-W hard at all outside of a Choice Band-boosted Double-Edge. Opposing defensive Gyarados also fare well, as it can phaze your Gyarados out. Kyurem-B is another solid counter, boasting the ability to take any hit, even Stone Edge in a pinch, and OHKO with Fusion Bolt in return. Finally, Porygon2 can shake off everything Gyarados can throw at it and OHKO back with a Thunderbolt.</p>

    <p>Any Pokemon that can outspeed Gyarados after a Dragon Dance is a pretty good check. These Pokemon include Choice Scarf Terrakion and Choice Scarf Thundurus-T. The latter resists Bounce, making it an even better switch-in; the former is a much riskier choice, as it is weak to Waterfall and doesn't resist Bounce. Jolteon can only outspeed non-Jolly variants that are at +1, but it works too. However, none of them can really switch in out of fear of Waterfall. Pokemon that resist or are immune to Water, such as Gastrodon, Starmie, Cloyster, Celebi, and Toxicroak, are also good checks. None of them, especially Celebi and Toxicroak, particularly enjoy taking a Bounce, however. For this reason, they are best when combined with a Pokemon that resists Flying. Perish Song Celebi with such partners is particularly good. Toxicroak is only useful against the Substitute + Dragon Dance variant and only if it runs Substitute itself. If all else fails, a surprise Electric-type move, such as ThunderPunch on Jirachi or Hidden Power Electric on Keldeo, will do in a pinch.</p>
  22. sirndpt

    sirndpt
    is an Artist Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

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    working on top (ish) of previous post

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    bulky DD
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    offensive DD
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    love your writing style p0078 btw
  23. Jukain

    Jukain .leaf
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributor
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    I got to pick and choose between the two checks, which was kind of cool; some of your changes were more subjective cbt, so I tweaked a few sections to my liking. Also, thanks sirn ^.^
  24. GatoDelFuego

    GatoDelFuego No matter if it seems so hard, friends are near
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributor

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    I am a slave >_< Jukain you devil you writing 18 paragraphs

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    [Overview]

    <p>Gyarados is easily one of the most threatening sweepers in the OU tier. While it hasn't changed much from DPP, nothing needed to be changed; Gyarados is still a monster. It has two STABs with great coverage and above-average stats across the board, in addition to two stellar abilities in Intimidate and Moxie. Gyarados is most commonly seen sporting a bulky Dragon Dance sweeper set, allowing it to set up on and tear apart many Pokemon. On the flip side, Gyarados can also run a more defensive RestTalk set aiming to utilize Gyarados's numerous resistances and the immense physical bulk granted by Intimidate. Gyarados can even utilize rain perfectly with its terrifying double-STAB Waterfalls. Unfortunately, the popularity of Volt Switch and Electric-type attackers in general makes Gyarados's life difficult. Additionally, Gyarados has rather lackluster initial Speed, meaning it can be forced out easily, a problem that is compounded by its Stealth Rock weakness. Gyarados can also still be outsped and OHKOed by many Choice Scarf users after a Dragon Dance. However, physical Water-type attackers are a rare commodity, in OU at least, making Gyarados a tough competitor in today's metagame.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Bulky Dragon Dance
    move 1: Substitute / Taunt
    move 2: Dragon Dance
    move 3: Waterfall
    move 4: Bounce
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 88 HP / 248 Atk / 4 Def / 168 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This is Gyarados's bread-and-butter set this generation, being able to set up on a multitude of Pokemon. Dragon Dance is just an amazing move for Gyarados, boosting its Attack to ungodly high excellent levels and patching up its underwhelming Speed. Gyarados also has an amazing Water / Flying typing, which distinguishes it from other Dragon Dance users. It provides resistances to common Fighting-type attacks (such as Mach Punch and Close Combat), Fire-type attacks, Bullet Punch, and U-turn, as well as an immunity to Earthquake Ground. With Intimidate, Gyarados can even take attacks such as Ice Shard, Icicle Crash, and Crunch. The most common variant of this set runs Substitute, which makes setting up much easier. With Substitute, Gyarados can avoid status, revenge killers, and Volt Switches. In a metagame full of those three things, Substitute makes it much less of a burden to set up. All walls that don't carry phazing moves are going to be in trouble against Gyarados. Terrakion will not be able to revenge kill Gyarados lest it be KOed by Waterfall (the same with other revenge killers). The other, less common variant, (AC) runs Taunt, which is geared specifically toward walls. Taunt renders walls unable to phaze, recover health, or use a status move or Perish Song. It is essential if you wish to beat Skarmory or Hippowdon with Gyarados, as both can take a +1 Waterfall and phaze Gyarados out. Additionally, it allows Gyarados to beat Perish Song Celebi paired with Steel-types there to take a Bounce Flying resists, one of the most common cores used to handle Gyarados.</p>

