Hippopotas** [QC: 3/3]

[Kingler]

Original analysis written by Kingler12345. This analysis, among others, had to be completed and submitted in a hurry for Smogon's new dex. The OP here has been fully changed to reflect QC's version of this, written by Goddess Briyella. Corkscrew has already QC checked this within the LC QC project and his changes have already been implemented, and prem and Goddess Briyella have already done QC checks on the forums, making this QC 3/3.

Overview
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- Good mixed bulk
- A must have for Sand-based strategy
- Is able to counter Vulpix, and Sun by extension
- Decent support movepool

Auto-Sun Counter
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name: Auto-Sun Counter
move 1: Earthquake
move 2: Slack Off
move 3: Stealth Rock
move 4: Whirlwind
ability: Sand Stream
item: Eviolite
evs: 132 HP / 20 Atk / 132 Def / 180 SpD / 20 Spe
nature: Careful

Moves
========

- Earthquake is the obligatory STAB attack and it hits things for decent damage
- Slack Off provides reliable healing and assists greatly in walling enemies
- Stealth Rock is there to put pressure on the opposing team, especially with switching
- Whirlwind puts a stop to setup as well as can help to shuffle teams and force multiple opposing foes to take damage from Sand and Stealth Rock

Set Details
========

- Eviolite is the optimal item for providing more bulk, since Slack Off is already a continuous and reliable source of recovery and greatly outclasses the one-time use of Berry Juice
- Careful nature and the given EV spread allows Hippopotas to comfortably switch in on Vulpix, changing the weather in the process, and avoiding a 2HKO from Vulpix's Fire Blast or Energy Ball
- Enough physical bulk is there to still reliably tank neutral physical hits just as it always has been able to since BW

Usage Tips
========

- Hippopotas can comfortably switch in on standard Vulpix and threaten it with a OHKO from STAB Earthquake; if Vulpix uses Will-O-Wisp to burn Hippopotas, EQ is still a 2HKO
- If Vulpix opts to flee to avoid death, Hippopotas can heal off the damage it might have took on the switch-in by using Slack Off, and also has Stealth Rock, to limit Vulpix's longevity and Whirlwind to force a switch into something else
- Whirlwind can also be very useful for screwing up Pokemon who attempt to set up by boosting stats, putting up Substitutes, and/or using Baton Pass to pass these
- Sand Stream removes other weathers allows Rock-type teammates such as Lileep and Archen a 50% Special Defense increase and this can be very useful in battle, though the weather effect only lasts 5 turns this generation, it's not super bad though; in addition, if Hippopotas leads and comes out at the same time as Snover or Vulpix, Sand will be the dominant weather since Hippo is slower than both of them

Team Options
========

- Drilbur and Sandshrew can benefit greatly from Sand Stream with their Sand Rush ability effectively doubling their Speed and making them a lot more formidable
- Vullaby is an invaluable partner for Hippopotas, as it can help deal with the Chlorophyll sweepers that often accompany Vulpix; it resists Grass and its Overcoat ability blocks Sandstorm damage as well as Sleep Powder
- Lileep gets the 50% Special Defense boost provided by Sand Stream and can also recover health from the Water moves aimed at Hippopotas's weakness to them
- Munchlax patches up the Ice weakness compounded by the group of Pokemon described here in this segment, and can make use of Berry Juice and Recycle to stall or boost with Curse; Hippopotas can tank the Fighting-type attacks aimed at Munchlax as well

Other Options
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- Stone Edge hits Flying-types hard
- Toxic stalling can work with STAB Earthquake (hits the two Poison-immune types, Steel and Poison, for super effective damage) and Slack Off
- Elemental fangs offer good coverage but are sort of weak and aren't very ideal
- Crunch hits Ghost-types hard (many have Levitate and can avoid EQ)
- Superpower offers great coverage but is hard to fit onto a set
- Curse can be used with Slack Off to set up

