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My First Crack at OU

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by XTar, Jul 25, 2012.

  1. XTar

    XTar

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2012
    Messages:
    44
    Edited Changes are in Red
    Hello All! I've followed competitive battling for about a year and a half now however I've only recently gotten into it about a couple months ago. This is my first successful team and I was wondering if you guys could help rate/improve it. I think it's pretty good as it has gotten me to 1242 on PO but after that I kind of hit a wall. Some of the sets are uncommon in today's meta-game but I find it usually does very well. Please be kind as this is my first try.
    Lead/ Entry Hazard/ Rapid Spinner
    Forretress @ Red Card
    Sturdy
    [​IMG]
    Sassy 252 Hp/252 Sp. Def/ 4 Def
    -Stealth Rock
    -Rapid Spin
    -Toxic Spikes
    -Volt Switch
    Forretress is great for setting up entry hazards due to his ability sturdy and his naturally high defense. I chose a specially defensive set because almost no one tries to beat Forretress through physical attacks (due to his typing) plus even without defense evs he reaches 317. I decided not to run sassy as to outpace opposing ferrothorn.The crux of this set is red card as many, many, MANY pokemon try to use Forretress as set up fodder which gives me free turns to lay up all my entry hazards. They soon get a nasty surprise when they realize they've fallen into the trap. Volt switch is there for momentum and to allow a switch without my pokemon taking damage (thanks to its awful speed). Later on it it can be used as a sacrifice for my choice pokemon to switch moves.

    Spec Sweeper/Wall Crippler
    Rotom-W @ Choice Scarf
    Levitate
    [​IMG]
    Timid 252 Spe Atk/ 4 Spe Def/ 252 Speed
    -Trick
    -Hydro Pump
    -HP ice
    -Volt Switch
    The oddest (aesthetically) member of my team, but a beast nonetheless. This guys is awesome. Trick absolutely ruins walls and annoyers. Rotom-W's awesome typing and ability give it only one weakness to grass which is fairly uncommon out side of breloom and virizion. This makes volt switch perfect as he can do damage with STAB then switch to a pokemon that resists whatever the attack is (which is surprisingly easy to predict). Anyway, Hydro Pump for fires, rock, ground STAB, Volt switch for Rain teams, Gyarados, Momentum, and HP ice for grass, flying and dragon types(Salamence). EVs are pretty obvious. Helps with physical walls and has overall great synergy with the rest of my team.

    Set-up Sweeper/ Crippler
    Breloom @ Leftovers
    Technician
    [​IMG]
    Jolly 4 HP/ 252 Atk/ 252 Speed
    -Spore
    -Swords Dance
    -Mach Punch
    -Bullet Seed
    Ah Breloom. I used to hate this thing so much until I started using it. Pretty self explanatory, come in, survive, spore, SD once or twice, and kill things to death. With technician, Mach punch reaches the same power as Scizor's bullet punch albeit a much better typing. Helps with rain teams, bulky ground/water types, Tyranitar, Terrakion and basically anything weak or neutral to one of its STABS. Much better late game as their are several pokemon who resist both of its attacks. EVs are self-explanatory. Yeah, Breloom's pretty cool.

    Spin Blocker/ Mixed Wall/ Hazer/ Crippler/ Mummy
    Cofagrigus @ Leftovers
    Mummy
    [​IMG]
    Relaxed 252 HP/ 134 Def/ 120 Sp.Def (0 Speed Ivs)
    -Hex
    -Will-o-wisp
    -Haze
    -Rest
    This guy is so underrated it's not even funny. It's probably because many people view him as an under-powered dusclops/duknoir/Jellicent, however this is far from the truth. With the many common electrical attackers in OU I find jellicent's defenses just don't cut it. I put duclops and dusknoir into consideration but they both lack 2 things Cofagrigus has. Haze and Mummy. Haze is incredibly useful as I find more and more pokemon are running set up moves. Plus Cofagrigus is able to utilize it effectively thanks to its natural bulk. Mummy is ridiculously good and has saved me on more than one occasion.Will-o-wisp is for physical sweepers plus residual damage, Shadow ball to hurt things and Rest for recovery and to stall opponents piling up burn damage. It's a pretty good check to fighting types with its high defense and mummy taking care of guts. I run no speed evs to tie with trick room reunicus who this team has problems with. Although after weakening it a bit with shadow ball one of the next members of my team can usually take it out pretty well. EVs are just for general bulk. With them he reaches 396 Def, 276 Spe Def, and 320 HP.