    <p>As for the moves, Gyarados's STABs generally provide enough coverage. Waterfall, especially with a rain boost, can put heavy dents in any Pokemon unlucky enough to be on the receiving end of it. Bounce has nice coverage with Waterfall, most notably hitting bulky Water-types, and ensures Gyarados's Substitute isn't broken while it attacks, only faltering against Thunder in rain while Gyarados is in the air.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EVs allow Gyarados to outrun Jolteon at +1 and prevent Jirachi and burned Ferrothorn from breaking a Substitute with Body Slam and Power Whip, respectively. In order to burn Ferrothorn, partners that carry Will-O-Wisp, such as Rotom-W, Gengar, Mew, Heatran, and Sableye, are recommended. Sableye in particular makes a good partner, as it can take advantage of its priority Will-O-Wisp to cripple foes such as Terrakion and Toxicroak. The HP number achieved increases the healing received from Leftovers. The remaining EVs are pumped into Attack for more power. Waterfall is obviously irreplaceable on this set, but Bounce isn't. Stone Edge can be used to hit Rotom-W, opposing Gyarados, and Dragonite harder, in addition to being more reliable against Substitute Kyurem-B, but Bounce is generally more useful. The ability choice is one of vital importance. Intimidate allows Gyarados to reduce the power of its foes upon switching in, allowing for easier setup and better match-ups against Pokemon such as Scizor, while Moxie boosts Gyarados's Attack with each kill, making it much more potent offensively. The choice really depends on whether you want a more offensive or defensive Gyarados. Do note, however, that Intimidate ensures Substitutes can't be broken by attacks such as lead Mamoswine's Ice Shard and Choice Scarf Jirachi's Ice Punch.</p>

    <p>The biggest threats to Gyarados are Perish Song Celebi, Substitute Toxicroak, Ferrothorn, Kyurem-B, and defensive Politoed, so Gyarados's teammates should be able to handle these Pokemon. Politoed is almost mandatory because the rain it brings boosts the power of Waterfall, which allows Gyarados to 2HKO Skarmory and OHKO 252 HP Jirachi, Choice Scarf Rotom-W, Garchomp, and Magnezone with a boost. Skarmory can also be a bit of a pain for Gyarados; Choice Specs Politoed can OHKO with Surf. Jolteon and Thundurus-T, while having to take a risk to do so, can absorb Electric-type attacks aimed at Gyarados, while Gyarados can switch in on Ground-type attacks aimed at the two formers. Both can dispatch Perish Song Politoed with ease, and Jolteon can even pass Gyarados a Substitute. To deal with Ferrothorn and Skarmory, Magnezone makes a great partner, as does Choice Specs Gothitelle. Gothitelle can also handle Choice Scarf Terrakion, Celebi, and Politoed. Terrakion is a good choice for Kyurem-B, while the aforementioned Gothitelle does best well against for Celebi. Scizor and Tyranitar are also good choices to handle Celebi. Pokemon such as Landorus-T, Latias, and Latios are recommended to deal with Toxicroak. Finally, Rapid Spin support is appreciated, as having Stealth Rock off the field allows Gyarados to switch in with much greater ease. Starmie is the best choice for a spinner, as it can deal heavy damage to bulky Water-types and Skarmory.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Offensive Dragon Dance
    move 1: Dragon Dance
    move 2: Waterfall
    move 3: Bounce
    move 4: Stone Edge / Earthquake
    item: Life Orb / Lum Berry
    ability: Moxie
    nature: Adamant / Jolly
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This Gyarados tosses aside easier setup for greatly increased offensive potential. After just one Dragon Dance, Gyarados can outspeed pretty much the entire unboosted OU tier. After a boost, Gyarados is nigh-impossible to wall, allowing it to soften up the opponent's team to the point where another Pokemon can sweep. When you factor in the sheer power of this set, it needs much less support than other sets. You won't have any issue getting Gyarados in either due to the ubiquitous many Close Combats present in the tier. With Gyarados's Attack sky-high after just one boost, it can just start attacking. It has no trouble punching massive holes early- to mid-game.</p>

