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Landshark in Love

Discussion in 'Past Gen Teams' started by Oddish On Fire, Oct 23, 2009.

  1. Oddish On Fire

    Oddish On Fire

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2009
    Messages:
    678
    Landshark in LOVE
    [​IMG]........[​IMG][​IMG]



    A Suspect RMT
    ____________________________________


    Description:

    I created this Suspect team from the remanents of my OU Team, but updated it for Suspect play, and in the process found an amazing partner for Garchomp, Baton Pass Scizor with Agility. Since all of Scizor's counters use a Fire Move, Garchomp is almost guaranteed to get an Agility passed to him, where he can Swords Dance. At +2 Speed and +2 Attack, Garchomp is unstoppable. As an added bonus, Scizor covers Garchomp's weaknesses. I have used this strategy to sweep through a large amount of teams extremely successfully.

    At a Glance...
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    ___________________________
    [​IMG]
    Betagross

    Metagross @ Choice Scarf
    Ability: Clear Body
    EVs: 80 HP/252 Atk/176 Spd
    Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Trick
    - Stealth Rock
    - Explosion
    - Meteor Mash

    Why Metagross is my lead:

    This is my custom Metagross lead that has served basically all of the purposes I have needed. It can cripple a starter, set up SR, and than explode, or I can Meteor Mash to OHK weaker pokes before they can even hit me. If I feel no threat, I use stealth rock and than have a reliable one kill with explosion later, and meteor mash provides a great stab that can sweep late-game. Trick cripples Crocune and Curselax. 176 Speed EVs with a +Speed nature let me run a slightly higher speed than base 115 Pokes. Out speeding Timid Scarf Heatran is pointless as I lack Earthquake, so I added some bulk and maximized Attack power.

    [​IMG]Metagross: No matter what I ALWAYS trick Metagross. If it uses EQ on me, I switch to Zapados or Latias, as EQ does not KO me. From there, I can proceed to set up either one of them. If it uses SR, than it is crippled and I use SR with no consequence.

    [​IMG]Azelf: Azelf is easily 2KOd by Meteor Mash.

    [​IMG]Swampert: I use the same strategy that I use on Metagross.

    [​IMG]Jirachi: Jirachi can trick me, because nothing will happen. Although Metagross does not kill Jirachi, it completely blocks it. I use SR first and then switch to an appropriate counter.

    [​IMG]Aerodactyl: Aerodactyl is faster :( But, Meteor Mash 2KOs and Aerodactyl can barely manage 50% percent with EQ.

    [​IMG]Hippowdon: Read Metagross.

    [​IMG]Ninjask: I SR and than switch to Scizor to Bullet Punch.

    [​IMG]Bronzong: Read Metagross.

    [​IMG]Tyranitar: T-tar is 2KOd by Meteor Mash.

    Synergy: Ground goes to Zapdos or Latias. Fire goes to Starmie, Latias, or Garchomp.
    [​IMG]
    Killowatt

    Zapdos (M) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Pressure
    EVs: 248 HP/76 Spd/184 SDef
    Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Thunderbolt
    - Substitute
    - Roost
    - Toxic

    Why this Pokemon and this moveset?

    Why not counter stall with stall? That's exactly what SubRoost Zapdos does. The combination of a stab thunderbolt and toxic provide great coverage. Toxic hits anything that is not steel, and thunderbolt hits that which is. After I toxic a Poke, I then substitute and roost until residual damage KOs them. Zapdos also provides a great check to Scizor, as it resists all of Scizor's stab moves, and can typically 2KO back with thunderbolt. 248 HP EVs ensure that I can switch into SR 5 times without dying, and the rest maximize my Special Defense while still keeping me at speed that most poke's do not run at. Also, when passed an Agility by Scizor, scarf users can do nothing against me (Garchomp) and PP stalling becomes incredibly easy.

