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My Little Pwny

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by Lord Moet II, Oct 20, 2012.

  1. Lord Moet II

    Lord Moet II
    is a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2011
    Messages:
    234
    MY LITTLE PWNY

    [​IMG]


    INTRODUCTION
    Hello everyone. Moet here with another rmt, but with one of the best teams I have ever made. This team is built around the concept of sub cm Keldeo plus Banded Tyranitar. As we all know Sub Cm Keldeo has 4 walls: Lati@s, Jellicent and Toxicroak. And Tyranitar can effectively take out 3 of those 4 mons which would leave my Keldeo free to sweep. Of course its never that simple but with team support It gets the job done. I hope you all enjoy My Little Pwny.​



    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]


    TEAM BUILDING

    My thinking Process (open)

    So as stated in the intro the whole concept of the team was to be around the combo of band Tyranitar + Keldeo. So from there I knew in order to sweep with Keldeo I needed as many hazards as I could get. But I also wanted a spinner so deo-d nor ferrothorn was what a wanted. The only other thing i could think of was Forretress. And its been very invaluable so far.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    So next I noticed I had nothing to tank a hit from any Physical attacker, namely Terrakion or Dragonite. I also knew to make this work I would need Stealth Rocks along with spikes, but putting both on Forrey was out of the question seeing how it would overwhelm it. So I choose one of the best defensive walls in the game imo who could do both. Hippowdon.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    As I started to look over my team 2 huge problems stuck out to me. Breloom and Tornadus completely destroyed me. I had nothing to take the combo of Hurricane + Superpower and I also had nothing to stop Breloom after I sleep foddered something. One of the things that came to mind was Xatu but I knew that couldnt stop Tornadus. Then I thought of Zapdos who could also help with my small issue with rain.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Lastly when I first played with this team I had Scarf Garchomp in the last spot simply as a Revenge Killer, but I was terribly weak to RP Genesect, which could set up on Hippo/Ttar locked into crunch or pursuit, and proceed to sweep me. So i started testing different things such as scarf Terrakion, and Band Breloom but in the end I decided on Ebelt Stoutland who can survive a Ebelt/LO ice beam from Genesect and KO back with Fire Fang.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]


    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    The Team

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~



    [​IMG]

    Keldeo @ Leftovers
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Secret Sword
    - Calm Mind
    - Substitute
    - Surf

    The set speaks for its self. I try to set a Sub up and Calm Mind as long as ! can till i can sweep. I also use it as just a revenge killer but its main job is to stay nice and healthy until I find the opportunity to sweep. 252 Special Attack and Speed is for max Speed and Power. 4 SDef is so that Genesect gets the Attack Boost.


    [​IMG]

    Tyranitar (F) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 252 HP / 156 Atk / 100 SDef
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Crunch
    - Pursuit
    - Stone Edge
    - Superpower

    The thing that makes Keldeo work so well. Tyranitar. I didnt want to do a straight 252 Attack 252 Speed/HP because those sets had more power yes, but had no survivabilty. Plus Ttar doesnt need all that power Banded Pursuit/Crunch does plenty without full investment plus it allows me to switch into Politoed multiple times. Moves are pretty standard. I tried Low Kick > Superpower for a while but hitting things like Breloom and Rotom-W on the switch harder was better.


    [​IMG]

    Hippowdon (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
    - Earthquake
    - Ice Fang
    - Stealth Rock
    - Slack Off

    Standard Hippo is standard. 252 HP and Def allows for me to tank hits for days. Even plus 1 Dnite has trouble Ko'ing this thing. Anything weaker than that stands no chance against this beast. Earthquake and Ice Fang to inflict damage, Stealth Rocks becuase hazards are oh so helpful, and Slack Off because no good wall can perform well without recovery. I opted for Ice Fang over Whirlwind/Roar because It tends to be more helpful. Doing 70%~ to Dnite is great and catching Lando's on the switch is even better. Plus I dont become set-up fodder for Gliscor late game.


