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Lilligant - Unreserved (QC 3/3)

Discussion in 'Locked / Outdated Analyses' started by Zaon, Nov 12, 2012.

  1. Zaon

    Zaon

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    [Overview]

    • Didn't changed in BW2
    • Great Special Attack and Speed
    • Access to Quiver Dance to boost his Special Attack, Speed and Special Defense
    • Lilligant has also Sleep Powder to help to set-up
    • However, Lilligant has a bad offensive type
    • A really shallow movepool
    • Need Hidden Power for coverage
    • Overall, Lilligant is an excellent and unique special sweeper

    [SET]

    name: Offensive Quiver Dance
    move 1: Quiver Dance
    move 2: Sleep Powder
    move 3: Giga Drain
    move 4: Hidden Power Fire/Hidden Power Rock
    item: Leftovers/ Lum Berry
    ability: Chlorophyll
    nature: Timid
    evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    • Quiver Dance is the best Lilligant's boosting move
    • She is the perfect user of this movet, it boostes Lilligant's great Special Attack, good Speed and decent Special Defense
    • Sleep Powder allows to render useless a counter like Munchlax and Drapion
    •Giga Drain is the main STAB and recovering HP
    • Hidden Power Rock hits hard fire-types like Moltres and Entei and also -Sygliph
    • Hidden Power Fire hits hard grass and steel such as Ferroseed ,other Lilligant, Ferroseed and Roselia and Escavalier
    • The choice between the two moves depends of the team but Hidden Power Fire is generaly more useful because Moltres is faster because of IV drop, Entei has ExtremeSpeed and other Fire-types like Magmortar and Typhlosion are uncommon while Ferroseed, Rotom-C, Roselia and Escavalier are all common and complety wall Lilligant without Hidden Power Fire

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    • EVs spread gives maximum power and speed
    • Timid nature allows to outspeed positive natured base 80s and as well speed tie with other positive natured base 90s

    • Leftovers for the staying power

    • Lum Berry to avoid status
    • Modest nature and Life Orb can be use for the extra power
    • Petal Dance could be use because it has much more power but the lock into à Grass move can be risky. In this case, Own Tempo is the best ability because it prevents from confusion
    • Wall by Fire-types if not using Hidden Power Rock and by Grass-types if not using Hidden Power Fire
    • Bulky water-types like Slowking and Quilfish for deal with Fire-types if using Hidden Power Fire
    • Fire-types like Entei and Moltres for deal with Grass-types if using Hidden Power Rock

    [SET]
    name: Bulky Quiver Dance
    move 1: Quiver Dance
    move 2: Giga Drain
    move 3: Sleep Powder/Aromatherapy
    move 4: Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Rock
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Timid
    evs: 252 HP / 188 Def / 68 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    • This set uses Lilligant's decent defenses to set-up easier Quiver Dance
    • Pratically same moves
    • Quiver Dance boosts Lilligant's great Special Attack, good speed and decent special defense easily thanks to the defensive investment
    • Giga Drain is the best STAB on this set because of the recovering.
    • Sleep Powder to put counters to sleep
    • Aromatherapy could be use to cure status like Toxic and Thunder Wave
    • Again, the choice of the Hidden Power depends of the team
    • Hidden Power Rock hits harder Fire-types while Hidden Power Fire hits other grass-types

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    • The EVs spread and the nature allow Lilligant to outspeed Swellow and Sceptile after a Quiver Dance while providing bulk
    • Substitute can be use, allowing Lilligant to protect from status moves but is generaly outclass by Sleep Powder because the last move allows to render useless a Pokemon and an easier set-up
    • Same counters, Grass-types if not using Hidden Power Fire and Fire-types if not using Hidden Power Rock.
    • Same teamnates, fire-types if not using Hidden Power Fire and water-types if not using Hidden Power Rock

    [Other Options]

    - a Sunny Day support can be use
    - except that, Lilligant doesn't too much options, she only has defensive options
    - a support set can be use
    - Stun Spore, Toxic, Healing Wish, Leech Seed and Light Screen are great options
    - a physicaly or specialy defensive spread can be use in this case

