1. One of them sucks. Replace OU with PU/FU.
2... There isn't a two.
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Inheritance [Prime Council Elected]
- Thread starter Snaquaza
- Start date
2... There isn't a two.
xJownage
Even pendulums swing both ways
Well, what do you think about having a donor clause? Do you think we can do it by evolutionary line instead? I don't think evolutionary line is too complicated. We could also do an ability clause, say, having 3 mons of the same ability is illegal. Either way, I can see the situations that arise as problems.
Limiting teams to one donor from each evolutionary line would fix the problem of people just using prevos, but leave the problem of unnecessarily restricting unique sets from the same donor... however, given that that is an edge case, I would be willing to accept it if there's no other obvious solution to the problem. There's no clean solution that leaves in everything we like and excludes everything we don't.
Two Mawiles running completely different sets will still have the same typing, statline, and other miscellaneous characteristics. In Inheritance, it's possible to construct completely different sets because you can use two different Pokemon drawing from the same donor.
xJownage
Even pendulums swing both ways
Yeah, I think honestly that by evolutionary lines is the best. I talked to a couple others who couldn't specify a more efficient solution. My one harp is things like different abilities, so maybe it could be evolutionary lines with the same abilities so you can't stack the same sorts of sets. What if you wanted to run a garchomp from tyranitar but wanted to run something with guts from larvitar on the same team? Both are completely different mons, so I think that there is a good argument for excepting mons with different abilities if in the same evolutionary line. This is likely too complicated, and I would prefer just banning the lines outright.
That's too complicated I think. If I want to limit Gale Wings or Protean spam, I'd simply use Ability clause for that.
Also, in less than one week, this metagame will go. Sad to see this go ;-;
The (Almost) Unbeatable team
Eviolite goomy (Goodra) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 88 SpA / 164 SpD / 4 Spe
Calm Nature
- Scald
- Dragon Tail / Psyshock
- Flamethrower / Foul play
- Icy Wind / Earthquake
Goodra is hear for a Water spout/Eruption counter, special protean counter, gengar hard check and special pivot. Goodra is also part of my regenrator core giving me the ability to outlast Adrian & Kl4ng (In theory). Goodra is just amazing, it truly does demotivate my opponent, which is my goal. I use Goodra and Regirock together who blanket counter a ton of the metagame, as they both care very little about all out attackers, though they struggle with set up sweepers. Gengar is mainly my Water spout/eruption counter as very little can reliably counter both of them. It Inherits from Slowking. Now you can run an efficient leftover set without any problems, but that means I have to get rid of assault west which lets me more comfortably beat Specs Eruption users, you can quiet possibly run a calm mind set up sweeper, but I like my team passive. Dragon tail is the most spam-able move, letting you phaze through the opponents team which is amazing for widdling offensive behemoths with SR up.
252+ SpA Choice Specs Heatran Eruption (150 BP) vs. 240 HP / 164+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra in Sun: 114-135 (29.9 - 35.4%) -- 29.4% chance to 3HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Clawitzer Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 240 HP / 164+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra in Rain: 109-129 (28.6 - 33.8%) -- 0.6% chance to 3HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Alakazam Ice Beam vs. 240 HP / 164+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 151-179 (39.6 - 46.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Gengar Ice Beam vs. 240 HP / 164+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 127-151 (33.3 - 39.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Adaptability Latios Draco Meteor vs. 240 HP / 164+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 286-338 (75 - 88.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO In the case of a 2HKO, switch out into Chansey, regenerator will help you scout.
232 SpA Pixilate Mega Gardevoir Boomburst vs. 240 HP / 164+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 270-318 (70.8 - 83.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO --
+6 4 SpA Suicune Scald vs. 240 HP / 164+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 60-71 (15.7 - 18.6%) -- possible 6HKO
+2 252+ SpA Life Orb Fairy Aura Togekiss Moonblast vs. 240 HP / 164+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 424-502 (111.2 - 131.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO -- there is a limit :)
Regirock @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Impish Nature
- Scald
- Recover
- Stealth Rock
- Rock Slide
The physical counter part to Goodra. Regirock is mainly my Gale wings spam counter. No matter what Talonflame wants to throw at Regirock I can tank any hit and start Scalding or Rock sliding. It's also my Stealth rocker, inheriting from Corsola. Generally, you really don't want Goodra or Regirock to take any hit other than what they're intended too, they don't take it well and it's a bad idea. You should rather use Regirock to counter those threats that are purely physical, Physical protean users, Gale wings, -Ate abusers (Watch out for Technoblast/Boom burst). Other than that I use Regirock and Goodra to outstall any other stall team I face, in theory atleast. I have two magic bouncers so getting up Stealth rocks is... difficult, allowing me to get them up more times than he can get up his, though if your opponent uses Defog you'll have to bounce his rocks atleast once to be able to PP stall his Defog. (Sorry, I'm not sorry)
Wall of calcs
252+ Atk Choice Band Landorus-T Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Regirock: 75-89 (20.6 - 24.4%) -- possible 6HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Landorus-T Steel Wing vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Regirock: 118-140 (32.4 - 38.4%) -- 3.1% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery -- Use Recover atleast once, to escape the 2HKO next time it comes in
252+ Atk Life Orb Protean Haxorus Drain Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Regirock: 166-198 (45.6 - 54.3%) -- 3.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery -- Switch into Sableye, you'll recover back and Haxoros doesn't beat Sableye
252+ Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Haxorus Outrage vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Regirock: 204-240 (56 - 65.9%) -- Guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recover -- Yeah, I have nothing for this.
