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Haxorus (QC 3/3) [GP 2/2]

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by PK Gaming, Dec 31, 2012.

  1. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
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    There's no better time to get this thread up now that Genesect's in the slammer.

    [​IMG]

    [Overview]

    <p>Haxorus's name isn't the only cool thing about him. Sporting a massive base 147 Attack, Haxorus has the ability to OHKO or 2HKO nearly everything in the game, even without entry hazard support. In addition, access to amazing moves such as Dragon Dance, Swords Dance, Outrage, and several great coverage moves including Superpower and Aqua Tail, make him both devastating and unpredictable. Unfortunately, he has meager defenses and a disappointing Speed stat which can sometimes cause him to be brushed aside in favor of his Dragon-type brethren, namely Garchomp, Salamence, Dragonite, and Kyurem-B. Haxorus faces considerable competition from Kyurem-B in particular, as both Pokemon are strikingly similar; possessing overkill Attack stats and similar Speed stats, but Kyurem-B possesses far greater durability and a great Special Attack stat. Despite these shortcomings, Haxorus's sheer power and incredible offensive coverage often merits him a spot on a team, as very little can safely switch into this behemoth.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Swords Dance
    move 1: Swords Dance
    move 2: Outrage
    move 3: Superpower / Low Kick
    move 4: Substitute / Aqua Tail / Earthquake
    item: Fighting Gem / Life Orb / Lum Berry
    ability: Mold Breaker
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>In a metagame filled with increasingly powerful physical threats, Swords Dance Haxorus still represents the absolute gold standard for one-turn power in OU. Haxorus is flat out uncounterable at +2—to put things in perspective, even Skarmory can't stop Haxorus once he gets going. When the opportunity presents itself, set up Swords Dance on something he can force out, usually by bluffing a Choice Band set. +2 Outrage will devastate anything that's unlucky enough to switch in; everything in OU (barring Skarmory and Forretress) is flat out 2HKOed by +2 Outrage at worst. Prominent physical walls such as Slowbro, Hippowdon, and Tangrowth all face potential OHKOes from +2 Outrage with a bit of prior damage (or none if Life Orb is used). Superpower might seem counterproductive on a boosting set, but you need its high Base Power in order to defeat any Skarmory or Forretress that might switch in. Fighting Gem temporarily gives Haxorus Fighting STAB on Superpower, which lets him overcome the Steel-types that aren't fazed by Outrage or Earthquake, such as Skarmory, Ferrothorn, Forretress. Substitute offers Haxorus protection against status and also grants him (a few) setup opportunities. It also provides Haxorus utility against faster paced offensive teams, since he isn't going to get very far with just Swords Dance. As those teams are less likely to use pure defensive Pokemon, he doesn't even need the power boost from Swords Dance and can do some damage with just Substitute.</p>

    <p>Aqua Tail gets an exceptional power boost in the rain, and is a staple for Haxorus on rain teams. You can forget about using Superpower Fighting Gem alongside Aqua Tail, as Skarmory and Forretress are effortlessly 2HKOed by +2 Life Orb Aqua Tail in the rain and some other Steel-types such asJirachi or Scizor are actually OHKOed. Low Kick makes for a great alternative to Superpower, as it's capable of dealing with most of the Steel-types that trouble Haxorus, and Aqua Tail can still cover Steel-types that take negligible damage from Low Kick. Earthquake nets you a little bit more coverage, and is more potent against Steel-types such as Jirachi, Metagross, and Bronzong. It's also useful in situations where you don't want to use up the Fighting Gem.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>There are several alternatives to the items listed on the Swords Dance set; Draco Plate provides a power boost to Outrage that is almost comparable to Life Orb but without the recoil, notably allowing Haxorus to always OHKO Hippowdon, Slowbro, and Tangrowth with +2 Outrage and a layer of Spikes. Mystic Water strengthens Aqua Tail and makes it frighteningly powerful under rain, granting Haxorus the 2HKO on Skarmory and OHKOes on both Landorus-T(after an intimidate) and Gliscor after a Swords Dance. Salac Berry can boost Haxorus's Speed, but it can be tricky to actually pull off in a match, although if you can get Haxorus to take one strong hit that won't OHKO him, or if you can spam Substitute into Salac Berry range, you can potentially have a +2 Attack, +1 Speed sweeper on your hands. You can opt for a bulkier spread consisting of 92 HP / 200 Atk / 216 Spe, which noticeably increases Haxorus's durability while keeping his Attack and Speed stat mostly intact. Keep in mind however, that if you lower Haxorus's Attack, he'll lose some potential OHKOs (most notable against Skarmory at 87% HP), and by lowering his speed, he risks getting outsped by Kyurem-B. Taunt will ensure that no matter what Skarmory will lose to Haxorus in a one-on-one match-up. It's also somewhat effective against Forretress, as it prevents Forretress from setting up.</p>

    <p>Wobbuffet is a fantastic partner to Haxorus; it grants him setup opportunities with Encore and can remove faster Choice Scarf Pokemon. Entry hazards from Pokemon such asDeoxys-D are appreciated, as they push physical walls such as Slowbro, Hippowdon, and Forretress into OHKO range. U-turn users that lure out Skarmory are great partners to this set, as even the nonexistent damage that U-turn deals to Skarmory (in addition to Stealth Rock damage when it switches out) can make the difference in OHKOing Skarmory when it switches into Haxorus later in the game. You should consider providing Haxorus with Reflect and Light Screen; with dual screens in play, you'd send out Haxorus early to soften up the opposing team and kill or weaken their revenge killers so that the rest of your pokemon sweep right through them. It's a wallbreaker either way, but it can be effective against offensive teams as dual screens can prevent Haxorus from being revenge killed. Swords Dance Haxorus is a great partner to most Dragon-types, since he can lure and weaken/KO most, if not all, of of their checks. Latios, Garchomp, and Kyurem-B are some of the Dragon-types that love having their checks and counters weakened or eliminated before going wild. A Haxorus with a Swords Dance under its belt is a huge threat—you almost always devastate slower Pokemon with Haxorus's overkill Attack and he is effective against stall teams or teams with strong defensive cores. Of course when all is said and done, Haxorus is still utterly useless in the face of faster Pokemon. Remember to use this set with discretion, as a Choice Band set might be the better choice for your team. It's a matter of ease of use versus potential; Choice Band is easier to use, and is much more effective early on, but can be easily stopped by hard counters or revenge killed. Swords Dance requires a bit more finesse and might not be useful early on, but it can rewarding when pulled off correctly.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Choice Band
    move 1: Outrage
    move 2: Superpower
    move 3: Earthquake
    move 4: Aqua Tail / Dragon Claw
    item: Choice Band
    ability: Mold Breaker
    nature: Adamant / Jolly
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Haxorus and Choice Band go together like peanut butter and jelly, as it boosts Haxorus's already amazing Attack to an absurd 648. There are very few Pokemon that can claim to counter Choice Band Haxorus, as virtually everything gets at most 2HKOed by an appropriate attack. Even the bulkiest physical walls such as Hippowdon, Slowbro, and Tangrowth will be unable to keep up with Haxorus's onslaught, and because many Steel-types are 2HKOed by him as well, Haxorus is as close to "uncounterable" as they come.</p>

