Mario Kart Mafia (NOC) END: VILLAGE WINS

[Metal Sonic]

I've already explained a lot about my stance on celever already, and now that he claimed BG(which is extremely stupid, imo but welp) I believe that I can omit this part of the explanation already.

I will elaborate on my stance on Spiffy. He has been consistently providing reads and asking numerous probing questions to the town in order to find out who is the scum. For example, post #530, #546, #560 and A LOT MORE. Furthermore, he is very active and consistent in his postings, and not attempting to lurk/stay behind the radar as a scum would. He has been pressuring many other players, not only celever(Solar Vapor in #461, Jalmont in #407, me in #423) throughout this time, which shows open-mindedness "What if celever is indeed town? Who are the other scum?"

He has contributed a lot to this game and is obviously a strong town. Therefore, I am of the firm belief that Spiffy pressuring celever was nothing more than that. Pressure. Spiffy wanted to find scum and thought that celever might be one, so he had to keep probing until celever could show his alignment. Unfortunately apparently celever showed his town alignment in... a not so ideal manner. Regardless, this shows that their back and forth was Town vs Town in my opinion and that is why they are extremely clean.

Houndoomsday is also extremely clean, and I suppose they can form a strong townbloc(not as if celever is going to survive the night but oh well) in order to lynch scum.

 

[Metal Sonic]

@Zyphirex there is no "tomorrow"

post your reads and role claim now.

the fact that you wasted the time that could be used to provide meaningful analysis for such bullshit(i am not surprised) only shows your poor/scummy play.

 

[Zyphirex]

It doesn't take me very long to type up something like that. If you can't wait for me to give analysis, lynch me now. You should have your scum friends bandwagon in and hammer (unless they are already voting for me). Anyways, why do you even care? You said it yourself. "I don't read your posts. They are all bullshit, and the way you make them is really annoying, and IDGAF!"

 

[Metal Sonic]

I am trying very hard to refrain from using ad hominem here

Just claim your role. If you claim vanillager I will not hesitate to get town to hammer you, because you are toxic to the game, your inexperience is extremely showing, and the fact that your first posts in Smogon are littering this game only prove this fact. You have less posts than cxinlee or Firemage, and clearly making up a big fuss when you know that you do not know how to play mafia.

In the worst case scenario that I am wrong(and you claim vanillager), we merely lose an oddball who may possibly screw the game over in the late-game.

In the best case scenario which I am betting on, we are 1/3 on the way to completing this game.


So now, think twice when you post your roleclaim. If you claim a PR, we may still consider tolerating and keeping you, and lynching Snaquaza instead. If you claim a vanillager, which can be very noncommital and is the go-to claim for most scum anyway, you may be insta-hammered

Think very carefully.

Remember: "I don't give a damn about this game!" is a very bad answer, and not only that but you may be potentially banned from joining other mafia games as well.

 

[JALMONT]

/yep this is a bad lynch rofl!!! (YES I AM CHANGING MY MiND I KNOW I THOugHT CxiNLEE AND FIRE MAGE WERE BAD BUt yeaa Mind chaNGED)

i still like a SNAQUAZA lynch because when the heat was one zyphire responded (from start to end he tried hard) snaquaza just be kinda ehhh sliding under the radar

oh WELL maybe i should try harder and things like this wouldn't happen

 

[Zyphirex]

@Jalmont I don't really understand what you are saying. Do you mean I am scum or that I am not scum?

 

[JALMONT]

snaquaza has completely fallen under the radar in the sense that as soon as things escalated on zyphire he completely disappeared - i suppose it could've been worse in that he coul'dve joined that wagon but both a re pretty bad

the reaction from zyphire suggests that as a beginning player (who cares about being lynched) he is much more liable to starting out "poorly" and "toxicly" in other people's eyes, and will attempt to rectify it by vigourosly defending himself - the appeal to emotion isn't scum as i think that's a defining and repetitive trait in new users who are about to be lynched (personal experience)

obviously as a user who has never played NOC mafia he doesn't know what to do, but his reads aren't artificial which is super important - beginning mafia players tend to avoid posting because of a fear of people calling them out - if they are accused of scum they retreat further into that shell so they avoid giving up their teammates; it's an irrational fear, but it happens i think - a villager who cares about the game is going to try to avoid getting lynched, by fighting hard which is what i think zyphire is doing

