Itemize (Now playable on Rom!)

[Rumors]

Approved by Eevee General and The Immortal

Playable on the Rom server!

Welcome to Itemize! The metagame that toys around with neither Pokemon, moves, abilities, or mechanics, but rather items! And how might you ask? By simply removing the species restriction on all non-form changing items! Yes, your dreams of threats like Light Ball sweepers and Eviolite walls all come true here! And honestly, the premise is so simple, so it doesn't require really any more explanation than that.

Clauses
Standard OU Clauses
Species restriction on normal items are lifted*
Soul Dew is unbanned
*No, mega stones, primal orbs, and the like do not work on everything, only the Pokemon they're meant for. There's already a meta that directly does that and a couple more that do similar.

List of now-unrestricted items and their effects

Adamant Orb - Increases Dragon and Steel-typed attack by 1.2x.
Deep Sea Scale - 2x Special Defense
Deep Sea Tooth - 2x Special Attack
Eviolite - 1.5x Defense and 1.5x Special Defense
Griseous Orb - Increases Dragon and Ghost-typed attack by 1.2x
Light Ball - 2x Attack and 2x Special Attack
Lucky Punch - Boosts crit rate by two stages
Lustrous Orb - Increases Dragon and Water-typed attack by 1.2x
Metal Powder - 2x Defense until the user Transforms
Quick Powder - 2x Speed until the user Transforms
Soul Dew - 1.5x Special Attack and 1.5x Special Defense
Stick - Boosts crit rate by two stages
Thick Club - 2x Attack

Note that Plates' effects remain the same since the Multitype ability is what controls their effects on Arceus. Griseous Orb also does not turn Pokemon into Giratina.

So feel free to discuss what potential threats and dangers that might arise from these powerful items becoming available to all! And also weep for the things that will fall behind in this meta! Especially common and dominate things in standard or even many other tiers!

Also imagine Light Ball Mega-Rayquaza.

Also also, while I think the meta name is decent, am open to better suggestions. No, Almost Any Item is not a better suggestion.

 

[SpartanMalice]

Light Ball is easily a threat on fast mixed attackers like Azelf, and even on bulky ones. I kinda had a similar idea, but this is nice too. On paper it seems borken but I think the items may balance each other out.

Metal Powder on paper seems useless, and Ditto itself would be useful with Imposter Eviolite. A niche use for Metal Powder would be to cripple said Dittos with trick, however.

 

[Esprite]

Eviolite Ditto. It's not quite imposter Chansey... But it's what we have.

 

[tehy]

there's no way in hell the items balance each other out... stall is already struggling in OU; Light Ball versus eviolite is slightly more powerful than Life Orb vs normal walls (i calced this using a terrakion and skarmory, though obviously results may vary depending on the mons used). then factor in the lack of leftovers or other defensive item, the lack of life orb recoil, and the fact that Chansey gets no buff at all? gg.

that said, stall might be ok due to the fact that a lot of the meta will revolve around quick powder abuse...still, a strong light ball attacker or two could be enough to break it wide open regardless, so i don't feel like it'll get much traction in this meta

edit: deepseatooth and thick club are inferior to items that already exist so i'd drop them from the hide tag (even metal powder is just equal to eviolite, and worse in certain cases, so i'd drop it too). i'd also have 'stick / lucky punch' since they're basically the same item

 

[Esprite]

there's no way in hell the items balance each other out... stall is already struggling in OU; Light Ball versus eviolite is slightly more powerful than Life Orb vs normal walls (i calced this using a terrakion and skarmory, though obviously results may vary depending on the mons used). then factor in the lack of leftovers or other defensive item, the lack of life orb recoil, and the fact that Chansey gets no buff at all? gg.

that said, stall might be ok due to the fact that a lot of the meta will revolve around quick powder abuse...still, a strong light ball attacker or two could be enough to break it wide open regardless, so i don't feel like it'll get much traction in this meta

Light ball Salamence might be kinda broke, DD, then start killing, and getting Moxie boosts.

 

[SpartanMalice]

But think about it. Without Light Ball (although I suppose knock off exists), these stall mons would be dominant. It is essentially the same case with espeed in Mix and Mega, a neccessary evil.

Tornadus seems to be very versatile. With Eviolite, it basically gets 79/130/145 with regenerator, and it retains the ability to use taunt. Similarly, it can go offensive with Light Ball or a slight mix of both with Soul Dew. This is fun.

