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Hard Hitting Trick Room

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by BattleFight, Mar 31, 2013.

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How well do you think this team will do?

  1. Bad

    1 vote(s)
    16.7%
  2. Okay

    3 vote(s)
    50.0%
  3. Good

    2 vote(s)
    33.3%
  4. Great

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. BattleFight

    BattleFight

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2012
    Messages:
    14
    This is another attempt at VGC, this time it's a trick room team. I battled many times with this team. I received a good amounts of wins with this team. Anyways... Here it is:

    Dusclops @ Eviolite
    Ability: Pressure
    EVs: 252 Def / 252 SDef / 4 HP
    Relaxed Nature
    - Pain Split
    - Trick Room
    - Night Shade
    - Will-O-Wisp

    Ah yes, Dusclops. In my opinion, the best trick room setter in VGC. Better than Cresselia because it is immune to Fake Out with one less weakness (Better bulk, too!), better than Dusknoir and Cofagrigus because it has better defenses with Eviolite and is slower (Trick Room's -7 priority doesn't even matter). Unfortunately it only can hold Eviolite so it could be usable, which makes it taunt bait. Pain split is so it could survive longer and hurt the opponent (usually), Trick Room is just obvious, Night Shade so it wouldn't become dead weight after taunt, and Will-O-Wisp is to neuter physical attackers. Relaxed nature may seem like an odd choice because of Will-O-Wisp, but it might come in handy when I'm setting up Trick Room, and saved me a few times.


    Hariyama @ Flame Orb
    Ability: Guts
    EVs: 252 Atk / 140 Def/ 120 SDef
    Brave Nature
    - Fake Out
    - Close Combat
    - Ice Punch
    - Detect

    While it may seem like Hitmontop is better, due to Intimidate and a faster Fake Out, it makes up for it by having better bulk and being alot stronger, too. Flame orb is on it for Guts to activate, and NOT have that DAMNED AMOONGUSS TO SPORE ME. Fake Out is for disabling one Pokemon on the opponent's side, which could help alot. Close Combat is there for major damage and STAB, Ice Punch for dealing with AMOONGUSS, both Lati, and Pokemon that resist or are immune to Close Combat, and other Dragons. Detect is so I can protect myself from moves, and set up guts. Also there to predict a faster fake out.

    Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
    Ability: Iron Barbs
    EVs: 252 HP / 148 DEF / 108 SDEF
    Relaxed Nature
    - Leech Seed
    - Gyro Ball
    - Power Whip
    - Protect

    Ferrothorn is a great wall. Leftovers is a good recovery (Because sitrus berry is taken). Leech Seed is for extra recovery with sapping the opponent's health. Gyro Ball is STAB and hitting Pokemon that don't resist it hard (Unless if they're slow), Power Whip is more STAB, but it also hits Pokemon that resist Gyro Ball (except Fire types) and also hitting Gastrodon for lotsa damage. Protect is well... Protect. Also gives me more healing time.

    Metagross @ Lum Berry
    Ability: Clear Body
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 HP / 4 SDef
    Brave Nature
    - Explosion
    - Zen Headbutt
    - Meteor Mash
    - Hammer Arm

    Metagross is a beast. Lum berry is there for FUCKING BURNS GO AWAY. Also to HIT FUCKING AMOONGUSS HARDER WITH NO SPORE EFFECT. Explosion is there when I need to do massive damage or when I'm low on health and there are no Ghost Types on the opponent's side. Zen Headbutt is to hit Fighting Types for massive damage, with STAB. Meteor Mash is a good STAB, and could make me stronger, but that 85% accuracy hurts it. Hammer Arm is to get Steel Types and make me slower so I can function better in Trick Room.

    Rotom-W @ Sitrus Berry
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 252 HP / SAtk 252 / 4 SDef
    Quiet Nature
    - Hydro Pump
    - Thunderbolt
    - Protect
    - Hidden Power Ice

    Rotom-W is my sole Special Attacker, and is a good one. Hydro Pump is a great STAB attack hitting many pokemon hard. The 80% accuracy isn't perfect though... Thunderbolt is another STAB and hits Water types hard. Protect is well... Protect. Hidden Power Ice is to handle anything that resist Hydro Pump and Thunderbolt. I decided against HP Fire because it didn't seem very useful.

    Ursaring @ Toxic Orb
    Ability: Guts
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 HP / 4 SDef
    Brave Nature
    - Facade
    - Close Combat
    - Protect
    - Crunch

    Weird for another Status Orb team member, but it still is great. Toxic orb was my only choice, as Flame Orb was already taken. Facade hits EVERYTHING that isn't ghost, steel or rock. The other 2 attacking moves are just coverage. Protect is protect, what more is to say? Also, MORE AMOONGUSS KILLERS AAAAARGH!!!!!