Checks & Counters
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**Snover**: Hippo is weak to both of its STABs and it also replaces Sand with Hail, this is a very solid counter

**Natu**: Is immune to Earthquake and deflects both Stealth Rock and Whirlwind with Magic Bounce

**Ground-immune Pokemon**: Flying-types and Levitate carriers can both sit their asses down in front of Hippopotas and not fear having to take direct damage

**Burn status**: Being burned is an annoyance to Hippopotas, and this is particularly problematic when the status is being threatened by a Scald user, as Hippopotas is also weak to Water

**Grass-types**: Grass-types usually resist, or are at worst neutral to, Earthquake and can easily KO Hippopotas with their STAB attacks.

 

[prem]

for team options: mention gligar and drillbur

obviously they dont actually help hippo do his job, but they are teammates that directly get help from hippo. drilbur is obvious,y but sand veil gligar is stupidly ridiculously annoying when all your moves miss lol.


also for usage tips: note how it helps you beat vulpix / sun sweeper teams relying on solarbeam. its obviously a ballsy move, but switching in on a solarbeam completely wrecks. also makes them play more conservatively


checks and counter:
vullaby says fuk you to sr and can only be whirlwinded. will just be knocked off
staryu can spin your stuff away and ohko
slowpoke just kills and isnt gonna be worn down
tesshiido uses hippo for leech seed and can set up its own hazards in peace
other grass types also deserve a mention as more become popular
archen has fun.
misdreavous comes in for free and burns for fun.

theres probably mroe just add them as they come to you

add all of that and

1/3

 

[Kingler]

implemented the above!
also do i generalize c&c? there's a lot of pointers there =(

 

[prem]

um im not exactly sure becuse of the new system but you can generally go:"many water types can beat hippotas because its weak to its stab and they all generally dont care about earthquake". but since we are basically using threatlists for checks and counters now so you can just have all those bullet points and all

 

[Goddess Briyella]

• Only 20 Attack EVs are necessary to attain the stat value that 44 EVs provides.

• Stress that Sand Stream is the true reason to even use Hippopotas in the first place. Stealth Rock and Whirlwind are just additional things it can utilize. Don't mention Sand Force anywhere in this entire analysis, not even Other Options. Hippopotas can't even make use of Sand Force without wasting a moveslot on Sandstorm, and without auto-Sand it's about as viable as Phanpy.

• It should be mentioned somewhere that special bulk investment will allow Hippopotas to mess with Vulpix; the fact that Vulpix is destroyed by STAB Earthquake and the fact that Sand replaces Sun only further complement this fact. I'm actually kind of considering adding a set that can go toe-to-toe with Vulpix since being able to mess up auto-Sun is amazing right now, but I need to do testing (expect me to comment further on this later). Tangela is still a huge problem for it regardless but that's what teammates are for and it's probably getting the boot soon anyway.

• Why is Snover not in the Checks and Counters? It should be the absolute top counter to Hippopotas, even higher than Gligar, as not only can Snover mess up Hippopotas's preferred weather for its team, but it can easily OHKO it and win the weather war for the whole battle in one simple move.

• The Checks & Counters don't have to be that specific outside of Snover (it's a major counter for the reasons listed above). The Flying-types can really all be categorized under the same title, since Earthquake is the only attacking move on the set and they are all immune to it anyway. The different antics of each can be added under this one title (Gligar using Defog to remove Stealth Rock for instance). The Water-types with Scald can also be consolidated under one title. It's less clutter and a lot more organized that way.

Also, there was some confusion about this earlier due to some mistakes made by those responsible for the new template. The decisively correct way to add the names of the sets is to add the name of the set both over SET NAME above the ######## and also underneath it by the "name" label, like so:

Support
########
name: Support
move 1: Earthquake
move 2: Slack Off
move 3: Stealth Rock
move 4: Whirlwind
ability: Sand Stream
item: Eviolite
evs: 132 HP / 44 Atk / 212 Def / 100 SpD / 20 Spe
nature: Impish



Withholding QC approval until I try specially defensive Hippopotas to deal with Vulpix.




