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Discussion in 'Dragonspiral Tower' started by NixHex, Jan 27, 2011.
Really, what is the point of this thread other than saying Ledian has no improvements?
If only ledian got speed boost like yamma, mischievous heart like volbeat/illumise, it would at least be high nu instead of low nu
if only it got something like huge power lol even though i still doubt it could do anything
If it got Huge Power and an exclusive priority bug attack it still wouldn't be able to do much.
There's only one thing that could make this thing semidecent (if you don't count inconsistent since it's banned):
Ledian evolution will get huge power and 120 base attack and a 100 base power bug priority attack, and 120 base speed and it will have a mohawk, a light saber, a bazooka, and a 14 inch penis.
No but seriously, I am sure if it got huge power and an exclusive priority bug move it may not be super awesome but it definitely would play some interesting roles.
For now, as said, hes got this amazing move pool, nothing changed for him, and hes just going to encore and baton pass. One day, hopefully, he will get what he deserves (see first paragraph). For now, he is only low NU worthy.
I don't even think Ledian would need an evolution, just Huge Power. Considering what Azumarill can do with Huge Power and 50 Base Atk, 35 Base Atk isn't much of a decrease. 252 Atk EVs Adamant Ledian with Huge Power and Choice Band reaches 555 Atk, which is amazing. Sure, it would probably never crack OU, but it would work in UU, and even OU sometimes.
Huge Power even makes sense, since Tokusatsu superheroes often undergo transformations that give them greater powers.
However, I'm totally against it getting an evolution. Cross generation evos are always fatter, more disformed, and a different color than their pre evos. And 9/10 they are unnecessary and don't even help the 'mon move up a tier.
Uh... I dont know about that... Youre right about things like Dusknoir who is just barely better than Dusclops... and Lickilicky who is absolutely awesome but is outclassed completely by Snorlax.
But then... Crobat, Electivire (noobish but still has its advantages), Scizor, Mamoswine, Weavile, Gliscor, Magnezone, Kingdra, Honchkrow, Rypherior, Tangrowth, Togekiss, Yanmega...
Most of these guys love their evolution. They may not actually move UP a tier but they are necessary. Golbat would be NU/UU, Electabuzz would never be OU, Pilloswine would never be OU... a lot of these guys are what they are because of these evolutions.
A Ledian with huge power by itself would definitely be better for sure... but an evolution to make 55 base attack, and give him a better second typing, like fighting... that would be the ideal icing on the cake for the potential of his move pool.
As an aside, with huge power Ledian would have the equivalent of ~120 base ATK, which is quite good. I also agree with your cross-gen evo opinion. I never liked lickilicky or tangrowth, mostly because of their nasty cries. Gliscor just looks damn crazy, the others are I guess okay.
No mention of Reflect or Light Screen psuedopassing at all?
I forgot to mention Screen passing! Reflect would definitely go first, and Light Screen might help it set up some Agility/SD boosts. Definitely more useful than that horrible boosting gimmick set. I'll update the OP with that in mind.
Maybe we can get a little more on-topic here? Extended Evo's won't happen for at least 3 years, if at all.
Eh I'm going to have to take issue with a few of the so called "good" evos you listed. Magneton would still be a pretty good steel trapper in OU, and would probably still be in OU due to it being able to check many threats/ similar BS's to Magnezone.
Any of the evos from gen 2 I don't have issue with since gen 1&2 were conceptualized together, so thematically/ stylistically the evos look the same. A lot of the new cross gen evos are really nothing like their prevos, which just irks me.
My main issue is that instead of giving us, say, a new bulky ass normal type with a great movepool and cool concept, we get some bastardized fatass version of a preexisting pokemon (lickitung/ Lickilicky) with minor/ neglegible base stat increases that is still hampered by pretty much the same factors that stopped its predecessor being good. And, while I'm definately not saying all those prevos would be OU, a lot of the Pokemon you listed are outmoded only because GF decided to fix somethings that weren't broke.
Ledian was really fun to use in Soul Silver and I had no problems (thanks to fail blast). Such a pity it really can't do anything well competitively. If I were to use it then it would be the baton passer but I guess we'll just have to wait until gen 6 for an evo.
On a side note: Rhyperior was a totally uneccesary evolution barely improving on Rhydon's stats which is why both were UU in gen 4 not to mention it's ugly as hell.
The statement in my sig proves how shitty Ledian is. >_>
Awwwww snap. I sense the coming of Iron Fist, Mach Punch Ledian. Move over Breloom, Ledian's coming to town
This thread has inspired me to run a team with Ledian on it in some capacity. Poor guy deserves to see some use, God dammit. What's the consensus on Ledian's 'best' set?
Or Agility+BP. Or both, if you're really confident. Basically get some boosts and give them to something that can actually do something.
Does it have anything that stops it from being outclassed by Ninjask as a Speed/Attack BPer?
It's... better at taking special hits? It might end up in a different tier?
It has passable Special bulk, but mostly just the fact that it's in a lower tier.
I'm a big fan of 2nd gen pokes, and ledian is so awesome looking, so I came up with a couple of sets.
1: the end all of special walls
Ledian@ light clay
Calm max hp max sp.d
I don't care what your special attack is, you arent puncturing 110 Sp d + light screen + struggle bug. Assuming your opponent has a physical attacker left it'll be coming in so reflect and get out. Ment to be used with some sort of toxic support because with only struggle bug to do damage you're not killing anything that has leftovers before they crit kill you.
2. Some sort of bulky sd
Ledian @ some item
adament max attack, rest in hp/speed/whatever
1. Swords dance
2. drain punch
3. mach punch
4. Filler of some sort, probably a STAB option.
Obviously a work in progress. Swords dance takes your attack from aweful to dangerous(it's the same boost as huge power), drain punch is buffed and gets a boost from Iron fist. Mach punch is priorty. Idk what to put in the last slot to go with complement the fighting type moves. Flying/bug punch would be nice. :P
Forgive me Gen. Empoleon, this was a long time ago. Anyway, why would you use that bulky sd set when Conkeldurr does nearly that whole set but better?
I will bring the pain of ten-thousand fiery suns down upon you
that's mean gen
in all honesty SD could use ice and thunderpunch to get better coverage, but that's just me.
Because if you're using Ledian you probably aren't playing OU.