1. Welcome to Smogon! Check out the Smogon Starters Hangout for everything you need to know about starting out in the community. Don't forget to introduce yourself in the Introduction and Hangout Thread, too!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

Ice, Ice, Baby - Hail Discussion

Discussion in 'BW OU' started by Cshadow, Nov 26, 2010.

  1. Cshadow

    Cshadow

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2009
    Messages:
    866
    (no hail discussion yet?)

    Hail has been left in the dust this generation, unfortunately. No boosts, no new Snow Warning users, but the other weathers seem to have been spoiled rotten in comparison. Both sun and rain can now boast, as Droughtails and Drizzletoad, a godsend, have been given to them. No longer do they have to rely Heat Rock or Damp Rock to sustain a mere seven turns of sun or rain, no, with the two new weather users, they can permanently set the stage for their respective teams (that is, of course, until someone else steps in ). Even sandstorm, while receiving no more Sandstream users, received its own fair share toys. Sandstorm teams now have their own version of Solar Power and Swift Swim with Sand Paddle and Sand Power, respectively.

    Hail (directly) received nothing more than a few mediocre Ice Body and Snow Cloak abusers. No defense boosts, no new abilities, zip. However, looking at the vast and wide pool of additions Black and White has graced the metagame with, perhaps hail will indeed find some new toys deep in its stocking.

    The Effects Of Hail

    - Blizzard bypasses the accuracy check (it always hits).
    - Moonlight, Synthesis, and Morning Sun only restore health by 25% under hail.
    - Solarbeam deals half of its normal damage.
    - Weather Ball becomes a 100 base power ice attack.
    - Pokemon with the ability Snow Cloak get an evasion boost of 20% and are immune to the effects of hail.
    - Pokemon with the ability Ice Body restores 1/16 of their health and are immune to the effects of hail.
    - Deals 1/16 damage to all Pokemon that are not of the Ice type, nor have the abilities Snow Cloak, Ice Body, Magic Guard, or Dust Proof.

    The Pokemon

    Ice-type Pokemon, and those with Magic Guard, and Dust Proof flourish in hail. Below we have a list of Pokemon that work effectively in hail, and is, not limited to, Ice-types.

    [​IMG]
    Ah; the metagame could use a little Christmas spirit, no? And whom is better fit to spread it other than the one and only Pokemon in the entire game who can boast the ability Snow Warning? Yes, Snow Warning is where the magic begins, as it lets Abomasnow bring a hailstorm unto the battlefield. Abomasnow’s stats are all average, sporting 90/75/85 defenses and decent 92/92/60 offenses. While being average isn’t necessarily a bad thing, it certainly isn’t a great thing, as Abomasnow has no outstanding stats to make use of his great movepool and decent offensive typing. Still, he could have been a lot worse, in fact, he’s pretty damn good as is!

    Abomasnow is fairly versatile - Substitute + Leech Seed, Swords Dance and Choice Scarf are all very good options for him. Blizzard, Wood Hammer, Earthquake, Focus Punch, Ice Shard, Giga Drain are fantastic options to use in conjunction with his above possible sets. Most notably Abomasnow can sport two 120 base power STAB offensive moves, and in conjunction with Earthquake, can let him hit all opposing weather Pokemon for super effective damage.

    Unfortunately, Abomasnow bears the burden of several crippling weaknesses. Weakness to Rock, Fighting, Fire (4x), Steel, Poison, Bug and Flying give Abomasnow a total of seven weaknesses, and thus widens the radius of his problems due to how common six of those weaknesses are. Typing wise though, he has several boons in a resistance to Grass, Water, Electric and Ground, which should give him several opportunities to switch in and reset the weather considering several of his best partners are Heatran, Walrien, Quagsire, Tentacruel, and many more! With teammates likes Rankurusu, Espeon, Nidoqueen, Sableye, Heatran, Forretress, Hariyama and Quagsire, Abomasnow should have few problems covering his many weaknesses.

    Abomasnow @ Shed Shell/Leftovers
    Trait: Snow Warning
    EVs: 4 Def/ 252 SAtk/ 252 Spd
    Modest (+SpA, -Atk)
    - Blizzard
    - Giga Drain
    - Leech Seed
    - Substitute

    Abomasnow is best described as the “anti-metagame”, shutting down all opposing weathers, replacing whatever benefits they could be receiving with residual damage. The loss of Swift Swim, Sand Throw, Solar Power, Chlorophyll, the extra STAB bonus(es), and other such boosts they depend on can absolutely cripple opposing teams. How is this advantageous to hail? Well, to be quite honest, hail has no such boosts to depend on to work; only two abilities and a 120 base power move that by passes the accuracy check.

    Blizzard and Giga Drain are give-ins, especially with Giga Drain’s base power buff and healing. Leech Seed and Substitute will help give Abomasnow some survivability. Substitute can give Abomasnow a defense against bulky waters he will usually find himself switching into, avoiding Toxic, and then recovering off the lost HP with Leech Seed (or Giga Drain), which will rack up quite the residual damage with entry hazards and hail. The choice between Shed Shell and Leftovers is simply which tier you find yourself playing in the most. Shed Shell is an absolute must for Dream World to avoid getting murdered by the ever popular Shanderra, while leftovers is more preferable for a Shanderra-less metagame.

    Sets will vary. Some people will find it more efficient to run things like Wood Hammer or Ice Shard on more lead oriented Abomasnow sets. Whatever floats your boat, really.

    A Choice Scarf set was mentioned before, was it not? With a set of Wood Hammer (or Giga Drain)/ Blizzard/ Earthquake/ Hidden Power [Fire]([Fighting]), Abomasnow will find himself able to severely damage opposing weather leads.

    Code:
    140 Atk / 116 SpA / 252 Spe 
    
    Wood Hammer (120 Base Power) vs. 252 Hp/ 152 Def Positive Nature Hippowdon: 46.2% - 54.8%
    Wood Hammer (120 Base Power) vs. 252 Hp/ 4 Def Neutral Nature Hippowdon: 57.6% - 68.6%
    Wood Hammer (120 Base Power) vs. 252 Hp/ 0 Def Neutral Nature Tyranitar: 63.9% - 75.7%
    Wood Hammer (120 Base Power) vs. 252 Hp/ 4 Def Neutral Nature Politoed: 92.2% - 108.3%
    
    Earthquake (100 Base Power) vs. 0 Hp/ 0 Def Neutral Nature Ninetails: 69% - 81.5%
    Earthquake (100 Base Power) vs. 252 Hp/ 0 Def Neutral Nature Ninetails: 56.6% - 66.9%
    
    While the damage output may look promising, Abomasnow finds himself unable to guarantee a kill unless the weather inducer has taken prior damage (in Hippowdon‘s/Tyranitar‘s case, quite a bit). Choice Scarf sets are also more dangerous for Abomasnow because Stealth Rock and other entry hazards can chip away at his health, and you may not find the opportunity you need to Rapid Spin in order to get Abomasnow in the time you /need him to get in/. Wish Support could work fairly well (I suppose), just be careful.

    Abomasnow’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    The Ghost of Christmas Past has returned, with her normal and fighting immunities still intact, and her Ghost/Ice STAB unmatched. Looking only at the stats, Froslass itself is fairly promising. 70/70/70 defenses are nothing to be proud of, and are, in fact, fairly mediocre. However, she sports 80/80/110 offenses (though, the offenses themselves may be a little lackluster), the most important part being that delicious 110 base speed stat. 108 is a popular number this generation, most notably found on our little musketeer quartet! Froslass has access to Spikes, Taunt, Destiny Bond, Ice Beam, Shadow Ball, Torment, Pain Split, and Trick, making Froslass quite capable in a variety of roles you could wish for it to fill.

    Froslass suffers from Ghost, Dark, Rock, Fire, and Steel, weaknesses while Froslass’s resistances are nothing to be proud of due to her frailty. However, Normal and Fighting immunities as well as Spikes are absolutely invaluable for a hail team, racking up plenty of passive damage and many a switch in opportunities in which to accomplish her job.

    Froslass @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Cursed Body
    EVs: 4 Hp/ 252 SAtk/ 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Spikes
    - Taunt
    - Destiny Bond / Shadow Ball
    - Ice Beam

    Froslass’s standard spiking set from last generation. With Taunt, Spikes, and 110 base speed, immunity to Fake-Out, and the ability to block Rapid Spin, Froslass, in theory, should have a relatively easy time setting up Spikes. However, Froslass runs into a slight problem this generation. With the advent of Mischievous Heart, Magic Mirror, and the Team Preview, Froslass is going to have difficulty maintaining position as a dedicated lead.

    Mischievous Heart may not be too terribly difficult to handle, as all the Pokemon with this ability are fairly frail. Taunt will however render most of Froslass’s set useless for three turns, meaning she will either have to switch out or be 2HKO’d by almost any attack thrown in her direction. Magic Mirror users are also not a huge problem, as they are weak to Shadow Ball. 252 Hp/ 0 SDef Espeon takes 59.9% - 70.7% from Shadow Ball, meaning Espeon cannot stay in without facing the risk of being absolutely crippled. Espeon and Froslass also share the same base Speed, leading much up to speed ties and mind games.

    The Team Preview is a pretty straightforward issue - the ability to switch a lead around to counter your “dedicated lead” Froslass. Froslass cannot risk not being in the lead position because it will be absolutely useless if it switches into Stealth Rock, breaking it’s sash and losing 25% health. Which, as we all know, is not a good thing for Froslass.

    Froslass however has other sets it could run to circumvent these issues. A Hail abuse set revolving around Snow Cloak could make life easier, as Froslass has access to Blizzard, Thunder Wave, and Substitute. Froslass’s other options consist of the choice between his abilities (now that I’ve mentioned it). Cursed Body will let Froslass have a 30% chance of locking and opponent’s attack when hit by said move. This can be great for forcing switches, or , alternatively, making switches easier. However, Froslass loses out on all tutors, most notably the move Trick, by using this ability.

    Froslass’s discussion thread can be read here.

    [​IMG]
    Oh Walrein, you are forever a classic. Walrein has cemented itself as a staple on hail stall teams, and still finding itself useful outside stall. Walrein only has a Water resist and a 4x Ice resist outside his incredibly-useless-for-hail ability; Thick Fat. While two resistances may seem less than spectacular, said resistances are actually fairly handy. Walrein also has with him Ice Body, making for an incredible stalling walrus machine. With his better-than-Swampert defenses (thanks to his Hp) he is perfectly capable of tanking hits and recovering off damage.

    Unfortunately Walrein brings with him an Electric and Grass weakness along side the typical Ice dregs. However, Walrein’s weaknesses may actually prove helpful, providing Abomasnow the opportunity to switch in on lesser Grass and Electric attacks and get the hail going. Walrein also has a few other useful teammates that would not mind switching into its other weaknesses such as Sableye, Heatran, and Tentacruel, to name a few.

    Walrein @ Leftovers
    Trait: Ice Body
    EVs: 220 HP/ 252 Def/ 36 SDef
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Protect
    - Substitute
    - Toxic / Roar / Super Fang
    - Surf / Blizzard

    His classic stalling set, and still effective. The walrus recovers 12.5% of his health per turn with hail active and leftovers still attached. This means with a Substitute up he can Protect every other turn, recovering lost damage. Be warned, many people find Walrein set-up fodder, so Roar is a great option, especially considering that Toxic Spikes may be about. A detailed analysis on this set can be found here.

    He may run into slight difficulty with Taunt users. Taunt goes through Substitute now, and depending on what you run, it can make two to three of Walrein's moves entirely useless for three turns, more than likely forcing him to switch out.

    Walrein has no 5th generation discussion thread at this point in time.

    [​IMG]
    Regice, of the infamous Regi trio. Regice did not do all that pleasantly last generation, being best described as, by GtM, “an inferior Blissey that was weak to Stealth Rock”. Regice can thank Santa Claus this year for what was left under his tree though! Regice is the only Pokemon in the entire 5th generation to have received the Ice Body ability and be able to make exceptional use of it. With this new addition Regice will comfortably sit on hail teams as a powerful special attacker and special attack absorber, also being able to function as a mini-Walrein.

    When choosing Ice Body be aware that Regice loses out on a lot of options from previous generations. These include Gravity, Counter, Sleep Talk and Focus Punch, to name a few.

    Regice @ Leftovers
    Trait: Ice Body
    EVs: 204 HP/ 252 Def/ 8 SDef/ 44 Spd
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Protect
    - Substitute
    - Toxic
    - Blizzard

    Walrien #2. Regice may not be as amazing as Walrein when it comes to stalling, but Regice has several things over Walrein that you should consider when choosing between the two. Regice lacks Grass and Electric weaknesses that could hinder his walling ability. Regice also boasts an amazing Special Defense stat and a very good special attack stat, meaning he can take special hits better and hit harder than Walrein. However, Regice also has a few problems. Regice does not a fantastic Hp, and lacks the 404+ Substitutes Walrein is capable of making, meaning Blissey can break Regice’s substitutes with Seismic Toss. Our gigantic ice cube is also weaker on the physical side of his defenses, and combining that with his low HP, [physical hits may prove to be a little problematic.

    Regice’s discussion thread can be read here.

    [​IMG]
    Brrr! It’s cold in here! I say there must be something wrong with the oh god kill me. Rotom-F had a unique niche last generation on hail teams, boasting a powerful Blizzard, as well as a Normal/Fighting/Ground immunity, which, coupled with his standard Rest + Sleep Talk set, made him a fairly useful status absorber/Rapid Spin blocker. All the Rotom Formes this generation were (sort of) blessed with a secondary typing to replace their former Ghost-typing, matching the type of their signature move(s). With Rotom-F’s signature move being Blizzard, he got - you guessed it - Ice typing. What does this mean for us? Well, it means Rotom-F was stripped of almost any good resistance he had. On the bright side, he did lose a Ghost and Dark weakness, meaning he is no longer pursuit bait!

    However, Rotom-F now suffers from a Rock, Fire, and Fighting weakness and lost his resistance to Bug, Steel, and an immunity to Normal/Fighting moves, which included the likes of Fake Out, Close Combat, Super Power etc. Rotom-F does retain an Electric, Ice (gained~) and Flying resistance as well as an immunity to Ground attacks though.

    Rotom-F @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 Hp/ 120 Def/ 136 SDef
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Thunderbolt
    - Blizzard
    - Volt Change
    - Trick

    With Rotom-F’s common weaknesses but good Special Attack and good defenses he himself is probably best adept at making use of a Choice Scarf. His Ice typing, despite the added weaknesses, has a silver lining: STAB Blizzard. Rotom-F also has this neat little thing - he is the only Pokemon to get STAB on both Electric and Ice attacks, give him quite the range of coverage with merely two attacks. Volt Change is the new Electric-typed U-turn, making a great pivot and scout. Trick is exceptionally useful for crippling tanks, walls, and other such Pokemon that would greatly prefer their current item than a Choice Scarf.

    As a Choice Scarf user, switching in repeatedly with Stealth Rock on the field is going to absolutely murder him. As suggest for Hail teams in general, it is a good idea to run a Rapid Spin/Magic Mirror/Taunt Pokemon.

    [​IMG]
    On the subject of Rotom formes, lets move onto someone who was not (almost) stripped of everything useful with the loss of his Ghost-typing. Rotom-H also lost a Fighting and Rapid Spin immunity, but gained a 4x Steel Resist, Grass resist, Fire resist and a 4x Bug resist. This makes Rotom-H one of (if not the) best counter to Scizor in the entire game, someone whom hail teams will undoubtedly have extreme difficulty dealing with. His Water weakness will not be a huge burden, but he himself also shares a Stealth Rock weakness with the rest of the Ice-types, making it even more important to try and keep it away.

    [​IMG]
    Rotom-W, the Rotom forme that was the most beneficial from the loss of its Ghost-typing. As mentioned with the other formes, Rotom lost its Fighting and Rapid Spin immunity, but with the Water-typing Rotom gained wonderful resistances. Such resistances include Water, Ice, Fire, Flying and a 4x Steel resist, making Rotom-W a wonderful defensive addition to a Hail team. Unlike the previous two formes mentioned, Rotom-W does not have to worry about a Stealth Rock weakness like the rest of the Ice Pokemon, making switching in much easier on him, only carrying with him a weakness to Grass attacks.

