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Help with team creation

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by assistdude, Sep 14, 2012.

  1. assistdude

    assistdude

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    Messages:
    8
    Gliscor (M) @ Toxic Orb
    Ability: Poision Heal
    EVs: 252 HP / 128 Atk / 128 S.Def
    Nature: Adamant
    - Substitute
    - Earthquake
    - Protect
    - Toxic

    Gliscor is the leading pokemon of this team, using Stealth Rock as a start, and with its known posion heal+protect combination, he might be able to survive hits while using powerful moves (Earthquake, and for flying pokemon- Fire Fang with the 252 EV in the attack stat)

    Jellicent (M) @ Splash Plate*
    Ability: Water Absorb
    EVs: 236 HP / 252 S.Atk / 20 S.DEF
    Nature: Modest
    - Scald*
    - Recover
    - Surf*
    - Toxic

    As a more passive play, Spiritomb's Toxic+Protect combination is nice, while it has Dark Pulse with BlackGlasses+252 Ev's in S.ATK and Shadow Ball in case of a dark type resistans he has an offensive role.

    Snorlax (M) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Thick Fat
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 6 S.DEF
    Nature: Relaxed
    - Sleep Talk
    - Rest
    - Body Slam
    - Crunch

    The Gurdian of the team, the familliar Rest+Sleep Talk combo, with leftovers and max HP/DEF he is a safe switch against status abusers and with his Body Slam+Crunch he can hit Ghosts and any other type of pokemon easly while Sleep Talking. I must say, this set of him saved me a lot of times.

    Ferrothorn (N) @ Rockey Helmet
    Ability: Iron Barbs
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 DEF
    Nature: Relaxed
    - Gyro Ball
    - Thunder wave
    - Leech Seed*
    - Stealth Rock

    The main Sweeper with Gyro Ball+63 Speed stat, I have made a lot of truble to my enemies with it, Trick Room for covering my low speed stat of course and Zen Headbutt for STAB. Honestly I am trying to think about a useful move instead of the not very used Earthquake of his.

    Tyranitar (M) @ Life Orb
    Ability: Sand Stream
    EVs: 252 Atk / 88 DEF / 168 S.DEF
    Nature: Adamant
    - Crunch
    - Rock Slide
    - Aerial Ace
    - Fire Punch

    The main reason I have thought about Tytar is because of his useful ability against weather teams and with his veraity of attack types it can make a very good damage with his Life Orb as an offensive role

    Heatran (M) @ Flame Plate
    Ability: Flash Fire
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 S.ATK / 252 Speed
    Nature: Modest
    - Flamethrower
    - Toxic
    - Protect
    - Roar

    Victini with his STAB of fire+ Choice Band+max EV's on attack+V create is a killing machine, 2HKO water type pokemons with it so I dont have to worry about the Choice Band limit. and in any case of water type against me or even rock, I still can use Brick Break and Fusion Bolt, but I still think its a waste of slots, so I am here to hear opinions about what is a good move to change to.

    * Everyone has max IV's exept for Bronzong's Speed IV which has 0 in it.
    ** I am trying to get an Idea about what pokemon to choose for the 6th slot since I cannot get a perfect V create Victini right now.
    ***I am not so sure about tyranitar and Spiritomb, so you can suggest any new pokemon as a replacement, and I will be glad to get advices about the Moveset/ Hold Item/ EV's/ Abilities/ Nature/ of any other pokemon.

    Thanks for helping!
  2. JWoodhead18

    JWoodhead18

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2012
    Messages:
    12
    Not enough depth.

    Hi there and welcome to Smogon!

    I see you have some issues with your team that you are not aware of for example I suggest this Gliscor instead of the one in your team:

    Gliscor @ Poison Heal w/ Toxic Orb
    140 Atk / 140 Def / 230 HP / Impish Nature

    - Substitute
    - Protect
    - Earthquake
    - Toxic


    This set provides a status inducer and a substitute along with earthquake just in case you are taunted to death and protect to drag on the poison damage to the opponent.

    I would also suggest changing Bronzong because it isn't that great compared with ferrothorn as ferrothorn can t-wave, leech seed and hit back with power whip or a stronger gyro ball than bronzong, also there is rocky helmet along with the iron barbs ability which can drain away physical attacking pokemon's health which is a must these days. Here is the ferrothorn set:


    Ferrothorn @ Iron Barbs w/ Rocky Helmet
    252 Atk / 252 Def / 4 HP / Impish Nature

    - Power Whip / Gyro Ball
    - Thunder Wave
    - Leech Seed
    - Spikes / Stealth Rock


    This set is designed to set up entry hazards as well as paralyze opposing pokemon along with leeching the life out of them, I would use it but it's your choice.

