Let's talk about the gameplay design of Pokemon

Last night, I played DHR's modification of Fire Red. His intention was to make the game more balanced and harder and add more variety. Currently, it's only a WIP: the version I played was done up until the player leaves Cerulean City for Vermillion City. After playing up to that point, I had the same feeling I had when playing a lot of other Pokémon hacks that attempt to increase difficulty: that Pokémon games rarely actually become hard, only more tedious.
It is extremely hard if not impossible to actually force the player to use strategy and be creative to beat any in-game quest. More likely, the "strategy" used to overcome any obstacle is to:
1. Buy more healing items
2. Save and hope for better luck (avoiding crits/misses in the AI's favor, getting crits/misses in your favor)
3. Grind levels



As I was putting this to words in a discussion in #oi, I realized that a lot of design choices in Pokémon can be argued as very poor if you look at it from a certain perspective. It's important to note that this does not mean that I think Pokémon games are all bad (I love them!). However, I'm sure you can all see that Pokémon games are generally not all that difficult, and trying to come up with a way to make them harder will only result in the players resulting into using one of the above "strategies". I consider them cop-outs more than strategies.

Let's look at Pokémon games from a perspective of a game designer who seeks to make a game where the player:
- Needs to use strategy to beat the opponents
- Cannot make use of the above cop-outs to compensate for lack of strategy

If at this point you're thinking: "I enjoy Pokémon games the way they are and wouldn't change a thing!", then this thread might not be for you.

Here's a proper outline of the problems present in the Pokemon games.

The Pokemon Center Problem
See if you can beat 5, 6, 7 or whatever amount of Trainers in a row! Think you got what it takes? If not, feel free to walk all the way back to the Pokémon Center inbetween battles, and you'll be fine. Healing at a Pokémon Center comes at no cost at all to the player other than his precious time. Pokemon Centers are obviously meant to be safe heavens, and there's a certain comfort to knowing that you can always get back to fresh.



But what they also do is devalue a player's ability to conserve health and PP over the course of multiple battles, and take away the option of increasing difficulty by placing multiple trainers in a row. I'm sure all of you remember the dungeons in the Black and White games being a lot less tough once you've found the neighbourhood doctor.

Items are too good
Oh boy, I didn't expect Cynthia's Garchomp to actually have Earthquake. RIP, Lucario. I'll just send in my Bidoof, Revive Lucario, maybe Hyper Potions if needed, and go at it again. OMG Cynthia how dare she use a Full Restore, so frustrating and unfair, NGGGH!

There's a reason link battles do not allow items: they are completely ridiculous. The ability to bring your Pokemon back from being fainted (even with full health if you're willing to use a Max Revive), heal 200 HP or more in one shot and maybe even get rid of their status conditions in the process is invaluable. And let's not forget the X-items that, in combination with healing items, basically give every Pokemon a status boosting move.

This issue is compounded by the fact that while some of these items don't "look" cheap ($300 for a glass of Lemonade? I'll pass!), we usually have a lot of money to work with.

Wild Pokémon, and therefore EXP, are in infinite supply
The concept of grinding is as old as any game with EXP, I'm sure. If you can't beat the big bad Gym Leader, you can always just have to beat 1000 Pidgeys and try again. Your level is only limited by your patience. Given enough time, any Pokemon can become the very best, like no one ever was (except perhaps a Thick Fat Azumarill against the Hoenn Elite Four).

This issue is of course only a big one in combination with the Pokemon Centers. In challenge runs that restrict or forbid the use of a Pokemon Center, such as this, a limit is placed on the amount of grinding the person can do. Note that this particular run does it anyway: he trains his Squirtle by catching a bunch of wild Spearow, finding Metapod and Kakuna in Viridian Forest and uses the known switch-in-and-out strategy to train Squirtle without wasting its PP.

There are of course more problems, but these are the ones that came to mind first.

That's great, we've found the problems. Now how can we solve them?