yea there;s nothing about what zyphire said? is that a bad thing? absolutely not considering the fact that it's too early in the game to be putting *that* much stock into read posts - illogical posts will be found and it's nbd because we are working off limited information - those posts become much more valuable the longer the game goes on and is why i am confident in saying zyphire is a bad lynch

if snaquaza is truly repeating his playstyle from the last NOC i tend to favor the belief that he is using the same playstyle as before, the playstyle that worked. nothing in how he posts suggest he is the sort of player who will throw us for a loop (no offense) it doesn't mean he is completely predictable and that he always does the same thing - i am saying that he is less likely than a user like Metal sonic who is much more volatile and more likely to switch things up. and of course they are the users such as spiffy and AG who play mostly of near exactly the same each time and you will likely never find a difference in their scum and town play (you probably could if you looked hard enough but I can't be bothered reading NOC games I didn't play in - boooooooooooring might as well play one!)

vote snaquaza if i'm not already voting him

 

[Zyphirex]

I suppose I should get something straight right now. Jalmont said that many beginning players care about getting lynched. Does this mean that experienced players don't care if they get lynched? This seems a bit counter-intuitive, since in my experience, if you die, you lose, and you only act completely out of self-interest if you feel that you are going to lose anyways.

 

[Metal Sonic]

I am still waiting for @Zyphirex's claim.

Otherwise Jalmont's post was convincing and I am also willing to lynch Snaquaza on the basis that he almost successfully fooled me last game. I don't want to take that risk of "reading him town" again.

 

[Zyphirex]

I am extremely hesitant to play by your rules @Metal Sonic, especially since you have been attacking me ever since I subbed in, but I guess I will claim now (I'm not doing anything else since it's 3 AM right now).

I am a villager with the power that, if someone attempts to nightkill me, for one time only, they are killed instead. Unfortunately, the power is pretty useless now that I have claimed :confused: but what the hell else am I going to do at L-2.

 

[Metal Sonic]

At the rate you're going, nobody is going to nightkill you ever(unless there is a vig)

Elaborate more when you say "A villager with the power to kill my attacker"

How can a villager have that kind of ability? Is that an item?

If an inspector inspects you will he be killed?

 

[Houndoomsday]

I suppose I should get something straight right now. Jalmont said that many beginning players care about getting lynched. Does this mean that experienced players don't care if they get lynched? This seems a bit counter-intuitive, since in my experience, if you die, you lose, and you only act completely out of self-interest if you feel that you are going to lose anyways.

villagers should play to have the village achieve their win condition (generally eliminate mafia). many new players however, just play to survive as long as possible- and those two goals are often not overlapping. for instance counterclaiming mafia who fake claims a PR benefits the village much more than if you die, however it does not benefit the player counter claiming at all for the most part. in that situation many more experienced players would counter claim, while a noob would just lie low, or at least thats how i understand it.

yet again you have a toxic attitude "if you die, you lose". that is not how village should play, and if you are playing that way i would suggest a shift immediately

will post thoughts on your claim tomorrow, as well as discuss some other scummy players so that this doesnt end up in another tunneling situation its 3 am and im tired

 

[Ampharos]

I'm assuming it's some kind of reflector role: "Reflects the first night kill targeted at him back upon the attacker" or something along those lines.

I was attempting to write up a post on why I'd rather lynch Zyphirex over Snaquaza at this juncture (basically his flip would give us more info), but as I've stated I'm uneasy lynching PR claims on the first day.

Jalmont finally opened his mouth and said words (and words that make sense, at that), so unvote.

I would like for Eagle to post a votecount before I vote for Snaquaza so I don't accidentally hammer, as I have no clue what the count is at right now.

 

[Ampharos]

also I agree with Metal Sonic (there's something I never thought I'd say) that Houndoomsday's last few posts have been very pro-town

 

[Zyphirex]

Yes, it is an item. I am not allowed to reveal the name of the item. The role pm said nothing about an inspector getting killed. It just said that for one time only, if someone attempts to nightkill me, they will be killed instead, after which, the item will be used up. I'm not sure whether I'm allowed to quote part of the PM or not, so, if you want a direct quote you will have to wait until Eagle4 comes on.

 

[Metal Sonic]

This is a dilemma.

"Claims villager with a good item"

fulfils both of my conditions as state above.

Smart, very smart.

