1. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

My first OU Team.

Discussion in 'Past Gen Teams' started by Raion, Nov 24, 2010.

  1. Raion

    Raion

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2010
    Messages:
    24
    Hello there Smogon. I've been lurking these forums for a few weeks now. I've been wifi battling a little over a month now. And I've been competing with my two brothers for over 3 months on Pokemon HG/SS and Platinum. Ok well to cut a long story short I'm generally a noobie when it comes to seriously looking at my team in-depth and would really like help at analyzing my major weaknesses and what sets I should change. Ok so here goes.

    Lead: Azelf
    EV's: HP 6 Atk 252 Speed 252
    Nature: Adamant
    Item: Focus Sash
    Moveset:
    -Stealth Rock
    -Taunt
    -Zen Headbutt
    -Explosion

    I chose this moveset due to the nature of the Azelf I got from a trade. I didn't want to waste the adamant nature and at the same time I also wanted my Azelf to be a lead. Stealth rock is there as an obvious choice for leads just for an entry hazard setup. I chose to taunt for the slower leads who are less likely to attack azelf right off the bat on the first turn. Zen Headbutt was chosen for a nice stab attack when you want to kill off the oponent's lead without using explosion when you're focus sash isn't broken yet. Explosion is there for killing off the opposing lead when all else fails. :P

    Scizor
    EV's: HP 252 Atk 252 Def 6
    Nature: Adamant
    Item: Choice Band
    Moveset:
    Bullet Punch
    Pursuit
    Superpower
    U-turn

    This pokemon has always been in my main PvP team since I started competing against my brothers. Bullet punch is there for the obvious stab + technician priority move. Pursuit is there to kill off Ghosts and lock them into play. Superpower I chose just in case I face off against a blissey, togekiss, and other steel types. I chose U-turn for a good stab/scout move which helps when you're up against a pokemon who lock you into play like magnezone.

    Infernape
    EV's: HP 6 Atk 252 Spe 252
    Nature: Jolly
    Item: Life Orb
    Moveset:
    Close Combat
    Mach Punch
    Flare Blitz
    Stone Edge

    Infernape. This magical monkey I found useful against the many steel types my brothers were throwing at me. It's my main sweeper and I love him because of the physical power he brings in. Close Combat is an obvious choice for Infernape because of the stab damage and overall destructive force it brings in. Mach punch is a good priority stab move for revenge killing pokemon who are just faster than Infernape. Flare Blitz is to take care of pesky grass pokemon like Celebi and Shaymin and great for neutral damage too. Stone Edge was chosen to take out annoying flying types like Dragonite.


    Suicune
    EVs: 252 Sp Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
    Nature: Timid
    Item: Leftovers
    Moveset:
    -Calm Mind
    -Surf
    -HP Electric
    -Ice Beam

    I chose this Cune because of his overall bulk and offensive power he brings into the team. After suggestions from the members here on smogon I reworked my Suicune looking for the perfect one with HP electric and a timid Nature. Well anyways, this pokemon brings in water/electric/ice attacks my team is lacking and still being bulky enough to take Earthquakes and ask for more. Thanks to The LegendKiller and undisputed for the suggestion on this.


    Shaymin
    EVs: 252 Sp Atk / 180 Spe / 76 HP
    Nature: Timid
    Item: Life Orb
    Moveset:
    -HP Fire
    -Seed Flare
    -Earth Power
    -Synthesize

    After getting the suggestion of adding shaymin into my team so I would have a good F/W/G core. I tried adding him and wow I wasn't disappointed. After my first wifi battle with my modified team it just blew me away at the overall offensive force. Shaymin brings in Seed flare to take out troublesome bulky waters (Vaporeon, Swampert, Opposing suicune), HP Fire totally wreaks havoc against opposing grass types (Opposing shaymin, Celebi, and for some reason the guy I fought last night used a Venusaur). Earth power to take out a countering heatran and for other grounded steel type pokes overall. I went for synthesize over rest however since if I use rest my shaymin would be incapacitated and I'd have to switch him out just to take off sleep. That would be giving my opponent 2 free turns of damage if I chose to bring shaymin back in. Thanks to undisputed for the suggestion on this one.


    Flygon
    EV's: HP 6 Atk 252 Spe 252
    Nature: Adamant
    Item: Choice Scarf
    Moveset:
    Earthquake
    Stone Edge
    Outrage
    U-turn

    I chose Flygon mainly for absorbing Earthquakes and Electric attacks my opponent is focusing on me. Earthquake and Outrage are their for stab damage killing off any Heatrans, Blisseys, Dragonites, opposing Flygons and generally other pokes who are weak to these moves. Stone Edge is there for Flying pokes and just in case you don't want to be locked into outrage trying to take out Dragonite. U-turn works in synergy with with Scizor and scouting. Basically you use U-turn to get in free damage against a poke Flygon is weak against and bring in Scizor and vice-versa.



