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OU Mawile

Discussion in 'Preliminary Pokedex' started by dragonuser, Dec 16, 2013.

  1. dragonuser

    dragonuser The only thing I look up to is the sky
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    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Overview
    ########

    Being blessed with a Mega Evolution this generation, Mawile finally has a chance to claw its way out of obscurity. The biggest boon Mawile received is its new ability, Huge Power, which doubles its Attack stat to monstrous levels. With good coverage and access to Intimidate before Mega Evolving, Mawile can be a very threatening setup sweeper. Mawile's good bulk and great typing also make it a formidable defensive pivot, able to take hits from much of the metagame. The main pitfall to Mawile is its low Speed stat, but its access to priority in Sucker Punch helps to offset that. Nonetheless, its over-reliance on Sucker Punch leaves it rather vulnerable to status and Encore users. With its buffs this generation, Mawile has turned into a formidable physical attacker that has the potential to threaten the entire metagame.

    Setup Sweeper
    ########
    name: Setup Sweeper
    move 1: Play Rough
    move 2: Sucker Punch
    move 3: Knock Off / Iron Head / Focus Punch
    move 4: Swords Dance / Substitute
    ability: Intimidate
    item: Mawilite
    evs: 132 HP / 252 Atk / 124 Spe
    nature: Adamant

    Moves
    ========

    With the equivalent of base 259 Attack, Mawile is an incredibly threatening sweeper. Play Rough serves as Mawile's premier STAB attack and has good neutral coverage. Sucker Punch offsets Mawile's low Speed stat and gets good neutral coverage in tandem with Play Rough. Knock Off eases wall breaking, removing healing from opposing walls that would otherwise trouble Mawile. Iron Head serves as another reliable STAB, getting good neutral coverage and hitting key threats like Mega Venusaur. Focus Punch carries a lot of surprise value, hitting otherwise hard counters such as Heatran and a Roosting Skamory hard. Swords Dance boosts Mawile's Attack to even more ridiculous levels, allowing it to break through common walls. Substitute can be used to ease the element of prediction needed with Sucker Punch, while also preventing status users such as Rotom-W from checking Mawile. If Substitute is used, it is recommended to use Focus Punch as well, due to the protection Substitute provides.

    Mawile also has access to many niche moves that can help it handle specific threats. Taunt, for instance, allows Mawile to reliably stop physically defensive phazers, such as Skarmory and Hippowdon, while also preventing it from being set up on. Taunt also has use in preventing an opposing wall from healing itself, easing Mawile's job as a wallbreaker. Alternatively, Fire Fang can be used to augment Mawile's coverage, beating otherwise troublesome walls such as Skarmory. Finally, Pain Split can be used in tandem with Substitute to increase Mawile's longevity.

    Set Details
    ========

    An Adamant nature maximizes Mawile's damage output, while the Speed EVs let Mawile outpace Scizor, Azumarill, and Aegislash. If Brick Break is used, it's recommended to use an alternate EV spread of 36 HP / 252 Atk / 220 Spe to outpace uninvested Heatran.

    Usage Tips
    ========

    Make use of Mawile's original ability, Intimidate, to set up more easily. Mawile's Dragon-type immunity can also aid setup, especially if the opponent is Choice-locked or locked into Outrage. Be wary in general of chip damage and overuse of Substitute; as Mawile lacks reliable recovery, every percentage point matters. Sucker Punch, despite being one of Mawile's greatest tools, can also backfire and greatly cripple Mawile if you mispredict, so always be careful when using it.

    Team Options
    ========

    Mawile works amazingly well with partners that can slow down the opponent or make use of Mawile's innately low Speed. This of course means Sticky Web and Trick Room support, but Pokemon such as Thunder Wave Thundurus also work well. Mawile also pairs well offensively with Pokemon that can reliably switch into Fire-types, making Dragon-types such as Dragonite effective partners. Mawile resists Ice and is immune to Dragon (both types that Dragon-types are weak to), while Dragon-types cover Mawile's weakness to Fire-types. Partners that can beat common physical walls, such as Hippowdon and Skarmory, are also useful. For example, Dragonite and Talonflame work very well with Mawile, weakening said walls so that Mawile can clean up. Mawile also greatly appreciates cleric support in case it mispredicts and is burned, so other Fairy-types such as Sylveon make for good partners.

