1. Welcome to Smogon! Check out the Smogon Starters Hangout for everything you need to know about starting out in the community. Don't forget to introduce yourself in the Introduction and Hangout Thread, too!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

MagBag

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by jmorris, Jan 1, 2013.

  1. jmorris

    jmorris

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    40
    This is my second LC team and instead of picking 6 pokemon to play different roles, as I have done in the past, I decided give team building a proper go and actually think about how each member would benefit the team. Anyway here's how MagBag looks:

    Omanyte - Magnemite - Abra - Mienfoo - Scraggy - Bagon​

    Omanyte @ Eviolite
    Trait: Shell Armor
    EV's: 236 HP/ 36 Def/ 236 Spd
    Bold Nature
    - Toxic Spikes
    - Stealth Rock
    - Scald
    - Protect

    If you hadn't already guessed this is my Stealth Rock/ T-Spikes setter and it usually is in the lead position. The EV layout and Evilolite makes it bulky all around and even with a little investment in Def it can still take a few hits. Maximum Spd and HP allows it to take neutral hits although Giga Drain is still a guaranteed OHKO. I had trouble with Mienfoo's Hi Jump Kick so Protect is there on the off chance the opponent will lead with the furry devil and it lets me scout their next move either before or after I've laid my hazards. Scald is there for a STAB attack to drive away enemy hazard layers that are weak to it as Omanyte is surprisingly fast when compared to others of its type.

    Magnemite @Eviolite
    Trait: Magnet Pull
    EV's: 156 HP/ 36 Def/ 240 SpA/ 76 SpD
    Modest Nature
    - Volt Switch
    - Magnet Rise
    - Flash Cannon
    - HP Fire

    As the first half of the team's name takes after Magnemite, this little guy plays quite an important part on my team. It's main job is to trap Steel types, mainly Bronzor and if it gets a safe switch in it's first move is to use Magnet Rise to avoid a HP Ground or Earthquake. HP Fire is to kill Bronzor and co once they have been trapped and Flash Cannon hits Dragon and Ground types although the damage isn't too high. Volt Switch forms the STAB and allows Magnemite get out of a fight it can't win (except against Ground guys). I would prefer to have Thunderbolt or Discharge there to use as STAB that won't force him out as it can be counterproductive. Magnemite works well here becuase it resists Grass, Flying, Psychic, pretty much all the types that hurt everyone else, however it can't be relied on too much throughout the battle as it's low speed and lack of recovery can hurt it.

    Abra @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Magic Guard
    EV's: 240 SpA/ 200 Spe
    Timid Nature
    - Psychic
    - Shadow Ball
    - HP Fighting
    - Protect

    I love Abra for its ablity to sweep while unaffected by hazards and weather and this set does that very well with max Special Attack and Speed. Protect lets it come in and block the opponents attack giving me the advantage as Abra's more likely to outspeed their next move or hit the switch in. Psychic is the main STAB here as it is very likely to OHKO after some residual damage. Shadow Ball is for opposing Psychics or if I suspect a Ghost is going to get switched in. HP Fighting serves the same purpose if there's a Dark or Steel waiting to come in. More often or not this allows Abra to take down two or more opponents before it's killed or has to switch. The beauty of this is I can switch it back in again without the fear or Stealth Rock or Spikes.

    Mienfoo @ Eviolite
    Trait: Regenerator
    EV's: 156 Atk/ 196 Def/ 36 SpD/ 76 Spe
    Impish Nature
    - Substitute
    - Baton Pass
    - Drain Punch
    - Payback

    This is quite the fun set to run as not too many people are expecting a SubPass Mienfoo. This team benefits greatly from a Substitute and Mienfoo is an excellent passer of it. The EV's increase bulk while allowing Drain Punch to score the occasional kill of it's own. Speaking of Drain Punch it works excellently with Regenerator to ensure Mienfoo will be able to set up multiple Substitutes throughout the battle. Payback is there to ward off Ghosts and Psychics although Mienfoo is usually too fast to get the damage boost. I chose to SubPass over Swords Dance as not everyone would benefit from receiving it whereas all will appreciate at the least a free switch in.

    Scraggy @ Eviolite
    Trait: Shed Skin
    EV's: 236 Atk/ 36 SpD/ 236 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Dragon Dance
    - Drain Punch
    - Crunch
    - Ice Punch

    There's not much I can say about Scraggy that you don't already know. Even after one DD it becomes unstoppable and the max Attack and Speed only help this. Scraggy can come in on any resisted attack thanks to its bulk and set up a sweep. A Substitute from Mienfoo works wonders here too. Drain Punch is the STAB of choice as i'm too big a wuss to run Hi Jump Kick, plus it's nice to recover most of its HP after a OHKO. Crunch is the second STAB and much like with Abra and Shadow Ball, it's very useful if I suspect a Ghost wants to block Drain Punch. It can OHKO Missy after a single DD and there have been many ragequits because of it (not that I'm proud of that). Ice Punch takes care of Murkrow and Flying types although withought Zen Headbutt I miss out nailing on Croagunk. One area that I would like some feedback on is running Shed Skin over Moxie as it's not always going to have a Substitute to block status but the extra attack bonuses from Moxie would help with its sweep.

