Jolteon [4N] - Rain Dance

[les gets]

I've been testing this set for a while now, and it works quite well.

Hopefully what you will read makes sense, as I don't do many of these.
_

http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/jolteon

[SET]
name: Rain Dance Lead
move 1: Rain Dance
move 2: Substitute
move 3: Thunder
move 4: Baton Pass
item: Damp Rock
nature: Timid
evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>With its blistering speed, Jolteon can set up Rain Dance before other Pokemon can launch their first attack. Throw in its modest movepool, and Jolteon becomes an effective Rain Dance lead.</p>

<p>If you suspect a status move coming your way, Substitute can be used to prevent it while at the same time giving you at least one free turn to set up Rain Dance if you haven't already. When you're up against a slower lead such as a Metagross, Substitute is a great move to start off with; if it uses Earthquake and breaks your sub, you can either set up Rain Dance and faint to get out of the way for a Swift Swimmer, or you can Baton Pass out to another Rain Dancer that can handle an Earthquake, like Bronzong. If you feel the need to, you can use Substitute again just in case your opponent predicts you switching and decides to use Stealth Rock.</p>

<p>While Jolteon may appear to be inferior to Electrode as a Rain Dance lead, Jolteon has several distinct advantages. The most significant of these is Jolteon's respectable Special Attack stat, and while both get STAB with Thunder, Jolteon's 30 extra Special Attack points provide a significant increase in damage. Jolteon's respectable Special Defense and its Volt Absorb ability allow it to come back in later in the game to set up Rain again once more or even make a revenge kill. Jolteon can also Baton Pass out, which not only scouts for switches, but also keeps Jolteon alive for later use while not wasting a turn of Rain Dance.</p>

<p>Physical Scarf leads spell trouble for Jolteon and its lackluster Defense, but fortunately they are few and far between. If you decide to stay in and chance it, Aerodactyl leads speed tie with Jolteon and easily take it out with Earthquake, while Jolteon will fail to OHKO Aerodactyl because of Focus Sash. Bronzong makes a great Rain Dancing partner for Jolteon, solving many of its problems; Bronzong doesn't mind any of Aerodactyl's attacking moves and can easily 2HKO it with Gyro Ball, assuming Aerodactyl has a Focus Sash. Also, the power of Bronzong's Gyro Ball will increase greatly against most of the occasional Scarf leads you will come across. Ludicolo offers great support for Jolteon (and for any Rain Dance team in general) providing some useful resists, including Ground-type attacks.</p>

 

[MetaNite]

This is a pretty good set, and I like your write up.

I've been testing this set for a while now, and it works quite well.

Hopefully what you will read makes sense, as I don't do many of these.
_

http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/jolteon

[SET]
name: Rain Dance Lead
move 1: Rain Dance
move 2: Substitute
move 3: Thunder
move 4: Baton Pass
item: Damp Rock
nature: Timid
evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>With its blistering speed, Jolteon can set up Rain Dance before other Pokemon can launch their first attack. Throw in its modest movepool, and Jolteon becomes an effective Rain Dance lead.</p>

<p>If you suspect a status move coming your way, Substitute can be used to prevent it while at the same time giving you at least one free turn to set up Rain Dance if you haven't already. When you're up against a slower lead such as a Metagross, Substitute is a great move to start off with; if it uses Earthquake and breaks your sub, you can either set up Rain Dance and faint to get out of the way for a Swift Swimmer, or you can Baton Pass out to another Rain Dancer that can handle an Earthquake, like Bronzong. If you feel a need to, you can use Substitute again just in case your opponent predicts you switching and decides to use Stealth Rock.</p>

<p>While Jolteon may appear to be inferior to Electrode as a Rain Dance lead, Jolteon has several distinct advantages. The most significant of these is Jolteon's respectable Special Attack stat, and while both get STAB with Thunder, Jolteon's 60 extra Special Attack points provide a significant increase in damage. Jolteon's respectable Special Defense and its(delete) Volt Absorb allows(I think?) it to come back in later in the game to set up Rain again or set up(delete) Rain Dance once more or even make a revenge kill. Jolteon can also Baton Pass out, which not only scouts for switches, but also keeps Jolteon alive for later use while not wasting a turn of Rain Dance.</p>