    Other than that I think your other pokemon are fine as long as you know how to use them and please comment back on what you think of my suggestions.
  3. Haunter

    Haunter 100% avocado
    is an official Team Rateris a Battle Server Administratoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris an Administratoris a Tutor Alumnus
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    We require that you test your team before posting a RMT. Please play with your team on our simulator and come up with a finalized version of it so it can get proper rates. You can find out most of your team's problems by just playing it on the ladder.
  4. assistdude

    assistdude

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2012
    Messages:
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    I have played with it in the pokemon online simulator
    I dont know what alse I can say about the team, what information would you like to know?

    I will start with the ferrothorn:
    I think its a very good thinking to change bronzong with it, but I got some questions:
    why is Impish nature better than relaxed which lowers the speed stat even more? and setting up stealth rock+leech seed+thunder wave is a lot of free turns for him to switch into a S.ATK pokemon and OHKO me with a fire attack, even without STAB. and why there is no Trick Room in this moveset? what makes TWave a better move than that?

    About the Gliscor:
    I love the EV you gave to it, but with this low speed, I wouldn't have the chance of subtitute before their attack, besides of that, its a very nice suggestion.

    And BTW, if I do these changes, the team could handle phisical attackers, but then I would need to change Snorlax's EV's to 252 on S.DEF and 4 DEF instead of 252 DEF and the 4 S.DEF so I would have a chance to counter S.Attack pokemons.

    Oh, I almost forgot:
    I need you to think about a replacement for the Victini since I cannot get it legitimally in my Black version...
    And I want your opinion about the Tytar because I am not so sure about him, he was my "last option" so I thought about a dragonite instead of him, or something like that.
  5. assistdude

    assistdude

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    up, I still need some help
  6. Delko

    Delko
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  7. assistdude

    assistdude

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  8. Alfalfa

    Alfalfa

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    I have no clue why Spiritomb is using BlackGlasses. It has only Dark Pulse to boost. Use Leftovers instead.
  9. assistdude

    assistdude

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    Sep 14, 2012
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    one item per team rule..
    I am using it on Snorlax
  10. Kidogo

    Kidogo

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2012
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    461
    Note: I think you mean bump instead of up.


    Anyway, as others have said, hi assistdude, welcome to smogon. I definitely recommend looking at the links above, they should help you out a lot. Some other suggestions for the team:
    The Pokemon you use are generally at least viable competitively, which is something that unfortunately cannot be said for many beginning teams. I think your major problem is that you're not clear on the roles that certain Pokemon are meant to play. Bronzong, for example, is a Pokemon inherently built to be a defensive supporter. Its stats, typing, and movepool are simply much more conducive to a defensive set. This means that if you want to use it that is a better set for you to use; if you want an offensive trick room user, another, more offensively geared Pokemon such as offensive TR reuniclus is probably the better choice. Also, levitate is generally superior to heatproof as the ability if you do choose to use Bronzong, unless you want to bluff levitate, a strategy I do not recommend.

    Spiritomb is, sadly, not a very viable Pokemon in OU. If it is used, it is probably better as a wall with will-o-wisp and pain split, as it has nice defensive stats and typing. If you are set on a special offensive set, I suggest CMtomb over your current one, as toxic + protect is a strategy better executed by others, such as the gliscor set suggested above. Both of these sets can be found in the strategydex Delko linked to above.

    In the current metagame snorlax's only really viable set is the choice band one, as it serves as a pursuiter for all sorts of special attackers, such as the Latis. Even so, it's not a great Pokemon in this fighting-infested metagame, but it does have a niche if you want to use it. If what you're after is a special wall, some good options include celebi, jirachi, Chansey and blissey, and others.