    Tank/ Mixed Sweeper
    Metagross @ Expert Belt
    Clear Body
    [​IMG]
    Lonely 156 Atk/ 168 Spe Atk/ 184 Speed
    -Meteor Mash
    -Earthquake
    -HP Fire
    -Psychic
    MixGross is a rare sight in the MG and certainly one that many are unprepared for. It's so satisfying to watch the opponent struggle in shock as their fighting types are ohko'd by Psychic. Psychic is an ok STAB that hits many fighting types and Poison types (namely Tentacruel) for high damage. Meteor Mash is a really cool move that just hits like a tank. Ice punch is for Landorus, Gliscor and dragons who think they can one shot you with earthquake. HP fire almost always Ohkos scizor and ensures you aren't sucked dry by leech seed ferrothorn. EVs in Spe Atk are for the ohko of conkeldurr and scizor and the rest into atk and hp for tanking capacity.

    Cleaner/ Physical Sweeper
    Tyranitar @ Choice Scarf
    Sandstream
    [​IMG]
    Jolly 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Speed
    -Superpower
    -Crunch
    -Ice Punch
    -Stone Edge
    This thing is freaking stupendous. There are no words to describe how awesome this thing is. Short and simple he's the boss. Tyranitar has always been my favorite pokemon (along with Mewtwo) and I'm glad he fits so well on this team. Between his four moves he has ridiculous coverage. Ice punch is the only move I was iffy about but I feel it is necessary for Gliscor and Dragonite. It is also more reliable then stone edge for flying types. Stone Edge and Crunch are there for power/coverage and superpower for opposing Tyranitar, non-scarf Terrakion, Magnezone, Lucario, Mamoswine Ferrothorn, etc. etc. With declining popularity of Scarf Tar this set is moderately unpredictable and I can almost always take out a pokemon with just surprise. That being said this averages much more than just one KO per game. I've had several occasions where Tyranitar sweeps more than half of my opponent's team. He is awesome late game as almost all of the opposing team has been weakened to KO range. He is one of the best cleaners I have ever used. Since I usually save him for late game, sandstream doesn't mess up my other team members to bad. EVs are self-explanatory. Now one thing I'm sure many people are asking is "where's Pursuit". Well to put it simply I don't think pursuit is that good. I've tried using it but it's just not as effective in practice as everyone makes it out to be. IMO Crunch does the job just fine.

    I can't take any credit for the pictures since I found just about all of them online. Sorry for any mistakes/lack of organization. I'm half asleep as I'm typing. So there it is, my first team. I'm open to any constructive criticism. Again I'm still pretty new so take it easy on me. Well, thanks for reading.
    Edited Changes are in Red
  2. tikidude

    tikidude

    Joined:
    May 1, 2011
    Messages:
    321
    Hey guy, cool team. Tyranitar's Sandstream is going to knock out your Brelooms Focus Sash. I would either switch items or pokemon. Red Card Forretress is great. Finally props for using Cofagrigus! He's a great pokemon that almost no one uses (he's also one of my favorites). Anyway good luck with the team! :P
  3. XTar

    XTar

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2012
    Messages:
    44
    Haha thanks a lot Im glad you like it. I usually don't send Tyranitar in until the end but I see what you mean by it being a problem. Ill try to think of something to fix this. And yeah Cofagrigus is pretty sick.
  4. bluewooper

    bluewooper

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2009
    Messages:
    154
    Hey Xtar, how are you doing? I took a look at this team and I discovered that it is very solid looking. I congratulate you on your nice ladder run. I have always been more of a Theorymon than a Battlemon, so any ladder run tends to impress me. However, I can suggest to you a few changes that I do think would help your team perform betteras a whole.

    Forretress: I have faced several Red Card Forretresses in the past, and I will admit that every single one that I see surprises me. However, I think that the role that Forretress plays on this team requires that he be able to come in all of the time on his resistances and either continue setting up Hazards or to spin them away as needed. I think that even though Red card is a nice "trap" that you can play for, overall, the sacrifices that you need to do to make it work would end up to costly for your team's success anyway. And if you choose to send in Forretress on a resisted move anyway, and lose the red card, you will miss out on any recovery that you could get from leftovers. So, with that in mind, I would recommend that you use Leftovers over the Red Card.

