Ladder Mix and Mega

[Hourai]

Read the rules/banlist is there something I'm missing here?View attachment 56520

Its Speed would drop into the negatives and its Defense would go above 255

 

[Lemon Ginger]

Some more interesting sets:

+ Red Orb
zappity doo da (Raikou) @ Red Orb
Ability: Pressure
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Rash Nature
- Weather Ball
- Thunder / Aura Sphere
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Volt Switch

This is a pretty cool user of red orb, since it gets stab weather ball and can threaten most blue orb users with electric attacks. Thunder is useful only when predicting a switch into a blue orb user, so use it wisely. HP ice is for zygarde. What stinks is that you have to use rash nature, so speed is 329, but at least you creep the 328s lol. Obviously, it is tough to argue using this over zapdos beyond the surprise factor and extra power.

+ Banettite
Black Jesus (Mew) @ Banettite
Ability: Synchronize
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Transform
- Roost
- Will-O-Wisp
- Super Fang

Along with having lots o' special bulk, this mew can deal with set up or annoying fatmons. Since you can't taunt through magic bounce, super fang is good for wearing down checks or forcing recovery. Will-o is obvious. Sure you're not taking advantage of the +50 attack, but 100/110/120 defenses are good. Transform is pretty fun against manaphy or toxic wielding magic bouncers. Counter sweep for days (on the 50:50 ayyy)

+ Aggronite
Tyranitar @ Aggronite
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Rock Slide
- Ice Punch
- Earthquake

Resists all the ates. You can either DD or bop them as you mega, while they expect to hit super effectively on the dark type. Surprise now you're steel.


P.S. use cameruptite Hoopa-U
I already made a post about this, but it is so good once e-speeders are gone.

Let's compare to OU's nuke of choice...
Against normal-typed 252/252+ Mew:
252+ SpA Sheer Force Hoopa Unbound Psychic vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Mew: 219-258 (54.2 - 63.8%)
252 SpA Choice Specs Latios Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Mew: 229-271 (56.6 - 67%)

also food for thought
252 SpA Choice Specs Latios Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Hoopa Unbound: 211-250 (57.9 - 68.6%)

So Hoopa-U does nearly as much damage as SPECS LATIOS, only it doesn't drop to -2, AND it has the special bulk of MAX INVESTMENT MEW, with only HP investment.

HAIL YOUR TRICK ROOM OVERLORD

 

[Quantum Tesseract]

what are the best Lopunnite users? (with sets)

thnx in advance

Hoopa-Unbound @ Lopunnite
Ability: Magician
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Zen Headbutt
- Drain Punch
- Gunk Shot/Hyperspace Fury
- Power-Up Punch/Hyperspace Fury
hands down the best

Mew @ Lopunnite
Ability: Synchronize
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Drain Punch
- Zen Headbutt
- Swords Dance
- Earthquake
Good

Terrakion @ Lopunnite
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Stone Edge
- Stealth Rock
- Swords Dance

Staraptor @ Lopunnite
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Double-Edge
- Brave Bird
- U-turn

 

[OM]

Some more interesting sets:

+ Red Orb
zappity doo da (Raikou) @ Red Orb
Ability: Pressure
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Rash Nature
- Weather Ball
- Thunder / Aura Sphere
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Volt Switch

This is a pretty cool user of red orb, since it gets stab weather ball and can threaten most blue orb users with electric attacks. Thunder is useful only when predicting a switch into a blue orb user, so use it wisely. HP ice is for zygarde. What stinks is that you have to use rash nature, so speed is 329, but at least you creep the 328s lol. Obviously, it is tough to argue using this over zapdos beyond the surprise factor and extra power.

+ Banettite
Black Jesus (Mew) @ Banettite
Ability: Synchronize
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Transform
- Roost
- Will-O-Wisp
- Super Fang

Along with having lots o' special bulk, this mew can deal with set up or annoying fatmons. Since you can't taunt through magic bounce, super fang is good for wearing down checks or forcing recovery. Will-o is obvious. Sure you're not taking advantage of the +50 attack, but 100/110/120 defenses are good. Transform is pretty fun against manaphy or toxic wielding magic bouncers. Counter sweep for days (on the 50:50 ayyy)

+ Aggronite
Tyranitar @ Aggronite
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Rock Slide
- Ice Punch
- Earthquake

Resists all the ates. You can either DD or bop them as you mega, while they expect to hit super effectively on the dark type. Surprise now you're steel.