    All Rotom Formes are perfectly capable of running sets that utilize Rest + Sleep Talk, Substitute + Pain Split, Substitute + Charge Beam, Dual Screens, Status (Will-O-Wisp/Discharge), among many other defensive or offensive roles. One thing that might be interesting may be to have each Rotom-Forme make use of a weather move that complements it’s new STAB. Rotom-F with Blizzard, Rotom-W with Rain Dance, and Rotom-H with Sunny Day. While Hail teams would rather have all these Pokemon run Hail in a Moveslot, it’s still something interesting to consider.

    The Rotom Forme discussion thread can be found
    here.

    [​IMG]
    Oh Mamoswine, how does one count the ways in which you are amazing? With the new generation Mamoswine gained some lovely new toys for Christmas that have been on his wish list for quite some time now. On top of Mamoswine’s impressive bulk he is the only Pokemon immune to passive damage from both the Hail and Sandstorm weather conditions (outside of Magic Guard/Dust Proof of course). Mamoswine’s typing is not limited to that though, he carries with him two of the best STABs in the entire game: Ice and Ground. Our Mammoth has gained a new STAB move in Icicle Drop (85 BP/95 Acc, may cause the opponent to flinch), allowing him to finally make use of a decent base power Ice-type move that isn’t Ice Fang (which was terrible anyways).

    Mamoswine also does not have to carry several of the weaknesses his Ice-type brethren must suffer through. Neutrality to Stealth Rock, and with his new ability Thick Fat, comes also a neutrality to Fire-type attack as well as an additional resistance to Ice. Mamoswine must still suffer through a vulnerability Fighting, Water, and Grass attacks though, but that is what teammates are for!

    Mamoswine @ Choice Band
    Trait: Thick Fat
    EVs: 152 Hp/ 252 Atk/ 100 SDef
    Adamant Nature (-SAtk, +Atk)
    - Icicle Drop
    - Earthquake
    - Ice Shard
    - Stone Edge

    Oh how lovely, the ‘Dragon Killer’ returns. Here are some damage calculation to demonstrate just how effective he still is at doing this:

    Code:
    Adamant Choice Band Mamoswine Ice Shard (40 Base Power) vs. 0/0 Ononokus (80.5% - 94.9%)
    Adamant Choice Band Mamoswine Ice Shard (40 Base Power) vs. 0/0 Crimgan (80% - 94.2%)
    Adamant Choice Band Mamoswine Ice Shard (40 Base Power) vs. 252/0 Crimgan (65.9% - 77.7%)
    Adamant Choice Band Mamoswine Ice Shard (40 Base Power) vs. 0/0 Sazandora (72.6% - 85.5%)
    
    Adamant Choice Band Mamoswine Icicle Drop (85 Base Power) vs. 0/0 Ononokus (170.6% - 201.4%)
    Adamant Choice Band Mamoswine Icicle Drop (85 Base Power) vs. 0/0 Crimgan (169.5% - 200%)
    Adamant Choice Band Mamoswine Icicle Drop (85 Base Power) vs. 252/0 Crimgan (139.7% - 164.8%)
    Adamant Choice Band Mamoswine Icicle Drop (85 Base Power) vs. 0/0 Sazandora (153.8% - 181.5%)
    
    Damn, pretty impressive. Mamoswine still keeps his title, perfectly capable of decimating opposing Dragon Pokemon. Mamowsine’s abilities are not limited to the offensive, Mamoswine is one of the few Pokemon to gain Stealth Rock through breeding, allowing him to play the role of a lead, or even defensive roles with Light Screen and Reflect if the need be. Mamoswine also has the option to go mixed with a Life Orb or a Choice Scarf, offering up another Blizzard spammer for hail teams. Mentioning his movepool, there are draw-backs to Mamoswine using Thick Fat as his ability. Mamoswine loses all previous tutors, meaning he no longer has access to the move Superpower. Keep this in mind when choosing which to use.

    Mamoswine’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Kyurem. The new long sought after Ice/Dragon of Generation 5. Kyurem wields in his tiny claws the highest offensive mixed stats of all Ice-type Pokemon (its offensive stats matching Mamoswine’s attack and Glaceon’s special attack respectively), as well as the second highest mixed attacking stats of all Dragon-type Pokemon (being only surpassed by Rayquaza and succeeding Giratina-O). Kyurem’s 95 base speed allows him to outrun his Black and White counterparts, as well as a good portion of the Uber tier. With such fantastic selling points, why exactly is Kyurem so looked down on?

    His movepool is absolutely horrid. Kyurem’s move pool is so barren, so lifeless, that he lacks a move to make the earth bend or quake outside of Hidden Power [Ground]. Kyurem also lacks the proper tools in dealing with the constant barrage of Steel Pokemon that switch into his (rather nice) dual STAB, having only Focus Blast or Hidden Power [Fire] to rely on. His Ice/Dragon typing is also somewhat of a curse despite its blessing, leaving him with few resistances to switch into and a plethora of weaknesses to deal with. Kyurem’s speed is also a slight disappointment. His 95 base speed, while fantastic in a tier filled with base 90 speed Pokemon (Ubers), is simply not good enough for standard.

    Not all is bad for Kyurem though, as several of his faults also contain selling points within them. Kyurem attracts steel Pokemon, like, well, a magnet (heh) and because Kyurem is so adept at attracting steel Pokemon, Pokemon like Magnezone, Rotom-H, and Heatran are able to switch in and help eliminate Steel Pokemon like Scizor that pose a huge threat to a hail team. Although Kyurem has to deal with several weaknesses thanks to his Ice-typing, he also has three important resistances to make use of because of his Dragon-typing, Grass, Electric, and Water.

    Kyurem @ Life Orb
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 84 Atk/ 172 SAtk/ 252 Spd
    Naive Nature (-SDef, +Spd)
    - Blizzard
    - Draco Meteor
    - Outrage
    - Focus Blast

    What Kyurem has over other Dragon-type Pokemon becomes apparent on a hail team. Blizzard has a mere 20 less base power than Draco Meteor, perfect accuracy, and does not have the backlash many other Dragons that utilize Draco Meteor feel in a -2 special attack drop. With this, Kyurem can a spam perfect-accuracy 120 base power stab move with no real downsides. This mixed sweeper set (other wise known as a wall breaker) lets him break down many a Pokemon that stand in his way.

    Code:
    Kyurem Life Orb Blizzard (120 Base Power) vs. Specially Defensive Skarmory (65.3% - 77.2%)
    Kyurem Life Orb Blizzard (120 Base Power) vs. Physically Defensive Skarmory (96.4% - 113.8%)
    
    Kyurem Life Orb Outrage (120 Base Power) vs. 252 Hp/252 Def Bold Blissey (57.1% - 67.4%)
    Kyurem Life Orb Outrage (120 Base Power) vs. 252 Def/252 SDef Calm Blissey (68.6% - 80.7%)
    Kyurem Life Orb Outrage (120 Base Power) vs. 252 Hp/252 Def Bold Chansey @ Evolution Stone (42.3% - 50%)
    
    Kyurem Life Orb Blizzard (120 Base Power) vs. 252 Hp/196 Def Sassy Nattorei (46.9% - 55.4%)
    Kyurem Life Orb Outrage (120 Base Power) vs. 252 Hp/ 252 Def Bold Burungeru (50% - 58.9%)
    
    Kyurem’s offensive abilities are impressive, and despite his barren movepool he is capable of being more than just a mixed attacker. Kyurem can function as an Anti-Lead, Choice user, and set up Dual Screens (though, Latias outclasses him in the support department in my opinion).

    Kyurem’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Tentacruel last generation proved an important tool to hail teams with its Fighting/Fire/Steel resistance, Toxic Spikes, the ability to absorb Toxic Spikes (very important) and ability to Rapid Spin away other entry hazards. This generation, those same characteristics that put it on 4th generation hail teams will bring it back to 5th generation ones. This generation Fighting-type Pokemon gained an amazing STAB recovery move in Drain Punch, Giga Drain got a boost and Mischievous Heart users are tossing Leech Seed left and right. One brave cephalopod will stand above the rest, with his unique ability Liquid Ooze, he makes the perfect switch into these attacks, causing them to lose health instead of recover it! These things make Tentacruel a very welcome addition to many hail teams.

    Tentacruel @ Leftovers
    Trait: Liquid Ooze
    EVs: 252 Hp/ 120 Def/ 136 SDef
    Calm/Bold Nature
    - Rapid Spin
    - Toxic Spikes
    - Boil Over
    - Evil Eye / Magic Coat / Knock Off / Giga Drain

    Tentacruel’s biggest issue may be “Four Moveslot Syndrome”. The last slot is almost always the most important and each move can find itself useful on Tentacruel. Evil Eye allows Tentacruel to hit Ghost-types that have been poisoned (or afflicted with another status ailment) with a 100 base power super-effective move. Magic Coat will reflect moves that can stop his set up, the most important move being Taunt, it also offers a way to bounce back other moves a Mischievous Heart users may throw in Tentacruel’s direction. Knock Off can cripple Pokemon that rely on leftovers, allowing passive damage to be even more threatening to the opposition. The last move is Giga Drain, which was boosted to 75 base power this generation and can offer Tentacruel a bit of recovery outside leftovers.

    The natures are up to what you feel Tentacruel should be running. With a Bold Nature Tentacruel has a slightly easier time dealing with physical attacks. Examples include:

    Code:
    0 Atk Sassy Nattorei Power Whip (120 Base Power) vs.. 252 Hp/120 Def Bold Tentacruel (37.1% - 44%)
    +0 252 Atk Adamant Roobushin Drain Punch (75 Base power) vs. 252 Hp/ 120 Def Bold Tentacruel (21.4% - 25.3%)
    +0 252 Atk Adamant Roobushin Payback (100 Base power) vs. 252 Hp/ 120 Def Bold Tentacruel (38.2% - 45.1%)
    
    0 Atk Nattorei Power Whip (120 Base Power) vs. 252 Hp/120 Def Calm Tentacruel (40.7% - 48.1%)
    +0 252 Atk Adamant Roobushin Drain Punch (75 Base power) vs. 252 Hp/ 120 Def Calm Tentacruel (23.4% - 27.7%)
    +0 252 Atk Adamant Roobushin Payback (100 Base power) vs. 252 Hp/ 120 Def Calm Tentacruel (42% - 49.5%)
    
    Oh, make good note! Liquid Ooze is not Tentacruel’s Dream World ability, meaning when using Liquid Ooze he has access to all his Move Tutors from previous generations. Tentacruel’s discussion thread can be found here

    [​IMG]
    With hail teams in constant fear of a weather change, there is one sumo wrestler of justice that can stand amongst the storm and triumph. Hariyama offers himself to hail teams as the best Tyranitar counter in the game, eliminating an opponents option in dealing with opposing weather. When using Thick Fat, Hariyama is also able to provide and Ice and Fire resistance on top of a Rock, Dark, and Bug one. Three of those resistances are absolutely integral and are common weaknesses on a hail team, providing many opportunities for Hariyama to help defend a teammate.

    Hariyama @ Leftovers
    Trait: Thick Fat
    EVs: 96 Atk/ 252 Def/ 160 SDef
    Impish/Careful Nature
    - Whirlwind
    - Low Kick / Force Palm
    - Payback / Knock Off
    - Stone Edge

    Low Kick may be a better option for those who wish not to accidentally spread paralysis on something that would have been better off poisoned instead. Whirlwind is useful for phazing and spreading around passive damage to the oppositions team. Payback and Stone Edge offer moves that hit opposing Fire and Ghost Pokemon that can cause problems for hail teams. Knock Off is another option, crippling the opponents leftover dependant Pokemon.

    The EV spread is a vain attempt to help improve Hariyama’s ability to absorb Fire-type attacks while still remaining bulky on the physical side to absorb moves like Stone Edge. The rest was poured into attack so Hariyama could do decent damage to opposing Pokemon with the attacking options he has on the set.

    Code:
    Impish Nature
    Adamant Choice Band Tyranitar Stone Edge (100 Base Power) vs. 0/ 252 Def Hariyama (31.5% - 37.1%)
    Choice Scarf Shanderra Overheat (140 Base Power) vs. 0/ 160 SDef Hariyama (33.8% - 40.1%)
    Choice Scarf Heatran Fire Blast (120 Base Power) vs. 0/ 160 SDef Hariyama (27.5% - 32.9%)
    
    Careful Nature
    Adamant Choice Band Tyranitar Stone Edge (100 Base Power) vs. 0/ 252 Def Hariyama (34.5% - 40.6%)
    Choice Scarf Shanderra Overheat (140 Base Power) vs. 0/ 160 SDef Hariyama (31% - 36.6%)
    Choice Scarf Heatran Fire Blast (120 Base Power) vs. 0/ 160 SDef Hariyama (25.4% - 30.1%)
    
    *If you have a better EV spread by all means post it, this was simply an experimental spread.

    Hariyama’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Hitmontop appeared in the second generation on a very short list of Pokemon who were capable of learning Rapid Spin. More than ten years later, that list hasn’t grown much larger. Hitmontop has two amazing abilities that allow it to function in many different roles. Intimidate and Technician open the doors for an offensive or defensive role on your team. His stats may not be the greatest, but 50/95/110 is far from terrible in conjunction with Intimidate, and a base 95 attack is great with Technician. Fighting-typing is just what the doctor ordered, giving him a great STAB as well as a Rock, Bug, and Dark resistance. With access to three priority moves in Sucker Punch, Mach Punch and Bullet Punch, as well as Rapid Spin, Close Combat, Low Kick, Stone Edge, Pursuit and Bulk Up, Hitmontop makes a great choice for hail teams.

    Hitmontop @ Expert Belt or Leftovers
    Trait: Technician / Intimidate
    EVs: 252 Hp/ 212 Atk/ 44 Def or 252 Hp/ 4 Atk/ 252 Def
    Adamant (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Sucker Punch
    - Mach Punch / Low Kick
    - Rapid Spin / Stone Edge
    - Stone Edge / Bulk Up / Close Combat

    Hitmontop has several interesting options, but his moves are pretty straightforward. Close Combat works well on sets with Intimidate, letting him switch into -1 physical attacks, outright killing threats like Tyranitar and Doryuuzu. Bulk Up sets and those that use the ability Intimidate should use the second EV spread but should not use Close Combat due to it cancelling out the defense boosts. Intimidate should be used with Close Combat. Stone Edge can be used over Rapid Spin with Bulk Up sets for more coverage, but one of the biggest reasons you want to use Hitmontop in the first place is Rapid Spin anyways.

    Technician is great for Hitmontop, and Expert Belt is suggested to be used in conjunction with it. With the first EV spread, Technician, and Expert Belt, Hitmontop can deal with his greatest enemy, Shanderra. Here are some calculations:

    Code:
    Technician 252 Hp/ 212 Atk/ 44 Def
    Sucker Punch vs. 0/ 0 Shanderra: (75.1% - 88.9%)
    Mach Punch vs. 252 Hp Tyranitar: (92.6% - 110.4%)
    Mach Punch vs. 0/ 0 Doryuuzu: (84.2% - 99.7%)
    
    Hitmontop cannot be trapped and killed by Shanderra when using this spread assuming Stealth Rocks are down thanks to Sucker Punch. This set also allows Hitmontop to OHKO non-Substitute variants of Tyranitar with Mach Punch and Check Doryuzuu. However, without Intimidate, Hitmontop is not able to take hits as fabulously as one would like, an example being Choice Band Tyranitar Stone Edge, which does 45.1% - 53.3% to Hitmontop.

    Bulk Up sets can achieve the same thing, but they require set up. 252 Hp/ 80 Atk/ 132 Def Impish will be the spread.