 

[Esprite]

Oh god, RIP offense, Eviolite Shuckle, and Cresselia.

Not even kidding here, omfg the bulk is real.

 

[Chopin Alkaninoff]

Oh god, RIP offense, Eviolite Shuckle, and Cresselia.

Not even kidding here, omfg the bulk is real.

Really? KNOCK OFF ALL OF THEM!!!

 

[Esprite]

Really? KNOCK OFF ALL OF THEM!!!

Switch to a justified Plate mon. Now what?

 

[Kit Kasai]

Oh god, RIP offense, Eviolite Shuckle, and Cresselia.

Not even kidding here, omfg the bulk is real.

Light Ball vs Eviolite. x2 Damage vs x1.5 bulk. Do the math =_=

stall is absolutely screwed, especially since offense has more opportunity to run knock off than stall does.

 

[SpartanMalice]

Plates are pretty much just a weaker Expert Belt, and it only changes Judgement. Unless, eh, Arceus is allowed and ditto uses a fighting/rock/steel type plate. With so much better options out there and the ability to use regular items still, I think the only use for plates would be to serve as a less useless Mail, but honestly, just opt for plowing through your opponent with power instead. Shuckle may have gigantic defenses, but it's movepool is still barren and lacks recovery, not to mention Light Ball doubles your offensive stats while Eviolite gives a weaker defensive boost, effectively making Shuckle weaker than before. Generally, Shuckle has improved, but so has the metagame around it.

 

[Esprite]

Strategy:
Step 1: Eviolite Cress
Step 2: switch into justified Fighting plate Lucario
Step 3: cause mayhem.

 

[DoW]

I honestly can't see this meta being anything but hyper offense, due to the way light ball just destroys every wall. Because of this, things I can see getting a whole lot better this meta:
Sticky Webs: with Eviolite, Shuckle remains one of the few mons capable of not getting 2HKO'd by every attack in existence, so there's a reasonable chance it can set Sticky Web and Stealth Rock while also threatening to knock off any light balls.
Priority: Light Ball Talonflame, Light Ball Espeed Dragonite, Thunder Wave Thundurus to stop sweeps are all a whole load better right now, and with only one DD it's perfectly possible for Dragonite to Espeed Sweep any teams not boasting Eviolite mons (which I can't see being particularly great considering how well Light Ball wallbreaks).
Fast Attackers: Stuff like Weavile or Sand Rush Exca not only still outspeed the vast majority of things, but now have the power to break walls too. Only the most dedicated walls will still be able to stop them, and they'll be very hard to revenge kill.
+2 252+ Atk Excadrill Earthquake vs. +1 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 159-187 (37.8 - 44.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO, good luck stopping it if it Swords Dances while you switch in though.
Moreover, one knock off and suddenly your dedicated wall is broken by the only thing it's there to wall. Some things I'm pretty sure can't be walled at all, or else have extremely limited walls that fall to a single knock off.
Knock Off: Like I said before, it halves attack and special attack or takes off the eviolte boosts and practically everything will be crippled by this. The only thing you can do is knock off before they do.
Lack of Megas: Honestly the boosts given just aren't that good compared to +2 attacking stats or +1 defensive stats. The only thing they really help with is tanking the knock offs that will be flying everywhere.

 

[I like donkeys]

I feel like an item clause should be in place to prevent, say, 6 light ball teams from becoming a thing. Seriously, that's all offense will be. 6 light balls, or maybe 5 light balls and a mega. Not only would a clause in general create more variety, but many items such as thick club and deep sea scale are COMPLETELY redundant, and an item clause would fix this.
Offensive teams would have to carefully choose which Pokemon to give the light ball, quick powder, etc. I think this option is way better than spamming 6 light balls.

Also

Strategy:
Step 1: Eviolite Cress
Step 2: switch into justified Fighting plate Lucario
Step 3: cause mayhem.

+2 252+ Atk Bisharp Knock Off (65 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Lucario: (53.7 - 63.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

 

[SpartanMalice]

Deep Sea Scale offers certain advantages. It reduces the amount of damage received from Foul Play for special attackers, which would be significantly higher with Light Ball due to a higher attack stat.

 

[Martin]

Just saying, but you did miss a few items from that list:

• Adamant Orb now boosts the power of Dragon- and Steel-type moves of its holder by 20% (originally Dialga-exclusive)
• Lustrous Orb now boosts the power of Dragon- and Water-type moves of its holder by 20% (originally Palkia-exclusive)
• Griseous Orb now boosts the power of Dragon- and Ghost-type moves of its holder by 20% (originally Giratina-exclusive)

I mean, they are all directly outclassed by Light Ball etc. but just for consistency's sake.