    <p>Naturally, Waterfall is the main move, ripping apart pretty much every Pokemon in the tier with rain and Dragon Dance boosts. Bounce is of course Gyarados's other STAB move, hitting Grass-types that resist Waterfall, such as Celebi, hard, as well as dealing heavy damage to all common Dragon-types. Without having to mess with a non-attacking move to set up, Gyarados also has room for a coverage move. Stone Edge hits Kyurem-B, Rotom-W, and Flying-types, such as Dragonite, (RC) for heavy damage, while Earthquake, on the other hand, hits Magnezone, Tentacruel, Toxicroak, Jirachi, and Heatran hard, which is especially useful in sun.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>There are important distinctions between the two nature choices on this set; while Jolly allows Gyarados to outrun Jolteon and Choice Scarf Politoed at +1 and Jolly Mamoswine without a boost, Adamant gives a noticeable power buff. Jolly also makes Gyarados much faster unboosted, but the loss in power is significant against foes such as Ferrothorn as well as for hole-punching. Since Because Gyarados can boost past the threats Jolly is needed to outspeed, Adamant is usually preferred, but it's your preference. For the item, Life Orb is usually best, boosting Gyarados's power even higher, which is what this set is all about. However, Lum Berry helps immensely against status users such as Ferrothorn and Jirachi and lets Gyarados avoid an untimely Scald burn. Double-Edge is a viable coverage option for Rotom-W and Dragon-types (most notably Substitute Kyurem-B). It also has amazing neutral coverage; the same is true of Return is an option if you don't want the recoil, though it loses out against Kyurem-B. Unfortunately, Double-Edge has rather nasty recoil, so only use it if you plan to play Gyarados recklessly. Finally, Intimidate can be used over Moxie to aid in setting up, but it really just gets away from the whole point of this set: power. The only reason to use it is because Double-Edge is unfortunately illegal with Moxie Intimidate.</p>

    <p>Rain support helps Gyarados get certain OHKOs after a boost, so Politoed is appreciated as a partner, but it is not obligatory, as this set still has enough power without rain. Rapid Spin support is essential with Life Orb, as Stealth Rock damage piled on with Life Orb recoil means Gyarados dies too quickly. Starmie and Tentacruel are good options because they can deal with many of Gyarados's checks and counters, such as Skarmory. Suicide leads that carry Taunt, such as Terrakion and Skarmory Mew, also work to prevent Stealth Rock. Moving on, Gyarados has a lot of trouble against revenge killers without Substitute. Latios, Terrakion, and Salamence can all outrun Gyarados, even if it has a +1 boost. Scizor can utilize its powerful Bullet Punch to deal with most revenge killers. Substitute + Calm Mind Jirachi and Swords Dance Scizor are Pokemon that can take advantage of weak Choice Scarf users and set up. Ferrothorn and Jellicent are difficult for Gyarados to get past, so Magnezone and Nasty Plot Celebi with Hidden Power Fire are good partners.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Choice Scarf
    move 1: Waterfall
    move 2: Ice Fang
    move 3: Stone Edge
    move 4: Earthquake
    item: Choice Scarf
    ability: Moxie
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>While Gyarados is no doubt a deadly sweeper, it can also function as an effective revenge killer. With a Choice Scarf attached, Gyarados can outrun many notable threats, just barely outpacing +1 Adamant Dragonite and having enough bulk to tank boosted priority moves, such as Breloom's Mach Punch. Even better, thanks to With Moxie, Gyarados can even function as a late-game cleaner à la Choice Scarf Salamence. Rain-boosted Waterfall and Moxie are Gyarados's main advantages over other Choice Scarf users. The other moves are for rather specific targets. Ice Fang is the best move Gyarados has to hit Dragon-types, such as Dragonite, Salamence, Latias, and Latios. Stone Edge hits Volcarona and Kyurem-B hard; it is necessary for the former under sun and doesn't carry the risk of activating Flame Body. Finally, Earthquake does solid damage to Tentacruel and Toxicroak.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Adamant is almost always the preferred nature; the only time Jolly is useful is on rain teams that have trouble against Jolteon. A move worth consideration is Outrage. Outrage can OHKO Latias after Stealth Rock damage, which is a feat Ice Fang simply can't manage. Unfortunately, it has a rather nasty lock-in side effect that pretty much ensures Gyarados will die the next turn.</p>