    [​IMG]

    Zapdos @ Leftovers
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 248 HP / 76 Def / 184 SDef
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Roost
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Heat Wave

    Zapdos has to be one of the most underrated pokemon in this meta. It works extremely well in this meta to the points where it can solo most rain team. And with some support its almost impossible to stop. 248 HP evs allow me the max HP while being able to come in on rocks a total of 4 times. 184 SDef is to tank most special hits such as Rotom-W's Hydro Pump and Scalds from various rain mons. 76 Def is as much as I felt like I could let go of from Sdef so I can take hits from Breloom better which I do effortlessly now. Thunderbolt is my main STAB for hitting all the Water types. Hidden Power Ice is for Landorus who think they can switch in on a Tbolt or who think a cant tank a LO HP Ice from them. And Heatwave is for Ferrothorn and Genesect and Scizor mainly.


    [​IMG]

    Forretress (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 248 HP / 60 SAtk / 200 SDef
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Volt Switch
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Rapid Spin
    - Spikes

    SDef Forretress is another mon I feel like doesnt get enough love. It takes hits so much better on both sides such as Politoed/Tentacruel's scald while none banded Terrakion cant even 2hko it. And with 60 Special Attack I can 2hko Dragonite with sand damage. Spikes are standard hazards, and Rapid spin is to remove the standard hazards from my field. Volt switch is to gain momentum on in-coming Gengar's who wish to spin block and Tentacruel's who want to spin my hazards. And HP ice is for damage against Dragonite/Landorus etc. etc.


    [​IMG]

    Stoutland (F) @ Expert Belt
    Trait: Sand Rush
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Ice Fang
    - Return
    - Fire Fang
    - Superpower

    Last but not least Stoutland. An extremely versatile pokemon that can revenge kill half the tier with ease. Max Attack and Speed with an Adamant nature is for max power. And while Outspeeding Keldeo, Terrakion, and the Lati@s that are scarfed can be useful at times I already have designated checks to each of those mons so there's no reason for me to outspeed them. Ice Fang and Fire Fang are to hit Landorus and Dragons and Genesect and other Steel types Respectively. Return is for STAB and Superpower is to hit Tyranitar's who think I'm choiced and plan to pursuit me.


    Closing Thoughts

    This team was/is fun to use and I say is because there's no way Im done using it. But I've given it out to so many people at this point there's no point in trying to keep it secretive. I built it for a tourney and Ive done the norm with it. Won tourney matches, peaked 1684 on the beta ladder so far, and I've enjoyed using it. I hope those of you who decide to try it enjoy using it as much as I do. Also big shoutout to user Ducktux for helping me test and junk =>

    Importable

    Enjoy ^^ (open)

    Tyranitar (F) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 252 HP / 156 Atk / 100 SDef
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Crunch
    - Pursuit
    - Stone Edge
    - Superpower

    Keldeo @ Leftovers
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Secret Sword
    - Calm Mind
    - Substitute
    - Surf

    Hippowdon (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
    - Earthquake
    - Ice Fang
    - Stealth Rock
    - Slack Off

    Forretress (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 248 HP / 60 SAtk / 200 SDef
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Volt Switch
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Rapid Spin
    - Spikes

    Zapdos @ Leftovers
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 252 HP / 76 Def / 180 SDef
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Roost
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Heat Wave

    Stoutland (F) @ Expert Belt
    Trait: Sand Rush
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Ice Fang
    - Return
    - Fire Fang
    - Superpower

  2. blunder

    blunder

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2011
    Messages:
    611
    This team is amazing. The only thing that looks annoying is LO SD Breloom as with hazards support, it can effectively take down everything barring Zapdos. Honestly it is very hard to change something on this team without ruining the synergy. If anything I would recommend adding some Speed Evs to Zapdos to beat Adamant Breloom. You only need 16. Other than that, amazing team Moet and congrats on the peak :]]
  3. Shurtugal

    Shurtugal The Enterpriser.