    Code:
    +1 252 Hp/80 Atk/ 176 Def Impish
    Mach Punch vs. 252 Hp Tyranitar: (62.4% - 74.3%)
    Low Kick vs. 252 Hp Tyranitar: (184.2% - 217.8%)
    Mach Punch vs. 0/ 0 Doryuzuu: (56.5% - 67%)
    Sucker Punch vs. 0/ 0 Shanderra: (75.1% - 88.9%)
    
    While the damage output might not be as impressive as Technician Expert Belt, he does take hits quite a bit better:

    Code:
    Technician 252 Hp/ 212 Atk/ 44 Def
    +0 Doryuuzu Earthquake: (55.3% - 65.1%)
    Choice Band Tyranitar Stone Edge: (45.1% - 53.3%)
    Choice Band Tyranitar Earthquake: (60.2% - 71.1%)
    
    Intimidate 252 Hp/ 80 Atk/ 176 Def
    -1 Doryuuzu Earthquake: (32.6% - 38.5%)
    +1 Doryuuzu Earthquake: (72.4% - 85.2%)
    -1 Choice Band Tyranitar Stone Edge: (23.7% - 28.3%)
    -1 Choice Band Tyranitar Earthquake: (31.9% - 37.8%)
    
    +1 Def Intimidate 252 Hp/ 80 Atk/ 176 Def
    -1 Doryuuzu Earthquake: (21.7% - 25.7%)
    +1 Doryuuzu Earthquake: (48.4% - 57.2%)
    -1 Choice Band Tyranitar Stone Edge: (15.8% - 18.8%)
    -1 Choice Band Tyranitar Earthquake: (21.4% - 25.3%)
    
    *If you have a better EV spread by all means post it, this was simply an experimental spread.

    Hitmontop’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Swampert, a glorious addition from the third generation Pokemon games. Swampert boasts solid 100/90/90 defenses in conjunction with absolutely fantastic Water/Ground typing. His weaknesses are few (Grass, easily covered) and his resistances are numerous (Fire, Rock, Poison, Steel, immune to Electric). Swampert has the ability to set Stealth Rock, phaze with Roar, and spam (an un-STABed) Blizzard, all this making him a wonderful choice for a hail team.

    Swampert @ Leftovers
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 240 Hp/ 216 Def/ 52 SDef
    Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
    - Earthquake
    - Ice Beam/ Blizzard
    - Stealth Rock
    - Roar / Boiling Water / Toxic / Yawn

    Even with the advent of this new generation, Swampert’s old set is still golden. The Evs are bog standard, taken straight from the 4th generation analysis. Blizzard is an option if you feel Swampert should go down that route, but Ice Beam is much safer. Earthquake and Stealth Rock are give-ins while the final slot provides you with many different options, almost all pertaining to status. Roar gives Swampert the option of phazing out an opposing Pokemon. Boiling Water gives Swampert a second STAB move to work off of, and you can take advantage of its Burn rate rather easily. If you focus on Toxic Spikes for some of your passive damage though, be aware that the possibility of burning something you really did not want to, or that something you wanted to be burned is already poisoned, lingers. Yawn is an alternative to Roar, but will find itself useless once the opposition has been poisoned.

    Swampert’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Looks like Froggy scarfed down another Chaos Emerald, turning himself into this giant volcano frog! Heatran was top-tier in Gen IV with his fantastic typing, great stats, and ability to check many threats. In Gen V, Heatran returns, his same typing and stats that put him in high OU proving to be just as useful as they were then as they are now. 91/106/106 defenses are great, making him rather bulky. 90/130/77 offenses may leave a little to be desired (77 Speed is rather underwhelming), but his 130 base Special Attack stat cannot be ignored, and can actually be compared with the massive power creep this generation has had. With Fire Blast, Overheat, Lava Plume, Earth Power, Dragon Pulse, Stealth Rock, Torment, Taunt, Roar, Will-O-Wisp, Rest, Sleep Talk, and an amazing ability in Flash Fire, Heatran should be considered for each and every hail team.

    A 4x resistance to Steel, Grass, Bug, Ice and 2x resistances to Normal, Flying, Psychic, Ghost, Dark, and Dragon, gives Heatran a plethora of resistances to work with, and he has only 3 weaknesses in exchange. Unfortunately, those weaknesses can be quite bad for him. A Fighting weakness puts him in the same situation many other members on a hail team suffer from: Coulrophobia. His Water and Ground weaknesses are easily manageable. Abomasnow, Latias, Shinpora, the teammates bountiful.

    Heatran @ Balloon
    Trait: Flash Fire
    EVs: 4 Def/ 252 SAtk/ 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spe, -Atk)
    - Fire Blast
    - Earth Power
    - Dragon Pulse
    - Stealth Rock / Hidden Power [Grass] / Stone Edge

    The Balloon is a blessing my dear friends. Many Pokemon with a Ground weakness are now perfectly capable of saving their own asses thanks to this stroke of genius by someone over at Nintendo. With the Balloon, Heatran’s largest problem - his Siesmophobia - is alleviated by this item, giving him plenty of free switch-ins. Unfortunately for Heatran this makes taking advantage of any resistance granted by his wonderful typing hard. The Balloon is, unfortunately, a one use item, being popped when hit with any sort of damaging attack that he isn’t immune to. This means that Heatran users must decide between maintaining his temporary immunity to his largest weakness or switching in on a deadly (resisted, no immune) attack aimed at another teammate.

    His set is pretty much a carbon copy from last generation’s Stealth Rock Lead set. All the moves are standard, the last slot being up to you. There are several interesting options here that should all be taken into account, but should only be chosen based on the needs of your team. Stealth Rock is great in general, and should be considered, but if you’re running say, Forretress along side him, it might not be as useful. Hidden Power [Grass] lets him hit bulky water Pokemon like Swampert, but that could be better left to Abomasnow, who, has an easy time walling many water Pokemon. Stone Edge could be used as a little surprise, as Heatran utterly walls most Ulgamoth, and this could be used to outright kill him with ease.

    Heatran is perfectly capable of running more defensive sets. Why with access to the aforementioned Taunt, Torment, Will-O-Wisp, Lava Plume, etc, he could be very useful. Unfortunately, SubTorment sets are not recommended. With Substitute, Heatran will lose 25% and cannot recover it with Leftovers, making it a rather large issue when using it in Hail. Heatran can also use more offensive oriented sets, such as Life Orb and Choice Scarf.

    Heatran’s Dream World ability is the worst of trash. Flame Body is absolutely useless, but that’s not such a bad thing! Because it is so useless, you know how access to all that Gen IV and Gen V have to offer with no downsides whatsoever.

    Heatran’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Steel Pokemon are often top-tier Pokemon and very powerful in their own right, boasting impressive defenses and rather lovely offenses. On top of this, Ice Pokemon have a weakness to Steel, making it one of the bigger issues a hail team must prepare for. With our own little piece of Roswell, New Mexico, we should be able to lessen the problem considerably. Magnezone boasts fantastic 70/115/90 defenses (which become even better coupled with his 13 resistances), and 70/130/60 offenses, paying special attention to his wonderful 130 base Special Attack. Magnezone’s true usefulness lies in his ability: Magnet Pull. The ability to trap Steel Pokemon can be invaluable, providing hail teams with a fantastic and easy to use way of eliminating a very prominent type of Pokemon.

    Magnezone’s resistances include Normal, Electric, Grass, Ice, Poison (immunity), Flying (4x), Psychic, Bug, Rock, Ghost, Dragon, Dark, and Steel (4x), with only 3 weaknesses: Fire, Fighting, and Ground (4x). Magnezone has lots of synergy with Pokemon like Latias and Kyurem, creating the infamous “2Drag1Mag” strategy.

    Magnezone @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Magnet Pull
    EVs: 4 Hp/ 252 SAtk/ 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (-Atk, +Spd)
    - Thunderbolt
    - Flash Cannon
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Volt Change

    Essentially the exact same set as last generation, only with Volt Change over the newly nerfed Explosion. There isn’t much to say. Magnezone, while a fantastic Pokemon, has a shallow movepool. It is not suggested to use a Substitute Steel Killer set due to it suffering the same problems Heatran would suffer from. Magnezone’s other options include Dual Screens, and making use of moves like Discharge, Magnet Rise, and Metal Sound. Other sets could be Life Orb, Choice Specs (though, the low speed could be off putting), and uh, well, that’s it actually.

    Magnezone vs. Magneton
    Magnezone and Magneton, while virtually the same Pokemon, have one large difference between them that gives Magneton any reason whatsoever to be chosen over Magnezone: his Speed stat. A base 70 Speed is quite higher than a base 60 Speed, allowing Magneton to outrun more threats, and, with his 120 base Special Attack stat, take them out just as Magnezone would (hopefully). Unfortunately for Magneton, he suffers from lesser bulk and a lesser attacking stat, giving him issues such as switching in and taking hits and the possibility of missing out on KO’s Magnezone could achieve.

    Some people will look to Miracle of Evolution as a way to mitigate the bulk issue.

    Code:
    Magnezone vs. Magneton [Bulk]
    
    Magnezone 
    Hp: 70
    Def: 115
    SDef: 90
    
    0/0/0 Neutral Nature: 281/266/216
    
    Magneton 
    Hp: 50
    Def: 95
    SDef: 70
    
    0/0/0 Neutral Nature: 241/226/176
    252/0/0 Neutral Nature [Evo Stone]: 304/339/264
    
    As you can clearly see, yes, Magneton ends up much bulkier than an un-invested Magnezone, but at what cost? Magnezone does not get Leftovers recovery when using Miracle of Evolution, meaning he will get ruined by hail damage due to having no form of recovery outside of Rest. On top of this, he won’t be able to outspeed /any/ of the threats Magnezone was capable of outrunning because Magneton cannot use two items at once, essentially making the whole idea of using Miracle of Evolution utterly useless.

    The biggest (most important*) thing worth comparing is their Speed Stat. Magneton with maxed out Speed will end up with 262 as his number. With a Choice Scarf, he hits 393, allowing him to outrun all base 125’s (just barely missing out on being able to outspeed base 130’s). Magnezone is only capable of outrunning all base 110’s (just barely missing out on being able to outrun all base 115’s). This widens Magneton’s range of Pokemon, letting him check more threats. However, you’ll have to decide whether the Speed or Bulk and Power are more important when choosing between them.

    Magnezone’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Blistering speed, an amazing movepool, the ability to use Rapid Spin and a Fire and Fighting resistance are very welcome to any hail team. Starmie is one of the few (the only?) Rapid Spin users with access to an instant recovery move as well as being one of the few able to switch into Toxic Spikes with impunity thanks to its ability, Natural Cure, letting it spin them away and its intoxicated status removed upon switching out. Starmie’s great special attack is also not something that should be overlooked, as Starmie is perfectly capable of spamming 100% accurate Blizzards. Starmie’s versatility thanks to its ability to provide offense or support to a hail team makes it another worthy Pokemon to consider when building yours.

    However, Starmie carries with it a Dark, Ghost, Bug, Grass, and Electric weakness, be sure to consider these when choosing Rapid Spin Pokemon.

    Starmie @ Leftovers
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 252 Hp/ 252 SAtk/ 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (-Atk, +Spd)
    - Rapid Spin
    - Surf / Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Thunder Bolt
    - Recover

    Starmie didn’t gain a whole slew of new moves this generation, and while the new moves it did gain are absolutely fantastic for offensive sets, it seems as though Starmie’s Rapid Spin set it more than likely going to remain untouched. Hidden Power [Fire] gets a slash so Starmie is not utterly helpless against any Grass Pokemon that switch into it (Nattorei). Starmie has many options outside this set, items like Choice Scarf and Life Orb complement his offensive prowess should you want to take that route.

    Starmie’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Espeon enters the fifth generation as one of two Pokemon to receive the new ability “Magic Mirror”. What does this mean for Espeon? Why, it just makes Espeon one of the best utility Pokemon in the game due to it’s ability to reflect back at the opponent any non-damaging move (read as: it works like Mirror Coat without having to waste a moveslot). This lets Espeon function well on a variety of teams who have trouble with things like Taunt, entry hazards, Spore, etc. Looking at Espeon’s stats, her defenses are rather horrible. 65/60/95 is nothing to be proud of. However, her offenses, 65/130/110, are fantastic. A 110 speed is very valuable and a 130 Special Attack stat is something to fear. With access to moves like Baton Pass, Reflect, Morning Sun, Psycho Shock, Calm Mind, Shadow Ball, and Grass Knot, Espeon can pull of both offensive and defensive sets that hail teams could find very useful.

    Immediately many of you will notice that I didn’t mention absolute gems like Wish, Charm, Fake Tears, Tickle, or Yawn. Magic Mirror Espeon is an event Dream World Pokemon, making him Male only. This means Espeon cannot have Magic Mirror and Egg moves (together), missing out on several very useful support options. How unfortunate for us. Oh, it should also be mentioned that Morning Sun, while a good move, should never be run on a Hail team due to it only recovering ¼ of her health.

    Espeon’s flaws outside of important illegal move combinations stem from its stats and typing, as well as the Team Preview function. Espeon is frail. There is no other way to describe or sugarcoat it. 65/60/95 is almost horrible, and still leaves much to be desired. This will make Espeon very vulnerable to any sort of priority attack, even resisted ones. It’s typing is a blessing in a metagame infested with Fighting-type Pokemon, but also makes it vulnerable to the Dark and Bug moves that many Fighting-type Pokemon will be carrying.

    The Team Preview hurts your ability to play Espeon a little bit. With Espeon being able to switch in at any time your opponent will more than likely be very weary of laying hazards down. This could cost Espeon on a switch in if you mispredict, but you also must weigh the cost and the rewards. Losing (or crippling) Espeon is obviously not something you want to do, but it can also keep several Pokemon in check and prevent hazards from being lain down, which, depending on your team, may be well worth it.

    Espeon @ Leftovers
    Trait: Magic Mirror
    EVs: 248 Hp/ 12 Def/ 248 Spd
    Timid Nature (-Atk, +Spd)
    - Baton Pass
    - Reflect
    - Psychic / Psycho Shock
    - Hidden Power [Fire]

    Last generation many players liked to describe the plethora of Psychic Pokemon as “Pursuit bait”, and, unfortunately for many of us, they did not have (m)any way(s) of escaping Pokemon like Tyranitar (making the name rather fitting). Espeon however, is lucky. It has access to the wonderful move Baton Pass, letting it escape slow Pursuit users like Tyranitar (although, Choice Scarf sets will pose a problem). Reflect is absolutely integral to playing Espeon, as it provides a little bit of team support on top of temporarily remedying Espeon’s abysmal Defense stat.

    Code:
    248 Hp/ 12 Def Timid Espeon under Reflect
    
    252 Atk Jolly Tyranitar Crunch: (59.88% - 70.66%)
    252 Atk Jolly Tyranitar Pursuit: (30.54% - 35.93%)
    252 Atk Adamant Choice Band Scizor Bullet Punch: (35.93% - 42.51%)
    252 Atk Adamant Choice Band Scizor Pursuit: (47.90% - 56.89%) 
    
    A Special thanks to IcyMan28, from whom I borrowed these useful calculations from : )

    Under Reflect all of Espeon’s old banes fail to kill her. This means Espeon (having set up Reflect) can simply run away to the appropriate counter with Baton Pass while giving the rest of the team a temporary Iron Defense.

    Espeon loves her Speed stat, and this EV spread reflects that. With 248 Speed (when accounting for Hidden Power [Fire]’s single point drop), Espeon is capable of outrunning all 108 base Pokemon - a very important number. With this Speed stat, Espeon can outrun Infernape, and, most importantly, our Musketeer Quartet (or Trio, depending on which tier you play). This will let Espeon effectively “check them” because of her dangerous Psychic-STAB. Psychic and Psycho Shock are a coin toss for whom is a bigger problem to your team. Psychic is obviously better for Pokemon like Breloom and Infernape, Kerudio, Roobushin, and Terrakion. However, boosted Kerudio and Virizion will be dealt much more damage with Psycho Shock. It should be noted that a new trend in Roobushin is to invest heavily in Special Defense to ensure that they aren’t murdered by a Shanderra Overheat, and that many Terrakion are run on Sandstorm teams. Depending on whether these are more frequent for you or not, it can actually be better to run Psycho Shock.