    Synergy: Ice goes to Starmie or Metagross. Rock goes to Metagross.
    [​IMG]
    Starstruck

    Starmie @ Choice Scarf
    Ability: Natural Cure
    EVs: 136 HP/252 Spd/120 SAtk
    Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Thunderbolt
    - Ice Beam
    - Trick
    - Surf

    Starmie is my all purpose check for Garchomp, Salamence, Dragonite, and Gyarados, as it can outspeed and OHK any of them with a 4x super-effective attack, even after Dragon Dancing due to its' choice scarf. Yet, that's not all. Starmie also provides a great status absorber with its' special ability Natural Cure, and its' stab Surf is incredibly powerful. As an added bonus, Trick cripples the wall that always tries to thrwart it, Blissey. If I absolutely have to, I will cripple Curselax/Crocune with trick. The EVs make it so that Starmie's bulk is maximized, yet it can still OHK all of the listed threats. Since this provides my "defensive backbone," bulk is important so that I can switch into attacks more often.

    Synergy: Electric Latias or Garchomp. Grass goes to Zapdos, Metagross, Scizor, or Latias. Bug goes to Gliscor, Scizor, or Zapdos. Both Ghost and Dark go to Scizor.
    [​IMG]
    Lady Luck

    Latias (F) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 128 HP/252 Spd/128 SAtk
    Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Calm Mind
    - Dragon Pulse
    - Recover
    - Hidden Power [Fire]

    This beast works wonders after Blissey has been eliminated. With its' number one counter, Scizor, OHKd by HP Fire, not much stands a chance. All I have to do is switch into a special attacker and begin Calm Minding, recovering when necessary. The coverage between Dragon Pulse and HP Fire is only resisted by Heatran, who will be beaten if it lacks Explosion or Toxic. If I see an opportunity, I will also pass a speed boost to it from Scizor, letting me rip through its' scafed counters, like Garchomp.

    Synergy: Dragon goes to Metagross or Scizor. Ice goes to Metagross or Starmie. Ghostand Dark both go to Scizor. Bug goes to Scizor or Zapdos.
    [​IMG]
    Handgun

    Scizor (F) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Technician
    EVs: 248 HP/88 Atk/172 Spd
    Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Bullet Punch
    - Agility
    - Baton Pass
    - U-turn

    This set is the crux of my team, luring in its' counters, so that they can be destroyed by Garchomp. After an agility, Scizor is not going to be outsped, and it can pass its' boost to Garchomp, who will easily absorb the fire attack aimed at Scizor. Bullet Punch and U-turn let me pretend like I am running a bulky Swords Dance set, so that when I finally get the chance to pass an agility, they don't see it coming. The given EVs let me retain an offensive presence while maintaing bulk and enough speed. Here are all of Scizors counters, and how Garchomp can setup on them and then sweep.

    [​IMG]Rotom-A: Rotom is one of the best counters against Scizor for a great reason, it can outspeed and OHK with Overheat, while taking almost no damage from Scizor. Yet, after using Agility, Scizor can Baton Pass to Garchomp, who takes minimal damage and has time to Swords Dance. Rotom is then an easy OHK with Dragon Claw.

    [​IMG]Zapados: Zapados poses no problem at all, as it is OHKd after I baton pass my speed boost to Garchomp and use Stone Edge.

    [​IMG]Gyarados: Gyarados switches in, expects a free Dragon Dance, and then gets a suprise, as Garchomp is safely passed to OHKs with Stone Edge.

    [​IMG]Heatran: Heatran is my absolute best friend. It swithes in on Scizor as I use Agility, and then it is outsped as I pass the boost to Garchomp, who can safely Swords Dance and OHK with EQ.

    [​IMG]Magnezone: Regardless of whether Magnezone is wearing a scarf or not, I will outspeed it, pass +2 Speed to Garchomp, and take little to no damage. Then I can OHK it with Earthquake or begin to use Swords Dance.