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2011
    Messages:
    1,301
    Really nice team, luvdisc'ed! I <3 Zapdos!!!
    Just a nitpick: put 4 evs on Hippo somewhere o;


    ;] Shurt

    EDIT: Your very SubSalac Terrakion weak, I just fought this team on the server (some player had obviously took this team) so I had the upperhand I guess. He couldn't do very much, because I had already killed Hippo and +2 kills Forretress, but my SE missed on Zappy and I ended up losing the match though -.- However, you might want to resort to LO Stout and use Jolly if you find that Terrakion is a big threat, but I don't think it's THAT necessary. GL
  4. Neliel

    Neliel Sacred Sword

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2012
    Messages:
    565
    Hi there, cool team :x

    The first thing I can say is that this team to me seems a little weak to offensive rain teams. In fact, your only water resist is Keldeo, which is not enough bulky to take strong Hydro Pumps anyway. I know you have two sandstorm inducers but i think that even a common Specs Toed can give problems to this team. Also, Tyranitar, Hippowdon, Keldeo and Stoutland are all weak to toxic spikes, meaning that a well builded rain stall with Tentacruel can status 4 of your pokemon. For this reason i would suggest you to use Tentacruel instead of Forretress. I know you lose the Steel type and in this way you are more weak to ground, but thats the only suggestion that can fix your rain problem.

    Also, I would give a try to use Life orb instead of expert belt on Stoutland, but thats just my opinion :x The point is that Stoutland needs raw power to sweep, because 100 base Atk is not that great at all. However, other than that i think that this is perfect, nothing else to add. If Tentacruel is worst than Forretress let me know.

    set (open)
    Tentacruel (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Rain Dish
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Scald
    - Protect / Knock off
    - Toxic Spikes / Toxic
    - Rapid Spin
  5. Lord Moet II

    Lord Moet II
    is a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2011
    Messages:
    234
    Hey thunder Thanks for the rate bud. As for the evs I can definitely try it but I like the evs the way they are because I will generally sleep fodder forretress and proceed to switch into Zapdos to kill it. Plus If I outspeed and I need to roost in that situation and they predict that. Then I will quite possibly get ko'd by bullet seed as I do so. Thanks though =]



    Thanks for the Rate and Luvdisc Shurtugal. First on the Hippo thing yeah I can put the 4 in attack thats not a big deal. On the second point I can try Jolly LO Stout but with enough Life recoil + hazard damage I can be ko'd by RP Genesect because an Ebelt Sect's Ice Beam does 55-60%. But I will definitely try it out. Thanks again =]



    Hey Neliel Tu Oderschvank thanks for the rate. First off against offensive rain team I tend to let them have the weather war so that way my keldeo can sweep easier. Plus there's nothing on a current Standard HO Rain team that can OHKO my Zapdos so thats one of the things Im going to switch into first. On the topic of facing rain stall is so sparse I hardly ever see it but I would volt switch as tentacruel is going into my forrey and trap with tar. Set up hazards and force switches. And lastly like the above post I will try out Jolly Stout. Thanks again =]
  6. TomX159

    TomX159

    Joined:
    May 1, 2012
    Messages:
    40
    hi MOET

    First off, I really like the team. Luvdisk'd ;D
    Secondly, I just wanted to say that I just fought this team on the ladder and swept through everything with my Conkeldurr once Keldeo was gone. I had a pretty big advantage b/c I had this team page open when I was playing and the first hole I saw was that Hippowdon didn't have Roar, so I just Bulk Up'd on him twice and it was game over. Since your physical walls are just set up fodder, Drain Punch will take care of Hippowdon and Forretress, Payback/Ice Punch/Stone Edge will take care of Zapdos, and Mach Punch cleans up Tyranitar and Stoutland. So my suggestion would be to put Stealth Rock on Forretress instead of Spikes and put Roar on Hippowdon. Congrats on the success ;D
  7. PDC

    PDC D I R T
    is a Smogon Social Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Team Rater Alumnus

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    Messages:
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    Great team you got here, so congrats!

    Mostly nitpicks, but I suggest trying out 100 Speed Tyranitar instead of your curent Banded variant spread to defeat Jellicent without getting burned to avoid any trouble with not being able to defeat Jellicent or Skarmory, which you also outspeed now.