252+ Atk Adaptability Ursaring Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Regirock: 73-86 (20 - 23.6%) -- possible 6HKO after Leftovers recovery
Suicune @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Recover
- Haze
- Encore
Suicune's S Rank for a reason. So suicune is the staple of my team, the only member that's been there from the start. So Suicune inherits from Quagsire, giving it unaware. It's the core member of my unaware core and is probably the pokemon you're going to have on the field most of the time. Scald is there for a nice burn chance, if you haven't noticed my team revolves around burning my opponent as Cresselia is the only member in my team who lacks the ability to spread burn. Haze is there to sort of shut down Mega Gyarados and Snorlax. Snorlax isn't an issue as it can't really do anything to my team, so I'm left to PP stall it (Sorry, I'm not sorry). Encore is there for obvious reasons, allows me to easily PP stall certain moves and generally gain momentum. Suicune has this nice defensive balance allowing it to take on most Pokemon to some extent and escape most 2HKOs. Suicune is also my -ate physical check, especially if they're mixed.
252+ Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Suicune: 139-165 (34.4 - 40.8%) -- 54.5% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Pixilate Mega Altaria Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Suicune: 109-129 (26.9 - 31.9%) -- 34.2% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
4 SpA Refrigerate Mega Glalie Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Suicune: 102-120 (25.2 - 29.7%) -- 0% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Explosion vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Suicune: 164-193 (40.5 - 47.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
Cresselia @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 56 Def / 200 SpD
Calm Nature
- Wish
- Protect
- Heal Bell
- Moonblast
The second part of my unaware core. Cresselia and Suicune handle 95% of the metagames set up sweepers, only losing to certain threats that either overpower them, has type advantage or has Mold Breaker. Cresselia is there to handle physical fighting types inheriting from
Mega Lucario, as they're most of the time walled by Cresselia. Cresselia handles set up sweepers like Zapdos, Thundurus and Togekiss.
It also provides Heal bell support but I tend to be really vary about using it as it has to little PP. I only really use it when either Cresselia + Suicune are statused as they need to be at a certain health. It also provides Wish support to some extend, but it can be nice if something is at really low health.
Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spe
Bold Nature
- Will-O-Wisp
- Shadow Ball
- Recover
- Defog
First part of my Magic bounce core, most effective against Stall. Sableye is only weak to Fairy, and Chansey is only weak to fighting. They really work together, Chansey packing immense special bulk while Sableye blanket checking so much. Sableye inherits from Ho-oh. Since Regenerator + Defog is incompatible I'm left with pressure, though it rarely matters as you have no reason NOT to mega evolve. Mega Sableyes typing alone gives me the ability to use it to double into Protean users to scout. I use Will o wisp to burn everything. Shadow ball for stab and pressuring Cresselia, especially the PH version. Recover over roost so people don't expect Ho-oh. Defog to remove hazards.
Chansey @ Eviolite
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 248 HP / 88 Def / 172 SpD
Impish Nature
- Recover
- Metal Burst
- Will-O-Wisp
- Knock Off
And finally, the last member of my team. If you haven't noticed yet, I don't like mixed walls. Chansey is mostly my special wall, I run some special EVs for... something. There's definitely a reason for running those EVs so I wouldn't remove them. Recover to heal up, of course. Metal burst to surprise kill something or demotivate Suicunes scald shenanigans as I do like 40% if they scald me. Will o wisp is to burn everything. Knock off is just to annoy the opposing team. I'll usually lead with this as it's easy to guess what your opponent will do.
Some threats to this team includes Trapping, Mega Gyarados, Mega Medicham, Mega Alakazam, Maroawk and Haxorous :] Enjoy
Shoutouts to: Eviolite Goomy, Kl4ng/Adrian, Darkeknight, Mothermalkova, I like Donkeys :]
REPLAY: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/inheritance-227512226
Eviolite goomy (Goodra) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 88 SpA / 164 SpD / 4 Spe
Calm Nature
- Scald
- Dragon Tail / Psyshock
- Flamethrower / Foul play
- Icy Wind / Earthquake
Goodra is hear for a Water spout/Eruption counter, special protean counter, gengar hard check and special pivot. Goodra is also part of my regenrator core giving me the ability to outlast Adrian & Kl4ng (In theory). Goodra is just amazing, it truly does demotivate my opponent, which is my goal. I use Goodra and Regirock together who blanket counter a ton of the metagame, as they both care very little about all out attackers, though they struggle with set up sweepers. Gengar is mainly my Water spout/eruption counter as very little can reliably counter both of them. It Inherits from Slowking. Now you can run an efficient leftover set without any problems, but that means I have to get rid of assault west which lets me more comfortably beat Specs Eruption users, you can quiet possibly run a calm mind set up sweeper, but I like my team passive. Dragon tail is the most spam-able move, letting you phaze through the opponents team which is amazing for widdling offensive behemoths with SR up.
252+ SpA Choice Specs Heatran Eruption (150 BP) vs. 240 HP / 164+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra in Sun: 114-135 (29.9 - 35.4%) -- 29.4% chance to 3HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Clawitzer Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 240 HP / 164+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra in Rain: 109-129 (28.6 - 33.8%) -- 0.6% chance to 3HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Alakazam Ice Beam vs. 240 HP / 164+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 151-179 (39.6 - 46.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Gengar Ice Beam vs. 240 HP / 164+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 127-151 (33.3 - 39.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Adaptability Latios Draco Meteor vs. 240 HP / 164+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 286-338 (75 - 88.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO In the case of a 2HKO, switch out into Chansey, regenerator will help you scout.