    Rotom-W: This set is good, however, you seem to be missing the last EV point. Please put that in Special Defense, in order to give Download Porygon Z (however rare) the boost in Attack instead of Special Attack. Just a nitpick, but it makes such a difference if you ever run across it

    Breloom: I see the attraction of getting a guaranteed turn to boost using the Focus Sash, but I really doubt that you will end up with the opportunity to use it. In order to use it in a position that is not the lead, you would be required to have no harmful weather conditions, as well as no hazards on the field. Additionally, Breloom can't switch into an attack. I would recommend Leftovers for the simple reason that you would have difficulty with the use of the focus Sash. Leftovers over Focus Sash

    Metagross: I absolutely love seeing a simple MixedGross. He has the perfect typing to do it, and he has strong enough attacking stats to get away with. However, I think that you should run some speed over HP. Many pokemon that are more defensively oriented are easily outsped with some EV investment in Speed. Instead of having to take a hit and hit back, I think that it is much more . . . economical for Metagross to outspeed some of those slower walls. I would switch to an EV spread of 156Atk/168SpA/184Spe. Also, I see that you chose to use Ice Punch to target Dragons. However, even with the suggested Speed investment, you will still be outsped by most Dragons anyway. would recommend Earthquake over Ice Punch because you will find that it is useful for nabbing Heatran coming in to wall a Meteor Mash.

    Tyranitar: Earlier today I had rated a different team that can use the same suggested Tyranitar set. First, let me copy paste you what I had posted earlier, and then I will let you know how it applies to your team.
    Show Hide



    [​IMG]
    Tyranitar @ Choice Scarf
    Hasty (+Spe, -Def)
    156 Atk / 100 SpA / 252 Spe
    ~Fire Blast
    ~Ice Beam
    ~Stone Edge
    ~Crunch

    This set is actually quite simple to use. Early in the game, you can easily feign a simple (physical) choiced Scarf set. That alone I have found has nabbed kills on the more unassuming ladders. However, when you bring Tyranitar in on a pokemon that will switch, you can easily nail any of the Gliscors, Landoruses, Skarmories, Scizors, etc. That are likely to come in on it. Additionally: Landorus-T is becoming a fairly common lead. Many will attempt to U-Turn out on the first turn, in hopes of gaining the early offensive momentum. Armed with the choice scarf, Ice Beam quickly will give you a 6-5 advantage, more than enough to cruise in with a win.


    Now, whether or not you decide to use this as a lead, this still is a great addition to your team. Metagross will doubtless appreciate any Physical wall that can be eliminated before he has to deal with it. THis set will lure in counters like Landorus, Gliscor, Skarmory, and Ferrothorn. All of these are also taken out by this set. I can personally attest that this is one of the greatest Tyranitar sets that I have used. This simply can perform the duties of a basic Scarftar, while still being able to lure in the pokemon in that you need to kill.
  5. DrunkDemon

    DrunkDemon

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2012
    Messages:
    206
    Hey Xtar, overall your team is solid and doesn't need many changes except for a few move-set tweaks. I'm going to agree with bluewhooper on a lot of what he suggested, although I wouldn't recommend using a mixed ScarfTar, and I'm iffy about his Metagross EV spread. Now that Rain has become much more prevalent, mixed Tyranitar sets have become much less effective due to the lack of coverage Fire Blast and Ice Beam have against common Rain threats. In addition, the threats it would provide coverage against are already handled pretty well by your team as it is. As for the Metagross spread, I'm really not sure about it. It seems counter-intuitive, but it could be useful.
  6. XTar

    XTar

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2012
    Messages:
    44
    Thanks for youre suggested input ill try most of the changes save the forretress one. Foretress is meant to set up entry hazards not so much be a wall. Im a little iffy about tyranitar but I'll give him a try. Other than that these suggestions seem really helpful and I can't wait to try them out tomorrow. Also what nature should I use for Metagross now?
  7. bluewooper

    bluewooper

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2009
    Messages:
    154
    Ok, I will respond to a couple things in this post, shortest to longest

    Forretress: All right. I guess for what you're using the Forretress for, you will want to have that Red Card. I just made that suggestion because I use mine differently.

    Metagross:
    The Metagross will definitely not want a Brave nature, as that would detract from the speed that he needs to outspeed opposing pokemon and sweep more effectively. A Lonely Nature will detract from his Defense slightly, while still allowing him moderate bulk for his weaker SpDef stat. The EV spread, by the way, still keeps the SpA EVs needed to get the KOs on Conkeldurr and Scizor, with enough also to outspeed Modest Magnezone (not enough Timids running around to make you worry about it). Finally, the rest are dumped into attack.