    Good luck!
  8. gr8astard

    gr8astard The Based Lord? My balls!!
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Tiering Contributoris a Past SPL + WCoP Winnerwon the 9th Official Smogon Tournament
    Moderator

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    363
    Hi Moet,

    I think the team is really solid and as such there's not so much that I feel needs to be changed, so most of what I'm saying are just nitpicks. For Stoutland, I used to run a Jolly spread with 72 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpDef / 180 Speed to outspeed scarf Latios, but since you're running expert belt you probably need the power of Adamant, plus you already have Tyranitar to handle scarf Lati@s and Hippowdon to handle scarf Terrakion. Another option you may want to consider is running Volt Switch on Zapdos. Now I know that Thunderbolt has its own merits with its extra base power, and there are times when you want to just stay in and attack instead of switching out, but I find the things that like to switch into Zapdos easily eliminated by CB Tyranitar. Just something to think about.

    Finally, but most importantly, I guess one weakness of this team is the lack of water resist. I'm pretty sure everything on this team gets OHKO'd by Specs Politoed aside from Tyranitar in the sand and Keldeo, who are 2HKO'ed. Now obviously Rotom-W over Zapdos is an easy "fix", but Zapdos handles Special Landorus and SD Scizor better, so I would keep it. Another idea is to use physically defensive Gastrodon over Hippowdon and move SR to Forretress over spikes (spikes stacking with Forretress without a spinblocker is a bit hard vs good players anyway), but that would make your matchup vs sun a bit more difficult.

    So in conclusion... I really don't have any definite changes to suggest. If I do, though, I'd be sure to post more :] Good job friend
  9. Lord Moet II

    Lord Moet II
    is a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2011
    Messages:
    234
    Thanks for the rate TomX :). As to your point yes on paper conk seems to destroy my team and I never really noticed this because I just dont face enough. But when i do i tend to weaken with zappy and revenge with keldeo. But I will try Roar on Hippo. Thanks again.


    Thanks for the rate PDC. 100 speed isnt a bad idea tbh. I do prefer the bulk so I can tank hits better but I can definitely try this out. Thanks =].


    Hey gr8 thanks for the rate bro. As for Stoutland since that seems to be the majority of what people are telling me it must be worth trying plus I like the addition of bulk. And as for max defense gastro Iirc it gets 2hko'd by plus 1 Dnite which can be a problem for me seeing how its my only wall. It cant hurt to try so I def will. Thanks again for the rates everyone =]
  10. chimpact

    chimpact fire nation
    is an official Team Rateris a Smogon Social Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2006
    Messages:
    1,818
    This is a great team. The only thing that I can see helping you out is giving your Forretress 244 HP EVs so that you heal the most efficient amount of HP with leftovers and add that 4 extra EVS into Spdef.

    Awesome job, [​IMG]'d :].
  11. ClubbingSealCub

    ClubbingSealCub

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2012
    Messages:
    390
    Is it me, or is Stoutland getting a lot of love around here?

    I have to say - don't change your Stoutland's spread unless Salac / Scarf Terrakion starts being a problem (Really, it shouldn't); but do try Life Orb on it for the added power, mainly because Return doesn't benefit from Expert Belt at all.

    Good team, luvdisc'd!
  12. King

    King

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2010
    Messages:
    597
    Good team, only problem I see is Scarf Terrakion if a few pokemon are eliminated. But You're a good enough player to avoid being defeated by that, so I don't see many flaws. Luvdisc'd
  13. the nub

    the nub

    Joined:
    May 29, 2012
    Messages:
    27
    hi Moe, nice team reallly but in keldeo you can test Hidden Power Electric > Substitute, this gonna help you to kill Politoed and Tentacruel (common pokemon), in Zapdos Sub > HP Ice i really like that zapdos sub roost, i think you can change in Tyranitar Choice Scarf > Choice Band and in Stoutland CB > LO, that's my opinion. What you doing vs Venusaur if sun is active?, yes i know that you have more probabilities to win the weather warr but Venusaur can Sleep one pokemon and do Good Damage with Giga Drain to Tyranitar, so becareful with Venusaur, and if the Sun TEam have Dugtrio give you more problems
  14. Lord Moet II

    Lord Moet II
    is a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2011
    Messages:
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    Will do thanks for the rate friend =].