    Sorry for the blocks of text but we're nearly at the end.

    Bagon @ Eviolite
    Trait: Rock Head
    EV's: 236 HP/ 36 Atk/ 196 Def/ 40 SpD
    Jolly Nature
    - Wish
    - Dragon Claw
    - Rock Slide
    - Protect

    This was honestly a bit of a last minute choice. I was looking for a Dragon to act as a revenge killer when I came across this one. With it's decent bulk and resistances to Fire, Water, Grass and Electric it acts as quite a good Wish passer. Dragon Claw is the STAB and is very useful once Magnemite has cleared and Steel types (hence the name MagBag) and Rock Slide hurts the Fire types that give Magnemite trouble and vice-versa. Protect can be swapped for Roar to phaze and help rack up hazard damage but I like Protect for giving Bagon a free Wish and for stalling out with Toxic Spikes.

    So there you have it. I've noticed that I have no solid counter to Croagunk but as I surprisingly haven't come across one yet I don't know how well or badly I'd do.

    EDIT: I've made some changes since posting this which are further down.
  2. Raseri

    Raseri here to help
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Smogon Social Media Contributoris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Researcher Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
    NU Co-Leader

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2007
    Messages:
    3,700
    Hey Jmorris, this is a pretty cool team. It's nice to see underrated threats instead of the same old every single battle. i particularly like your use of Omanyte, I think it has some potential in this metagame that hasn't been explored.

    There are some really big threats to this team though. Sand teams can walk all over you, nothing on your team can safely switch into Drilbur, it can really just walk all over you.

    When looking for a weak link on your team, I notice that Abra really doesn't contribute all that much to your team. I would recommend replacing it with a Choice Scarf Snover.


    Snover @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Snow Warning
    EV's: 104 Atk / 184 SpA / 200 Spe
    Naive Nature
    - Blizzard
    - Giga Drain
    - Ice Shard
    - Hidden Power Rock

    Snover is one of the most annoying Pokemon that a sand team can face, changing the weather and outspeeding + OHKOing Drilbur, Hippo, and Sandshrew. Snover is weak to residual damage so a well played Sand team can still win, so be on guard!


    I'm also really not sure what Rock Slide is doing for Bagon. You say it hits Fire-types, but so does Dragon Claw. I think that using Roar there will be a lot better, as it will stack up residual damage and stop things like Timburr from setting up on you. Because only 22% of them run Ice Punch anyways.


    Also I would recommend Zen Headbutt on Scraggy. You already do a decent job against Murkrow with the rest of your team, but Croagunk is a real issue, especially if you get rid of Abra. This is a really important change if you choose to add Snover. Also Impish > Jolly. I have no clue why Jolly is there, c/p from Scraggy error maybe?

    tl;dr (open)

    Choice Scarf Snover > Abra
    Roar > Rock Slide on Bagon
    Impish > Jolly on Bagon
    Zen Headbutt > Ice Punch on Scraggy
  3. jmorris

    jmorris

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    40
    It did seem a bit out of place on this team, mainly due to it being a carryover from my previous, less successful team and it's severe lack of bulk wasn't the best either. Snover looks like a good addition. I was thinking of adding a Scarfed sweeper and Blizzard backed by Hail should be lethal.


    Herp Derp I see your point with Roar > Rock Slide.


    I was getting tired by this point lol Jolly was put there by accident. Thanks for the rate, once I fix up the error and implement the changes to my team, i'll give it a thorough test.
  4. apt-get

    apt-get 笑っている 今が愛おしくて ひとりじゃないと思った
    is a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2012
    Messages:
    645
    Hi! First team check!

    I can see you have a big weakness to Fighting-types. Bulk Up timburr and ScarFoo walk all over you, with four pokémons weak to fighting!

    To alleviate this problem, you can use a Foongus. You already have a solid counter to Snover and Murkrow in Magnemite, and Foongus can screw Timburr's boosting attempts with Clear Smog and only receive few damages from ScarFoo's HJK.

    236+ Atk Mienfoo Stone Edge vs. 124 HP / 156+ Def Eviolite Foongus: 7-9 (28 - 36%) -- 24.73% chance to 3HKO
    It can then use spore and heal itself with Synthesis or with Regenerator, crippling Mienfoo for the entire battle. It can also serve as a shaky check to Drilbur, as it's 2HKOed by its Life Orb Earthquake and can OHKO it with Giga Drain.

    You could place it over Bagon, as it still provides the key resistances to water and grass, and can actually beat Chinchou. For fire attacks, you already have Omanyte that can beat fire-types. Lack of wish kinda hurts, but it's imo a better pivot.

