1. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

JAA Smeargle Strategy

Discussion in 'Archives' started by david stone, Jul 10, 2006.

  1. david stone

    david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming.
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Smogon IRC AOp Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2005
    Messages:
    5,150
    Mewtwo @ Scope Lens ** Tetragrammaton
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 216 Atk / 252 Spd / 40 SDef
    Mild Nature (+SAtk, -Def)
    - Ice Beam
    - Thunder
    - Selfdestruct
    - Shadow Ball

    The Special Defense EVs are to make it survive Kingdra Hydro Pump guaranteed (barring a CH, of course). Shadow Ball is to hit Ghosts, Ice Beam Groudon and Thunder(bolt) stuff like Kyogre. Selfdestruct when you're through, or, usually, on turn 1.

    Smeargle (M) @ Salac Berry ** Feargle
    Trait: Own Tempo
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Endeavor
    - Endure
    - Extremespeed
    - Spore

    Use Extremespeed in this mode of play, it helps against things like Rayquaza. Use Boom with Mewtwo and Endure with Smeargle. This will probably kill 2 of the enemy's Pokemon right there, but even if it doesn't, it means they most likely Protected, meaning they won't likely protect next round. After you Endure, Salac activates, making Smeargle very fast.

    Jynx (F) @ Brightpowder ** Equilibrium
    Trait: Oblivious
    EVs: 236 Def / 252 Spd / 22 SAtk
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Fake Out
    - Ice Beam
    - Psychic
    - Shadow Ball

    Shadow Ball is for Shedinja, who would otherwise destroy this. Psychic is for Gengar, as Endeavor doesn't hit Ghosts in-game (it's bugged on Netbattle). Shadow Ball and Psychic can be somewhat combined into Hidden Power Dark, but Hidden Power Dark doesn't OHKO Gengar, which is very important to do, especially if Gengar has 318 speed or more. The speed needs to be absolutely maxed for this, because of Rayquaza. Fake Out and Extremespeed have the same priority, so if they bring out Rayquaza after you Explode on turn 1, you need to be able to Fake Out before they can use Extremespeed, or they can kill Smeargle and ruin the whole strategy. Max Speed Jynx ties at worst with Rayquaza, and I originally had Quick Claw to push that tie in your favor an extra 12% of the time (50% of the time you lose, but 24% of the overall time, Quick Claw activates, .5x.24=.12). However, this was a very bad move! If Quick Claw activates during battle, then Jynx will Ice Beam before Smeargle Endeavors, so they will be left with 1 HP unless Ice Beam OHKOs. Brightpowder is filler. This surprisingly effective EV spread will always survive CB Rayquaza Extremespeed, and Jynx's role is to kill Pokemon at 1 HP, so special attack doesn't really matter. However, this might be too much for some people, which is why another EV spread is to run 16 Def / 252 Spd / 240 SAtk. The Defense is to survive non-CB Rayquaza Extremespeed as you Ice Beam it into oblivion. This is not recommended, however, as your killing power doesn't change.

    So, the basic strategy goes like this:

    1) Mewtwo Selfdestructs, Smeargle Endures.

    2) Bring out Jynx as they bring out whatever.

    3) If one enemy is faster than Jynx, Spore that one and Fake Out the other, otherwise, Spore the Pokemon least likely to be carrying a Lum Berry (since there is Item Clause, only one Lum is allowed per team). This means that one Pokemon is put to sleep, and the other flinches.

    4) Endeavor the Pokemon that is awake, and Ice Beam it with Jynx. Since you Spored the Pokemon that is faster, the Pokemon awake should be slower. Endeavor brings them down to 1 HP, and Ice Beam finishes them off, killing them before they do anything, leaving them with a sleeping Pokemon on the field.

    5) Repeat on every awake Pokemon, finally finishing off the sleeping Pokemon.


    In JAA, you can see your opponent's six Pokemon before choosing your four. Use this to your advantage! Put Kyogre or Rayquaza on your team (not Groudon, because EQ hits your ally) if you see Tyranitar on their team, and use Rayquaza with weather abusers (although they usually lead with their sole Rain Dancer, who dies to Selfdestruct).

    If you see they have a Rayquaza, things get interesting. If it's out turn 1, good, you can kill it with Selfdestruct. However, if they have it in reserve, play like normal at first. Selfdestruct and Endure, and then bring out Jynx. They bring out Rayquaza and a Pokemon. Since Jynx and Rayquaza have the same speed, it's a tie at worst, so you're almost certain to go first because of how rare a max speed Rayquaza is. Fake Out Rayquaza, spore the other Pokemon. Next turn, Endure with Smeargle as you Ice Beam with Jynx to kill Rayquaza. Continue as usual.