    This might sound like a good idea but without a Jolly nature LO doesnt do much but hinder me. I am however currently trying out Jolly LO Stout. Thanks for the rate =].


    Firstly thanks for the rate. Now on hp electric Keldeo, I need sub to sweep especially when facimg tentacruel so it cant toxic or burn me and i can continue to setup. On the point of zapdos hp ice is important for beating special lando/ thundurus which i can beat quite easily while sub doesnt help much execpt for when i face SDef Rotom-W. On the last two I need the raw power of tyranitar more and since Im using a bulky set that wouldnt work well. And stoutland I need to be able to switch up moves in a pinch because I would hate to get putsuited by scizor/ttar because im locked into Return. Thanks for the rate man =].

    @Steamline I have banded Tyranitar with Superpower Ebelt Stoutland with Superpower and Cm Keldeo with Secret Sword. Im sorry but i dont get how a Blissey beat you.
  15. TGMD

    TGMD +Biosci: you both gave me crabs
    is a Tutoris a Battle Server Moderatoris a Team Rater Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
    Tournament Winner

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    995
    Hey Moet, really great team, easily one of the best Sand teams I've seen since the introduction of BW2.

    SubDD Gyrados can cause some major issues for your team, without Stealth Rocks up and getting a Flinch on Forretress, Gyrados can't actually sweep your team, but it can set up on Keldeo, Hippowdon, and Tyranitar locked into Pursuit / Superpower. Then, at +1, Gyrados outspeeds everything bar Stoutland, and OHKOs everything bar Forretress and Hippowdon (who can't do anything to Gyrados at all.) Late game it could really cause some problems and you'll lose a few pokemon in the process of getting rid of it. To help remedy this situation I suggest running Wild Charge over Ice Fang on Stoutland. Wild Charge lets you OHKO Gyrados before it can do anything to your team. Wild Charge also allows you to OHKO Starmie, Tornadus-T etc after Stealth Rocks, and Tentacruel, Jellicent (Tyranitar can't always remove Jellicent, if it switches out after taking a Wild Charge; Tyranitar shouldn't have a problem taking it out later on in the match) etc after Stealth Rocks. This could be particularly helpful because you're relatively weak to rain and water types in general, considering your only water resist is your main sweeper. Losing Ice Fang makes you a bit weaker to dragons, but you still have return, Ice Fang Hippowdon, and Hidden Power [Ice] Forretress.

    You may want to try a spread of: 28 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 224 Spd over your current one. This spread allows Stoutland to outspeed everything it could previously but with a bit of extra bulk, you miss out on speed tying with opposing Stoutland (which isn't really a threat to your team at all) and +2 Dragonite (you're not bad enough to let Dragonite get to +2 and then let the outcome of a match be deicded by a 50/50, lol.)

    I back up Gr8astard's suggestion of Volt Switch over Thunderbolt. Even though it's weak to Stealth Rocks; Zapdos can be a great defensive pivot and Volt Switch can also give you free switch-in oppurtunities, something your team appreciates. Being able to pivot out to your Tyranitar on the Latios switch-in, or pivoting out to Keldeo on the setup fodder are oppurtunities that could shift the game in your favour. The extra power and not having to switch out are good reasons to keep Thunderbolt, but Zapdos is not in your team to do mass amounts of damage, and the synergy in your team is good enough to prevent too many problems if you Volt Switch out on a pokemon you had a favourable matchup with.

    Anyway, I hope this rate helped and GL with the team man! Luvdisc'd :)
  16. Finchinator

    Finchinator

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2011
    Messages:
    647
    Hello Moet, your team is very good imo!
    However, I'd consider moving a small portion of the defense ev's on Zapdos to speed (to outspeed either adamant breloom by 2 [241] or, neutral base 80's [260]) then it can outstall more threats and nail crucial kills by outspeeding them while maintaining reasonable bulk.
  17. Myzozoa

    Myzozoa Throw-up on the internet, or get off on TV
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

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    This is a very solid team, a classic Ttar+Keldeo team that destroys rain in the weather wars. I still think there are a couple of minor things that would improve this team:

    These first few nitpicks are largely personal preference, but I'm not sure that it is necessary to use Hidden Power Ice on Forretress and have Ice Fang on Hippowdon as well. It seems redundant to me personally. I think that Whirlwind or perhaps Toxic would be a better move.