    Espeon’s ability also lets her do fairly decent damage to many common Pokemon charged with the duty of setting down Spikes, most notably, Skarmory, Nattorei, and Forretress.

    Code:
    0 SAtk Hidden Power [Fire] (70 Base Power)
    
    252 Hp/ 252 Def Impish Nattorei: (63.6% - 75%)
    252 Hp/ 252 SDef Sassy Nattorei: (46.6% - 55.7%)
    252 Hp/ 240 Def Impish Skarmory: (50.9% - 59.9%)
    252 Hp/ 240 SDef Careful Skarmory: (34.7% - 41.3%)
    252 Hp/ 144 Def Relaxed Forretress: (108.5% - 127.7%)
    252 Hp/ 252 Def Sassy Forretress: (70.1% - 83.6%)
    
    Very promising damage output. Due to Espeon reflecting back any non-damaging move they may carry on their individual sets (more than likely a lot of them), it makes me wonder what kind of physical damage Espeon is able to deal from them with when under Reflect.

    Code:
    248 Hp/ 12 Def/ 248 Spd Espeon 
    
    0 Atk Nattorei Power Whip: (28.1% - 32.9%)
    0 Atk Nattorei Gyro Ball: (43.8% - 52%)
    0 Atk Skarmory Brave Bird: (24.5% - 29%)
    0 Atk Forretress Gyro Ball: (29% - 34.4%)
    
    Still promising! Espeon will serve well on a hail team as a check to dangerous fighting-type Pokemon as well as common entry hazard setters.

    Espeon loses out on all previous generation move tutors, egg moves, and event moves when using her Dream World ability Magic Mirror.

    Espeon’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Gamefreak decided to surprise our little goblin with a stroll on down to Hopkinsville this year. And what did Gamefreak have to give him? Why, just one of the most game changing abilities this generation has to offer: Mischievous Heart. Will-O-Wisp, Recover, and Taunt, three fantastic moves Sableye finds himself being able to make perfect use of thanks to his brand new ability. Sableye has no weaknesses accompanied by a Fighting, Normal, and Psychic immunity, giving him plenty of opportunities to switch in on a hail team riddled with Fighting weak Pokemon.

    Sableye @ Leftovers
    Trait: Mischievous Heart
    EVs: 252 Hp/ 124 Def/ 132 SDef
    Careful (+SDef, -SAtk)
    - Fake Out / Night Shade
    - Recover
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Taunt

    The last three slots are what makes Sableye so popular as a MH user. Sableye functions well as a lead, making a Fake Out a good choice for breaking Focus Sashes. Night Shade can be used as an alternative, but doesn’t get priority with Mischievous Heart, though it can be a better option outside the Lead position (then again, Fake Out + hail damage when Sableye switches in can be useful too). Recover is for survivability, making Sableye difficult to take down, and Taunt is to shut down opposing leads. Will-O-Wisp is incredibly useful for burning strong physical attackers (Scizor) that could be problematic in the match. Overall Sableye is a very effective Pokemon and only has to watch out for Magic Coat and Magic Mirror.

    Sableye’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Alakazam on a hail team? Blasphemous. That is until you realize Alakazam received one of the most amazing abilities Pokemon has ever known: Magic Guard. What does this mean for him? Alakazam is now able to switch in without having fear of entry hazards or the residual damage from hail, sandstorm, Life Orb and status (Magic Guard no longer negates paralysis‘s “fully paralyzed” chance). Aside from an amazing ability, Alakazam carries with him amazing base 120 speed and a fabulous 135 base special attack stat. Alakazam is capable of outrunning some of the fastest Pokemon in the game and his special attack stat is only ten base less than Shanderra’s, one of the hardest hitters to come out of the 5th generation.

    Alakazam’s has one big flaw: he’s one of the frailest Pokemon programmed into the game. Everything is going to kill him, and with priority being thrown left and right to help deal with Doryuzuu, Alakazam is going to find it hard to survive without a Focus Sash.

    Alakazam @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Magic Guard
    EVs: 4 Hp/ 252 SAtk/ 252 Spd
    Timid (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Psychic / Psycho Shock
    - Shadow Ball
    - Focus Blast
    - Energy Ball / Hidden Power [Whatever] / Encore

    All Fighting-type Pokemon this generation have a defense equal to their special defense, the exception being the new Grass/Fighting Pokemon Virizion, the Steel/Fighting Pokemon Cobalon and Roobushin. Psycho Shock may be great if you plan on tackling Blissey, but almost all the other Fighting Pokemon (Roobushin!!) are hit harder if not just as hard with Psychic. Shadow Ball and Focus Blast are your generic coverage options so you aren’t completely walled by Pokemon like Rankurusu or Zuruzukin. The last slot is a toss up, Alakazam loses out on Signal Beam when using Magic Guard, so you get to choose between Energy Ball, the Hidden Power of your choice, and Encore.

    I mentioned a comparison between Psycho Shock and Psychic. Here are some damage calculations as a demonstration:

    Code:
    Psychic
    252 Hp/ 0 SDef Adamant Roobushin: 104.3% - 123.2%
    216 HP/ 40 SDef Adamant Roobushin:  100.7% - 118.5%
    96 Hp/ 136 SDef  Impish Nageki: 74.1% - 87.4%
    208 Hp/ 252 SDef Careful Nageki: 55.9% - 66.5%
    4 Hp/ 0 SDef Adamant Dageki: 131.5% - 154.8%
    40 Hp/ 0 SDef Adamant Terrakion: 99.7% - 117.7%
    
    Psycho Shock
    252 Hp/ 0 Def Adamant Roobushin: 68.1% - 80.2%
    216 HP/ 0 Def Adamant Roobushin:  69.6% - 82%
    96 Hp/ 216 Def  Impish Nageki: 54.8% - 65.2%
    208 Hp/ 24 Def Careful Nageki: 69.3% - 81.8%
    4 Hp/ 0 Def Adamant Dageki: 117.1% - 138.4%
    40 Hp/ 0 Def Adamant Terrakion: 88.3% - 104.5%
    
    Two Pokemon mentioned above not included in the calculations were Virizion, and Cobalon, both with dramatically different defensive stats and as a result will be dealt a very large difference of damage between Psycho Shock and Psychic. You’ll notice in the calculation that Roobushin (!!) is his much harder with Psychic than Psycho Shock, thus making it the superior option if your team is in need of a way to deal with him. However, for those that feel the need to, Psycho Shock and Psychic could very easily be run on the same set, just use Psycho Shock in the last slot. Running one or the other is up to you though.

    Alakazam’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Oooh, lets move on to the more fun, lovable, Magic Guard Pokemon. Aesthetically, Rankurusu is absolutely fantastic, wonderful, and adorable. Competitively, the same applies. Our new teddy bear boasts 110/75/85 defenses, which, is not bad, and, actually rather good! His special attack stat is 125, rivaling Alakazam and Gengar’s by a mere ten and five points respectively. Rankurusu’s movepool is similar to the type of movepool we see with normal Pokemon, making it large, deep, and full of surprises (just like a Christmas stocking)! Many people look at its base 30 speed and get a little disappointed, but our adorable little fetus-bear thing has the option of running Trick Room, making him lightning fast in comparison to the opposing Pokemon, while also lending a hand to some of the speed-challenged Pokemon on a hail team.

    Rankurusu @ Leftovers
    Trait: Magic Guard
    EVs: 252 Hp / 156 Def / 102 SDef
    IVs: 0 Spd
    Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
    - Recover
    - Psychic
    - Trick Room / Toxic / Reflect
    - Explosion / Toxic / Safeguard / Protect / Light Screen / Shadow Ball / Focus Blast

    Defensive Trick Room Rankurusu. I can see this working on a hail team rather effectively, setting up on offensive threats like Roobushin or Doryuuzu, quickly turning the tables on both of them. The options are many, and the room for all of them is limited to four, what will you choose? Trick Room is not mandatory, as Raknurusu is actually has a great supportive movepool. Reflect, Light Screen, and Safeguard are all great options. Coverage wise, Focus Blast and Shadow Ball are good choices. Focus Blast lets Rankurusu hit Doryuzuu and Dark Pursuit users, so he isn’t totally trapped. Explosion as an option is listed mostly so I can say don’t use it. Its coming off a horrible attack stat, and although a free switch in without actually having to switch is a lovely thought, chances are you wont be killing whomever you blow up on.

    Code:
    Adamant 252 Atk Roobushin Drain Punch (75 Base Power): (16% - 19.1%)
    Adamant 252 Atk Roobushin Stone Edge (100 Base Power): (28.5% - 33.7%)
    Adamant 252 Atk Roobushin Payback (100 Base Power): (57.1% - 67.5%)
    Adamant 252 Atk Roobushin Payback (50 Base Power): (28.8% - 34%)
    
    (+1) Adamant 252 Atk Roobushin Drain Punch (75 Base Power): 24.1% - 28.3%
    (+1) Adamant 252 Atk Roobushin Stone Edge (100 Base Power): (42.7% - 50.5%)
    (+1) Adamant 252 Atk Roobushin Payback (100 Base Power): (85.4% - 100.9%)
    (+1) Adamant 252 Atk Roobushin Payback (50 Base Power): (42.9% - 50.9%)
    
    Adamant 252 Atk Doryuuzu Earthquake (100 Base Power): (41.7% - 49.1%)
    
    And what you do back:

    Code:
    Psychic (90 Base Power) vs. 252 Hp/ 0 SDef Roobushin: (79.2% - 93.4%)
    Focus Blast (120 Base Power) vs. 0/0 Doryuzuu: (82% - 97%)
    
    Offensive Raknurusu is another alternative, and a highly popular one. Offensive Trick Room Rankurusu is often seen with a spread of 252 Hp/ 4 Def/ 252 SAtk @ Life Orb (Relaxed), running Psychic (or Psycho Shock) / Shadow Ball / Focus Blast / Trick Room. This set will secure KO’s on both Roobushin and Doryuuzu, as shown here:

    Code:
    Psychic (90 Base Power) vs. 252 Hp/ 0 SDef Roobushin: (127.5% - 150.7%)
    Focus Blast (120 Base Power) vs. 0/0 Doryuzuu (129.6% - 152.9%)
    
    Also, a Relaxed 252 Hp/ 120 SAtk Rankurusu @ Life Orb achieves the same KO’s. This will also let you pour extra EVs in defenses if you wish.

    Code:
    Psychic (90 Base Power) vs. 252 Hp/ 0 SDef Roobushin: (115% - 136.2%)
    Focus Blast (120 Base Power) vs. 0/0 Doryuzuu (117.5% - 138.5%)
    
    Rankurusu’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    All the other weather teams are doing it! Last generation Cleffa took the title of the first Magic Guard Endeavor user, finding her way onto both hail and sandstorm teams. This generation level 1, 2, and 3 Endeavors are now even more viable on weather teams (read as: Sandstorm is able to run Endeavor Aron now), some even outside them (read as: Sturdy Pain Split Probopass). What Yuniran brings to the team is not impressive offensive stats or useful resistances, but the almost-guarantee that you will have eliminated one of your opponents Pokemon.

    This Pokemon will have trouble dealing with Ghost Pokemon if you plan on using him, find some way to remove them. Priority is also an issue.

    Yuniran @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Magic Guard
    EVs: 0 Hp/ 0 Def/ 0 SDef
    IVs: 0 Hp/ 0 Def/ 0 SDef/ 0 Spd
    Hardy Nature
    - Trick Room
    - Endeavor
    - Toxic
    - Protect

    The first step to using this set is to have eliminated all Ghost Pokemon on the opposing team. The next step is to set up Trick Room, you now outrun your opponent and are more than likely at 1 Hp. With this, you Endeavor down (assuming you haven’t been killed by priority) and let hail wipe out your opponent. You have now done exactly what the set was meant to do: kill a minimum of one Pokemon on the opponent’s team and set up Trick Room in the process. While kind of gimmicky it can be very fun and very useful if you manage to eliminate a huge threat in the process.

    I can’t seem to find Yuniran’s Little Cup discussion thread.

    [​IMG]
    Shinbora is one of the many graced with generation 5’s distribution of previously one Pokemon exclusive abilities, Magic Guard. Like most Magic Guard Pokemon, Shinbora comes with a unique set of moves to help it abuse such a wonderful ability. Cosmic Power, Calm Mind, Assist Power, Psycho Shift, Roost, Toxic, Thunder Wave, Dual Screens, Safeguard, Hypnosis, Gravity, Trick Room, it’s movepool is filled with an abundance of toys. Aside from its movepool, its stats are very much worth looking at. 72/80/80 defenses are higher than it’s Psychic/Flying counterpart, Xatu, though, they are still nothing special. It does however have a 103 base special attack stat as well as a 97 base speed, letting it outrun threats Xatu couldn’t and hitting hard with whatever it has in its arsenal.

    Psychic/Flying is a mixed bag. Offensively, the coverage is rather redundant, and walled by one of the biggest threats to a hail team, Tyranitar. Defensively, he’s weak to Rock, Ice, Electric, Dark, and Ghost. There is a brighter side to this though; a 4x Fighting-type resist and STAB Psychic/Flying attacks let it switch into the most prominent type this generation, Fighting. An immunity to Ground-type attacks is always welcome, and thanks to Magic Guard, Shinbora does not have to worry about entry hazards or status.

    Shinbora @ Flame Orb
    Trait: Magic Guard
    EVs: 252 Hp/ 124 Def/ 132 Spd
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Cosmic Power
    - Assist Power
    - Psycho Shift
    - Roost

    A personal favorite of mine. With this set, Shinbora becomes one of the biggest Tyranitar lures in the game. Psycho Shift and Flame Orb is a fantastic combination, allowing Shinbora to shift burns onto threatening physically based attackers not named Roobushin, from which he can just recover off the damage. Cosmic Power and Assist Power work fabulously in conjunction with each other. Assist Power is a 20 base power Psychic-type move that when one of your stats is increased it gains an additional 20 base power. Cosmic Power increases Assist Power by 40 base power each time, giving it a grand total of 260 base Power before STAB when you’ve maxed out your defenses.

    Psycho Shift and Flame Orb not only lets you cripple offensive threats like Tyranitar, Scizor, and Breloom, but serves a secondary purpose. It makes you immune to status, effectively making this Pokemon a great status absorber, getting free switch ins to Toxic, Hypnosis, and Thunder Wave assuming you’ve already been burned (and for Toxic and Thunder Wave, you’re perfectly capable of simply passing it on to a member of the opponent’s team).

    The EV spread helps give it the best defenses possible while outrunning all base 70 Pokemon (Breloom). This makes Shinbora a good switch into Technilooms, but Breloom that run Stone Edge will give you a problem assuming you aren’t already at +2 or +3 by the time they switch in.

    Code:
    +0 252 Hp/ 124 Def/ 132 Spd Bold
    
    252 Atk Adamant Breloom Stone Edge: (64.9% - 77%)
    252 Atk Adamant Breloom Bullet Seed: (17.2% - 21.6%) (total)
    252 Atk Adamant Scizor Choice Band Bullet Punch: (44% - 52%)
    (Burned) 252 Atk Adamant Breloom Stone Edge: (32.8% - 39.1%)
    (Burned) 252 Atk Adamant Breloom Bullet Seed: (8.6% - 11.5%) (total)
    (Burned) 252 Atk Adamant Scizor Choice Band Bullet Punch: (21.8% - 26.1%)
    
    +1 252 Hp/ 124 Def/ 132 Spd Bold
    
    252 Atk Adamant Breloom Stone Edge: (43.7% - 51.7%)
    252 Atk Adamant Breloom Bullet Seed: (12.9% - 15.8%)
    252 Atk Adamant Scizor Choice Band Bullet Punch: (29.3% - 34.8%)
    (Burned) 252 Atk Adamant Breloom Stone Edge: (22.4% - 26.4%)
    (Burned) 252 Atk Adamant Breloom Bullet Seed: (5.7% - 8.6%)
    (Burned) 252 Atk Adamant Scizor Choice Band Bullet Punch: (14.7% - 17.5%)
    
    As soon as you’ve accumulated a few boosts (preferably by setting up on Pokemon that can’t really do anything to you); you’ll have the ability to take hits much better and burn other threatening attackers. Tyranitar is tricky to play around, but you outspeed all non-Choice Scarf variants (which, I do believe are going out of style?) making it easier to burn him and then accumulate boosts.

