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Discussion in 'BW LC' started by Pen Ink, Jan 11, 2012.

  1. Pen Ink

    Pen Ink

    Feb 2, 2011

    Overview and Discussion (open)
    Suction Cups: Negates moves that force switching out.
    Storm Drain: Water-type moves are drawn to this Pokemon. Water-type moves will do no damage and the Pokemon's Sp. Attack stat is raised by one stage. (Dream World)

    Lileep is quite an interesting Pokemon. With unique Grass/Rock typing, he has only three weaknesses, Ice, Rock, and Fighting, although one is a major weakness in this metagame. Still, Lileep functions incredibly well right now, able to act as a special sponge and a Stealth Rock layer, and being part Rock, gets a Special Defense boost from the most common weather, Sandstorm. He has notoriously been known as the second best Sandstorm abuser, next to Drilbur, of course. Although I totally support the discussion of sets and usage in this metagame, I feel the discussion should more be geared toward an ultimate question: does Lileep have what it takes to be used in a Sandstorm team?
    Stats and Movepool (open)
    HP: 66
    Attack: 41
    Defense: 77
    Special Attack: 61
    Special Defense: 87
    Speed: 23

    Important moves in bold
    1 Astonish
    1 Constrict
    8 Acid
    15 Ingrain
    22 Confuse Ray
    29 Amnesia
    36 Gastro Acid
    43 Ancientpower
    50 Energy Ball
    57 Stockpile
    57 Spit Up
    57 Swallow
    64 Wring Out

    06 Toxic
    10 Hidden Power
    11 Sunny Day
    17 Protect
    21 Frustration
    22 Solarbeam
    23 Smack Down
    27 Return
    32 Double Team
    36 Sludge Bomb
    37 Sandstorm
    39 Rock Tomb
    42 Facade
    44 Rest
    45 Attract
    48 Round
    53 Energy Ball
    69 Rock Polish
    70 Flash
    75 Swords Dance
    80 Rock Slide
    86 Grass Knot
    87 Swagger
    90 Substitute

    Egg Moves:
    Mirror Coat
    Wring Out
    Mega Drain
    Stealth Rock

    Dream World:
    Giga Drain

    Gen III and Gen IV only:
    Bullet Seed
    Giga Drain
    Secret Power
    Sleep Talk
    Natural Gift
    Earth Power
    Seed Bomb
    Pain Split
    String Shot
    Worry Seed
    Psych Up
    Body Slam
    Sets (open)
    name: Special Sponge
    move 1: Recover
    move 2: Energy Ball
    move 3: Toxic/Stealth Rock
    move 4: Hidden Power Fire
    item: Eviolite
    ability: Storm Drain
    nature: Calm
    ev's: 228 HP|140 Def|140 SpD

    Lileep works wonderfully as a special sponge, dealing with some of the more notorious special attackers in the metagame, such as Chinchou or Staryu. His base SpD is already high, and Eviolite increases this by 50%. Recover works really well in conjunction with Toxic or Toxic Spikes, and Eviolite lets it comfortably tank some special and physical hits and Recover off most of the damage. Energy Ball works very well when you switch into a Hydro Pump from Chinchou or Staryu, gaining +1 Special Attack, while letting you get good coverage on Waters, Rocks, and Grounds, which in conjunction with Toxic can wear the opposing Pokemon down. This set can act as a Stealth Rock layer, but Toxic in general helps this set a lot, wearing down anything that you hit; Toxic Spikes works well with this set too and lets Lileep comfortably use Stealth Rock, plus Lileep beats the best Rapid Spinner in the metagame 1 on 1, Staryu thanks to Storm Drain.

    Hidden Power Fire is mainly for coverage, as Energy Ball and Toxic are both resisted by steel types. Although this set can function quite well without Sandstorm, Hippopotas is a great partner with Lileep. He has great synergy with Storm Drain and sandstorm extremely raises Lileep's Special Defense. Lileep struggles to beat Snover, who gets rid of sandstorm and has a STAB Blizzard, but is hard pressed to switch in because of Stealth Rocks and Hidden Power Fire. Larvesta makes a great partner with Lileep, too, who resists all of Lileep's weakness: Ice, Fighting, and Steel, and Lileep is immune to water-type attacks.


    name: Stockpile
    move 1: Stockpile
    move 2: Energy Ball
    move 3: Hidden Power Fire/Toxic
    move 4: Recover/Rest
    item: Eviolite
    ability: Storm Drain
    nature: Bold
    ev's: 228 HP|220 Def|60 SpD

    This set's main priority is to set up Stockpile and wall anything in its path. Energy Ball + Storm Drain greatly helps this set, letting Lileep beat bulky waters with relative ease, including Frillish and Chinchou. The choice between Hidden Power Fire and Toxic is difficult. Hidden Power Fire lets Lileep take on the main walls to this set, Ferroseed and Snover, although Lileep will need some boosts to take on the latter. Lileep really appreciates Toxic, though, which is his main way to stall an opposing Pokemon in conjunction with Stockpile. Therefore, Lileep loves Toxic Spikes support, and Tentacool makes a wonderful partner, sponging two of Lileep's 3 weaknesses. Recover is generally the superior recovery option since you don't have to wait two turns to start attacking again, but Rest can be used as an alternative because Lileep generally gets screwed by Toxic itself.