    <p>Rain support is non-negotiable with this set, as otherwise Gyarados is completely outclassed by Salamence. Rapid Spin support is another requirement because it ensures Gyarados can switch in and out freely. Starmie is the best choice, as it can hit bulky Water-types for good damage and soften up opponents to set the stage for Gyarados. After taking Hydro Pumps from Starmie, the opponent will often be ill-equipped to handle Gyarados. Other options include Tentacruel, who which can Toxic bulky Water-types, and Forretress, who which can set up entry hazards and take physical hits well. Unfortunately, the former has a hard time against spinblockers. It is important to note that Gyarados isn't an amazing revenge killer; it's best used to sweep late-game. Therefore, you probably shouldn't use Gyarados as your sole Choice Scarf user. In any case, bulky Water-types, Ferrothorn, Latias, Kyurem-B, and Celebi are perfect stops for this set. Your own Celebi can take care of bulky Water-types, while Scizor can deal with Ferrothorn, Latias, Kyurem-B, and Celebi, as well as use Bullet Punch to help Gyarados with its revenge killing duties.</p>

    [SET]
    name: RestTalk
    move 1: Rest
    move 2: Sleep Talk
    move 3: Waterfall
    move 4: Roar / Dragon Tail
    item: Leftovers
    ability: Intimidate
    nature: Impish
    evs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Although it is an effective attacker, Gyarados can also perform well with a defensive set. With solid bulk, a great typing, and Intimidate, Gyarados has all the tools it needs to be a good bulky Water-type. However, Gyarados is a bit different from your usual bulky Water-type, as it doesn't have reliable recovery. On the bright side, resistances to Fighting, Bug, and Steel, as well as an immunity to Ground make Gyarados a stellar pivot. Consequentially, Gyarados is also a perfect counter to Scizor, Mamoswine, and Volcarona outside of sun. In order to be healthy enough to deal with these threats, Gyarados unfortunately must rely on RestTalk, which is a rather shaky combination, especially with this generation's sleep mechanics. On the other hand, it does make Gyarados much more sturdy. Just be sure to avoid resting while foes such as Jolteon are still alive, as Gyarados hates being forced out while asleep. Waterfall provides Gyarados with a reliable attacking move. The last slot gives Gyarados a phazing move, which helps against setup sweepers and allows Gyarados to spread entry hazard damage. Roar is 100% accurate and can hit through Substitute, while Dragon Tail isn't affected by Taunt and can hit Magic Bounce users, which is helpful for teams that struggle against Baton Pass chains.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Since As Gyarados is meant to challenge physical attackers, its EVs should make it as physically bulky as possible. While Gyarados should usually run Rest and Sleep Talk, this scenario is different if a good Wish passer and Rapid Spin user are paired with it. If that is the case, RestTalk should be replaced with Taunt and Thunder Wave. The former helps against defensive Pokemon, while the latter can cripple offensive Pokemon. However, in order to run those, you again need to have a Wish passer and Rapid Spin user. For the Wish passer, Jirachi is best used because of its great defensive synergy with Gyarados, particularly helping against Kyurem-B; Terrakion and Scizor also work for that purpose. For the Rapid Spin user, Forretress is best, as it can take Outrages, which that Gyarados cannot do. A Pokemon that can trap Ghost-types, such as Choice Scarf Tyranitar or Gothitelle, is useful to ensure Forretress can spin. Additionally, Heal Bell Celebi makes a great partner, as it counters Thundurus-T and other Electric-types that threaten Gyarados. Heal Bell can also wake up Gyarados if it is sleeping, which is helpful. Finally, Ferrothorn can set up entry hazards and take Electric- and Rock-type attacks, making it a good partner.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Choice Band
    move 1: Waterfall / Aqua Tail
    move 2: Double Edge
    move 3: Ice Fang / Stone Edge
    move 4: Earthquake
    item: Choice Band
    ability: Intimidate
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 88 HP / 252 Atk / 168 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This set sacrifices the ability to sweep for raw power right off the bat. With a Choice Band and Intimidate, Gyarados makes for an amazing offensive pivot. This is no surprise combined with Gyarados's Fighting and Water resistances and Ground immunity. Most importantly, Gyarados can switch into threats such as Volcarona, Mamoswine, and special Landorus. Once it is in, Gyarados can hit the foe with a powerful attack. It plays as a sort of hit-and-run, all-purpose attacker; the best term to use here is "hard-hitting tank." Gyarados's rain-boosted Waterfalls strike fear in the hearts of its opponents. Boasting a fairly high flinch rate and perfect accuracy, Waterfall is almost always the superior move choice option. However, Aqua Tail allows Gyarados to OHKO certain foes, such as defensive Landorus-T and Choice Scarf Jirachi. Double-Edge is mainly used to hit a lured-in Rotom-W, though no bulky Water-type other than Jellicent appreciates being hit by it. Ice Fang is preferred in the third slot to hit Grass-types such as Celebi and Breloom, being the only move on this set that can OHKO the latter; it also hits Dragon-types hard. Stone Edge, on the other hand, does a boatload of damage to Kyurem-B and opposing Gyarados. Finally, Earthquake does deals heavy damage to Jirachi, Ninetales, Tentacruel, and Toxicroak.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EVs allow Gyarados to outrun Adamant Breloom while still being powerful enough to dish out heavy damage; the remaining EVs are placed in HP to give Gyarados a little bulk. Avalanche can be used instead of Ice Fang for a harder hit, but negative priority is a major detriment, as Gyarados doesn't want to take any unnecessary damage. Bite can 2HKO Jellicent and Celebi and deal solid damage to Starmie and Latios.</p>