    RestTalk
    ########
    name: RestTalk
    move 1: Rest
    move 2: Sleep Talk
    move 3: Play Rough
    move 4: Foul Play
    ability: Intimidate
    item: Mawilite
    evs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
    nature: Impish

    Moves
    ========

    This set forgoes Mawile's offensive capabilities for more of a support role. The key to this set is Rest, offering the longevity that the Swords Dance set lacks. Sleep Talk ensures that Mawile isn't complete setup bait by granting Mawile a good chance of attacking the opponent on the turns it's asleep. Play Rough is Mawile's main damaging move, getting a STAB boost and good neutral coverage in tandem with Foul Play. Play Rough also has the ability to lower the opponent's Attack, indirectly buffing Mawile's Defense. Foul Play deters setup sweepers from using Mawile as setup bait, as it also gets the boost from Huge Power.

    Set Details
    ========

    The EVs are focused on maximizing bulk so as to let Mawile survive as many hits as possible from common threats such as Terrakion, Breloom, and Dragonite. It's for this reason that an Impish nature is used as well.

    Usage Tips
    ========

    While a Huge Power-boosted Foul Play is great, Mega Evolving right away might not always be best, as you might sometimes want to make use of Intimidate. Be careful about letting Mawile Rest too soon, and be wary of Mawile's low Speed stat as Mawile lacks any way to damage faster opponents, as this set lacks Sucker Punch.

    Team Options
    ========

    Mawile pairs very well with bulky special walls, which both appreciate Mawile's physical bulk and cover its frail defensive side. Mawile also greatly appreciates cleric support, making Pokemon such as Sylveon and Chansey excellent partners. Due to its lack of passive healing, entry hazards greatly annoy Mawile; as a result, Rapid Spin and Defog users such as Excadrill and Mandibuzz make for good partners. Switch-ins to common Fire-types such as Talonflame and Heatran are necessary when using Mawile, making Pokemon that resist Fire such as Tyranitar good partners.

    Other Options
    ########

    A Stealth Rock set can be used, but Mawile's low Speed stat makes it a fairly unreliable hazard setter.

    Checks & Counters
    ########

    **Status Users**: Due to Mawile's reliance on Sucker Punch to handle faster threats, status users are reliable checks to any Mawile lacking Substitute. Will-O-Wisp Rotom-W is a good check, as it is able to neuter Mawile while avoiding Sucker Punch.

    **Bulky Attackers**: Many bulky pivots that can withstand Sucker Punch are good checks to Mawile. Garchomp is the most notable, as a little defensive investment lets it avoid being OHKOed and it can threaten back with Earthquake. Fighting-types such as Keldeo and Terrakion also do well, threatening Mawile with their STAB attacks.

    **Physical Walls**: Walls such as Skarmory are fairly reliable counters to Mawile sets that lack Fire Fang and can use Mawile as entry hazards setup bait or phaze it out if it accumulates too many boosts.

    **Fire-types**: Given its coverage, Mawile can have trouble against popular Fire-types, which resist most of its attacks. The most notable of these is defensive Heatran, which can wall any Mawile set that lacks Focus Punch.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 12, 2014
  2. BKC

    BKC
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    approved.

    slut.
    Jaiho likes this.
  3. dragonuser

    dragonuser The only thing I look up to is the sky
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    gracias.

    slut.
  4. alexwolf

    alexwolf Rain Summoner
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    I don't think that Swords Dance is a must on Mega Mawile, just a move you use if the opportunity for it arises. Also, why you are using a move to ''annoy'' your checks and counters (Knock Off), when you can 2HKO anything not named Heatran anyway? Knock Off is not main set material. The first three moves should always be Play Rough + Sucker Punch + Fire Fang, and the last slot should have Swords Dance / Pain Split imo, with Pain Split offering survivability and SD helping wallbreaker better and clean up wakened teams. ThunderPunch and Ice Punch could probably fit somewhere on the set too, for Pokemon such as Landorus-T, Gliscor, Tentacruel, and Talonflame.