    That is my team. Give criticism! I want it to improve.
  2. tlyee61

    tlyee61

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2010
    Messages:
    377
    Hi, looks like a good TR team. I might try crafting some custom EV spreads using a damage calc. 252 / 252 spreads are often really inefficient! On dusclops, I would recommend 252 HP EVs and 252 in a defense of your choice. This gives it more overall bulk. Actually, you could also keep it like you have so that Pain Split gives back more HP. (I think... Sorry, I'm not too familiar with Pain Split mechanics) What do the EVs on Hariyama help with? I might change them to a simple 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 filler spread. Ferrothorn looks good! I haven't seen Gyro Ball Ferro in a long time, but it definitely is strong! On Metagross, I think you should move the 4 EVs into Defnese to never be OHKOed by Swagger-boosted Metagross EQs / only 3HKOed by other Metagross EQs. Also, since you're using 4 attacking moves, consider Choice Band with Trick. I don't really see the reason for a Lum Berry if you're not using it in a Swagger combo. On Rotom-W, I might actually go with HP Fire because Hariyama already has Ice Punch. You already mentioned it, but you might want another Sp. Attacker. One could be Reuniclus, who can also set TR up. Ursaring looks decent on your team, but it adds a Fighting weakness... Maybe consider adding another TR setter / Sp Attqcker in its place... Reuniclus, chandelure, Cresselia and even slowbro / slowking could fit the place. Plus, Chandelure and Slowking/Bro have pretty good synergy with your team.
  3. BattleFight

    BattleFight

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2012
    Messages:
    14
    The reason why I didn't add 252 HP EVs on Hariyama is because it would actually be less bulky with it rather than defense and Special Defense EVs. I actually was considering putting another special attacker. The 4 SDef on Metagross was a typo. Also, more HP on Dusclops will give it less HP healing, but I'll test it out. Choice Band with Trick seemed good, even I considered it, but it didn't work out in the end. I guess I will try out Chandelure with 4 battles. Also, Chandelure just gives me more weaknesses, and is not as bulky as Ursaring. When poisoned, Ursaring actually has a higher attack stat than a power tricked 252 DEF non-defense boosting natured shuckle, plus has great coverage, and I'm not willing to lose that. But I might replace another. Not Dusclops (obviously), not Hariyama... Who...?
  4. TheMantyke

    TheMantyke Larvitard
    is a Smogon Social Media Contributoris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Team Rater Alumnus
    VGC Leader

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2007
    Messages:
    5,540
    Hi there. You have a decent team on your hands, but I think there's definately some room for improvement. Here are my recommendations:

    1) Chandelure > Dusclops

    Like you've mentioned, Dusclops is complete taunt bait, but there are some other serious negative traits to Duslops. Dusclops has virtually no damage output beyond the pitifully weak Night Shade. This means your opponent isn't under much threat from Dusclops and can focus down your partner while Dusclops sits there doing nothing.

    I would recommend swapping out Dusclops for a Chandelure. It still gives you a Fake Out immune Trick Room user, but it also gives you tons of offensive fire power. You seem to have a very well justified hatred for Amoonguss and Chandelure can roast that fucker. Quiet 252 SpAtk Chandelure's Overheat is guaranteed to OHKO even Sassy 252 HP / 252 SpDef Amoonguss.

    A set along the lines of this sounds good:

    [​IMG]
    Chandelure @ Focus Sash
    Flash Fire
    Quiet
    252 HP / 252 SpAtk / 6 Def, 0 Attack IV / 0 Speed IV
    -Overheat
    -Shadow Ball
    -Protect
    -Trick Room

    2) Abomasnow > Ferrothorn

    I'm a huge fan of Ferrothorn, but on your team, it seems pretty unneeded. You already have Metagross to sponge Draco Meteors and Rotom-W to tank hits versus rain. Plus, Ferrothorn doesn't benefit very much from Trick Room; it's pretty indifferent about moving first or second. I would recommend trying an Abomasnow in its place.

    [​IMG]
    Abomasnow @ Ice Gem
    Snow Warning
    Quiet
    252 HP / 252 SpAtk / 6 Atk, 0 Speed IV
    -Blizzard
    -Giga Drain
    -Ice Shard
    -Protect

    Abomasnow trades the ability to take the hits Ferrothorn can for a fantastic secondary STAB. At the moment, you only have Hidden Power Ice and Ice Punch for Ice coverage, so I think Abomasnow would add some welcomed offensive prowess to your team. It should also be noted the Abomasnow is still just about as powerful a player versus rain as Ferrothorn is thanks to its Grass typing and Snow Warning.

    3) Cresselia > Ursaring

    [​IMG]
    Cresselia @ Leftovers
    Levitate
    Sassy
    252 HP / 252 SpDef / 6 SpAtk (feel free to play with this spread), 0 Attack IV / 0 Speed IV
    -Psychic
    -Ice Beam
    -Swagger
    -Trick Room

    This might sound kind of weird since my first piece of advice was to drop Dusclops for something with better offensive fire power, but Ursaring isn't offering much Metagross and Hariyama don't already provide and Cresselia would add bulk similar to Dusclops with a few great advantages. Cresselia gives you a secondary Trick Room inducer. Though it is vulnerable to Fake Out, the it doesn't care about it most of the time thanks to its sheer bulk. Cresselia also comes with actual attacking stats; Psychic and Ice Beam can leave a few dents. Finally, Cresselia can use Swagger to disrupt enemy Special Attacks and, most importantly, to give Metagross a terrifying +2 Attack boost.

    I'd also like to add that if you do like the sound of Cresselia, you'll want to make a few changes to Metagross to make the most of it. Change Metagross's nature to Adamant and give it a speed IV of 14. This way, Cresselia is one point of speed slower than Metagross, allowing you to Swagger Metagross and attack with Metagross immediately afterwords while in Trick Room. I would also recommend replacing Explosion and Hammer Arm for Protect and Earthquake on Metagross for the ever useful utility of Protect and the power of a coverage spread attack with Earthquake.

    Hope this advice helps! Sorry with how lengthy these suggestions are; hopefully it doesn't feel like I'm changing too much.

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