I don't know for sure, but I have some ideas. Here are some that I don't like:
- Make enemies have higher levels / better movesets
This is what most Pokémon hacks do, and unfortunately, what this does is make the player resort to the cop-outs above. Some people enjoy this kind of a challenge, but I personally do not.

- Make healing cost money / Give the player less money
The reason I don't like this kind of solution is because it makes the game a bit scary to play. You can get yourself stuck in a spot where you can't win anymore because you might need a certain amount of items or healing to get past a certain point. It might turn the game into one where you have to trial-and-error on your first playthrough, and then everything from there becomes a cakewalk.

Here is a "hack idea" with changes that, in theory, solve the above problems. They might not create the Pokemon experience everyone is looking for, as they differ so much from what makes Pokemon Pokemon...but remember, that's not our main goal!

Turn the game into a giant Battle Tower

This means that every battle adopts Battle Tower rules, which has the following consequences:
1. Players cannot use items during battle
2. Players are automatically fully healed between battles
3. All Pokémon are at a certain level and do not gain EXP
4. Enemies are set to a certain level as well

You would still have your usual overworld nature adventure as usual, but you do not go through a progress of training. Instead, you could gradually increase the level that the battles take place at, and with that the complexity of both the player's and opponent's movesets. Instead of leveling up, the player's Pokemon would gain new moves through TMs, move tutors and other events whenever the designer deems it balanced.

This makes the game flow a lot more predictable, as the game designer knows exactly what the player has access to at any point of the game. Of course, this system will reduce replay value and makes skippable battles entirely redundant, as there's no feeling of accomplishment whenever a player's Pokemon levels up.

I hope I've explained my points properly. Please use this thread to discuss Pokemon and game design, any problems in the Pokémon games and any (theoretical) solutions you might have to these problems!

tl;dr Nope just read my post.
 
If at this point you're thinking: "I enjoy Pokémon games the way they are and wouldn't change a thing!"
Let's just assume for a moment that literally everyone who sees this thread loves the games (after all, how else would they end up here, of all places, if they didn't).

I think there's a pretty fundamental difference between agreeing with this statement and disagreeing with your post. These games (the actual pokemon games) won't ever be, and shouldn't ever be, too difficult for a 10 year old to beat. The people here, who are (ostensibly) adults, are not the target audience and are not the main customers either. The actual games should not present a challenge to us to beat without imposing bizarre restrictions such as the Blue version run you mentioned.

That being said, I basically agree with everything you mentioned, as long as it's applied to fan-made hacks. Cranking up all the levels of opposing trainers monsters doesn't actually make it harder, just longer (and in my opinion, worse). That being said, it's pretty tough to actually increase the AI in any way other than giving them spammable moves that cover lots of types or higher levels. The AI doesn't really understand when it does or doesn't have a safe turn, good opportunities to set-up, what useful non-STAB moves something might have (even when their Pokemon has the same moves)... The only way I can think of to actually make the games more challenging is to find some way to actually improve the AI.

I similarly see (way) more flaws than benefits to try and change how Pokemon Centers work. You could place fewer of them/makes routes longer, but making it harder to get back to them wouldn't fix it and charging a fee wouldn't either. I can't think of any way to actually change that for the better.

The multiple Battle Tower idea is neat, I guess, as long as it's really only used for Gyms (or even just the Elite 4). I actually think that most every hack really misses out by not including more Battle Frontier elements. The various Frontiers had several great implements and the fact that (some of them) still had novelty to reach the Frontier Brains even in post game was excellent design. Obviously, you would want a bit less time investment if it was incorporated into the mainline game (I have to beat 50 trainers in a row before I can leave this stupid place? What!?), but scale it back and it would make things way more fun.