    I don't know how well ttar fits with the team--the only Pokemon that really appreciate the sand are gliscor and Bronzong, while the rest of the team will be taking passive damage each turn. If you're looking for a strong LO attacker with good coverage, some options include starmie, sheer force landorus, and magic guard alakazam. If you want to stick with ttar, maybe for the security it gives you against other weathers, I would advice either going with a scarf or band set, or with a special defensive set. With the boost from SS, ttar has incredibly high SpD, making it a good option for your team's special wall. Ttar and gliscor have decent synergy together and can ward off the majority of offensive threats, so they are a good defsnsive core. If you want a more offensive set, ttar is best running a choice one--either scarf to serve as a good revenge-killer or band to achieve a ton of power and act as a wall-breaker.

    Lastly, victini is really only viable in OU on a sun team--otherwise its weaknesses and mediocre stats will outweigh the power of V-create in a metagame dominated by rain and sand. If you want a fast offensive fire type, some good options include infernape, heatran, and volcarona. However, the are a plethora of base-100 speed Pokemon that can utilize fire type moves very effectively. Some good ones include genesect, mixmence, scarf moxiemence, dragonite, and many others.

    Seething you should note is that most teams posted are for simulators, which do not have restrictions such as item clause. You should probably note at the top of your post that this is a wifi based team.

    Sorry for the length of the post, I hope my suggestions helped. I highly recommend following Delko's links as they should help you out a lot. GL with the team!
  11. assistdude

    assistdude

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    I understood the problem with Bronzong and already changed it with the Ferrothorn suggested above


    I am not looking for a defensive Spiritomb so I guess I need a suggestion for a replacement because you convinced me to do so.



    In case I change it to Bllisey, what will be a good physical attacker's tank?
    I dont think Ferrotorn would be enough...


    Ttar was in a question mark in first place, and I just wanted to know what do you think will fit the best as a set for Starmie (I already got a flying ground Gliscor so landorus would be a waste in my opinion).
    and please give a full review to the pokemon inclues EV's, moveset, hold item, ability..


    And about Victini, as I said, I am unable to get such a perfect Victini legitimally so I would go for a flash fire Heatran which can be a safe swich from my Ferrothorn so let me know about a good set for him =]


    Thanks for helping out!
  12. Rust

    Rust

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    Sep 23, 2012
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    If you want Gliscor to deal damage to Flying types, why not just go EdgeQuake?
  13. Alfalfa

    Alfalfa

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    633
    Ice Fang > Stone Edge

    Ice Fang is weaker, but it gives some better coverage.
  14. assistdude

    assistdude

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    I dont want him to damage flying types...
    are you talking about Tytar?
  15. Thunderbolta

    Thunderbolta

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2012
    Messages:
    45
    No, that would have been regarding Gliscor.

    Anyway... Spiritomb replacement, eh? Since you were using it as a Tox staller and Gliscor does that SO much better, time to think about what you're missing. By swapping Victini to Heatran, you're missing any kind of revenge killer. Terrakion, or Scarf Genesect tend to fill this role with great ease. Take your pick, I'm not sure which'd work better.

    Show Hide

    Terrakion @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
    Jolly Nature
    - Close Combat
    - Earthquake
    - Stone Edge
    - X-Scissor

    Genesect @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Download
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 144 Spd / 112 Atk
    Hasty Nature
    - U-turn
    - Thunderbolt
    - Ice Beam
    - Flamethrower
  16. JumpMan23Swag

    JumpMan23Swag

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2012
    Messages:
    12
    Alright first of all there isnt a one item per team rule enless your playing something different than i am. Second like others have suggested editing the gliscor set so it doesent have stealth rocks may be a more liable choice than what you are currently running. While stealth rocks is great and all it honestly hinders gliscor a bit nowadays.
    Gliscor sets to try:

    This is the set i prefer to use it works pretty good.
    Gliscor (F) @ Toxic Orb
    Trait: Poison Heal
    EVs: 244 HP / 44 Def / 220 Spd
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
    - Aerial Ace
    - Protect
    - Toxic
    - Earthquake

    This set is more standard and gives you the substitute over aerial ace (which i just use for a little more coverage, hit baloons off, and hit things that cant be hit by ground moves. It especially helps if you find a breloom roaming around.)
    Gliscor (F) @ Toxic Orb
    Trait: Poison Heal
    EVs: 244 HP / 192 Def / 72 Spd
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
    - Substitute
    - Protect
    - Toxic/taunt
    - Earthquake

    Next up on the list, spiritomb honestly isnt very effective at all in OU. I noticed a booming weakness to water type attacks, so i would suggest maybe a jellicent.
    Jellicent (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Water Absorb
    EVs: 248 HP / 176 Def / 84 Spd
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Taunt
    - Will-O-Wisp / toxic
    - Recover
    - Scald