    Synergy: Fire goes to Latias, Starmie, or GARCHOMP.
    [​IMG]
    Gargoyle V2

    Garchomp (M) @ Life Orb
    Ability: Sand Veil
    EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
    Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Swords Dance
    - Earthquake
    - Dragon Claw
    - Fire Fang

    This badass is my final sweeper, and a damn good one. At +2 Speed and +2 Attack, nothing is stopping it. If Sand Veil is activated, it becomes even harder. Earthquake and Dragon Claw collectively hit almost the entire game for at least neutral damage, with Fire Fang destroying Skarmory, Scizor, and Bronzong. I chose Dragon Claw over Outrage so that steels cannot switch in with almost no penalty, and after a Swords Dance, a weakened team can't stand up to Dragon Claw. Life Orb provides power over survivability, so lately I have to require on Garchomp less for synergy, and more for that final sweep. Yet, the power it provides combined with Fire Fang allows me to OHK Skarmory after SR.

    Synergy: Ice goes to Starmie or Metagross. Dragon goes to Scizor or Metagross.

    Thanks for reading! All advice is appreciated.
  2. Oddish On Fire

    Oddish On Fire

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    What is Suspect?

    For those of you looking to rate who do not know the difference between the Suspect and the OU Metagames, it is only a difference of two pokemon. Garchomp and Manaphy are allowed in Suspect, whereas they are banned in Standard play. Here are the links to the pages where these two pokes reside, so that you can understand their standard movesets. Since they are also massive threats in this playlist, I will also add how I deal with them.

    [​IMG]Manaphy- Manaphy gets a damn-near guaranteed kill against my team. SubGlow set requires me to sacrifice one Poke to break its sub and then I can revenge-kill. If it's not running a SubGlow set though, they typically try to setup on my Scizor, who they think is Choice-Banded. I U-turn out, doing quite a bit of damage, and then can kill it with ease.
    [​IMG]Garchomp- Starmie kicks any Garchomp's ass. Ice Beam is a sure-fire OHK. Against ScarfChomp, I typically wait until it kills one of my Pokes with Outrage, and then I send in Starmie for the revenge. Swords Dance without a sub doesn't provide me much trouble with so many pokes on my team outrunning it and then KOing. Sub-Swords Dance causes more trouble though, as it can set up on Zapdos with ease, forcing me to swith to Scizor to break its' sub. Typically, at least one of my pokes dies against Garchomp, and then after figuring out its set I can deal with it accordingly.
  3. franky

    franky
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    Solid team here. One thing I noticed is the amount of support your giving Garchomp but the lack of 'finish'. You've neglected to give Garchomp power to sweep efficiently late game. I would really like you to try out Fire Fang over Stone Edge right. Stone Edge does a max of 89.82% to Special Defense Skarmory, having around 15% chance of OHKO with Sr down (which is quite low). With Fire Fang, you hit 95.21% - 112.57%, a really high chance of OHKO normally, and a surefire OHKO with Stealth Rock down. The last thing you really want is getting Whirlwinded by late-game Skarmory, potentially removing both your stat-ups. By the way, those calculations applied Life orb. I highly suggest Life Orb to dish out good damage late game. You certainly don't need Leftovers right now and any form of berry, assuming you have Agility passed anyways.

    As for other options, I just don't like Scarfmie acting as a defensive backbone, which is unreliable for the most part. If you want to make the best out of checking Gyarados and such, go for a bulkier spread. Toy around 252 HP / 6 SpA / 252 Spe. Starmie really isn't sweeping anything and it should focus on adding more bulk to come in on Gyarados or even Salamence to a lesser extent. Even with small investment into SpA, it will still OHKO chomp, mence, and Gyarados since they are 4x weak. If your not satisfied with the EVs, balance out the EVs within HP and SpA. Something like 136 HP / 120 SpA / 252 Spe should work out. overall gl.
  4. Oddish On Fire

    Oddish On Fire

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    Do both spreads retain enough power to OHK Salamence, Flygon, Garchomp, Dragonite and Gyarados? If so, I would LOVE using the 252 HP, as its' lack of bulk really has caused massive issues. Regardless, I'll be testing the second spread with 136. Thanks a lot!