I don't think that overworld use of items should be limited. It's uncontrolled circumstances out there. If anything, I think that item usage should rise drastically by the gang-AI. They're supposed to be national threats, and criminals who (don't play by the rules). I get that designers want to introduce the gangs quickly enough to have you keep them in mind the whole time, but I don't think anyone ever is going to be worried about some jerkbag with a level 10 zigzagoon (except Mr. Briney). If anything, you should be prevented from facing them by circumstance until you have 3 or 4 badges and are 'accepted' as an above average trainer. Other trainers should use items more often too. In fact, gym leaders should be the least likely to use items. Those are 'controlled circumstances' as far as the world goes. Nobody should be able to use items during any battle in a gym. I also think that gyms, like frontier areas, should be run as a gauntlet. If you can't make it to the gym leader without leaving, you aren't strong enough to 'defeat the gym.'

So, all my ideas can really be theorized as 'create more realistic AI,' : have the characters behave the way they talk like they behave, separate battling rules into controlled and uncontrolled circumstances, and make the 'good battlers' have more sophisticated AI. Now, obviously, this is far and away the most difficult way to fix things, but I can't think of a better way in the long run.
 
I definitely agree with a smarter and more strategic AI, especially for the Elite 4. While I can understand Gym Leaders specializing in types to show everyone what types are, I think that honestly the Elite 4 are just glorified Gym Leaders at the moment – you just bring in a 'mon with a super effective move to win most of the time. Having each E4 member have an actual team with strategy and good AI would be amazing.

Secondly, healing at Pokémon Centers. I don't think that this is a bad thing, necessarily. However, there definitely should be more circumstances that prevent you from moving backwards for a time: imagine if the doors to the Team Flare Secret HQ shut as soon as you entered, preventing you from healing. (There would probably be an auto-heal before the Lysandre/legendary fights, though.)

Items are of course a major thing, as if opponents used items like Revives for balance, then the game would become much more annoying. I can think of a few options: perhaps have an 'item limit' in battle that only allows you to bring in 2 Revive-like items and 3 healing items. A Wonder Launcher-esque system in every battle might also work, especially if both sides can use it. Finally, a more restricted bag size might also be helpful, although any bag size restrictive enough to cause a major difference in a single battle would just be annoying.

Finally, Gym Leaders should scale with Pokémon, moves, and items based on the level of the highest Pokémon on your team. If I grind in the wild until I'm level 30 before fighting Viola, that's all well and good for the puny trainers (there should be at least some benefit), but I should be prepared for Viola to pack a 4-Pokémon team all around level 30, each pretty strong.
 

Layell

Alas poor Yorick!
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I want to add that the switch/set mechanic is probably the most player preferential broken mechanic that has ever existed, the game becomes much more difficult when you can't switch whatever the opponent switches in before they actually switch in their next mon.

In many ways Colloseum and XD might just be harder games because the amount of grinding you can do is sort of limited to tournaments, every catch is really important because it takes a while longer to recatch things, and not to mention Doubles is often more unforgiving than singles due to how much destruction can occur. A game hack that cuts the shop and limits items to only ones you find might be very challenging, a cost for the Pokemon Centre however minimal would also give a ton of tension. It's really crazy how much the cult of nuzlocke and other such challenges have been necessary in order to make the games actually difficult.
 
I think that the main problems are AI and items. The AI is incredibly dumb; while they have gotten somewhat better, they're still laughable. To increase the difficulty of a Pokemon game, increasing the intelligence of the AI is first and foremost. Being able to switch out when they send out a Pokemon doesn't do any favors for the difficulty either. Items compound this problem; regardless of how much smarter or stronger the AI is compared to you, intelligent item use can almost always override it.
Pokemon Centers don't seem like a problem to me. The Battle Tower idea in the OP has automatic healing after every battle, so it doesn't seem to me like it would hurt anything to keep them in the game and free.
Grinding, to me, is the tough one. I love the feeling of progression at my own pace. If I want one of my Pokemon to be horrifically overleveled, then I damn well should be able to make it that way. By contrast, the flat scaling idea in the OP has no appeal to me at all. I love being able to level at my own pace, but then you run the risk of overleveling everything and just blazing through the game.