P.S. use cameruptite Hoopa-U
I already made a post about this, but it is so good once e-speeders are gone.

Let's compare to OU's nuke of choice...
Against normal-typed 252/252+ Mew:
252+ SpA Sheer Force Hoopa Unbound Psychic vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Mew: 219-258 (54.2 - 63.8%)
252 SpA Choice Specs Latios Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Mew: 229-271 (56.6 - 67%)

also food for thought
252 SpA Choice Specs Latios Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Hoopa Unbound: 211-250 (57.9 - 68.6%)

So Hoopa-U does nearly as much damage as SPECS LATIOS, only it doesn't drop to -2, AND it has the special bulk of MAX INVESTMENT MEW, with only HP investment.

HAIL YOUR TRICK ROOM OVERLORD

As an Avid user of red orb raikou I can say that you're underselling red orb raikou a lot.

Electric/Fire is great coverage and the +50 special attack post primal means that it out damages blue orb raikou 100% of the time. It can also deal with zapdos easily and resists all forms of -ate thanks to it's shiny new electric/fire type. Ground types are scarydue to the 4x weakness, but this also deals with most steel types.

 

[thdhted]

I've used Red Orb Raikou before. It's definitely solid. It breaks walls pretty hard, and deals with Absolite Manaphy so easily it isn't even funny. It's fast enough to outrun most things pre-mega and powerful enough to take them down. However, it struggles with ground types and opposing Red Orb users, requiring some support. Switching into a Weather Ball is difficult, but getting raikou in to do so can be a bit tricky. I definitely recommend Aura sphere on aggressive Calm Mind sets, as that allows you to bop Blue Orb Steels as well as do a solid chunk to Blissey outside of your weather.

 

[Lemon Ginger]

I've used Red Orb Raikou before. It's definitely solid. It breaks walls pretty hard, and deals with Absolite Manaphy so easily it isn't even funny. It's fast enough to outrun most things pre-mega and powerful enough to take them down. However, it struggles with ground types and opposing Red Orb users, requiring some support. Switching into a Weather Ball is difficult, but getting raikou in to do so can be a bit tricky. I definitely recommend Aura sphere on aggressive Calm Mind sets, as that allows you to bop Blue Orb Steels as well as do a solid chunk to Blissey outside of your weather.

Yup, I very much agree. Why is this thing not on the VR btw? It is definitely better than half the B level stuff, and is definitely the best of the orb+weatherball users. (Though redorb roserade is bananas).

I don't mean to be underselling it, I just feel that red orb zapdos does just about the same thing and more, along with having recovery or utility options like defog and tailwind.

 

[Imperator Romanum]

Yup, I very much agree. Why is this thing not on the VR btw? It is definitely better than half the B level stuff, and is definitely the best of the orb+weatherball users. (Though redorb roserade is bananas).

I don't mean to be underselling it, I just feel that red orb zapdos does just about the same thing and more, along with having recovery or utility options like defog and tailwind.

The Viability rankings are going to be very much reworked! Which is gonna happen throughout the weak! Nothing really is bad worthy imo, so it'll probably be a pretty consistent month!

Pm me on the server if you want something nommed! I'll be on in 30 minutes! Also, my team lost after a 80 winstreak ;(

 

[thdhted]

The Viability rankings are going to be very much reworked! Which is gonna happen throughout the weak! Nothing really is bad worthy imo, so it'll probably be a pretty consistent month!

Pm me on the server if you want something nommed! I'll be on in 30 minutes! Also, my team lost after a 80 winstreak ;(

I'd love to help with that if you're working on the Viability Rankings. I worked on the Mega Stone Rankings(Lukethehedgehog refined it and added in megastone sprites), as well as contributed to the first viability rankings of them(never got finished.).

 

[Quantum Tesseract]

I would like to nominate Hoopa-U for A rank.