    Also, RestTalk with Play Rough + Foul Play and max HP / max Def+ should definitely be a main set.
  5. dragonuser

    dragonuser The only thing I look up to is the sky
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    I agree about Fire Fang and Resttalk, not so much about SD and psplit getting slashed

    will implement changes shortly
  6. Colonel M

    Colonel M I don't suck it's my team that sucks!
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    Has anyone tried SubPain Split? Seems interesting on paper and Huge Power helps make up for the lack of STAB on Sucker Punch.

    - Sub
    - Pain Split
    - Play Rough
    - Sucker Punch / Knock Off

    Seems decent to try at least. Hell I would test it.
  7. Cshadow

    Cshadow

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    Edit: I suppose that if I am going to contribute / argue in favor of something, I should probably actually make a post that doesn’t suck.

    I have used this set to quite a bit of success. Substitute / Pain Split Mawile was the first set I tried out, and is also one I have kept revisiting throughout my experience with playing in Pokebank. One of the biggest boons to using this set is that alternating between Substitute / Pain Split gives Mawile the ability to wear down threats without having to resort to Mega Evolving. By conserving Mawile’s base form, you have more opportunities to take advantage of Intimidate, which can provide Mawile with more late-game openings to switch-in and pick off weakened threats, or eliminate Pokemon that would otherwise inhibit any sweepers you have in the rear. Mawile just has so much more utility and longevity when using this set, and it really capitalizes on his ability to support the team rather than just sweep the opponent’s.

    In short:
    • Substitute / Pain Split gives Mawile the opportunity to wear down the opponent's team without having to resort to Mega Evolving.
    • This gives Mawile more utility as a team player rather than a sweeper.
    • By being able to keep Intimidate for a longer period of time, Mawile can Mega Evolve later in the game after certain Pokemon have been eliminated to pick off weakened threats, eliminate certain walls, and pave the way for other sweepers.
    What I recommend:

    SubSplit
    ########
    move 1: Substitute
    move 2: Pain Split
    move 3: Play Rough
    move 4: Sucker Punch
    ability: Intimidate / Huge Power
    item: Mawilite
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 132 HP / 252 Atk / 124 Spe

    I am also kind of surprised that Focus Punch has been relegated to other options – Focus Punch / Substitute Mawile is absolutely fantastic and gives him the ability to eliminate would be counters like Heatran and Rotom-W, who would merely use Roar / Will-O-Wisp (respectively) after switching into the Swords Dance to either force you out for cripple you for the rest of the match. A Substitute-focused set also gives Mawile the opportunity to set up on Pokemon like Blissey or Jellicent, who would cripple you with Thunder Wave / Will-O-Wisp while you set-up Swords Dance (and before anyone says that Mawile does not care about Thunder Wave – a Pokemon with no speed and mediocre defenses which are only as good as they are because of his fantastic typing does not exactly want to be immobilized for a turn when trying to sweep the opponent’s team). In addition to that, Substitute isn’t competing with a coverage move to deal with threats like Skarmory, Ferrothorn, or Scizor more reliably, making the set itself less reliant on team support to punch holes in the opponent’s team. Also, Substitute makes Mega Mawile less-likely to be revenge killed, so the extra protection is nice.

    In short:
    • This set differentiates itself from the Swords Dance set by functioning as a wall-breaker rather than a sweeper, making it less reliant on team support to function and more of a team player.
    • Substitute gives Mawile protection against Pokemon that would switch-in on the Swords Dance, like Rotom-W and Heatran, and stops them from being able to cripple you with Will-O-Wisp or force you out with Roar, respectively. Heatran can do both, though.
    • Substitute protects Mawile from other common status, like Thunder Wave, and can act as a safeguard against would-be set-up opportunities, like Blissey, who would try to cripple you before switching out.
    • Unlike the Swords Dance set, Substitute isn't competing for a moveslot, so you're not going to be walled by Pokemon like Skarmory and Ferrothorn, who would probably set-up Spikes in your face, wear you down with Iron Barbs / Rocky Helmet (both, in the case of Ferrothorn) or force you out with Whirlwind (Skarmory).
    • Mawile can still beat Ferrothorn, Skarmory, and Scizor one-on-one.
    Some damage calculations:
    vs. 248 HP / 0 DEF (Calm) Heatran: (152.7 - 179.7%) -- Guaranteed OHKO.
    vs. 252 HP / 184 DEF (Relaxed) Ferrothorn: (109.6 - 129.5%) -- Guaranteed OHKO.
    vs. 252 HP / 0 DEF (Adamant) Scizor: (89.5 - 105.5%) -- Guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock.
    vs. 252 HP / 252 DEF (Impish) Skarmory: (52.3 - 61.9%) -- Guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers, Guaranteed OHKO when using Roost.
    vs. 248 HP / 252 DEF (Bold) Rotom-W: (69.7 - 82.2%) -- Guaranteed 2HKO, and actually damages Rotom-W enough to put it in the KO range for Sucker Punch (37.1 - 44%).