    [Checks and Counters]

    - Munchlax
    - Grass and Steel like Ferrossed, Rotom-C, Victreebel and Escavalier and Sygliph if not using Hidden Power Fire
    - Fire-types like Moltres, Entei, Magmortar and Typhlosion if not using Hidden Power Rock
    - Sap Sipper Bouffalant, Miltank and Sawsbuck
    - Unaware Clefable
    - Drapion
    - Druddigon
    - Cryogonal
  2. Windsong

    Windsong .dancin
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    Mention Aromatherapy Quiver Dance.
    Mention Substitute Quiver Dance.
    Add Sap Sipper Miltank and Sawsbuck, and Unaware Clefable into Checks and Counters.
    Get Lum Berry out of the Offensive QD Set - add lefties instead.

    QC APPROVED 1/3

    edit: meant life orb out of offensive qd, not lum berry. sorry!
  3. kokoloko

    kokoloko supersmooth
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    Why is Chlorophyll the main option when you're slashing Petal Dance?
  4. Zaon

    Zaon

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    Windsong : I added all changes, thanks

    kokoloko : Thanks, I mention Own Tempo is the best ability with Petal Dance
  5. Honko

    Honko
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    I'm not really convinced on the Sunny Day set. It looks "ok" but that's not good enough. As a supporter it's quite frail and just compounds weaknesses that sun teams already have, and as an attacker it's inferior to the more common Chlorophyll sweepers due to how easy it is to wall, and inferior to its own QD set too, since +1 Giga Drain is almost as strong as SolarBeam. It has a small niche and might be useful occasionally, but that's what OO is for.

    QD should be split into two sets. Trying to cram LO/Lum/Lefties/Giga Drain/Petal Dance/Aromatherapy/Sleep Powder/Substitute/offensive/bulky all into one set is a bad idea. The offensive set should be exactly what's on site right now, except remove the Modest slash because Modest is dumb, and move Petal Dance to AC imo. The bulky set should be similar to what's on site, with Substitute mentioned in AC, and maybe an updated spread.
  6. Zaon

    Zaon

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    Thanks Honko, I did all your changes.
    Have you got a new spread for the bulky set ?
  7. complete legitimacy

    complete legitimacy Honko's Happy Funtime With Men
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    I don't know if I'm the only one that thinks this, but in my opinion HP Fire is better than HP Rock in this metagame. The main reasons to use HP Rock are for Moltres (outspeeds because of IV drop), Entei (has ExtremeSpeed anyway), and Magmortar (isn't that common or good right now). However, when you use HP Fire you can beat Ferroseed, Rotom-C, Roselia (with some prior damage), and Escavalier, which you would lose to otherwise and are overall much more common. Personally, I'm a lot more scared if Lilligant has HP Fire as opposed to HP Rock.
  8. Texas Cloverleaf

    Texas Cloverleaf meh
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    QC APPROVED 2/3

    I agree with c_l but either one is fine as the primary slash
  9. Zaon

    Zaon

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    Thanks, I'll mention HP Fire is better and also slash it as the primary option

    edit : got out Life Orb, thanks
  10. complete legitimacy

    complete legitimacy Honko's Happy Funtime With Men
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    [QC]3/3[/QC]

    I know this would be caught in GP but just so you know, you need spaces between the slash itself and the things being separated by it. Example being:

    It needs to be fixed to be like this when it goes on-site.
  11. Honko

    Honko
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    Please hold off on writing this up. QC is still discussing what to do with the 2nd set, and if SubQD deserves its own set.
  12. Zaon

    Zaon

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    Ok, I'll only write the Introduction and Offensive Quiver Dance's SET COMMENTS
  13. citro

    citro

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    I'd honestly mention something other than Munchlax here. They almost always have Sleep Talk, which means they don't care about Sleep Powder and continue to wall you until they roll Whirlwind.
  14. DittoCrow

    DittoCrow
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    This has been reassigned. Post in the index thread if you want it!

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