    <p>Even though Choice Band Outrage is incredibly powerful, you should use Haxorus's coverage moves to weaken his checks before really cutting lose with Outrage. One of the strongest physical Fighting-type moves, Superpower, has been made available to Haxorus, and with it comes the ability to utterly destroy most Steel-type switch-ins. For example, Ferrothorn, a Pokemon that was once a good check to Choice Band Haxorus, is now hard-pressed to switch into Haxorus, as Superpower will easily OHKO with a bit of prior damage. Superpower is actuallyas strong as a STAB Dragon Claw, so it's a good idea to use it in situations where you intend to deal high damage, but don't want to trap Haxorus by using Outrage. Earthquake is a bit weaker than Superpower, but complements Outrage well by nailing grounded Steel-types, and thanks to Mold Breaker, Levitate users such as Bronzong, Gengar, and Rotom-W must think twice about switching in. Aqua Tail is used solely to deal heavy damage to Skarmory, Forretress, Landorus-T, and Gliscor, each of which face 2HKOes from switching into a rain-boosted Aqua Tail. It should go without saying, however, that Aqua Tail demands the use of Politoed as a partner to function and is practically useless without the boost from rain. Dragon Claw exists as a weaker alternative to Outrage; it may not kill everything, but it's still a damaging move option that doesn't lock Haxorus in.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>In order to appreciate the sheer power of Choice Band Haxorus's Outrage, here are some damage calculations against some of the premier physical walls and Steel-types that resist it:</p>

    <ul class="damage_calculation">
    <li>-1 Outrage vs. 200/244 Landorus-T: 54.74 - 64.49%</li>
    <li>Outrage vs. 252/184+ Gliscor: 64.69% - 76.27%</li>
    <li>Outrage vs. 252/252+ Hippowdon: 54.29% - 63.81%</li>
    <li>Outrage vs. 248/252+ Vaporeon: 75.16% - 88.77%</li>
    <li>Outrage vs. 252/0 Scizor: 51.45% - 60.47%</li>
    <li>Outrage vs. 252/48+ Ferrothorn: 34.94% - 40.91%</li>
    <li>Outrage vs. 252/0 Jirachi: 43.81% - 51.49%</li>
    <li>Outrage vs. 0/0 Heatran: 52.01% - 61.30%</li>
    </ul>

    <p>A Jolly nature allows Haxorus to always outspeed Kyurem-B and most variants of opposing Haxorus and Hydreigon. In truth, there isn't much point to using a Jolly nature on Choice Band Haxorus, as the extra Speed isn't worth the large drop in power, nor is it worth the irreparable damage to your pride. Haxorus's movepool is sparse, but Dual Chop and Rock Slide are worth considering over Dragon Claw. Dual Chop can be used to break opposing Substitutes, but its accuracy can be off-putting. Rock Slide lets Haxorus hit Gyarados, Volcarona, and Zapdos without locking himself into Outrage, but they are still hit hard by Dragon Claw, and Rock Slide can give Steel-types free switches. Another option that should be considered is Rivalry. Although Mold Breaker is great when used with Earthquake, Rivalry can be used for an extra boost. The 25% increase in power is very significant considering Haxorus's amazing Attack—for example, with one layer of Spikes, Outrage will usually 2HKO the standard Relaxed Ferrothorn. However, this can easily backfire, as the 25% penalty in Attack can prevent Haxorus from getting the OHKO on Pokemon who would ordinarily be OHKOed by Mold Breaker Haxorus.</p>