    Additional Comments:
    I chose these pokemon after reading through smogon's OU tier list and fighting against some of these pokemon through wi-fi battles. All the while thinking of how they will fit into my team. So far I've had trouble with Swampert but the way I dealt with him was PP stalling him with my Cune and killing him off little by little with neutral damaged Surf. I've also had a little trouble with a late game sweeping gengar. I'm kind of having trouble seeing which pokemon would give this team trouble so would you guys kindly help me out by analyzing my team a bit more for me?

    Retired/Reworked Members
    Suicune
    EV's: HP 252 Def 252 SpD 6
    Nature: Relaxed
    Item: Leftovers
    Moveset:
    Surf
    Roar
    Rest
    Sleep Talk

    My bulky water type. It's great for a bit of PP stalling and tanking out damage my other pokes can't handle. Surf is his main Stab move. Chosen for it's high PP and good base damage. Roar is there for phazing purposes and making sure people don't try to set up while Suicune is rested. RestTalk is it's main form of recovery to keep it stalling for a really long time while phazing/damaging the other team.

    Jirachi
    EV's: HP 252 Def 156 SpD 100
    Nature: Adamant
    Item: Leftovers
    Moveset:
    Wish
    Iron Head
    Thunderwave
    U-turn

    My wish passer! It heals infernape and other pokes in need of it's wish passing abilities. Wish is there for healing itself and other pokes. Iron Head and Thunderwave make up the dreaded para-flinch combo with serene grace reinforcing this. U-turn is there to pass wishes while getting in some free damage and possibly scouting.
  2. afterburn

    afterburn Villain of some untold story
    is a Team Rater Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2009
    Messages:
    685
    Rest talk Suicune looks misplaced on such an offensive team, and might even slow it down. You should go for 252 Satk/4 Sdef/252 Spe a Timid nature and Calm Mind/Hydro Pump/Ice Beam/HP Electric with Leftovers on Suicune. Currently, Suicune slows down the team, and invites Bulky Gyarados over, who shuts down Suicune with Taunt and can sweep the team with a Dragon Dance. Flygon won't be KOing Bulky Gyarados easily with Stone Edge, and Gyarados can use this opportunity to nab another Dance to terrorize the team with. With the Suicune I mentioned, you will actually check Gyarados really well, and set up on Heatran, and Infernape trying to come in on Jirachi, and manage a sweep on many unprepared offensive teams with a Calm Mind and unresisted coverage from the three moves.

    I don't have much time right now, and I will look over this team once again when I'm free.
  3. Raion

    Raion

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2010
    Messages:
    24
    Hey thanks for the comment. I didn't really think of that possibilty right away when training my cune. Because of your input I'm going to look for another cune that will fit my team more. Thanks again for that. :D
  4. y4f

    y4f

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2010
    Messages:
    82
    For Infernape, I'd throw on Overheat over Flare Blitz to get the surprise KO on many Steel-type more physically oriented walls, as a physical sweeper with some special capabilities takes people by surprise and improves stallbreaking ability.

    Your Gyarados set is ineffective considering that you don't have that many entry hazards - you seem to be running more of a fast paced offensive team. If you really like RestTalk, then at least run Rest / Sleep Talk / Dragon Dance / Waterfall, but I would suggest a Taunt BulkyDos in order to run through stall a lot more effectively.

    [box]Gyarados) (M) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Intimidate
    EVs: 156 HP/72 Atk/96 Def/184 Spd
    Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Taunt
    - Waterfall
    - Stone Edge
    - Dragon Dance[/box]

    This is an incredibly effective set that can switch in on pokemon it counters, get up a DD, Taunt any incoming walls / phasers, set up, then prepare to sweep. EVs are tailored so that after 1 DD, Gyarados outspeeds all +nature 252 speed EVs base 115 pokemon. Other EVs are just for maximum bulk while still maintaining the ability to outspeed counters and set up.

    Next, your Jirachi. The set is very similar to one I used to use, yet not quite as effective IMO. Your set is incredibly weak to bulky walls that can Taunt or shrug off T-Wave (ex. Hippo, Gliscor, Swampert, etc). Keep in mind Iron Head only has a 60% flinch rate, so paralysis is quite necessary in order to get hax-kills without getting hit by EQ. What I would suggest to remedy that is this:

    Jirachi @ Leftovers
    Ability: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 HP/224 Def/32 Spd
    Impish nature (+Def, -SAtk)
    - Wish
    - Fire Punch
    - Body Slam
    - Iron Head

    This is the ultimate physical tank wishpasser Jirachi. Fire Punch allows you to hit incoming Steels hard, and possibly get burn hax. Also kills HP Fire Magnezone, who thinks it can come in and easily kill off Jirachi, which is completely untrue. Body Slam has a 60% paralysis rate even against Ground-types, so you can Body Slam on switches, paralyze the incoming poke, then kill it off with the hax from Iron Head. 40% chance of moving with Iron Head x 75% chance while paralyzed = 30% chance of moving each turn with paraflinch. Pretty much guarantees you get at least 3 Iron Heads in before they can hit you with anything, and by that time they will have generally made the mistake of switching out and giving up, leaving yet another one of their pokes vulnerable to being beaten by hax. Speed is to outrun max speed +speed Tyranitar.