    A Ludicolo+Kyogre starter is quite possibly the most fearsome thing to face, if, and only if, Ludicolo has Fake Out. Ludicolo uses Fake Out on Mewtwo, and then no matter what Kyogre does, you're in trouble. If it attacks Smeargle, it's left at 1 HP and dies to Ludicolo next turn, unless you can pull off a double Endure (50% chance). If it attacks Mewtwo, things aren't as bad, I guess. Mewtwo dies, but Smeargle is at full HP and still only has a 50% chance of Endure working. Then you can do something like send out Rayquaza and kill Ludicolo, but I'm still not sure entirely how to recover from such a blow. If I ever see those two paired up, I simply would not use this strategy (which is why it's important not to use a joke 6th slot in things like these). A lot of people think that since you can only use 4 Pokemon per game, their team is made up of 4 Pokemon. In reality, all 6 are important. This only has 2 real specialized Pokemon (Jynx and Smeargle), so you still have a team of 4 without using them.
  2. Black Leather Jacket

    Black Leather Jacket

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2005
    Messages:
    1,466
    Uh...Why would you use those two in a tournament filled with ubers?

    As skarm would say "I predict a 1st round exit"


    ((just joking)) I'm looking foward to reading guide.
  3. david stone

    david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming.
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Smogon IRC AOp Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2005
    Messages:
    5,150
    It's up, at least all I have for now. I'll probably add more maybe.
  4. Toothache

    Toothache Let the music play!
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2004
    Messages:
    3,730
    Needs mention of Groudon/Shiftry leads, since Shiftry + Chlorophyll's speed dwarfs both Jynx and Salac Smeargle, heck it can even outspeed Mewtwo.
  5. david stone

    david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming.
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Smogon IRC AOp Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2005
    Messages:
    5,150
    If they lead with it, it's irrelevant, unless Shiftry uses Fake Out on Mewtwo, as Shiftry cannot OHKO Mewtwo, Mewtwo is faster than Groudon, and Smeargle is Enduring. Also, if I see a Shiftry/Groudon team, I'd use that 4th Pokemon, Rayquaza. I'll add this in.
  6. Jibaku

    Jibaku Not taking FS requests atm.
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Smogon IRC SOPis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Past SPL Winner
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2005
    Messages:
    6,127
    Might want to mention Persian and Sneasel as a Fake Outing options. They're faster than Jynx and can be useful for knocking out the foe if they have both guys speeding at 100+ base. While they won't necessarily OHKO Rayquaza, its not like Jynx will do much better, since Rayquaza could easily Protect on the second time Smeargle Endures and if Endure fails on the next, the strategy is dead. Jynx will get the kill on Rayquaza after Smeargle is dead, however, but it doesn't matter much.

    They both can use Shadow Ball to KO Shedinja as well. Gengar isn't really common here and from what I've seen Dusclops is more common, and neither Jynx/Persian/Sneasel would OHKO it anyway.
  7. Black Leather Jacket

    Black Leather Jacket

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2005
    Messages:
    1,466
    Swift Swim teams will always beat this [[
  8. david stone

    david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming.
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Smogon IRC AOp Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2005
    Messages:
    5,150
    Especially when a certain Pokemon survives Rayquaza by 1%.
  9. Callum

    Callum

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2006
    Messages:
    213
    How does Mewtwo get Selfdestruct? Is it an XD move or something? It doesn't seem to be either on Netbattle or on anything else.
  10. freaktron

    freaktron

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2005
    Messages:
    1,627
    Yes, it is an XD move. On Netbattle, find the Smogon NetBattle mod in your hard drive. Mewtwo should have Selfdestruct there.
  11. Yohbilly

    Yohbilly

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2006
    Messages:
    34
    Why Mewtwo.
  12. Mekkah

    Mekkah
    is a Super Moderatoris a Tutor Alumnusis a Site Staff Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis an Administrator Alumnus
    Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2005
    Messages:
    14,024
    Because it's fast and blows up before opponents can do anything.
  13. skarm

    skarm I HAVE HOTEL ROOMS
    is a Tournament Director Alumnusis a Site Staff Alumnusis a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Smogon IRC SOp Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis an Administrator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2004
    Messages:
    2,280
    I used Snorlax to Selfdestruct on my team in Chicago, with Persian as my Fake Out user simply because it was the fastest. I didn't realize Obi had used Mewtwo to Selfdestruct when I had decided, with Aeolus, that we needed a second 'mode' to our JAA team instead of just going with standard stuff.