<p>Physical Scarf leads spell trouble for Jolteon and its lackluster Defense, but fortunately they are few and far between. If you decide to stay in and chance it, Aerodactyl leads speed tie with Jolteon and easily take it out with Earthquake, while Jolteon will fail to OHKO Aerodactyl because of Focus Sash even if it attacks with Thunder. Bronzong makes a great Rain Dancing partner for Jolteon, solving many of its(keep it consistent) problems; Bronzong doesn't mind any of Aerodactyl's attacking moves and can easily 2HKO it with Gyro Ball, assuming Aerodactyl has a Focus Sash. Also, the power of Bronzong's Gyro Ball will increase greatly against the occasional Scarf lead you will come across(I'd just get rid of this sentence. A boosted Gyro Ball won't get rid of Jirachi). Ludicolo offers great support for Jolteon (and for any Rain Dance team in general) providing some useful resists, including Ground-type attacks.</p>

 

[les gets]

Made those changes (a while ago). Looking for some more feedback.

 

[Random Pizzaman]

The most significant of these is Jolteon's respectable Special Attack stat, and while both get STAB with Thunder, Jolteon's 60 extra Special Attack points provide a significant increase in damage.

Jolteon only has 30 extra points more of Special Attack, not 60. That would mean it would have 140 Special attack, obviously not the case

 

[les gets]

Jolteon only has 30 extra points more of Special Attack, not 60. That would mean it would have 140 Special attack, obviously not the case

oopsy

 

[les gets]

Just bumping for some final thoughts.

 

[franky]

It's iffy to tell you the truth (in the lead slot.) I can imagine it just unleashing Rain Dance and other than that it easily dies.

It looses to Metagross
You can't hit Swampert at all which means its going to set up SR or use Earthquake for OHKO
Earth Power from Heatran shatters you. (not sure if OHKO though)
Aerodactly has the advantage because of Focus Sash and can threaten with Earthquake.
You loose to Lead Lucario and Infernape leads.

I think it would be good outside the lead slot, it can force more switch outs and you can use Rain Dance on the switch. I think you can take full advantage of this set outside the lead slot, because its really not that effective. Its basically suiciding for one Rain Dance. I think Focus Sash deserves a slash because I myself would use Focus Sash instead of Damp Rock in this situation to survive an attack and scout out with Baton Pass or strike with Thunder or something. You think HP Grass deserves a slash in place for Substitute to surprise hit Swampert? I don't know what can status you (which is very rare nowadays)

 

[les gets]

franky, the goal is, not to hit every lead, but to set up quickly and get out of the way, saving Jolteon for later. I have mentioned how Jolteon can come in later in the game.

 

[franky]

franky, the goal is, not to hit every lead, but to set up quickly and get out of the way, saving Jolteon for later. I have mentioned how Jolteon can come in later in the game.

"set up quickly and get out of the way", the leads today will probably OHKO after you set-up. But then again I suggested a slash on Focus Sash so it can actually return later on. I actually think this is outclassed by Electrode. if you want to set up quickly without getting taunted Electrode would probably be best. The only difference is a stronger STAB attack which stands no chance on the other leads. Most frail leads carry Focus Sash. Electrode on the other hand has access to Taunt and Explosion. I';m not trying to bring down the analysis but I just want to know what makes this different from Electrode? Well anyways Ill just suggest slashing in sash.

 

[Blue_Tornado]

Hmm, I'm sorry if I tried to do almost the same thing, but I actually had approval that this thread is 'over' and that I can do it, since it lacks 'Team Options'. Well, now I've been confronted with a lock, and have been told to try to help here.

Here is a quote from my locked thread:

Ok, this is my first contribution, so wish me luck!

This set is used a lot today that I think it has it's place in the analysis. If the Moderators disagree, it at least deservs a mention in the 'Other Options' section.

http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/jolteon
[SET]
name: Rain Dance (or Rain Dance Supporter)
move 1: Thunder
move 2: Rain Dance
move 3: Hidden Power (Grass / Ice)
move 4: Shadow Ball / Signal Beam / Baton Pass
item: Damp Rock / Leftovers
nature: Timd
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
<p>An Electric-type immunity is very important in Rain Dance teams, and Jolteon has just that, along with blistering speed. These facts make Jolteon a decent Rain Dance supporter. STAB Thunder can break through the opposition, and is powerfull enough to force switches, which Jolteon can take advantage of as a free turn to set-up rain. Jolteon can also scare away common 'trouble pokemon' for Rain Dance teams, like Celebi and most of the bulky Waters.</p>