    Tyranitar
    I know that the Tyranitar set at first seems quite odd. However, I can explain it a bit more. Basically, this is a lure set. It is designated to attract and eliminate some of the real killers of a Metagross sweep. Metagross would be outspeed and severely nailed by a Gliscor's Earthquake; however, you could use Tyranitar to lure in Gliscor in and KO it with Ice Beam. Same thing goes with Skarmory and other "hard" counters to Tyranitar that also wall Metagross. Having these pokemon removed simply makes your game easier to win. I know that you might question it because of the fact that you have never seen a MixScarfTar before, but if I could convince you to try it, I know that it would work wonders with it. It takes a little bit of prediction, which takes getting used to, but you will find that it works absolute wonders, especially if the opposition doesn't even know you're scarfed. I beg of you to try this set.
  8. nob

    nob

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2012
    Messages:
    16
    You might want to consider Hex on Cofagrigus, with Toxic Spikes and Will-o-wisp, it will be doing 100 damage more often then not.

    Also, you might want a Calm Mind set, but maybe it's not your style.

    Cofagrigus @ Leftovers
    Mummy
    Relaxed 252 HP/ 252 Def/ 4 Sp.Def (0 Speed Ivs)
    -Shadow Ball
    -Calm Mind
    -Hidden Power Fighting
    -Rest
  9. Jimbon

    Jimbon FAKE TRAIN
    is a Team Rater Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2012
    Messages:
    513
    Hi there!

    This is a cool team with a lot of potential, stacking hazards to make it easier for Breloom to sweep. Rotom revenges things that look troublesome for Breloom, while your defensive core does a good job of handling a lot of common threats. To start off, I do think you should run a Sassy Nature over Calm on your Forretress, as well as using Leftovers over Red Card. A Sassy Nature ensures your Forretress has the best special defensive capabilities possible, while also being as slow as possible. This is important because it allows Forretress to get the Volt Switch off after your opponent has made a move, pretty much guaranteeing you momentum and a free switch into another mon. The only thing you lose with Sassy is being able to outspeed Ferrothorn like you said, which really isn't important as they both wall eachother, and you want to be able to Volt Switch after Ferrothorn to avoid Thunder Wave / Leech Seed. As for Leftovers, it provides Forretress with residual recovery, which is arguably one of it's biggest problems. It slightly increases longevity of Forretress, and Red Card itself is incredibly situational, as you can easily bring in things such as Magnezone, or other stat boosters that use Forretress as setup fodder.

    Looking at your team, Cofagrigus does look like the weakest link to me. It's pretty hopeless against defensive threats, as your opponent easily sets up hazards against you. It's a pretty subpar check to fighting types, as Terrakion and Keldeo still cause problems for you. I know you said that you didn't like it, but Jellicent really does patch up a lot of problems for your team. Jellicent seems like it would be a great addition to your team, giving you a more reliable check to fighting types, as Jellicent actually has reliable recovery. Jellicent can also form as a great stallbreaker, with Taunt it easily shuts down many defensive threats, including Forretress, Skarmory, Chansey, Jirachi and many more, something that your Cofagrigus fails to do. Jellicent also synergizes much better with your team, especially with Forretress. Fire attacks aimed at Forretress are walled by Jellicent, and grass moves aimed at Jellicent are dealt with by Forretress. One of Cofagrigus's only merits over Jellicent is haze, which Jellicent can stop stat boosters with Taunt. Not to mention that with Cofagrigus's terrible speed stat, it may have trouble using Haze, as mons at +1 or +2 will probably be 2HKOing Cofagrigus before you can Haze.

    Looking at your team, there does seem to be a little redundancy. You have two Choice Scarf users, which may have it's own benefits, but it does cause a lot of switching for you. This looks especially problematic for your team as your Tyranitar is not running Pursuit, and Forretress as a Spinner has no reliable recovery, so you may have trouble Spinning away hazards, and in turn have a harder time keeping your Pokemon alive. I recommend that you change your current Choice Scarf Tyranitar to a Specially Defensive variant. Specially Defensive Tyranitar gives you another addition to your defensive core, synergizing well with Forretress and Jellicent, should you choose to use him over Cofagrigus. Ultimately, your team does seem a little weak to Rain Teams, maximizing Tyranitar's bulk means you increase it's longevity, making it harder for your opponent to win the weather war. Tyranitar also gives you an additional check to Tornadus, who currently causes a lot of problems for your team. Making this change gives you a greater Special Tank, while increasing your chance of beating opposing weather. You don't really lose anything by making this change, the lack of offensive presence is more than made up for by Breloom and Rotom, both who do a much more efficient job of revenging than Tyranitar does.