    Substitute on Keldeo is just fine, if you find yourself missing coverage you should change to some hidden power, but the way I see it, substitute allows you to make more trouble for offensive teams, or still take advantage when you don't need a CM to sweep a team.

    I like the Stoutland set, pursuit is not necessary as TTar already does it for you.

    My only suggestion is that Bulky Starmie could help you cover a tremendous Terrakion weakness (and it would be a small help against sun too) and with Toxic it could catch Latias, which helps Keldeo sweep. If you implement this change you do become much weaker to Genesect, so be wary of that. If you choose not to make this change, then I strongly advise changing Hippowdon to a specially defensive set to better deal with Torn-t.


    Zapdos is fantastic on this team, but I don't really see any need for HP ice on it, Ttar covers all the Lati@s, and Salamence can be covered by Forretress and Hippowdon. Maybe you could put a phazing move on Zapdos, or substitute to take advantage of pressure stall.

    Awesome team, I don't see any important weaknesses, my suggestions are largely personal preference as this team is already solid.
  18. Zeta5

    Zeta5

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2011
    Messages:
    101
    Its nice to see such an interesting team once in awhile. The first (sort of) flaw i can see is if your opponent has a scarf Genesect or Gengar (or both). What this means is that Gengar can kill t-tar (which you noted as essential to taking out key threats to keldeo, to the extent idk but still). Sure you can bring in Keldeo but you should be cautious if so. Genesect doesn't have completely free roam over this team but T-tar can't tank hits from Genesect forever. The last thing i noticed was the lack of a phazer, it seems a little important in my eyes since you have SR and spikes at your disposal. I do suggest putting Roar over Ice Fang on Hippo. You could invest also a Spinblocker but I don't know how it will affect your team. Hopefully this helped!

    OH and one last thing, YOUR STOUTLAND GETS WALLED BY TORKOAL gotta watch out for that torkoal! I hear he's pretty used now :]
  19. Valentine

    Valentine バレンタイン
    is a Tutor
    Mentor

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    555
    Sup buddy boy. I was the 40th Luvdisc; goml is basically all i'm saying.

    I haven't read any of the rates; sorry if I make similar suggestions to others. Your Tyranitar's EV spread is atrocious. Jellicent run speed EVs, and will Will-o-Wisp before you can even think about killing it. Whats more, is that with your weak set, Crunch will never OHKO, and Cursed Body can active on whatever you lock yourself into.. this allows Jellicent to Recover back to full after it burns you. Anyways.

    Tyranitar @ChoiceBand
    adamant
    158 hp / 248 atk / 104 speed
    -suit
    -crun
    -se
    -super

    248 Atk puts you at an even number, which is better for Choice Band. 104 Speed EVs allows you to outpace any practical Jelli, and also things like 24 speed Skarmory (the most common). SE is a solid 2hko after rox on the metal bird. You also outpace standard (and most other) band scizor. Oh, and here's the new damage output on Jelli: 248Atk Choice Band Tyranitar (+Atk) Crunch vs 252HP/252Def Jellicent (+Def): 98% - 115% (396 - 468 HP). Unfortunately, this set cannot tank two Specs surf from a Latios. But, it can take any two hits from any variant of Latias (EDIT: almost i suppose 252SpAtk Choice Specs Latias (Neutral) Surf in Sandstorm vs 158HP/0SpDef Tyranitar (+SpDef): 44% - 52% (170 - 200 HP). 8% chance to 2HKO)

    To help with Latios, I suggest you run Pursuit (or Crunch) over Ice Fang on Stoutland. Not only does this help eliminate Latios, this also gives you something to hit Jellicent and Gengar with. That brings us to the dogs EVs spread. Since you aren't outpacing Scarf Terrakion anyways, you need to be looking at the next lower bracket; which is Scarf Mienshao. You only need 236 speed EVs to outpace Scarf Mienshao (you also outpace max speed +2 cloyster still). This gives you 20 EVs to play around with in bulk. You may keep 252 speed EVs if you feel you need to tie with opposing Stoutland- but what do you have Hippodown, Forretress, Tyranitar and prediction for?