My solution would go like this: Items, if usable at all in trainer battles, would be limited to one or two per match. Gyms and the Elite Four would be no-item zones. The AI would be considerably smarter, using actual strategies with a variety of Pokemon. Their levels would scale with yours, but only to the average level of your team; that way, a balanced team would have a nice challenge, while people who want to speedrun the game could just overlevel one Pokemon and blaze through it if they so desire.
Of course, this would only be an idea for a Challenge Mode or some similar thing in a game; after all, the games are intended for kids, so there still has to be a way for them to play through it.
 
Pokemon is an RPG, not a turn-based strategy game. People, generally, don't play RPGs for the challenge, they play them for the story, the immersiveness of the world, or, in Pokemon's case, that feeling of "I'll just do one more thing before I stop playing". In fact, if you made the game harder, it would have the adverse effect that suddenly you could only use good in-game Pokemon successfully, rather than any Pokemon you liked, thereby taking away a player's freedom and the idea of "winning with your favourites."

Anyway, I'm sure you knew all that. The battle facilities have been getting better, and the mechanics are certainly sophisticated enough to create an impossible-to-master metagame, but you would have to improve the AI to make it truly interesting. Perhaps the AI could be improved if it were fed data from actual human versus human battles? For example, a good AI might observe that players will generally switch in Skarmory or Togekiss versus an opponent's Garchomp, and could be taught to copy that sort of behaviour. You would never be able to capture the psychology of competitive battling (if you don't believe that such a concept is utter bullshit, anyway), because computers don't do psychology, but it would certainly be interesting.
 

Age of Kings

of the Ash Legion
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
The best solution, to appeal to everyone, would be implementing various difficulty levels. Almost every single RPG nowadays implemented this. They tried it in BW2....but I am completely baffled as to why it wasn't unlocked at the start unless you knew someone in-person with Black 2 who could give you the key. As is, Colosseum is the closest thing to a hard Pokemon game.

Also, my favorite Pokemon is banned in nearly every tier and only able to be caught after you beat the E4, so I have literally no sympathy for anyone who cries about not being able to use their favorites.
 
You're right, difficulty levels would be amazing for this. It would allow newer players to get in the game while letting seasoned players have more of a challenge. (And I agree that that key system was totally useless... player interaction is great and all, but it seems to be purposefully downgrading the game quality without it.)

Edit: Difficulty levels would probably affect some of the things I outlined in my previous post. Better AI with more strategy, more no-heal zones, item restrictions, gym leader level scaling, etc. This also brings up the issue of the XY Experience Share: honestly, I think it's a good development in that it decreases grinding. It would probably be nerfed at higher difficulty, though.
 
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How do you implement difficulty levels though? Any difficulty through raised Pokemon levels and better enemy movesets/AI can just be circumvented with more grinding. That's not difficulty, that's grinding.
 
How do you implement difficulty levels though? Any difficulty through raised Pokemon levels and better enemy movesets/AI can just be circumvented with more grinding. That's not difficulty, that's grinding.
The best way to circumvent grinding, IMO, is to make the opponents scale with your level. That way, you get to maintain the feeling of progression due to your own work, rather than simply saying, "Okay, you made it here, all your pokemon are this level now". At the same time, scaling opponent levels would circumvent a lot of grinding's effects, since the only real improvement you would get would be a larger movepool.
 
Pokemon is a game aimed at young kids; they're the major audience. The competitive scene, IV breeding, and battle maison are more than enough for us "big kids", I would think. Besides, appealing to the young, consumption-heavy audience allows Game Freak and Nintendo to actually sell these games and make enough money to keep them going as long as they have. For me, I would like if the games were harder, sure, and I know a lot of you would agree, but they have to be the way that they are to be accessible to ALL ages, and especially so to the huge number of young kids buying this game. This also applies to the anime; I would watch it if it was more mature and had more depth, but I don't actually WANT it to be that way. The anime gets the new generation interested much more efficiently.
Go play a nuzlocke, people.
 
You know, I want to say that Colosseum was the most difficult "main series" Pokemon game, and I think its difficulty was done right. You guys are right when you say that most "mods" just increasing the grinding and that's it. I think Colosseum did the "difficulty" part so well because you had a limited amount of Pokemon to catch and experience was harder to get. Double battles could result in several losses(especially if you're nuzlocking), and it just required more strategy than the other games. It's one of the reasons why I love it more than the other non-handheld Pokemon games.