    Additionally, you gain the ability to Pursuit Trap Lati Twins, while also utilizing Stealth Rock. This puts less pressure on Forretress to get all your hazards up, which can lead Forretress to become setup fodder for many other threats such as Terrakion, Haxorus, Gengar and many more. If you choose to go with this change, I highly recommend that you use Gyro Ball > Stealth Rock. Tyranitar has many more opportunities to switch in than Forretress does, meaning it can set up Rocks a lot easier. It's also good as you don't have a huge reliance on Forretress to set up all your hazards AND to Spin opposing hazards, as Forretress does warrant easy switch ins for Steel trappers such as Magnezone.

    Cool team, hope I helped!

    Sets (open)
    Jellicent @ Leftovers
    Trait: Water Absorb
    EVs: 248 HP / 216 Def / 44 Spe
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Scald
    - Taunt
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Recover

    Tyranitar @ Chople Berry
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 252 HP / 76 Atk / 180 SDef
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
    - Stealth Rock
    - Superpower
    - Rock Slide
    - Pursuit
  10. TrollFreak

    TrollFreak (╮°-°)╮┳━┳ (╯°□°)╯ ┻━┻
    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2011
    Messages:
    1,249
    To mention one thing Jimbon missed, use Spikes over Stealth Rock on Forretress, as Tyranitar already has Stealth Rock.
  11. XTar

    XTar

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2012
    Messages:
    44
    Thanks for the hex idea, I kind of forgot about it. Thanks Jimbon for the set suggestions, I decided to switch red card with leftovers since everyone seems to think its a good idea. I won't edit any of the poke's today but I will try all the sets you guys have listed and see how they work out. So far the team has been doing good and I hit something like a 12 win streak (starting from 0000) but then I started getting sloppy so I think I'll take a break for now.
  12. nob

    nob

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2012
    Messages:
    16
    I actually think Red Card is a good idea on Forretress, but only in certain situations. For example, like you said, saving your team from a sweep, or if a pokemon deals 60% damage, then gets shuffled to something that can't touch Forretress.

    Sure Lefties gives you 6.5% per turn, and is pretty much Forre's only form of recovery, but the red card can surprise enemies and potentially save you from getting swept. In order to counteract Forre's lack of recovery, why don't you try running a wish passing set like Salamence or Jirachi?

    [​IMG]
    Salamence (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 252 HP / 192 Def / 64 Spd
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Wish
    - Protect
    - Dragon Tail
    - Flamethrower
    The first set I recommend is Salamence. It's synergy is perfect with Forretress, allowing you to send him in, wish as they send in an Ice, Rock, or Dragon attack, then switch to Forretress and get healed.
    The move set is simple. Wish to get recovery across the team, and protect if you need the recovery your self. Dragon Tail is for Phazing, things like Conkeldurr and Scrafty. Flamethrower can deal with all the steel type walls like Ferrothorn or Forretress. The EVs are to out-speed max speed Scizor just in case, you also out-speed Adamant Breloom and Tyranitar.
    If you want more instant recovery, you can do Roost over Protect, which would take advantage of out-speeding Ttar to remove your Rock weakness.

    [​IMG]
    Jirachi @ Leftovers
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 HP / 192 SDef / 64 Spd
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
    - Wish
    - Iron Head
    - Body Slam
    - Fire Punch
    Jirachi is arguable a better wishpasser than Salamence, but I think Salamence is better because of how his synergy is good with your team. On top of that, Fire Punch doesn't pack as much power as Flamethrower, and the Phazing with Dragon Tail is nice.
    The EVs are straight from smogon, with 64 Spd to outrun Max Speed Scizor. This set provides heavy utility to your team, being able to spread Paralysis, and ParaFlinch allowing you to heal yourself with wish, also.

    I personally recommend you replace Metagross with these, but that's up to you, you can test whatever you want.
  13. tikidude

    tikidude

    Joined:
    May 1, 2011
    Messages:
    321
    Oh, I forgot to mention something about Forretress. The one I was using had Pain Split as well as Red Card. It worked very well. Just something to think about.
  14. CJorex

    CJorex

    Joined:
    May 31, 2012
    Messages:
    958
    Hi Xtar, nice team! The only thing I've noticed is that you're running a Brave nature on Metagross, but you've also invested speed EVs. Either the nature or the EVs should be changed on Metagross to make it more effective.
  15. XTar

    XTar

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2012
    Messages:
    44
    Sorry it should've been lonely . Pain split seems interesting and for nob the team would appreciate wish support but metagross is too valuable.
  16. XTar

    XTar

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2012
    Messages:
    44
    Ok thanks for the help guys the team's been doing great. Although many of the set suggestions are great they don't quite fit in with the team. Nevertheless they were all greatly appreciated.

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