1. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.
  2. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!

Metang (QC 0/3)

Discussion in 'Locked / Outdated Analyses' started by Molk, May 8, 2012.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Molk

    Molk Assault Vest Whimsicott ^_^
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Smogon IRC AOPis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    RU Leader

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2011
    Messages:
    3,227
    21:14 Zeb i really think the best way to go with it
    21:14 Zeb is to just do a joke analysis
    21:14 Zeb and explain how shit it is

    this is still being debated so hang tight.

    [​IMG]


    [Overview]

    • sciences failed attempt at creating a utility counter for the NU tier
    • counters stuff that other things counter better, but it sets up stealth rock!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! must be amazing
    • base 75 attack is terrible for a tank without a boosting move and it fails to OHKO frail stuff like simisear and chatot
    • usually sets up stealth rock and does nothing else
    • even though metang checks things, it can only check them for a limited amount of time, no recovery whatsoever, not even leftovers
    • almost every common pokemon kicks its ass directly/sets up on it
    • fails to accomplish much of anything in general
    • the only reason it wasnt rejected outright is because of usage, and even then its still slightly below the "needs a set" cutoff
    • lack of coverage prevents it from sweeping, even with several hone claws boosts
    • overall, metang is probably the worst pokemon in the NU tier that people actually use, and should never be considered for a teamslot, even in the most dire situation


    [SET]
    name: Pivot
    move 1: Stealth Rock
    move 2: Toxic
    move 3: Light Screen / Reflect
    move 4: Meteor Mash
    item: Eviolite
    nature: Impish
    evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD

    [SET COMMENTS]

    • Set up stealth rock, and do minor damage to the opposing team
    • Stealth rock because without Stealth rock metang would be outclassed by everything that gets stealth rock
    • Toxic to cripple anything metang cant hurt (read: everything)
    • Meteor mash doesnt even OHKO hoppip after rocks, but its useful so you arent COMPLETE tauntbait
    • Reflect and Light screen help your team take hits, and may possibly let a teammate set up during the 5 turns



    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    • evs and Impish Nature make sure metang dies as slowly and painfully as possible, and maybe it will actually do something :o
    • Good Teammates are: nothing because metang is so bad nothing can support it enough to make it useful. (something that benefits from screens and can actually do something, like Gurdurr or Fraxure)
    • clear body blocks intimidate from shit like tauros (not like it will be doing damage anyway but w/e
    • here are some calcs of the incredible damage metang can do

    [Hilarious calcs of metang 3hkoing ninjask and shit go here]
    Meteor Mash: 157-186 (58.14 - 68.88%) this is against eviolite hoppip, nuff' said

    • alternate ev spread of 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 spe with an adamant nature to do slightly more damage and outrun things like vileplume by 1 point

    • Light Clay for longer screens, but metang loses a crapload of bulk which is really the only good thing about it, bar metang clause it will probably take one hit, without eviolite it cant take hits very well

    [Other Options]

    • Restalk is cool, except you cant damage anything and lose stealth rock, which is pretty much the only reason to use metang in the first place
    • signal beam to do 28% to tangela and not OHKO exeggutor
    • hone claws mono attacker thats walled by pretty much every physically defensive pokemon and cant defend itself
    • trick room.... oh wait it doesnt learn it
      • Explosion for when metang realizes that its completely useless

    [Checks and Counters]

    • Misdreavus taunts it prevents it from setting up stealth rock
    • anything that has taunt, really
    • anything that doesnt care about toxic/is boosted by it
    • wartortle rapid spins away rocks and takes less than1 1% from meteor mash
    • magmortar can come in and fire blast it to death
    • duosion and scraggy get to +6 and sweep
    • gorebyss gets not an easy +2 but an easy +4 on it
    • ninjask is only 3hkod by meteor mash and can make a teammate sweep your entire team
    • quagsire hard walls you bar toxic
    • samurott also gets a free+4 vs you
    • garbodor sets up 3 layers of spikes on you without breaking a sweat
    • tangela buts you to sleep
    • gurdurr gets boosted by guts and sets up in your face
    • skuntank can taunt you to stop you from doing anything, or just 2hko you with fire blast if its mixed
    • this is only a small amount of counters
    • lastly, metang clause, whenever metang is about to do something, PO's rng makes sure it dies as quickly as possible (seriously when i tested it in half the matches it got OHKOed by a crit EQ lol)
  2. Zebraiken

    Zebraiken
    is a member of the Site Staffis an official Team Rateris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderatoris a Super Moderator Alumnus
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2011
    Messages:
    2,999
    Hi QC team, there's a pretty big issue that we have with Metang. DTC, tennis, and I (actually not tennis but I'm throwing him in here anyway) agreed that we should open it up to discussion amongst the QC members: Should Metang have an analysis at all? And if it does deserve one, should it be a serious analysis or a joke one?