My reasons are as follows:
First- Hoopa-U can use a wide variety of stones. These include: Lopunnite, Manectite, Pinsirite, Salamencite, Lucarionite, Absolite, Diancite, Sceptilite, Charizardite-X and Pidgeotite
Second- Hoopa has incredible stats. With the exception of speed and defense, they are easily uber tier, with incredible 160/170 offenses
Third- It has two boosting moves. Between nasty plot (special) and Power Up Punch (lopunnite), it can easily boost up and defeat stallmons. The switches it causes gives it plenty of opportunities to set up.
Fourth- It has a wide moverpool. While it isn't as large as it might wish, it gets Gunk Shot, Drain Punch, Power Up Punch, Hyperspace Fury, Dual Chop, Last Resort, and Zen Headbut for physical sets, and Psyshock, Psychic, Dark Pulse, Shadow Ball, Signal beam, Nasty Plot, Focus Blast, Energy ball, Grass Knot and Thunderbolt for special sets.
Fifth- Its speed, while not fast even with a stone, can outspeed many things that haven't mega evolved yet.
Sixth- it demolishes stallmons.

I would nom for higher, but the meta is still not solidified so I'm not sure how it'll stack up.

 

[InfernapeTropius11]

I would like to nominate Hoopa-U for A rank.
View attachment 56590
My reasons are as follows:
First- Hoopa-U can use a wide variety of stones. These include: Lopunnite, Manectite, Pinsirite, Salamencite, Lucarionite, Absolite, Diancite, Sceptilite, Charizardite-X and Pidgeotite
Second- Hoopa has incredible stats. With the exception of speed and defense, they are easily uber tier, with incredible 160/170 offenses
Third- It has two boosting moves. Between nasty plot (special) and Power Up Punch (lopunnite), it can easily boost up and defeat stallmons. The switches it causes gives it plenty of opportunities to set up.
Fourth- It has a wide moverpool. While it isn't as large as it might wish, it gets Gunk Shot, Drain Punch, Power Up Punch, Hyperspace Fury, Dual Chop, Last Resort, and Zen Headbut for physical sets, and Psyshock, Psychic, Dark Pulse, Shadow Ball, Signal beam, Nasty Plot, Focus Blast, Energy ball, Grass Knot and Thunderbolt for special sets.
Fifth- Its speed, while not fast even with a stone, can outspeed many things that haven't mega evolved yet.
Sixth- it demolishes stallmons.

I would nom for higher, but the meta is still not solidified so I'm not sure how it'll stack up.

I am gonna agree with this wholeheartedly, and I would even push for A+ or S. I have used it on my most successful team to date (41-3, mostly in challenges/tours against decent people, fuck ladder), and it really is fantastic. It has excellent coverage, unbelievable raw power, and the ability to fix all of its problems. Wanna take on -ates? Become a hard hitting tank w/ Slowbronite or Aggronite. Wanna nuke tf outta walls? Use something like Lucarionite, Blastoisinite, or Cameruptite. Wanna fix its terrible speed issues? Use Diancite, Loppunite, or Absolite. It's unpredictablity is such a huge boon for it, as switching in something you think can wall it can get smashed, putting you at an immediate disadvantage. It can abuse different stones to gain STABs and power through checks. I've never been disappointed whenever I've used it and it is just so incredible at nuking stuff. One of those mons that puts in work every game, and it definitely deserves a high ranking.

 

[xJownage]

The Viability rankings are going to be very much reworked! Which is gonna happen throughout the weak! Nothing really is bad worthy imo, so it'll probably be a pretty consistent month!

Pm me on the server if you want something nommed! I'll be on in 30 minutes! Also, my team lost after a 80 winstreak ;(

My original viability rankings from the OP aren't updated iirc, so here's the one you want:

Mix-and-Mega Viability Rankings!!!!1​

That's right, we're doing this again.


S Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are at the top of mix and mega's metagame. These Pokemon are able to perform a variety of roles very effectively, or can just do one extremely well. Their use has low risk involved and high reward exerted. Pokemon in this rank have very few flaws that are patched up by numerous positive traits. These Pokemon are here as top threats and potential Bans due to using multiple megastones easily or just one very well.

S Rank

Mew (Ampharosite, Lopunnite, Pidgeotite, Diancite)

Primal Groudon (Red orb)

Manaphy (Sceptilite, Absolite)

A Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are fantastic in the Mix-and-Mega metagame, and can sweep, support, or wall significant portions of the metagame. These Pokemon require less support than most others to be used effectively and have few flaws that can easily be overlooked when compared to their positive traits.