    <p>Although Haxorus is going to be hitting everything hard with Outrage, it still has trouble with the bane of most physical attackers: Skarmory. Skarmory can come in on any of Haxorus's attacks and proceed to Roost off the damage or set up Spikes thanks to its amazing Defense. Other than Skarmory, there aren't really any other true Haxorus counters. Bronzong, Ferrothorn, and defensive Jirachi are decent checks, but although they can usually take two Outrages, they will fall to a well-predicted Earthquake or Superpower. Magnezone is one of the best partners for Haxorus because it can easily trap and kill most Steel-types with Magnet Pull. It also has solid synergy with Haxorus, as it can take Ice- and Dragon-type attacks aimed at the giant salamander. Haxorus is prone to being revenge killed by the likes of Mamoswine, Weavile, and Scizor thanks to their powerful priority attacks. A Scizor of your own can be helpful in this situation to take Ice Shards and Bullet Punches aimed at Haxorus. You also might want to consider pairing Haxorus with Pokemon that can take advantage of Haxorus's ability to KO most Steel-types and physical walls. Pokemon such as Latios will absolutely love having Ferrothorn, Scizor, and Heatran out of the picture so it can spam Draco Meteor with little to nofear. Choice Band Haxorus tends to get picked off after it has KOed a Pokemon, though smart play and proper positioning can allow Haxorus to stick around longer and potentially get even more KOs.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Double Dance
    move 1: Dragon Dance
    move 2: Swords Dance
    move 3: Outrage
    move 4: Low Kick / Earthquake
    item: Lum Berry / Draco Plate
    nature: Adamant / Jolly
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>While it should be fairly obvious that Haxorus makes great use of either Dragon Dance or Swords Dance, each set is somewhat ineffective against specific types of teams, which limits Haxorus's utility if certain threats haven't been eliminated. By using both moves on the same set, however, Haxorus gains the ability to set up flexibly and destroy almost any team after the appropriate boost. For instance, using Swords Dance enables Haxorus to break through walls and bulky attackers on slower defensive teams, while Dragon Dance is reserved for offensive teams with faster Pokemon. If possible, Haxorus should find opportunities to use both boosting moves to become faster and even stronger, though his sweep might be at risk if he attempts to boost again. After either dance, practically every Pokemon in OU is 2HKOed, if not instantly vaporized, by any combination of Outrage, Low Kick, or Earthquake (except for Skarmory).</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>This set can be tweaked in a few ways; if you desire some bulk, 120 HP / 252 Atk / 136 Spe is a viable alternative, as it allows Haxorus to outspeed positive base 130s after a Dragon Dance boost.Because setting up is more crucial than ever, Lum Berry is ideal to heal off status and Outrage-induced confusion, giving Haxorus opportunities to set up in front of status-reliant foes. As far as power-boosting items are concerned, Draco Plate is the preferred item, compromising between Haxorus's decent bulk and Life Orb's detrimental recoil. Even then, Lum Berry tends to be the better choice in most instances because of the popularity of defensive status users in the metagame, especially Ferrothorn and Rotom-W. Seeing as you can choose whichever boosting move to use for the appropriate situation, very little is completely safe from this set. To play this set correctly and avoid Outrage-induced confusion, however, bulky Steel-types, especially Skarmory and Forretress, in addition to Jirachi if Low Kick is used, need to be eliminated beforehand. For starters, Magnezone is an instant solution to these threats due to its ability to trap and eliminate them immediately. Dual screens support from the likes of Latios and Espeon (preferably with Hidden Power Fire to weaken Steel-type counters) is still a good team option to consider, providing more setup opportunities and a form of insurance against possible revenge killers. It would also be advisable to pair Haxorus with alternative offensive teammates that can take advantage of the damage that Haxorus causes ifhe finds himself attacking and fainting too early in the game.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Dragon Dance
    move 1: Dragon Dance
    move 2: Outrage
    move 3: Earthquake
    move 4: Low Kick / Taunt
    item: Lum Berry / Yache Berry
    nature: Adamant / Jolly
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Haxorus is by no means slow, but his awkward base 97 Speed means he'll always be outpaced by common Pokemon such as Garchomp, Latios, Terrakion, and Keldeo. As such, Haxorus can make great use of Dragon Dance to boost his already sky-high Attack along with his mediocre Speed in order to outpace and KO faster threats that he would otherwise lose to. Although finding an opportunity to set up may be difficult for a fragile Pokemon such as Haxorus, and other Dragon Dance users are generally better, the benefits to setting up with Haxorus can be quite substantial, as the combination of speed and power make Haxorus incredibly hard to stop. After a single Dragon Dance, Haxorus reaches a terrifying 648 Attack and 427 Speed, enough to outpace every common Pokemon without a Choice Scarf. With a Dragon Dance under his belt, Outrage will 2HKO virtually everything in the game. Earthquake will nail all other Steel-types besides Skarmory—even Bronzong isn't safe thanks to Mold Breaker. Low Kick provides Haxorus with additional coverage against Ferrothorn, which doesn't take that much damage from +1 Earthquake, and Air Balloon Heatran. Taunt,on the other hand, can prevent some untimely phazing, or prevent status users from completely crippling Haxorus. Lum Berry is a great item that allows Haxorus to avoid being hit by statusor to immediately snap out of confusion after using Outrage. Yache Berry is handy for weakening Ice-type moves and preventing Haxorus from being picked off by Ice Shard users.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Life Orb is a powerful, albeit risky item for this set. Haxorus's teammates should focus on either eliminating his counters or creating an opportunity for him to set up a Dragon Dance. Magnezone deserves an obvious mention for its ability to turn Skarmory into fried chicken through the use of Magnet Pull and Thunderbolt. Choice Scarf Rotom-W is also an excellent partner because it has little to fear from Skarmory, Bronzong, and most other Haxorus checks. Rotom-W can also use Trick to cripple an incoming Pokemon, which will subsequently give Haxorus a chance to use Dragon Dance as the Tricked Pokemon is forced to switch out. Haxorus is extremely susceptible to revenge killing by priority users such as Mamoswine, Weavile, and Scizor, all of which Rotom-W can check decently as well. A Skarmory of your own can add some more insurance as most priority users are physically inclined, while Haxorus will appreciate Skarmory's ability to set up Spikes. Pokemon that can set up dual screens will be immensely useful for Haxorus due to his poor defenses. Azelf, Latios, and Espeon are all very good choices thanks to their great Speed, and with the proper investment, they still possess the bulk to set up dual screens more than once. Wobbuffet support is worth considering for Haxorus because it can eliminate Choice Scarf Pokemon with either Counter or Mirror Coat and Encore a support move such as Stealth Rock to give Haxorus a free switch in to use Dragon Dance.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Choice Scarf was once a staple on Haxorus, but has been made largely unnecessary with the introduction of Kyurem-B. It still takes neutral damage from Stealth Rock, and it isn't weak to common priority moves, so if you're pining for a strong and fast physical Dragon-type, feel free to use it. Haban Berry might seem attractive on paper, but it's rather underwhelming in practice as Haxorus is still usually OHKOed by most Dragon-type moves. As mentioned earlier, you can gamble with Haxorus by using Rivalry and hoping for a potential Attack boost. If an Attack boost is achieved, Haxorus is capable of potentially 2HKOing Pokemon it wouldn't dream of 2HKOing with Choice Band-boosted Outrage, such as Skarmory and Ferrothorn after Stealth Rock. The inverse is also true, and Haxorus loses out on many potential OHKOes if Rivalry is used. Since genders are randomized, your odds of achieving an Attack boost is 50% at best (keep in mind that some players selectively choose their genders for each Pokemon), so it isn't a very good ability to use in a serious match. Unnerve is completely worthless on Haxorus, since he doesn't face Pokemon that typically use resist Berries. Haxorus's movepool is fairly limited, and most viable options have already been covered. Dragon Tail is a decent option on the Choice Band set, but its negative priority coupled with Haxorus's poor defenses makes it a relatively risky choice. Roar can be used on the Choice Band set to disrupt Baton Pass teams that utilize Espeon. Other than that, there aren't many other useful moves for Haxorus to take advantage of.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>The list of Pokemon that can switch into Haxorus safely is unfortunately (or fortunately!) quite sparse due to his ridiculous Attack and powerful STAB. Skarmory is as close to a counter as they come, as it can come in on most Outrages and Roost off the damage. Skarmory should watch out for the Swords Dance set however, as it risks getting OHKOed by +2 Fighting Gem Superpower after a bit of prior damage or 2HKOed by +2 Aqua Tail in the rain. Other Steel-types such as Scizor, Ferrothorn, Jirachi, and Forretress are also fine choices to take Haxorus's Outrages, although they all lack Skarmory's combination of stellar Defense and reliable recovery and can be picked off by Haxorus's coverage moves. Revenge killing Haxorus with a faster Pokemon is often the safest way to take him out. There are numerous fast and strong Pokemon such as Latios, Garchomp, Salamence, and Terrakion that can reliably revenge kill Haxorus assuming they avoid a super effective attack. Flying-types such as Tornadus can come in unharmed if Haxorus is lured into using Earthquake and OHKO back with an appropriate attack. Strong priority moves such as Bullet Punch, Mach Punch, and Ice Shard can damage Haxorus quite badly as well. Mamoswine and Weavile get special mentions because Haxorus is weak to their STAB priority Ice Shard, while Scizor is another fine choice because it resists Haxorus's STAB Outrage.</p>
  2. AccidentalGreed

    AccidentalGreed HOMERUN, CABRONES
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    Dear Google Chrome. Stop shutting off on me everytime I try playing a certain video on YouTube and type Smogon-related stuff while doing that, thanks.

    Okay, so anyways, a condensed version of what I was about to post:

    • Testing out stuff, will be back with you assuming irl stuff doesn't catch up to me
    • Low Kick as either a mention or slash on the double dance set, because it's generatlly a better option against a majority of Steel-types including Ferrothorn, Skarmory, and Balloon Heatran
    • Haxorus only really loses out on Rotom formes and Jirachi if Low Kick is used, since they're both lightweight and aren't super effectively hit
  3. Dungeons

    Dungeons

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    Swords Dance set:
    Life Orb/Leftovers > Fighting Gem
    Add Brick Break as an alternate to Super Power.

    Personally, I would say that the gem won't be as useful. Swords Dance will take a turn to set up and Haxorus doesn't have the highest speed in the world unboosted. Life Orb and Leftovers will help more. Swords Dance should give you enough power without the Gem. Also with that said, some people might not want to give up power and defenses. So Brick Break can be viable.

    Double Dance set:
    Brick Break/Superpower > Low Kick
    don't use Draco Plate. Lum Berry or Leftovers will help you a lot more and if you want more power, go for an item like Life Orb.

    Dragon Dance set:
    Brick Break/Superpower > Low Kick.

    My opinion is that Low Kick isn't the greatest of moves. I find it rather gimmicky.Other wise, I like this page :3
  4. RaikouLover

    RaikouLover

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    why not just Max / Max I get that the speed tier is wierd but we use it for every other sweeper...