    What I recommend:

    SubPunch
    ########
    move 1: Substitute
    move 2: Focus Punch
    move 3: Play Rough
    move 4: Sucker Punch
    ability: Intimidate / Huge Power
    item: Mawilite
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 164 HP / 252 Atk / 92 Spe

    Unlike the other sets, this set doesn't rely on Sucker Punch to beat Scizor, so he only really needs to run enough Speed to out-pace Assault Vest Tyranitar and minimum Speed Jellicent. He can still run the other spread, though, since relying on having a Substitute up to beat Scizor may not be the most reliable option in the world.
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2013
  8. asterat

    asterat

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    So you all know mega mawile OHKOs 56/0 heatran at +2. Not much of a counter lol, this thing is way too strong.
  9. alexwolf

    alexwolf Rain Summoner
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    Offensive Heatran cannot counter Mega Mawile with SD true, but SpD Heatran with Roar can.
  10. Seven Deadly Sins

    Seven Deadly Sins ~hallelujah~
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    I wouldn't call it a counter. +2 Play Rough does 34-40%, and Heatran is neutral to SR. At best, Roar just "makes it go away". I would be hard pressed to counter Mawile with Heatran, especially since Mawile takes 97% max from Lava Plume and can Sucker Punch if you choose to try and challenge it immediately.
    6feetunder likes this.
  11. Namso

    Namso
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    Will-O-Wisp Heatran is the only Heatran that checks/counters Mawile.
  12. 6feetunder

    6feetunder

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    Skarmory is a check, not a counter. All it can do is phaze Mawile out, since brave bird does jack shit.
  13. KnockYourselfOut - Kyo

    KnockYourselfOut - Kyo

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    I'm no QC, so take what I say with a grain of salt.
    From what I'm looking at, I feel that the Physical Attacker set should be modified a bit.

    Physical Attacker
    ########
    move 1: Play Rough
    move 2: Sucker Punch
    move 3: Fire Fang / Swords Dance
    move 4: Swords Dance / Substitute
    ability: Intimidate / Huge Power
    item: Mawilite
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 132 HP / 252 Atk / 124 Spe

    Mawile's main application is to wallbreak. However, Mawile is bulky enough and strong enough to force plenty of switches, which is one of the reasons why I suggest Substitute + 3 Attacks. While it struggles more with Heatran than it did before, access to Fire Fang still allows Mawile to defeat Pokemon it would otherwise struggle with more, such as Scizor and Skarmory as well as reasons mentioned in this thread.

    Stealth Rock is a move I've been trying out lately and so far with great success, due to reasons explained above and because Mawile can deal with most Rapid Spinners and Defoggers pretty effectively. I'm not entirely sure if it's worth being part of the set though and as such, I'd consider it OO for now. Otherwise, slash it after Substitute.

    Brick Break also deserves an AC-/OO-mention, since it allows it to deal with Heatran without the use of luring with SubPunch.
    252+ Atk Huge Power Mega Mawile Brick Break vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 294-348 (76.1 - 90.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    As for Pain Split... While I can see the appeal and idea, I'm not entirely sure if it's worth a set, largely because Mawile is naturally pretty slow and not THAT bulky and such.
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2013
  14. kabbes

    kabbes

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    I didn't think that Mawile got Focus Punch?
  15. KnockYourselfOut - Kyo

    KnockYourselfOut - Kyo

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    It got Focus Punch in Gen 4 via TM.
  16. kabbes

    kabbes

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    Ah. Not a particularly easy move to obtain in-game, then!
  17. sidakarya

    sidakarya

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    It should be noted, that Heatran needs 100 Def EVs with a neutral nature to survive a +2 Sucker Punch after Stealth Rock. Of course, you could just predict the Sucker Punch and burn Mawile instead, since its other attacks don't do that much damage, even at +4 and burned. Skarmory is only a check, since it needs to eat an attack to Whirlwind it, and it can do naught else.