A+ Rank

Victini (Red Orb, Cameruptite, Pidgeotite)

Blissey (Sablenite, Slowbronite)

Terrakion (Lucarionite, Diancite, Pinsirite, Lopunnite)

Thundurus (Manectite, Pideotite, Altarianite)

Gengar (Absolite, Manectite, Diancite, Pidgeotite)

Zygarde (Altarianite, Pinsirite)

Arceus-Normal

A Rank:

Heatran (Latiasite, Absolite, Pidgeotite, Red Orb, Altarianite, Cameruptite)

Entei (Pinsirite, Altarianite, Aerodactylite, Red Orb)

Landorus-T (Lopunnite, Mewtwonite X, Altarianite, Salamencite)

Archeops (Aerodactylite, Charizardite X, Pinsirite, Salamencite, Lucarionite)

Arcanine (Salamencite, Altarianite, Banettite, Pinsirite, Red orb)

Suicune (Aggronite, Slowbronite, Sceptilite, Blue Orb)

Gyarados (Salamencite, Pinsirite, Charizardite X, Blue Orb, Aggronite)

Weavile (Glalitite, Aerodactylite)

Tornadus (Pidgeotite)

Metagross (Pinsirite, Aerodactylite, Diancite)

A- Rank:

Mamoswine (Lucarionite, Glalitite)

Keldeo (Lucarionite, Blue Orb, Pidgeotite, Absolite, Manectite)

Diggersby (Medichamite)

Ferrothorn (Blue Orb)

Kyurem (Glalitite, Diancite, Aggronite, Absolite, Sablenite, Camerupite, Pinsirite)

Latios(Altarianite, Sceptilite, Manectite, Absolite, Lucarionite, SoulDew)

Noivern (Gardevoirite, Pidgeotite, Salamencite)

Hippowdon (Red Orb, Sablenite, Slowbronite)

Excadrill (Lucarionite, Pinsirite)

Zapdos (Manectite, Pidgeotite, Sablenite, Venusaurite)

Skarmory (Blue Orb, Venusaurite)

Xerneas

B Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are great in the Mix-and-Mega metagame. These Pokemon have more notable flaws than those above them that affect how they function in the tier. Their positive traits still outshine their negatives, but they require a bit more team support to bring out their full potential.

B+ Rank

Blaziken (Blazikenite)

Tyranitar (Sharpedonite, Steelixite, Garchompite, Diancite, Pinsirite, Salamencite)

Staraptor (Lopunnite, Pinsirite, Mewtwonite X, Aerodactylite)

Snorlax (Banettite, Metagrossite, Altarianite, Salamencite)

Cobalion (Aerodactylite, Lucarionite, Galladite)

Garchomp (Gyaradosite, Diancite, Banettite, Scizorite)

Giratina (A)

Togekiss (Gardevoirite, Aggronite)

Slowking (Sceptilite, Slowbronite)

Slowbro (Slowbronite, Aggronite, Sceptilite)

Mewtwo (Mewtwonite X, Mewtwonite Y)

Gourgeist-Super (Aggronite)

Hoopa-Unbound (Manectite, Diancite, Absolite, Aggronite)

Jirachi (Metagrossite, Sceptilite, Ampharosite, Diancite, Manectite, Absolite)

Ho-Oh

Kangaskhan (Kangaskhanite)

B Rank

Mienshao (Lopunny, Altarianite, Pinsirite, Aerodactylite)

Porygon-Z (Diancite, Altarianite, Pidgeotite, Absolite, Manectite)

Latias (Soul Dew)

Azumarill (Mawilite, Medichamite)

Rypherior (Heracronite)

Infernape (Banettite, Diancite)

Azelf (Red Orb)

Scizor (Blue Orb)

Breloom (Banettite)

Lugia

Volcarona (Red Orb, Sablenite)

Vaporeon (Aggronite, Sceptilite, Sablenite)

Meloetta (Slowbronite, Lopunnite, Manectite)

Yveltal

Genesect

Deoxys Attack

Arceus Ghost

B- Rank

Roserade (Red Orb, Scizorite, Pidgeotite)

Flygon (Pinsirite, Altarianite)

Giratina (O)

Salamence (Salamencite, Pinsirite)

Alakazam (Pidgeotite, Absolite, Manectite)

Bisharp (Metagrossite, Lucarionite)

Haxorus (Gyaradosite, Metagrossite, Aerodactylite)

Shaymin-Sky

Darkrai

Magnezone (Latiasite, Cameruptite, Diancite, Manectite)

Starmie (Pidgeotite, Blue Orb, Sceptilite, Altarianite)

Rayquaza

Krookodile (Blue Orb, Altarianite, Diancite)

Milotic (Sceptilite)

Heliolisk (Sceptilite, Manectite, Blue Orb)

Kyurem-Black

Kyurem-White

Deoxys Speed

C Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are mediocre in the Mix-and-Mega metagame, but have just as many notable flaws that prevent them from being effective. Pokemon in the C tier often require significant support to be effective. Pokemon from this rank tend to face a lot of competition with the more commonly used Pokemon. These Pokemon exert a below average presence in the current metagame.