    Earthquake > Fighting move on DD / Double Dance. Steels and Rotom are hit super effectively.. and Super effective is better than neutral. Mold breaker makes his Earthquake quite good. Skarm is still a dick, but +2 Outrage 2HKOs I'm pretty sure.
  5. Jukain

    Jukain fuck redew
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    I agree with RaikouLover, you should definitely run max Speed. Seriously, 4 Speed points (always tying with opposing Haxorus) helps you way more than 4 HP points.

    Also, is there any particular reason Dragon Claw is slashed on CB? When using Haxorus, I never find that I use it much. Meanwhile, Dual Chop can get me around stuff like parashuffler Dragonite, so I use it quite a bit more. Dragon Claw is total wasted filler, Aqua Tail / Dual Chop have use. imo there's no need to slash it.

    You should really mention somewhere that Kyurem-B is way bulkier and does technically hit harder. It's true, and the whole analysis ignores Kyurem-B other than saying what Haxorus has over it. Kyurem-B gives Haxorus heavy competition - you should note that.

    Just my two cents.
  6. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
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    Ready for QC CHECKS!!!

    OK.

    Both of them are really good move options, but Low Kick gets priority because it targets Ferrothorn(who is extremely prevalent). Without Low Kick, you don't have a chance of beating Ferrothorn with taking heavy damage or getting statused with EQ.

    Earthquake is really useful for smashing Jirachi (and the lesser common Bronzong / Metagross). If its any consolation, you already 2HKO Defensive variants with Outrage, and avoid the para w/ Lum Berry.

    Earthquake is already a primary move option on the DD set.

    Good point, it's better if I just mention Dragon Claw in AC.

    Is the Overview mention (which will obviously be fleshed out in the final analysis) not enough? I agree that Kyurem-B should receive more mentions in the Choice Band set, and I was intending to elaborate on that in the final writing, but there is absolutely no reason to mention Kyurem-B on the other sets. I could write a brief eulogy in OO, pertaining to Kyurem-B murdering the Choice Scarf set but thats it.
  7. jc104

    jc104 Humblest person ever
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    This looks pretty good. The only thing I'm unsure about really is the choice of fighting gem on SD Haxorus, especially in addition to Aqua Tail. Is rain aqua tail not sufficient against the likes of skarm, and a super effective superpower not sufficient against the likes of ferrothorn? I'd say a Life Orb is the better choice overall, and certainly a viable option.

    As for the set order, I'm really not sure. I think CB might still be the best. I find the other sets quite difficult to justify over something like DD Salamence, which pretty much beats all the walls without need for SD, and has better speed and intimidate.

    Finally, could we add "more dragons" to the ac of pretty much all the sets? I feel that's where Hax is best - taking out the dragon counters before a better one clears up.
  8. CedOmega

    CedOmega

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    I honestly think Jolly nature deserves a sash on the Double Dance and ChoiceBand sets.

    Reason: The rare Jolly Haxor can outpace and win against Adamant variants & also score wins against Timid Rotom, Jolly Kyurem-B & other base 97 Speed threats not resistant to its attacks.

  9. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
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    Fighting Gem is absolutely mandatory on SD Haxorus. You need it if you want to have a chance of OHKOing Skarmory after SR ([81.13 - 95.5%], which is a guaranteed OHKO after a bit of prior damage, in addition to already having a chance to OHKO with just SR). Aqua Tail doesn't come close to OHKOing Skarmory, and you need rain support if you want to reliably 2HKO Skarmory. Fighting Gem is THE reason why I tout SD Hax as unwallable; You can't do a decent enough job at wallbreaking without it. Fighting Gem also wrecks SpD Jirachi and does a sizeable amount of damage to Forretress and Bronzong. In regards to Ferrothorn, a Fighting-gem isn't necessary to OHKO Ferrothorn after a boost, I just mentioned it because Haxorus has a decent chance of OHKOing Ferrothorn without a boost. I don't like using Life Orb on SD Haxorus at all. You don't need the extra juice against physical walls that take neutral damage from Outrage (Draco Plate more or less accomplishes it) and you don't need it against Steel-types either. (In fact, there's a chance you lose against Skarmory if it spams roost). LO also comes with some nasty recoil; Haxorus is frail enough as is, I don't think it needs to residual damage on top of that.
    I thought about keeping Choice Band at the top, but after some testing (with Princess Brii) we decided on making SD the #1 set. It's currently the only set that doesn't really suffer any concrete competition (CB has Kyurem-B, DD has Dragonite/Mence, etc). On competitive level, both are good but SD definitely has more potential. CB is way easier to use, and it fits on more teams, but SD can cause more damage.
    It's always difficult to justify using Haxorus over any of the other dragons, but in regards to your comment about SD Hax being outdone by DD mence; it doesn't have its main coverage move crippled by rain (in fact its the opposite with Haxorus w/ Aqua Tail) and it isn't SR weak (there's more precision involved with setting up with DD mence imo). As for DD Mence VS DD Hax, I don't think its as outclassed as you think; Salamence still needs to contend with its SR weakness and 4X Ice weak, which makes it easier to revenge kill. I'm not saying that Dragon Dance Salamence is bad (far from it) but i'm just pointing out reasons as to why you'd want to use Haxorus in the first place in the first place.

    And sure, but don't expect a heavy emphasis on DragSpam in this analysis!!!

    Even with a Haban Berry, Haxorus is getting OHKOed by pretty much every heavy duty Dragon-type move in the game. I should add it to OO though.
  10. jc104

    jc104 Humblest person ever
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    I'm sorry, but taking lefties into account (a near certainty outside of hail, unless it's using shed shell), the chance for Haxorus to OHKO Skarm is minute. Unless the Skarm player neglects to use roost as you superpower, you're going to fail to kill it that way. If it doesn't decide to roost, a Life Orb superpower would do more than enough, and the following superpower would be significantly more powerful. Interestingly, if I lower skarm's defense so that a OHKO is guaranteed with superpower after SR, a 2HKO with Life Orb superpower is all but certain even when skarm does use roost.

    Life Orb superpower also OHKOes SpD Jirachi at +2, so that's moot.

    The additional power offered to aqua tail and outrage far outweighs this very minor advantage against skarmory. A 15% power boost on a single superpower is not worth as much as a 30% boost every other time you attack. I find it very hard to see how this is not even worth a slash.
  11. alexwolf

    alexwolf King of Conquerors
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    agreeing with jc. superpower fighting gem is very situational and lo is bettter in almost all cases (the only thing you gain from it is a miniscule chance to ohko skarmory after sr and that's it). even lum berry is better imo, as it lets you set-up on a myriad of defensive pokemon that you couldn't reliably before, such as any scald or wow users (politoed, jellicent, rotom-w) and t-wave mons (chansey, celebi, and amoonguss come to mind), enhancing your ability to destroy stall and walls even more, which is the purpose of this set anyway. so the main items should be lo/lum berry, and a mention of fighting gem cna be given in ac.

    btw here is something interesting:

    +2 lo aqua tail in rain vs defensive skarmory: 79.34 - 93.41%

    while skarmory can do nothing except from phazing you or going for some desperate damage with bb. not to mention that in rain, aqua tail is essentially a 90 bp drawback free stab move which you can abuse to the fullest, thanks to mold breaker. pokemon such as gastrodon, jirachi, gliscor, hippowdon, and forretress can be reliable ohko-2hkoed by aqua tail without the need to lock yourself into outrage. not to mention that with aqua tail taking care of jirachi (the main target of superpower) you are now free to run low kick for ferrothorn and friends, meaning that the opponent cannot play around haxorus via switching anymore (switching around to take advantage of the atk and def drops of superpower).

    tl;dr


    • lo and lum berry need to be in the main set over fighting gem
    • also low kick should be slashed after superpower, and it would also be very heplful to explain how rain boosts sd haxorus's potential as a wallbreaker
    (sorry for the lack of caps, i am in a net and something is wrong with the keyboard)
  12. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
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    You raise some fair points, but you're strictly looking at things on paper. With all due respect, I think there are a several factors you haven't considered when using LO on SD Haxorus.