With that said, I just don't think that making the whole game a "Giant Battle Tower" would work so well. I mean, one of the main things about Pokemon is watching your team grow in levels. As you mentioned, that would just reduce replay value a lot. The Battle Tower was designed as a post-game challenge in mind, it's designed to be a challenge after you've made your full team. I just don't see how that could really work well as the entire game.
 
I assume that you aren't suggesting that we be unable to catch our own Pokémon... maybe as a special mode, but to be honest the Battle Maison gets boring fast and I wouldn't want the entire game like that.
 
To be perfectly fair, a Battle Factory run would be the coolest thing ever. I just don't want any of that AI hax shit.
It would be fun, but as I've been painfully learning for the past two years, you can't do the factory without AI hax. :(

Also yeah, it would be a rather bland cycle as nitrox said.
 

DHR-107

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I was actually talking to Mekkah about this getting feedback about my hack, that's where it all came about from. We were trying to work out a way that wasn't grindy but wasn't boring. That's where the battle frontier style game came from. It certainly would be a totally different way of playing Pokemon. We even brought it right down to the point where the only Pokemon you had available would be extremely limited to just gifts or limited wild Pokemon.

This would allow the designer to specifically make threats that you would have to play around. The issue with this though as most people have pointed out is the terrible AI the game can sometimes throw at you. While I was fiddling with the trainer data for my hack, I found out that setting the AI to Elite 4/Champion levels does *significantly* change their behaviour of there is a way out of getting hit by an attack. For example, one of Misty's Pokemon has Water Absorb as an ability, and she would consistently switch that in against Water moves aimed at one of her other Pokemon. She would also switch said Pokemon into Electric moves due to a type immunity. So I think the baseline AI is there.

The best solution, to appeal to everyone, would be implementing various difficulty levels. Almost every single RPG nowadays implemented this. They tried it in BW2....but I am completely baffled as to why it wasn't unlocked at the start unless you knew someone in-person with Black 2 who could give you the key. As is, Colosseum is the closest thing to a hard Pokemon game.

Also, my favourite Pokemon is banned in nearly every tier and only able to be caught after you beat the E4, so I have literally no sympathy for anyone who cries about not being able to use their favorites.
Just worth mentioning here, I thought Challenge Mode in BW was actually really interesting. Especially throwing Grimer in with Mud Slap for Roxie totally screwing over Magnemite in the process. It was a really nice way of adding a little bit of challenge seeing as Magnemite was really close and walled the whole gym otherwise.
 
Mekkah, have you played Pokemon Crystal World? It's a weird hack to be honest; but maybe it's the thing you're looking for and I feel it's more challenging than Showderp (I like how some portions of the game require excellent teamwork to overcome some VERY big troubles where grinding can't help unless you're masochistic, or playing the stealth game with those trainers).

In a self-imposed or Gamefreak given challenge mode there are two things that I believe will help tremendously: first a mix of Dark Souls' and the original Final Fantasy's restrictions in "caves". You can't heal in caves outside of using rare/expensive healing items and if you dare to step out of the cave or use an Escape Rope, you will find out that every trainer there have healed their Pokemon too. This can be carried to a whole other level by heavy usage of Pressure Pokemon, Spite, Grudge and Destiny Bond. Maybe also throw in some nuke Pokemon trainers from Crystal World on some side paths to resemble Black Knights, I don't know. This will hurt the "security" of bonfires Pokemon Centers and will make PP/item management actually needed.

The second important idea I have is making money an actually scarce resource, even if it's only until facing Elite Four. So goodbye Vs. Seeker, goodbye Battle Chateau and Restaurants. When money is scarce, unless you really don't like catching Pokemon with fancy balls or wearing nice clothes, paying 2000$ for that Full Restore will really hurt your budget and the powerful item problem you've mentioned will go away by itself.