    Zapados@Lefties
    calm
    248hp/28 Def/216 Spdef/16 Spe
    -roost
    -volt switch
    -heat wave / toxic
    -hp ice

    216 spdef hits a free point, sexy. 248 hp obvs. 16 speed outpaces addy loom, something it needs to do. you shouldn't be roosting on loom- this gives it a turn to bulk up, sub, spore, stun spore, leech seed, swords dance, whatever. you need to outpace and heat wave before it can set up anything. 28 def is leftovers- i'd personally throw this into spatk, but i guess it can potentially help with breloom.

    Your hippo is male- you need to fix that. Gold hippowdons look gross, but sleek, silver/grey female hippos look good. Also, 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 def.. Although reaching >THAT BIG 420 HP STAT is rather nice..having spikes take an extra HP every switch in isn't worth it. What am i saying. Yes it is. 420 blaze it. You need Roar on this (BAN ME PLEASE). Ice Fang weak and doesn't even OHKO Dnite, Gliscor, Lando, or Sala (after intimidate especially).

    Run Gyro Ball over HP Ice on Forretress. Gyro Ball is going to 2hko Dnite regardless. Gyro hits a million more things.

    I just realized that I suggested you remove 3 ice moves lmao. Uhh. Maybe keep Ice Fang on Hippo.. it actually makes sense to have, since Dnite usually carry fpunch and will fuck forre up. Stoutland will probably die to a +1 ES anyways, but if it lives, Return will do a big chunk anyways. Man.

    I wanted to take a look at your Forre's spread but i just got bored. GL, see you on skype soon.
  20. Lord Moet II

    Lord Moet II
    is a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2011
    Messages:
    234
    Hey Doom thanks for the rate buddy =). About Wild Charge I dont struggle with any of the listed pokemon so its more of a preference. It looks weak on paper to Gyarados, but I have always been able to play around the ddance varient without losing more than one mon. The spread you gave for Stoutland is nice so Ill prob try that once Im done testing out Jolly stout. And as for Volt Switch on Zapdos it would make it harder to wall Sdef Rotom-W seeing how if I volt switch on them they will either Will-o-Wisp or Volt switch giving them the upperhand and losing me momentum. So once again its another preference thing and I prefer Thunderbolt. Thanks again. =]


    Thanks for the rate finch. About moving some speed over Im not understanding why outspeeding breloom even matters tbh because even if I outspeed it and switch it in Im still getting spored while on the otherhand If I forgo the speed for defense I can tank the incoming hit better. I will make sure to give it a try though. Thanks again =].


    Hey myzozoa thanks for the rate man. Firstly yeah I have thought about toxic on hippowdon to help with gastro which can wall my team to an extent and since I have Stout to cover Dragons Im really leaning towards that. Bulky Starmie, like you mentioned would add accentuate my weakness to Genesect which seems to get more popular as the days go by. And Zapdos is my one Special Lando Counter if it gets a rp up. Stout can no longer outspeed it and Forretress gets 2hko'd and can't ohko with HP Ice. I dont know how many hits it would take for Heat Wave to ko it (probs 3) but as you said Its a preference thing and It makes me feel better knowing I have a hard counter almost to it. I will try out toxic on hippo and roar on zapdos though just to see how it changes.



    Hey zeta thanks for the rate bro. Scarf Genesect is something I tend to play around just because its so versatile and it really doesnt have a hard counter besides Heatran but with all of the GeneDug combo's its hard to work one in. As for gengar it cant break through zapdos without 2 Sdef drops i believe and that is very unlikely. On the point of a spinblocker I just have no room. No good spinblocker has even a decent niche on my team without ruining the synergy I was trying to accomplish. And finally the fearsome torkoal. I might be terrified of it but people dont know how to bring out its true power yet. And until that day Ill continue to use Stoutland. Thanks again pal =].