    • For one, you completely forgot about LO recoil damage. This is kind of a big deal with Haxorus since its frail. It's not frail to the point where it's OHKOed by everything, but Haxorus is usually brought to 20-10% if its hit by a reasonable strong neutral STAB move (or even some resisted moves on the special side haha). When you add Sandstorm and entry hazards into the mix, Haxorus just ends up dying short before causing meaningful damage (from my experience).
    • Adding to that, LO makes it worse at stallbreaking. LO puts Haxorus on a timer and good players can actually pivot by switching (though admittedly, its hard to "pivot" through +2 Aqua Tail). Regardless, if Haxorus has taken some damage, hazards are up or its statused, it can't break through stall as easily if it has LO.
    • LO is incompatible with Substitute. This is the big one, because Substitute is actually really good on this set. In fact, after some brief laddering I've determined that substitute is almost too good to pass up on SD Haxorus. Substitute is infinitely more useful against offensive teams (where the SD is not as useful) and eases prediction in situations where you're unsure if your opponent will switch or not AND protects you against status.
    jc104, you're right in saying +2 Superpower has a negligible chance of OHKOing Skarmory after SR, but that wasn't my point. +2 Fighting Gem Superpower has a chance of OHKOing Skarmory with a bit of prior damage (you literally just need Skarmory to be at around 80% to kill it, which isn't all too difficult if you can force it to switch once). You mention that it only has a 15% damage boost over LO, but you forgot to factor in the lack of LO recoil and its usability w/o Swords Dance. Unboosted Fight Gem boosted Superpowers hit like a truck. From my experience (in laddering both in & out of suspect) there weren't many times where I needed to use Superpower twice. Most teams only have 1 dedicated Steel-type.

    alexwolf, I can mention I can slash LO & Lum with Fighting-gem, and emphasis its usefulness in the rain (and at the same time mention that needs rain whereas Fight Gem functions on every team). Good call on Low Kick, i'll add it right away.
  13. jc104

    jc104 Humblest person ever
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    Now that you've put sub in as the first slash, that seems fine. Sub + gem is a great combo - you really need sub to make sure that the gem counts.

    Could you possibly add LO to AC of the DD sets? The extra power is largely unnecessary, I know, but with LO you might even get away with dragon claw rather than (or, in the case of pure dd, in addition to) outrage. I don't see why draco plate can't fit on pure dd either. Lum Berry, Life Orb, Draco Plate and Yache berry are probably viable on both sets. I know you don't want to repeat yourself, but it's better than misrepresenting the facts regarding what's viable.

    umm....

    Apart from that

    [qc] 1/3[/qc]
  14. Dice

    Dice what's a god to a nonbeliever
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    looks good after discussing it with you a few times

    [qc]2/3[/qc]
  15. Pocket

    Pocket Bringing the Afro to Space
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    One of the biggest advantages Haxorus have over Kyurem-Black is its access to Dragon Dance and Swords Dance, which gives it greater sweeping potential, so you should emphasize that.

    AC mention Salac Berry in the Swords Dance set for realizing a sweep mid- late-game
  16. alexwolf

    alexwolf King of Conquerors
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    I don't like Fighting Gem that much, but it is true that it works good with sub, at least in theory, and i trust your judgement anyway, so the sd set looks fine to me...

    Fake QC approval!!! (1/3)

    EDIT: Not fake anymore!
  17. tehy

    tehy

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    With all the hullabaloo about fighting gem, let me just point something out:

    There's a REALLY easy way to get some prior damage on Skarmory. It's called U-turn (with Rocks up). This has the added benefit of beating Shed Shell Skarmory, which Magnezone fails to do, or providing an actual useful team slot if you're not running heavy DragMag (Since haxorus seems able to stomp most steels anyhow).
    Also, let's not forget: Skarmory's a Spikes User. Many players (And i count myself among them) would accept 10% or even 20% damage on Skarmory (With rocks up) as an acceptable sacrifice for a layer or two, especially since it can usually take 2 CB outrages with SR up after that. This may change eventually, but it's true now (And it may be true even after Fight Gem Haxorus becomes legit and well-known)
  18. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
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    Open for business!
  19. AccidentalGreed

    AccidentalGreed HOMERUN, CABRONES
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    "After either dance, practically every Pokemon in OU is 2HKOed, if not instantly vaporized, by any combination of Outrage, Low Kick, or Earthquake."

    If changing it to this seems implausible, just mention Earthquake somewhere else since it might seem odd to slash Earthquake there and not mention it at all in the set comments.

    Outside of that:

    [​IMG]
  20. alexwolf

    alexwolf King of Conquerors
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    After either dance, practically every Pokemon in OU is 2HKOed, if not instantly vaporized, by any combination of Outrage, Low Kick, or Earthquake (except for Skarmory in the case of Dragon Dance).

    Change the sentence to this ^ and you are good to go!
  21. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
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    Well I didn't mean every Pokemon in OU (hence why I said practically). I elaborate on this later on:
  22. tehy

    tehy

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    This behemoth of a pokemon certainly had a behemoth of an analysis.

    Add green, cut red, comments below.
    I've bolded some stuff I commented on. In addition, I italicized an entire paragraph that I feel needs some work.