Okay, Hippopotas with the following set can switch into Vulpix against both Fire Blast AND Energy Ball comfortably. After Hippopotas gets in, it can either OHKO Vulpix cleanly with Earthquake, or it can Slack Off to heal off the damage as Vulpix flees to avoid death, while leaving Sand the active weather and not Sun. This kind of check is incredible, and Tangela has a very good chance of being banned at the moment, so I'm going to suggest that this gets its own particular set, as it's so successfully anti-meta, it's crazy to not present it.


Auto-Sun Counter
########
name: Auto-Sun Counter
move 1: Earthquake
move 2: Slack Off
move 3: Stealth Rock
move 4: Whirlwind / Yawn
ability: Sand Stream
item: Eviolite
evs: 132 HP / 20 Atk / 132 Def / 180 SpD / 20 Spe
nature: Careful

With the weather changed to Sand upon Hippopotas switching in, the given special bulk guarantees these calculations from standard Vulpix (most of them use Heat Rock or Choice Scarf as the held item):

196 SpA Vulpix Fire Blast vs. 132 HP / 180+ SpD Eviolite Hippopotas: 7-10 (28 - 40%) -- 98.9% chance to 3HKO

196 SpA Vulpix Energy Ball vs. 132 HP / 180+ SpD Eviolite Hippopotas: 10-12 (40 - 48%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Hypnosis is something Hippopotas would hate to switch into, true, but that can be said about any switch-in to a sleeping move, and the accuracy on it is quite horrible. In return, Hippopotas knocks Vulpix out in one hit while Vulpix is unable to finish Hippopotas off:

20 Atk Hippopotas Earthquake vs. 52 HP / 0 Def Vulpix: 32-38 (152.3 - 180.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO

If Vulpix stays in, the weather war is won and Sun is ruined for the opposing Sun team. If Vulpix switches out, it gives Hippopotas a free turn to either heal off damage with Slack Off or trap an incoming check with Yawn. Will-O-Wisp is a bit annoying but really only prolongs the process of Hippopotas beating Vulpix out throughout a match if Hippopotas is paired with a cleric (which should definitely be added to Team Options after this set is added) because Earthquake will still do well over half to Vulpix (and therefore will still kill it easily in two hits even if Hippopotas is burned) and it has no means of recovery, while Hippopotas has Slack Off for itself. Hippopotas counters Vulpix pretty reliably, and this should probably be somewhat standard especially after Tangela goes.

I'd like to tag Ray Jay to discuss the addition of the set. I don't know if it's a better idea to just combine the two sets since the attacks are mostly similar, or if the natures, EVs, and overall purposes are different enough to warrant my idea its own set, and maybe even enough to replace the first set, since this one counters Vulpix and does everything the first set does anyway. I'm still withholding QC approval but please implement the things I listed in my bullet points for now.

 

[Kingler]

Goddess Briyella
Either make that the spread on the main set or im gonna mention it in OO. While i dont mean to offend anyone, having a separate set just for tweaked evs with the same moveset is stupid. Anyway made your other changes ^.^

 

[Goddess Briyella]

Goddess Briyella
Either make that the spread on the main set or im gonna mention it in OO. While i dont mean to offend anyone, having a separate set just for tweaked evs with the same moveset is stupid. Anyway made your other changes ^.^

If it were up to me, this would probably be the main set, but I think we should wait for more input, which is why I tagged Ray Jay. And sets that serve different purposes are not "stupid" just because there are a few blatant similarities as far as moves. For example, in my Snubbull analysis there are two completely different sets that do different things with the only real difference in moves being one has Heal Bell and the other doesn't. My given Hippopotas set has different EVs as well as a different nature than yours, and these changes you might call minor or insignificant allow Hippopotas to pull off something extremely important that your given set cannot. I myself am not comfortable making the 100% call here about this, but I do know that this set is way too good to be relegated to Other Options as if it were simply a niche option. Wait for Ray Jay's input on this, and please don't rush the project.