Lets list the possibilities of a zyph flip:

Zyph scum Snaq scum : Snaq is bussing zyph, lynch snaq d2
Zyph town snaq scum: snaq is pushing for zyph mislynch, lynch snaq d2
zyph scum snaq town: snaq is a good scumhunter, but cannot tell the diff between 1st option
zyph town snaq town: cant tell the diff between 2nd option



so it seems that at this point snaq is doomed to get lynched regardless of zyph's alignment
lets see what we get if snaq gets lynched today
snaq scum zyph town: snaq pushing for a mislynch, zyph self preservation max newbie town
snaq scum zyph scum: cant tell diff from 1st option, however can be inspected
snaq town zyph scum: snaq is a good scumhunter, lynch zyph d2
snaq town zyph town: snaq genuinely believes zyph posting shit, cant tell the diff between 3rd option, unless inspector checks zyph we will have to lynch him



It seems that a snaquaza lynch gives us more information than if we lynch zyphirex. This is because snaquaza has strong scum motivations for voting for a clean zyph, but this is not reciprocal.

To be more specific, if zyph flips town or scum, snaquaza will be lynched day 2 regardless, however if snaquaza flips scum there is a chance that zyphirex is clean; but if snaq flips town zyph is going to get lynched day 2 anyway.


Be glad you picked the right option for claiming, Zyphirex. I'll be keeping a strong eye on you.

Vote snaquaza

Remember if he flips town(which is unlikely) I will be coming after you, @Zyphirex.

L-2

This is banking on the fact that snaquaza is not likely to flip town, and if this is the case the inspector can probably check Zyphirex in order to clean/damn him.

 

[Ampharos]

IMO a Snaquaza scumflip helps Zyph more than it hurts him, his complaints against Snaq have been legitimate and I'm not getting a bussing vibe from their interaction.

What do you guys think the odds are that the mafia leaves Celever alive tonight to continue casting suspicion on him (IF he's town, that is)?

 

[Metal Sonic]

0%

 

[Celever]

Too much activity :s!

@Metal Sonic just did a giant 180, seriously, absolutely massive. I cannot believe that he spent so long going for Zyph and now he unvotes him. PLUS you said he was toxic to the game, why do you want to keep him when you said yourself he will never get night-killed and he is toxic to the game so we would have to spend another day going for him? Plus, I can't think of an item that could work like Zyph said in Mario Kart. The only thing loosely connected is Thunder Cloud... I suppose that could work though. But which character would have a Thunder Cloud? My mind does not compute ;~;

I'm pleased that Jalmont is being active again.

@Walrein Now that you have said that absolutely no chance, I was hoping that it would happen but you just doomed me. Rude IMO >:[

 

[Metal Sonic]

I didn't say he was town. Its not a 180, its more of a 10; Jalmont's post made me reconsider and I decided that #1 scumread from Zyphirex has been switched to Snaquaza, and Zyphirex is #2 scumread.


Anyway celever help us decipher what item Zyphirex has and if he is lying or not. If he is, we'll find out anyway so yes

Also by claiming BG you kind of die at night lol x.x

 

[Celever]

I already said the only item possibly related to what he described was the Thunder Cloud, and the only logic is he is getting zapped by the thunder cloud by trying to kill Zyph the killer bumps into him and gets the Thunder Cloud passed unto him, however the only way this could work is if Zyph will get lynched some time in the game anyway because the Thunder Cloud would logically zap and kill him anyway.

The other possible item is the bob-omb but that would make sense as Zyph dying as well as the killer so I suppose not :/

 

[Metal Sonic]

Zyph will get lynched some time in the game anyway because the Thunder Cloud would logically zap and kill him anyway.

hehehe ironic...

or maybe his item comes with a description that says "You must act as scummy as possible or else you will get godkilled"

that will explain the behaviour of firemage+cxinlee+him

lol

 

[Celever]

It would also explain why the spot had so many subs FireMage and Cxinlee would have just been like "oh hell naw I'm not wasting my time on a game like this which will just kill me anyway >:["

 

[Metal Sonic]

yeah xD

"You will die automatically in 3 days so make the most use of what time you can!"

Eagle4 votecounts pls

 

[Ampharos]

yeah xD

"You will die automatically in 3 days so make the most use of what time you can!"

Eagle4 votecounts pls

this was literally Quagsires's role in Handicapable mafia