Level scaling should also be done to some level, but I'm not sure which. Scaling important trainers with respect to the highest level Pokemon seems to be the best method for punishing raising only one Pokemon to absurd levels and rewarding actually balanced teams.

There's also one more problem I want to mention, the linearity of the gyms. It was actually a good idea in Red/Blue, where Bulbasaur/Squirtle/Charmander resembled Easy/Normal/Hard modes during the first two gyms but now I think it's an outdated concept. Now that we have the technology, freedom is an amazing thing that we have in our reach. It opens up so many options while increasing replay value. When not fixed to a schedule, you may start from any town, obtain any pokemon as the first members of your team and discover the world in any way you like. I was so thrilled in that scene in Pokemon Origins where Brock asked Red how many badges he had and chose Pokemon accordingly. It was amazing and I'd love it if it actually became a feature.
 
Level scaling should also be done to some level, but I'm not sure which. Scaling important trainers with respect to the highest level Pokemon seems to be the best method for punishing raising only one Pokemon to absurd levels and rewarding actually balanced teams.
I've thought about this too to some extent, and the 'best' method I've thought of is to have generic trainers scale to average team level and gym leaders to highest team level (you could get really crazy and scale the E4/Champion to highest level +X/+2X if you wanted) but level scaling, of some kind, is usually such an effective design I don't know why it hasn't been implemented in these games.


There's also one more problem I want to mention, the linearity of the gyms. It was actually a good idea in Red/Blue, where Bulbasaur/Squirtle/Charmander resembled Easy/Normal/Hard modes during the first two gyms but now I think it's an outdated concept. Now that we have the technology, freedom is an amazing thing that we have in our reach. It opens up so many options while increasing replay value. When not fixed to a schedule, you may start from any town, obtain any pokemon as the first members of your team and discover the world in any way you like. I was so thrilled in that scene in Pokemon Origins where Brock asked Red how many badges he had and chose Pokemon accordingly. It was amazing and I'd love it if it actually became a feature.
I agree with this too, but I do find it funny that you used gen1 as your example because gen1 gave the most wiggle room for gym order because the only things limiting progression were HMs and the Pokeflute. Other than gyms 1,2, & 8 you had a lot of leeway for when you did any of the gyms (you could conceivably do Sabrina 3rd through 7th as you could for Lt. Surge, Blaine could be in any order after Koga but before Giovanni, etc.) and you have been positively railroaded since then, excluding post E4 Kanto which barely counts. They've tried to show the 'gym leaders don't really suck' thing via the rematches and the world tournament and whatnot, but leeway on order would be way more fun.
 
Make healing cost money
I also agree about the low difficulty of pokemon games. They could make everything a bit more difficult but IMO pokemon centers costing money will be adding a bit too much difficulty as most players depend on them for healing since there isn't any natural way of replenishing PP. I also agree that the gym leaders and elite 4 should be made a bit more difficult. Imagine facing off against every gym leader having a full party of six pokemon! Now that would add a lot more to the difficulty. I also think that instead of raising the levels of our pokemon by grinding, we could have a fair match up of levels against gym leaders, elite 4's and champions. The move sets of the pokemon which the gym leaders have could also receive a tweak so that everything about the gym leader will be a lot more difficult. Yes I'm talking about Drayden's haxorus which DD's for some turns and instead of the expected dragon claw or outrage, there comes the dragon tail which many of us do not see as we have already knocked it out.
 
A few of my thoughts on how to make the games more challenging.

Shift/Set Option
One thing I have stopped doing since Pokemon Platinum is using the Shift option which gives you the warning about what's coming from the opponent. In the anime and in Battle Frontiers, you get no warning about what's coming. If you have warning, you can switch and prepare without losing a turn. With set, you get no warning which means you take things as they come. If you remove the Shift/Set option and arbitrarily go with Set, the AI can bring in something that you have/had no plan for and you have to adjust quickly or get run over.