    Speaking of accumulating Cosmic Power boosts, after 3 boosts, Assist Power will have 140 base power. Let’s see what kind of damage it can do:

    Code:
    +3 Shinbora Assist Power (140 Base Power)
    
    0/ 0 Breloom: (177.3% - 209.1%)
    0/ 0 Blaziken: (136.2% - 161.5%)
    252/ 0 Roobushin: (106.3% - 125.1%)
    
    The damage is impressive, meaning Shinbora is perfectly capable of killing most Fighting-type Pokemon with 2-3 boosts minimum. This gives it more power and lets it take hits fantastically. The only problem being that this set is completely walled by Dark-type Pokemon. Therefore Pokemon like Hitmontop and Hariyama make excellent partners and should be considered when using this Pokemon.

    With 200 speed EVs and a Bold nature Shinbora outruns all neutral base 90 Pokemon. With a Timid nature and 196 EVs Shinbora outpaces all positive base 90 Pokemon, and with 240 speed EVs and a Timid nature, Shinbora outruns all positive base 95 Pokemon. Shinbora’s other options include taking a Rankurusu-esque role and abusing his decent speed and good special attack with Life Orb (although, Rankurusu has better bulk, higher special attack, and Trick Room), Dual Screens, Calm Mind, a Status Platform set (one that utilized Thunder Wave/Toxic), and a few others that you yourself could probably think of.

    Whether hail stall (which I would recommend trying this specific set on), balance, or offense, Shinbora is good at what is does, use it if you need it, but don’t make it an inferior Rankurusu.

    Shinbora‘s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Generation 5 graced us with another pure Poison-type Pokemon, Dasutodasu. One thing you’ll quickly notice is that The Trash Man here doesn’t have any base stats above 95. While this isn’t necessarily a good thing, it shouldn’t looked onto as a bad one. Those who use Abomasnow know how efficient he can be, and his base stats are all average too. Aside from his stats, Dasu boasts two absolutely fantastic abilities in Breakable Armor and Aftermath, and a wonderful movepool to abuse them with. Such things in his movepool include Spikes, Toxic Spikes, Haze, Clear Smog, Amnesia, Curse, Explosion, Gunk Shot, Recycle and Stockpile.

    Dasu’s main flaws are his unusable Special Attack stat, for which he cannot make use of his wonderful special movepool with. No Fire moves outside of Hidden Power (which shouldn’t be used for previously mentioned reasons) also gives him a major disadvantage against opposing steel types. His lack of instant recovery also hurts his ability to be as effective with the move sets suggested below.

    Dasutodasu @ Leftovers/Focus Sash
    Trait: Broken Armor/Aftermath
    EVs: 252 Hp/ 4 Def/ 252 Spd or 252 Hp/ 252 Def/ 4 Atk
    Jolly/Impish Nature
    - Gunk Shot
    - Explosion
    - Spikes / Haze
    - Toxic Spikes

    Dasutodasu’s biggest selling point above any other Poison type on a Hail team is a Fighting resistance coupled with Speed boosted Spikes. Aside from Forretress, Dasutodasu is the only Pokemon to get both Spikes and Toxic Spikes, and with the combination of his pretty fantastic abilities, he will no doubt be perfectly capable of setting them up. The set above is more than likely going to be his bog standard set. Gunk Shot and Explosion are literally (and I do mean literally) his only worthwhile physical moves, which kinda sucks as he would have really appreciated Earthquake to complement his nice 95 base attack stat.

    Aftermath and Broken Armor are great abilities (as mentioned several times) and as such choosing between them can be difficult. Breakable Armor lets Dasutodasu function as a lead, letting him make use of +1 Spikes and Toxic Spikes. Breakable Armor will also let Garbage Man make use of Haze or Clear Smog, eliminating the stat boosts of opposing sweepers, and if you‘re using Haze, you‘ll have eliminated your +1 Spd and -1 Def. It can also let him suicide against frailer physical attackers by switching into a resisted contact move, gaining his speed, and then using Explosion. Breakable Armor can also be used to switch into Breloom’s attacks and then kill him with the risky Gunk Shot.

    Code:
    Breakable Armor Speed Tiers
    +1 Dasutodasu with these EVs Outspeeds
    
    Neutral Nature 0 EVs: Base 75’s
    Neutral Nature 48 EVs: Base 85’s
    Neutral Nature 104 EVs: Base 95’s
    Neutral Nature 164 EVs: Base 105’s
    Neutral Nature 252 EVs: Base 120’s
    
    Positive Nature 0 EVs: Base 90’s
    Positive Nature 52 EVs: Base 100’s
    Positive Nature 108 EVs: Base 110’s
    Positive Nature 188 EVs: Base 125’s
    Positive Nature 244 EVs: Base 135’s
    
    Aftermath makes for a great bulky spiker. Switching into threats it can wall and then using Spikes or Toxic Spikes. Clear Smog can be used to help stop Pokemon like Roobushin from setting up against you, allowing you to make use of Spikes as Spikes and Haze are illegal together. Aftermath also makes him great fodder, as you can switch into a dangerous sweeper when Dasu is nearly dead (and hopefully the sweeper has been worn down) and then strip them of 25% of their health. Combine that with Stealth Rock, Life Orb, and Hail Damage, and they’ve lose roughly 53% of their health.

    Information about what constitutes as a contact move can be found here.

    Code:
    252 Hp/ 252 Def/ 4 Atk Impish Dasutodasu
    
    +1 Max Attack Roobushin Drain Punch (75 Base power): (23.9% - 28.3%)
    +2 Max Attack Roobushin Drain Punch (75 Base power): (31.9% - 37.6%)
    +3 Max Attack Roobushin Drain Punch (75 Base power): (39.6% - 47%)
    
    +3 Max Attack Roobushin Stone Edge (100 Base Power): (70.9% - 83.5%)
    +0 Max Attack Roobushin Stone Edge (100 Base Power): (28.3% - 33.5%)
    
    Oh, and something fun:

    Code:
    Dasutodasu Gunk Shot (Physical Poison 120 Base Power)
    
    0 Atk Neutral Nature vs. 0/0 Adamant Breloom: (113.6% - 134.1%)
    0 Atk Neutral Nature vs. 252/220 Bold Celebi: (46% - 54%)
    0 Atk Neutral Nature vs. +0 96/0 Adamant Roobushin: (34.7% - 41.1%)
    
    0 Atk Positive Nature vs. 252/220 Bold Celebi: (50.5% - 59.4%)
    
    Dasutodasu’s other options include being able to make use of Curse and Breakable Armor (allowing him to cancel out the +1 Speed and -1 Defense), Stench in conjunction with Double-Slap (or Rock Blast), and Rock Polish. His other physical attacking options include Payback, Knock Down, and Return.

    Honestly, Dasutodasu will probably linger in UU when tiers establish themselves, but you’re running a Hail team, and if you ever wanna try one of the more fun options, this guy is right here for you. Try not to use him as an inferior Tentacruel or Forretress.

    Clear Smog is legal with Spikes and Toxic Spikes but can be seen as inferior to Haze because it does not affect Steel-type Pokemon. Haze however is illegal with Spikes due to breeding issues. Tentacruel has access to Toxic Spikes and Haze, and Forretress has access to both Spikes and Toxic Spikes as well. However, no Pokemon has access to Clear Smog (or Haze) and Spikes as well as Toxic Spikes, other than Dasutodasu.

    Dasutodasu’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Nidoqueen has always been looked down upon as an inferior Nidoking due to its lower Attack stats and Speed. Ever since Generation 1 Nidoking has always usurped Nidoqueen for a spot on people’s teams. What does Nidoqueen have to offer that Nidoking does not have? Why, the obvious of course: better Defenses and a better defensive movepool in which to abuse them. While 90/87/85 defenses have never (nor will they ever) shake the very foundation the metagame has laid itself out upon, they are fairly good. With its Poison/Ground typing it has a resistance to Fighting, Poison, Electric (immune), Bug, and Rock, most of which are very common attacking types and very important resistances to have. Nidoqueen’s typing also has it as one of the few Pokemon with an immunity to Toxic and Thunder Wave while having the ability to absorb Toxic Spikes upon switching in. With moves like Toxic Spikes, Charm, Counter, Disable, Taunt, Roar and Dragon Tail, Nidoqueen will no doubt find itself useful.

    Nidoqueen has a Water, Psychic, Ice, and Ground weakness, all of which are common attacking types and should be easily covered by one of the five other members on your team.

    Nidoqueen @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sheer Force (Encourage)
    EVs: 252 Hp/ 252 Def/ 4 Sdef
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Toxic Spikes
    - Roar/Dragon Tail / Taunt
    - Earth Power
    - Blizzard

    Most people reading through this have probably noticed the lack of mentioning of Sheer Force in the opening paragraphs. Well, I thought I’d have those eager to hear what I say about it wait a little longer ; )

    Seriously though, Sheer Force is an absolutely fantastic ability. Essentially, having it as an ability is the equivalent of holding a Life Orb, which is great for Nidoqueen who’s other two abilities were rather lack luster. Sheer Force comes at a cost, it removes the secondary effects of Nidoqueen’s attacks. Which, is, actually a good thing, as when making use of the rest of her movepool (Sludge Bomb/Slime Wave/Thunder Bolt/Ice Beam/Flamethrower), you won‘t have to worry about inflicting status on something you would have rather left alone. With Nidoqueen switching into resisted (physical) attacks the last she wants to do is activate Guts on a certain Fighting Pokemon (Roobushin), or any other Guts/Quick Feet/Status Ability Pokemon, which she risks doing with Poison Point. Poison Point is also kind of redundant with Toxic Spikes anyways.

    The moves are pretty straightforward. Toxic Spikes is one of the big bonuses to using Nidoqueen, and works great with Roar or Dragon Tail (especially if you have any other hazards up). Make sure that if you see Roobushin (or any Quick Feet/Guts user for that matter) in the team preview you don’t:

    A) Lay down Toxic Spikes and
    B) Start Roaring with them up

    The decision between Roar and Dragon Tail can be a tough one. While the Mischievous Heart Pokemon are not exactly what one would describe as “not a threat”, most of them are very frail, and as such would not want to switch into Sheer Force boosted Blizzard. However, other Taunt users can pose a problem, rendering Roar useless. Dragon Tail is basically a physical version of Roar, it however, does not go through Substitutes, and Pokemon with Substitutes will not be swapped.

    Earth Power and Blizzard are probably two of Nidoqueen’s best attacking options, and as we know from Mamoswine, Ground and Ice offer Superb coverage. Blizzard will have 100% accuracy under the Hail storm and have base power roughly equal to 156, which, is not bad. Not bad at all~

    The spread used above was made with the intention to make Nidoqueen as physically bulky as possible (note: it’s purely theorymon, I have no idea how a spread like that will actually play), but 252 Hp/ 152 Def/ 100 SDef Bold can help you take special hits a bit better. No Special Attack EV’s were invested because Nidoqueen is not meant to play as an offensive Pokemon, its new found ability simply giving its Special Attacks a bit more oomph.

    Code:
    252 Hp/252 Def Bold Nidoqueen
    
    (+0) Standard Roobushin Drain Punch (75 Base Power): (14.6% - 17.2%)
    (+2) Standard Roobushin Drain Punch (75 Base Power): (28.9% - 34.4%)
    (+4) Standard Roobushin Drain Punch (75 Base Power): (43.8% - 51.6%)
    
    (+2) Standard Roobushin Payback (100 Base Power): (51.6% - 60.9%)
    (+2) Standard Roobushin Stone Edge (100 Base Power): (25.8% - 30.5%)
    
    Nidoqueen takes relatively low damage from Roobushin’s attacks (and thus does well against the plethora of other Fighting-type Pokemon) and is capable of Phazing him or completely stopping him from setting up with Taunt. Nidoqueen also outruns most of the slow bulky fighting types but is incapable of outrunning any Fighting types that invest in Speed, a prime example being Breloom, who Nidoqueen must run a positive Speed nature to beat if he’s using Jolly, and must still invest heavily with a neutral nature (208 Spd Evs to be exact) in order to outrun Adamant Breloom.

    Nidoqueen is also lucky enough to resist the Bug/Fighting/Rock combo, making it a good switch in to Pokemon like Terrakion, having nothing to fear from any of it's attacks.

    Nidoqueen’s has plenty of other moves in its movepool such as Flamethrower, Fire Blast, Thunder Bolt, Thunder, Ice beam, Shadow Ball, Focus Blast, Slime Wave, Crunch, and Rock Slide, as far as offenses go. Counter is the only other good defensive option that hasn’t been slashed in above.

    Nidoqueen has no discussion thread at this point in time.

    The Sheer Force discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Nidoking, for lack of a better choice of words, has always been a beast. His fantastic movepool coupled with his decent offensive stats (92/85/85) have never let him fall lower than UU. Nidoking has always been famous for being a mixed attacker, and what ability does Gamefreak give him that allows him to fill this role even more efficiently that one could imagine? Why, they give him Sheer Force of course! Nidoking lands a 30% boost to all attacks with a secondary effect (read as: (nearly) his entire movepool), coupled with his wonderful typing, boasting all the same resistances Nidoqueen does (Fighting, Rock, Bug, Poison, Electric), as well as an immunity to both Toxic and Thunder Wave, Nidoking may find himself with several switch in opportunities to rip the opponent to shreds with.

    Unfortunately for Nidoking, while his offensive stats may be superior to Nidoqueen’s in every single way, his Speed still does not reach the mark many players wish it were at. With Nidoking’s defensive stats being best described as “mediocre” he himself is not fit to take more than two or three hits. Hail teams are underrated, unexplored, and well, get creative! Nidoking loves Thunder Wave support, and the passive damage is absolutely lovely for him, so maybe running a Baton Pass team with Hail support (or alternatively, a Hail team with Thunder Wave support) could help Nidoking with the little boosts he needs.

    Nidoking @ Life Orb
    Trait: Sheer Force
    Timid/Modest Nature
    EVs: 252 SAtk/ 252 Def
    - Earth Power
    - Slime Wave / Focus Blast / Shadow Ball
    - Blizzard
    - Thunder Bolt

    Yes. This the set in which he will perfectly abuse his new ability, Sheer Force. On top of the power Sheer Force adds to these moves, Life Orb will add a second 30% boost, basically multiplying the attacks base power by roughly 1.69. Fortunately for Nidoking he won’t have to worry about the Life Orb recoil and Hail’s passive damage chipping away at his valuable life span, as a little glitch has made it so that any move that receives the Sheer Force boost will not take any Life Orb recoil. This basically gives Nidoking a little more than a STAB boost on all of his attacks at no cost. Wonderful.

    Well, why don’t we take a gander at what kind of damage he inflicts to the more popular walls in the Generation 5 metagame, shall we?

    Code:
    252 SAtk Life Orb Nidoking
    
    Focus Blast vs. 252/252 Bold Evo Stone Chansey: (26.5% - 31.5%)
    Shadow Ball vs. 252/128 Bold Dusclops: (37.3% - 44.4%)
    Thunder Bolt vs. 48/252 Calm Burungeru: (51% - 60.6%)
    Flamethrower vs. 252/252 Sassy Nattorei: (96.6% - 114.8%)
    Focus Blast vs. 252/0 Bold Blissey: (36.1% - 42.6%)
    Flamethrower vs. 252/240 Careful Skarmory: (71.3% - 84.4%)
    
    +1 Nidoking
    
    Focus Blast vs. 252/252 Bold Evo Stone Chansey: (39.6% - 46.7%)
    Shadow Ball vs. 252/128 Bold Dusclops: (55.6% - 66.2%)
    Thunder Bolt vs. 48/252 Calm Burungeru: (77.1% - 91.2%)
    Flamethrower vs. 252/252 Sassy Nattorei: (144.3% - 170.5%)
    Focus Blast vs. 252/0 Bold Blissey: (53.8% - 63.3%)
    Flamethrower vs. 252/240 Careful Skarmory: (106.6% - 125.7%)
    
    So, it seems our old friend is back with a vengeance, threatening walls of all assortments old and new with his wonderful new ability. Rock Slide, Poison Jab and Sucker Punch are all the other worthwhile options in his movepool.