<p>Hidden Power is a given, but the choice of Grass / Ice is up to you. Hidder Power Grass means that Jolteon is able to hit Swampert as Hidden Power Ice gives you the Bolt-Beam combination. The last slot gives you several options. Shadow Ball gives you another form of coverage while Signal Beam allows you to get rid of opposing Celebi as well as hitting Grass types if Hidden Power Grass was your former choice. Baton Pass might seem like a weird option, but it can actually be a great move on Jolteon. Like U-Turn, it allows Jolteon to scout your opponents switches, and Jolteon will be causing a lot of them. This also allows for a Rain Dance abuser to switch in safely and cause havoc. For example, Jolteon will attract many Blissey and Tyranitar. Jolteon can then Baton Bass to a phisical Rain Dance sweeper such as Kingdra and Kabutops on the switch, as they will threaten them and might open up a possible sweep.</p>

<p>Jolteon is a great addition to Rain Dance teams as the synergy it provides with the most common Rain Dance sweepers can be a blessing to most teams. The common Kingdra can easily switch in on Blissey, a common Jolteon counter, while the only threatening thing Blissey can do is Toxic. After all, you won't find Blissey trying to Thunder Wave a Jolteon, and this fact can be easily taken advantage of by your teammates. One of the more helpfull combinations is pairing up Jolteon with Ludicolo, as Phisical versions can easily prey on the previously mentioned Blissey and Tyranitar, as well as the bulky Gounds that are likely to switch into Jolteon. Pairing Jolteon with Wish support by the likes of Vaporeon can give it much more staying power, thus allowing it to set-up Rain Dance even more. The great thing about Jolteon is that is lures in Ground types - easy targets for Rain Dance teams.</p>

<p>The EV spread is the classic 252/252 spread as usual, as Jolteon doesn't have a lot to do with his Defences. This spread suits Jolteon well either way, as it can be a great pokemon to clean up late-game on any team, and it greatly appreciates the added power. Damp Rock is the primary option for maximum rain abuse, but Leftovers is a reasonable option for more survivablilty.</p>

And I think that's about it. If any changes regarding the moveset, EVs or anything else on your mind is needed, feel free to mention it here.​

Maybe try to consider a set like this? It doesn't have to be a lead too, but just a supporter.

 

[Lord Liam]

Although Jolt is a kickass Pokemon, I have to agree that Electrode is the superior Pokemon in terms of Rain Support.

 

[les gets]

Although Jolt is a kickass Pokemon, I have to agree that Electrode is the superior Pokemon in terms of Rain Support.

Well it all comes down to the fact that electrode has taunt and a little more (needed?) speed, while jolteon has more / different options that allow it to come in later in the game, as well as a higher special attack. Once you witness the power of a STAB Thunder from Jolteon, you might change your mind. Sort of like the dark side of the force

if you could elaborate on that statement a bit, it might help me understand something I missed? :)

 

[Blue_Tornado]

At least consider my idea a bit. It's your choice though.

 

[Stellar]

Please don't bicker. Just work together to develop the set and write team options. I'm sure whatever you come up with together will be better than the individual products.

 

[Lord Liam]

Well it all comes down to the fact that electrode has taunt and a little more (needed?) speed, while jolteon has more / different options that allow it to come in later in the game, as well as a higher special attack. Once you witness the power of a STAB Thunder from Jolteon, you might change your mind. Sort of like the dark side of the force

if you could elaborate on that statement a bit, it might help me understand something I missed? :)

edit: I wasn't trying to be mean stellar lol

Elaborating.

Although 10 points of speed may seem unneeded, it gives you quite an edge when dealing with certain Scarfers that hang in the high base 70 area of speed. Also, 140 speed means it outspeeds Crobat and Aerodactyl which is great to have, as forcing a speed tie with these Pokemon may cause you some problems (Aerodactyl's Earthquake, Crobat's Hypnosis)

Furthermore, Taunt is arguably what makes Electrode superior to Jolteon in this position. Beating able to outspeed common leads like Bronzong Smeargle and prevent them from using Stealth Rocks and Spore respectively really makes it a key move to any leading set.

On a side note: I don't know why Focus Sash isn't listed on the analysis, Electrode has to hold one most of the time, and they are both similar in terms of bulk (Electrode has more defense and HP, Jolteon has more Sp.Def)

I hope you understand my argument better now.

 

[Blue_Tornado]

Elaborating.