    Good luck with your team!
  5. undisputed

    undisputed
    is a Tutor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnusis Smogon Frontier's Frontier Lackeyis a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2009
    Messages:
    2,118
    Hi Raion,

    This is a decent team you have, especially for wifi play. When I looked at the team, I automatically assumed Suicune was offensive, but then I looked back and it's not. On a team with this much offensive tilt, Defensive Suicune will slow your pace, and your opponent will easily be able to counter and gain momentum. To remedy this, I would definitely change Suicune to an offensive variant. Suicune already has plenty of natural bulk, and with the added speed and fire power, I think it will greatly benefit your team.

    In addition, I think it would be beneficial to change your Jirachi to a LO Shaymin. Not only will this give you a good looking F/W/G core, but it will also give you some more assurance against water types, which looks a tad concerning right now. With this change, Shaymin should definitely help you break down opposing Suicunes and Starmies which none of your Pokemon could reliably do earlier.

    Here are the sets:

    Good Luck with your team!
  6. Raion

    Raion

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2010
    Messages:
    24
    Thanks for the replies. I have the same exact shaymin in my storage except instead of rest I went with synthesis so I wouldn't be disabled for 2 turns. :P So swap out jirachi for shaymin huh? Thanks for the input. I really appreciate it. :D

    Thanks for the input on my 3 pokes except I don't have a gyarados on my team. :o I just have 2 questions for the other 2 pokes you evaluated for me. Number 1 if I chose Overheat over Flareblitz would my low Satk be enough to take out bulky physical def based steels? And how do I get body slam on jirachi? :O
  7. Raion

    Raion

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2010
    Messages:
    24
  8. MassImpact

    MassImpact

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2010
    Messages:
    1
    I'm pretty rusty, but I do have a few possible suggestions:

    You should swap your Infernape for a standard MixedApe since it grants more overall coverage than your physically-based one. Mach Punch isn't really necessary since you have priority Bullet Punch and a Scarfed Flygon, so Grass Knot should replace it for KOing Swamperts and such.

    As for Shaymin, Rest is probably the superior option because of Natural Cure.

    The rest looks pretty good, but you might wanna throw a ghost of some sort in there? Your opponent spinning away your precious rocks = your Azelf having no use at all.
  9. Raion

    Raion

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2010
    Messages:
    24
    Would you have a suggestion for a decent ghost type I can use in Wifi? I have a Tank Dusknoir, and a Speedy Sweeping Gengar. Which would be the better choice? And which would I take out?
  10. Smith

    Smith is a 90's bitch
    is a Team Rater Alumnus

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2009
    Messages:
    1,341
    Hey I got your message, for being new to competitive Pokemon this team looks pretty good! I actually wouldn't worry about having a ghost type too much, adding a Gengar or Dusknoir would more likely than not cause more problems than they would solve.

    Anyways one of the main concerns I have are Lead Machamp. You basically have to choose between severely denting the beast so somebody else can revenge him and forgoing SR, or getting up SR and facing a 100% demon in the face that nobody can stop. Neither scenario is good. I'm not familiar with the wi-fi metagame, but I'd imagine that many people are still using Lead Machamp, more so than on Shoddy, because they don't want to have to re-breed. Anyways you might try running a hybrid set, that both eliminates Machamp and allows you to get SR up.

    [​IMG]@ Colbur Berry
    8 HP / 140 Atk / 144 SpDef / 216 Spe
    Jolly

    or

    8 HP / 144SpDef / 252 Spe / 104 Atk
    Adamant

    -Stealth Rock
    -Taunt
    -U turn
    -Explosion

    Azelf, with these EVS and item, can take any hit it is likely to face in the lead metagame (including Machamp's Payback/Bullet Punch) and set up SR. From there, it can taunt slower leads, U turn to break sashes, or explode for some massive damage, OHKOing Machamp leads. The full analysis is on the Smogon page, but it's a great lead that matches up well and usually starts you off with some momentum and explodes on one member. It loses no lead mach up, save the rare Icy Wind Gengar (rare rare rare). I included the "or" in case you really don't want to re-breed, but the first set will work a lot better most of the time.

    Also a quick note on Shaymin, Rest > Synthesis in most scenarios. With Rest, Shaymin can abuse Natural Cure and just switch out, leaving him at full HP with no sleep. Synthesis only heals 50% most of the time, which may seem good until you realize that, in the sand, it only heals 25%. I'm not sure how common non-sun weather is on wi-fi, but you have to recognize that in those scenarios you'll hardly be healing anything at all. You might try just giving him the Rest TM.

    That's all the advice I have, I hope this helps! Good luck!
  11. Raion

    Raion

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2010
    Messages:
    24
    Thanks for the comment Smith. Yeah. I did have trouble up against a machamp lead. The only other lead that gives me trouble other than Machamp is Aerodactyl since he outspeeds my Azelf. Hmmm. So I should switch out my Synthesis for rest. Well ok. Thanks again for the Rating and comments. Thanks to smogon my Pokemon gameplay changed drastically. I lose less often now. :P

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)