C Rank

Hydreigon (Blastoisinite, Manectite, Gardevoirite)

Gorebyss (Banettite)

Kyogre

Conkeldurr (Gyaradosite, Pinsirite, Aerodactylite, Charizardite X)

Aegislash

Chandelure (Red Orb, Cameruptite)

Goodra (Ampharosite, Gardevoirite)

Dialga

Palkia

Dragonite

Rotom-Wash (Manectite)

Reshiram

Zekrom

Darmanitan (Diancite, Pinsirite, Altarianite)

Deoxys Defense

D Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are mediocre in the Mix-and-Mega metagame, but are viable enough to justify their use on select teams. These Pokemon are either usable but have no real niche, or are only capable of doing their specific task and fail at doing anything more than that. Pokemon from this rank have multiple crippling flaws that prevent them from being successful a majority of the time, and are often severely outclassed because of it.

D Rank

Shaymin (Lucarionite, Manectite)

Reuniclus (Cameruptite)

Drifblim (Banettite)

Diancie (Altarianite, Diancite)

Cresselia

Greninja

Meganium (Sablenite, Audinite)

Deoxys Normal

Arceus Steel


''CONCLUSION REACHED'' POKEMON: Pokemon in this list have reached a conclusive ideal ranking, so unless the metagame changes towards them or there is something about them that hasn't been said, discussion about them is disallowed.

• None

BLACKLISTED POKEMON: Pokemon that are not only unviable in Mix-and-Mega, but also make the thread shitty whenever they are brought up because most people that argue about them getting ranked are inexperienced players using bad arguments.

• Dewgong

Rules:

• Post Intelligently. Your argument should consist of the pokemon's effectiveness relative to the tier's threats, and how it fits into a certain ranking.
• NO flaming over rankings. OM has had an issue before with some arguments getting a little heated, but I will ask a moderator to delete any post containing an argument that is remotely insulting.
• Usage/how common something is should not be used in your argument. Viability rankings isn't what mons are the most used, its what's the most effective.
• Eevee General is beautiful. This is an undisputed fact.

Notes​

• Thanks to Dr. Phd. BJ, AllJokesAside, Ransei, SpartanMalice, InfernapeTropius11 for helping me do the rankings!
  
• All ranks are up for debate atm. Nominate a mon if it is not listed, or nominate movements.
  
• Any and all nominations can be rejected for any reason if there is consensus it is a bad nomination.
  
• If you nominate a new mon, be sure to include ALL stones it can viably use, unless some stones are very niche in comparison to their ranking.
• Updates may be slow, please be patient; I will update this in bulk.

Bunch of things need to be added and moved, and descriptions of ranks removed, but nothing excessive. I would love to help you with this whenever possible and can repost/reorganize whenever decisions are made. This was on page 25, for reference.

 

[Ghoul King]

We now have a banner, thanks to Ransei.

Revel in its glory.

Oh, and feel free to keep discussing the meta itself of course.

 

[Quantum Tesseract]

Ransei op.
On the thought of manaphy, here is a preliminary replay. I'm still gathering them, but this one stood out. I think it needs to be looked into.
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/mixandmega-326773490 Manaphy has power and acceptable bulk. Not as good as the other one, but and actual replay this time.

 

[InfernapeTropius11]

Nice job linking the room, noob




/s

No need to say this in the thread, that's what VMs are for (in fact I've already VMed him about this).

So this isn't also a complete shitpost, I'd just like to throw it out there that I too would be interested in helping with the VR. I've also tested Cobalion, and agree with a high ranking for it, bird spam is just so good, and bulky walls that can defeat -atespeeders can't always take a +2 Return/Frustration (depending on your preference). And now for a nom:

--> B+ Rank
I've been using Vaporeon on my most recent team (which you can check out here) as a Wish passer to Cobalion and Primal Groudon. I used Sablenite, and I believe the main thing that differentiates it from Suicune is its access to Wish, and its niche over Blissey is access to Scald and the ability to take on Keldeo and Terrakion. It's never let me down every time I used it, and serves as a great -ate check to boot.