Although 10 points of speed may seem unneeded, it gives you quite an edge when dealing with certain Scarfers that hang in the high base 70 area of speed. Also, 140 speed means it outspeeds Crobat and Aerodactyl which is great to have, as forcing a speed tie with these Pokemon may cause you some problems (Aerodactyl's Earthquake, Crobat's Hypnosis)

Furthermore, Taunt is arguably what makes Electrode superior to Jolteon in this position. Beating able to outspeed common leads like Bronzong Smeargle and prevent them from using Stealth Rocks and Spore respectively really makes it a key move to any leading set.

On a side note: I don't know why Focus Sash isn't listed on the analysis, Electrode has to hold one most of the time, and they are both similar in terms of bulk (Electrode has more defense and HP, Jolteon has more Sp.Def)

I hope you understand my argument better now.

I agree about the fact that it's outclassed by Electrode in the lead spot. But that's just it - in the lead spot. Jolteon is better off as a rain Supporter (like in the set I mentioned earlier) thanks to its ability and much higher attacking power (to help against bulky waters that curse Rain Teams). Me and Cost are talking about this now btw.

 

[ferron]

you should mention a move to put in the place of sub if you plan on have sash as a slashed item (thunder wave, protect, agility, magnet rise, etc.).

 

[les gets]

if more people agree about jolteon being better utilized as a supporter, then I'll update the write up accordingly (mentioning a lead option)

once that happens, or doesn't happen, I'll add in team options and make changes to the moveset, evs, etc. depending on what was decided

:)

edit: and if someone wants to help me test then don't be shy

 

[Snorlaxe]

I've been testing this set for a while now, and it works quite well.

Hopefully what you will read makes sense, as I don't do many of these.
_

http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/jolteon

[SET]
name: Rain Dance Lead
move 1: Rain Dance
move 2: Substitute
move 3: Thunder
move 4: Baton Pass
item: Damp Rock
nature: Timid
evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>With its blistering speed, Jolteon can set up Rain Dance before other Pokemon can launch their first attack. Throw in its modest movepool, and Jolteon becomes an effective Rain Dance lead.</p>

<p>If you suspect a status move coming your way, Substitute can be used to prevent it, (added comma) while at the same time giving you at least one free turn to set up Rain Dance if you haven't already. When you are up against a slower lead such as a Metagross, Substitute is a great move to start off with; if it uses Earthquake and breaks your sub, you can either set up Rain Dance and faint to get out of the way for a Swift Swimmer, or you can Baton Pass out to another Rain Dancer that can handle an Earthquake, like Bronzong. If you feel the need to, you can use Substitute again, (added comma) just in case your opponent predicts you switching and decides to use Stealth Rock.</p>

<p>While Jolteon may appear to be inferior to Electrode as a Rain Dance lead, Jolteon has several distinct advantages. The most significant of these is Jolteon's respectable Special Attack stat, and while both get STAB with Thunder, Jolteon's 30 extra Special Attack points provide a significant increase in damage. Jolteon's respectable Special Defense and its Volt Absorb ability allow it to come back in later in the game to set up Rain again once more or even make a revenge kill. Jolteon can also Baton Pass out, which not only scouts for switches, but also keeps Jolteon alive for later use, (added comma) while not wasting a turn of Rain Dance.</p>

<p>Physical Scarf leads spell trouble for Jolteon and its lackluster Defense, but fortunately there are few of them in today's Metagame. If you decide to stay in and chance it, Aerodactyl leads speed tie with Jolteon and easily take it out with Earthquake, while Jolteon will fail to OHKO Aerodactyl because of Focus Sash. Bronzong makes a great Rain Dancing partner for Jolteon, solving many of its problems; Bronzong doesn't mind any of Aerodactyl's attacking moves and can easily 2HKO it with Gyro Ball, assuming Aerodactyl has a Focus Sash. Also, the power of Bronzong's Gyro Ball will increase greatly against most of the occasional Scarf leads you will come across. Ludicolo offers great support for Jolteon (and for any Rain Dance team in general), (added comma) providing some useful resists, including one to Ground-type attacks.</p>

Just noticed some mistakes, though I think MetaNite stamped most of them out when he first proofread.

What is the status of this write-up?

 

[les gets]

Just noticed some mistakes, though I think MetaNite stamped most of them out when he first proofread.

What is the status of this write-up?

on hold / testing

everyone can let this thread die for the time being and I'll bump it when I update it

 

[Colonel M]

This set has been explained in this guide. For this reason, I am closing this (and any Rain Dance set) for now.