    Show Hide

    <p>Haxorus's name isn't the only cool thing about him. Sporting a massive base 147 Attack, Haxorus has the ability to OHKO or 2HKO nearly everything in the game, even without entry hazard support. In addition, access to amazing moves like Dragon Dance, Swords Dance, Outrage, and several great coverage moves like Superpower and Aqua Tail, make him both devastating and unpredictable. Unfortunately, he has meager defenses and a disappointing Speed stat, which can sometimes cause him to be brushed aside in favor of its Dragon-type brethren, namely Garchomp, Salamence, Dragonite, Kyurem-B. Haxorus faces considerable competition from Kyurem-B in particular, as both Pokemon are strikingly similar; both Pokemon possessing overkill Attack stats and similar Speed stats, but Kyurem-B posseses far greater durability and a great Special Attack stat. Despite these shortcomings, Haxorus's sheer power, and incredible offensive coverage often merits him a spot on a team, as very little can safely switch into this behemoth.</p>¶

    [SET]¶
    name: Swords Dance¶
    move 1: Swords Dance¶
    move 2: Outrage¶
    move 3: Superpower / Low Kick¶
    move 4: Substitute / Aqua Tail / Earthquake ¶
    item: Fighting Gem / Life Orb / Lum Berry¶
    ability: Mold Breaker¶
    nature: Adamant¶
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe¶

    [SET COMMENTS]¶

    <p>In a metagame filled with increasingly powerful physical threats, Swords Dance Haxorus still represents the absolute gold standard for one-turn power in OU. Haxorus is flat out uncounterable at +2—to put things in perspective, even Skarmory can't stop Haxorus once its gets going. When the opportunity presents itself, set up Swords Dance on something you can force out, usually by bluffing a Choice Band set. +2 Outrage will devastate anything that's unlucky enough to switch in; everything in OU (barring Skarmory & Forretress) is flat out 2HKOed by +2 Outrage at worst. Prominent physical walls like Slowbro, Hippowdown and Tangrowth all face potential OHKOes from +2 Outrage with a bit of prior damage (or none if LO is used). Superpower might seem counter-productive on a boosting set, but you need its high base power in order to defeat any Skarmory or Forretress that might switch in. Fighting Gem temporarily gives Haxorus Fighting-STAB on Superpower, which lets it overcome the Steel-types that are barely phasunfazed by Outrage or Earthquake, such as Skarmory, Ferrothorn, Forretress. Substitute offers Haxorus protection against status and also grants him (a few) setup opportunities. It also provides Haxorus utility against faster-paced offensive teams, since it isn't going to get very far with just Swords Dance. Since those teams are less likely to use pure defensive Pokemon, you don't even need the power boost from Swords Dance and you can do some damage with just Substitute.</p>¶

    <p>Aqua Tail gets an exceptional power boost in the rain, and is a staple for Haxorus ion rain teams. You can forget about using Superpower Fighting Gem alongside Aqua Tail, as Skarmory and Forretress are effortlessly 2HKOed by +2 Life Orb Aqua Tail in the rain and some other Steel-types like Jirachi or Scizor are actually OHKOed. Low Kick makes for great alternative to Superpower, as it's capable of dealing with most of the Steel-types that trouble Haxorus, and Aqua Tail can still cover Skarmory and Jirachi, Steel-types that take negligible damage from Low Kick. Earthquake nets you a little bit more coverage, and is more potent against Steel types such as Jirachi, Metagross and Bronzong. It's also useful in those situations where you don't want to use up your Fighting Gem.</p>¶

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]¶

    <p>There are several alternatives to the items listed on the Swords Dance set; Draco Plate provides a power boost to Outrage that is almost comparable to Life Orb, but without the recoil. It, notably allowsing Haxorus to always OHKO Hippowdon, Slowbro and Tangrowth with +2 Outrage with a layer of Spikes. Mystic Water strengthens Aqua Tail and makes it frighteningly powerful under rain, but it also grantsing you the 2HKO on Skarmory and OHKOes on both Landorus-T and Gliscor with +2 Aqua Tail regardless of the weather. Salac Berry can boost your Speed, but it can tricky to actually pull it off in a match. I, although if you can get Haxorus to take one strong hit that won't OHKO him, or if you can start spamming Substitute into Salac Berry range, you can potentially have a +2 Attack, +1 Speed sweeper on your hands. You can opt for a bulkier spread consisting of 92 HP / 200 Atk / 216 Spe, which noticeably increases Haxorus's durability while keeping its Attack and Speed stat mostly intact. Keep in mind, however, that if you lower Haxorus's Attack, you lose some potential OHKOes(most notable against Skarmory at 87% HP), and by lowering its speed, you risk getting outsped by Kyurem-B. Taunt will ensure that no matter what, Skarmory will lose to Haxorus in a 1 vs 1 matchup. It's also somewhat effective against the likes of Forretress, since it prevents it from setting up.</p>¶

    <p>Wobbuffet is a fantastic partner to Haxorus; it grants him set up opportunities with Encore, and can remove faster Choice Scarf Pokemon. Entry hazards from Pokemon like Deoxys-D are appreciated, since they further push physical walls like Slowbro, Hippowdown, and Forretress into OHKO range. U-turn users that lure out Skarmory are great partners to this set, as even the non-existent damage that U-turn deals to Skarmory (in addition to Stealth Rock damage when it switches out) can make the difference in OHKOing Skarmory when it switches into Haxorus later in the game. Swords Dance Haxorus is a great partner to most Dragon-types, since he can lure and weaken/KO most, if not all of of their checks. Latios, Garchomp and Kyurem-B are some of the Dragon-types that love having their checks & counters weakened or eliminated, before going wild. A Haxorus with a Swords Dance under its belt is a huge threat—You almost always devastate matchups against slower Pokemon with Haxorus's overkill Attack stat and he is highly effective against Stall teams or teams with strong defensive cores. Of course, when all's said and done, Haxorus is still utterly useless in the face of faster Pokemon, which ultimately prevents Haxorus from being a top-tier threat. Remember to use this set with discretion, as sometimes going witha Choice Band might be the better choice. It's a matter of ease of use versus potential; Choice Band is easier to use, and is much more effective early on, but is but can easily stopped by hard counters or revenge killed. Swords Dance requires a bit more finesse and might not be useful early on, but it can be rewarding when pulled off correctly.</p>¶

    [SET] ¶
    name: Choice Band¶
    move 1: Outrage¶
    move 2: Superpower¶
    move 3: Earthquake¶
    move 4: Aqua Tail / Dragon Claw¶
    item: Choice Band¶
    ability: Mold Breaker ¶
    nature: Adamant / Jolly¶
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe¶

    [SET COMMENTS]¶
    <p>Haxorus and Choice Band go together like peanut butter and jelly, as it boosts Haxorus's already amazing Attack stat to an absurd 648. There are very few Pokemon that can claim to counter Choice Band Haxorus, as virtually everything gets at most 2HKOed by an appropriate attack. Even the bulkiest physical walls, such as Hippowdon, Slowbro, and Tangrowth, will be unable to keep up with Haxorus's onslaught, and since many Steel-types are 2HKOed by him as well, Haxorus is as close to "uncounterable" as they come.</p>¶

    <p>Even though Choice Band Outrage is incredibly powerful, you should use Haxorus's coverage moves to weaken his checks before really cutting loose with Outrage. One of the strongest physical Fighting-type moves, Superpower, has been made available to Haxorus, whicand with it comes with the ability to utterly destroy most Steel-type switchins. For example, Ferrothorn, a Pokemon that was once a good check to Choice Band Haxorus for example, is now hard-pressed to switch into Haxorus, as Superpower will easily OHKO with a bit of prior damage. Superpower is actually about as strong as a STAB Dragon Claw, so it's a good idea to use it in situations where you intend to deal high damage, but don't want to trap Haxorus by using Outrage. Earthquake is a bit weaker than Superpower, but complements Outrage well by nailing grounded Steel-types, and thanks to Mold Breaker, Levitate users such as Bronzong, Gengar, Rotom-W, Latios, and Latias must think twice about switching in. Aqua Tail is used solely to get deal heavy damage to Skarmory, Forretress, Landorus-T and Gliscor—E, each of those threatswhich face 2HKOes if they directly switch intom rain-boosted Aqua Tail. It should go without saying, however, that Aqua Tail demands the use of Politoed as a partner to function and as is practically useless without the boost from rain. Dragon Claw exists as a weaker alternative to Outrage; it may not kill everything, but it's still a damaging move option that doesn't lock Haxorus in.</p>¶