232 SpA Pixilate Mega Gardevoir Boomburst vs. 240 HP / 164+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 270-318 (70.8 - 83.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO --
+6 4 SpA Suicune Scald vs. 240 HP / 164+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 60-71 (15.7 - 18.6%) -- possible 6HKO
+2 252+ SpA Life Orb Fairy Aura Togekiss Moonblast vs. 240 HP / 164+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 424-502 (111.2 - 131.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO -- there is a limit :)
Regirock @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Impish Nature
- Scald
- Recover
- Stealth Rock
- Rock Slide
The physical counter part to Goodra. Regirock is mainly my Gale wings spam counter. No matter what Talonflame wants to throw at Regirock I can tank any hit and start Scalding or Rock sliding. It's also my Stealth rocker, inheriting from Corsola. Generally, you really don't want Goodra or Regirock to take any hit other than what they're intended too, they don't take it well and it's a bad idea. You should rather use Regirock to counter those threats that are purely physical, Physical protean users, Gale wings, -Ate abusers (Watch out for Technoblast/Boom burst). Other than that I use Regirock and Goodra to outstall any other stall team I face, in theory atleast. I have two magic bouncers so getting up Stealth rocks is... difficult, allowing me to get them up more times than he can get up his, though if your opponent uses Defog you'll have to bounce his rocks atleast once to be able to PP stall his Defog. (Sorry, I'm not sorry)
Wall of calcs
252+ Atk Choice Band Landorus-T Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Regirock: 75-89 (20.6 - 24.4%) -- possible 6HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Landorus-T Steel Wing vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Regirock: 118-140 (32.4 - 38.4%) -- 3.1% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery -- Use Recover atleast once, to escape the 2HKO next time it comes in
252+ Atk Life Orb Protean Haxorus Drain Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Regirock: 166-198 (45.6 - 54.3%) -- 3.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery -- Switch into Sableye, you'll recover back and Haxoros doesn't beat Sableye
252+ Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Haxorus Outrage vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Regirock: 204-240 (56 - 65.9%) -- Guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recover -- Yeah, I have nothing for this.
252+ Atk Adaptability Ursaring Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Regirock: 73-86 (20 - 23.6%) -- possible 6HKO after Leftovers recovery
Suicune @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Recover
- Haze
- Encore
Suicune's S Rank for a reason. So suicune is the staple of my team, the only member that's been there from the start. So Suicune inherits from Quagsire, giving it unaware. It's the core member of my unaware core and is probably the pokemon you're going to have on the field most of the time. Scald is there for a nice burn chance, if you haven't noticed my team revolves around burning my opponent as Cresselia is the only member in my team who lacks the ability to spread burn. Haze is there to sort of shut down Mega Gyarados and Snorlax. Snorlax isn't an issue as it can't really do anything to my team, so I'm left to PP stall it (Sorry, I'm not sorry). Encore is there for obvious reasons, allows me to easily PP stall certain moves and generally gain momentum. Suicune has this nice defensive balance allowing it to take on most Pokemon to some extent and escape most 2HKOs. Suicune is also my -ate physical check, especially if they're mixed.
252+ Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Suicune: 139-165 (34.4 - 40.8%) -- 54.5% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Pixilate Mega Altaria Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Suicune: 109-129 (26.9 - 31.9%) -- 34.2% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
4 SpA Refrigerate Mega Glalie Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Suicune: 102-120 (25.2 - 29.7%) -- 0% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Explosion vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Suicune: 164-193 (40.5 - 47.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
Cresselia @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 56 Def / 200 SpD
Calm Nature
- Wish
- Protect
- Heal Bell
- Moonblast
The second part of my unaware core. Cresselia and Suicune handle 95% of the metagames set up sweepers, only losing to certain threats that either overpower them, has type advantage or has Mold Breaker. Cresselia is there to handle physical fighting types inheriting from
Mega Lucario, as they're most of the time walled by Cresselia. Cresselia handles set up sweepers like Zapdos, Thundurus and Togekiss.
It also provides Heal bell support but I tend to be really vary about using it as it has to little PP. I only really use it when either Cresselia + Suicune are statused as they need to be at a certain health. It also provides Wish support to some extend, but it can be nice if something is at really low health.
Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spe
Bold Nature
- Will-O-Wisp
- Shadow Ball
- Recover
- Defog
First part of my Magic bounce core, most effective against Stall. Sableye is only weak to Fairy, and Chansey is only weak to fighting. They really work together, Chansey packing immense special bulk while Sableye blanket checking so much. Sableye inherits from Ho-oh. Since Regenerator + Defog is incompatible I'm left with pressure, though it rarely matters as you have no reason NOT to mega evolve. Mega Sableyes typing alone gives me the ability to use it to double into Protean users to scout. I use Will o wisp to burn everything. Shadow ball for stab and pressuring Cresselia, especially the PH version. Recover over roost so people don't expect Ho-oh. Defog to remove hazards.
Chansey @ Eviolite
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 248 HP / 88 Def / 172 SpD
Impish Nature
- Recover
- Metal Burst
- Will-O-Wisp
- Knock Off
And finally, the last member of my team. If you haven't noticed yet, I don't like mixed walls. Chansey is mostly my special wall, I run some special EVs for... something. There's definitely a reason for running those EVs so I wouldn't remove them. Recover to heal up, of course. Metal burst to surprise kill something or demotivate Suicunes scald shenanigans as I do like 40% if they scald me. Will o wisp is to burn everything. Knock off is just to annoy the opposing team. I'll usually lead with this as it's easy to guess what your opponent will do.
Some threats to this team includes Trapping, Mega Gyarados, Mega Medicham, Mega Alakazam, Maroawk and Haxorous :] Enjoy
Shoutouts to: Eviolite Goomy, Kl4ng/Adrian, Darkeknight, Mothermalkova, I like Donkeys :]
REPLAY: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/inheritance-227512226
Attachments
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Ultimate C-Team coming through.