    Nidoking’s discussion thread can be found here.

    The Sheer Force discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Gothiruselle is one of three fully evolved Pokemon to have ever received the ability Shadow Tag since it‘s debut in Generation III. Gothiruselle does not have Wobbuffet’s bulk, nor Shanderra’s massive Special Attack Stat. What Gothiruselle has over the two of them however is the capability to be able to perform both offensive and defensive roles. 70/95/110 defenses are nothing to scoff at, and it allows Gothiruselle to be relatively bulky on both sides of the spectrum. 55/95/65 are however pretty below average for offenses, the only good thing about them being her decent 95 base Special Attack Stat. What should give Gothiruselle any consideration whatsoever is her ability to make use of Charm, Tickle, and Fake Tears in conjunction with Shadow Tag (Wobbuffet only having access to Tickle). Charm, Tickle, Fake Tears, Captivate, Reflect, Light Screen, Thunder Wave, Safeguard, Taunt, Pyscho Shock, Thunderbolt, Shadow Ball, and Grass Knot, that pretty much sums up her movepool. Very good support moves, and several great offensive ones.

    Gothiruselle’s largest drawback by far is her instant recovery deficiency. Gothiruselle does not have any sort of instant recovery outside of Rest. No Recover, no Wish, no Moonlight, zip. Which is unfortunate for a Psychic Pokemon to be quite honest. However, Rest does cure her susceptibility to Status, and Taunt will shut down any opposing Pokemon’s attempts to phaze, set up, or inflict poison on her, which, is pretty nice actually. With Gothiruselle’s ability to cripple the opponents Walls/Tanks/Slow Bulky Pokemon, and then outright kill them, she’s perfectly capable of breaking the opponent’s core.

    Gothiruselle (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Shadow Tag
    EVs: 252 Hp/ 208 Def/ 44 Spd
    Bold (+Def, -Atk)
    - Tickle / Charm / Fake Tears / Captivate
    - Psychic / Psycho Shock
    - Rest / Calm Mind
    - Taunt

    With four de-buffers at her disposal, it all comes down to which you feel would be most efficient. For more defensive sets, Charm and Captivate are the top two choices. Charm and Captivate will lower the opponents Attack and Special Attack respectively, making her great for switching into certain walls like Skarmory, Hippowdon, for example, a combination of Taunt and Charm absolutely crippling them. Tickle and Fake Tears should be used for more offensive sets. Tickle should be used in conjunction with Psycho Shock because it lowers the opponents Attack and Defense simultaneously, while Fake Tears is more suited for use with Psychic. Rest and Taunt are very important to this set. Taunt will shut down the opponent for exactly three turns. No phazing, no set up, nothing. Taunt will also allow you to use Rest successively, having you wake up the turn after the Taunt has ended, letting you repeat the cycle.

    The EV spread is tailored on the more defensive side of things. 44 Speed evs were thrown to avoid being out sped by minimum speed Skarmory, with the rest thrown into her defenses. Oh, it should be noted that when running this spread, you get outran by 16 Spd Skarmory, meaning, if this is a problem, you should be running 252 Hp/ 196 Def/ 60 Spd.

    No defensive Pokemon is complete without damage calculations, no?

    Code:
    252 Hp/ 208 Def/ 44 Spd Gothiruselle
    
    (-0) Roobushin Payback: (57% - 67.4%)
    (-1) Roobushin Payback: (38.4% - 45.3%)
    (-2) Roobushin Payback: (29.1% - 34.3%)
    (-3) Roobushin Payback: (22.7% - 27.3%)
    (-4) Roobushin Payback: (19.8% - 23.3%)
    Total damage assuming having used Charm twice: (48.9% - 57.6%)
    
    (-0) Skarmory Brave Bird: (24.4% - 28.8%)
    (-1) Skarmory Brave Bird: (16% - 19.2%)
    (-0) Hippowdon Earthquake: (27% - 31.7%)
    (-1) Hippowdon Earthquake: (17.7% - 21.2%)
    
    The results are particularly interesting. Gothiruselle is perfectly capable of taking out the slower threats on an opponents team from the looks of this. Gothiruselle also has several other useful sets to make use of. A Status Platform, Choice Specs, and Calm Mind are the very first ones to spring up. A status platform may not be spectacular for a hail team due to how often Toxic Spikes are used, but if you’re looking for someone to spread paralysis she should be fairly useful. Choice Specs are deadly, allowing her to trap and decimate opposing Fighting-type Pokemon, though Shanderra, even with less bulk, may find himself more adept at that role. Calm Mind is more defensively oriented, trapping Pokemon that cant touch her and then setting up. Should work fairly similarly to Calm Mind Shanderra.

    Gothiruselle’s discussion thread can be found here.

    The Shadow Tag discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    The most famous Pokemon the 5th generation has brought with us, who also just happens to be #1 on the charts with the Dream World Pokemon. Shanderra has fantastic dual typing, which gives it several great resistances and an amazing STAB combination. It’s ability Shadow Tag makes it one of the best (if not the best) revenge killer in the entire game. Shanderra also carries with him the highest special attack of all non legendary Pokemon, an amazing 145 base special attack. Slap a Choice Scarf onto this bad boy and, well, your set.

    Shanderra @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Shadow Tag
    EVs: 4 Hp/ 252 SAtk/ 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Overheat
    - Shadow Ball
    - Energy Ball / Psychic
    - Hidden Power [Ice] / Hidden Power [Fighting]

    It’s pretty much the perfect revenge killer, nearly guaranteeing one kill per match. Its choices depend on what you want to deal with. Ground and Water Pokemon are dealt with using Energy Ball, while Psychic is often used for Roobushin. Hidden Power [Ice] and Hidden power [Fighting] are based on preference, choose which on what Pokemon you feel you should cover. Shanderra is perfect at coming in on Choice locked Fighting-type moves, as well moves like Bullet Punch or such things like that, and with such weaknesses abundant with the Ice-type Pokemon found on hail teams, Shanderra will find itself sitting comfortably.

    Shanderra’s discussion thread can be found here.

    The Shadow Tag discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Gamefreak seems to love homage Robots (here’s looking you Genosect, you Soundwave/Shockwave love child you). Goruugu has a wonderful 124 base attack stat, decent defenses, and wonderful Ghost/Ground typing. His typing provides him with three incredible immunities (Fighting, Normal, Electric), immunity to sandstorm, as well as a Rock and Bug resist. His Dream World ability is No Guard, making him the only other Pokemon besides Machamp that can utilize a 100% Dynamic Punch. Although he does not have STAB on Dynamic Punch, he does have STAB on Shadow Punch and Earthquake.

    Goruugu has several problems in his Water/Grass/Ghost/Dark and Ice weaknesses. Will-O-Wisp would have been a wonderful addition with No Guard, but, he doesn’t get it. Stealth Rock and Shadow Sneak are also some of the other things common to other Ghost-types, but our American Robot lacks. Goruugu is best described as wasted potential.

    Goruugu @ Leftovers
    Trait: No Guard
    EVs: 252 Hp/ 252 Atk/ 4 Def
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Dynamic Punch
    - Stone Edge
    - Earthquake
    - Toxic / Protect / Shadow Punch

    The moves are straightforward and a give-in. There really isn’t much else to explain on. Goruugu can utilize his other ability Iron Fist, or run other sets like Sub Dynamic Punch, Rock Polish, and Choice. Goruugu also carries with him very low speed (base 55), which can allow him to be effective on a Trick Room hail team. His options are limited, but what he offers to a hail team in his immunities and resistances can prove very useful.

    Goruugu’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Moltres carries on it’s burning wings a resistance to Fire, Fighting, Steel, two 4x resistances in Bug and Grass, and an immunity to Ground attacks. Aside from Moltres’s fantastic typing, he has a great 125 base special attack stat and pretty darn good 90/90/85 defenses. Moltres’s speed is slightly middling, but not too bad, and should allow it to do what you need it to do efficiently. Moltres’s ability to stop Sczior dead in its tracks is also very useful. Moltres’s movepool isn’t large, but it does contain U-Turn, Flamethrower, Fire Blast, Roost, Will-O-Wisp and Toxic.

    With such good resistances, Moltres must unfortunately shoulder a crippling Stealth Rock weakness, stripping it of 50% of its health on the switch in. That’s not such a huge problem however, as ways to keep entry hazards like Stealth Rock on the field is already a necessity for any successful hail team.

    And here we have a fine suggestion thanks to outofdashdwz:

    [​IMG]
    Tyranitar has always been held in our highest regards ever since his debut in Generation II. Tyranitar was blessed with a very generous BST and an offensive movepool that many Pokemon would kill for. From his BST Tyranitar received 134/95/61 offenses, which made him very deadly, and was even given solid 100/110/100 defenses to boot! Things could only get better from there, as Tyranitar was given Sandstream, an ability that summoned a permanent Sandstorm, boosting his already very good Special Defense by 50%. With access to moves like Rock Slide, Earthquake, Crunch, Stone Edge, Pursuit, Superpower, Focus Punch, Aqua Tail, Fire Punch, Dragon Tail, Flamethrower, Ice Beam, Blizzard, Thunderbolt, Focus Blast, Thunder Wave, Stealth Rock, Curse, and Dragon Dance, Tyranitar has a plethora of options at his disposal to be used in a variety of roles.

    Interestingly enough, Tyranitar was given a new ability in Generation V, Tension. While Tension in itself may seem useless, it’s more of what Tyranitar does no longer do when he has this ability. Tyranitar no longer permanently sets up a Sandstorm, letting Hail have free reign! This lets you take advantage of Tyranitar’s ability to pick off Pursuit weak Pokemon without negating any of hail’s benefits (such as passive damage and 100% accurate Blizzards).

    Unfortunately for Tyranitar he has several big flaws. Most notably, his weakness to common attacking types. Bug, Ground, Fighting, Water, Steel, and Grass. From those types, Tyranitar is also priority weak, suffering from a vulnerability to Mach Punch, Aqua Jet, and Bullet Punch. Another weakness comes from his Dream World ability, which will alienate him from all previous generation move tutors and event moves and strip him from his 50% Special Defense Boost. However, because Tyranitar’s weaknesses are so common, they should be relatively easy to cover. A Ghost Pokemon comes to mind.

    Tyranitar @ Choice Band
    Trait: Anxiety
    EVs: 180 Hp/ 252 Atk/ 76 Spd
    Adamant (+Atk, -SpA)
    - Pursuit
    - Crunch
    - Stone Edge
    - Earthquake

    Tyranitar is probably best when employing this set, making wonderful use of a Choice Band. With Pokemon like Abomasnow and Forretress, one would wonder whom would be best equipped to take out the ever popular Shanderra. Tyranitar takes a measly 31.9% - 37.8% from a Shanderra Overheat (in hail of course), making him an ideal switch in when baiting that attack with the likes of Forretress and Abomasnow. Shanderra is absolutely ruined whether he stays in or switches out, as Tyranitar does 92% - 108.8% with Pursuit. Tyranitar still remains the same powerhouse he’s always been, and is still capable of picking off weaker threats with his good defenses and high offenses.

    Tyranitar can make use of many other sets. Choice Scarf, Dragon Dance, TyraniBoah, and other such Mixed attackers all come to mind. If you’re really into using both Tyranitar and Hail, you could also always try a “Dirty Snow” strategy. Oh, it’s also worth noting that Tyranitar has access to Blizzard, meaning he can make perfect use of it when wielding a Choice Scarf.

    Tyranitar’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Everyone generation always get’s a “derpy” Pokemon. Fortunately for us, Quagsire is absolutely adorable. It’s a shame that he’s such an underrated Pokemon though. Last generation Quagsire was made famous for his performance in Ubers as one of the greatest checks to that one of that metagame‘s most dominant forces, Kyogre. Water/Ground has always been fantastic typing, sporting resistances to Rock, Fire, Steel, Poison, and an immunity to Electric-type attacks. Quagsire’s defenses are rather good too, as 95/85/65 makes him capable of taking many hits aimed at him (just barely missing out on being 2HKO’d by this Generation’s more popular offensive threats) but his offenses are a little low, 85/65/35 isn‘t something I‘d describe as “spectacular”. Luckily, Quagsire has quite the movepool to make up for his lack of offensive prowess, Haze, Encore, Yawn, Recover, Amnesia, Stockpile, Sleep Talk, Counter, Earthquake, Hail, Blizzard, Rock Slide and Stone Edge are just fantastic.

    If his movepool, typing, and stats weren’t enough, Quagsire has two amazing abilities at his disposal: Unaware and Water Absorb. Water Absorb has it’s uses, letting Quagsire switch into powerful Water attacks and recover off 25% of his health, Unaware may find itself a little bit more useful. With powerhouses like Doryuuzu running amok, Quagsire can prevent sweeps with his ability to ignore the opponents boosts, and simply Recover off damage or reset the weather with Hail. However, Water Absorb does provide free switch-ins on Rain Dance teams, meaning you can make use of Encore/Yawn even more so against Pokemon like Kabutops/Gorebyss (look out for HP Grass!).

    Quagsire’s drawbacks are few. His Grass weakness isn’t very difficult to deal with, as there are a plethora of Pokemon capable of taking any Grass-type attacks aimed at our little Quagmire. Quagsire honestly wishes he had higher stats. While Quagsire’s stats may be good, he simply wishes they were a little higher. His stats are just barely enough to make the cut, nothing in particular is absolutely fantastic either, they’re simply “decent”.

    Quagsire @ Leftovers
    Trait: Unaware/Water Absorb
    EVs: 252 Hp/ 4 Atk/ 252 Def
    Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
    - Hail
    - Recover
    - Encore
    - Earthquake

    (One of) Quagsire’s biggest asset(s) to a hail team is the ability to reset the weather without having to risk Abomasnow dying and being able to check several deadly threats with Unaware. Hail allows Quagsire to reset the opponents weather, providing the team with a sort of “back up” hail. This will help ensure that the opponent’s weather simply doesn’t happen, leaving him in a rather crippled position (assuming they run a weather team). Recover will help Quagsire stay in tip top shape. The last few moves can be a touchy decision. Blizzard lets Quagsire abuse his own reset weather, but Boiling Water has the off chance of burning the opponent, while Waterfall simply works off his higher attacking stat. Toxic will help Quagsire with opposing bulky Water-type Pokemon (though I would think Abomasnow would be better at taking them on). Yawn and Encore can also be run to force other sweepers to switch out, forcing them to set up once more. Haze can also be put in somewhere, Quagsire isn’t going to last forever after all.

    One of the most notable threats Quagsire is capable of checking is Doryuuzu. Many Doryuuzu operate in Sandstorm, meaning he gets double speed and can often be found atop a Balloon. While Doryuuzu uses Swords Dance, Quagsire will switch in and will generally 1) cripple Doryuuzu by resetting the weather, negating his Speed boost and forcing him out or 2) try to force a switch with Yawn/Encore.