    Consider the following points:

    - Metang is generally accepted to be awful
    - Metang already has an analysis on-site
    - Metang has something like 3.2% usage, which is pretty high
    - Metang does have a few niche uses, like (paraphrasing from DTC) semi-countering Braviary and some Psychic-types, amongst other things

    I'd really like to strongly leave this to the QC team to sort out, although if you're not on QC and you must post something about it that provokes some discussion and isn't listed above then go ahead, sure.
  3. TROP

    TROP [02:45] <~Molk> i have a personal hatred for druddigon
    is a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2011
    Messages:
    755
    Need a mention of Garbodor getting 3 layers easily against Metang, and possibly 1 Toxic Spikes Layer if Metang goes for SR.

    Earthquake: 136-162 (37.36 - 44.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO. Calc for reference.

    And we all know getting all those hazards against you is great.

    think of it like UU ambipom good players agree that it is awful while bad ones think it is good, and because more bad players than good ones play it results in it having a high usage.
  4. Steamroll

    Steamroll resident zombie
    is a Smogon IRC AOPis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2011
    Messages:
    2,340
    Give me some rocks, iron-oxide shavings and a rock polisher; I'll make thermite in three hours.

    not to be a total jerk or anything, but seriously if this thing does get an analysis it should be a joke analysis. Seriously this thing is a pile of crap.

    Here's my reasons for:
    - usage (63rd in april just missing NU cut)
    - stopping jynx
    - soft checking Braviary
    - soft checking some psychics (Eggy hates this thing)
    - Hazards

    Here's my reasons against:
    - lacks power
    - lacks speed
    - lacks recovery
    - lacks anything useful beyond setting up rocks
    - total set-up bait for all sorts of teams
    - fails to 2hko most of the tier (IT FAILS TO 2hko some ABSOL GOD DAMNIT)

    I believe the usage of it comes from people unaware of just how fucking bad it is. I mean sure when I first got QC I tested it, but the only reason why I remotely approved of it was because there were 200 other mons getting sets and it actually had use in checking 95% of Jynx at the time (which was and still is the only reason why I'd use it). People look at its stats and think that it's just an average mon, but when you get down to the movepool and the types of mons running around in the tier you realize that Metang is rolling further and further down the bell curve; to the point where its only shining moments are the fact that it soft checks some key mons. besides, those mons that are soft-checked can easily blow past with a decent strategy and team built around them.
  5. breh

    breh
    is a Smogon IRC AOP

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2010
    Messages:
    3,098
    I realize that it's weak, but it's hard to disagree with the fact that those defenses are phenomenal. Its defense score approaches that of max invested Registeel and its Special Defense score is about 5/6 of it (assuming both run 252/252+)

    restalk seems less awful than lead tbh; agreeing that lead gets up rocks and sits there (and is thus a bad set). At least restalk can switch in multiple times, toxic something if it's lucky, and switch out. This thing can wall every physical attacker without setup moves bar Emboar and Rapidash, which is something. Meteor Mash / Toxic / Rest / Sleep Talk seems less terrible. In a way, it's like a Regirock with better typing and far less power.

    Regardless of whatever you choose to do, you shouldn't be running 4 Spe to begin with for speed creep reasons.
  6. jrrrrrrr

    jrrrrrrr wubwubwub
    is a Tiering Contributoris a Battle Server Moderatoris a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    May 23, 2006
    Messages:
    3,172
    Registeel is different. At least it can use Seismic Toss to actually deal damage, and it gets Thunder Wave for support. Metang just can't hurt anything, and IT LOSES TO THE THINGS ITS SUPPOSED TO COUNTER.