    <p>Rain support is a necessity for Gyarados, as otherwise it just doesn't hit hard enough to be justified over another Choice Band user, such as Dragonite or Terrakion. Additionally, Gyarados has a rather nasty Stealth Rock weakness, so since because it intends to switch in and out a lot, Rapid Spin support is required. Life Orb Starmie is the best choice, as it can beat most bulky Water-types and provide Rapid Spin support; unfortunately it adds yet another Electric weakness to the team. Breloom, specifically the SubPunch variant, is another choice to beat bulky Water-types. It can set up a Substitute against on and kill Jellicent and KO it, which Starmie can't do; Gastrodon, Tentacruel, and Politoed are also vulnerable to it. Finally, be sure to have Pokemon such as Terrakion or Jirachi to deal with Kyurem-B.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Gyarados really doesn't have any other options worth considering. Aqua Tail could be used over Waterfall on Dragon Dance sets for bit of extra power, but its lower accuracy makes it usually not worth it. While Scald might seem tempting for a bulky set, its lack of power makes Gyarados complete Taunt fodder. Flail isn't really that great for Gyarados with its relatively low Speed. Wacan Berry could be worth a shot, but Gyarados still dies to most Electric-type moves anyway. Bounce and Outrage might be worth a look on Choice sets, but they have detrimental lock-in effects that make them not worth the while.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Despite its diversity, Gyarados has quite a few counters. The foremost of these is Ferrothorn, who can take pretty much any attack and break Gyarados's Substitutes with Power Whip. Additionally, it can set up Stealth Rock, which makes Gyarados's life miserable. Skarmory is also difficult to break through and can phaze out Gyarados, negating any boosts it has obtained. Rotom-W is also a good response, especially if it carries Thunderbolt. Gyarados really can't hit Rotom-W hard at all outside of a Choice Band-boosted Double-Edge. Opposing defensive variants of Gyarados also fare well, as it they can phaze your Gyarados out. Kyurem-B is another solid counter, boasting the ability to take any hit, even Stone Edge in a pinch, and OHKO with Fusion Bolt in return. Finally, Porygon2 can shake off everything Gyarados can throw at it, possibly even Intimidate Gyarados with Trace, and OHKO back with a Thunderbolt.</p>

    <p>Any Pokemon that can outspeed Gyarados after a Dragon Dance is a pretty good check. These Pokemon include Choice Scarf Terrakion and Choice Scarf Thundurus-T. The latter resists Bounce, making it an even better switch-in; the former is a much riskier choice, as it is weak to Waterfall and and does not resist Bounce. Jolteon can only outspeed non-Jolly Gyarados variants that are at +1, but is still usable but it works too. However, none of them can really switch in out of fear of Waterfall. Pokemon that resist or are immune to Water, such as Gastrodon, Starmie, Cloyster, Celebi, and Toxicroak, are also good checks. None of them, especially Celebi and Toxicroak, particularly enjoy taking a Bounce, however. For this reason, they are best when combined with a Pokemon that resists Flying. Perish Song Celebi is particularly effective good when paired with such partners. Toxicroak is only useful against the Substitute + Dragon Dance variant and only if it runs Substitute itself. If all else fails, a surprise Electric-type move, such as ThunderPunch on Jirachi or Hidden Power Electric on Keldeo, will do in a pinch.</p>


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  25. MatchMaster

    MatchMaster

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2013
    Messages:
    55
    Bolded part should say this:

    Double-Edge is unfortunately illegal with Moxie.

    Edit: Just saw the above post. Nevermind.

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