Also, you forgot to remove the mention of Sand Force. If you do leave it there, be sure to at least talk about why it's totally impractical, as the whole reason to use Hippopotas is Sand Stream, and you'd need to waste a moveslot for Sandstorm in order to reap the benefits of Sand Force.

 

[Goddess Briyella]

Kingler12345, I spoke to Ray Jay on IRC and he decided there's no point in having these sets be separate. I'm going to go ahead and suggest that we replace your given set with the one I presented, as the one listed in the analysis is outclassed by a set that is able to counter Sun. Hippopotas is the only thing in the tier that is able to pull this off. It still has Slack Off and good physical bulk even with the new set. Sorry this took so long but I wanted to ask first on this one.

Feel free to add any and all of my points. Make this change and that's QC 2/3

 

[Rowan]

Is auto-sun counter really the best set name? I mean it does remove sun but that's not all it does... I think something simple like 'Mixed Wall' or 'Wall' would be better.

 

[Kingler]

Agreeing with Corkscrew that I feel the set name should change. Should i do that Goddess Briyella ?

 

[Goddess Briyella]

Kingler12345, Auto-Sun Counter is fine. It's honestly the ONLY reason to even run this kind of special bulk and there is nothing wrong with something that important having this kind of emphasis as the title. There are no special walls or mixed walls that counter Sun other than this thing, so for this reason I find the title very appropriate. I'm not sure why you removed Yawn; as this can screw up a lot of switch-ins as Vulpix flees, and should be given the slash with Whirlwind as I suggested. Whirlwind is still a viable option though, and it should be highlighted in the analysis that even though Hippopotas's standard set is now more specially bulky, it balances out since now there are notable specially inclined setup sweepers to phaze, particularly Swirlix; and forcing it to switch also has the great advantage of nullifying Unburden's Speed Boost for the rest of the battle if it has already consumed its Berry Juice.

Also, somewhere in the set description, you might say something along the lines of: "Hippopotas has always traditionally been used primarily as a physical wall, but the unban of Vulpix and Hippopotas's ability to counter it and the sunlight it brings have called for a new recipe." Also be sure to not mention Tangela or Yanma when this is written up, as they have both been banned.

I'd mention Hippopotas's traditional nature and EV spread somewhere too, as it still functions great as a physical wall when it's not countering Sun.

• One final addition! Natu should be the number one counter to this set in Checks & Counters right under Snover. It can't threaten Hippopotas outright offensively or mess with its weather, but it is immune to Hippopotas's only attacking move and it deflects all of its other moves via Magic Bounce. It can switch into Hippopotas with impunity and not have any kind of fear, while getting a free turn to use a status move as Hippopotas is forced to flee.

 

[Shaymin :D]

Yanma is banned, so remove the mention .3.

 

[Kingler]

done after a million years, ready for 3rd qc

 

[Goddess Briyella]

Mentions of Gligar/Swirlix need to be removed from this analysis.

 

[Kingler]

Sorry about this, I just haven't had the time to look at this lately. If someone wants to take this over asap, feel free, but I'll do it in a while or so. Anyway, thanks for reminding me! n_n

 

[Kingler]

OK, I removed gar/swirlix wasn't there and generally added and removed some stuff and made the analysis better in general etc. QC?

 

[athleteandy1]

Last gen, Sandshrew and Drilbur made a good Sand Rush combo. Having tested them, it works well this gen, too. Add Sandshrew with Drilbur to Team Options

 

[Goddess Briyella]

This Pokemon, as is the case with many others, was on a list of Pokemon that were high priority and needed to have completed skeletons for Smogon's new dex as soon as possible. As such, the OP of the thread has been fully edited to reflect the QC team's writeup of this Pokemon, as it will make things run a lot faster.

Thank you for understanding. :)