    Regarding Garchomp, I'm testing Fire Fang right now, but with Fire Fang I have trouble with Gyarados that switch in. I'll test it out and see if I can 2KO with Dragon Claw. I will be testing life orb too, but I'm worried about using Chomp before it's passed an Agility if I'm losing so much health every turn.

    Thanks for the great rate Franky! I really do appreciate it :)
  5. franky

    franky
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    That's with 0 SpA investment. As you can see Stealth Rock plays a big role, but you'll get it down for the most part.

    With 120 SpA, you really have a high chance as the lowest possible damage% you can give on these guys is 93.05% on Gyarados. With Stealth Rock down it should be no problem anyways. See which one you like better 0 SpA or 120 SpA.
  6. Oddish On Fire

    Oddish On Fire

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    Well, to be honest, I sometimes don't get Stealth Rock up, so I need minimum damage to be 100%. Therefore, I will use the alternate spread of 136 HP and 120 SpA. I'll be doing some damage calcs though to see the exact spread that I need for surefire KOs.

    Also, this is an update because I'm changing Starmie's spread, and I'm giving Garchomp Fire Fang. Thanks a lot Frank! My team has been performing much better.
  7. Sock Monster

    Sock Monster

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2009
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    This is a great team and i'm not pretending to be some OU expert but i was just wondering what would happen if your Garchomp got disabled and by this i mean hit by Will-o-Wisp on the baton pass from scizor.

    The only potential pokemon that could do that would be non-choiced Rotom who predict a switch after seeing the Agility boost.
    And seeing that Rotom is used in nearly every team, this could be a problem.

    Since Scizor cannot really do much against bulky Rotom or even non-bulky variants and Agility gives the Rotom far more of a reason to predict a switch/Baton Pass out as it does not power up Scizor's attack, Rotom could shoot off a Will-o-wisp on the switch and maim one of your pokemon or even Garchomp, the backbone sweeper of your team. Furthermore, there is no cleric on your team and Will-o-wisp could pretty much cripple anything bar Starmie.

    You could argue that you could Baton Pass out to something else to take Rotom's attacks but none of your team can really take Rotom's attacks except Latias which still doesn't enjoy switching in.

    Shadow Ball is SE against Starmie and Latias while Zapdos only has toxic to deal with Rotom. Even if you switch Starmie in on a Will-o-wisp, it is unable to KO Rotom while Rotom can hit it hard. Your best bet in this situation would be to use Metagross as death fodder, trick Rotom with Starmie or to simply stall it out with Latias who does not enjoy being burnt.

    Your best bet against non-choiced Rotom is a lot of prediction.
    One way to help with this problem would be to put Substitute on Scizor as it prompts Rotom to attack or gets you a free Sub (Use stealth rock to check for Lefties recovery and Sub/switch from there) or put a Lum Berry on Garchomp which only stops the first burn.

    Aside from that, it seems this team has not many other problems.
    (Why is there a thumbs down on my rate?)
  8. Oddish On Fire

    Oddish On Fire

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    Well, I suppose I should have written what I do against non-scarfed rotom. First off, I ALWAYS make sure it does not have Will-O-Wisp before attempting a Baton Pass. If it does have Will-O-Wisp, then Latias and Zapdos become my number 1 recipients of Agility. Latias only takes around 33% from Shadow Ball, which combined with the Burn is 45%%. Once you factor in Lefties, it's only 39%, which is GREAT for setting up. In this scenario, Latias will always win, as CM slowly reduces the damage I take. This is also great for my Latias, because then it cannot be paralyzed or poisoned, meaning that it will destroy Blissey 1v1. If their Rotom does not switch out, I end up at +6 SpA, +6 SpD, and +2 Spe. Thanks Rotom! If I switch to Zapdos, then I once again only lose 6% per turn to burn with lefties included. Rotom fails to do much damage against my Zapdos, and I in turn can Toxic and then Sub-Roost it to death.

    Sorry for the confusion based off my lack-of description.

    I'll add this to my description of Rotom :)

    Also, just so you know, this is Suspect.
  9. Oddish On Fire

    Oddish On Fire

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    Bump. Please rate.

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