Anyway, I'll just say a few things that stick out to me.

• As I said before, the timespace orbs are directly outclassed by multiple items
• Light Ball is insane for a fast, frail 'mon. On fully specialised 'mons (i.e. fully physical or fully special), it is identical to Thick Club and Deep Sea Tooth, respectively. This is a godsend for mixed attackers. For fully specialised 'mons, I feel like it'd be down to personal preference whether you use Light Ball or Thick Club/Deep Sea Tooth.
  
• Quick Powder is really going to f*ck with the speed tiers. If you thought scarf already f*cked with them enough, just wait to see how a free, permanent Rock Polish boost without any drawbacks is going to f*ck with it.
• Metal Powder is literally identical to Eviolite on Pokémon without Imposter or Transform in their moveset.
• On strictly special walls or Pokémon which have an insane defense stat and comparatively lackluster special defense, Deep Sea Scale is probably a better option than Eviolite/Metal Powder (*cough* Steelix *cough* Avalugg *cough* Regirock *cough* Aggron *cough* (when I was looking up things with high defense stats, I discovered that Onix and Primal Groudon shared the same defense stat and that Nosepass has a higher defense stat than Ferrothorn))
• Soul Dew is nice for any bulky attacker, but is outshined by other items a lot of the time - most likely limiting it to stuff like Slowbro which have high special attack and defense stats (cause somehow I feel like CM users would prefer Eviolite/Metal Powder) and OTR 'mons.
  
• Stick and Lucky Punch are literally useless outside of being a better choice for Focus Energy 'mons.

Also I get the feeling that this has a f*ck tonne of potential in ubers as well (debatably more), but I can't wait to see the carnage that this will create in OU regardless. I can't wait to break out my OTR Soul Dew Reuniclus and destroy souls >:)

I feel like an item clause should be in place to prevent, say, 6 light ball teams from becoming a thing. Seriously, that's all offense will be. 6 light balls, or maybe 5 light balls and a mega. Not only would a clause in general create more variety, but many items such as thick club and deep sea scale are COMPLETELY redundant, and an item clause would fix this.
Offensive teams would have to carefully choose which Pokemon to give the light ball, quick powder, etc. I think this option is way better than spamming 6 light balls.

Good idea in theory, bad idea in practice. There are too many "clone" items for this to be viable tbh. Seriously, I don't think it would have any effect what-so-ever considering that there are effectively three quote-on-quote "light balls", two Eviolites and an item which completely breaks the speed tiers. Seriously, on a fully specialised attacker, I would much rather use their class-boosting item over Light Ball tbh simply because it means special attackers take less from confusion and Foul Play and because Thick Club has novelty to its use as well as being really freaking cool (ok, no practical improvement over Light Ball, but they are identical on a fully physical attacker anyway so...

On a side note, when I saw this meta's name, I thought that it was giving Pokémon a way to hold two items at the cost of their ability XD

One last thing. People say to use justified plates to deal with Knock Off, but they can only be retained if the holder has Multitype. Strategy busted.

edit: one option that we could do to stop Light Ball (and possibly Quick Powder) completely centralising the metagame would be to just ban it all together and make it so that you can only use either Thick Club or Deep Sea Tooth for your 2x boosting needs. Admittedly it would make stuff like HP Ice Landorus-T less threatening, but it'd be a way of balancing the item distribution a little.

 

[I like donkeys]

Deep Sea Scale offers certain advantages. It reduces the amount of damage received from Foul Play for special attackers, which would be significantly higher with Light Ball due to a higher attack stat.

Foul Play's damage is not dependent on the opponent's item. For example foul play would do the same regardless if the opponent had a life orb or choice band or not.
EDIT: What it DOES affect is confusion damage, although uncompetitive bullshit is often not discussed in situations like this.

Good idea in theory, bad idea in practice. There are too many "clone" items for this to be viable tbh. Seriously, I don't think it would have any effect what-so-ever considering that there are effectively three quote-on-quote "light balls", two Eviolites and an item which completely breaks the speed tiers. Seriously, on a fully specialised attacker, I would much rather use their class-boosting item over Light Ball tbh simply because it means special attackers take less from confusion and Foul Play and because Thick Club has novelty to its use as well as being really freaking cool (ok, no practical improvement over Light Ball, but they are identical on a fully physical attacker anyway so...