Absol-Mega (Suicune) @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 HP / 24 Spe / 232 SpD
Bold Nature
- Substitute
- Swords Dance
- Baton Pass
- Knock Off
Hawlucha (Electivire) @ Life Orb
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Thunder Punch
- Taunt
- Roost
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Regirock: 290-343 (79.6 - 94.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Sableye: 415-489 (136.5 - 160.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 890-1049 (126.4 - 149%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Suicune: 881-1037 (218 - 256.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Cresselia: 426-503 (95.9 - 113.2%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 240 HP / 0 Def Goodra: 450-530 (118.1 - 139.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Technically only Electivire is needed but Suicune is useful for boosting and passing a sub to stop pesky burns.
This is a fantastic team with, as you say, very few weaknesses.
A few notes/questions:
- What's the story behind Goodra's EVs?
- Earthquake is better than Psyshock on Goodra, I've noticed, for really nuking Desolate Land Heatran and Gengar. Doesn't even require investment.
- Why Lax on Regirock? Does it need to outspeed other Regis that badly?
- Psyshock lets Dark-types wall Cresselia. I'd recommend switching to Moonblast, which has no immunities and can pressure Dark-types that want to fuck with it.
- While I was able to counterteam one particular incarnation of this team with a terrible Cacturne set, you've since remedied that. However, I was able to construct a set that, while it can't CT you like my last one did, should threaten every team member. It's not even half-bad, imo.
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 Atk / 208 SpD / 48 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Facade
- Roost
- Toxic
Inherits Drought from Mega Charizard Y (many donors can give the moveset) to drop Scald damage for a short period of time. Speed EVs let it outspeed Suicune/Cresselia with some room to spare. Special Defense EVs help it tank Moonblasts from Cresselia (if you make that change), while Defense EVs are preferred otherwise, as Altaria doesn't care about any of your Scalds anyways and Rock Slide/Psyshock should be tanked. Roost is mandatory for staying power, and since you don't have Taunt, it's reliable.
Burnt Pixilate Facade is unresisted on your team, and deals heavy damage even to your Unaware walls.
252+ Atk Pixilate Mega Altaria Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 56 Def Cresselia: 237-279 (53.3 - 62.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery <== assisted by Toxic and Recovery
252+ Atk Pixilate Mega Altaria Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Suicune: 190-225 (47 - 55.6%) -- 19.9% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery <== assisted by Toxic, tough matchup
252+ Atk Pixilate Mega Altaria Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 88+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 616-726 (87.5 - 103.1%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO <== Swords Dance lol
252+ Atk Pixilate Mega Altaria Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Sableye: 356-422 (117.1 - 138.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Pixilate Mega Altaria Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Goodra: 780-918 (203.1 - 239%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Pixilate Mega Altaria Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Regirock: 126-148 (34.6 - 40.6%) -- 60.5% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery (OHKOs at +4, which it can easily get to on Regi)
This is all premised on getting a burn, but you almost can't avoid burning certain threatening physical attackers, that shouldn't be terribly difficult.
And as mentioned, Tough Claws Banded Haxorus destroys you as well.
Ultimate C-Team coming through.
Absol-Mega (Suicune) @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 HP / 24 Spe / 232 SpD
Bold Nature
- Substitute
- Swords Dance
- Baton Pass
- Knock Off
Hawlucha (Electivire) @ Life Orb
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Thunder Punch
- Taunt
- Roost
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Regirock: 290-343 (79.6 - 94.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Sableye: 415-489 (136.5 - 160.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 890-1049 (126.4 - 149%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Suicune: 881-1037 (218 - 256.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Cresselia: 426-503 (95.9 - 113.2%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 240 HP / 0 Def Goodra: 450-530 (118.1 - 139.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Technically only Electivire is needed but Suicune is useful for boosting and passing a sub to stop pesky burns.
- Suicune should be minimum speed so it can slow-BP to Electivire.
- Given that the Cress set in question isn't max Pdef, that's a guaranteed OHKO.
- I don't think you need Taunt if you're running that set with Suicune. I think you would want something to OHKO Regirock -- Brick Break does the trick with 100% accuracy.
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I mean, if you really, really try you can probably counter team. But I don't think that Electivire is going to beat my Regirock, I can spam Scalds and then spam rock slides, you get pressured quickly, and I'll happily do a double down. But this set is also deadweight against any other team and considering I only battle when the second guy on the ladder you're not going to catch me off guard. I'm glad the team centralises the meta enough, lmao. Oh, and I can phaze you with Goodra, I'll live a +2 and regenerate back up.Ultimate C-Team coming through.
Absol-Mega (Suicune) @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 HP / 24 Spe / 232 SpD
Bold Nature
- Substitute
- Swords Dance
- Baton Pass
- Knock Off
Hawlucha (Electivire) @ Life Orb
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Thunder Punch
- Taunt
- Roost
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Regirock: 290-343 (79.6 - 94.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Sableye: 415-489 (136.5 - 160.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 890-1049 (126.4 - 149%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Suicune: 881-1037 (218 - 256.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Cresselia: 426-503 (95.9 - 113.2%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
+6 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Electivire Thunder Punch vs. 240 HP / 0 Def Goodra: 450-530 (118.1 - 139.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Technically only Electivire is needed but Suicune is useful for boosting and passing a sub to stop pesky burns.
I changed all of what you suggested and the EVs are to always survive 3 water spouts/eruptions!
i don't think you can say 'The (Almost) Unbeatable team' when you auto-lose to any decent mega gya (which is quite common by now) team :/ also you need a better check to protean mons like this:
Mence@life orb
protean
100at/156spa/255spe
rash
-knock off
-drain punch
-grass knot
-tbolt/toxic/Last Resort(this is for the lols)
which 1hko or 2hko your entire team and your best mon agganist it (goodra) can only hope for a scald burn
The only thing the opponent also needs is a slow passer like this:
Chansey@eviolite
Magic Bounce
252def/252spdef
bold
-subs
-baton pass
-moonlight
-calm mind/work up
TL;DR : Your team is too passive, and doesn't have enough momentum to deal with powerfull wallbreakers. Overall, regen u-turn spam stall is better. Btw stall in generall isn't that good anymore.