    TL;DR
    Foongus > Bagon

    Sets
    Show Hide

    [​IMG][​IMG]
    Foongus @ Eviolite
    Trait: Regenerator
    Level: 5
    EVs: 124 HP / 156 Def / 76 SAtk / 76 SDef / 76 Spd
    Bold Nature
    - Clear Smog
    - Giga Drain
    - Spore
    - Synthesis

    You'd better use Synthesis instead of Stun Spore since most of your team is/will be fast anyway.
  5. Superpowerdude

    Superpowerdude is an official Custom Title Rater
    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2012
    Messages:
    1,379
    hey nice team!

    it looks to me like this team has good potential for an offense team, however their are a few things holding it back. Firstly i don't really like the use of Omanyte on this team, your team is to offensive to make good use of the poison damage Toxic Spikes brings to the table and wold be much better of with Spikes instead. I also don't see why your team needs a Wish passer as it slows your team down a bit and you really have no Pokemon that can abuse it. After all Omanyte is a suicide lead, Scraggy is a set up sweeper therefore he won't be switching out to much, and Abra can't afford to switch a lot in order to preserve its Focus Sash.

    I think a Hazard Setting Dwebble>Omanyte would be a great fit. Dwebble is a much better entry hazard for offensive teams such as your own. Firstly it has a good 16 speed, sturdy and Oran Berry letting it set up entry hazards much easier. Dwebble can set up Stealth Rock and Spikes, which is quite nice because Spikes can turn potential 2hkos into 1hkos and is an overall much better option then Toxic Spikes due to your team not being able to use Toxic Spikes properly because it carries no real stalling Pokemon. With Rock Blast Dwebble can actually do something to Natu something that not much hazard setters can brag about. X-Scissor is pretty much just there for stab. As i mentioned Dwebble is a much better fit in your team because it supports your team much better offensively.

    I also agree with Sarkynin in using Foongus>Bagon i mentioned above why Wish Passing doesn't really work on your team and Foongus preforms a similar role being a bulky support Pokemon that has key resistances to Water, Electric, Grass and Fighting. Foongus helps you against Fighting-type threats like Timburr and Mienfoo. However Sarkynin mentioned Synthesis on the set. I would much prefer Stun Spore for its great support to cripple opposing sweepers. With Regenerator Foongus already has good recovery and with the prevalence of sand Synthesis won't be healing much and would be a waste of a moveslot. Status support such as Spore and Stun Spore really help Scraggy set up which your team will greatly appreciate.

    Good luck with the team i hope i helped!

    Set
    Show Hide
    Show Hide

    [​IMG]
    Dwebble @ Oran Berry | Sturdy
    Jolly | 36 Hp / 236 Atk / 236 Spe
    Stealth Rock | Spikes | Rock Blast | X-Scissor

    TL:DR
    Show Hide
    Show Hide

    Omanyte--->Dwebble

    Bagon--->Foongus



    ~Superpowerdude
  6. jmorris

    jmorris

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    40
    My team's gone through quite a few changes since I made this RMT and I'm happy to say they're all for the best.

    Choice Scarf Snover > Abra

    Snover @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Snow Warning
    EV's: 104 Atk / 184 SpA / 200 Spe
    Naive Nature
    - Blizzard
    - Giga Drain
    - Ice Shard
    - Hidden Power Rock

    Identical to the set Raseri recommended, it not only adds a powerful STAB in Blizzard but some much needed speed straight off the bat as opposed to Scraggy who needs a turn or two to set up. Hail does hurt the rest of the team slightly but it also finishes off foes who are down to their last bit of health. Munchlax pretty much puts a stop to its attacks bar Ice Shard but a Drain Punch from Scraggy or Mienfoo takes it down with no trouble.

    Bagon > Foongus


    Foongus @ Eviolite
    Trait: Regenerator
    Level: 5
    EVs: 124 HP / 156 Def / 76 SAtk / 76 SDef / 76 Spd
    Bold Nature
    - Clear Smog
    - Giga Drain
    - Spore
    - Stun Spore

    I really wanted to keep a hold on Bagon as I really liked what It brought to a fight and also I'd have to change the name of the team (MagFoo doesn't sound as good). It was too hard to look past Foongus' resistance though and it's relatively bulky to boot. Spore's helped numerous times, letting Omanyte lay hazards in peace as well as letting Scraggy set up a Dragon Dance. I chose to run Stun Spore over Synthesis as it's not Foongus' job to stick around for more than a few turns so Giga Drain and Regenerator provide it with enough recovery.

    I want to try Omanyte out a bit longer as it hasn't failed me so far and the recent additions to the team cover it weaknesses, letting it stick around after it has laid the appropriate hazards. Since Foongus is spreading status Toxic Spikes had to go in favour of Spikes. Plus it dents those who are resistant to SR.

    Magnemite hasn't changed and neither has Mienfoo or Scraggy. These three are the most solid members of the team and do a great job of removing any threats to the rest of the team. I've decided to keep Shed Skin for Scraggy as two DD's (damn my dirty mind) are usually enough to KO with residual damage.

    Thanks for all the suggestions you guys have made, I'm really learning as I go along and of course if there's anything else you'd like to add I'd be more than happy to listen.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)