    Code:
    252 Hp/ 252 Def Unaware Quagsire
    
    252 Atk Adamant Balloon Doryuuzu Earthquake (100 Base Power): (37.6% - 44.4%) 
    252 Atk Adamant Life Orb Doryuuzu Earthquake (100 Base Power): (49% - 57.9%) 
    252 Atk Jolly Balloon Doryuuzu Earthquake (100 Base Power): (34.3% - 40.4%)
    252 Atk Jolly Life Orb Doryuuzu Earthquake (100 Base Power): (44.2% - 52%)
    
    Factoring in Leftovers, the only variants of Doryuuzu that are capable of 2HKO’ing Quagsire is Adamant Life Orb Doryuuzu, whom, from my knowledge, isn’t particularly common, as many people go in favor of Jolly Life Orb or Adamant Balloon Doryuuzu variants. From this point Quagsire can simply reset the weather and switch out to a Pokemon that isn’t afraid of Earthquake. Such partners might include Latias, Gliscor, etc. Quagsire shouldn’t try to stall anyone out as it’s just begging to be hit with a critical hit that will cause irreparable damage. Pokemon like Gliscor cannot touch Quagsire (although they can cripple him with poison), and often meet a frosty end. Blizzard does 87% - 102.8% to 252 Hp Neutral Nature Gliscor.

    As mentioned before Water Absorb is a very fantastic ability, and should also be considered when building your team.

    While Quagsire can efficiently make use of Hail, that isn’t the one function he serves on a hail team. Unaware is absolutely amazing, ignoring any and all boosts an opponent has will make him a very efficient check to Pokemon like Gliscor, Salamence, Doryuzuu, and Manaphy, threatening them with a 100% accurate Blizzard, Yawn, Encore, or the removal of the weather from which they so desperately depend on to be as amazing as they are. Keep in mind though that Quagsire is not a one-stop-shop to all of them, as Quagsire needs to be at full health to take on Pokemon like Salamence and Doryuuzu, or tailored (a little bit) more Special Defensively to take on threats like Manaphy (assuming Manaphy lacks Energy Ball, as most usually use Ice Beam/Surf/Rest/Boosting Move).

    Quagsire loses out on all previous move tutor moves when using his Dream World ability Unaware.

    Quagsire’s discussion thread can be found here.



    Other notable Pokemon that have yet to be covered (but will be soon!)
    Clefable
    Cleffa
    Forretress
    Burungeru
    Nattorei
    Machamp
    Kingdra
    Latias
    Latios
    Zapdos
    …and many more (more than likely, I don’t think I’ve even scratched the surface yet o0).

    Threat List

    [​IMG]
    One of the largest threats to any hail team. Just by switching in he changes the weather, reducing Blizzard to a paltry 70% accuracy while simultaneously putting a stop to any Pokemon with the ability Ice Body. Tyranitar’s STAB Stone Edge, high attack stat, and slight unpredictability (an example being the ability to go mixed) will make him had to deal with. On top of all this, Tyranitar is fairly bulky, meaning he will be hard to take down.

    It weaknesses however are easily exploited and entry hazards will wear him down. Sableye and other Ghost-type Pokemon can easily burn him, cutting his attack stat in half. Hariyama and Machamp also have STAB Fighting moves to beat Tyranitar back.

    [​IMG]
    Ninetails brings the sun, and with it a deadly boosted Fire STAB to leave nothing more than a puddle as her team rampages through the Ice-types.

    Ninetails is the frailest of the weather inducers, and its weaknesses too are common. Earthquake, Surf, Hydro Pump, and Stone Edge are in high usage and will no doubt find there way onto your hail team. Heatran is also capable of switching in thanks to his Flash Fire ability, allowing him to take advantage of the sun, firing off STAB sun-boosted Fire Blasts off a 130 base special attack stat, which, will no doubt, burn like the dickens. Pokemon like Kingdra and Burungeru are also able to sponge attacks pretty well thanks to their great typing and impressive defenses.

    Another alternative is to run a Pokemon on the team with Icy Rock and Hail (much like how rain teams may run an extra Rain Dancer in the ranks), providing a nasty little surprise.

    Ninetail’s discussion thread can be found here.

    The sun team discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Politoed himself is not too terribly threatening to a hail team, but its more of the team that surrounds him that makes him deadly. Pokemon commonly found on rain teams include Kabutops, Gorebyss, Zapdos, and Ludicolo to name a few. Rain also carries with it several Steel-type Pokemon thanks the Rain lessening their Fire weaknesses. Thunder, Bullet Punch, Stone Edge and STAB Rain boosted Water attacks will hurt, a lot.

    Abomasnow can switch into lesser Water and Electric attacks, negating Rain’s boosts and Thunder’s perfect accuracy, letting Abomasnow fire off STAB Super Effective Wood Hammers to the non-Steel members of the team. Sableye can burn other Physical Sweepers (but he‘s not able to switch into any attacks), and Rankurusu is capable of turning the tables on the rain by using Trick Room, taking advantage of their incredible speed. Regice would more than likely be able to sponge some of the weaker attacks, but the stronger attacks like a Gorebyss’s Modest 252 rain-boosted Hydro Pump will 2HKO him (51.4% - 61%).

    Pokemon like Nattorei and Burungeru resist water an have very impressive defensive stats. Kingdra has a 4x resistance to Water and has good synergy with the other Ice-types on the team.

    Let us borrow a strategy from Rain! We can keep a bulky Pokemon in the back holding Icy Rock and use Hail to stop rain sweepers dead in their tracks. Pokemon like Regice and Kyurem are good choices.

    Politoed’s discussion thread can be found here.

    The rain discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Shanderra is a great asset to a hail team and a huge threat to its members. His ability to trap anyone with Shadow Tag means that anyone who run Shanderra + Weather is capable of completely shutting a hail team down.

    How do you deal with it? I don’t know. A second hail user is right up there on the list of “Ways We Can Keep Hail Going”. Shed Shell Abomasnow is another option, letting him escape Shanderra and letting you switch to someone more suited to “deal” with him. Shanderra’s defenses are decent but not fantastic (65/90/90), so any strong STAB attacks are more than likely going to hurt him a lot. A weakness to Water, Ground, and Rock also makes him a little more manageable, but not really. If the hail is going and Walrein has a sub up, Shanderra loses to him.

    Shanderra’s discussion thread can be found here.

    The Shadow Tag discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    What makes Scizor so threatening hasn’t really changed, Scizor will still be punching holes in teams with his Choice Banded STAB Technician boosted Bullet Punches. It just so happens that Ice Pokemon have a nasty little habit of being weak to Steel-type moves. Bullet Punch, U-turn, Bug Bite, Super Power, and Pursuit give Scizor a decent amount of tools and will find himself hitting many members on a hail team for super-effective damage.

    Which is why we run Pokemon that wont let him do that! Magnezone, Heatran, Sableye, Shanderra and Alakazam that run Hidden Power [Fire] are some Pokemon on a large list that threaten Scizor, just pick your poison. Espeon can escape on a Baton Pass assuming Scizor uses Pursuit, but she’ll die to Bullet Punch. Magnezone and Heatran can switch in, only having to worry about Super Power. Sableye has no weaknesses and threatens Scizor with a priority Will-O-Wisp, crippling him for the rest of the match. Shanderra can switch into all of his moves with out fear (bar Pursuit, which, is impossible to switch into).

    Scizor's discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    A Pokemon that can threaten nearly any team, and hail is no exception. Rooster man has a deadly dual Fire/Fighting STAB, both of which hit the Ice Pokemon on hail teams for super effective damage. Blaziken also wields incredible mixed attacking stats and a wonderful ability in Speed Boost, removing the one and only problem Blaziken has ever really had as a sweeper.

    Latias resists both of his STAB moves and out speeds a +2 when using a Choice Scarf, and can scare him off with Surf, Draco Meteor, or Psychic. Latios can do the same, but with much higher SAtk. Alakazam can take advantage of an unbroken Focus Sash and threaten him with a STAB Psychic, but Blaziken can always just Baton Pass away. Sableye can Taunt him, making attempt to try and stop him from setting up. Burungeru is immune to Fighting and resists Fire-type attacks. Any Ghost Pokemon can switch into a properly predicted Hi Jump Kick and cause Blaziken some massive pain with the recoil.

    Blaziken’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Infernape is in the same boat as Blaziken, boasting the same amazing dual STAB and the same counters. Infernape is now much less threatening than Blaziken thanks to his lesser mixed stats and so-so abilities, but Infernape is still a threat. With Iron Fist, Infernape receives a boost to all his punching moves, including his STAB priority move, Mach Punch. Infernape also has Nasty Plot over Blaziken, making him a huge mixed threat.

    Infernape’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Heatran has an incredible special attack stat and amazing resistances, most importantly to Ice (4x). STAB Fire Blast coming off of a 130 base special attack stat, as mentioned before, is going to hurt. A lot.

    Heatran however runs into trouble with bulky Water Pokemon (though he’s more than likely going to have a much easier time dealing with the thanks to Nitro Charge). Burungel and Swampert can switch into Heatran’s Fire Blast, but will run into trouble if its already been boosted by Flash Fire and the sun, and should be even more afraid if he‘s running Choice Specs and not a Choice Scarf. Swampert and Burungeru also have to watch out for Hidden Power [Grass] and Nitro Charge respectively. Kingdra can switch into his Fire Blast with ease thanks to her amazing 4x Fire resistance, but has to watch out for Dragon Pulse. Choice Specs, sun-boosted, Flash Fire Fire Blast runs the risk of dealing a 2HKO to most bulky Water Pokemon you can throw at him.

    [​IMG]
    Roobushin is one of this generation’s famous Bulk Up sweepers. Roobushin has an amazing 140 base attack stat, the newly boosted Drain Punch (75 Base Power) and Mach Punch, making him a huge threat to hail teams.

    Alakazam with an unbroken Focus Sash and Rankurusu have an easy time dealing with him, as many Roobushin are starting to favor Stone Edge over Payback. Rankurusu is also able to set up Trick Room on him. Shanderra and Sableye are both immune to his STAB Fighting moves and can switch in. Sableye can Taunt him to prevent further Bulk Ups, while Shanderra can use Psychic or Overheat. Latias and Latios both have impressive special attack stats and STAB Psychic, making them a great choice to deal with him. If Walrein has his Substitute up and hail is going, he will have no problem stalling him out. Tentacruel can switch into Drain Punch, causing him to lose health instead of recover it.

    The new mechanic allows us to see Roobushin on the opponents team before the match starts, so please, for the love of god, if you run Toxic Spikes, don’t start until you’ve eliminated him, as it will activate Guts.

    Roobushin's discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    A Pokemon that no single team will ever not find annoying from time to time. Serene Grace sets Jirachi apart from all of the other Steel-type Pokemon, doubling Iron Head’s (and other moves) chance to flinch (as well as their other secondary effects). If that wasn’t already bad enough, Iron Head is a Steel-type move with STAB, meaning Jirachi is going to hit a pretty damn good portion of your team pretty hard (hello Ice-types). Jirachi’s wide movepool, solid stats and fantastic typing let it do a plethora of things that you need to be on the look out for when dealing with it.

    Hitmontop can take advantage of Intimidate when switching in, causing Jirachi to do paltry damage with Iron Head (-1 252 Adamant Jirachi vs. Rapid Spin Hitmontop 19.7% - 23.7%). Shanderra can switch in safely to Hidden Power [Ground]-less Jirachi variants, trap, and OHKO with Overheat. Jirachi variants that don’t carry an Electric or Psychic attack are utterly walled by Rotom-W, while those that lack a Water or Psychic type move are given a run for their money by Rotom-H. All the Rotom Formes and Sableye are capable of crippling Jirachi for the rest of the match with Will-O-Wisp. Heatran can stop the onslaught with his 4x Steel resist, but those that run a Balloon will lose it in the process. Jirachi that run 252 Hp/176 Spd to outrun base 90s are outran by Kyurem, and 2HKO’d by Hidden Power [Fire] when factoring in hail damage (46.5% - 55%) (46 + 46 + 12 - 104%).

    Other Pokemon that are able to have an easy time with Jirachi are Zapdos, Moltres, and Burungeru (assuming no Thunderbolt).

    Jirachi’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Metagross is one of my favorite Pokemon that came from the third generation. Metagross has fantastic typing, an excellent stat distribution (which includes a 135 base attack stat and a 130 base defense stat), and a movepool that allows him to fill both offensive and supportive roles. He might not have gained much this generation, but Metagross really didn’t need anything else to begin with.

    Metagross carries with him a devastating 100 Base Power move in Meteor Mash (150 factoring STAB), and when said move is used in conjunction with his 405 attack stat, it’s going to be hitting a lot of things quite hard. Instantly the best counters that come to mind are Heatran, Zapdos, Moltres, the Rotom Formes, and Burungeru.

    Heatran makes a great switch in thanks to his 4x Steel resistance, and with Balloon, the extra ground immunity can provide a wonderful opportunity. Heatran will have to worry about Occa Berry variants after his Balloon has been popped on the switch though, as he will be killed by Earthquake the subsequent turn. Zapdos and Moltres pretty much wall him completely, but Trick variants that utilize Iron Ball will be a problem because he will outspeed them the next turn and will do massive damage with Earthquake. Rotom-H and Rotom-W have to worry about the same things as Zapdos and Moltres, but the Rotom Formes can burn Metagross thanks to Will-O-Wisp. Rotom-H has even less to worry about thanks to his STAB Overheat. Burungeru can switch into most of Metagross’s moves with ease (252 Hp/ 252 Def variants losing out on the 2HKO with Thunder punch 41.6% - 49%) and can then burn him.

    Hitmontop is not a good switch in to Metagross as Clear Body will negate Intimidate.

    Metagross’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Genosect is the first legendary Bug-type Pokemon. Bug/Steel is fantastic typing with a plethora of resistances and few weaknesses, letting him switch in on most moves a hail team would carry. Genosect also carries with him 120/120 attacking stats and a movepool that allows him to make use of said stats with Ice Beam, Flamethrower, Flash Cannon, U-Turn and Thunderbolt.

    Genosect will often be used with a Choice Scarf, and as such will be making use of U-Turn, so your best weapon against him is smart switches. Hitmontop can switch into U-Turn, lowering his attack with Intimidate and take pretty pitiful damage thanks to his Bug-type resistance. Both Heatran and Shanderra can switch into either Flamethrower or Bug Buzz, but Heatran will have to worry about his Balloon being popped thanks to the latter.

    Most Pokemon to switch in will have to worry about Download boosted Special Attacks/U-Turns or defensive pivots straight to a counter. Genosect can also make use of Self-destruct or Explosion, so you have to worry about those too. You will have to be careful when trying to deal with this Shockwave/Soundwave abomination.

    Genosect’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    Breloom is the first Pokemon that was able to make use of Spore in standard, thanks to his fantastic dual typing and wonderful Fighting STAB. Diamond and Pearl gave him another ability in Poison Heal, letting him jump onto Toxic Spikes with no worries at all. Although his defenses are sub-par, his attack stat is phenomenal. With Substitute, Focus Punch, Spore, Leech Seed, Mach Punch, Stone Edge and Seed Bomb, Breloom is still going to find himself as one of the more annoying Pokemon hail teams have to deal with.

    Magic Mirror Espeon is the best counter to Breloom. Breloom will more than likely always Spore the first turn to put a dangerous Pokemon asleep or to help ensure that a Substitute is brought up. This will let Espeon bounce back Spore (more than likely uselessly though, as many Breloom use Toxic Orb), and threaten to kill it with Psychic. Kyurem and Heatran cannot switch in for fear of Focus Punch (and the subsequent KO with Mach Punch assuming they survive), but they both outrun Breloom and kill him. Shanderra has nothing to fear once a Pokemon has been put to sleep.

    The newest thing with Breloom is to use him in conjunction with Blaziken, Breloom being the Baton Pass recipient. This will make Breloom very difficult to deal with, so watch out.

    Breloom’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    There’s nothing to say that has yet to be said, Lucario is top dog for a reason. Lucario has fantastic typing, a fantastic movepool and fantastic 110/115/90 offenses. It has numerous 4x and 2x resistances (Rock, Dark, Dragon) and an immunity to Toxic Spikes. With Close Combat, Crunch, ExtremeSpeed, Stone Edge and several boosting moves to make use of (Swords Dance, Agility, Nasty Plot) he will absolutely rip through hail teams if he isn’t beaten down like the mutt he is.