    Smeargle (M) @ Salac Berry ** dog: dog
    Trait: Own Tempo
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Endeavor
    - Endure
    - Perish Song
    - Spore

    I went with Perish Song on the off chance something bullshit happened after the first two Pokemon died. After debating a bit with Aeolus we realized that Extremespeed was, at least, a rather useless gesture. I can't remember if you use it or not in Denver, Obi, but I don't really see a scenario where I'd need it. Perish Song actually saved Aeolus' ass in that first round disaster he called a battle.


    Snorlax (M) @ Quick Claw ** The Best
    Trait: Thick Fat
    EVs: 200 HP / 68 Atk / 140 Def / 100 SDef
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Body Slam
    - Sandstorm
    - Selfdestruct
    - Shadow Ball

    Like I said earlier I didn't know Obi had used Mewtwo to Selfdestruct. If you followed the 'politics' of JAA you'd hear some guys from Detroit who put up the JAA Detroit videos making fun of me because I didn't know Mewtwo learned Selfdestruct (apparently they asked me on NetBattle and I said it didn't, which I would have until I found out after Chicago that Obi had used Mewtwo). This worked well with the team regardless, though. Although I didn't use it anywhere at all, I should have gone with Protect over Sandstorm. I didn't even think about Protect on Snorlax as an option, but as Calvin Chan showed me in the finals of Chicago, it is a good idea. Sandstorm was a gimmick idea in case my opponents lead with Shedinja. Naturally Shadow Ball could do that job, but since anyone with half a brain would Protect turn #1 with Shedinja I figured this was a better option. I was also scared to a degree that Kyogre/Swift Swimmer leads would get the better of me, so I figured taking away their Rain would be a good thing.

    Now, you might say that this is a really, really, poor idea when I have Obi's Smeargle strategy going. I told you this team how two parts. I could use "Obi-Mode", which is what Aeolus and I dubbed the JAA Smeargle strategy (as Obi himself calls it), or I could use Sweeper-Mode, which is Snorlax/Mewtwo/Kyogre/Rayquaza. Specifically I was worried that heavy Rain teams would get the drop on my sweeper side (I was actually very worried about this) so I figured Sandstorm would help. Typically I just blew it up turn 1 even into double protects.

    Persian (F) @ Starf Berry ** Kelly
    Trait: Limber
    EVs: 156 HP / 252 Spd / 100 SDef
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Aerial Ace
    - Fake Out
    - Frustration
    - Shadow Ball

    Aeolus and I decided that speed would probably help more than Jynx. It didn't really matter. Either the sleeping Pokemon would wake up or we'd kill it. We believed Persian and Sneasel were cooler than Jynx anyway, even though I am a hardcore Jynx fan. Starf Berry for shits and giggles.

    Mewtwo @ Leftovers ** Timidry
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Spd / 252 SAtk
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Ice Beam
    - Protect
    - Psychic
    - Thunderbolt

    What I used as the fourth selected Pokemon in Obi-Mode. Its a standard sweeper since it is a key part of Sweeper-Mode. Obi used a CB Rayquaza. This Mewtwo is a lot more useful and I used it every single battle regardless.

    ~The Rest~

    Kyogre @ Shell Bell ** Seattle
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Spd / 252 SAtk
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Protect
    - Thunder

    Rayquaza @ Scope Lens ** Beijing
    Trait: Air Lock
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd*
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)**
    - Aerial Ace
    - Ice Beam
    - Extremespeed
    - Protect
    *I can't remember the exact EVs. This team file is before I added Ice Beam over Earthquake, which I would never use.
    **Ditto to the above point, except I am not sure if I kept it Jolly. I am pretty sure it is Jolly.


    Standard stuff. Out of curiosity Rayquaza did not faint in 5/5 battles I used it in. Persian did not faint in 1/1 battles. Just some random stats for your interest.
  14. david stone

    david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming.
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Smogon IRC AOp Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2005
    Messages:
    5,150
    I had Extremespeed to finish off Salacers, Groudon in particular, so they can't just Endure my Fake Out. I think I ended up using it once against a Salac Charizard.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)