Sure, there are a lot of clone items, but at least those items would be USED. Having an item clause WILL provide more variety because you won't be able to spam 6 light balls and instead use the other newly-unrestricted items available, which is what this meta is all about. Also, after looking at it a bit more, there aren't THAT many clones. The only items that provide a +2 boost to an offensive stat is light ball, deep sea tooth, and thick club. This means a fully offensive team (under the item clause of course) would have to run other items like soul dew and quick powder, or perhaps even the basic choice scarf or life orb.
EDIT: Sorry i forgot you already covered those items :3

One thing i have been interested about lately, items that can't be knocked off when held by their respective users (Giratina, Arceus, etc), do their knock off-proofness translate to any Pokemon holding those items?

 

[Rumors]

Forgot about the Dragon Orbs, since I thought those were usable by everyone anyway and were usually ignored because almost nothing has the typing to use them outside their intended users. I'll update that. And also, that'd mean every Pokemon can become its Origin form! Except only Giratina has an Origin form, so that's a wash.

Second, item bans will be an absolutely, positively last resort since the whole point of the meta is to make them available and since there's so few to begin with, one ban could have very drastic consequences on the meta (or at least it appears so from the theorymon stage). I'd much rather prefer Pokemon bans if any become broken or over-centralizing enough to warrant it. Item Clause would also be a possibility if an item is over-centralizing, but let's wait and see on that first.

As for Knock Off-ability, Plates can be removed when Arceus isn't Multitype, so the same would apply here. Knock Off immunity appears to be a component of the dragon orbs themselves, however, so I assume they would still be unaffected.


Also, personally, I'm kinda seeing a Rock-Paper-Scissors thing goes on. Deep Thick Ball beats Metal Eviolite which beats Quick Powder which beats Light Sea Club. If you run 6x Light Balls, you might make stall players despise you, but you run a high risk of losing to Quick Powder users. At least, that's how I see it potentially happening involving those three.

 

[Martin]

One thing i have been interested about lately, items that can't be knocked off when held by their respective users (Giratina, Arceus, etc), do their knock off-proofness translate to any Pokemon holding those items?

Items which can not be knocked off when held by their respective users are usually to prevent form changes which should only be possible outside of battle. However, when held by another Pokémon, they can be knocked off. This means that plates can be knocked off if held by, say, Victini.

edit: epic ninja

 

[Mr155551]

Eviolite Regis and Eviolite Lugia :D

Edit: Oh and Eviolite Weezing i mentioned this in another place

 

[Lcass4919]

adamant orb and lustrous orb are both knock offable, even on palkia and dialga respectively.

 

[Martin]

Also, personally, I'm kinda seeing a Rock-Paper-Scissors thing goes on. Deep Thick Ball beats Metal Eviolite which beats Quick Powder which beats Light Sea Club. If you run 6x Light Balls, you might make stall players despise you, but you run a high risk of losing to Quick Powder users. At least, that's how I see it potentially happening involving those three.

I like this because it makes this game feel more like Fire Emblem's weapon triangle... It is also true as well. I mean, in standard, scarfers struggle more with bulky 'mons, bulky 'mons struggle more with wallbreakers and wallbreakers struggle more v.s. scarfers. It is the same kind of thing with Quick Powder, Light Ball and Eviolite.

Eviolite Regis and Eviolite Lugia :D

Edit: Oh and Eviolite Weezing i mentioned this in another place

But this is based on OU...

 

[Chopin Alkaninoff]

Metal Powder - 1.5x Defense and 1.5x Special Defense until the user Transforms

Hmm. When I /dt Metal Powder in ps, it says Defense is doubled. Can you fix this?

 

[Lcass4919]

Hmm. When I /dt Metal Powder in ps, it says Defense is doubled. Can you fix this?

its false. its a 1.5 on both defenses. it started in 4th generation, its in game description is incorrect.

 

[I like donkeys]

Also, personally, I'm kinda seeing a Rock-Paper-Scissors thing goes on. Deep Thick Ball beats Metal Eviolite which beats Quick Powder which beats Light Sea Club. If you run 6x Light Balls, you might make stall players despise you, but you run a high risk of losing to Quick Powder users. At least, that's how I see it potentially happening involving those three.

I am 100% certain that 6x light ball teams will consist of at least one priority user. Good luck with that quick powder of yours.