Mence@life orb
protean
100at/156spa/255spe
rash
-knock off
-drain punch
-grass knot
-tbolt/toxic/Last Resort(this is for the lols)
which 1hko or 2hko your entire team and your best mon agganist it (goodra) can only hope for a scald burn
100 Atk Life Orb Protean Salamence Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0+ Def Cresselia: 299-354 (67.3 - 79.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
156+ SpA Life Orb Protean Salamence Grass Knot (100 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Suicune: 343-406 (84.9 - 100.4%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKOgif
156+ SpA Life Orb Protean Salamence Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Regirock: 460-541 (126.3 - 148.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
100 Atk Life Orb Protean Salamence Drain Punch vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 393-463 (61.2 - 72.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
156+ SpA Life Orb Protean Salamence Grass Knot (100 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Sableye: 172-203 (56.5 - 66.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
100 Atk Life Orb Protean Salamence Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 240 HP / 86 Def Goodra: 227-269 (59.5 - 70.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
156+ SpA Life Orb Protean Salamence Grass Knot (100 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Suicune: 343-406 (84.9 - 100.4%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKOgif
156+ SpA Life Orb Protean Salamence Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Regirock: 460-541 (126.3 - 148.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
100 Atk Life Orb Protean Salamence Drain Punch vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 393-463 (61.2 - 72.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
156+ SpA Life Orb Protean Salamence Grass Knot (100 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Sableye: 172-203 (56.5 - 66.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
100 Atk Life Orb Protean Salamence Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 240 HP / 86 Def Goodra: 227-269 (59.5 - 70.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
The only thing the opponent also needs is a slow passer like this:
Chansey@eviolite
Magic Bounce
252def/252spdef
bold
-subs
-baton pass
-moonlight
-calm mind/work up
TL;DR : Your team is too passive, and doesn't have enough momentum to deal with powerfull wallbreakers. Overall, regen u-turn spam stall is better. Btw stall in generall isn't that good anymore.
You're free to run both of those set but you're wasting two of your move slots, and I only have to predict around regardless. Goodra can also Dragon tail lmao, Cresselia can stall it out aslong as I don't come in on a Knock off, as i'll wish protect.i don't think you can say 'The (Almost) Unbeatable team' when you auto-lose to any decent mega gya (which is quite common by now) team :/ also you need a better check to protean mons like this:
Mence@life orb
protean
100at/156spa/255spe
rash
-knock off
-drain punch
-grass knot
-tbolt/toxic/Last Resort(this is for the lols)
which 1hko or 2hko your entire team and your best mon agganist it (goodra) can only hope for a scald burn
100 Atk Life Orb Protean Salamence Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0+ Def Cresselia: 299-354 (67.3 - 79.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
156+ SpA Life Orb Protean Salamence Grass Knot (100 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Suicune: 343-406 (84.9 - 100.4%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKOgif
156+ SpA Life Orb Protean Salamence Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Regirock: 460-541 (126.3 - 148.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
100 Atk Life Orb Protean Salamence Drain Punch vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 393-463 (61.2 - 72.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
156+ SpA Life Orb Protean Salamence Grass Knot (100 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Sableye: 172-203 (56.5 - 66.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
100 Atk Life Orb Protean Salamence Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 240 HP / 86 Def Goodra: 227-269 (59.5 - 70.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
The only thing the opponent also needs is a slow passer like this:
Chansey@eviolite
Magic Bounce
252def/252spdef
bold
-subs
-baton pass
-moonlight
-calm mind/work up
TL;DR : Your team is too passive, and doesn't have enough momentum to deal with powerfull wallbreakers. Overall, regen u-turn spam stall is better. Btw stall in generall isn't that good anymore.
I respect your opinion but I disagree. Others have used more offensive stall teams and I still came out on top.
EDIT: About the mega gyarados, it doesn't get that many free set up opportunities and I can annoy it with Suicune and potentially lock it into Shell smash/DD, but yeah, I also listed it as a threat.
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encore suicune doesn't check mega gya. I'm sure it doesn't work because i used to use the same set :P if you encore subs he will just use subs till encore ends and sweep your team. the only way to stop it is encoring shell smash/dd and he'll just switch, come on cress and sweep you. Only prankster encore beats mega gya (those pesky ferros)
The problem with your team is not aggaist stall (regen stall still pp stall beat you just by switching till victory) is aggaist offense, which is getting much better by now. i gave up on using stall and now i'm using extreme speed spam + mega gya. regen stall can actually counter mega gya and gives much less set up opportunities to set up sweepers.
I don't think grass knot is a waste of a move slot when people try to check gw mence with their rock types/unaware suicune just to be ohkoed on the switch :O
Finally just a set i'm using to stallbreak teams without being afraid to lose because of a scald burn:
Gyarados @ Gyaradosite
Ability: Synchronize
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Knock Off
- Swords Dance
- Roost
- Heal Bell
This set is that nice, a heal beller and a stall breaker on the same mon (also f*ck scald)
Other set for pure offense which helps extreme speed spam a lot is this:
Tyranitar @ Black Glasses
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 180 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD / 12 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Sucker Punch
- Knock Off
- Pursuit
- Swords Dance
The problem with your team is not aggaist stall (regen stall still pp stall beat you just by switching till victory) is aggaist offense, which is getting much better by now. i gave up on using stall and now i'm using extreme speed spam + mega gya. regen stall can actually counter mega gya and gives much less set up opportunities to set up sweepers.