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]¶

    <p>In order to appreciate the sheer power of Choice Band Haxorus's Outrage, here are some damage calculations against some of the premier physical walls and Steel-types that resist it.</p>¶

    <ul class="damage_calculation">¶
    <li>-1 Outrage vs. 200/244 Landorus-T: 54.74 - 64.49%</li>¶
    <li>Outrage vs. 252/184+ Gliscor: 64.69% - 76.27%</li>¶
    <li>Outrage vs. 252/252+ Hippowdon: 54.29% - 63.81%</li>¶
    <li>Outrage vs. 248/252+ Vaporeon: 75.16% - 88.77%</li>¶
    <li>Outrage vs. 252/0 Scizor: 51.45% - 60.47%</li>¶
    <li>Outrage vs. 252/48+ Ferrothorn: 34.94% - 40.91%</li>¶
    <li>Outrage vs. 252/0 Jirachi: 43.81% - 51.49%</li>¶
    <li>Outrage vs. 0/0 Heatran: 52.01% - 61.30%</li>¶
    </ul>¶

    <p>A Jolly nature allows Haxorus to outspeed always outspeed Kyurem-B and most variants of opposing Haxorus and Hydreigon. In truth, there isn't much point to using a Jolly nature on Choice Band Haxorus, as the extra Speed isn't worth the large drop in power, nor is it worth the irreparable damage to your pride. Haxorus's movepool is sparse, but Dual Chop and Rock Slide are worth considering over Dragon Claw. Dual Chop can be used to break opposing Substitutes, but its accuracy can be off-putting. Rock Slide lets Haxorus hit Gyarados and Zapdos without locking himself into Outrage, but they are still hit hard by Dragon Claw, and Rock Slide can give Steel-types free switches. Another option that should be considered is Rivalry. Although Mold Breaker is great when used with Earthquake, Rivalry can be used for an extra boost. The 25% increase in power is very significant considering Haxorus's amazing Attack, -for example, with one layer of Spikes, Outrage will usually 2HKO the standard Relaxed Ferrothorn with the help of Rivalry. Though. However, this can easily backfire, as athe 25% penalty in Attack can prevent you from getting the OHKO on Pokemon who would ordinarily be OHKOed by Mold Breaker Haxorus.</p>¶

    <p>Although Haxorus is going to be hitting everything hard with Outrage, it still has troubles with the bane of most physical attackers: Skarmory. Skarmory can come in on any of Haxorus's attacks and proceed to Roost off the damage or set up Spikes thanks to its amazing Defense. Other than Skarmory, there aren't really any other true Haxorus counters. Bronzong, Ferrothorn, and defensive Jirachi are decent checks, but although they can usually take two Outrages, they will fall to a well-predicted Earthquake or Superpower. Magnezone is one of the best partners for Haxorus because it can easily trap and kill most Steel-types with Magnet Pull. It also has solid synergy with Haxorus, since it can take Ice- and Dragon-type attacks aimed at the giant salamander. Haxorus is prone to being revenge killed by the likes of Mamoswine, Weavile, and Scizor thanks to their powerful priority attacks. A Scizor of your own can be helpful in this situation to take Ice Shards and Bullet Punches aimed at Haxorus. You also might want to consider pairing Haxorus with Pokemon that can take advantage of Haxorus's ability to KO most Steel-types and physical walls. Pokemon such as Latios will absolutely love having Ferrothorn, Scizor, and Heatran out of the picture so it can spam Draco Meteors with little to fear. Choice Band Haxorus tends to get picked off after it has KOed a Pokemon, though smart play and proper positioning can allow Haxorus stick around longer and potentially get even more KOs.</p>¶

    [SET]¶
    name: Double Dance¶
    move 1: Dragon Dance¶
    move 2: Swords Dance¶
    move 3: Outrage¶
    move 4: Low Kick / Earthquake¶
    item: Lum Berry / Draco Plate¶
    nature: Adamant / Jolly¶
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe¶

    [SET COMMENTS]¶

    <p>While it should be fairly obvious that Haxorus makes great use of either Dragon Dance or Swords Dance, each set is somewhat ineffective against specific types of teams, which limits Haxorus's utility if certain threats haven't been eliminated. By using both moves on the same set, however, Haxorus gains the ability to set up flexibly and destroy almost any team after the appropriate boost. For instance, using Swords Dance enables Haxorus to break through walls and bulky attackers in slower defensive teams, while Dragon Dance is reserved for offensive teams with faster Pokemon. If possible, Haxorus should find opportunities to use both boosting moves to become faster and even stronger, though its sweep might be at risk if it attempts to boost again. After either dance, practically every Pokemon in OU is 2HKOed, if not instantly vaporized, by any combination of Outrage, Low Kick, or Earthquake.</p>¶

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]¶

    <p>This set can be tweaked in a few ways; If you desire some bulk, 120 HP / 252 Atk / 136 Spe is a viable alternative, as it allows Haxorus to outspeed positive base 130's after a Dragon Dance boost. Since setting up is more crucial than ever, Lum Berry is ideal to heal off status and Outrage-induced confusion, giving Haxorus opportunities to set up in front of status-reliant foes. As far as power-boosting items are concerned, Draco Plate is the preferred item, compromising between Haxorus's decent bulk and Life Orb's detrimental recoil. Even then, Lum Berry tends to be the better choice in most instances because of the popularity of defensive status users in the metagame, especially Ferrothorn and Rotom-W. Seeing as you can choose whichever boosting move to use for the appropriate situation, very little is completely safe from this set. To play this set correctly and avoid Outrage-induced confusion, however, bulky Steel-types, especially Skarmory and Forretress, (in addition to Jirachi if Low Kick is used), need to be eliminated beforehand. For starters, Magnezone is an instant solution to these threats due to its ability to trap and eliminate them immediately. As always, dual screens support from the likes of Latios and Espeon (preferably one with Hidden Power Fire to weaken Steel-type counters) is still a good team option to consider, providing more setup opportunities and a form of insurance against possible revenge killers. It would also be advisable to pair Haxorus with alternative offensive teammates that can take advantage of the damage that Haxorus causes, if the dragon finds himself attacking and fainting too early in the game.</p>¶

    [SET]¶
    name: Dragon Dance¶
    move 1: Dragon Dance¶
    move 2: Outrage¶
    move 3: Low Kick ¶
    move 4: Earthquake ¶
    item: Lum Berry / Yache Berry ¶
    nature: Adamant / Jolly ¶
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe¶