    Another very good check to Mawile is Landorus-T, which has Intimidate to lower attack and can take a +1 Sucker Punch or even -1 Play Rough and Sucker Punch with rocks on the field. Uninvested EQ has a possible OHKO on the 124 HP set, guaranteed with Stealth Rock or some prior damage. Rotom-H can so long as rocks are cleared off work well in a similar way as Heatran, and it only fears Stone Edge, which as far as I can tell isn't a thing yet. Revenge-killers need to be able to take a +2 Sucker Punch, but there are a lot of these (Terrakion being the finest, since it gets boosted for free).

    Also agreeing, that SubPunch is a monster of a wall-breaker. A Substitute set at least should be mentioned because of how radically different its counters and checks are. For example, Heatran, Rotom-W, and Skarmory are no longer reliable checks, but because of the lack of boosting, Landorus-T and Moltres stomach Sucker Punches easier. Also note that Substitute protects from burn, but not Roar and Whirlwind. Substitute without Leftovers means it'll be worn down fairly quickly, so Wish support is really useful.
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2013
  18. dragonuser

    dragonuser The only thing I look up to is the sky
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    Made changes to the main set to reflect the non SD Substitute set

    I am still not convinced of the utility of SubPunch > Sub set in general, but I'll test it a bit more
  19. alexwolf

    alexwolf Rain Summoner
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    Aftre testing it a bit, a SubPunch set is definitely viable and should get a main set. Being able to beat your number one check, Heatran, as well as punish hard every single switch that Mega Mawile forces is awesome. Not to mention that the combo of Focus Punch (on the switch) + Play Rough does 90% damage minimum to physically defensive Hippowdon, meaning you can 2HKO it with just one layer of Spikes or a tiny bit of previous damage. Fairy Wish passers are excellent teammates, as they attract Steel-types like the plague, and Mega Mawile is the best Pokemon in the world to punish them by getting a free Sub as they switch out, while also providing Mawile with some much appreciated recovery. Don't use any Speed EVs on this set, so you can take one S-Toss from Blissey and then set up a Sub.
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2013
  20. dragonuser

    dragonuser The only thing I look up to is the sky
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    Ok, I see validity of a SubPunch set

    added
  21. TROP

    TROP *tips fedora*
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    Minor thing I noticed while reading this: in set details for the first set it says Mawile needs 216 speed evs to outspeed univested Heatran, but this not actually true because 216 speed evs Adamant Mawile hits 190 speed and Heatran has 190 speed with 0 evs.
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2013
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  22. 6feetunder

    6feetunder

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    Why is the first set called "Physical Attacker?" ALL of Mawile's sets are physical. Calling it "Physical Attacker" implies that it can run a special set (lol).
  23. ginganinja

    ginganinja Dating Haunter
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    QC APPROVED 2/3

    Bitch
  24. Soulgazer

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    From what i know, Mawile does learn Brick Break:

    252+ Atk Huge Power Mawile Brick Break vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Heatran: 292-344 (75.84 - 89.35%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    +2 252+ Atk Huge Power Mawile Brick Break vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Heatran: 582-686 (151.16 - 178.18%) -- guaranteed OHKO

    252+ Atk Huge Power Mawile Brick Break vs. 248 HP / 255+ Def Heatran: 214-252 (55.58 - 65.45%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    +2 252+ Atk Huge Power Mawile Brick Break vs. 248 HP / 255+ Def Heatran: 426-502 (110.64 - 130.38%) -- guaranteed OHKO




    I don't see why you should run Focus Punch or Knock Off to beat it while you can easily KO Heatran (or even 2HKO it as it try to switch on Mawile) with little prior damage.

    I might be wrong though

    EDIT: I know that Brick Break doesn't offer the best coverage ever, I just wanted to point out that it does learn it when I saw there was an ENTIRE set around Mawile using Focus Punch to beat its 'best check', Heatran, when it doesn't have to.
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2013
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  25. dragonuser

    dragonuser The only thing I look up to is the sky
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    Lol pretty surprised I haven't seen that/noticed it on move list

    I added an AC mention of it, as while it does reliable beat Heatran it has little use outside of that

    will write this up tomorrow

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