I don't think grass knot is a waste of a move slot when people try to check gw mence with their rock types/unaware suicune just to be ohkoed on the switch :O
Finally just a set i'm using to stallbreak teams without being afraid to lose because of a scald burn:
Gyarados @ Gyaradosite
Ability: Synchronize
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Knock Off
- Swords Dance
- Roost
- Heal Bell
This set is that nice, a heal beller and a stall breaker on the same mon (also f*ck scald)
Other set for pure offense which helps extreme speed spam a lot is this:
Tyranitar @ Black Glasses
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 180 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD / 12 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Sucker Punch
- Knock Off
- Pursuit
- Swords Dance
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Well, I have never lost to Mega Gyarados and I've faced it multiple times. I've lost twice to a legitimate strategy, once was because of illusion Tyranitar Knock off my eviolite and then he swept me with Sniper Latios and the other time was me not seeing that his Aerodactyl was Mold breaker and I defogged on it instead of burning it. Other than that I've only lost to lag, with another team or to trapping. I'm saying this because you're arguing with really silly arguments. No stall team can prepare for everything, of course there is some set that hyper centralises around beating mine. That's the point. I want my opponents to centralise their teams so much that they can either prepare for someone else team, or risk facing mine.encore suicune doesn't check mega gya. I'm sure it doesn't work because i used to use the same set :P if you encore subs he will just use subs till encore ends and sweep your team. the only way to stop it is encoring shell smash/dd and he'll just switch, come on cress and sweep you. Only prankster encore beats mega gya (those pesky ferros)
The problem with your team is not aggaist stall (regen stall still pp stall beat you just by switching till victory) is aggaist offense, which is getting much better by now. i gave up on using stall and now i'm using extreme speed spam + mega gya. regen stall can actually counter mega gya and gives much less set up opportunities to set up sweepers.
I don't think grass know is a waste of a move slot when people try to check gw mence with their rock types/unaware suicune just to be ohkoed on the switch :O
Finally just a set i'm using to stallbreak teams without being afraid to lose because of a scald burn:
Gyarados @ Gyaradosite
Ability: Synchronize
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Knock Off
- Swords Dance
- Roost
- Heal Bell
This set is that nice, a heal beller and a stall breaker on the same mon (also f*ck scald)
Other set for pure offense which helps extreme speed spam a lot is this:
Tyranitar @ Black Glasses
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 180 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD / 12 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Sucker Punch
- Knock Off
- Pursuit
- Swords Dance
There is no definitive playstyle I struggle with. I beat your average offensive team unless they specifically prepare for my team ( look above). I beat Stall as I have dual Magic bounce & dual regenerator allowing me to switch between them indefinitely. And yes, others can to that as well but that will just result in an endless battle and the battle will tie. Unless the opposing stall team packs a regenerator + magic bounce core I beat it. I'll PP stall it and I've done it before. Balance is even easier as it's very predictable, though it usually takes some time to break their defensive core (PH Snorlax, PH Cresselia or a Suicune) but they never pose a threat. There are 5 Pokemon that threaten me. 1 that is broken and can win by match up. There is A combination of Mold breaker, Grass, Dark & Fighting coverage that can threaten me. You can sit there all day and copy and paste your argument, it's not going anywhere.
Lcass4919
The Xatu Warrior
looking at the above team reminds me of a pokemon ive been using on my stall teams recently:
Altaria @ Altarianite
Ability: Keen Eye
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Boomburst
- Heat Wave/sub/encore/idk..this move is pretty useless tbh
- Roost
honestly...at first glance you ask what this has over gardevoir..and ill tell you: bulk+typing. this thing single handedly dismantles stall teams, and enless you run spc def cress, it will mow through all common unaware users:
252+ SpA Pixilate Mega Altaria Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 200+ SpD Cresselia: 181-214 (40.7 - 48.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ SpA Pixilate Mega Altaria Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Suicune: 258-304 (63.8 - 75.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Pixilate Mega Altaria Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Suicune: 190-225 (47 - 55.6%) -- 19.9% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
and just for show:
+2 252+ SpA Pixilate Mega Altaria Boomburst vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 297-349 (46.2 - 54.3%) -- 56.6% chance to 2HKO
+2 252+ SpA Pixilate Mega Altaria Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Registeel: 156-184 (42.8 - 50.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
+2 252+ SpA Pixilate Mega Altaria Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Heatran: 138-162 (35.7 - 41.9%) -- 87.5% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery(lmao what do you expect..)
altaria is a massive threat to ALL stall teams, since even their "wincons(setup sweepers)" struggle to beat altaria.
and now to awnser your raging question: why on earth did i chose this over garde. well...100 speed isnt all that amazing in the current teir...and gards bulk is seriously lacking. altaria fits well on a stall team, as it has niche resistances vs offense, and has enough bulk to at LEAST live a strong hit and revenge something. while garde is nothing but a liability to these type of teams. altaria is meant to stop stall teams from outstalling me, but its ability to tough it out on offensive teams really appeals to my type of playstyle. i might try garde anyways to see if its worth considering. but i digress.
Altaria @ Altarianite
Ability: Keen Eye
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Boomburst
- Heat Wave/sub/encore/idk..this move is pretty useless tbh
- Roost
honestly...at first glance you ask what this has over gardevoir..and ill tell you: bulk+typing. this thing single handedly dismantles stall teams, and enless you run spc def cress, it will mow through all common unaware users:
252+ SpA Pixilate Mega Altaria Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 200+ SpD Cresselia: 181-214 (40.7 - 48.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ SpA Pixilate Mega Altaria Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Suicune: 258-304 (63.8 - 75.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Pixilate Mega Altaria Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Suicune: 190-225 (47 - 55.6%) -- 19.9% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
and just for show:
+2 252+ SpA Pixilate Mega Altaria Boomburst vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 297-349 (46.2 - 54.3%) -- 56.6% chance to 2HKO
+2 252+ SpA Pixilate Mega Altaria Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Registeel: 156-184 (42.8 - 50.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
+2 252+ SpA Pixilate Mega Altaria Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Heatran: 138-162 (35.7 - 41.9%) -- 87.5% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery(lmao what do you expect..)