 

[Funbot28]

Ghoul King Can you update the second post with Jownage's VR? It seems to be the more updated one

I agree with Hoopa-U to A+, due to it's amazing wallbreaking capabilities with Absolite and Diancite (even Manectite to some extent). Yes it's low Defense leaves it suspectible to -ate speed, but when that's out of the way, it can literally destroy teams not running mons above ~130 Speed. Cameprutite is also amazing on TR teams, really having no switchins at all (Ampharosite Mew gets 2HKO'ed by Psychic). Definitely a top tier mon.

Still gonna bring up Zygarde to S

I also have another nomination:

Klingklang Unranked -> C

So I have been testing out Pinsirite Klingklang recently, and it actually is quite good. You may be thinking "why should I use this instead of Cobalion" well the answer is simple, Shift Gear. Shift Gear boosts Klingklang's Atk and Spe simultaneously, which can become very scary for offensive teams thanks to Steel/Flying being great offensively. It lacks coverage and may be underwhelming at times, but I still feel it deserves to be ranked somewhere on the VR, and D would be too low imo. Altarianite also works, but then you get walled by P-Don.

Replay: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/mixandmega-326735157

P.S Cobalion should also raise to like at least A/A+ for the reasons AllJokesAside mentioned earlier, and some more mega stones should be mentioned for some mons.

 

[Lcass4919]

Ghoul King Can you update the second post with Jownage's VR? It seems to be the more updated one

I agree with Hoopa-U to A+, due to it's amazing wallbreaking capabilities with Absolite and Diancite (even Manectite to some extent). Yes it's low Defense leaves it suspectible to -ate speed, but when that's out of the way, it can literally destroy teams not running mons above ~130 Speed. Cameprutite is also amazing on TR teams, really having no switchins at all (Ampharosite Mew gets 2HKO'ed by Psychic). Definitely a top tier mon.

Still gonna bring up Zygarde to S

I also have another nomination:

Klingklang Unranked -> C

So I have been testing out Pinsirite Klingklang recently, and it actually is quite good. You may be thinking "why should I use this instead of Cobalion" well the answer is simple, Shift Gear. Shift Gear boosts Klingklang's Atk and Spe simultaneously, which can become very scary for offensive teams thanks to Steel/Flying being great offensively. It lacks coverage and may be underwhelming at times, but I still feel it deserves to be ranked somewhere on the VR, and D would be too low imo. Altarianite also works, but then you get walled by P-Don.

P.S Cobalion should also raise to like at least A/A+ for the reasons AllJokesAside mentioned earlier, and some more mega stones should be mentioned for some mons.

way back when, last omotm i actually used altarianite klingklang for kicks, and i can confirm its actually pretty good, it really surpassed my expectations. of course it wasn't amazing(don wasn't really being used at the time) but offense was hard pressed to do anything to it if you switched in the right poke and set up. it can be a terror to take down, and i would imagine pinsirite would do the same but better. the only issue with klingklang is that it lacks good coverage, being forced to run steel/flying(fairy)/electric as coverage. i personally ran fairy, because electric types were more of a problem(again, because nobody used groudon) but flying is definitely the better choice nowadays.

 

[Lemon Ginger]

I am finding baton pass to be a hugely effective strategy for basically all styles. Basically, the boost provided by the mega stones lets you skirt around the speed-pass clause, since you can tailor stones and passing combos to make up for whatever the recipient lacks. It's really easy to do too.

The eevee-lutions in particular I have found to be great, as they all have wish, baton pass and a boosting move, enabling them to act as excellent defensive pivots. Handing +2/+2 calm minds from aggronite sylveon to Hoopa-U? Sure, don't mind if I do.

A couple variants:
On all of these you could run protect/sub instead of an attacking move. They all get work up, if you just want to generally pass to anything on your team. Aggronite works well for the Defense boost and typing, but other defensive stones work too, such as sablenite or slowbronite.

Flareon @ Aggronite
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Wish
- Baton Pass
- Flare Blitz
- Curse

65/110/130 defenses and 160 attack with a great typing.
Just hand this to your blue orb user or anything that normally partners well with heatran, and you'll be all set.

Sylveon @ Aggronite
Ability: Cute Charm
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
- Wish
- Calm Mind
- Baton Pass
- Moonblast

95/115/150 defenses and steel fairy
Partners amazingly with any dark or fighting type sweeper you may have.