    Hey nitro thanks for the very long and insightful rate =]. Tyranitar needs all the bulk it can get so while your set is very strong I feel as if I need the bulk more so. I might try a knockoff of that set though where I can forgo some attack for more HP or Sdef evs. On the point of Stoutland its my Secondarly line of defense almost. If something were to happen to Hippowdon like a crit, I would like to fall back on Stoutland plus Lati@s is covered by Tyranitar and Gengar is covered by Zapdos. Since it seems to be the norm that I need speed on zapdos It wont hurt me to try it so I will but I just feel like using volt switch > thunderbolt really cant help much but I can always give it a shot. On to Hippo that set looks fine and I can use it, I might change it to toxic > ice fang but I will most likely change it. And gyro ball Forretress has always had mix results for me but it wont hurt to try it out. Thanks again for the rates and luvdisc's everyone. It really means alot =].
  21. Stone RG

    Stone RG Megas are broke

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2012
    Messages:
    346
    Gr8 team man, no doubt about that.

    However, i see quite an issue with rain, specifically with pokes spamming hydro in its weather (*cough*keldeo, rotom w, politoed*cough*), to patch this weakness up id reccomend you a specially defensive rotom w, replacing zapdos in the team, since it handles pretty much every rain team lacking a ferrothorn, which ttar can completely demolish considering almost all ferro's this days a re sp defensive. The only real issue is the lack of a fighting resistance, but hippo handles pretty much every fighting covered.

    Rotom-W@Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    Nature: Calm
    EVs: 252 HP, 252 SpD, 4 SpA
    - Hydro Pump
    - Volt Switch
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Pain Split
    Again, grats on such a good team.

    Hope i helped :]
  22. Lavos Spawn

    Lavos Spawn
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2012
    Messages:
    2,960
    Yo Moet, great team of course, you always make some good ones but this in particular is exceptional. Only one big issue here, really, I'm noticing a gigantic Starmie weakness, especially in the Rain it can 2HKO every single member of your team and OHKO a large portion of it. Also you're somewhat Latios weak, if the opponent is smart and waits you out a little bit, wearing down Tyranitar before bringing out the big guns, then they can do some serious damage with a Life Orb or Choice Specs set, as Forretress simply can't last forever. To resolve both these rather large weaknesses, I'd like to suggest you replace your Choice Band Tyranitar with a ScarfTar instead. This will help you get the edge on Starmie and Latios, as you'll now be able to outspeed non-Scarfed variants and OHKO with Crunch or OHKO with Pursuit on the predicted switch if you so choose. Losing the raw power of BandTar is unfortunate, but necessary in my opinion, as I don't think Keldeo is going to have even a chance at sweeping while Latios and Starmie remain in play. The suggested set is below:

    [​IMG]
    Tyranitar @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature
    - Stone Edge
    - Crunch
    - Pursuit
    - Superpower

    That's all I have for you. Again, excellent team, and congratulations on its roaring popularity!
  23. alexwolf

    alexwolf Fear the D
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2009
    Messages:
    6,960
    Awesome team, marry me, luvdisc'ed and all that stuff!

    The only minor suggestion i have to make is Muscle Band over Expert Belt on Stoutland. The 10% more power on Return can come very hand oftentimes, and you don't really miss the 10% power on your coverage moves, as all of the pokes you want to check with them, are still OHKOed with the appropriate coverage move (do calcs if you don't believe me).
  24. Lord Moet II

    Lord Moet II
    is a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2011
    Messages:
    234
    Hi Stone RG thanks for the rate. If I used Sdef Rotom-W Breloom would be able to solo my team and I wouldnt be able to do anything about it. So that isnt going to work. Thanks for the rate though. =]


    Hey Lavos thanks for the rate pal. About Scarf Tar. It never came up on my radar as good on this team because it just isnt strong enough and the power of band really helps me win the weather. I do however see where you are going with this and I will give it a test to see how it works. Thanks again =].


    Hi alexwolf, thanks for the rate. I've never tried muscle band on any of my pokes but it seems to be on of those harmless things I can try if it will net me the same ko's, so thats what I'll do. Thanks for the rate =].

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