altaria is a massive threat to ALL stall teams, since even their "wincons(setup sweepers)" struggle to beat altaria.
and now to awnser your raging question: why on earth did i chose this over garde. well...100 speed isnt all that amazing in the current teir...and gards bulk is seriously lacking. altaria fits well on a stall team, as it has niche resistances vs offense, and has enough bulk to at LEAST live a strong hit and revenge something. while garde is nothing but a liability to these type of teams. altaria is meant to stop stall teams from outstalling me, but its ability to tough it out on offensive teams really appeals to my type of playstyle. i might try garde anyways to see if its worth considering. but i digress.
xJownage
Even pendulums swing both ways
I liked a good portion of this post until you said stall in general isn't that good anymore.i don't think you can say 'The (Almost) Unbeatable team' when you auto-lose to any decent mega gya (which is quite common by now) team :/ also you need a better check to protean mons like this:
Mence@life orb
protean
100at/156spa/255spe
rash
-knock off
-drain punch
-grass knot
-tbolt/toxic/Last Resort(this is for the lols)
which 1hko or 2hko your entire team and your best mon agganist it (goodra) can only hope for a scald burn
100 Atk Life Orb Protean Salamence Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0+ Def Cresselia: 299-354 (67.3 - 79.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
156+ SpA Life Orb Protean Salamence Grass Knot (100 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Suicune: 343-406 (84.9 - 100.4%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKOgif
156+ SpA Life Orb Protean Salamence Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Regirock: 460-541 (126.3 - 148.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
100 Atk Life Orb Protean Salamence Drain Punch vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 393-463 (61.2 - 72.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
156+ SpA Life Orb Protean Salamence Grass Knot (100 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Sableye: 172-203 (56.5 - 66.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
100 Atk Life Orb Protean Salamence Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 240 HP / 86 Def Goodra: 227-269 (59.5 - 70.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
The only thing the opponent also needs is a slow passer like this:
Chansey@eviolite
Magic Bounce
252def/252spdef
bold
-subs
-baton pass
-moonlight
-calm mind/work up
TL;DR : Your team is too passive, and doesn't have enough momentum to deal with powerfull wallbreakers. Overall, regen u-turn spam stall is better. Btw stall in generall isn't that good anymore.
a
He wasn't lying when you said you auto lose to any gyara that can set up. The problem is many variants run subsmash (including mine), and that literally obliterates your team if it puts up a sub; your only chance is to get off an encore, which is pretty predictable. I know i went over this with you before, but sub literally destroys your team since you can't break them with scald. Haze can reset the stats, but it can just SS again whenever since that requires you to sack the cune.
Also grass knot protean is a big time threat; it slaps a lot of common switch-ins, especially things like cune, regirock, etc. And yes, people still switch in suicune on protean.
Personally, if I want to break stall with a set like this, I prefer garde. It requires literally ZERO support to destroy every single stall team in this tier. The bulk is lacking, but most defensive mons hit on the special side, in which garde has very good bulk. You still have reliable recovery as well. from Garde, you are not walled by unaware cress, and can easily muscle past chansey after a nasty plot before anything else beats it.
Just posting for you guys here...
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/inheritance-227516225
Obviously there is no "unbeatable" team, lol, everyone would run it.
Don't use the team plz. I've been a stall player since ever but in light of these events i might toss all my teams and build some random Azelf+Diancie HO team or something. Always at least run a win condtition imo.
Also, I've been using that Altaria set on Gardevoir and it worked out pretty well. Most Unaware users can't stand a Boomburst and the things that can are easily set up on.
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/inheritance-227516225
Obviously there is no "unbeatable" team, lol, everyone would run it.
Don't use the team plz. I've been a stall player since ever but in light of these events i might toss all my teams and build some random Azelf+Diancie HO team or something. Always at least run a win condtition imo.
Also, I've been using that Altaria set on Gardevoir and it worked out pretty well. Most Unaware users can't stand a Boomburst and the things that can are easily set up on.
I said almost :) You could've just done it an unlimited amount of time just switching between your regenerator mons. Did you guys plan that battle or was is randomly on the ladder?
InfernapeTropius11
get on my level
You can tell it was on the ladder because of the fact that the ladder updated at the end of the replay.
Nice team, though you should definitely change Chansey's spread to the standard 4/252+/252. Your current spread only adds a tiny bit of special bulk:
+2 252+ SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Porygon Hyper Beam vs. 248 HP / 172 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 440-518 (62.5 - 73.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 252+ SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Porygon Hyper Beam vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 410-484 (63.8 - 75.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
In exchange for a ton of physical bulk (~50% more damage taken!):
252+ Atk Choice Band Porygon Giga Impact vs. 248 HP / 88+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 522-615 (74.2 - 87.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Porygon Giga Impact vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 325-384 (50.6 - 59.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Chansey's defense is so low that investing only a tad less in defense makes it take a huge hit to its physical bulk, and while ideally you won't be taking physical hits, it's still nice to be able to take them in general if you need to Metal Burst something for example. If you don't want to lose more special bulk 4/252/252+ is another spread which is bulkier on both sides of the spectrum than your current one.
I'll change it when I get the opportunity
At what point did this thread become an RMT?
So that this isn't a one liner, I still believe that Mega Tyranitar deserves a solid slot on the viability rankings.