    [SET COMMENTS]¶

    <p>Haxorus is by no means slow, but its awkward base 97 Speed means he'll always be outpaced by common Pokemon such as Garchomp, Latios, Terrakion, and Keldeo. As such, Haxorus can make great use of Dragon Dance to boost its already sky-high Attack along with its mediocre Speed in order to outpace and KO faster threats that he would otherwise lose againsto. Although finding an opportunity to setup may be difficult for a fragile Pokemon like Haxorus, and other Dragon Dance users are generally better, the benefits to setting up with Haxorus can be quite substantial, as the combination of speed and power make Haxorus incredibly hard to stop. After a single Dragon Dance, Haxorus reaches a terrifying 648 Attack and 427 Speed, enough to outpace every common Pokemon without a Choice Scarf. With a Dragon Dance under its belt, Outrage will 2HKO virtually everything in the game. Low Kick trashes Ferrothorn and Air Balloon Heatran, while Earthquake will nail all other Steel-types besides Skarmory, as -even Bronzong isn't safe thanks to Mold Breaker. Lum Berry is a great item that allows Haxorus to avoid being statused, or to immediately snap out of its confusion after using Outrage. Yache Berry is handy for weakening Ice-type moves and preventing Haxorus from being picked off by Ice Shard users.</p>¶

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]¶

    <p>Life Orb is a more powerful, albeit riskier item for this set for the additional power boost. Haxorus's teammates should focus on either eliminating its counters or creating an opportunity for him to set up a Dragon Dance. Magnezone deserves an obvious mention for its ability to turn Skarmory into fried chicken through the use of Magnet Pull and Thunderbolt. Choice Scarf Rotom-W is also an excellent partner because it has little to fear from Skarmory, Bronzong, and most other Haxorus checks. Rotom-W can also use Trick to cripple an incoming Pokemon, which will subsequently give Haxorus a chance to use Dragon Dance as the Tricked Pokemon is forced to switch out. Haxorus is extremely susceptible to revenge killing by priority users such as Mamoswine, Weavile, and Scizor, all of which Rotom-W can check decently as well. A Skarmory of your own can add some more insurance since most priority users are physically inclined, while Haxorus will appreciate Skarmory's ability to set up Spikes. Pokemon that can set up dual screens will be immensely useful for Haxorus due to its poor defenses. Azelf, Latios, and Espeon are all very good choices thanks to their great Speed, and with the proper investment, they still possess the bulk to set up dual screens more than once. Wobbuffet support is worth considering for Haxorus because it can eliminate Choice Scarf Pokemon with either Counter or Mirror Coat, and it can also Encore a support move such as Stealth Rock to give Haxorus a free switch in to use Dragon Dance.</p>¶

    [Other Options]¶

    <p>Choice Scarf was once a staple on Haxorus, but has been made largely unnecessary with the introduction of Kyurem-B. It still takes neutral damage from Stealth Rock, and it isn't weak to common priority moves, so if you're pining for a strong-and-fast physical Dragon-type, feel free to use it. Haban Berry might seem attractive on paper, but it's rather underwhelming in practice as Haxorus is still usually OHKOed by most Dragon-type moves. As mentioned earlier, you can gamble with Haxorus by using Rivalry and hoping for a potential Attack boost. If an Attack boost is achieved, Haxorus is capable of potentially 2HKOing Pokemon it wouldn't dream of 2HKOing with Choice Band Outrage, such as Skarmory and Ferrothorn after Stealth Rock. The inverse is also true, and Haxorus loses out on many potential OHKOes if Rivalry is used. Since genders are randomized, your odds of achieving an Attack boost is 50% at best (keep in mind that some players selectively choose their genders for each Pokemon), so it isn't a very good ability to use in a serious match. Unnerve is completely worthless on Haxorus, since he doesn't face Pokemon that typically use resist berries. Haxorus's movepool is fairly limited, and most viable options have already been covered. Dragon Tail is a decent option on the Choice Band set, but its negative priority coupled with Haxorus's poor defenses makes it a relatively risky choice. Roar can be used on the Choice Band set to disrupt Baton Pass teams that utilize Espeon. Other than that, there aren't many other useful moves for Haxorus to take advantage of.</p>¶

    [Checks & Counters]¶

    <p>The list of Pokemon that can switch into Haxorus safely is unfortunately (or fortunately!) quite sparse due to its ridiculous Attack and powerful STAB. Skarmory is as close to a counter as they come, as it can come in on most Outrages and Roost off the damage. Skarmory should watch out for the Swords Dance set however, as it risks getting OHKOed by +2 Fighting Gem Superpower after a bit of prior damage or 2HKOed by +2 Aqua Tail in the rain. Other Steel-types such as Scizor, Ferrothorn, Jirachi, and Forretress are also fine choices to take Haxorus's Outrages, although they all lack Skarmory's combination of stellar Defense and reliable recovery and can be picked off by Haxorus's coverage moves. Revenge killing Haxorus with a faster Pokemon is often the safest way to take him out. There are numerous fast and strong Pokemon such as Latios, Garchomp, Salamence, and Terrakion that can reliably revenge kill Haxorus assuming they avoid a super effective attack. Flying-types such as Tornadus can come in unharmed if Haxorus is lured into using Earthquake, and OHKO back with an appropriate attack. Strong priority moves like Bullet Punch, Mach Punch and Ice Shard can damage Haxorus quite badly as well. Mamoswine and Weavile get special mentions because Haxorus is weak to their STAB priority Ice Shard, while Scizor is another fine choice because it resists Haxorus's STAB Outrage.</p> ¶



    Comments:
    Right in the overview, you use his, then its in one sentence. You should really pick just one
    One-turn power for SD? I mean, after one turn, sure, but one-turn power sounds like a term you'd use for a CB pokemon. (Maybe just to me?)
    Maybe you should say either "Skarm/Rachi" or "Steel-types that take negligible damage from Low Kick"
    Lando-T has intimidate, so it's probably not getting hit at plus 2 by an SD set. Maybe just say it's OHKO'd after an SD? (Also, regardless of the weather? Sun says hello).
    "The likes of forretress" Is there anything else that tries to set up hazards on an SD haxorus? Yes ferro but the set usually has fight gem Superpower, or at least LO superpower/Low Kick. Maybe I'm forgetting something here?
    As a personal comment, is that u-turn mention because of me earlier? Or was that just there already?
    I think Latios and Latias have bigger fears from Haxorus from Mold Breaker Outrage, js. And 3's enough for such a list anyhow.
    Are we really not mentioning Volcarona in the Rock Slide section?
    Pokemon such as Latios is plural;It can spam draco meteors is not, and also refers only to Latios. So that needs changing, one way or another.
    You say "as always screens support helps". You haven't mentioned those in the SD set at all, JS.


    Edit:Wire, what would Forretress do to it? If it uses hazards, unless it has a priority user on its team, that's GG for him. Other than that, not much Taunt blocks anyhow.

    Double edit: Yeah, Alex is right. Practically would make sense if Skarm wasn't used hard and used for Hax, but it is, so yeah.

    TRIPLE edit: Well, just trying to help. Also it's not a GP check... YET! (Or ever, possibly.)
  23. Wire

    Wire

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    You should add Taunt into the DD set. This lets it get another DD on Forretress where stuff like Scarf Azelf can't even outspeed it
  24. alexwolf

    alexwolf King of Conquerors
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    Well PK doesn't practically imply everything that gets usage or something similar (in practice you will always 2HKO the whole meta)? I don't know this is how i get it, but i may be wrong...
  25. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
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    Ok, you're right. The sentence has been changed.

    I finished implementing tehy's GP check. Your comments were very helpful.
    Yup. I sometimes used that strategy when running SD Haxorus, but I didn't give it much thought until you brought it up.

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