    But with that said, if it is actually seen in the tier then it should be given an analysis. That's the point of analyses: analyzing the pokemon in the metagame. Metang is at 3.2% usage, which is not negligible. If someone wants to do it, why not? lol
  7. tennisace

    tennisace BAPBAPBAPBAPBAPBAP
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a CAP Contributor Alumnus
    Twitter Head

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2007
    Messages:
    6,579
    This is a terrible Pokemon, and its analysis should reflect that. I don't think it should be given the "full joke treatment" (by that I mean the tone of the Unown or Farfetch'd analysis), but the analysis should make it abundantly clear that the only thing Metang does good is sit there and maybe Toxic something or get up SR or tickle something's balls and the only reason it is ever considered for a teamslot is that it is a Steel-type.
  8. erisia

    erisia (macho) brace yourselves
    is a Contributor to Smogon

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2011
    Messages:
    882
    Let's have a look at all of the bad points about Metang.

    • The most dangerous threat it checked, Jynx, is now gone.
    • Unlike Probopass and Bastiodon, it has the support movepool of a blueberry muffin.
    • As illustrated by the calcs, it can't deal with some ridiculous things due to its low attacking power. So it can't support or attack effectively.
    • This thing is ludicrous setup fodder for stuff like Samurott, Gorebyss, Torterra, pretty much anything with decent physical bulk or a resistance to Steel. Calm Mind + Baton Pass Musharna just laughs as you try to "counter" it.
    • Golem pretty much 100% outclasses it as a Stealth Rock lead. It gets more powerful STAB, better coverage, a better priority move, and its physical bulk is still plenty good enough. It's not setup fodder either as Earthquake / Rock Blast + Sucker Punch can break through a lot.
    • If overall defensiveness and being a Steel type is your argument, then Klang is my counterpoint. This is not enough to give it an analysis, especially when the latter can use Gear Grind, Trick Room, Thunder Wave, Shift Gear, Volt Switch...
    People say it's a good bird and Psychic counter, but Skuntank is a FAR better response to Psychic types as it can actually kill them and gain some offensive momentum, whereas Metang has to just throw out a Meteor Mash and wait for the opponent to switch almost anything into it. Luxray does a much better job at dealing with Braviary and Swellow, and can gain momentum with Thunder Wave / Volt Switch.

    In my opinion, Metang doesn't warrant an analysis. However, with its substantial usage, I get the feeling that there needs to be an analysis that actually discourages people from using it. It's a bad, bad pokemon, but people are still going to think "oooh, shiny!" unless we tell them otherwise. When it's usage drops, then we can remove the analysis.

    Also, Toxic should be slashed with Bullet Punch. It'll give Metang the option of somewhat deterring setup sweepers.
  9. Steamroll

    Steamroll resident zombie
    is a Smogon IRC AOPis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2011
    Messages:
    2,340
    Erisia the only qualm I have with your post is that Blueberry Muffins are OU in the Muffin Metagame, and you're doing it and the kind people who tier them injustice. Now if you mentioned Bran Muffins...
  10. MikeDecIsHere

    MikeDecIsHere Congregation of the Classiest
    is a Battle Server Moderatoris a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2010
    Messages:
    2,463
    bran muffins are great

    There seems to be this idea running around in NU that any Pokemon is viable if it has access to Eviolite, which is probably why Metang is even though of being used in the first place.

    I guess maybe mention Zen Headbutt in the OO since it is another STAB Option, and since Bullet Punch is honestly completely worthless on this thing sometimes (though every move is worthless on a worthless Pokemon).

    Yeah, Metang is shit.
  11. DTC

    DTC ˢᵉʳᶦᵒᵘˢ
    is a Battle Server Administratoris a Forum Moderatoris a Smogon IRC SOPis a Pokemon Researcheris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnus
    Moderator

    Joined:
    May 8, 2011
    Messages:
    1,684
    Metang is not bad enough for a joke analysis. Yes, it is very bad, but in the extremely rare circumstance where you need everything that Metang has to offer, it can be slightly useful. At best, it sets up Stealth Rock, kills/weakens something it actually checks, and maybe kills off something with Bullet Punch. That's enough, imo. However, emphasize that Metang should only be used when you /really/ need everything that it can offer.

    It offers:
    1) A wonderful defensive typing in Steel/Psychic
    2) Amazing bulk
    3) The ability to check most Flying-, Psychic-, and Ice-types. Also checks Pokemon such as Cincinno
    4) Stealth Rock
    5) Priority (albeit very weak)

    Of course, it also has 2 major flaws:
    1) Incredibly weak
    2) No recovery

    Those things really pull it down and makes it much worse as a Pokemon.