    Okay moving on. The bronzong is okay... but i just think its place on the team could be utilized by a better pokemon. I would suggest either ferrothorn or forretress. Forretress gives you access to a spinner and toxic spikes if you would like them (im not really sure the pace your playing at with this team, if its faster id go with nattorei if its slower paced id go with forretress for the toxic spikes to wear them down.) Honestly you could even go with a skarmory if youd like, just for the immunity to ground and instant recovery. If you do decide to pick up one of these pokemon to add to your team i would suggest maybe a heatran to add for the ability to absorb fire and it could also work as your stealth rocker. So what i see working best is using forretress for rapid spinnning and adding a heatran over snorlax or victini ( doesent matter becausei plan on suggesting something over which ever you dont replace with heatran.)

    Heatran (M) @ Leftovers / shed shell ( to excape dugtrios )
    Trait: Flash Fire
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 SDef / 8 Spd
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Roar / toxic
    - Protect
    - Stealth Rock
    - Lava Plume

    Forretress (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SDef
    Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
    - Rapid Spin
    - Toxic Spikes
    - Volt Switch
    - Gyro Ball

    Next im gonna suggest changing either victini or snorlax, whichever wasnt replaced by heatran, to a latias. I just feel this will work better.

    Latias (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Calm Mind
    - Roost
    - Dragon Pulse
    - Thunderbolt
    You could also consider, salamence, or dnite. either dragon dance set would work okay.

    So a redcap of the changes so far: Changed gliscor set, jellicent added, forretress latias and heatran added. Lastly the tyranitar fits but i would to its set to the following...

    Tyranitar (M) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Stone Edge
    - Crunch
    - Pursuit
    - Superpower
    This i think will work well to get revenge kills and help kill off some things that may halt your latios in its process of sweeping.

    These are all just rough ideas, i havent been able to test any of it so im not sure if it will all work but i am pretty sure it will work nicer than what you had originally. I know i changed a lot but i think it was necessary... if theres anything you insist on keeping just tell me and ill try and rerate while keeping any pokemon you just really want to keep on the team. Ill test this out to make sure it runs smoothly and adjust anything i see, and get back at you with what i think works the best. I hope ive been able to help and if not sorry for wasting your time haha:P


    Also i decided id get you some sprites to make your post look a little more attractive.


    [pimg]477[/pimg] [pimg]490[/pimg] [pimg]623[/pimg] [pimg]380[/pimg] [pimg]248[/pimg] [pimg]205[/pimg] those are all the icons for the pokemon i suggested.


    Edit: i just realized i probably shouldve read all the other posts to see if their were other suggestions and if he made changes and didnt update his main post... so sorry about that i read some of the others but a little short on time so i havent been able to read them all. If some of this doesent apply to what you have done to your team since last time i do appologize.
  17. assistdude

    assistdude

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2012
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    as u said, I did some changes but I am the one that sorries because I havent updated the post, ill do it right away
    anyways, I think I would keep Snorlax since I am trying to put a tank into the team, and Snorlax is doing a great job, or I have thought about putting a blissey in it as well, and I am trying to keep away legenderies from my team so one is ok (heatran) but adding a latios... I dont think so.
    and about Terrakion\Genesect, I dont seek for a revange killer, I mean, Heatran can do it pretty good since it has a stong offensive stats and STAB to fire, and it case of amunity i can always take out Jellicent ;]
    and I cannot get a genesect in my pokemon black anyways.
    so its snorlax\blissey+heatran+jellicent for now
    [pimg]143[/pimg][pimg]Heatran[/pimg][pimg]623[/pimg]

    and now, about the Gliscor, I already changed the set, to the substitute u have mentioned, but why have u chose a female? I like it as a male in my team =]

    about Tytar: I dont mind to change it to the set u offered me, but I think it would be nice my way, I have expirinced a lot of battles among this team, and a fire type move on a Tytar is suprisingly suprising the enemy and it has a chance to 1HKO grass types so it doesnt need to get afraid of those

    and as for the bronzong, I changed it with Ferrothorn as some1 suggested to me, and it is a great phisical attackers counter =]
    check out the update of my post.. =]
    all the * marks meas I am not so sure, and let me know what u think about the movesets themselves, like flamethrower in heatran instead of lava plume

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