    Although incredibly defensive already with Eviolite, Stockpile heightens this to a point where Lileep is basically non-afraid of most moves, and in some cases even weaker super effective moves, such as Drain Punch and Flash Cannon. This set loves the help that Sandstorm brings, and Hippopotas is always a good partner for Lileep, setting up Stealth Rocks and luring in water-types for free setups and boosts from Storm Drain. Toxic Spikes, as said before, makes the set highly more efficient then normal, allowing you to not run Toxic and waste turns Toxicing, although this should be considered in great deal since Croagunk, the most used poision type, shuts down this set completely and hits back with STAB SE Drain Punch while absorbing Toxic Spikes.

  2. spuds4ever


    Oct 4, 2011
    A few nitpicks. Lileep has 4 weaknesses, Ice, Fighting, Bug, and Steel. Of the 4, only 2 really matter, Ice and fighting. Ice because it gives the flower a tougher time switching into water types who often carry ice type moves and fighting because it is so popular in the tier. I think giga drain deserves an honourable mention in a bulky hard-hitter set here:

    Lileep @eviolite
    EVs: 188 sp. atk, 220 sp. def, 100 spd
    Modest (+sp. atk, -atk)
    Storm Drain
    Giga drain
    Earth power/Ancient power
    Hidden power fire

    If lileep comes in on a water attack, lileep has its special attack boosted to a tasty 24 and can set up a substitute with ease as it switches. Giga drain gives some good restoration. Hidden power fire hits ferroseed and bronzor hard(ish in the latter case). Earth power hits a bit harder than ancient power but ancient power can hit flying types like taillow.

    And what about some info on team-mates and counters. A little more thorough would be good.

    And btw, in your signature, drilbur isn't broken ;)
  3. iss

    iss happily ever after
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Jun 5, 2009
    To be honest, there's nothing here that's not already onsite. Encourage creativity with these threads- post a great new set or improve or elaborate on old ones. There's nothing "wrong" here, but it really is basically a rewrite of what's onsite.

    Also to the above, Giga Drain is illegal with Storm Drain.
  4. comatthew6

    is a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

    Jan 7, 2010
    All you have to do to beat Lileep is to hit it with Toxic or Knock Off. That's really it.
  5. Methmite


    Jun 11, 2010
    It's rock typing is kinda a huge issue too. being meinfoo weak is never a good thing. A stockpile set could end up *really* wrecking things just cause its impossible to take out w/o crits; and does more than just absorb damage
  6. metsrule158

    metsrule158 Don't disturb him on his break.
    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Jun 2, 2010
    Yeah, I mean, any Fighting-type Pokemon can defeat Lileep with ease as long as it hasn't gotten too many Stockpiles up.
  7. Good_Luck!


    Apr 18, 2011
    Lileep is my passion (along with Vullaby) so I feel I must defend it. The abundance of Fighting pokes AND the wide distribution of fighting type moves for coverage (HP on Gastly, Brick Break on a lot of Normal types and so on...) are the biggest weak points for the lovely flower, but they're not the only things that destroys Lileep. Its weakness to U-turn, Ice-type moves, susceptibility to Toxic AND the strong dependance on Eviolite (giving it a fear to Knock Off) are some things that really makes Lileep a difficult poke to play with.

    HOWEVER, it can shine if you understand that Lileep is not the average Wall; sandstorm and Stockpile are its biggest selling points. I have swept with Lileep just because my opponent kept attacking me with HP Fighting in sandstorm and let me Stockpile with impunity. With the prevalence of special attackers (Chinchou, Gastly, Staryu) and the abundance of Fighting counters gives Lileep the spot to shine; I mean, like a lot of pokes, good team support (a heal beller and a fighting counter) makes Lileep shine.

    Personally, I like a Lileep a little more oriented to Def as opposed to SpD:

    Lileep (F) @ Eviolite
    Trait: Storm Drain
    EVs: 148 HP / 220 Def / 140 SDef
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Energy Ball
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Recover
    - Stockpile

    This gives 27 Def, 25 SpD and 25HP; after just one stockpile Lileep can handle weak physical fighting moves (unstabbed Brick Break, for example), 25 HP lets it recover 13 points and with Hippo support it's almost impossible to take it down. Vullaby is a great partner 'cause it removes common toxic users if she carries Taunt (Bronzor, Slowpoke and the not-so-common Frillish), AND with Air Slash as Flying STAB it destroys Larvesta and Fighting 'mons who generally have weaker SpD.

    It's not anti-meta, but the combo gave me a little success. Maybe if I were better at teambuilding I would've give them the proper support to be a top player :P.

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