Vaporeon @ Aggronite / Sceptilite
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Wish
- Baton Pass
- Acid Armor / Aqua Ring
- Scald

130/110/115 defenses
Yeah..you could even run aqua ring to make slowbronite blissey invincible.

Leafon can pass SD. Umbreon is good as well.

As long as you can avoid taunts (especially banettite taunts), this is a very easy and effective strategy to use.

 

[readytolose]

Is there any particular reason only fully evolved pokemon can use Mega Stones? It seems like a very arbitrary restriction. Plus there are some NFEs I would like to try using mega stones on.

 

[Maleovex]

Is there any particular reason only fully evolved pokemon can use Mega Stones? It seems like a very arbitrary restriction. Plus there are some NFEs I would like to try using mega stones on.

This is due to the fact that only Fully Evolved Pokemon can mega evolve in the actual Pokemon games

 

[readytolose]

This is due to the fact that only Fully Evolved Pokemon can mega evolve in the actual Pokemon games

nowhere in the game does it say that only fully evolved pokemon may mega evolve

 

[Maleovex]

nowhere in the game does it say that only fully evolved pokemon may mega evolve

It doesn't say that necessarily but as of now, that's what we have been lead to believe and it makes sense, as in a way, mega evolution is a kind of extra evolution on top of its current ones

 

[thdhted]

Is there any particular reason only fully evolved pokemon can use Mega Stones? It seems like a very arbitrary restriction. Plus there are some NFEs I would like to try using mega stones on.

What would even be the point? There are zero prevos that are even remotely usable as a mega. I guess Porygon 2, but I'm pretty sure there are things that do that better.
There's a difference between diversifying a meta and adding a useless feature that adds nothing new and useful.

 

[IronGrahn]

Mega evolutions is also known for bringing the evolution line one step further. So you can say that a fully evolved pokemon is kind of a Mega evolutions already to the pre-evolved mons.
(Someone plz quote me if I'm wrong.)

 

[OLD GREGG (im back baby)]

I have to say that I think TR is under rated in MnM.

Here is a suicide lead Ive been using to get up TR and hopefully get a ko or two out of it.

Bronzong @ Pinsirite
Ability: Levitate
Happiness: 0
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Gyro Ball
- Frustration
- Trick Room
- Explosion


Hoopa-U is great in TR as already stated.
You also have the existence of Camerupt, Heracross, Ampharos, Sabeleye, Garchompite, and Abomasnow mega stones that all reduce speed opening up new possibilities for TR abuse along with a bunch of other mega stones that do not affect speed. Due to the very fast nature of this meta, TR is a great strategy. Since a lot of TR mons are super bulky-they can normally take a non boosted ate-speed and dish out a load of damage in return; making ate-speed only a semi-reliable counter to TR playstyle.


Here is a set Ive been using on a semi-TR team I made this morning:

Diancie @ Cameruptite
Ability: Clear Body
Happiness: 0
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Earth Power
- Calm Mind
- Ancient Power
- Moonblast

Pretty simple set that can be very hard to play around if the opposing team lacks a proper check(aka blissey)


Anyway, I don't think TR has been getting enough attention since it gets some huge buffs in this meta and it can completely destroy ate-speed archetypes without having to heavily rely on certain mons with a precious typing.

 

[Ghoul King]

Viability Rankings have been given several updates, including placing Hoopa-Unbound in A+.

I included every Stone suggested for it except for Sceptilite. (Sceptilite seems inexplicable to me) Because, yes, they are all quite good on it.

... this places Hoopa-Unbound as the single longest list of Stones for suggestions in the Viability Rankings by quite the margin.

Cobalion has been moved to A for the moment.

I'd rather see more discussion on Zygarde before considering moving it up. I really don't think it's S-rank material, but I could be convinced by a compelling argument.

Is there any particular reason only fully evolved pokemon can use Mega Stones? It seems like a very arbitrary restriction. Plus there are some NFEs I would like to try using mega stones on.

There are almost no NFEs that are meaningfully different from their evolved form such that they are not simply inferior. (Yes, Scyther for instance has the same BST as Scizor, just distributed differently, but this is highly unusual) Only a few Pokemon would have any chance of meaningfully entering into the meta at all.

The payoff is near-zero. Possibly outright zero, if nothing proves worth running.