    Please make the skeleton less pretentious and sarcastic. Even as a joke analysis, it's not really funny and isn't very useful. Explain why Metang is a very bad Pokemon and should rarely ever—if ever—should be considered for a team.

    Also, there is no need to remove the analysis once it's up, imo. What if its usage rises up?
  12. tennisace

    tennisace BAPBAPBAPBAPBAPBAP
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a CAP Contributor Alumnus
    Twitter Head

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2007
    Messages:
    6,579
    Your own wording and the rest of your post says that Metang is crap. A sarcastic tone is fine as long as Molk doesn't go too overboard with jokes (which I've been working with him on). Again, I'm not going to allow a full on Unown level joke analysis, but if Molk wants to be sarcastic in explaining why not to use Metang, I'll chalk it up to author's voice.
  13. Oglemi

    Oglemi it's me heysup's gay friend, the legendary gaysup
    is a Tournament Directoris a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
    C&C Leader

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2009
    Messages:
    8,067
    I gave Molk a set to use that should use Metang to its best abilities, and not the one in the OP

    [SET]
    name: Pivot
    move 1: Stealth Rock
    move 2: Toxic
    move 3: Light Screen / Reflect
    move 4: Meteor Mash
    item: Eviolite
    nature: Impish
    evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD

    Basic idea is to use it as a pivot, and not a tank. Switch it in, set up Stealth Rock, switch out to the appropriate teammate. Metang has a nice typing, use it to its advantage. It should be played a lot like Slowking or Steelix in RU. Toxic gives Metang some utility since Meteor Mash isn't doing jack shit to most opponents. Light Screen or Reflect gives it something for a teammate to use to set up and sweep the opponent; most mons in NU only need a turn of set up and Metang can give it to them.

    In any case, this should be the set to use if you're using Metang, and not the one in the OP, which doesn't really do anything at all.
  14. Molk

    Molk Assault Vest Whimsicott ^_^
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Smogon IRC AOPis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    RU Leader

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2011
    Messages:
    3,227
    yeah that set might be the best way to use metang

    ill test it out in the morning


    EDIT: Metang the best's Metang used Meteor Mash! A critical hit! [CF] Cooloolcool's Haunter lost 72% of its health!

    i loled
  15. Molk

    Molk Assault Vest Whimsicott ^_^
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Smogon IRC AOPis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    RU Leader

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2011
    Messages:
    3,227
    ummmmm, so is this going to be a joke analysis or not?

    i need to get to writing this either way
  16. No Luck Involved

    No Luck Involved

    Joined:
    May 8, 2011
    Messages:
    1,705
    Metang is pretty bad and is set up bait for a lot of things but so is a lot of Pokemon. Stuff like Armaldo lacking SD can't reliably spin at all, or do much damage and often just sets SR and dies in a match or gets set up on all the same. There's many more examples, e.g. Camerupt back in the day. Metang just might be a particularly bad case but its purpose is still just to get a few hits on something before dying which isn't too different from a lot of things. If certain people had a particular team that just needed something (anything) to set SR and tank a couple of hits then Metang has a unique typing that may appeal to them. Just a thought.
  17. Zebraiken

    Zebraiken
    is a member of the Site Staffis an official Team Rateris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderatoris a Super Moderator Alumnus
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2011
    Messages:
    2,999
    Armaldo has base 125 Attack and two pretty cool dual STABs which are only resisted by Steel-types (not Metang, though!!) and Fighting-types. It's certainly not set-up bait imo (unless the set-upper is Gurdurr). Idk who used non-Roar Camerupt, but that was certainly the best set and not set-up bait either. Metang doesn't really do either of these things, really. :(


    Oglemi's set should be the way to go. I like it infinitely better than the one in the OP. At least it actually does something and provides team support... and with that set in particular, I'd really like it to be more of a legitimate analysis rather than a joke one, since that set has some (albeit minor) utility. I'll QC an updated skeleton.
  18. Zebraiken

    Zebraiken
    is a member of the Site Staffis an official Team Rateris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderatoris a Super Moderator Alumnus
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2011
    Messages:
    2,999
    See you in three months.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)