    Most Pokemon will have to worry about something thanks to his wide movepool. The best thing to do is to take advantage of his frailty and his average speed. Ghost-type Pokemon can switch into Fighting attacks with impunity and can threaten him with Will-O-Wisp assuming they aren’t mauled by a boosted Crunch the next turn. Sableye can switch into Close Combat and burn him before being attacked thanks to Mischievous Heart. Shanderra can switch into the Fighting moves of non-Agility variants and kill him with Overheat. Agility variants will mow over him however, as Life Orb Crunch is guaranteed to kill him after Stealth Rock (92.7% - 109.6% w/out factoring Stealth Rocks). Kyurem outruns non-Agility Lucario and puts him down with Focus Blast (102.5% - 121%). Un-boosted Life Orb Crunch will 2HKO Rankurusu, but he can set up Trick Room the turn he survives the attack and use Focus Blast (141.6% - 167.3%) or Psychic. Zapdos and Moltres have an easy time assuming he isn’t running Stone Edge. Other suggestions include priority moves (Mach Punch) and assessing which set he uses to better advantage yourself.

    Lucario’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    The Mole with the drill that has pierced the heavens, Doryuuzu! Although not as manly as Gurren Lagaan, he’s just as strong if not more so with his 135 base attack stat (tieing with Metagross and Shubarugo). Doryuuzu’s movepool is shallow, but it has just enough to do what it needs to do. Earthquake, X-Scissor, Rock Slide, Brick Break and Swords Dance are it’s best (only) weapons. With the Ability Sand Throw, Doryuzuu has his already decent 88 base speed doubled in a Sandstorm, allowing him to outrun all +Spd Nature Choice Scarf base 115 Pokemon (assuming Adamant Max Speed Dory, letting him reach 550), making revenge killing with a Choice Scarf during Sandstorm more difficult to accomplish.

    Doryuuzu’s problem lies within his frailty and dependence on Sandstorm to be able to outspeed anything worthwhile. Switching in on Earthquake will allow Abomasnow to reset the weather, letting you send in the appropriate way to deal with him. Technician Hitmontop (212 Atk) does 84.2% - 99.7% to 0/0 Doryuuzu with Mach Punch when holding an Expert Belt; while Intimidate Hitmontop (252 Hp/ 252 Def) does 103.6% - 123% with Close Combat and cannot be OHKO’d by any +1 attack. Sableye can instigate the same old priority Will-O-Wisp and cripple him. Burungeru is in the same boat as Hitmontop, taking nearly the exact same amount of damage (assuming 252 Hp/ 252 Def Bold) with the added bonus of being able to burn him with Will-O-Wisp or 2HKO him with Boiling Water (59.8% - 70.4% to 0/0 Dory).

    Most super effective priority moves are a one-stop-shop to Doryuuzu, as is eliminating the oppositions Tyranitar/Hippowdon.

    Doryuuzu’s discussion thread can be found here.

    [​IMG]
    The Three Musketeers newest addition, Kerudio. Kerudio’s defenses are identical Terakion’s, but Kerudio has much, much better typing to help him make use of his solid 91/90/90 defenses. Water/Fighting gives him a very deadly dual STAB, and his movepool lets him make use of Hydro Pump and Sword Of Mystery (think Psycho Shock). Combine those with his 108 base speed and 129 base special attack, the little Musketeer should not be underestimated despite being such a young, new addition to the troupe, as he is anything but inexperienced in sword play.

    According to Pokemon Online, his most common Dream World set consists of Calm Mind/ Sword of Mystery/ Hidden Power [Electric]/ Hydro Pump. I can’t be the only one who noticed immediately when I listed that out that the set is completely and utterly walled by Dragon-type Pokemon. Latias can switch in with ease and can KO a +0 Kerudio with either Psychic (132.5% - 156.7%) or Draco Meteor (103.1% - 121.7%) when using Choice Specs, while Latios achieves the same KOs with Psychic (130% - 152.9%) or Draco Meteor (100.6% - 118.9%) while holding a Life Orb. Neither one OHKO’s Kerudio with either move when he’s at +1, but he’s still easily killed. Kerudio can only 2HKO Burungeru with a +1 Hidden Power [Electric] (assuming 252 Hp/ 0 SDef Bold) and can intoxicate it, and completely walls him if he carries Hidden Power [Ice] instead.

    Kerudio’s biggest downfall is his movepool, if you can isolate which Hidden Power is being used, you’ll more than likely be fine.

    Kerudio’s discussion thread can be found here.

    Advantages
    • Diversity - While hail teams may lack the raw power of Rain Dance and Sunny Day teams, hail is still quite diverse. Abilities like Dust Poof, Magic Guard, Flash Fire and the importance of carrying Fire, Fighting, Rock resistances/immunities gives hail a wide pool of choices with a bunch of different Pokemon complementing its abilities and patching up its weaknesses.
    • Blizzard - A move with base power similar to Draco Meteor (with the added bonus of no -2 SAtk stat drop), 100% accuracy in a hail storm, and absolutely fantastic offensive typing (hitting Grass, Ground, Dragon and Flying super effectively, and 9 types neutrally) is a wonderful plus.
    • Ice Body - Hail is the only weather to boast an ability that gives Leftovers recovery while simultaneously negating the opponents (thanks to hail's passive damage). This is great for stalling tactics and fast healing.

    Disadvantages
    • Weaknesses - Rock, Fire, Fighting and Steel weaknesses burden Ice Pokemon greatly. These attacking types are not obscure and are found on nearly every team.
    • Lack of raw power - Sunny Day and Rain Dance teams gain offensive boosts to their STAB moves as well as doubling the speed of Pokemon with the ability Chlorophyll or Swift Swim (respectively), and increasing the damage output of Pokemon with the ability Solar Power. Sandstorm gives a SDef boost to all rock types on the team, allowing them to tank special attacks easier, and with the new abilities, Sandstorm‘s offense can rival that of Sunny Day and Rain Dance. Hail receives no such boosts.
    • Entry hazards - Stealth Rock cripples nearly all Ice Pokemon upon switching in, and Toxic Spikes are nothing to shrug off for hail stall teams, making Rapid Spinners very important.

    Show Hide

    Well, there you have it. I tried to be fair and frank and give information I felt was necessary. I tried to include a Pokemon’s selling points as well as their weaknesses. I haven’t included everything (as I’ve previously mentioned, missing a few Pokemon that are very useful or very threatening). I hope I’ve done a good job, if you any disagreements, want changes to be made, Pokemon to be added, or sets added to this post I’ll be happy to oblige. Thanks for reading.

    Update - Dec 5th
    • Fixed an incredible amount of spelling errors, sentence structure, among other things.
    • Replaced Abomasnow's Choice Scarf set.
    • Added Hitmontop
    • Added Moltres
    • Added Jirachi, Metagross, Genosect, Breloom, Lucario, Doryuuzu, and Kerudio to the threat list.
    • Added this fancy updates list.

      Update - December 12th
    • Fixed Hitmontop's calculations
    • Added Shinbora

      Update - December 31st
    • Added Dasutodasu
    • Added Nattorei

      Update - January 1st
    • Added Nidoqueen
    • Added Nidoking
    • Added Gothiruselle

      Update - January 17th
      Rewrites
      Pokemon
    • Abomasnow
    • Froslass
    • Rotom-F
    • Heatran
    • Magnezone
    • Espeon
    • Gothiruselle

      New Additions
      Pokemon
    • Tyranitar
    • Quagsire
    • Claydol
  2. LoveHurts

    LoveHurts

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2009
    Messages:
    20
    It's a shame that Hail hasn't got a lot of boosts this gen, and there haven't been any significant 5th gen pokemon apart from Kyremu that can directly abuse Hail via Ice Body / Snow Cloak.

    I've heard rumors that Kyremu would get two attacks that would benefit from Hail, though I can't say for sure and it came from a fairly unreliable source.

    However, with the new additions to help deal with Hail's threats like Magic Mirror Espeon and Shadow Tag Shandera, this thread has convinced me to make a Hail team. Great thread, Cshadow.
  3. Green Mage

    Green Mage

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2008
    Messages:
    567
    Hail is my favorite weather (which is why it's the worst, because I apparently killed puppies in a previous life) but it just didn't gain enough to overtake sand and sun in standard. A big reason is because Abomasnow is easily the worst permaweather poke in the game. I do think that hail can beat rain, but it loses so badly against sand and sun that it isn't even funny.

    It needs a new snow warning pokemon. My hopes were on Articuno (which would of course make perfect sense, but troll freak is troll freak) but now we can only wait and see if Kyurem's alternate form gets snow warning.

    On a personal note, i'm happy that Ice Body Regice might eventually be released because I never liked Walrein.
  4. Barilzar

    Barilzar

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2010
    Messages:
    106
    Good thread dude, but I think you should make mention of Weavile, especially with all the dragons being played.
  5. LateNightJazz

    LateNightJazz

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2010
    Messages:
    3

    Rain Dish?
  6. LoveHurts

    LoveHurts

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2009
    Messages:
    20
    Now that you mention it, Dry Skin also recovers HP.

    Clefable may be a good choice on a Hail team. It can support the team with Wish, Aromatherapy, and status support. Magic Guard is an excellent ability, letting it have Leftovers recovery in the Hail. It also gets Calm Mind and (I believe) Blizzard, so it can hit fairly hard as well.
  7. Axa

    Axa

    Joined:
    May 14, 2010
    Messages:
    403
    Froslass makes decent work of dragons, unless they're Scarfed. The Rotom Formes have situational protection- Frost Rotom has the best offense against them but is weak to Stone Edge and Fire Blast. Wash Rotom has the best neutrality (it's only weak to Grass), but can't really do much aside from Hydro Pump against Grachomp/Flygon and Thunderbolt against the Dragon/Flying. Sazandora walls it pretty well, though.

    Weavile has its uses, but to me personally it's just really frail, especially on a team that's usually more defensively-oriented like Hail.
  8. Barilzar

    Barilzar

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2010
    Messages:
    106
    True, but Weavile does make a decent counter to Tyranitar, assuming I ran my damage calcs correctly, Low Kick OHKOs.
  9. alphatron

    alphatron Volt turn in every tier! I'm in despair!

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2010
    Messages:
    1,443
    He can revenge him. But what can Weaville switch in on that Tyranitar does?
  10. Barilzar

    Barilzar

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2010
    Messages:
    106
    You have a point, but Weavile can also revenge Shandera. Ive found the poke quite useful on my team.
  11. cosmicexplorer

    cosmicexplorer pewpewpew
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    May 25, 2010
    Messages:
    1,555
    Damn that's a huge post.

    It would probably be good to mention that Abomasnow can hit all other weather starters SE, and also, when scarfed, makes a good check to Doryuuzu, being able to hit it hard with EQ or HP Fire.
  12. Donny Mae.

    Donny Mae.

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2009
    Messages:
    213
    This is a great write up. I'm going to make a hail team, haha. 120BP 100% accuracy? Yes please.
  13. Jiggy

    Jiggy

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2006
    Messages:
    275
    That's one amazing and exhaustive OP. One thing that jumped out at me, though:

    If the last move is Blizzard, Walrein shouldn't have major issues with most Mischievous Heart users. Tornelos, Voltolos, Erufuun, and Murkrow are weak against Ice, and meanwhile Riolu (...like anyone would use it in standard) and Lepardas have the most paper of paper defenses at 40/40/40 and 64/50/50. That just leaves Sableye, Volbeat, and Illumise--and Illumise would be most likely to show up on a sun team where Growth passing becomes awesome, which would mean Blizzard is still probably the better option since it hits Grass-types and isn't nerfed by sun other than not having 100% accuracy. Sableye is the only one of those three who learns Taunt anyway.

    That's not to say that Blizzard should definitely be the last move, since Surf's higher PP is good for stalling and hits Steel-types for neutral and so on, just that if the Walrein user is worried about Mischievous Heart specifically, then Blizzard might be preferred.
  14. Cshadow

    Cshadow

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2009
    Messages:
    866
    I appreciate everyone's kind feedback, really, its nice to hear as I've never posted this sort of thing before~

    Thats all well and true, and a good point, however, it still doesn't stop Mischievous Heart users that utilize Taunt making 2-3 of Walrein's slots (Protect/Substitute and maybe Toxic depending) useless for three turns though, more than likely forcing him to switch out. Though, saying Taunt rather than mentioning Mischievous Heart users is probably going to sound better, fixed~

    Added to Aboma's section~

    Can you provide a more convincing argument (I really hope that doesn't sound rude - thats literally the best way I think I can phrase it) for Weavile? Damage calculations are useful, as well as what he can do over, say, Mamoswine would be nice.

    Oops, fixed with a more accurate description~
  15. Jiggy

    Jiggy

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2006
    Messages:
    275
    Well, I guess I just see getting a KO as a better deal than forcing a switch most of the time, but it does depend on the entry hazard situation, enemy Pursuit users, enemy U-Turners, enemy priority, etc.

    Anyway, yeah, Taunt itself is a more general problem, nice fix. :)
  16. Barilzar

    Barilzar

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2010
    Messages:
    106
    No offense taken sir, I'll compile an argument for Weavile and post back here later.
  17. Farewell

    Farewell

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2008
    Messages:
    770
    Snover with Evolution stone might be viable as a back-up hailer. Especially if Abomasnow goes offensive, having Snover as a Leech Seed / Blizzard / Protect / Wood Hammer defensive set could be useful to make-up for its lower offensive stats. Leech Seed more than makes up for missing Leftovers, and allows it to stall with Protect, and can be useful to ensure weather is set, going slower than all other weather setters barring hippo Jr.

    Snover worked decently in UU, and with an Evolution Stone, might be fairly use able with the right set. (Strictly as a back-up Hailer of course).
  18. Axa

    Axa

    Joined:
    May 14, 2010
    Messages:
    403
    I'm not sure Wood Hammer on Snover would be worth it. With 62 Attack it's not gonna be doing much, and the recoil hurts its lack of Leftovers. I'd use Toxic myself, since nothing's gonna take Blizzard and Toxic (or Leech Seed) both well, except perharps Rest Ludicolo.
  19. Tobes

    Tobes "The absolute strongest reindeer"
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2010
    Messages:
    2,581
    ^Um, Nattorei?

    Also saying that Hail is where Kyuremu really shines.
  20. The.Lost.Hylian

    The.Lost.Hylian I'll have what you're drinking
    is a Researcher Alumnus

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2004
    Messages:
    5,795
    Is this true for Tyranitar with EVs invested heavily into HP and Defense?
  21. Noble Cactus

    Noble Cactus

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2010
    Messages:
    133
    Excellent OP. Nicely laid out and enjoyable to read. I like the fact Hariyama's getting some love as well; I did a double-take after seeing those valve involving Shanderaa. I guess that's one thing he has over Roobushin.

    Have you considered Lickilicky a threat to Hail? From what I read, he's the best anti-weather this side of Rayquaza, and he can deal with most Ice-Types well with Focus Blast and nice defenses. Even though Cloud Nine doesn't completely stop weather (it only nullifies it as long as Lickilicky is out), it's enough to cripple Ice Body users.
  22. Gabe

    Gabe

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2010
    Messages:
    2,569
    It would have been so cool if Gamefreak decided to give the Polar Bear or another ice type an ability called "Heavy Snow", that decreases the speed of non-ice types. Or If Ice types got a Def boost in Hail. But no, let's make Sandstorm even better and give Hail nothing. :(
  23. 1234gjy

    1234gjy

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2008
    Messages:
    365
    I know right? Seriously, 2 new sandstorm abusing abilities? And most of the users are really powerful.

    Poor hail, I guess Japanese people just hate it.
  24. Darkamber8828

    Darkamber8828

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    Messages:
    2,979
    Two pokemon with the weaknesses of Abomasnow isn't really ideal. Shed Shell would be much more viable.
  25. min min

    min min

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2010
    Messages:
    939
    Wow, this is comprehensive. And there's still more to come.

    I think they really should reserve a page on-site for this.

    On a side note, you could mention a gimmicky option where Rankurusu sets up Trick Room for itself, swapping out at the last possible moment to let a Lv1 Endeavor user do its dirty work.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)