Gym/Elite 4
Most gym leaders tend to use three Pokemon or so in battle. You have all six at your disposal. Therefore, change the requirements so that you can only use the same number of Pokemon as the the gym leader. And like the anime, the leader cannot change his/her Pokemon while you can freely switch, though once you've used the same number of Pokemon that the leader has, you're locked into those Pokemon. I also am not a fan of the use of items during a battle. At best, I limit myself to the same number of items that the leader uses. But I would be fine with items being removed from Gym/Elite 4 battles altogether for both you and the opponent. Or as SSJ said, make gym battles a full 6 on 6 battle. Same goes for the Elite 4.

I am also a fan of level scaling based on the strongest level of your Pokemon, therefore forcing every Gym battle to test your abilities. Not saying it'll be hard/easy, but it'll make you work.

Pokemon League
I watch the anime, and see Ash and his rivals compete in a huge tournament at the end of the series to determine the league champion. I wish we could get a tournament to compete in too as a way of determining the league champion. With now 719 Pokemon, I'm sure it isn't too hard to generate something like 200 or more AI opponents to be thrown into a tournament bracket of 64. This way, your tournament runs will always be different and can keep you on your toes. And then if you win and make it all the way to the end, you then earn the right to challenge the Elite Four. And if you beat them, you can challenge the Champion. And like always, you lose, you're out.
 
Can the OP change this thread's title, seriously? It's a classic case of bait and switch - it promises to cover the games' design in their entirety, but the resultant thread is focused on one topic only, difficulty.
 

Age of Kings

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How is it bait and switch when most people zone in on difficulty as the main problem? (Also linearity was addressed as an issue independent of difficulty.) If you have an issue with catching, exploration, or other game features in general, by all means bring it up. In fact, the main issue with reducing grinding (and increasing difficulty) is that people don't want to change immersion. This is where Colosseum failed imo because you are given a limited amount of Pokemon to collect so there's only so many combinations you can use.

I just thought of something to remove the element of grinding or severely limit it without changing the core aspect of encountering wild Pokemon. I think that in addition to scaling experience based on level, Pokemon should stop giving experience at a certain point. For instance, a lv40 Pokemon gets normal experience from lv35 mons and above, medium from lv25-35, almost none from lv20-24, and nothing from under 20. Obviously this is hypothetical and in no way balanced exactly as I proposed it (WoW is much less forgiving for instance, giving you no experience if the monster is more than 5 levels below you) but it accomplishes a few things while retaining the "gotta catch 'em all" experience. It encourages you to face Pokemon of an equal level to you, limits overleveling thus encouraging you to use multiple Pokemon instead of training a select few, and since wild Pokemon are often much lower in level, you cannot grind much off them. This would also be a toggled option because it might be a pain in the ass after you beat the game and you want to just efficiently train Pokemon for competitive battle.
 
Pokemon League
I watch the anime, and see Ash and his rivals compete in a huge tournament at the end of the series to determine the league champion. I wish we could get a tournament to compete in too as a way of determining the league champion. With now 719 Pokemon, I'm sure it isn't too hard to generate something like 200 or more AI opponents to be thrown into a tournament bracket of 64. This way, your tournament runs will always be different and can keep you on your toes. And then if you win and make it all the way to the end, you then earn the right to challenge the Elite Four. And if you beat them, you can challenge the Champion. And like always, you lose, you're out.
Have you played Yu-Gi-Oh Dungeon Dice Monsters? It's a pretty nice implementation of your idea
 
I just thought of something to remove the element of grinding or severely limit it without changing the core aspect of encountering wild Pokemon. I think that in addition to scaling experience based on level, Pokemon should stop giving experience at a certain point. For instance, a lv40 Pokemon gets normal experience from lv35 mons and above, medium from lv25-35, almost none from lv20-24, and nothing from under 20.
I'm not such a huge fan of this idea... while it would reduce grinding in-game, imagine post-game: you wouldn't be able to get a Pokémon above Level 80-90 without Rare Candies. What I think would be better is if it's based on Gyms: maybe any Pokémon can disobey you if you overlevel it past the badge level, or Pokémon are just barred from gaining levels until you get a badge.
 

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