Tyranitar @ Tyranitarite
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Stone Edge
- Knock Off
- Circle Throw
- Parting Shot
This set inherited from pangoro is an outstanding pivot and arguably the best user of the move Parting Shot. This Mega Tyranitar with its terrific typing in this meta and mixed bulk in sand storm, alongside its great attack stat even uninvested has proved to be extremely splash able and I use it on half of my teams. Stone Edge and Knock Off are very strong STABs with nice base power and the utility from Knock Off. Circle Throw again gives great utility as there are a lot of pokemon attempting to set up in this meta. The slow Parting Shot is one of the best scouting tools and gives so many free switch ins. Slow Parting Shot is just so incredibly strong and allows so many pokemon free set ups and clean sweeps.
Imo this is the best check to V-Create teams as it can tank V-Create like a champ, hit Fire types with STAB Stone Edge and is immune to Trick. Its typing also makes a fantastic check to Flying spam, particularly Talonflame inheritors.
In summary, Mega Tyranitar inheriting from Pangoro provides; A great flying and fire check, utility in Knock Off, Sand Stream, Parting Shot and Circle Throw (also being able to sponge Knock Offs is good utility wise), great mixed defenses, two strong STABs, and strong offensive presence even uninvested. Together these things make it an extraordinary pivoting tank.
The only things holding this thing back are its weaknesses to Fighting and Ground, and its lack of recovery. I'd consider putting it as high as A-, though B+ may be justifiable due to the opportunity cost of taking up a mega slot preventing the use of an incredible sweeper like Mega Gyarados or Glalie.
So that this isn't a one liner, I still believe that Mega Tyranitar deserves a solid slot on the viability rankings.
Tyranitar @ Tyranitarite
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Stone Edge
- Knock Off
- Circle Throw
- Parting Shot
This set inherited from pangoro is an outstanding pivot and arguably the best user of the move Parting Shot. This Mega Tyranitar with its terrific typing in this meta and mixed bulk in sand storm, alongside its great attack stat even uninvested has proved to be extremely splash able and I use it on half of my teams. Stone Edge and Knock Off are very strong STABs with nice base power and the utility from Knock Off. Circle Throw again gives great utility as there are a lot of pokemon attempting to set up in this meta. The slow Parting Shot is one of the best scouting tools and gives so many free switch ins. Slow Parting Shot is just so incredibly strong and allows so many pokemon free set ups and clean sweeps.
Imo this is the best check to V-Create teams as it can tank V-Create like a champ, hit Fire types with STAB Stone Edge and is immune to Trick. Its typing also makes a fantastic check to Flying spam, particularly Talonflame inheritors.
In summary, Mega Tyranitar inheriting from Pangoro provides; A great flying and fire check, utility in Knock Off, Sand Stream, Parting Shot and Circle Throw (also being able to sponge Knock Offs is good utility wise), great mixed defenses, two strong STABs, and strong offensive presence even uninvested. Together these things make it an extraordinary pivoting tank.
The only things holding this thing back are its weaknesses to Fighting and Ground, and its lack of recovery. I'd consider putting it as high as A-, though B+ may be justifiable due to the opportunity cost of taking up a mega slot preventing the use of an incredible sweeper like Mega Gyarados or Glalie.
I really want to know why Gale Wings and -atespeed haven't been banned yet. Stall users and balance teams with dedicated checks to birdspam in general might not mind, but the offense vs offense matchup in Inheritance currently boils down to nothing more than "who had more priority", "which lando-t won the speed tie" "who clicked stab pixilate espeed the hardest". On offense teams there is basically no counter-play to this stuff other than to run it yourself and pray you win the speed tie.
Right now this kind of priority spam is limiting teambuilding to the point to where I basically have to run scarfed Heatran or something stupid like Regirock on my hyper offense teams just to make sure I don't get 6-0'd. Banning Gale Wings as well as Espeed + Pinsirite/Altarianite/Glalitite would really open up more teambuilding options for offense and make the matchup a little more bearable.
Right now this kind of priority spam is limiting teambuilding to the point to where I basically have to run scarfed Heatran or something stupid like Regirock on my hyper offense teams just to make sure I don't get 6-0'd. Banning Gale Wings as well as Espeed + Pinsirite/Altarianite/Glalitite would really open up more teambuilding options for offense and make the matchup a little more bearable.
Probably because there will be too much to ban. Remember that there's Band/Life Orb Adaptability Espeed Ursaring/Braviary and Protean Fake Out + Sucker Punch or Shadow Sneak. Banning all of that will be no different imo. If there's no priority, it will be "who'll click Shell Smash or Geomancy faster" instead.
well most pokemon that are physically bulky preferly steel types can take those out.
There are Pokemon immune to regular Espeed, and Pokemon like Terrakion and Aerodactyl can be offensive checks to regular Espeed. This isn't true with -atespeed running around and fast Steel types are basically the only thing that can stand a chance on an offensive team. The Protean sets with multiple priorities don't bother me because they aren't ridiculously high powered. Sucker Punch is a conditional 80 that leads to 50/50 scenarios, Fake Out is 40 base for the first turn only, Shadow Sneak is 40, etc. They don't have the raw power of firing off a guaranteed 80 damage STAB that has no immunities and few resists, but hits plenty of good typings for SE damage and always goes first.
Gale Wings is the same thing except slightly more manageable. While it might not have as much priority as Espeed it has more base power and these users can actually hold items like Band and aren't restricted to a free Life Orb boost. The unfortunate thing is that you're STILL forced to run fast Rock/Steel types if you don't want to be 6-0'd.
If banning this kind of strong priority means setup gets stronger, I honestly wouldn't mind. I'd rather at least have the option to pressure my opponent and not give them the chance to set up than to forfeit at the team preview because the opponent has an Altaria/Pinsir/Mence/Lando-T on their team. At least in one scenario I feel like I can come out on top with good play rather than warping my team around the idea that if half my Pokemon can't take a Banded Brave Bird from Landorus-T or FakeSpeed from Mega Pinsir then I can't compete at all.